No. I didn't cherry-pick "low showings." I just showed what happened the three most recent times Wolverine got shot in a non-Ennis title. Not my fault he got put down in every instance. Just because you Wolverine fanboys like to beat dead horses with a stick doesn't suddenly validate your arguments. This thread ended on page 28 as did any interest besides you, Sado22, Phantomzone and Jinzin keep putting into it. Yeah, he heals, we get it. You unload a few hundred bullets into him or manage to get one into his brain, and he goes down just like the rest of us. At least, long enough to be considered a knockout per forum rules. This thread started with you all trying to disprove Ennis' writing and you got put on your heels by a 1-2-3 combo of scans from non-Ennis, Wolverine-oriented titles.
I don't even have to go backwards into Wolverine's history, current titles tell the story better then your precious fanboyish obsession with Wolverine. Let's wait a month or two, there will probably be more published instances of Wolverine getting beat by bullets-
- oh wait! Speak of the devil... newly published Logan #2. Takes place during WWII, which makes this post-Azrael immortality healing factor Wolverine. Waylaid by a shot to the head, long enough for his new romance to fight off the thug for several minutes before she was finally brutally murdered. Here's a nice tidy scan for you to chew on:
Go to your little corner, and whimper. While you suck your thumb from being scan-spanked continuously, you can suck on the scan. WWII Wolverine isn't current Wolverine, but the healing factor is the same. In fact, the healing factor is superior to current Wolverine since it's pre-downgrade. A bullet got into his brain and he was knocked out cold for several minutes. If you can't wrap your head around how that applies to the current debate, then you're a failure. Stick around for a couple of months. At this rate, Wolverine will get pwned by bullets in a few weeks or so.
And my username is an inside joke. Oh... and ad hominem attacks don't add to the debate. But scans sure do! Especially relevant ones. Especially relevant ones that are the most current. There, there lil baby. Scan-spanking isn't meant to hurt you, only make you a lil smarter in the future. It's what I do.
Oh sure I'm the one that's crying because I'm the one who's so desperate to have Punisher win I'm using invalid scans and cherry picking low showings and then lieing about it...
Oh wait that'd be you. [csm]doped[/cs,]
You wish. WW2 is before he had the adamantium removed and his healing factor got boosted... But oh that's right let's not actually read any comics with wolverine on them, just use scans found on the internet.
And pre-upgrade too...
Did he have the adamanitum? If he did its a load of PIS. Deal with it fanboy. there's bone behind the eye, in fact the brain is completely incased in bone, or in wolverine's case Adamantium... Ao go cry to mommy little one your lies and illogic aren't going to work here.
Projecting.
There's no way that a bullet ccan get into wolverine's brain. If you think it can YOU fail at anatomy. Which means you're the failure.
Sre it will fanboyu, sure it will.
And its still acurate as you are One Dumb G0.
Look, more hypocricy.
In your dreams fanboy. You keep using irrelivant ones and low showeings. Go ahead and keep breaking the forum rules.
Which you have yet to provide.
Which is not the ww2 one, cause even you admitted that ww2 is not currwnt wolverine. Oops, pwned yourself.
You're so deluded that you think you're right. But you already discrredited your own scan.
You can turn around and chase your tail all you want, kid. Doesn't take away the fact that you've been scan-spanked, yet again. That's four times in less than that many months that bullets have been used to put down Wolverine. I'm sorry if a scan of Wolverine with a healing factor getting a bullet put through his brain doesn't apply to you. Because this was before he got his adamantium skeleton, before he got an upgrade from his mutations post-Fatal Attractions but also before he got his most recent downgrade with the resoltuon of the Azrael storyline? Ha. It's Wolverine. It's his healing factor. You don't think his WWII healing factor is any good? Do you have proof that it is definitely worse then his current healing factor? No, you don't? Yeah. Thought so. Even if you don't like it, go ahead and suck on the three previous scans of current Wolverine, whose healing factor timeline you can't equivocate around getting put down by bullets. I'm not just trying to inform you, but anybody else interested in seeing your fanboy opinions of Wolverine go up in smoke.
You can try to piece together portions of my post to mischaracterize my arguments all you want. You can even try to artificially inflate the size of your post to give the impresssion that what you're saying somehow has more substance. You can completely and utterly resort to ad hominem attacks to cover up the poignancy with which that scan threatens your arguments. You can even try to equivocate around how close his healing factor was back then to how it is now and argue yourself in circles. You can also try to post with an exaggerated false bravado and try to feign confidence in order to cast of the scent of being scan-spanked...
... you know what you can't do? You can't unring that bell and you can't undo those scans. Everybody else sees them. I will admit; I enjoyed spanking you far more then I really should have. Hush now and gnight, kid.
Punisher with 1 hour prep 6/10. Scans speak for themselves.
Scalphunter shot Logan in the head and with a bullet in his head and Scrambler trying to nullify his healing factor he was getting up in one panel... That's faster than Sabretooth was healing from brain trauma three years ago. THAT Sabretooth took everything that an elite group of super commandos could throw at him, more than an army of hydra agents a super android and a mote filled with piranhas could toss his way, more than Omega Reds death factor could dish, more than the combined efforts of Caliban, Psylocke, Beast, Jean Grey, Cyclops, Archangel, and Iceman could too.
But Punisher with an hour of prep is going to pull off a KO against someone who has a comparatively superior healing factor to THAT? oooookay.
Then we have the desert situation. Wolverine vol. I, the effects of a desert environment on his healing factor are flat out stated (please log in to view the image)
At the time, even less bullets were required to put Wolverine down in a desert environment. Now? It took hundreds fired off by five men, for who knows how long (all we know for sure is that Wolverine has enough time conscious to think about getting back at Mystique and about counting all the bullets to exact his revenge to the appropriate degree.), they shoot him in the face with a shotgun and kick him down a cliff and he's getting up ten minutes later! Even in the desert...
But... So what? This isn't the desert. It's a warehouse where we're expecting Wolverine's HF to be performing at the best of it's capabilities.
Finally we've got the Deadpool encounter.. Yeah, a bullet in his brain seemingly put Logan down and the Punisher fans/supporters want to acknowledge that, but what about the multiple stabs, bullets, explosions, piano drop, car run-over, drag, concrete embedding and h2h that took place before that? Where Wolverine wasn't put down? Are we supposed to only look at one panel of the end of the fight and ignore the two issues of fighting (WITH PREP) that it took Deadpool to get there?
And......
So.... you don't need to go into his past but choose to bring up a WWII example of his HF to describe what he can do currently?
I mean I suppose you're not aware that his HF steadily increased since then to his time with the X-men and even afterwards, especially after his secondary mutation started taking place huh?
Now, while I do feel that a bullet to the brain pan SHOULD put Wolverine out of commission for a little while and probably longer than Scalphunters bullet had him down... Let's consider this.
You've shown 3 examples of Wolverine going down with a bullet to the brain...
One has Wolverine without an Adamantium skull.. so irrelevant.
One uses the impossibility of a bullet going through an adamantium eye socket... irrelevant.
And one uses a mercenary who had more prep AND more time than Frank and STILL only got into the position he was in to shoot Wolverine because of his advanced healing factor which Frank doesn't have... so... irrelevant.
And it doesn't help show that you're NOT ignorant with Wolverine when you're going off on rants about Lazear not being a part of Wolverine's existence by WWII when Wolverine first killed his ass in WWI...
__________________ "damn jinzin, you're a real trooper, you provde fact after fact and pages and pages of proof and these wanton miscreants just keep at it"~MERC
Of course it is, which is why his healing factor wasn't able to take him being hit by an ATV a few years later during the Korean war, but he could take punches from Hulk and super robots a couple decades later... Totally the same...
Of course it is, of course his healing factor is weaker now than it was during WWII, even though Lazaer WAS a factor in the WWII scans and Wolverine's HF NOW is allowing him to take wounds and heal them faster and more effeciently then it was 7 years ago. But let's ignore that because you say so...
Well maybe you can explain how it applies to the current debate since we're debating Wolverine vs. Punisher and when you consider both Wolverine AND Punisher you have to consider this:
"You've shown 3 examples of Wolverine going down with a bullet to the brain...
One has Wolverine without an Adamantium skull.. so irrelevant.
One uses the impossibility of a bullet going through an adamantium eye socket... irrelevant.
And one uses a mercenary who had more prep AND more time than Frank and STILL only got into the position he was in to shoot Wolverine because of his advanced healing factor which Frank doesn't have... so... irrelevant"
Yup.... I mean, Wolverine's HF delt with hundreds of bullets in a desert environment better than it did in the early 90's, it countered everything DP with prep could throw his way, it had him getting up in one panel after being shot in the brain (better than Sabretooth from three years ago) and then up again in three panels after Scrambler (a power nullifying mutant) got ahold of him. He got up a page after having his insides incinerated by a plasma blast after fighting half the Wrecking Crew, and up a couple panels after having his upper half incinerated by a Super Skrull using scott's eyebeams with a fire inducing enhancement.
But he totally get pwnzerd1! by bulletseses.
And why? Because you say so dammit!
Then start posting some...
Like ones from WWII where Wolverine didn't have as strong a healing factor OR an Adamantium Skeleton?
__________________ "damn jinzin, you're a real trooper, you provde fact after fact and pages and pages of proof and these wanton miscreants just keep at it"~MERC
Cresh was right... The only person you've owned is yourself.
__________________ "damn jinzin, you're a real trooper, you provde fact after fact and pages and pages of proof and these wanton miscreants just keep at it"~MERC
Read the comics you're trying to cite. His encounter with Lazaer occurred during World War I. Not World War II. Therefore, he is in possession of a post-Lazaer healing factor upgrade during World War II. The same period in which the Logan #2 scan shows up.
It's simple. Let's go through it one by one. 1) Wolverine has had a bullet penetrate into his brain through his eye. Whether you like it or not and want to argue real world science vs comics science is your cup of tea. Scans take precedence over your ideal world. 2) The second one involves a simple bullet through his throat up into his brain. Just because you don't have any ability to imagine Punisher doing the same to Wolverine is not a fault in my arguments for this debate. It's your recalcitrance and intransigience. Which is just fine for you, everybody else other than Creshock and you yourself can imagine a scenario where Punisher can put a bullet through Wolverine's throat into his brain. 3) And the third instance? Honestly, just another example in the last few short months of Wolverine's appearances where he is indeed put down by bullets.
No. Because comics say it. FOUR SEPARATE TIMES in the last two months. I don't even have to go back into his storied past. Wolverine, with his great healing factor, has been put down by bullets... FOUR SEPARATE TIMES in the last two months! Do you not appreciate ON-PANEL evidence? Just because it completely overturns your perception of your favorite character doesn't change the power of proof. On-panel evidence speaks volumes. You can theorize and equivocate and blind yourself to on-panel evidence all you want. Want you can't do is unpublish those comics. You ignoring the most recent on-panel evidence, ESPECIALLY when three of those instances occur with Wolverine's current downgraded healing factor is purely asinine. You wanted to argue against Ennis' on-panel pwnage of Wolverine with your literary criticisms. I can't change the fact that you hate Ennis or that Wolverine got absolutely punked by Punisher ON-PANEL in 2 out of 3 meetings. Now you have three other authors putting current Wolverine down with bullets without any illusory benefit of the "Ennis-hates-Wolverine" argument and you still act like you have a leg to stand on. Laughable.
Why don't you go ahead, and try to prove one of those scans down. Prove that WWII Wolverine's healing factor is weaker then current downgraded Wolverine's. I already pointed out your mistake between WWI and WWII. Good job reading your favorite character's comics! But that is besides the point. Go ahead and do this: "Prove that WWII Wolverine's healing factor is weaker than current downgraded Wolverine." I concede he doesn't have his adamantium skeleton. Doesn't stop a bullet going into his brain. A single bullet is all it takes, and THAT's been shown THREE TIMES ON PANEL. Go ahead and try to equivocate around it. ON PANEL EVIDENCE takes precedence over your personal tastes.
You had it right all the way back on page 27. Why do you continue to act like you have anything further to contribute when you already conceded this debate? I don't even need to own you. You managed to get owned waaaay before I decided to step back in. The further scan-spanking is just shoveling more dirt over the grave of your arguments.
Out of the four times Wolverine's fought the Punisher in a comic, one was interrupted by the bad guy, Punisher's clearly won twice, Wolverine won one. Punisher's ahead. And the most recent four times Wolverine's confronted bullets? Put down. This thread isn't so hard. What you fail to realize is I give Wolverine credit. But I don't give him the majority. Punisher's going to have a tough time, but the odds are slightly in his favor, especially since Wolverine's healing factor is downgraded.
Ah, I thought you were trying to say that the feat was before the Lazaer "upgrade" as you like to call it.
So then we're to assume that characters can do things that are physically impossible for the even the characters being discussed because.. Oh right because you say so dammit!
I suppose then that Wolverine can stab through an Adamantium skull with severe ease because hell, a writer was ignorant enough not to know Sabes had Adamantium at the time.. But Wolverine did it so it must be true.
Wolverine can cut through Adamantium like a machete through wet paper! Woohoo!
Hell, even ignoring the fact that it's physically impossible for Wolverine to have that happen to him and even contradicted by him being shot in the eye by a massive mechanized tank piercing gun.... in that instance, Wolverine was getting up immediately after being shot... he wasn't "put down" until Scrambler got ahold of his head...
So.. IRRELEVANT.
No, it's a fault that you fail to realize that it took an advance healing factor to even get DP to that point without dying. Punisher doesn't have an advanced healing factor he would have been dropped well before getting to that point... It's IRRELEVANT. THAT'S a fault of your argument.
Everybody else being you Phantom Zone, and Sado? Yeah....
If you're going to throw ten dollar words at me at least spell them correctly please. It's amazing that you can come off as arrogant and ignorant at the same time.
Listen, there's no authority that says Punisher can do what DP did to Logan, or that Punisher can do what Scalphunter did to him... So what's there to resist? The delusion that he can.
Of course we're not going to compromise on something that we think is strictly ridiculous.
Punisher would get the crap stomped out of him in any scenario where he'd be close enough to even TRY putting a bullet into Logan's brain the way Deadpool did.
By bullets in the brain perhaps... Which is fine, but using an example that is 1) outdated by secondary mutations and 2) IRRELEVANT due to an Adamantium skeleton isn't the best way to support an already failing argument.
I appreciate on panel evidence that's suitable to use for the arguments at hand. I appreciate non circumstantial evidence that doesn't fail to represent comparable scenarios or points that are being made here.....
Is your evidence suitable? No!
Is it circumstantial? You bet your ass.
Unless Punisher is holding up in a desert based warehouse, can shoot with the equivalence of five men using full auto, and Wolverine's not inclined to fight back because he's not hostile towards Punisher so he just takes the abuse for an undetermined amount of time, then sure that example works just fine.
If Punisher can reality warp to the point that Wolverine's Adamantium skull doesn't act like a regular skull anymore in spite of it being artistically represented as such on about a dozen different occasions already then I guess the Scalphunter example works too... Especially since Wolverine's getting up one panel after it happened... But hey he dropped to the floor and that's all that counts right?
If Punisher has a DP (I can heal from goo) healing factor, then that example's perfect for this thread!
If Punisher's reality warping abilities can not only revert Wolverine's healing factor by 60 years but also completely strip him of his Adamantium TOO?!?! Then man.. I guess you totally got us beat eh?
And yet...
"I mean, Wolverine's HF dealt with hundreds of bullets in a desert environment better than it did in the early 90's, it countered everything DP with prep could throw his way, it had him getting up in one panel after being shot in the brain (better than Sabretooth from three years ago) and then up again in three panels after Scrambler (a power nullifying mutant) got ahold of him. He got up a page after having his insides incinerated by a plasma blast after fighting half the Wrecking Crew, and up a couple panels after having his upper half incinerated by a Super Skrull using Scott's eyebeams with a fire inducing enhancement."
When you start your hypocitical, nonsense filled rants do you even stop to think for a moment, or are you not aware that these feats are also after the Lazaer deal?
2 out of your 4 examples don't show that Wolverine's can be downed by bullets and only bullets.. One uses the desert environment which implies limitations on Wolverine's HF as it is. The other is after Deadpool threw everything he had at Wolverine and the kitchen sink before he finally had to blast him in the brain pan.
Then your other two examples? One's from Wolverine in the 40's.. yeah great evidence there.
The other has Wolverine getting up immediately after getting shot...
But hey, it's only YOUR perception of the character that matters right? The one that goes down to bullets free of circumstantial evidence, physical impossibility, or the fact that it wasn't only bullets...
Because we have rules on this forum that are supposed to prohibit people from using PIS to support their arguments... Ennis who writes Wolverine taking rocket launchers to the gut, shotgun blasts to the face, state to state punches to the face from Hulk, and steam rollers in Ennis' own writing to having him downed by a throat chop or a bat to the balls shows a massive inconsistency in that VERY SAME writing. Which instances there were uncharacteristic compared to multiple contradictory examples and only served to further the plot so Punisher had an excuse to live to the next panel? Well I'd tell you but that might shatter YOUR perception of the character..
And uh. Way to show off your ignorance again. There's been 4 encounters between Frank and Wolverine. Frank's been left for dead and on the ground in two of them, one ended before either gained any real advantage and then.. Ennis...
I already did... Hell you already did. lol.
Logan getting up from a bullet to the brain in one panel is faster than Sabretooth's from three years ago who Wolverine said had a faster HF than himself at the time.
Wolverine's still been dealing with damage faster and better than he ever did before his Adamantium removal and even in many many instances afterwards in either case... Better than before Azrael and himself made there deal in many instances.
__________________ "damn jinzin, you're a real trooper, you provde fact after fact and pages and pages of proof and these wanton miscreants just keep at it"~MERC
The only thing I failed to read was your post correctly... If you were so good at reading and comprehension, you would realize that.
Already did...
And context takes precedence over ONE PANEL of artwork.
One bullet didn't actually put Logan down as he was getting up.
One was after a maelstrom of bombs, guns, and blades from DP.
and One was an example from the 40's.
So me asking another member for specification before I had 1) context of the anti feat and 2) multiple new feats that show off Wolverine's current HF as not being handicapped in the least shows a concession to the debate? lol.. I suppose if you're delusional enough to think that Ennis does good character representation, that you're owning Cresh, or that Wolverine's HF from the 40's is equivalent to today's, it's not much a stretch to believe that too...
..The hell? What two fights do you think Wolverine lost to Punisher?... The Ennis fight is the only real fight he's ever got an advantage against Wolverine in, and even then that's only evidence that Punisher was in the process of winning. There's multiples of evidence that dictates Punisher would have lost had that battle continued anyway...
lol I love how delusioned you are to think that in spite of everything else that's been pointed out to you, it's still someone else who's failing to realize something... lmao.
__________________ "damn jinzin, you're a real trooper, you provde fact after fact and pages and pages of proof and these wanton miscreants just keep at it"~MERC
By your reasoning Frank doesn't stand a chance as there's a scan of wolverine having climed out and walked away after falling intoa vat of molten steel. By your reasoning Frank doesn't stand a chance because there's scans of Wolverine taking mushroom cloud explosions with his pants intact.
You fail at anatomy again. The adamantum vertebrae would be in the way. The Brain is completely encased withinbone, and thusly in Wolverine's case adamantium
Actually it indicates you've failed to prove your case. which is a flaw in your arguments: Evidence that Punisher will be able to reproduce these events post adamantium skeleton.
CAlling us stubborn does'nt help your case any, especially when you use two synonyms of the big words that you were using to try and make yourself look intelligent.
Not only is this an ad populem argument it's also a blatent lie. Did you not see where I went through the thread and found that 7 people supported punisher while 22 supported wolverine?
Talk about desperate when you have to resort to lies like this... oh and make it 7 to 23 with Ricardo Potter.
But you have no grasp of concept of minority vs Majority so like you fail at anatomy you also fail at math.
Using events from ww2 does not count as within the last couple of months. That's like using a flashback as evidnce against someone.. oh wait... that's exactly what you're doing.
Not when its' pis or is irrelivent. I can post a scan of Spiderman fighting the hulk and that'd have as much weight as your pre-upgrade scans.
[ Which you still sorely lack.
Which you tend to ignore as well.
You fail at logic with your hypocricy.
Anatomy, Math, Truth, Logic...
You know you still haven't proven this...
Want to use einnis's stuff? Did you notice how Wolverine took a shotgun blast to the face and didn't even notice it?
Oops... so much for your Bullets>logan theory.
How hypocritial of you... You really should stop trolling
You already did that, remember? That was pre-adamantium skeleton, and pre-bone claw healing factor boost.
Prove that it's downgraded. Yiou ignore context.
Anatomy. Math, Truth, Logic, Context. Man you fail hard don't you?
You fail at anatomy so hard...
As opposed to the times when he's taken more bullets than one... You fail at math again.
That's what you're doing.
Good, cause you can't wih your failures at anatomy, math, truth, logic, context...
Failure at honesty again. Wishful thinking fallacy.
God you're one deluded troll reported by the way.
You fail at honesty with your biadsed fanboyism.
Prove it. And quit ignoring your opponents arguments.
Carver doesn't fail at anatomy, comic writers do. If you're going to discount Carver's point on the basis of it being inaccurate with real anatomy, then you're going to have to disregard many feats in comics that stand in the face of science, physics, and facts.
Also, Logan's anatomy doesn't make sense. Wolverine fans (Jinzin and Battlehammer) have often pointed out that Logan's skeleton is all one piece (hence he doesnt fall apart when burned to the bone)...that would also fail the rules of anatomy.
Wolverine's never been pulled apart, Wolverine's skeleton is always shown as one connected piece.
His Skull, has been depicted as a regular human skull having bone behind the sockets and being a rounded orb which a bullet would not penetrate under the jaw line. There's even evidence supporting that as he was shot in the eye by an anti-aircraft gun and it didn't go in his brain.
__________________ "damn jinzin, you're a real trooper, you provde fact after fact and pages and pages of proof and these wanton miscreants just keep at it"~MERC
1. You have not proven that its a highier number
2. Its more than two. Its about 5
Despite the fcat that hes done in without Einnis.
Nope it was not Einnis I think it was Larry Hama. It defintely was not Einnis.
Yeah thats why I said I could settle for 5/10, that indicates that I want things to be done only my way.
Well first of all theres more than two showings concerning bullets. If you want to talk about class 100s hes been KOed by much less eg US Agent, Pip the Troll etc etc.
Well actually in Wolverine issue 1 volume 3 it was only two people. I think the best or one of the best gunmen in marvel can be more dangerous than two guys.
KMC Community Forums
Apr 12th, 2008 03:56 AM
Attachment: 
Especially relevant ones. Especially relevant ones that are the most current. There, there lil baby. Scan-spanking isn't meant to hurt you, only make you a lil smarter in the future. It's what I do.
WW2 is before he had the adamantium removed and his healing factor got boosted... But oh that's right let's not actually read any comics with wolverine on them, just use scans found on the internet.
So.... you don't need to go into his past but choose to bring up a WWII example of his HF to describe what he can do currently?
"damn jinzin, you're a real trooper, you provde fact after fact and pages and pages of proof and these wanton miscreants just keep at it"~MERC
