__________________ "Your Lord knows very well what is in your heart. Your soul suffices this day as a reckoner against you. I need no witnesses. You do not listen to your soul, but listen instead to your anger and your rage."
__________________ Recently Produced and Distributed Young but High-Ranking Political Figure of Royal Ancestry within the Modern American Town Affectionately Referred To as Bel-Air.
a jedi doesnt need a palpatine clone or some silly holocube projection of a sith lord to be tempted by power and become corrupt.
i dont want to see a technical wonder which lights up in dazzling 3d and rehashes old and done plotlines.
besides there has been nothing to illustrate that new skills or powers are aquired by deciding to become a sith, but rather and simply by using the dark side of the force as well as being a maniacle power hungry ***hole.
__________________ "Your Lord knows very well what is in your heart. Your soul suffices this day as a reckoner against you. I need no witnesses. You do not listen to your soul, but listen instead to your anger and your rage."
In a game that's approx. 50 hours of mostly dialogue, holocrons are only brought up twice, by Bastila's mother and Lashowe. And in the most casual, forgettable, inconsequential manner. Mentioned offhand as flippantly as some NPCs stock dialogue about Czerka Corporation.
How were they effective and appropriate in KotOR? They were non-entities.
__________________ Recently Produced and Distributed Young but High-Ranking Political Figure of Royal Ancestry within the Modern American Town Affectionately Referred To as Bel-Air.
Last edited by Lord Lucien on Jul 21st, 2013 at 01:31 AM
Used few and far between as to not become distracting. Or, they didn't focus the story just on holocrons and the information they contain.
[SPOILER - highlight to read]: Edit - Let me recap what I think happened, here. You thought I meant KotOR II and not KotOR because of how much more holocrons were involved in KotOR II. I didn't. In fact, I think you don't remember that holocrons were in KotOR and even spent time searching to make sure. You didn't find anything so you thought you would "call me out" to point out my supposed ignorance. Cool. You were wrong. So you changed your approach to ask about how they were effective because of how little they were used in KotOR, thinking you got me, again, but from a different angle. That failed, too, because I really did like how they handled holocrons in KotOR: few and far between and not focusing the main story on them. And thus ended the game you thought to play. Of course, I could be mistaken and you didn't know but your second response pretty much makes almost everything above, true.
And about the politics.
I see no difference between the political powerplay between Leia and Tarkin, Padme and the Senate. It is all politics and it is directly regarding the safety of many lives. [SPOILER - highlight to read]: In fact, the stories very closely parallel between I and IV
You fellas may enjoy how the politics were done in the OT more (because it had a big boom boom thingie that destroyed a whole planet at the end of the political powerplay instead of the removal of the Chancellor). But I like to label them same.
So why did we even start talkingabout politics? Because politics will definitely be in VII.
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Last edited by dadudemon on Jul 21st, 2013 at 02:01 AM
I was talking about KotOR I. I've played through it dozens of times. Holocrons are apart of its gameplay twice, both times about finding one. But in neither of those side quests are the holocrons--in and of themselves as a piece of cool technology--introduced as an integral part of each quest's story. They're just run-of-the-mill items you have to fetch for someone. Kind of a letdown, since the EU before 2003 had made use of holocrons as plot points--Jedi turning to the Dark Side because of them, and all that. But in KotOR I, they're spoken of by the relevant NPCs as casually as someone talking about a nice pair of sneakers they want you to find--one of those people being just some poor old widow in a bar, and the holocron she wants being no more than a simple recording device. And you don't even get to see the holocrons. They're just nondescript items you loot from corpses. Nonentities, and not even vital to the story. Hence: how were they used effectively?
BUT if you meant KotOR II... I've beat that game only twice. They were tedious playthroughs, so I haven't gone back and don't remember holocrons at all. So I need filling in. How were they used in that game?
Yeah that's what I thought you were getting at. The difference between the emotional (keyword) interplay between two characters, is different than the trudging procedural politics of a senatorial meeting between several cardboard cutouts with frozen expressions of disinterest and boredom on their faces, and the same in their voices. On screen, there's a big difference between this:
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and this:
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The first has interesting characters with emotional inflections in their voices, where the stakes of their political powerplays (not really a powerplay, Leia has none despite her bravado--part of what makes her a likeable character) are visual and palpable. And not exactly what comes to mind when the topic of "politics in film" is discussed. The second is devoid of all humanity and passion, where the stakes are emotionally non-existent, and the "characters" don't seem to give a shit. A la the PT in general, and TPM's senate scenes especially. Political arenas and debates in the senate aren't intrinsically boring in a film. They're just boring if the they're done poorly. I think the sequel writers have learned from George's mistakes in that regard, and will write political scenes that are gripping, impassioned, fascinating, and emotionally investing. If they have, and it's all apart of taking Star Wars in a new direction, I'm looking forward to it.
__________________ Recently Produced and Distributed Young but High-Ranking Political Figure of Royal Ancestry within the Modern American Town Affectionately Referred To as Bel-Air.
Last edited by Lord Lucien on Jul 21st, 2013 at 03:34 AM
Ahhh, good stuff. The way it should be in a film. Virtually out of ind tools, not the focus.
Me too. One thing I liked about the PT is the delicious details you can pull from the whole political thing. I didn't pick up all the details of it, in Phantom Menace, the first time I watched it. The second time was a much more enjoyable viewing than the first.
I don't necessarily think doing something exactly like the PT is a great idea. It has to have a different feel. I would not mind some of the "stuff"* from the PT and OT mixed in with some original "stuff"* that will give us a feel for the ST.
*The French of a phrase for this. I forget that phrase. But if you know what I'm talking about, please replace the word "stuff" with that phrase.
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Last edited by dadudemon on Jul 21st, 2013 at 07:48 AM
__________________ Recently Produced and Distributed Young but High-Ranking Political Figure of Royal Ancestry within the Modern American Town Affectionately Referred To as Bel-Air.
Edit - After looking up the literal translation, the French have no idea what to call it, either! haha! Is it ironic/idiotic that us English speakers use that phrase as though it was the actual thing we were looking for?
in the PT it didnt bother me that they portrayed a senate.
i was bored and annoyed at the ridiculous amount of time wasted on depicting the inner-workings of stagnant ineffectual congress. then other drawn out scenes of sitting in offices complaining about said congress.
what a ball of yawn, man.
__________________ "Your Lord knows very well what is in your heart. Your soul suffices this day as a reckoner against you. I need no witnesses. You do not listen to your soul, but listen instead to your anger and your rage."
It was.... it was boring for SW. And you know, it was even boring for a political drama. It would have been boring (or simplistic even) for something like West Wing or House of Cards...
ok so not surprisingly john williams has confirmed that he will be scoring the new trilogy.
__________________ "Your Lord knows very well what is in your heart. Your soul suffices this day as a reckoner against you. I need no witnesses. You do not listen to your soul, but listen instead to your anger and your rage."
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Jul 20th, 2013 06:06 AM
