And befor you say something to the effect of "Well that feat's not on par with someone like Superman's" let me just say that I'm not claiming that it is. I'm just showing it in the hopes that you quit saying rediculous things like "his fight with Wolverine proves that he's slow and doesn't have super speed".
Last edited by darthgoober on Feb 24th, 2010 at 05:17 AM
It's obvious Thor has superspeed and crazy reflexes. No one is suggesting that he has them in the same manner Superman does, but he has enough of both to suggest that he won't get overwhelmed by sheer speed. I don't even know where that myth originated from.
so do you think hulk would be overwhelmed by sheer speed? do you think anyone in comics would be overwhelmed by sheer speed...because I guarantee you that every established character in comics has impressive speed reaction feats
by that logic, everyone has superspeed and no one will be overwhelmed by speed.
I do think that speed is often overrated and some posters do believe it translates into instant victory.
As far as Thor's own reflexes and superspeed goes, he has numerous on panel depictions of being able to hit both incredibly fast moving targets as well as move fast on his own. When said instances are brought up, they're usually dismissed as PIS or being "too old" to count when as far as I know, all of his feats are valid, especially since Thor hasn't been retconned or explicitly reduced in power aside from gaining/losing the OF.
The idea that because Thor doesn't explicitly become a blur of motion while traveling or "omgz speedblitz combo to ko" somehow equaling "lawlz, Thor is slow and he's can't people who r fast and shit!" is retarded, plain and simple. It's correct in assuming that Thor isn't know for being a "speedy" kind of character, but completely incorrect to assume that because he doesn't display overt speed feats ala Superman/Sentry/Glads/Other A-Typical Hero types he gets overwhelmed by speed in a forum setting.
I never said speed would spell instant victory over thor, but I do believe it to be an major and perhaps decisive factor in a hypothetical fight between Superman and Thor under KMC settings
in a comic, no doubt Superman wouldn't even blitz thor...nor would thor use alot of his hammer powers.
but on KMC, thor would use such powers and superman would attempt speedblitzes. would thor be completely overwhelmed...most likely not. but I think superman would gain enough of an edge with his speed to eventually win.
the thing is, comic writers make it very clear who the fast characters are (as you list, ie superman, sentry, gladiator). don't you find it odd that a new character like sentry already is far more established in the speed department than thor is...well, its not odd if you accept that speed isn't thor's strength. yes, he has some reaction feats against speed, and maybe 30 years ago he has some onetime feats of debatable speed, but anyone who reads thor's comics will not claim him to be a speedy character whereas if you read even 2 or 3 of sentry's comics, you know he's damn fast.
that difference doesn't play a huge role in comicbook fights because speed is underrated in comics. On KMC however, I believe speed becomes a much bigger factor.
its for the same reason why hulk never seems to suffer a disadvantage in comics in terms of his mobility, but in a KMC fight, he is obviously outclassed in mobility...wouldn't you agree?
The problem with what you're saying as far as Superman using speed and Thor using exotic hammer powers is more of a CIS thing than anything. Under forum rules they fight at the best of their ability, yes, but still in character. Thor will brawl more often than not, but his brawling WILL be as good as it ever has been shown outside of an amp or PIS. Likewise, Superman will brawl with some HV or superbreath thrown in, but it WILL be to the best of his ability.
Again the idea that Thor doesn't use superspeed for the purposes of moving very fast in terms of transportation (usually) or fly about a dozen or so fists in a blur equaling he doesn't have superspeed and is disadvantaged against characters with superspeed that use it more overtly than him is ridiculous. It's even more ridiculous when you begin to factor in Thor's skill and other powerset and the fact he's not stupid. I mean, if Thor - for some reason - can't tag a vastly moving target by his preferred (see: wailing with Mjolnir) method, why wouldn't he spin the hammer in a defensive arc as he's been shown to do god knows how many times on panel? Why wouldn't he just start raining lightning bolts around? Why wouldn't he omniblast? By that very same token, if Superman is trading blow for blow with Thor and is feeling the effects of Thor's enchanted weapon, why would Superman just shrug it off and continue to do so instead of changing things up? I'd like to think both characters are smart enough to, y'know, change tactics before they get KOed and I know both are good enough to do so before that happens, anyway.
As far as Hulk goes, he's been alluded or outright stated to have a preternatural ability to hit very fast moving targets. And even he's not so stupid (usually) to repeatedly allow himself to be struck by a moving target without regrouping or thunderclapping or something similar.
It's like people, and it's disturbing to see, honestly believe that combo-to-ko bullshit. That once a fast character begins to strike a character who is slower than him, OH SHIT! The fight's over.
There is nothing conceptually wrong about "Combo-to-KO", but how it is applied is quite specific to each matchup/battle.
If I had even low-level Superspeed and say we are both average humans with same strength and durability, whats wrong with the theory that if I get the first heavy hit on you, that I couldn't then continue pummeling you til you were out cold? If someone punched you hard in the face, would you be able to immediately retaliate? No, you'd be momentarily stunned, and the chances of recovering is close to none if I repeatedly kept punching you in the head with my super speed.
I think most people's objection to this theory is because it would spell an easy and almost certain defeat against their character in some fights. Again, of course, whether this is viable or not depends on the specific matchup. But for the most part, if the person receiving the super speed blows doesn't have any other powers other than comparable strength and durability, then its not looking good for them.