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Reality Warpers Vs Ridiculously Amped Thanos
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Mr Master
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Can I see any evidence of a Domino effect or pond effect...

Thanos lets out a blast that travels and travels causing destruction every place it goes...

What is confusing about this scene?

We see no evidence of thanos blasting something..
the blast ending..
but hiim destroying that something causing a chain reaction for this and that...
WHERE IS THAT SCENE that would support this domino or pond effect. It doesn't exist.
What we see plain a day.. thanos unleashes a blast..
the blast is a continous blast that causing destruction where ever it travels..
So what is so unclear about this scene.
Now I don't agree that this feat beats mxy's feat or some others...
but I also don't agree that there was anything else going on other
than exactly what we see on panel..

One blast and keeps going and going and destroying and effecting everything in its path...

thumb up Exactly. That's all I saw.

... and I was also not suggesting this is greater than what Mxy did,
but allow for it to be downplayed I will not.



Thanos let off blast that travels in all directions and devastates as it goes along.

We know it blew out of 616 cause it smacked up Asgard,
caused Inter-Dimensional changes,
and even shifted the freakin Space-Time Continuum.

It's clear, this is the ONLY thing that Thanos did in the IG arc,
that resembles (literally) applies, coincides, and reflects the feat in the Tie-In.

The writer of the Tie-In, is not just gonna make that up without reason,
he had to base it off of something Thanos did,
and that's the only plausible thing it can be.


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Old Post Jul 27th, 2012 05:28 PM
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Mr Master
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Cogito

Here's what I see.

Things that don't concern Marvel Comics right now it appears.
quote: (post)
Originally posted by Cogito

The Beyonder (shared feat with Molecule man --
who was more powerful)
caused "trans-multiversal reality" to tremble.


Anyway, Reality trembled (from the Quantum to the Trans-Multiversal)
because of the Forces unleashed (two Cube beings fighting)

Those Forces were altering Reality across the Omniverse:

(please log in to view the image)


At the end ... the Omniversal "Time Variance Authority"
is met with the mess Owen/Beyonder left them across the MultiverseS!

(please log in to view the image) (please log in to view the image)

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Cogito

The Beyonder was defeated by that level of power.

His feat ends there.

Just ask friend, and I'll fill you in.
But cease from assertive claims, that's how bad reps are formed.

Anyway ..

Beyonder's feats end here:

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/...mp;pagenumber=3


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Last edited by Mr Master on Jul 27th, 2012 at 05:56 PM

Old Post Jul 27th, 2012 05:43 PM
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TheGodKiller02
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I think my Actuality Ripple argument opened up a Pandora's Box .


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Old Post Jul 27th, 2012 06:22 PM
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KuRuPT Thanosi
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The only box that got opened up was people speculating what happened and not going with what was shown. Seems very similiar to the Big Bang Explosion and Lucifer eh

Old Post Jul 27th, 2012 06:32 PM
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leonidas
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Mr Master
I

So you're still stuck on Asgard and the Pantheons being withIN 616?

And that although "Inter-Dimensional changes" took place ...
(obviously referring to other UniverseS being affected)

and the "Space-Time Continuum shifted" ...
(All of Reality displaced)

All due to Thanos letting out an omni-directional psychic wave of destructive power in 616,
which literally did EXACTLY what the ripple did was aid to do in the IG Tie-In.

Yet, you somehow believe this is not connected?


of course it's connected. that's....what i said. thanos caused a wave in 616 which affected the dimensions/layers/whatever within 616. this caused some sort of ill-defined shift. this shift in balance was felt by the beyonders. no need to bring in the omniverse at all, nor is there a need to suggest the wave travelled all the way through the omniverse--none of which was ever stated, anywhere.

quote:
It was established clearly in the SSII
that Shooter was referring to the Multiverse of Alternate UniverseS when he mentioned that.


really. so when beyonder said the universE was many-layered, he actually MEANT to say the the multiverse was full of alternate universeS? confused that's quite the inference.......

quote:
You must know this from the Beyonder scan where he walks through the Multiverse (Negative Zone - Microverse - Nexus of Realities, and so on)
after Shooter said, "funny thing about Our Universe,
that is it many layered, composed of Infinite Dimensions,
indeed, it is a Multiverse
"

[img=http://s4d4.turboimagehost.com/t/12722881_Beyonder_explores_the_Mulitverse.jpg]

[img=http://s4d4.turboimagehost.com/t/12722884_Beyonder_explores_the_Mulitverse2.jpg]


I know I won't get a thumbs up, but so long as we know. stick out tongue [/B]


huh? why wouldn't i give a thumbs up to that? again, in absolute, irrefuteable black and white--OUR UNIVERSE IS A MULTIVERSE. that is exactly what i've been saying all along. thumb up

funny how a couple months back i used that exact scan to prove that 616 is a multiverse, now you use that exact scan to say it's proof that it......isn't? confused then even more you actually go on to say that the AUTHOR was wrong. that he didn't actually mean universE, he meant the MULTIVERSE is........a multiverse?? you have a term being used in a manner that does not fit with the way you think it should be used, so you are taking the liberty of 'translating' for us. that....is not the way it should be done imo. erm

again, i'll choose to go by what is on panel, acknowledging that not all authors are well-versed in marvel's disastrous cosmology (which means these things CAN be seen in different ways and that writers will NOT maintain strict consistency all the time) so things should be viewed on an individual basis as opposed to a gestalt approach.

anyway, this isn't the place for that discussion. we can go on in the cosmo thread if you'd like.


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Old Post Jul 27th, 2012 09:21 PM
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leonidas
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by basilisk
It's not that Maelstrom was proven superior in power, it's just that Maelstrom came out looking better in that encounter. Thanos for all his supposed omniscience wasn't even aware of Maelstrom's existence, yet Maelstrom's senses pinpointed Thanos, and Maelstrom was able to sneak up to his base. Then Maelstrom totally insults Thanos, tanks his blast without a scratch, basically laughs at him and leaves. Then Thanos still appears clueless as to who Maelstrom is and what the hell's going on, and despite Mael's clear retort after the blast, Thanos still concludes he must have destroyed him. Nothing further was ever proven or shown (except in a What If) but it was a low showing for IG Thanos.

As for the Thanos scans, they are as always impressive, but not convincing compared to what Mxy did on panel. But that's no shame on Thanos - WF was basically like a toon joke story, breaking all rules and completely insane.


well said. with a greater amount of patience than i have for this topic anymore. laughing out loud


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Old Post Jul 27th, 2012 09:23 PM
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Mr Master
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by leonidas

of course it's connected. that's....what i said. thanos caused a
wave in 616 which affected the dimensions/layers/whatever within
616. this caused some sort of ill-defined shift. this shift in balance
was felt by the beyonders. no need to bring in the omniverse at all,
nor is there a need to suggest the wave travelled all the way
through the omniverse--none of which was ever stated, anywhere.

That's your opinion
that Asgard as well as any Pantheon and/or demon realm is withIn 616.

In Marvel comics though,
All pocket-verses/dimensions
and parallel universes waiting to diverge,
and alternate universes,
all of them, are located outside 616 in their own space withIn the Multiverse.

I proved this in your thread with undeniable proof.

Any idea other than any coming straight from Marvel Comics
and hopefully corroborated by Handbooks,
will never change that fact.

That aside ..

As for the wave traveling through all the Omniverse to reach the Beyond Realm ..

That's right.

I'm not sure if you're aware ... but that's where the Beyond Realm is,
BEYOND the final ascendance of All Eternity.

Not just outside space-time ...

Literally Beyond all known existence/creation/universe/dimension whatever.

That which lies beyond the Omniverse.


----------------------------------------------------------


Here Kubik and Kosmos ...

Went ascending levels of existence until they surpassed All of Eternity:

[img=http://s4d4.turboimagehost.com/t/12725834_1.jpg]

(the "spheres' are Universes, together comprising an infinite number)

===============


What is Beyond All of Eternity?
What is the final ascension?
What is Beyond everything?

Where can this place be where All of Eternity "dwindles into insignificance?"

[img=http://s4d4.turboimagehost.com/t/12725890_BY5-1.jpg]


The Beyond Realm.


----------------------------------------------------------------


At the very end/edge of the Time Variance Authority's vessel/headquarters,
there is a doorway which leads to that which beyond all creation,
that which is BEYOND the Omniverse.

They dump planets/galaxies and UniverseS through the door into ...

The nothingness Beyond: (Beyond Realm)

(please log in to view the image)

===============


How do we know this is the END of the Omniverse?

How do we know that the end of the Omniverse is at the end/edge of the TVA's vessel/gheadquarters?

Impossible! ... the TVA's headquarters has to be as long as the Omniverse! eek!

Here's how:

(please log in to view the image)

Reed asks Mr Morbius:

"The rows seem endless. How far do they actually extend?"


He replies:

"How large is the Omniverse?"


------------------------------------------


Holy! .. it is as long as the Omniverse.


quote: (post)
Originally posted by leonidas

really. so when beyonder said the universE was many-layered, he actually
MEANT to say the the multiverse was full of alternate universeS? that's
quite the inference.......

huh? why wouldn't i give a thumbs up to that? again, in absolute, irrefuteable
black and white--OUR UNIVERSE IS A MULTIVERSE. that is exactly what i've
been saying all along.

funny how a couple months back i used that exact scan to prove that 616 is a
multiverse, now you use that exact scan to say it's proof that it......isn't? then even
more you actually go on to say that the AUTHOR was wrong. that he didn't actually
mean universE, he meant the MULTIVERSE is........a multiverse?? you have a term
being used in a manner that does not fit with the way you think it should be used,
so you are taking the liberty of 'translating' for us. that....is not the way it should be
done imo.

again, i'll choose to go by what is on panel, acknowledging that not all authors are
well-versed in marvel's disastrous cosmology (which means these things CAN be
seen in different ways and that writers will NOT maintain strict consistency all the
time) so things should be viewed on an individual basis as opposed to a gestalt approach.

O... k.

Anyway, Shooter was referring to the Multiverse of infinite universes.

Simple.

When Shooter had Beyonder travel this Multiverse,
he passed the Microverse (located in the universe created by the Makers outside 616)
he passed the Pocket-Dimensions (outside 616) like Meph/Asgard,
he passed the multi-pocket Dimension of Dormy, (outside 616)
he even ended up in the "CrossRoads" (a Nexus of Realities)

The "CrossRoads" ... that's the same place big G and heroes travelled thorough
to get to Magus' Universe over 100 UniverseS away from 616.

Simple.

Now, you can try and prove that the Microverse is withIn the 616 Universe,
or that the "CrossRoads" is withIn the 616 Universe,
heck or any of the "Pockets"

But I'm 100% confident you can only return when an intelligent yet proof-less reply.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by leonidas

anyway, this isn't the place for that discussion.
we can go on in the cosmo thread if you'd like.

Not really. Nowadays it seems debating is just being done for the sake of it. stick out tongue


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Last edited by Mr Master on Jul 27th, 2012 at 11:06 PM

Old Post Jul 27th, 2012 11:00 PM
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leonidas
MWHAHAHAHA!

Gender: Male
Location: Planning to take over the WORLD!

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Mr Master
That's your opinion
that Asgard as well as any Pantheon and/or demon realm is withIn 616.

In Marvel comics though,
All pocket-verses/dimensions
and parallel universes waiting to diverge,
and alternate universes,
all of them, are located outside 616 in their own space withIn the Multiverse.

I proved this in your thread with undeniable proof.


well, you're right, it is my opinion. but....i didn't see any conclusive proof at all that tells me these places are definitively not part of 616. in fact, since i also have proof that 616 is a multiverse, it is steadfastly impossible for you to have conclusively proven such a stance.

always wanted to use that smilie.....

quote:
Any idea other than any coming straight from Marvel Comics
and hopefully corroborated by Handbooks,
will never change that fact.


well, the on-panel references made by the beyonder and dr strange occurred within marvel, so.....check. thumb up

quote:
As for the wave traveling through all the Omniverse to reach the Beyond Realm ..


now, i knew you would show this and i've refrained from getting into this issue before, but, aside from the name, what exactly leads you to believe the place in the ff book is actually the home of the true beyonders? seems like some dumping ground and that doesn't seem like something the beyonders would like very much. i mean the tva is pretty well versed in all things cosmic. you'd think they might be aware of dumping universes and such into the home of some uber cosmic beings..... and they specifically said it was NOTHINGNESS. not the beyond REALM. a realm of NOTHINGNESS. i don't think the writers at all intended for that place to be the beyond realm you're referencing....

quote:
I'm not sure if you're aware ... but that's where the Beyond Realm is,
BEYOND the final ascendance of All Eternity.


sure. according to that all you need to do is step outside eternity to reach it though. unless you're somehow now stating that they weren't talking about 616 eternity but rather multi-eternity. and if that's the case it's just one more example of your forcing an interpretation that is never brought up in the book. if you're not saying that the eternity in that scene represents the multiverse, then you're left with saying that going outside eternity gets you to the beyond realm. if that;s the case, i agree. smile it fits perfectly what was shown in that wave scan--the wave impacted the 616, then billowed out and affected the beyond realm. no need whatsoever to bring in the omniverse or affecting anything more than the 616--which is ALL that was shown to have been impacted. wonderful!

the more telling piece of info though comes from this scan:

http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/12725834/1.jpg.html

THIS UNIVERSe IS A 4-D CONGRUNENCE OF SPHERES (REALITIES/UNIVERSES/DIMENSIONS/ETC) EACH NESTLED INSIDE THE OTHERS.... spheres nestled inside each other inside a universE??? wow, sounds an awful lot like a multiverse to me. once again, clear as can be in a scan you are showing to support your stance.

quote:
(the "spheres' are Universes, together comprising an infinite number)


lol thumb up and all these spheres nestled inside the UNIVERSe. yet more support for the idea of the 616 as a multiverse, which is what i've said all along.

quote:
The nothingness Beyond: (Beyond Realm)


you mean the Nothingness beyond? (no reference whatsoever made to the Beyonder realm.....)

quote:
Anyway, Shooter was referring to the Multiverse of infinite universes.


well, so you say, but you'd think maybe he wouldn't have you know, used the word UNIVERSe so often if that is what he meant. no expression

quote:
Simple.


indeed. all those places are part of the 616 universE as envisioned in the SW arc.

quote:
Now, you can try and prove that the Microverse is withIn the 616 Universe,


huh? of course it's a 'sphere' within the 616. the ss hid there from galactus and the ff followed him by SHRINKING and entering one of reed's microscope slides! i don't think you reach other universes by just shrinking......

it seems you actually helped my case more with this post than your own. gracias. laughing out loud


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Last edited by leonidas on Jul 28th, 2012 at 12:50 AM

Old Post Jul 28th, 2012 12:45 AM
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Mr Master
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by leonidas

well, you're right, it is my opinion. but....i didn't see any conclusive proof at all
that tells me these places are definitively not part of 616. in fact, since i also have
proof that 616 is a multiverse, it is steadfastly impossible for you to have
conclusively proven such a stance.

always wanted to use that smilie.....

I love that smile.

Well, aside from all the on panel evidence, and the handbooks to support said evidence ...

Here's Odin (while in Asgard) himself stating that the 616 Universe is in another Reality:

(please log in to view the image)


No doubt you'll spin this, as you've spun my other material in this thread,
but it's all good so long as the right heads see it for what it is.

Don't take offense, I don't believe it's intentional, I know you really believe it.


***

Anyway, more proof on top of proof:

The Pocket-Realms/dimensions/universes are OUTWARD of 616,
heck, even OUTWARD of the grouping of infinite alternate universeS,
located at the center of the Multiverse.

(please log in to view the image)
quote: (post)
Originally posted by leonidas

now, i knew you would show this and i've refrained from getting into this issue
before, but, aside from the name, what exactly leads you to believe the place in the
ff book is actually the home of the true beyonders? seems like some dumping
ground and that doesn't seem like something the beyonders would like very much.
i mean the tva is pretty well versed in all things cosmic. you'd think they might be
aware of dumping universes and such into the home of some uber cosmic
beings..... and they specifically said it was NOTHINGNESS. not the beyond
REALM. a realm of NOTHINGNESS. i don't think the writers at all intended for that
place to be the beyond realm you're referencing....

I see.

The Beyond Realm is a realm of what exactly then?

When Dr Doom and the FF went looking for Beyonder's Universe they passed by the BeyonderS Realm,
it was lightless, and void.

When Kubik/Kosmos went into the Beyond Realm it was a vast infinite nothingness:

(please log in to view the image)


What's the difference here again between where the TVA is dumping universes and the Beyond Realm?


Yes I know, the TVA headquarters is as long as the Omniverse,
and although that's a fact,
and although they are dumping Realities at the end/edge of their headquarters
through a doorway that's Beyond their headquarters that is as long as the Omniverse,
therefore Beyond the Omniverse,
this means nothing:

(please log in to view the image)


Interesting, it looks exactly like the Beyond Realm too, a white void "NOTHINGNESS"

That just coincidentally happens to be located Beyond the TVA's headquarters and TVA headquarters is as long as the Omniverse,
so logically this dumping ground of realities is Beyond the Omniverse a well,
since the TVA is dumping this shit at the end/edge of their Omniverse long headquarters.

Further interests are sparked when we realize Kubik/kosmos ALSO
surpassed the ENDS of All Eternity, where Eternity's infinity literally ends,
and well whatdayaknow, the Beyond Realm happens to be the next location
BEYOND all creation/existence/universe/dimension anything.

Incredible coincidences, but maybe you're right and everything pointing the other way is wrong.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by leonidas

sure. according to that all you need to do is step outside eternity to reach it
though. unless you're somehow now stating that they weren't talking about 616
eternity but rather multi-eternity. and if that's the case it's just one more example of
your forcing an interpretation that is never brought up in the book. if you're not
saying that the eternity in that scene represents the multiverse, then you're left with
saying that going outside eternity gets you to the beyond realm. if that;s the case, i
agree. it fits perfectly what was shown in that wave scan--the wave impacted the
616, then billowed out and affected the beyond realm. no need whatsoever to
bring in the omniverse or affecting anything more than the 616--which is ALL that
was shown to have been impacted. wonderful!
the more telling piece of info though comes from this scan:
THIS UNIVERSe IS A 4-D CONGRUNENCE OF SPHERES (REALITIES/
UNIVERSES/DIMENSIONS/ETC) EACH NESTLED INSIDE THE OTHERS....
spheres nestled inside each other inside a universE??? wow, sounds an awful lot
like a multiverse to me. once again, clear as can be in a scan you are showing to
support your stance.
and all these spheres nestled inside the UNIVERSe. yet more support for the idea of the 616 as a multiverse, which is what i've said all along.
huh? of course it's a 'sphere' within the 616. the ss hid there from galactus and the
ff followed him by SHRINKING and entering one of reed's microscope slides! i
don't think you reach other universes by just shrinking......

Oh Leo, my friend. There's no point in debating this further.

I respect your opinion, but I disagree,
and on panel handbook supported proof isn't changing that,
therefore, it's pointless to discuss it anymore.
quote: (post)
Originally posted by leonidas

it seems you actually helped my case more with this post than your own. gracias.

laughing ... I'm seriously laughing.


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Last edited by Mr Master on Jul 28th, 2012 at 03:46 AM

Old Post Jul 28th, 2012 03:36 AM
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leonidas
MWHAHAHAHA!

Gender: Male
Location: Planning to take over the WORLD!

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Mr Master
I love that smile.

Well, aside from all the on panel evidence, and the handbooks to support said evidence ...

Here's Odin (while in Asgard) himself stating that the 616 Universe is in another Reality:

(please log in to view the image)


No doubt you'll spin this, as you've spun my other material in this thread,
but it's all good so long as the right heads see it for what it is.

Don't take offense, I don't believe it's intentional, I know you really believe it.


true, i do believe it. or i believe it is at least a supportable stance. no spinning necessary. smile but i never said asgard isn't a different reality. confused of course it is.....

quote:
Anyway, more proof on top of proof:

The Pocket-Realms/dimensions/universes are OUTWARD of 616,
heck, even OUTWARD of the grouping of infinite alternate universeS,
located at the center of the Multiverse.

(please log in to view the image)


i see. so you choose to accept that scene, instead of the SW scene. well, at least you made it obvious that you really are just picking and choosing. THAT set up is precisely NO MORE valid, than the spheres nestled within spheres description previously mentioned. precisely NO MORE valid than the dr strange scan. except in my 'proof' i never added/replaced words to the scan that are not there.

again.

which words: OUTWARD OF 616 somehow replaced AWAY FROM THE CENTER OF THIS HYPOTHETICAL SPRECTRUM.

hypothetical isn't exactly rock solid i'm afraid. you used this spectrum analogy before, but i don't recall you saying it was just hypothetical...

quote:
The Beyond Realm is a realm of what exactly then?


er, home of the beyonders.....? confused NOT a NOTHINGNESS, anyway.

quote:
What's the difference here again between where the TVA is dumping universes and the Beyond Realm?


well, i don't think any description of their home would list it as a dumping ground for one. and just because it's big and white isn't exactly solid proof either..... when strange and ss and phoenix met that dead eternity it was white. they were beyond that eternity. were they in the beyond realm too? if someone were in the beyond realm, or dealing with the beyond realm, i'm of the crazy, spinny, unsupported notion that the book might TELL you it was the beyond realm. as opposed to a nothingness. but you're right, hopefully the right heads will see this. wink


quote:
Yes I know, the TVA headquarters is as long as the Omniverse,
and although that's a fact,
and although they are dumping Realities at the end/edge of their headquarters
through a doorway that's Beyond their headquarters that is as long as the Omniverse,
therefore Beyond the Omniverse,
this means nothing:

(please log in to view the image)


Interesting, it looks exactly like the Beyond Realm too, a white void "NOTHINGNESS"

That just coincidentally happens to be located Beyond the TVA's headquarters and TVA headquarters is as long as the Omniverse,
so logically this dumping ground of realities is Beyond the Omniverse a well,
since the TVA is dumping this shit at the end/edge of their Omniverse long headquarters.

Further interests are sparked when we realize Kubik/kosmos ALSO
surpassed the ENDS of All Eternity, where Eternity's infinity literally ends,
and well whatdayaknow, the Beyond Realm happens to be the next location
BEYOND all creation/existence/universe/dimension anything.

Incredible coincidences, but maybe you're right and everything pointing the other way is wrong.


not really much of a conincidence when really all they showed was a white nothingness that has been seen before. but yeah, a lot easier to believe that once again readers were supposed to have seen that kubik scene to understand what was REALLY happening in a completely unrelated book, and that now we're supposed to equate the eternity from that kubik scene with........the OMNIVERSE! eek!

have you even thought about what you've said the last few posts?

--SW beyonder never meant universe like he said, but meant multiverse.
--kubik's idea of spheres in spheres within a universE is just....wrong?
--a hypothetical spectrum idea is the way we should look at it
--kubik passed beyond eternity to the beyond realm but the beyond realm is beyond the end of the omniverse though there was no mention of the beyond realm in the issue. anywhere.

yeah, again, i do hope the right heads are seeing this mrm.


quote:
Oh Leo, my friend. There's no point in debating this further.

I respect your opinion, but I disagree,
and on panel handbook supported proof isn't changing that,
therefore, it's pointless to discuss it anymore.

laughing ... I'm seriously laughing.


unsupported handbook proof?? you're right, i'm happy with not discussing this anymore and letting whoever hasn't left the thread read over these last few posts and conclude whatever they'd like.

yep, we're both laughing here. thumb up


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Old Post Jul 28th, 2012 01:21 PM
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Galan007
Time Master

Gender: Male
Location:

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Cogito
^ All I see is you attributing the highest possible power explanation for the IG (& Beyonders, CCUs), while simultaneously attributing the lowest possible power explanation for Mxy.

"Trans-multiversal influence" -- gimme a break. Odin shook the multiverse. Thor & Co held it up. As far as I'm concerned, it means little to nothing.

"Minute bit of energy" -- We saw Mxy destroy and recreate the entirety of DC with a finger snap. Is there a clearer visualization for a "minute bit of energy" than snapping your fingers? To boot, he does it every week, so it's clearly not draining him at all. To call what he did the limit of his potential power is also ridiculous given the ease with which he accomplished that feat.

Here's what I see. The Beyonder (shared feat with Molecule man -- who was more powerful) caused "trans-multiversal reality" to tremble. Mxy destroyed it. The Beyonder was defeated by that level of power. His feat ends there. Mxy went further -- recreating everything with a snap. Then he went further -- he does it every week for kicks.
Agreed. Causing trans-multiversal damage in an all-out battle, or unleashing an 'actuality ripple' that spreads outward until it hits the Beyond realm, while impressive, is/are still INFINITELY LESS impressive than what Mxy did with a casual degree of ease. That much is completely indisputable. Hell, even if you couple Thanos' best feat with the IG with Reed's top feat with the UN, it still doesn't compare to Mxy's feat alone.

So I have to ask: why in the hell is there still a debate? The team EASILY crushes Thanos here.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by leonidas
no expression

if by cool explanations that are dead wrong, you mean, reading what is written on the page and trusting that the writer knew what he was talking about, then sure. thumb up

kinda funny that it destroyed a beyonder world and just managed to short out IM's armor too. laughing out loud

there is never, ever any mention of the the wave coursing through to the "end of the omniverse", anywhere. that is you using other sources to support the idea. the wave ripped through 616 including the pantheonic realms that are part of 616. it caused changes. the changes upset the balance. the upsetting of said balance caused damage somehow to the beyonders world. all of that isn't just interpretation--all of that is ACTUALLY what is written on panel. you choose to say the wave spread through the whole OMNIVERSE. except.....the wave is never mentioned in the scans. and the omniverse is never mentioned ANYWHERE. my 'explanation' coincides PRECISELY with what is shown. your 'interpretation' requires that you fill in 2 PARTS THAT DON'T EXIST AND AREN'T SUPPORTED ON PANEL--the lack of mention of any blast of power, and the term omniverse.

i prefer to go with what is ACTUALLY said on panel.



none taken, but......you proved that some marvel definitions of terms support your idea, but unless handbook stuff is supported on panel it is meaningless crap. and those terms are most CERTAINLY not used with consistency by writers. so while adding support to your idea you in no way at all 'proved' that what i was saying (and still believe) was or is wrong.



don't think this was addressed to me, but for my part it seemed we simply reached an irreconcileable difference of opinion. i had enough support to justify my stance about the universe being a multiverse unto itself. even here the beyonder acknowledges the many layers:

http://oi55.tinypic.com/293k8pl.jpg

so, like i said, irreconcileable differences.
thumb up

quote: (post)
Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
The only box that got opened up was people speculating what happened and not going with what was shown.
When did this happen? I certainly haven't seen it... confused


__________________


Old Post Jul 28th, 2012 06:01 PM
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Mr Master
Senior Member

Gender: Male
Location: somewhere within time & space

^^^ Some left over energy from the Infinity Gems re-created multiple MultiverseS,
after creating UniverseS back to back on top of one another
and nearly destroying All Realities.

I can only imagine Thanos' potential
had he wanted more than Eternity's place.

So a fraction of the 616 IG power = multiple Multiversal power.

The UN isn't needed here,
heck incomplete IG punked the most powerful weapon with but a thought.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by leonidas

true, i do believe it. or i believe it is at least a supportable stance.
no spinning necessary.

but i never said asgard isn't a different reality. of course it is.....

It's not supported by Marvel Comics. That's all I go by.

So you believe Asgard is in a different Reality.

So why are you also saying it's withIN the 616 Reality?

Which is it?

Anyway, according to Marvel Comics ... Asgard:

[img=http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/12736332_Asgard9.jpg]

"Asgard is an OtherDimensional (other universe) body ...
whose nature & physics are different from bodies in Earth's Dimension
. (universe)

"At the boundaries, a being or object can step off into the Void"


"The Void?" ... huh, what they talking about, Asgard is in 616 right? erm

Nah.


-------------------------------------------


The Asgard bio is quite clear across it's in-depth info,
that Earth's Dimension/Universe is separated from Asgard's.
The ONLY way to travel from Earth to Asgard or vice-versa,
is via a Dimensional/Universal Portal/Rift/Vortex.

If Asgard was in 616 ... you could travel there via distance,
with no need for a portal that crosses Dimensional/Universal Boundaries.

Simple.


-------------------------------------------


Again, you can't fly at any speed (even forever) and ever reach Asgard.

No Dimension/Universe hopping, = no see Asgard for you.


-------------------------------------------


On Panel


-------------------------------------------


[img=http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/12736327_Asgard4.jpg]

"Opening a Dimensional Vortex ... Thor through the Void until ... Asgard"



(please log in to view the image)

"Rainbow Bridge which spans the infinite void between Earth and Asgard"



(please log in to view the image)

"I thought the Bridge was gone, despite my powers to By-Pass Space & Time,
I barely reached Asgard
"


-------------------------------------------


Here Arishem simultaneously attacks 3 Pantheonic Realms (Other-Universes - pocket-size though)

In order to do this, Arishem opens a DImensional Rift (portal to other universes)
and wrecks shop in all 3 Other-Dimensional Spaces

In fact, had Arishem destroyed the Dimensional portals to either of their pocket-verses,
they would've been cut-off forever from the 616 Universe.

[img=http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/12736326_Asgard3.jpg]


-------------------------------------------


Here, while "Bifrost" (rainbow bridge) is damaged,
Leir (Celtic Pantheon)
travelled "Across the treacherous Dimensional Planes" (universeS)
just to reach Asgard.

(please log in to view the image)

Also ...

"The destruction of the Rainbow Bridge,
Asgard hath been denied secure passage to the Mortal Plane
." (universe)


-------------------------------------------


Again, Avalon (Leir's home ... Celtic Pantheon)
is located "Across the Infinite Dimensional Gulfs" in distance relation to Asgard.

(please log in to view the image)


But perhaps the on panel is lying and this new idealism yall pumping is the truth.

I respect your opinion but I wish there was more.


-------------------------------------------


Like I continue to pump:

[img=http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/12736330_Asgard7.jpg]

"A critical juncture is fast approaching in the Extra-Dimensional Realm of Asgard"



quote: (post)
Originally posted by leonidas

i see. so you choose to accept that scene, instead of the SW scene. well, at
least you made it obvious that you really are just picking and choosing. THAT set
up is precisely NO MORE valid, than the spheres nestled within spheres
description previously mentioned. precisely NO MORE valid than the dr strange
scan. except in my 'proof' i never added/replaced words to the scan that are not
there.

You're confusing yourself with anger homie.

Perhaps we should cease the debate
if you're going to star fallacious accusing me of tampering evidence.

The SW scene doesn't support your view.

Beyonder travelled the Multiverse, he passed the Microverse (located OUTSIDE 616)

And Beyonder passed the Negative Zone (OUTSIDE 616)

And the Pocket-Realms of Asgard/Meph & Dormy, ALL located OUTSIDE 616.
quote: (post)
Originally posted by leonidas


again.

which words: OUTWARD OF 616 somehow replaced AWAY FROM THE CENTER
OF THIS HYPOTHETICAL SPRECTRUM.
hypothetical isn't exactly rock solid i'm afraid. you used this spectrum analogy
before, but i don't recall you saying it was just hypothetical...

So you think the writer had Strange just making all that specific shit up? laughing

You can CAP fonts all you want, I'll just reply with simple truth.

Anyway ... I can't believe now you're trying to use THAT, as the spin. lol.

It's HYPOTHETICAL because laughing out loud obviously the Multiverse is not literally a "Spectrum."

The writer was trying to convey the design/structure of the Multiverse
in a fashion it could be understood, hence the "Spectrum" analogy.

Wait ... were you serious here, are you pulling my chain?

Please tell me you were joking.


__________________

Old Post Jul 29th, 2012 01:28 AM
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Mr Master
Senior Member

Gender: Male
Location: somewhere within time & space

quote: (post)
Originally posted by leonidas

er, home of the beyonders.....? NOT a NOTHINGNESS, anyway.

Really.

Well, I have every appearance and reference of the Beyond Realm.

Be a pal and point me to the Marvel issue
where the Beyond Realm (BeyonderS race) was anything more than a lightless/white/black Void.

Oh yea, NOTHINGNESS! ... Whatever is in there, CAN"T BE SEEN!!! or PERCEIVED!!!

Oh I see,
you must confusing yourself cause you saw Thanos obliterate a Planet withIN the Beyond Realm.

Well, that was a SINGLE Planet (original Counter-Earth actually)
that was placed withIN the Beyond Realm as an experiment by the BeyonderS via a deal.

Meh, in any case, the same white/black VOID surrounded that single Planet,
although, now that it's been destroyed, it's once again a seeming infinite NOTHINGNESS!

Just like the place where the TVA was dumping universes.

Heck, BeyonderS probably don't even register those realities being dropped in,
since even ALL of Eternity "dwindles into insignificance" next to the Beyond Realm.
quote: (post)
Originally posted by leonidas

well, i don't think any description of their home would list it as a dumping ground
for one. and just because it's big and white isn't exactly solid proof either..... when
strange and ss and phoenix met that dead eternity it was white. they were beyond
that eternity. were they in the beyond realm too? if someone were in the beyond
realm, or dealing with the beyond realm, i'm of the crazy, spinny, unsupported notion that the book might TELL you it was the beyond realm. as opposed to a
nothingness. but you're right, hopefully the right heads will see this.

Yea, that whiteness where Strange/SS and Jean ended up in was a Void of Nothingness.

As far as us being told, if you have even basic knowledge of these things it self-explanetory.

The Beyond Realm was everything outside the all universes during it's pre-retcon era.

The Beyond Realm is everything outside all universes nowadays as well.

So, when you have the TVA's headquarters which is as long as the Omniverse,
and you have them dumping material at the end/edge of their headquarters,
well, it doesn't take too much sense to realize, hey, their dumping materials
into a place that Beyond the Omniverse, Beyond all creation,
something that seems like a white Void of Nothingness.

Hello ... Beyond Realm.
quote: (post)
Originally posted by leonidas

not really much of a conincidence when really all they showed was a white
nothingness that has been seen before. but yeah, a lot easier to believe that once
again readers were supposed to have seen that kubik scene to understand what
was REALLY happening in a completely unrelated book, and that now we're
supposed to equate the eternity from that kubik scene with........the
OMNIVERSE!

Kubik referenced "All the MultiverseS" in that story.

[img=http://s4d4.turboimagehost.com/t/12736343_LT_all_multiverses.jpg]

If his journey had nothing to do with other MultiverseS, or even the prime Multiverse fro that matter,
why even mention that.

Who cares Kubik, this explanation is constricted to one universe,
why are you even letting us know that there is a Multiverse, or holy kaka MultiverseS!

You're here telling us about how the Cosmos works concerning the major players
and also the Planes of Existence as they Ascend the great powers.

Yes, I know you presented entities from OTHER UniverseS: (blue boy, big head, ugly, above Shuma)

(please log in to view the image)

(like Dweller in Darkness' Universe,
which is so FAR away from 616 it's literally HIGHER than the 6th Dimension)

(please log in to view the image)

"Nightmare ... we both come from Everinnye, a Universe higher than the Sixth Dimension."

---------------------------------------


Meh, this is getting boring.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by leonidas

have you even thought about what you've said the last few posts?

--SW beyonder never meant universe like he said, but meant multiverse.
--kubik's idea of spheres in spheres within a universE is just....wrong?
--a hypothetical spectrum idea is the way we should look at it
--kubik passed beyond eternity to the beyond realm but the beyond realm is beyond the end of the omniverse though there was no mention of the beyond realm in the issue. anywhere.

yeah, again, i do hope the right heads are seeing this mrm.

... this smilie was itching to appear, it finally met its mark.

This isn't directed at you per say,
but at the misconstruing (by accident or design) of my posts,
added with the laughable fact of attempting to use my scans against me.
quote: (post)
Originally posted by leonidas

unsupported handbook proof?? you're right, i'm happy with not discussing this
anymore and letting whoever hasn't left the thread read over these last few posts
and conclude whatever they'd like.

yep, we're both laughing here.

thumb up


__________________

Last edited by Mr Master on Jul 29th, 2012 at 01:37 AM

Old Post Jul 29th, 2012 01:28 AM
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Galan007
Time Master

Gender: Male
Location:

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Mr Master
I can only imagine Thanos' potential
had he wanted more than Eternity's place.
Unfortunately imagination is all you'll ever have, as Thanos didn't preform a feat remotely comparable to what you mentioned. It is only fair to use Thanos' feats with the IG here, because Thanos is the specific IG wielder in this thread--and as we know, every being who wields the IG typically uses the collective gems much differently. ie. Thanos =/= Nebula =/= Warlock =/= Magus =/= Rune =/= Nemesis =/= the gems acting by themselves =/= Hood =/= Iron Man. Etc.

Again, even if you combine Thanos' feats with the IG, and Reed's feat with the UN, Mxy's feat is still superior. That much isn't based on my imagination/opinion. It's based on what we saw these characters do with their respective powers on panel.

...And again, that's JUST Mxy. Nevermind the insanely powerful team he's got backing him. Thanos goes down HARD.


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Old Post Jul 29th, 2012 04:29 AM
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"Id"
The Man of Tomorrow

Gender: Unspecified
Location: Diablo Corps

Mr. Master do a "De-construction of Thanos w/Infinity Gauntlet ... the final debate!"

Go!


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I'm Superman. I can do anything.

Old Post Jul 29th, 2012 04:33 AM
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leonidas
MWHAHAHAHA!

Gender: Male
Location: Planning to take over the WORLD!

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Mr Master
^^^ Some left over energy from the Infinity Gems re-created multiple MultiverseS,
after creating UniverseS back to back on top of one another
and nearly destroying All Realities.

I can only imagine Thanos' potential
had he wanted more than Eternity's place.

So a fraction of the 616 IG power = multiple Multiversal power.

The UN isn't needed here,
heck incomplete IG punked the most powerful weapon with but a thought.


It's not supported by Marvel Comics. That's all I go by.

So you believe Asgard is in a different Reality.

So why are you also saying it's withIN the 616 Reality?

Which is it?

Anyway, according to Marvel Comics ... Asgard:

[img=http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/12736332_Asgard9.jpg]

"Asgard is an OtherDimensional (other universe) body ...
whose nature & physics are different from bodies in Earth's Dimension
. (universe)

"At the boundaries, a being or object can step off into the Void"


"The Void?" ... huh, what they talking about, Asgard is in 616 right? erm

Nah.


-------------------------------------------


The Asgard bio is quite clear across it's in-depth info,
that Earth's Dimension/Universe is separated from Asgard's.
The ONLY way to travel from Earth to Asgard or vice-versa,
is via a Dimensional/Universal Portal/Rift/Vortex.

If Asgard was in 616 ... you could travel there via distance,
with no need for a portal that crosses Dimensional/Universal Boundaries.

Simple.


-------------------------------------------


Again, you can't fly at any speed (even forever) and ever reach Asgard.

No Dimension/Universe hopping, = no see Asgard for you.


-------------------------------------------


On Panel


-------------------------------------------


[img=http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/12736327_Asgard4.jpg]

"Opening a Dimensional Vortex ... Thor through the Void until ... Asgard"



(please log in to view the image)

"Rainbow Bridge which spans the infinite void between Earth and Asgard"



(please log in to view the image)

"I thought the Bridge was gone, despite my powers to By-Pass Space & Time,
I barely reached Asgard
"


-------------------------------------------


Here Arishem simultaneously attacks 3 Pantheonic Realms (Other-Universes - pocket-size though)

In order to do this, Arishem opens a DImensional Rift (portal to other universes)
and wrecks shop in all 3 Other-Dimensional Spaces

In fact, had Arishem destroyed the Dimensional portals to either of their pocket-verses,
they would've been cut-off forever from the 616 Universe.

[img=http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/12736326_Asgard3.jpg]


-------------------------------------------


Here, while "Bifrost" (rainbow bridge) is damaged,
Leir (Celtic Pantheon)
travelled "Across the treacherous Dimensional Planes" (universeS)
just to reach Asgard.

(please log in to view the image)

Also ...

"The destruction of the Rainbow Bridge,
Asgard hath been denied secure passage to the Mortal Plane
." (universe)


-------------------------------------------


Again, Avalon (Leir's home ... Celtic Pantheon)
is located "Across the Infinite Dimensional Gulfs" in distance relation to Asgard.

(please log in to view the image)


But perhaps the on panel is lying and this new idealism yall pumping is the truth.

I respect your opinion but I wish there was more.


-------------------------------------------


Like I continue to pump:

[img=http://s4d3.turboimagehost.com/t/12736330_Asgard7.jpg]

"A critical juncture is fast approaching in the Extra-Dimensional Realm of Asgard"




You're confusing yourself with anger homie.

Perhaps we should cease the debate
if you're going to star fallacious accusing me of tampering evidence.

The SW scene doesn't support your view.

Beyonder travelled the Multiverse, he passed the Microverse (located OUTSIDE 616)

And Beyonder passed the Negative Zone (OUTSIDE 616)

And the Pocket-Realms of Asgard/Meph & Dormy, ALL located OUTSIDE 616.

So you think the writer had Strange just making all that specific shit up? laughing

You can CAP fonts all you want, I'll just reply with simple truth.

Anyway ... I can't believe now you're trying to use THAT, as the spin. lol.

It's HYPOTHETICAL because laughing out loud obviously the Multiverse is not literally a "Spectrum."

The writer was trying to convey the design/structure of the Multiverse
in a fashion it could be understood, hence the "Spectrum" analogy.

Wait ... were you serious here, are you pulling my chain?

Please tell me you were joking.


so yuo admit it's not a structure and that the author didn't really know exactly WHAT it was? so why show the scan exactly? others writers didn't really seem to have that problem. you use scans from writers who don't know how to explain it, i'll use scans from those who do. that seems to work better.

you continually say the same thing over and over. yes, asgard and all those places are pocket realms--within the 616 multiverse

what's so hard to wrap your head around? you asked for proof, i've given it to you. you simply CHOOSE to ignore/redefine it. i'm not the one saying there is NOT contradictory evidence. i AM saying there is support for what i'm saying. you speak as though your explanation is air-tight and immuteable. that is steadfastly wrong.

strange saw eternity as a MULTIVERSE. dormmy entered eternity and discovered it was a MULTIVERSE. kubik says the UNIVERSe contains spheres withIN spheres, aka, the UNIVERSe is a MULTIVERSE. all supported ON PANEL. the UNIVSERe has many layers. on and on we go. all evidence to support my idea. but you what? simply redefine it, speak for the authors, force-fit your theory around this.

don't confuse being dumbfounded with being angry. you used the microverse as an example of another universe. well, shrink enough and you enter it as reed did. a universe withIN a universe. a sphere withIN a sphere.

why you don't see that this is wholly valid, i literally have no clue but preach on. smile


__________________

Last edited by leonidas on Jul 29th, 2012 at 02:28 PM

Old Post Jul 29th, 2012 02:24 PM
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leonidas
MWHAHAHAHA!

Gender: Male
Location: Planning to take over the WORLD!

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Mr Master
Really.

Well, I have every appearance and reference of the Beyond Realm.

Be a pal and point me to the Marvel issue
where the Beyond Realm (BeyonderS race) was anything more than a lightless/white/black Void.

Oh yea, NOTHINGNESS! ... Whatever is in there, CAN"T BE SEEN!!! or PERCEIVED!!!

Oh I see,
you must confusing yourself cause you saw Thanos obliterate a Planet withIN the Beyond Realm.

Well, that was a SINGLE Planet (original Counter-Earth actually)
that was placed withIN the Beyond Realm as an experiment by the BeyonderS via a deal.

Meh, in any case, the same white/black VOID surrounded that single Planet,
although, now that it's been destroyed, it's once again a seeming infinite NOTHINGNESS!

Just like the place where the TVA was dumping universes.

Heck, BeyonderS probably don't even register those realities being dropped in,
since even ALL of Eternity "dwindles into insignificance" next to the Beyond Realm.

Yea, that whiteness where Strange/SS and Jean ended up in was a Void of Nothingness.

As far as us being told, if you have even basic knowledge of these things it self-explanetory.


lol

seriously. "basic knowledge". basic knowledge is thor is a god who uses a hammer. basic knowledge presupposes that readers would even KNOW about the characters in the first place. no mention of beyond realm is made in that book. tva would know about them. most readers wouldn't even KNOW about the beyonders let alone have your definition of 'basic knowldege' that this nothingness.dumping ground is their realm! laughing out loud please, tell me YOU'RE joking. you can't even admit you're speculating and have no proof from the ff arc you're citing. again, don't confuse anger with my utter disbelief.

quote:
Kubik referenced "All the MultiverseS" in that story.

[img=http://s4d4.turboimagehost.com/t/12736343_LT_all_multiverses.jpg]

If his journey had nothing to do with other MultiverseS, or even the prime Multiverse fro that matter,
why even mention that.

Who cares Kubik, this explanation is constricted to one universe,
why are you even letting us know that there is a Multiverse, or holy kaka MultiverseS!


laughing out loud

the term multiverseS makes PERFECT sense. he already specifically said the universE is spheres in spheres. that makes it a multiversE. so, of course lt rules over multiverseS.

that is NOT spinning. that is using what is actually, word-for-word SAID ON PANEL. the term multiverseS is not a typo (lol) as i`ve heard said. it is a confirmation of what he said earlier and what we have seen in other cases.

and i`m not the one demanding there is only one way to view this stuff btw. as far as misconstruing your words or spinning, take that little list i made and point to me exactly what i said that was incorrect or `misconstrued`. if i did say something that was false, i`ve no problem apologizing for it. but i`m pretty sure what i said was accurate.

everything i`ve said has direct-explicit on panel corroboration, in some cases by your own scans. you can`t even use the ff arc you`re referencing to prove the nothingness is the beyond realm. yet i`m spinning stuff. yeah, we`re done. but i wasn`t bored. just tired of trying to follow your convoluted trails of ``proof`` and tired of reading your interpretations and reinventions of what is written in simple black and white. i would happily bz this issue--is it possible to view the universe as multiverse and be happy to have a group of judges decide the issue one way or the other. if yes, just pm me. barring that, there isn`t anything more to discuss here, though for my part, it`s been entertaining as it always is. smile


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Old Post Jul 29th, 2012 02:50 PM
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Blight
Ass Hole

Gender: Male
Location: [Insert Nerd Refuge]

Wow, riveting debate!

In the end I see Leonidas as making more sense based on reading the on panel scans and seeing that some writers conflict with other writers.


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Old Post Jul 29th, 2012 03:48 PM
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leonidas
MWHAHAHAHA!

Gender: Male
Location: Planning to take over the WORLD!

challenge is open to any sychophant who clings to any word mrm says, btw. you know who you are. wink


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Old Post Jul 30th, 2012 07:59 PM
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Colossus-Big C
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Account Restricted

Just a question,

How would you guys rate team 2 in power?


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I have returned

Old Post Jul 30th, 2012 08:13 PM
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