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Gladiator (kallark) vs Thor Odinson -- strength feats
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Rage.Of.Olympus
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Iight, then tell me what scene you're referring to. Or PM if you must.


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Old Post Jun 20th, 2011 06:38 AM
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zopzop
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Not for anything some of those Thor scans are nothing but hyperbole. I mean we see the narrator or Thor or whoever claiming "planet busting" power but we don't see it on panel, unlike with the Gladiator scans.

Also re : the sky skyscraper feats, Gladiator's skyscraper is fully constructed while Thor's is mostly steel beams and Thor was struggling. Think about how many thousands (tens of thousands?) of tons more weight would have been added to the building had it been covered with concrete and brick like Glads skyscraper was? Also Thor needed Spider-man's help, Gladiator needed no help.

Thor had BRB's help lifting Asgard, Gladiator had no help moving that massive Shi'ar space station loaded with god knows how much tons of weapons on his kamikaze run and he did it at superspeed.


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Old Post Jun 20th, 2011 06:45 AM
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psycho gundam
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was thor tugging hydro base posted yet?


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Old Post Jun 20th, 2011 07:00 AM
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Rage.Of.Olympus
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by zopzop
Not for anything some of those Thor scans are nothing but hyperbole. I mean we see the narrator or Thor or whoever claiming "planet busting" power but we don't see it on panel, unlike with the Gladiator scans.

Also re : the sky skyscraper feats, Gladiator's skyscraper is fully constructed while Thor's is mostly steel beams and Thor was struggling. Think about how many thousands (tens of thousands?) of tons more weight would have been added to the building had it been covered with concrete and brick like Glads skyscraper was? Also Thor needed Spider-man's help, Gladiator needed no help.

Thor had BRB's help lifting Asgard, Gladiator had no help moving that massive Shi'ar space station loaded with god knows how much tons of weapons on his kamikaze run and he did it at superspeed.


I guess dividing my post up into sections was pointless.

If you don't think Thor's Skyscraper feat (Thor was affected by outside factors during the showing, hence the struggle) is as impressive as Gladiator's, then Thor/Bill lifting Asgard easily trumps it. Asgard is a city.

And in turn, the Midgard Serpent feat is easily more impressive strength wise than moving the Shi'ar vessel. The ship was stated to be as big as a complex or what have you, while the Serpent encircled the entire planet.

For the record, I'm pretty sure the ship had some type of thrusters -I remember them taking off from the planet- it is a star ship after all. Said feat also took all of the power at his command, and I believe it's worth noting that he died in the explosion which IIRC destroyed a mountain or something.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by psycho gundam
was thor tugging hydro base posted yet?

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e.../TowIsland1.jpg
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e.../TowIsland2.jpg
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e.../TowIsland3.jpg


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Last edited by Rage.Of.Olympus on Jun 20th, 2011 at 07:05 AM

Old Post Jun 20th, 2011 07:03 AM
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Rage.Of.Olympus
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Old Post Jun 20th, 2011 07:18 AM
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zopzop
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
I guess dividing my post up into sections was pointless.

If you don't think Thor's Skyscraper feat (Thor was affected by outside factors during the showing, hence the struggle) is as impressive as Gladiator's, then Thor/Bill lifting Asgard easily trumps it. Asgard is a city.

And in turn, the Midgard Serpent feat is easily more impressive strength wise than moving the Shi'ar vessel. The ship was stated to be as big as a complex or what have you, while the Serpent encircled the entire planet.

For the record, I'm pretty sure the ship had some type of thrusters -I remember them taking off from the planet- it is a star ship after all. Said feat also took all of the power at his command, and I believe it's worth noting that he died in the explosion which IIRC destroyed a mountain or something.


http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e.../TowIsland1.jpg
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e.../TowIsland2.jpg
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e.../TowIsland3.jpg


Rage, Thor AND BRB lifting something isn't the same as Thor lifting it by himself no?

The skyscraper feat, even assuming Thor was affected by the gas, still pales to Gladiator's feat because Thor's skyscraper was "bare-bones" it wasn't fully constructed. Gladiator's had THOUSANDS of tons of concrete and other material adding to it's weight because it was fully constructed.

The Midgard Serpent feat is awesome and no one is taking away from that.

It should be noted that the Hydro Base feat, while nice, isn't all it's cracked up to be; since Hydro Base is a floating island. All Thor was doing was pulling it along. It's like those little tugboats that pull those huge @$$ ships. The water is carrying the weight, the tugboats are just providing the thrust.


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Old Post Jun 20th, 2011 07:19 AM
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Rage.Of.Olympus
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by zopzop
Rage, Thor AND BRB lifting something isn't the same as Thor lifting it by himself no?


Did I ever say otherwise? If you cut the weight of Asgard in half, it's still easily more impressive than lifting a single Skyscraper. That's the entire point.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by zopzop
The skyscraper feat, even assuming Thor was affected by the gas, still pales to Gladiator's feat because Thor's skyscraper was "bare-bones" it wasn't fully constructed. Gladiator's had THOUSANDS of tons of concrete and other material adding to it's weight because it was fully constructed.

The Midgard Serpent feat is awesome and no one is taking away from that.


If you think it's noticeably less impressive, then you can use the Asgard scene. It's why I posted both, as I was unsure.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by zopzop
It should be noted that the Hydro Base feat, while nice, isn't all it's cracked up to be; since Hydro Base is a floating island. All Thor was doing was pulling it along. It's like those little tugboats that pull those huge @$$ ships. The water is carrying the weight, the tugboats are just providing the thrust.


I only posted the scene because PG inquired about it. I'm not using it as any evidence.


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Old Post Jun 20th, 2011 07:23 AM
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JakeTheBank
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Not sure if this was posted or not, but doesn't Thor have a feat where he pushes down a pillar with his legs and the narration claims its hundreds of tons? Small stuff in comparison to what he's done before, but it's a nice leg strength feat, I'd wager.


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Old Post Jun 20th, 2011 07:28 AM
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Rage.Of.Olympus
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http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e...TonArchRock.jpg

Is that the one? It was a million tons by the way.


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Old Post Jun 20th, 2011 07:33 AM
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JakeTheBank
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Yeah, pretty sure that was it. It was def Kirby/Lee era Thor.


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Old Post Jun 20th, 2011 07:35 AM
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Rage.Of.Olympus
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I'd wager that's the scene you're referring to. No other moment springs to mind.

Can we now safely conclude that in terms of feats, Gladiator has failed in matching Thor much less proving that he's about twice as strong as an individual has claimed?

As far as I can tell, Gladiator's best showings are lifting a Skyscraper, moving a Shi'ar Starship and destroying a planet. He also claimed that he could move a planet and collapse a Star I believe. Impressive no doubt, but Thor has him beat.


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Last edited by Rage.Of.Olympus on Jun 20th, 2011 at 08:34 AM

Old Post Jun 20th, 2011 08:29 AM
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Simbon
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus

Can we now safely conclude that in terms of feats, Gladiator has failed miserably in matching Thor much less proving that he's about twice as strong as an individual has claimed?

As far as I can tell, Gladiator's best showings are lifting a Skyscraper, moving a Shi'ar Starship and destroying a planet. Impressive, but simply not on the same level.


Actually... They do kind of seem on the same level. I like this thread mostly because it's so one-sided, but I haven't seen anything that puts Thor in a different class. At best it simply combats the notion that Glads is on a different level.


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Old Post Jun 20th, 2011 08:34 AM
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Rage.Of.Olympus
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I've never argued that Thor is noticeably stronger than Gladiator -although I'd give him the edge- but the other side has been determined in arguing that Gladiator has the edge. I honestly don't see how anyone could argue that Thor is not at least his physical equal.

In regards to feats, the World Engine feat, rocking entities like Surtur, busting through Celestial armor, destroying -with aid from Bill- an object noticeably larger than Stars, striking power -with Mjolnir- on a Universal scale etc. is all far more impressive than destroying a single planet with a few all out strikes, which is about Gladiator's best feat. Thor resisting the gravity of a Neutron Star alone is on par with Gladiator's best feat in my book. From there, he can go higher, Gladiator can't.

Frankly, Thor stalemating the Hulk for extended periods in strength or an entity like Kurse when enraged is at least as impressive as anything Gladiator has done in my book.

I'm sorry, but destroying a planet just isn't that impressive to me. Drax destroyed a planet in a clash with Thanos and ripped apart a Star. Captain Marvell held his own against this Drax IIRC and yet despite being noticeably amped, was getting his ass handed to him by Thor not too long afterward.


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Last edited by Rage.Of.Olympus on Jun 20th, 2011 at 08:44 AM

Old Post Jun 20th, 2011 08:38 AM
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zopzop
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
I've never argued that Thor is noticeably stronger than Gladiator -although I'd give him the edge- but the other side has been determined in arguing that Gladiator has the edge. I honestly don't see how anyone could argue that Thor is not at least his physical equal.

In regards to feats, the World Engine feat, rocking entities like Surtur, busting through Celestial armor, destroying -with aid from Bill- an object noticeably larger than Stars, striking power -with Mjolnir- on a Universal scale etc. is all far more impressive than destroying a planet, which is about Gladiator's best feat.


Dude the majority of the stuff you mentioned isn't because of Thor's personal power but Mjolnir's. This isn't Mjolnir feats vs Gladiator feats. It's Thor's strength feats vs Gladiator's strength feats.

PS quick question, that Thor vs Midgard Serpent thing, what issue did it take place in? And are you arguing that Thor lifted the thing? Or merely dislodged it from the Earth?


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Old Post Jun 20th, 2011 08:42 AM
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Rage.Of.Olympus
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by zopzop
Dude the majority of the stuff you mentioned isn't because of Thor's personal power but Mjolnir's. This isn't Mjolnir feats vs Gladiator feats. It's Thor's strength feats vs Gladiator's strength feats.

PS quick question, that Thor vs Midgard Serpent thing, what issue did it take place in? And are you arguing that Thor lifted the thing? Or merely dislodged it from the Earth?


Unfortunately, Gladiator's second major supporter claimed that Thor can't match him even with Mjolnir so for this particular thread -as it was created with him in mind- I'm not making any distinction.

For the record, out of the scenes mentioned, I'd argue that only the last one had Mjolnir providing a noticeably larger amount of force.

Thor #327. My take is the one supported by the scans: He overpowered, dislodged and pulled/lifted the Serpent away from the Earth.

If you want a scene of pure lifting, while weakened, he was able to lift the foot of a more powerful version of the Midgard Serpent. The Serpent had compressed his entire body into a much smaller form -Fing Fang Foom- so it's still very uber.


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Last edited by Rage.Of.Olympus on Jun 20th, 2011 at 08:57 AM

Old Post Jun 20th, 2011 08:51 AM
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tsilamini
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by zopzop
Dude the majority of the stuff you mentioned isn't because of Thor's personal power but Mjolnir's. This isn't Mjolnir feats vs Gladiator feats. It's Thor's strength feats vs Gladiator's strength feats.


wouldn't that be akin to saying Iron Man is a base level human because everything he can do is only because of his armour?

Like, "Iron Man can't lift more than Spider-Man, its just his armour"

Mjolnir is a pretty integral part of Thor... It'd be like saying Pumpkin Bombs aren't to be taken into account when discussing Green Goblin...


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Old Post Jun 20th, 2011 12:53 PM
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Prof. T.C McAbe
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
erm

In what way was that cheap or not truthful? Because I didn't post the entire battle? I've done it plenty of times -would have if requested- and everyone along with their mother has read it.



It was cheap because you didn't show the outcome of this "strength"-duel, in which Gladiator seemed superior, when you look at it. You didn't show that he actually won and send Masterson flying.
Further you put up a scan where Loki says that Thor is 10 times stronger. Even Masterson is aware that Loki, the god of lies and mischief, tries to demoralize him.
Not enough, after it you show a scan where Masterson ASSUMES that Thor is stronger and where Thor shows his h2h superiority.

So Rage, truth be told, what did you want to imply? roll eyes (sarcastic)

Cheap.

And not everyone remembers the battle, so when you post a duel where the combatants vanish from view, post the outcome.
Glads was superior to Masterson, he teached him a lesson.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus

I posted the only scan relevant to this discussion. Masterson Thor matched Gladiator in strength and yet I'd give Thor the edge over Masterson Thor in terms of strength. It's really that simple.



No you didn't. You posted the scan that suited your case and didn't bother to show how it ended (Masterson flying, he was weaker it seems). And even then, you didn't post the only scan you deemed relevant, you posted two more, which are more irrelevant then the second scan of the Glads vs Masterson fight.

It's really that simple. laughing out loud


quote: (post)
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus

What does posting the entire fight actually change? It certainly doesn't affect my argument. I never claimed that Masterson Thor beat Gladiator straight up without any outside assistance. For the record, what Masterson accomplished with the Living Lightning was something he'd be capable on his own.



Already explained the fault in your argumentation.
Masterson, as you can see in the scans I posted, already send a blast at Glads, which Glads tanked quite easy. So no he couldn't have accomplish it without the Living Lightning, else he would have done it.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus

Yes, they are equals strength wise. Gladiator however was a much more experienced and battle savy fighter in comparison to Masterson. That was the entire point of the battle.


Glads was stronger and the better fighter. That's how it looked to me.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus

Carver would disapprove, that wasn't the 'real' Gladiator, hence why I didn't post it. I participate in this thread with two particular individuals in mind, hoping that they'll eventually grace us with their presence.


What two individuals? Carver and h18?

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus

It should be noted that Gladiator exposed a weakness no longer present and was going for the kill while Thor was holding back. For the record, I don't think there's any big gap in strength like some of the people on the other side do. I believe it's within Gladiator's capabilities to knock Thor out -at least with some circumstances present- as he is a peer strength wise. But if push comes to shove, Gladiator is eating dirt one way or another.


I think that they are quite even too. Though it should always end 5/10. Strengthwise I wasn't sure if they are peers. I assumed it but well, seeing the feats and the lack of feats of a char like Thor, who has more showings on his belt then Glads, much much more showings, is quite disappointing. Because the 3 main stregth feats of Glads are uber. The best I saw from Thor till now was the Midgard serpent, and yes it's enough.


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Old Post Jun 20th, 2011 03:56 PM
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Omega Vision
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Has anyone actually posted this amazing planet destroying feat yet?

I've heard it talked about all the time but have never actually seen it.


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Old Post Jun 20th, 2011 04:35 PM
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Rage.Of.Olympus
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Batman-Prime
It was cheap because you didn't show the outcome of this "strength"-duel, in which Gladiator seemed superior, when you look at it. You didn't show that he actually won and send Masterson flying.
Further you put up a scan where Loki says that Thor is 10 times stronger. Even Masterson is aware that Loki, the god of lies and mischief, tries to demoralize him.
Not enough, after it you show a scan where Masterson ASSUMES that Thor is stronger and where Thor shows his h2h superiority.

So Rage, truth be told, what did you want to imply? roll eyes (sarcastic)

Cheap.

And not everyone remembers the battle, so when you post a duel where the combatants vanish from view, post the outcome.
Glads was superior to Masterson, he teached him a lesson.


Are you an idiot or do you lack the ability to read?

I said I posted the only scan relevant to the discussion at hand, and I did. Gladiator was able to send Masterson flying but not because he was superior:
http://i779.photobucket.com/albums/...sGladiator4.jpg

ďIÖ.shouldnít have relaxed my grip.Ē

Like I said, Masterson was not a warrior.

Reading is important and words have meaning. Keep this in mind when debating something involving literature.

Yes, I posted a scan where Loki claimed Masterson was only a tenth as strong as Thor. That was obviously bullshit but it was clear that Masterson was inferior to Thor strength wise as under that same writer, a noticeably amped Loki got his shit pushed in by Thor when he became enraged:
http://i779.photobucket.com/albums/...featsLoki67.jpg
http://i779.photobucket.com/albums/...featsLoki68.jpg
http://i779.photobucket.com/albums/...featsLoki69.jpg
http://i779.photobucket.com/albums/...featsLoki70.jpg

Yet he stomped Masterson.

I donít give a shit if you think posting evidence is underhanded but donít spout nonsense about dishonesty. I wonít tolerate that bullshit.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Batman-Prime
No you didn't. You posted the scan that suited your case and didn't bother to show how it ended (Masterson flying, he was weaker it seems). And even then, you didn't post the only scan you deemed relevant, you posted two more, which are more irrelevant then the second scan of the Glads vs Masterson fight.

It's really that simple. laughing out loud


This debate is about who has the physical edge. A weaker incarnation of Thor was able to stalemate Gladiator in a contest of strength. Nothing I posted was off topic or irrelevant.

Refer above for the Masterson/Gladiator idiocy.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Batman-Prime
Already explained the fault in your argumentation.
Masterson, as you can see in the scans I posted, already send a blast at Glads, which Glads tanked quite easy. So no he couldn't have accomplish it without the Living Lightning, else he would have done it.


Masterson wielded most of the power of Thor. Of course he could accomplish it on his own, how can you claim otherwise? Do you have any idea how far Thorís damage output can go? The Odinson possesses enough power to go so far as to kill Gladiator without much if any fuss. Heís noticeably more powerful than Kallark.

For the record, it doesnít matter if a Mjolnir blast bounced off his chest. Masterson doesnít know how to use Mjolnir or tap into itís power properly:
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e...featsRonan1.jpg
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e...featsRonan2.jpg

In that very fight, he forgot about Thorís ability to summon lighting until he saw his teammate.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Batman-Prime
Glads was stronger and the better fighter. That's how it looked to me.


Then you need to re-read it. Gladiator sent Masterson flying but not because of a strength advantage. It was due to a warrior mindset that Masterson lacked.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Batman-Prime
What two individuals? Carver and h18?


Yes.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Batman-Prime
I think that they are quite even too. Though it should always end 5/10. Strengthwise I wasn't sure if they are peers. I assumed it but well, seeing the feats and the lack of feats of a char like Thor, who has more showings on his belt then Glads, much much more showings, is quite disappointing. Because the 3 main stregth feats of Glads are uber. The best I saw from Thor till now was the Midgard serpent, and yes it's enough.


Thor takes it at least 6/10 against Gladiator in a battle. The Odinson is at least on par with Gladiator physically. All of this is evident.

I have literally no idea how in one breath you can claim Gladiatorís feats are impressive and then look down on what Thor has accomplished. Have you not been keeping up with this discussion at all?

Gladiatorís best feats are lifting a Skyscraper, using all his power to move a Starship the size of a complex, and destroying a planet.

Thorís best strength feats are resisting the gravity of a Neutron Star and having his weight multiplied infinitely, overpowering the Midgard Serpent, overpowering the World Engine itself, and breaking through Celestial Armor in one blow despite planet shattering blows from the Odin Destroyer failing to. Each feat involved little to no usage of Mjolnir.

It's heavily one sided. And I havenít even taken into account heís showings vs. other entities or those involving Mjolnir as you'd b*tch about it.

That by the way includes stalemating the Hulk, destroying the Infinity Watch and Surfer, rocking entities from Surtur to Galactus, operating on a Galactic and even on a Universal scale etc.

Not. Even. A. Contest.


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Last edited by Rage.Of.Olympus on Jun 20th, 2011 at 04:48 PM

Old Post Jun 20th, 2011 04:38 PM
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Rage.Of.Olympus
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Omega Vision
Has anyone actually posted this amazing planet destroying feat yet?

I've heard it talked about all the time but have never actually seen it.

http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/...051ws_super.jpg

I do find it amusing that Gladiator's second biggest supporter claims that Bill destroying a planetary body isn't as impressive as we don't know it's actual size but loves this feat.


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Last edited by Rage.Of.Olympus on Jun 20th, 2011 at 04:45 PM

Old Post Jun 20th, 2011 04:43 PM
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