I'd say a Borg Cube would win. The Death Star is a relatively stationary target and it's main gun is on one side of it's hull and takes a prolonged firing sequence to use. Borg sensors would be able to tell that the firing sequence was commencing as well as override and shut the process down. The Enterprise D had more advanced systems than the Death Star had, and in it's first encounter with the Borg (when Q tossed them to the Delta Quadrant to prove they weren't ready for what was out there) Picard and crew were essentially helpless to prevent the Borg from scanning them or accessing their systems. The Death Star would face the same issue. Coupled with the Cube just needing to stay out of the line of site aim of the Death Star's main gun, I can't see the Death Star winning. Everyone on the ship save Vader and Palpatine would likely be assimilated, and all they'd have to do is shut down life support on the station and the two Sith will eventually suffocate, if the Death Star isn't blown up outright.
So, does the Death Star not get the four capital ships and thousands of fighters and craft it houses?
__________________ Recently Produced and Distributed Young but High-Ranking Political Figure of Royal Ancestry within the Modern American Town Affectionately Referred To as Bel-Air.
Don't think it would matter considering all imperial forces use the same type of weaponry. Once the Cube adapts to the Star Destroyer's, or even a Tie Fighter's weapons fire, it becomes a downhill battle for the Borg. Death Star's main gun is pretty much their only shot unless Vader and or Palpatine can force crush the Cube outright.
The laser bolts from Star Wars put out in the gigaton range with every shot. What is the maximum amount of energy Borg shields can adapt to?
__________________ Recently Produced and Distributed Young but High-Ranking Political Figure of Royal Ancestry within the Modern American Town Affectionately Referred To as Bel-Air.
Not sure, but given that the Millennium Falcon was able to take multiple shots to it's deflectors and hull from both Tie Fighters and Star Destroyers without the benefit of adaptive shielding, I'm of the opinion that a Borg Cube's shields and regenerative hull which routinely deflect and adapt to full yield phaser and photon torpedo fire, and even eventually quantum torpedoes, can withstand laser fire.
The Falcon actually had a shield up--remember the line "If we lose the shield, we'll be sitting ducks". The smaller guns on the fighters aren't putting out in the gigaton range--those are the stats for the hull-mounted turbolasers, but they're still very powerful nonetheless. There was a site a few years back that put the numbers from SW and Star Trek up side by side, and SW came out on top in terms of sheer firepower. It's authenticity is up in the air, so I'm hoping someone can provide a quote from the show or an official encyclopedia that details Trek's output.
EDIT: This thread (Nai's posts) is the best I know of on KMC where someone who knows Trek and SW intimately can argue for both. He favored Star Wars, but if there are any updates to Trek's canon since then, it'd be good to add them.
__________________ Recently Produced and Distributed Young but High-Ranking Political Figure of Royal Ancestry within the Modern American Town Affectionately Referred To as Bel-Air.
Last edited by Lord Lucien on Oct 7th, 2012 at 05:13 AM
Death Star Stomps 1 blast and its over, if that does not workd. Vader would slash through all of them and no adapting to a lightsaber, or force-lighting from the Emperor.
__________________ Don't play games with me General
Last edited by Supra on Jan 17th, 2013 at 01:12 AM
How, its not a projectile or a frequency. The handle contains a power cell. Adegan crystals focus the energy of the power cell into the beam that can cut or burn through anything. Hell he could just start slicing up the ship from the inside. And have Palatine tossing and zapping everyone else. No adapting to force powers.
Last edited by Supra on Jan 17th, 2013 at 01:39 AM
Each Borg drone has his/her own personal force field generator, ie shields. Stands to reason they could adapt their shields to stop a lightsabre, after "x" amount of drones are killed from one.
That is, what are the limits of Borg shields? Like, if you fire the death star laser at two drones, can the third resist it? If you cut down two drones with a beam of super magic plasma, can the third resist it?
Also, what is the range of adaption--distance wise? Like, if a group of drones adapt to the frequency of one phaser, does the entire collective--as in, every drone in the galaxy adapt to it as well? What is the spatial/numerical range of adaptation? Is it just that specific weapon they're adapting to, or what? When does the adaptation wear off? Does the Federation have to keep upping the power output of their weapons every tome one of their soldiers or vessels fire at the Borg?
Also, what exactly are they adapting to? I've only ever heard of them adapting "frequencies". But they've been shown to be vulnerable to physical matter and kinetic energy, of which the plasma in a lightsaber and blaster bolt is, so... what happens then?
Tell me! AAAHHH!
__________________ Recently Produced and Distributed Young but High-Ranking Political Figure of Royal Ancestry within the Modern American Town Affectionately Referred To as Bel-Air.
Saying something like "a lightsabre can cut through anything" would be a no limit fallacy. I gave a reason and example of how the Borg drones could possibly adapt to a lightsabre. It's a blade of super-heated plasma, not a beam so powerful that it can destroy a planet in one hit or something outside the realm of physics like magic.
Borg have adapted to "physical matter" and "kinetic energy". Klingons and Romulans use blaster-like weapons somewhat similar as seen in Star Wars, that fire bolts of heated energy that has mass behind it. Even phasers have some kinetic energy behind the beam, as we see people getting tossed back form a hit.
Both phasers(not all) and blasers(not all) are classified as "particle weapons" and both in some incarnations use plasma as a medium. They're really not all that different.
So what are the adaptation limits of Borg? What's their threshold of adaptation, how long does it last, what's the spatial distance, and the numerical (number of drones/ships) limit?
__________________ Recently Produced and Distributed Young but High-Ranking Political Figure of Royal Ancestry within the Modern American Town Affectionately Referred To as Bel-Air.
So far, there's really only one thing shown to be utterly impervious to the Borg. Species 8472 with their evolutionary apex biology and their bio-based technology from another dimension.
Phasers and disruptors aside prior to adaptation, Klingon bat-leths(ie handheld edged weapons) and holographic bullets have felled Borg drones,and Data's positronic brain showed resistance. But none of those were stated to be invulnerable to adaptation indefinitely. eg We do see the Borg adapt to stabby weapons by learning to dodge/avoid, after a couple of their friends didn't bother to.
I assume bat-leths aren't imbued with magic, the powers of the gods, or energy in some way, they're just blades?
So we know drones can be killed with physical material, explosions, not-real bullets, and a certain amount of energy (whatever that limit may be). I'm going to assume that since the Federation et al. are capable of withstanding the Borg over several generations and many encounters, that the Borg shields have limitations to them, both in durability, range, and duration. We also know they couldn't assimilate a piece of technology that exists within their universe and it's own laws of physics. That's the drones covered. As soldiers capable of taking on, and taking over the soldiers and technology in the Death Star... I think it unlikely they'll get far.
What about their ships? What are their shields like? Do they adapt too? Same thing--limits, range, etc? Are the ships' shields different in some fundamental to the drone shields, or are they just larger versions of the same technology? The Death Star just needs one shot to destroy a cube. And a "fully manned and operational" (according to the OP) Death Star has thousands of fighters, gunboats, and several capital ships. How do the weapons and shields of the Borg ships match up against those?
__________________ Recently Produced and Distributed Young but High-Ranking Political Figure of Royal Ancestry within the Modern American Town Affectionately Referred To as Bel-Air.
Last edited by Lord Lucien on Jan 17th, 2013 at 04:58 AM
If you're going to use PSI/CSI as a means to say how shitty the Borg are(cos on paper, the Borg shouldn't lose to the Federation), please apply that same 'logic' to the Empire, were they were beaten my furry midgets and stone-age technology. Ergo, the Borg stomp the Death Star on that merit alone. But let's not be idiots and not do that.
The advantage the Borg have over Death Star personal, the Borg can replenish their troops by potentially assimilating anyone into a Drone, from the lowest Death Star janitor to Palpatine, though I'd say Palpatine would be very difficult to assimilate. Also, adapting to their weapons(blasters) in time. In a melee fight, it's the Storm Troopers fight to win, as Borg drones are physically very strong and the Troopers would have to come into range of the Drones assimilation injectors. Thereby turning a Storm Trooper into a Drone Trooper
Borg ships have adaptive shields and the the ships can regenerate, though they have to go to "sleep" for this to happen.
The Death Star hitting a Borg Cube would be highly unlikely. The weapon needs some measure of time to build up, the Borg have censors and would be aware of this massive energy build-up and a Borg Cube unlike a planet isn't set in a predictable moving pattern, they can move away which way. They can also fire/attack while at warp speeds, But yes, if the Death Star's beam were to hit, I'd venture it'd destroy the Cube.
One Borg cube ****ed shit up in Battle Wolf 359. 39 starships were destroyed and was about to being assimilating Earth.
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