What a hypocrite you are then. One debate you argue how unimpressive it is,and then in another, you change your stance 180 degrees.
Vader has outdone that many times in the mythos, crumbling down a 20 story building with his scream, collapsing an entire cathedral in an attempt to kill himself etc etc. All these a way more impressive that smashing the foundations of some old rotting temple.
Yes.
Deflecting and shielding yourself from a turret thats been shown to take down star destroyers requires an unimaginable amount of skill and reaction time. So yes, not every tom dick and harry can do this.
Do YOU notice the difference? Galen simply shields himself from the blast, while Vader actually got hit by the massive generator physically and had the whole thing blow up on him.
Theres a huge difference here, learn to actually spot the difference paki.
And whats to stop vader from doing the same vice versa?
I can say the same for Vader, considering that Vaders display with TK outmaches anything shown by bane along with the fact that you would have to prove that bane would even know of Vaders weakness with the suit.
Last edited by shinkoryu on Jan 6th, 2013 at 01:27 PM
Where did I stated that this feat is not impressive?
Show me then.
This turret?
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As per this statement of yours:
Does this turret matches the power of Death Star?
Yes, the feat is impressive but Darth Vader isn't the only one who could do this.
Ok.
Now check this example:-
Weakened by the blast, the dome's supports gave way. It collapsed into the superlaser dish, triggering a series of conventional explosions. Stormtroopers converged on the site. Through the dense smoke, two figures were visible from the apprentice's rarefied perspective.
Darth Vader struggled to his feet from the rubble, even more damaged than before. He reached out for support and found only his Master, scowling. (The Force Unleashed)
Darth Sidious took the brunt of this blast and he was perfectly fine. In contrast, Vader's armor sustained further damaged.
If tanking abilities of Gallen Marek and Darth Sidious are not sufficient then consider the example of Darth Malgus:-
Darth Malgus got hit by a Starship Engine during his Force augmented leap towards the position of the Jedi Master Kao Cen Darach. Darth Malgus clearly sustained the impact and the resulting blast without any issue.
Much later on, Darth Malgus tolerated a direct hit from a missile and sustained the resulting blast.
Marek, Sidious and Malgus aren't half-machines and demonstrate better durability then Darth Vader against impact of blasts.
Intended point is that Darth Vader's armor can get damaged by dangerous blasts; this can hinder his performance in the duel or even result in his defeat. You need to accept the fact that Darth Vader's armor is also one of his chief weaknesses.
Darth Vader can summon Force Lightning?
Don't you think that Darth Bane can do better at defending himself from explosions? He is not half-machine.
Also, it doesn't takes a genius to figure out that Darth Vader is half-machine; a vulnerability to be exploited.
Last edited by S_W_LeGenD on Jan 6th, 2013 at 02:19 PM
First off i don't even know why the hell are you bringing Malgus into the debate. This is Bane vs Vader, not Malgus vs Vader in taking hits.
^ You tried to downplay it here, by calling it unmaintained.
Show me then.
Yep, and do check the scans paki, instead of skimming through it.
Does it have to match the power of the death star paki? Did you actually watch the Original Trilogy with the same turret series taking down an entire star destroyer?
Or do you just have so much TOR fanwankery you actually forgot this fact?
Show me another force user deflecting a super turbo laser that could take down entire star ships.
When something is already damaged, it gets even easier to damage further. Try punching a damaged cracked window compared to a normal window, and see which ones easier to smash.
Marek is a piss poor tank if you actually played the game, considering he got stabbed once and then had his brains knocked out by getting slammed on the wall.
Malgus and Vaders tanking far outweighs that of galen.
So did Vader if you actually looked at the scans, other than having his cape getting a little torn.
Marek hasn't. And the final blast of energy destroyed an entire tower, kill every stormtrooper in the entire vicinity and barely further damaged his already damaged armor.
And no, its very likely that Malgus actually shields himself from the blast, or there would at the very least be tatters on his cape.
It his weakness that has rarely been exploited, heck, go look at the scans, his control box on his chest gets smashed and it does nothing to actually weaken him.
You don't need to use FL to interrupt attacks paki. TK works just as much, if not even better than a blast of FL.
Show me where an entire bomber class ship blows up in his face, and him walking out as if nothing has happened. Being "Half Machine" in no way indicates he is less capable of defending himself nor does it mean he is able to take any less damage, in fact, it allows him to take even MORE damage. Its his control box and respitory system thats his real weakness, the only weakness that in the whole mythos thats been exploited by Sidious.
Its his suit, that according to you,is his "weakness", the only thing that is his actual weakness is his control box. Which even Galen Marek clone, and the combined power of the sky, his overpowered lightning and 3 supercharged pylons did jack against.(TFU2 interactive scripted scene)
Last edited by shinkoryu on Jan 6th, 2013 at 04:36 PM
Big enough that Vader is convinced it would outright kill him. As for the damage, not much, other than his armor and not him taking most of the damage despite being buried for days.
Was this in the trailer?
Its maintainers were extinct prior to Bane's visit to the site.
By how many hits?
Only Death Star was capable of one-shotting a Star Destroyer, if I recall correctly.
Its been long since I rewatched OT movies.
It would be convenient to know the source featuring Turret related feat. Otherwise, I am dealing with ambiguity here.
What I gather from this feat is that if a Force-wielder really concentrates, s/he can deflect such firepower with a lightsaber. Few may try though.
Jedi have shown that they may stand a chance against Turrets and other heavy weapons such as AT-AT and vice versa. Revan encountered several Turrets inside Star Forge on his way to the position of Bastilla Shan; Luke deflected firepower of AT-AT. Their might be more examples.
Difference here is that Vader can shield himself with the Force. He should be able to prevent his damaged armor from getting further damaged. But somehow he doesn't.
How is this related to tanking explosions?
Hmm! Still he is not invincible in the context of tanking.
Marek gave himself to the Force; hence, the resulting explosion. Also, Sidious was right next to Marek when this explosion occurred. Vader wasn't.
He suffers some physical injuries but they are superficial.
Well...
Their are several ways to hurt him. Two mentioned below.
Ok. Good point.
Well, Bane isn't explored from this angle if I recall correctly.
The closest example in the context of durability for Bane is from events in Lehon; Kas'im tanked a Temple shattering TK. Bane, whose command of the Force is relatively superior, should be able to do better.
Also, check this:
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Marek showed that advantage can be gained against Vader by hurling potentially explosive objects at him. His clone showed that advantage can be gained against Vader with powerful barrage of FL. Bane can exploit Vader in both ways.
Well, it isn't necessary to damage Vader's armor fully or heavily to turn the tide of the battle against him; any sort of explosion or event which disturbs Vader, will be sufficient to grant Bane an opening he needs.
I am not saying that Vader is easy to beat. Obviously, Vader is expected to put up considerable fight but his chances of success are limited against an opponent like Bane. The latter has more options to hurt Vader then the opposite.
Last edited by S_W_LeGenD on Jan 9th, 2013 at 07:48 AM
Ergo, you downplayed the feat.
Two hits. One shot is enough to cripple an entire star destroyer, two, is enough to take it down.
Ergo, you don't do your homework.
Show me who can deflect the same turrent.
It takes an extremely powerful force titan to replicate a feat on this kind of scale, not any force wielder can simply do such a feat, what the hell do you think the artist was telling the audience?
WHICH jedi? Other than Galen and luke deflecting an ATAT blast?
None of which compares to the planatery turret that smashed an entire star destroyer.
You were talking about his "endurance" mr paki, not about whether he could shield himself or not. Don't attempt to derail this and answer my damn question.
Because you claimed galen has extraordinary tanking abilities, to which i responded and refuted. Don't attempt to derail this.
Neither is anyone else but the fact that Vaders endurance and tanking abilities gives him FAR more credit than you give credit.
You're derailing the point again as usual due to your incompetent ability to comprehend ones point.
Show me. His cape wasn't even in tatters, so its very likely he shielded himself rather than tanking it full like vader did.
What durability? It was kasim who was blocking himself from the force wave, he didn't "tank" it considering the fact that the writer explicitly stated that Kasim would have been dead have he not shielded himself.
Thanks for proving my point, that blow up killed everyone in the vicinity, the troopers, the droidsandit blew up right at his face and control box, and what happens? Vader acts like nothing happened!
Galen clones "barrage of lightning combined with the sky and 3 pylons" did jack to Vader, how is that exploitation? And any tom dick and harry can gain an advantage chucking explosives to each other .
Whats to stop Vader from doing the same exact thing to Bane? By throwing massive objects that bane has never been shown to do on the same level?
Incorrect, what you think Bane can do to Vader, Vader can do to Bane even more effectively with his command of the force.
The only way Bane is going to beat Vader is through a pure saber combat.
If Sidious found him "inadequate" then Vader wouldn't have been his apprentice.
He was disappointed because he wanted an apprentice who would eventually surpass him. And that seemed a lot less likely after his injuries.
Didn't you just said above that neither is Vader??
Marek was a force beast who was moving star destroyers and disintegrating an entire Frigate. And Vader still pretty much stalemated him in TFUII.
Vader's limitations are mostly physical and psychological. But his Force TK has always been way more impressive since after his injuries. It wasn't even very long after his injuries he began doing Uber TK feats.
People are just now starting to understand this particular aspect?
A lot of these youngsters are really making me feel old.
- Vader's TK does and always has rivaled Yoda's and Sidious's TK. I'm not sure why this wasn't obvious to everyone from the start.
It's the whole point of the thing - he's in a mobile-respirator, so his melee capabilities are restricted - but seeing as how he's the Chosen One, has Midichlorians that go beyond Yoda's and has experience using TK all the time just to move his body, I don't see how everyone wouldn't have picked up on all this much sooner.
People tend to underestimate him because of the quote saying that he's only 80& as powerful as Sidious. But yes, he is very powerful with his TK. He's demonstrated better ability with it than Sidious himself iirc. A good example of how someone can be as good or better than someone at an aspect of the Force despite being less powerful.
__________________ "Happiness is a lie. Life is horror. The light is always dying all across the universe. The last star will flicker out someday, when it does, all that remains is shadow. And I will be its king!"'-Amahl Farouk
Jan 6th, 2013 01:18 PM
