If Destiny didn't have the hype of Bungie releasing their non Halo game or toting it as the best thing ever, I don't think Destiny would talked about and criticized as much.
But it is one of those games where there is something clearly wrong with it (as mentioned in previous posts) that the little things also get picked on. The hype also doesn't help it either.
It's funny. This game released at the perfect time. Activision had the hype of a new game from Bungie, the first true next gen game to be released and a release calendar devoid of any big shooters. If the game was released next year, or last year on last gen near GTAV release, no way this does as well.
Small sample of how good the lore is. This details Eris's fireteam demise, the hive and gives new insight to the core gameplay mechanics of the 2nd raid. It also makes me want to punch Bungie for being lazy asses.
Here's the lore on Eris' Fireteam. They were:
The Titan, Vell Tarlowe.
The Hunter, Sai Mota
The Warlock, Eriana-3
The Hunter, Omar Agah
The Hunter, Eris Morn
The Warlock, Toland the Shattered
The first five were members of a secret organization known as "The Hidden", pioneered by Ikora Rey. They were an elite team of Guardians who's mission was to infiltrate the darkness and provide intel from the lost colonies They were sent into dangerous situations with little to no support. Their last mission was to dive deep into the Hellmouth and eliminate Crota while he still slept.
To get into the Hellmouth, they needed the help of the exiled Warlock, Toland the Shattered. His research had deciphered the Hive runes and know how to open the gate, so they sought his council. Toland described the Hive to the Hidden, explaining their connection to Crota and how each of them contained a piece of Crota's soul. The team would need to kill all of them. The Fist, the Heart, the Hand, the Might, and the Will. And to get to them, they would need to enter into an alternate dimension where Crota sleeps.
So they set off to defeat them and exterminate Crota once and for all. But the Hive would be too much for them, and only Eris would return alive.
- Vell Tarlowe was overwelmed by the Hive Wizard, Verok, and her army of Thralls. Its possible that the fallen Titan we see on the Moon outside the Temple of Crota is Vell, and the Ghost inside is his.
- Sai Mota the Hunter died fighting Omnigul herself. She killed him, mocking his allies as she did.
- After these two fell, Eriana-3 vowed revenge. She would become cruel and merciless, capturing a Hive Wizard and torturing her in an attempt to discover the secret to killing Crota. Eventually she lost herself to the darkness and became a Hive Wizard herself; Ir Yut, the Deathsin.
- Omar Agah was captured by The Heart of Crota, and dragged into the depths of the moon. The Heart broke all his bones, took his ghost from him, and then devoured his light. His screams and light fed the spawns of crota.
- Toland simply vanished. Before the expansion, Ikora was looking for him and his journal, in hopes of finding the fate of The Hidden. Hence the exotic bounty, "Toland's Legacy".
This left Eris Morn alone. Amidst the chaos, her ghost had fled. We actually received a grimoire card detailing him earlier, with "Ghost Fragment: Hive".
Eris hid in the Hellmouth for years, learning to use the shadows as the Hive had. It corrupted her and drained her of light, thus her appearance was altered. But she persevered until the moon's defense grid reactivated, and Rasputin took control.
You are the reason she survived and made it back to the tower. Had you not activated the array on Earth that allowed Rasputin to take control of the colonies, she would have been trapped forever.
When she arrives back on earth, Cayde-6 and Commander Zavala want her cast out as an exile. They believe that she is corrupted by the Hive and is a threat to the Tower. Ikora fights to keep her in the tower as long as she can, and so we meet her.
Knowing that we killed the Swarm Princes and wielded the Sword of Crota, Eris tasks us with eliminating the enemies that she and her team could not.
As it turned out, their fireteam only get to Crota's netherworld because the Hive wanted them too. The Hive eat light to grow more powerful, and they intended to steal the light of Eris' fireteam in order to revive Crota. The stolen light was placed in a chalice, which was to be consumed by Crota upon his awakening. However, Eris' escaped with some of her light, thus preventing Crota's return. And thus they needed more.
Enter us. We step up to face Crota, and they construct a portal to lure us in. We, however, turn the tides by taking the chalice, allowing us to heal using the Light of Eris' team. This allows us to defeat Crota and destroy his body forever.
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Extra time would only make this game do better IMO.
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Many thanks to Rao Kal-EL Da Man
Last edited by Zack Fair on Jan 9th, 2015 at 11:32 PM
15. Juggling Weapons
In a game where you can store matter into immaterial, volume-less, spaces; and you can teleport matter in an instant, why am I limited to only 3 weapons? Why do I have to go into a menu to switch guns? Why can I not cycle through my weapons very quickly? Maybe have an inventory where all my weapons are stored and then have a "in-game weapons" inventory that you add weapons to that you can cycle through. Set the cap at 9 using the same 3x3 square that they use for each weapon type. Most people aren't irritated by this by I'm a fast-twitch player who likes to switch weapons quickly. I'll organize and memorize the exact number of button presses needed to cycle to each type of weapon depending on the current weapon I'm holding. Some may think I'm just stupid for wanting that feature. But here's why we need that feature: you cannot pause the game to switch weapons. You're still getting raped while you are switching weapons. FFS. I can understand the PvP not allowing you to switch weapons because it's live. But there's no reason to limit that in the PvE stuff. It doesn't have to pause the game for anyone on your fire-team or Raid team....just make the player go intangible for a bit so people know that person paused. Just something. More weapon swaps and pausing would be preferable, obviously, but I know beggars cannot be choosers.
16. Upgrading Weapons
The fact that you have to upgrade your weapons with other stuff you've found is a problem. I'm okay with requiring XP to level-up your weapons with your character. But that's not what happens. Oohho ho ho ho no. That's not how they did it. You have to grind for materials to level up weapons. You also have to grind for XP to level up your weapons. Just earning XP, alone, is not enough. Nope. When you level up your guns, most of the time, you're not going to be able to upgrade them. This makes leveling up your guns useless most of the time...because you can't actual level them. Also, the long ass missions for Exotics: f*ck you. There were missions like that in Borderlands and Borderlands 2, don't get me wrong. But they took you 2-4 hours, not 2-8 days (because some require you do the weekly strike and if you get the mission after you've done it, you're stuck on quest progress until then). Bungie's parent company is Activision. Cal of Duty has a great upgrade system for their weapons (but they upgrade weapons with additional options as you level). I would be okay adding a leveling system to weapons. As you level the weapon, it unlocks OPTIONS. I'm okay with leveling the weapon and upgrading the damage, range, reload, etc. That's cool, too. But it should unlock the options, as well. The perks your weapons get could still be unique. Basically, I'm just asking for a massive overhaul of the upgrade system in Destiny.
I had a great idea. How about a weapons system that starts out with EVERYTHING as level 1? Meaning, your class perks can still help make your weapons stronger but all the shit is the same when you pick it up. The only difference between common, uncommon, rare, legendary, and exotics would be the types and number of perks that are unlockable. This means that if you level up a common gun all the way to 30 (you read that right: 30), the damage, range, reload speed, kinetic hit, etc. all get leveled up WITH options. Meaning, the player can select how the weapon levels up: if they want to invest in kinetic damage or better range, they can do so. This would make players MUCH more attached to their guns. It also makes making PvP easier to balance.
Where did I get this idea? Remember KOTOR 2 and you could get that light saber crystal that leveled up with you? That was the single most awesomest idea in an RPG type system. It would change how it worked based on your light-side and dark-side affiliation, too.
17. Speeders
There are several things wrong with them.
a: They aren't that fast. They should be much faster. It doesn't same much time going between sections on the maps. It'd be great if they were much much faster. Maybe 3x as fast.
b: The worlds are not that "open" or have clear "race" paths for your speeders. Why make tight spaces and stupid ridiculous turns that players are going to tak their speeders on? This is telling of shitty game design where different groups did not communicate well. This speaks to a shitty design vision that was lacking in the top minds in Destiny's development. This is the kind of "polish" that is missing from the game that shows that this game clearly f*cked up majorly.
c: Speeders don't have weapons. I can understand the default speeder not having weapons. But the subsequent speeders need to be better. They should be harder to unlock and cost more. Such as you need to be a certain level, you need to have so much glimmer, and you need to have completed a certain story mission (not any of those other stupid requirements that they put into the game for the legendary speeder/s). So, for instance, the next speeder up, an uncommon one, would have guns. Then the next, more speed. Then the next, regenerative shielding. Then the next, better weapons and shielding. And so forth. Until you end up with a legendary speeder that can easily wipe out the Minions of the Darkness. Hell, they could do even better than my idea and just make the speeders modularly upgradable. Meaning, you can upgrade certain pieces of the speeder as you play. Want better armor or speed? Add it. You could build a tank speeder that has very high damage and very high armor and shields but super shitty speed. But that would be a fun idea. That would be making the game more enjoyable. Nope. Can't have that. F*ck you, grind this shitty game.
18. Your Player's Look
This one is very simple: players want to be able to customize the look of their player more. Not only that, they should get to change how the look in the game after they make their player, as well. Very simple. Player creation sucked and it lacked options.
19. The Lack of Characters You Like
No one gets attached to any of the NPCs in the game. There's nothing there. Your Ghost is very...bland. The only time we get any type of fun player interaction is when your main character calls your ghost "little light" and he gets angry and says, "Don't do that." The game needs more of that times 1 million. More voice acting, interactive missions with NPCs (like...wouldn't it be awesome to see The Speaker do a mission with you where he curbstomps some minions for a section or two? What about the Cryptarch going with you on some emgram discovery missions (lol, actual side quests...) while he cracks geeky cryptarchy jokes? Anything to actually give the NPCs life would be great, really. I'm not a good character writer but if I can do better than what they did, clearly, they have a problem.
20. Weekly Strike
It includes DLC stuff which almost forces you to have to buy the expansion. Also, it doesn't match you with fellow players: you have to do it solo OR go out of your way to form a Fireteam. I tried 2 solo: it's just too frustratingly hard to do it by yourself (not because it is actually difficult but because of the way the game is setup, it is impossible to keep from dying and you are reset on your progress). I'll comment on this, more, later.
I disagree whole heartily with the juggling aspect of your idea.
especially making player intangible while doing it. That would get abused to no end by players.
Also I like the dynamic of having to carefully to choose your weapons if you plan on doing it for different missions. I also can not think of too many games that allow to rapidly have nine different weapons all keyed and easy to switch out.
That is not a legit gripe, that is just more of your personal preference and one I do not agree with.
Also I think Sparrows are plenty fast. They are definitely faster than walking to a place. Even with some of the tighter turns you've mentioned.
You brought up Call of Duty's weapon upgrade system multiple times now. I know people who would hate to have Call of Duty style weapon upgrades and customization. Also the leveling up of the weapons is more RPG style which is fine and still allows for a level of customization that allows you to adapt to your play style.
21. The "Gunplay is Awesome" Myth."
No it is not. It is actually subpar. Here are the reasons it is subpar:
a. You cannot spin around very quickly even when you turn the sensitivity up to max.
b. Ammo always seems scarce.
c. Even you want to be only sniper: f*ck you. You have hardly any ammo. And the ammo packs you can buy have a cooldown so f*ck you some more if you want to prepare for a mission.
d. Its hundred or perhaps thousands of years into the future and there are no such things as semi-automatic shotguns. I find shotguns COMPLETELY useless. Seriously, I have tried to use them and find that the only way they are useful is for a single, quickly fired shot, in a pinch, when your primary ammo runs out.
e. I think the auto-aim messes with my ability to close-quarters shoot. I'll be trying to shoot stuff and I'll empty an entire clip and hit nothing but air. Any other FPS game I've played, I'm an absurd beast in close-quarters, twitch-trigger, head shots. Not this game. Part of this is due to how slow it aims while aiming down the sights. Part of this is the auto-aim messing with my ability to lock onto targets properly. Sure, I could just "teach" myself but it hasn't worked with probably over 50 hours logged on this game (probably many more than that but that is a guess). Some players have no issues. Some players have suggested I get the XIM4 (the keyboard and mouse adapter). Some people never had any issues.
You're thinking PvP multiplayer: none of my comments apply to PvP unless explicitly stated. I don't like PvP so my comments almost never apply to PvP. For PvP, I 100% agree with you. That would be a stupid "feature" to implement in PvP games.
Maybe in a local match? Oh, lol, local matches are not in the game. This is another "always online" game.
That's not how the system works. You can change your weapons in any single player mission at any time...but in a cumbersome manner that does not pause "your game." That's my entire complaint. And it is not just me who complained about this. Look at all the other people whining about it, too:
Regardless of whether or not other people are whining about it, this is my complaint. It doesn't matter what others think because this is my list of complaints.
I can't think of any games that restrict you to only 3 different "hold-able" weapons, when you can hold over 30 weapons in your inventory, that does not also allow you to pause the "enemies" while you switch weapons. I would be okay with the lack of pause if I could cycle weapons rather quickly. Again, this is for the "single" player aspect of the game: not PvP.
Is it really that big of a deal to be able to cycle through like...say, 10 weapons with some button presses? Why would you not want this? Just because you think other games don't allow this does not mean it would be an amazingly nice and convenient feature.
lol, wut? That is a legit gripe. You cannot dictate to me what I strongly dislike in a game. If you want to make your own gripe list about Destiny, feel free! I'll support your efforts, even. I also promise not to tell you your complaints are not legitimate.
I don't. lol
Did you see my other complaint about how slow the characters run, as well? Slow running characters, slow moving sparrows...
Since we cannot fast travel to the areas, we have to slow-travel. But the slow traveling is made worse by the fact that the sparrows are not all that fast. Then the issue is our characters, who seem to have endless stamina, cannot run any faster than a slow jog...this is hundreds of years in the future with matter to energy streams flying everywhere and our super hero characters with jetpacks n'shit, can't even run faster than a slow jog? lol
Great. I don't care about those people nor do I care about their opinions (I do care about your opinion, however). This is my opinion, not theirs. You're mistaken if you think yours or their opinion is some how invalidating mine: it doesn't. These are my complaints about a game that was done with tons of shitty things. Things I find shitty. The things people find shitty in this game are going to vary from person to person. I definitely accept that.
But I would also note that people want a better system for upgrading weapons in Destiny. If Bungie/Activision actually ran a proper business, they would poll the millions of players who quit this game and see why. I can tell you, some of those reasons are because the weapons/armor system sucks massive turds.
It is an assholish RPG style. One that does not level up your weapons, at all. One that does not allow your weapons to level up on their own as you play, like some other RPGs. It is a "let's create more grind in this game because we do not have content" "feature" system for the weapons. But let's be clear that it is definitely not a weapons leveling system. The levels cannot be changed on the weapons (besides, I believe, for the new ones for the Hive weapons: those are upgrade missions but I am unsure if the weapon level itself changes). I would definitely like it if the weapons did level, however. That'd be pretty sweet. If they leveled as you earned XP...the weapons would seem a tad bit more alive. And if they changed designs as they upgraded, too? That'd be awesome! I'd love to be able to buy upgrades for my weapons like grips, stocks, magazines, and various other little upgrades for my weapons. It would be even BETTER if those options opened up as your weapon upgraded. The higher the rarity and level, the more options you had to customize your weapons. I'm salivating over such a system. Like you said, that'd be a very difficult and complicated system....something that would greatly improve the complexity and depth of the game but would take forever to program before launch. Let's hope they improve the weapons and armor leveling system as the game matures.
Thanks for your input. I wish more people would respond to my whining.
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Last edited by dadudemon on Jan 13th, 2015 at 10:18 PM
Edit - I fixed some of the errors. I typed this post up on Friday of last week so it still had some lingering errors.
I also missed 3 or 4 things in my complaint list about stuff I don't like about the gunplay. I'll add those later. If anyone is paying attention, #20 is missing from my list. That's being worked on. It will take a bit to format and post 20.
Mass Effect and Red Dead Redemption are both examples of why it's silly that you can't how-swap more than two weapons.
In this day and age there's really no excuse for not having this mechanic. They made a conscious design choice to limit you to two hot-swappable weapons- basically just their continued emulation of "popular" FPS's (all the cool kid shooters like Halo/COD/Battlefield limit you to two guns, let's do that too!")
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"The Daemon lied with every breath. It could not help itself but to deceive and dismay, to riddle and ruin. The more we conversed, the closer I drew to one singularly ineluctable fact: I would gain no wisdom here."
But you can actually use 3 guns in total, and you can simply press start and switch to whatever weapon you have in your inventory with a minor ammo penalty that can be negated with higher level guns that possess infinite ammo(Ice Breaker) and ammo synthesis that instantly replenish ammunition for all weapon types.
*Shrug*
It is all part of their gameplay design. They want you to think about what loadout you're going to use and how you want to compliment it with your gear and other guns. That is exactly what Exotics are for. You pick one and you build your char/setup from there.
Halo started the only 2 guns at any given time gameplay design, so I don't really think its bungie following what is popular. It is Bungie doing what they do, and making it better by adding the 3rd gun. Having Primary, Special and Heavy guns is very overpowering actually. Especially so when you have high level gear. So overpowering that we have people soloing the new raid just a week after release. Legit no cheese.
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Many thanks to Rao Kal-EL Da Man
Last edited by Zack Fair on Jan 14th, 2015 at 09:41 AM
BTW Neme X you havent popped your raid cherry, have ya?
We can clear it on normal no problem. Hard too, but I'm not sure you're high enough. All depends on the availability of my friends, but I got so many we are bound to get a team on any given day.
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Many thanks to Rao Kal-EL Da Man
Last edited by Zack Fair on Jan 14th, 2015 at 09:58 AM
I should clarify what I mean as a legit gripe. I'm not trying to invalidate your opinion. I just want to point out the difference between opinions and things that are universally agreed upon. You may think it is shitty others may not. Therefore I would not think of it as something that should be held against the game as something that needs to be fixed which is what I thought you list was. On a personal level if you do not like it fine I'm not going to tell you should. Now there are things like story which objectively are just bad.
Also I think the intangibility would totally be abused in PvE as well. As in draw agro from a opponent then go intangible to not take any damage. Then have another teammate draw agro go intangible rinse repeat. Or if you get into a tough spot go intangible until the foes leave you alone then unphase.
The problem with that is that unlike Halo or CoD or any of the other games, you're already be forced to specialize in different weapons by virtue of the game's RPG mechanics. Your class dictates what type of weapons you get bonuses for. You have to level up your guns which means that you have to make a conscious decision to invest more time in using some guns over others, etc. There's already a layer of tactical decision making built into the game without resorting to this redundant mechanic.
As for the menu, well it sucks lol. Yeah, you can always just open up the menu and select something, but unless you have MLG reflexes it's hard to do that in the middle of a protracted gunfight without getting raped- that's why the radial dial hot-swap mechanic was invented in those other games.
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"The Daemon lied with every breath. It could not help itself but to deceive and dismay, to riddle and ruin. The more we conversed, the closer I drew to one singularly ineluctable fact: I would gain no wisdom here."
That's quite fair and I will readily admit when one of my complaints is just me being a picky *sshole (which you pointed out in your previous post, but not so bluntly, obviously).
That's a bit more difficult to talk about. Because what would make the game better to me may make the game worse for you. And that's also fair and you are definitely entitled to think something I loathe with a passion is something you love with a passion. We are bound to disagree.
On a personal level if you do not like it fine I'm not going to tell you should. Now there are things like story which objectively are just bad.
This is addressed in other games since the days of NES multiplayer: it pauses the game for everyone. But no one wants that. I wouldn't want that. I would want exactly what I described and what you describe, here, to be a possibility, as well (meaning, I want people to be able to do what you state is an exploit). But that abuse doesn't bother me in the slightest: f*ck Bungie for making the game so unnecessarily grindy. You and I both know they did this because of the lack of real content. There are other games that allow you to pause (let's face it, Destiny is, at best, a co-op, not an MMO game) but not affect the other player in co-op. It seems to do just fine in those games.
However, your point is invalid in the fact that it does not offer any real-world or tangible reason to not implement a pause system that removes the player from the game while they switch weapons. The aggression thing is not even slightly a big deal in any of the missions they have designed. Players already ping-pong boss and minion aggro in missions without pausing.
Additionally, when players die in strikes from minions, the minions stay around the player when waiting to revive. If players tried to abuse the pause system, as soon as they unpaused, they'd die. The game is already nicely done/setup to accommodate a pause system that removes the player from active play while they look at equipment. In fact, the code for how a player becomes intangible would have several objects that could be transferred from the cool-down system and used for a pausing type system. In fact, the graphics used when a player dies could also apply when a player pauses: the little floating blue ghost-energy thingie.
I wanted to make it clear that I got that fact right in my post because I don't want you to think I'm a complete moron :
This is fair. I remember the "old days" of multiplayer FPS where you pressed 1, 2, 3, and so forth for you weapons (PC). And you could add more as you go. I am almost positive that it was Bungie, via Halo, that popularized the "let's only do 2 weapons, bitches" approach. It has been so long that I don't remember Quake's approach to weapons I do want to say it was the "press 1, 2, 3, etc." method.
True. I'd be willing to relent my "pause" position for a quick swap menu that holds like...12 weapons? 10? That would be an improvement and something that would make the game more fun and fast pace for me.
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