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Home » Star Wars » Star Wars: TV Series » New on the Live-Action Star Wars Show


New on the Live-Action Star Wars Show
Started by: SnakeEyes

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Jovan
Forbidden Drag

Registered: Apr 2008
Location: Belgium


 

I believe the better the FX the lousier Lucas's work gets... In the original trilogy he had to work around the technical impossibilities, meaning he had to write himself out of trouble. Now he just puts his guys of ILM at work and they have to fix things with flashy FX and thus he doesn't take the trouble anymore to work on scenes that have a purpose. (Imo every scene needs a purpose or it's useless.)


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Old Post Apr 2nd, 2009 08:46 PM
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queeq
Chaos

Registered: Oct 2000
Location: JP's bed

Moderator


 

I tend to agree. I think limitations makes the work better, more creative, more focused on the things that really count.


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Old Post Apr 2nd, 2009 08:49 PM
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Jovan
Forbidden Drag

Registered: Apr 2008
Location: Belgium


 

Tend to agree? He started his downfall already in 1997 with the SE. I'm not refering to Han shooting first but for instance to the unnecessary entrence of Luke and the rest to Mos Eisley: bad CGI.
It took them till the DVD release to clean that up to a more respectable level.


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Kyuzo: Don't you see? A real sword will kill you.
Mr. Earl Brooks: If I were here to kill you, you would already be dead.
Mercedes: My mother told me to be wary of Fauns.
Mr. Le Chiffre: No, I believe in a reasonable rate of return.
James Bond: Now the whole world will know you died while you were scratching my balls!

Old Post Apr 2nd, 2009 09:05 PM
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queeq
Chaos

Registered: Oct 2000
Location: JP's bed

Moderator


 

Yeah, well, tend... because I don't understand where the innovative filmmaker that Lucas once was has gone. It's hard to understand. People like Spielberg have developed themselves well, someone like Coppola also made his best work in the 70s. But Lucas ONLY worked in the 70s until the PT. And it's well.... you saw it.


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Old Post Apr 3rd, 2009 06:28 AM
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REXXXX
Networking

Registered: Nov 2001
Location: San Diego

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Yeah, I'm not feeling you there, Ordo. AOTC had beautiful, beautiful imagery to share with the audience... but overall, I dunno. It really just does not sit right with me.

Also, the space battle from TPM over the space battle from ROTJ? I think not. I'm not saying it was shit, but I definitely did not enjoy it as much as ROTJ.

Anyways, just to keep things on topic, I hope that the live action show goes much more with the OT feel of things.


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Last edited by REXXXX on Apr 3rd, 2009 at 09:59 AM

Old Post Apr 3rd, 2009 09:56 AM
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Ordo
Enforcer of the Republic

Registered: Feb 2005
Location: Kamino Boot Camp


 

Yes. Nothing castrates a series more than enforced nostalgia by an aging fan base. I'll be bold here and hope he makes something GOOD...and it better have a REAL Mando in it. Sometimes I think Lucas intentionally is sabotaging Clone Wars to force fans to the Live action series. "Oooooo, this is so much better!" *dies*

<>

As to space battles. Naboo didn't have the emotional intensity of the Saga riding on it, but the artistry, the cinematography, the sound mixing....god its so beautiful. Even the pilots are better. The inescapable beauty that was the Death Star run is recaptured only there. (This is one reason I support the Special Editions, those added scened in the Death Star run perfect perfection).

As to AOTC, I understand why people don't like it. Maybe because its the one film that made me a fan, i dunno. The imagery plays heavily on me, but I also think its the deepest film in the saga, and that really resonates with me.


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Old Post Apr 3rd, 2009 01:30 PM
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queeq
Chaos

Registered: Oct 2000
Location: JP's bed

Moderator


 

It's not about Mando. We need a decent story and some relevant character development. Maybe he shoul hire J.J. Abrams to make it. At least he understands what it's all about. Seeing the Star Trek trailer I might even consider becoming a Star Trek fan... can't believe I said that. wink


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Old Post Apr 3rd, 2009 04:45 PM
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LordPrydon
Restricted

Registered: Apr 2009
Location: United States

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Generally I don't believe GL had a downfall, he just made the movies he wanted to for the prequel trilogy even if they did not go down well with the hardcore fans.
Having said this, I enjoy The Clone Wars series and movie a little more than the prequels which are mired in their own hype and offer very little that engages the seeming majority of the fans today as the originals did in their time.

Old Post Apr 3rd, 2009 06:08 PM
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Ordo
Enforcer of the Republic

Registered: Feb 2005
Location: Kamino Boot Camp


 

quote: (post)
Originally posted by queeq
Seeing the Star Trek trailer I might even consider becoming a Star Trek fan... can't believe I said that. wink


I feel the same way.

Star Wars has never had great character development. It would be refreshing if it had some.


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Old Post Apr 3rd, 2009 11:29 PM
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REXXXX
Networking

Registered: Nov 2001
Location: San Diego

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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Ordo
Yes. Nothing castrates a series more than enforced nostalgia by an aging fan base.


I didn't mean for the sake of nostalgia (though it would be on my part), but since it will be covering the gap between Episode III and Episode IV, it would make more sense if the series progressed away from the style of the PT and moved into the OT. It obviously will never look or quite feel like the OT, but it should be the thing that transfers us into that era.


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Old Post Apr 5th, 2009 08:26 PM
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queeq
Chaos

Registered: Oct 2000
Location: JP's bed

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As long as it's any good.


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Old Post Apr 6th, 2009 09:04 PM
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Ordo
Enforcer of the Republic

Registered: Feb 2005
Location: Kamino Boot Camp


 

Gah I wrote a long post to Rex and it got deleted.

Yes, it shoudl transfer, but a real achivement would be to transfer us from the moral relativism of the PT to the moral absolutism of the OT.

Though how you do this successfuly, I dunno, since moral absolutism is always wrong wink


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Old Post Apr 6th, 2009 10:56 PM
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queeq
Chaos

Registered: Oct 2000
Location: JP's bed

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But good for a movie.


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Old Post Apr 7th, 2009 06:33 AM
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Imaginary
blinded

Registered: Sep 2004
Location: Sydney, Australia.


 

This is being MADE? Why...? How....? Just so Lucas can get himself some more money... pfft.

If it is a bit darker and Deadwood-like, however, sounds good.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by queeq
It's not about Mando. We need a decent story and some relevant character development. Maybe he shoul hire J.J. Abrams to make it. At least he understands what it's all about. Seeing the Star Trek trailer I might even consider becoming a Star Trek fan... can't believe I said that. wink


Same here, I feel like I'm betraying myself!


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Old Post Apr 7th, 2009 07:40 AM
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REXXXX
Networking

Registered: Nov 2001
Location: San Diego

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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Ordo
Gah I wrote a long post to Rex and it got deleted.

Yes, it shoudl transfer, but a real achivement would be to transfer us from the moral relativism of the PT to the moral absolutism of the OT.

Though how you do this successfuly, I dunno, since moral absolutism is always wrong wink


Moral absolutism serves its purpose for Star Wars, though. Especially as far as the Force is concerned, where we have the Light Side and the Dark Side. Any venture towards the Dark Side results in falling to it, and any trek back the other way (in the films) is rare and nearly unheard of, making Anakin's redemption and sacrifice so much greater. Introducing moral gray to that just seems to lessen Anakin's return, as EU is doing with what Ush has called the 'Revolving Door policy,' where characters of little importance have flip-flopped from Ligh to Dark to Light again.

However, straying away from the Jedi, moral gray could be a little more acceptable in the Star Wars universe if we're talking clonetroopers or bounty hunters or politicians, etc.

Personally, I enjoy clearly defined sides to things like Star Wars. I always root for characters who are obviously good-natured to not do terrible things that would compromise their morality.


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Old Post Apr 7th, 2009 08:05 AM
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queeq
Chaos

Registered: Oct 2000
Location: JP's bed

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The greater the sacrifice. I agree, Rex.


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Old Post Apr 7th, 2009 10:47 AM
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Ordo
Enforcer of the Republic

Registered: Feb 2005
Location: Kamino Boot Camp


 

Well, personally I approach Star Wars from more of the non-Jedi side. I guess that why I see more relatavism. But I'm also a pretty big canon boy, I dont read a lot of EU (which is proably why I still think it can be good material lol).

I understand the revolving door, but there already are some moments when Vader gets over his dissociative disorder and seems to share sympathy for Luke or hesitation about Sidious.

I dunno. Whats interesting is that Han is portrayed as a morally relative character in Star Wars, but then loses that when we get to ESB. Now that I think of it, it bears further analysis on my part. Guess I'm watching the OT this weekend lol.

Regardless, I think moral relativism is more convincing than absolutism. The "revolving" door thing is annoying, but it results from a conflict between Lucas' light-dark absolutism and a lot of the EU's relativism. Lucas presents it as a doorway, which character on one side or the other. However, Lucas always presents this as dichotomous (the split light on Luke's face during his duel with Vader in ROTJ). One action makes you darkside. It does make the personal choice greater, but it also seems to eliminate the need for the force as a morality. If our character is determined by choice, the force has no role and is simply an ability, a reflection of ourselves.

The EU has added the revolving door, where there are transition states. To compromise, you get characters popping in one side and going out the other, flipping back and forth through this unstable transition state. This is annoying (I agree) and why I dont look at it that way.

Instead, everyone is in the revolving door all the time, you can never exit to one side or the other. This is more of a Potentium/Living Force view, but its not really canon, though I do find it applicable to the films in many, but not all, respects. I just find morally ambiguous character more entertaining, more applicable to my life...which makes their triumphs or failure more applicable to my life.

<><><>

Though speaking of the Qui-Gon's "Living Force"... THAT would be cool to have in the show, an old Jedi Master who adhered to that view. Perhaps he could converted to Yoda's absolutism "do or do not, there is no try."


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Old Post Apr 7th, 2009 04:13 PM
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Ushgarak
Paladin

Registered: Sep 2000
Location: Chelmsford, Essex, UK

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Star Wars is simply an absolutist story, that's how it is. The whole point with han- totally boring as he has sadly become by ROTJ, one of that film's flaws- is that he really IS a good guy, he's just trying to deny it throughout ANH, and is trying to get comfy as one in ESB.

There are so m any other franchises that are relativst, I am happy to have Star Wars as the one where good and evil are very clear concepts.

The Living Force is just about instincts and being sensitive to others; all Jedi can do that, QGJ just ran with it furhter. There was no moral implication to it, and QGJ was seeing things in the same absolustist terms as everyone else. His methods differed, is all.


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Old Post Apr 7th, 2009 05:01 PM
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Ordo
Enforcer of the Republic

Registered: Feb 2005
Location: Kamino Boot Camp


 

I disagree that Star Wars is absolutist. There are characters like Lando (who, like Han is a "good guy" then a "bad guy" then a "good guy" again. Padme' openly questions the War in ROTS and Anakin blindly believes in it. As to Han, he IS a scoundrel, he just falls in love and that makes him a better person. He doesn't know how to cope with love. He's not a closet "good guy."

Unfortuantely for Lucas, relativism is realism and he fails to present an airtight portraytal of his ideas because he portrays them in a semi-realistic medium.

Please stop saying "Thats how it is." We've been discussing people's opinions here.


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Old Post Apr 7th, 2009 05:42 PM
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REXXXX
Networking

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Location: San Diego

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Even with Lando and Han are reputedly low-life scoundrels, they aren't bad people. They are good guys at heart, even if they do less-than-legal things. Lando sells out to Vader because he doesn't want stormtroopers destroying the lifestyle of the people of Cloud City, but when Vader 'alters the deal' and the occupation is basically permanent, he joins our heroes in their fight against the Empire because dealing with them (the bad guys) doesn't work.

Sure, Padme questions the war, but we the viewer know that the war is being manipulated by Sidious, who is Palpatine, who is evil incarnate. She's obviously not promoting some ill motive in saying that the war might be wrong or that they might be on the wrong side.


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Old Post Apr 8th, 2009 01:05 AM
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