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Who wins the race: Surfer vs Flash
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Fiendish
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The "gauntlet grab" showing is potentially far less impressive than it's often made out to be, a scene in Silver Surfer #56 seemingly places Adam and Surfer far closer than a light year away before his attempt.

http://i.imgur.com/699SFOY.jpg

Seems like a low showing at that point given what Surfer had already accomplished in the past with the Skrull base blitz and such.

Old Post Jan 23rd, 2017 06:01 AM
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Galan007
|Imperial Tactician|

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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Fiendish
The "gauntlet grab" showing is potentially far less impressive than it's often made out to be, a scene in Silver Surfer #56 seemingly places Adam and Surfer far closer than a light year away before his attempt.

http://i.imgur.com/699SFOY.jpg
That can be chalked up to an artistic discrepancy, tbh.

After all, Warlock explicitly stated that he and Surfer were positioned just over a light year away from Thanos and the other heroes, near the end of Infinity Gauntlet #3:
(please log in to view the image)

...And they certainly didn't move closer to the battle before Surfer attempted to snag the IG soon afterward. /shrug


__________________

"A great tactician creates plans.
A good tactician recognizes the soundness of a plan presented to him.
A fair tactician must see the plan succeed before offering approval.
Those with no tactical ability at all may never understand or accept the plan.
And when a mind is too deficient in understanding, the resulting gap is often filled with resentment."

-Thrawn

Last edited by Galan007 on Jan 23rd, 2017 at 04:09 PM

Old Post Jan 23rd, 2017 04:06 PM
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Galan007
|Imperial Tactician|

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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Mr Master
How bout' universeS?

Surfer travels across 1000 entire universeS in seconds. imo ... less than 10 seconds! thumb up

(HOW many "seconds" exactly though... that's open to interpretation)

Surfer takes off from Earth and first visits Zenn-La, then he begins his speed feat journey.

It is not outright stated it was "in seconds" ...
but I easily reached this conclusion from the following two pages.

Although I believe this,
I also think the "speed" of the feat is open to interpretation based on how one views the circumstances.

Basically, as Surfer leaves Zenn-La to find a race called the "Decimators" (located 1000 universeS away)
Human Torch lets off his full power and is no sold, literally, "seconds later" it's over,
because Surfer already reached the reality of the "Decimators" located 1000 universeS away.

(please log in to view the image) (please log in to view the image) (please log in to view the image) (please log in to view the image) (please log in to view the image)
I know this feat isn't applicable here because it is an alternate Surfer, but I don't think a character can simply fly to alternate universes as though they are walking to their next door neighbor's house -- especially a universe 1,000x removed from the one they currently occupy... Not without some kind of 'boost' at least.

As is also the case with DC, universes in Marvel occupy the same physical space, but they are separated by variances in their vibratory pattern(s):
(please log in to view the image)

So to achieve that feat, it seems like 71016-Surfer would've *had to* either: create a wormhole to access the specific universe of the Decimators, OR alter his own vibrational pattern to match theirs -- either of which would have allowed for nigh-instantaneous transport to that specific universe.




...Thoughts?


__________________

"A great tactician creates plans.
A good tactician recognizes the soundness of a plan presented to him.
A fair tactician must see the plan succeed before offering approval.
Those with no tactical ability at all may never understand or accept the plan.
And when a mind is too deficient in understanding, the resulting gap is often filled with resentment."

-Thrawn

Last edited by Galan007 on Jan 23rd, 2017 at 04:37 PM

Old Post Jan 23rd, 2017 04:34 PM
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psycho gundam
The Nightmare of Solomon

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quote: (post)
Originally posted by CosmicComet
I used to think so too, but someone pointed out that he could have simply scanned like a radar over an indeterminate radius while flying over the Earth. Would still be a great speed feat even if he just criss-crossed the Earth a handful of times while scanning though, but unless it shows that he manually looked everywhere, I can't assume he did, especially when he has the cosmic awareness for efficiency.
quote: (post)
Originally posted by CosmicComet
Occam's Razor
stick out tongue


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Old Post Jan 23rd, 2017 05:06 PM
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CosmicComet
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Almost but not quite. stick out tongue

Flew and looked manually every square foot, or flew and scanned. Neither is a more straightforward an explanation than the other, but the former would be a lot less efficient and much harder to do. :P


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Old Post Jan 23rd, 2017 06:17 PM
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Badabing
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by carver9
Lol...the smiley Bada, the smiley. You are the one that told me to use smilies anytime I'm not serious.
Yes Carver, I noticed the smiley. In fact, a lot of your recent posts have shown smilies. That means a lot of your posts weren't serious. Posts which aren't serious are spam posts. Spam posts are against the rules.



WARNED! thumb up


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Old Post Jan 23rd, 2017 06:42 PM
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Galan007
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__________________

"A great tactician creates plans.
A good tactician recognizes the soundness of a plan presented to him.
A fair tactician must see the plan succeed before offering approval.
Those with no tactical ability at all may never understand or accept the plan.
And when a mind is too deficient in understanding, the resulting gap is often filled with resentment."

-Thrawn

Old Post Jan 23rd, 2017 06:53 PM
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Fiendish
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Galan007
That can be chalked up to an artistic discrepancy, tbh.

After all, Warlock explicitly stated that he and Surfer were positioned just over a light year away from Thanos and the other heroes, near the end of Infinity Gauntlet #3:
(please log in to view the image)

...And they certainly didn't move closer to the battle before Surfer attempted to snag the IG soon afterward. /shrug


That was my original thought as well. However at some point, they did move from the position there, where Warlock makes that statement, to an area with the asteroids that we see Warlock standing on in both the scene from Silver Surfer #56 and the scene from Infinity Gauntlet #4. It's done off panel so it can't be stated with certainty that it wasn't closer.

To me it's not that big a deal, as since then Surfer's done the "light years in seconds" thing multiple times IIRC, his escape with Air-Walker during Annihilation Silver Surfer #1 specifically coming to mind.

Old Post Jan 24th, 2017 08:51 AM
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Philosophía
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by psycho gundam
stick out tongue
Occam's razor would indicate that somebody with one of the best [cosmic] senses in comics wouldn't physically have to look in every corner of the planet.

Occam's razor =\= not using logic.


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Old Post Jan 24th, 2017 02:21 PM
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Surtur
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Anyways so yeah Flash still wins this race.


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Old Post Jan 24th, 2017 03:19 PM
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Galan007
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Fiendish
That was my original thought as well. However at some point, they did move from the position there, where Warlock makes that statement, to an area with the asteroids that we see Warlock standing on in both the scene from Silver Surfer #56 and the scene from Infinity Gauntlet #4. It's done off panel so it can't be stated with certainty that it wasn't closer.
Again, it is just an artistic discrepancy between the main series and the Surfer tie-ins. Starlin made it explicitly clear in the main series that Warlock and Surfer were just over a light year away from Thanos the entire time. The tie-ins certainly do not change that, as they contain NO statements/dialogue giving us a closer distance than what Starlin/Warlock stated.

Furthermore, the context of that entire scene --the whole reason Warlock positioned them that far away-- was so Thanos would not sense them while he was actively battling the other heroes. Warlock would absolutely NOT have risked moving them closer to the battle than they already were for no reason -- doing so could have alerted Thanos to their shenanigans ahead of schedule.

tl;dr-
They were ~ a light year away when Surfer attempted the Gauntlet-snag. It is quite unarguable, tbh. thumb up


__________________

"A great tactician creates plans.
A good tactician recognizes the soundness of a plan presented to him.
A fair tactician must see the plan succeed before offering approval.
Those with no tactical ability at all may never understand or accept the plan.
And when a mind is too deficient in understanding, the resulting gap is often filled with resentment."

-Thrawn

Last edited by Galan007 on Jan 24th, 2017 at 05:24 PM

Old Post Jan 24th, 2017 05:20 PM
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Mr Master
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Galan007

I know this feat isn't applicable here because it is an alternate Surfer, but I don't think a character can simply fly to alternate universes as though they are walking to their next door neighbor's house -- especially a universe 1,000x removed from the one they currently occupy... Not without some kind of 'boost' at least.

As is also the case with DC, universes in Marvel occupy the same physical space, but they are separated by variances in their vibratory pattern(s):
(please log in to view the image)

Hey there G, you're totally correct concerning the vibratory separations of universes.

btw. luvs that Excalibur team feat. They used a portion of Merlyn's power source at the time,
and look at what they were able to accomplished, easily I might add.

matrix-Merlyn baby, don't sleep. ... "cause sleep is the cousin of death"
quote: (post)
Originally posted by Galan007

So to achieve that feat, it seems like 71016-Surfer would've *had to* either: create a wormhole to access the specific universe of the Decimators, OR alter his own vibrational pattern to match theirs -- either of which would have allowed for nigh-instantaneous transport to that specific universe.

...Thoughts?

I agree. ... This is why ol' Stan the man dropped the ball in this story. (or simply confused us)

It seems Stan not only had Surfer (possibly because it's open to interpretation) do it ...

but he definitely had the Adjudicator doing it:

... Reed highlights he's registering it's speed. (so it's traveling)

[img=http://s6d1.turboimg.net/t/32699217_Ad1.jpg]
[img=http://s6d1.turboimg.net/t/32699218_Ad2.jpg]

... "Adjudicator flashes past entire universeS. ... Not in a spaceship. But propelled by a force" ...

---------------------------------------

and, it seems Galactus did it too:

[img=http://s6d1.turboimg.net/t/32699219_Ad3.jpg]
[img=http://s6d1.turboimg.net/t/32699220_Ad4.jpg]

"Time and Space intermingle as the Galaxies speed by"

Although I'll submit, one could interpret this as at-least a warp drive.
But one could see it as physical travel likewise imo.

---------------------------------------

The Adjudicator's feat is without question, the other two, can be debated. (specially Surfer)

But, on the other hand, which is yours,
the fact that Stan described what the Adjudicator did as though it was special,
leans towards the idea that Surfer used a different method, perhaps a more practical method as you're suggesting.
Galactus? well, his take off could easily be perceived as a space warp, (or not) so ...

meh, it's a bit confusing, but I think I agree with you more than not here.


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Last edited by Mr Master on Jan 26th, 2017 at 02:51 AM

Old Post Jan 26th, 2017 02:46 AM
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leonidas
MWHAHAHAHA!

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surfer was said to be able to travel to the unilord's universe via straight travel as well, though even at his top speed it would have taken him many many years. /shrug


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Old Post Jan 26th, 2017 02:57 AM
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Galan007
|Imperial Tactician|

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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Mr Master
Hey there G, you're totally correct concerning the vibratory separations of universes.

btw. luvs that Excalibur team feat. They used a portion of Merlyn's power source at the time,
and look at what they were able to accomplished, easily I might add.

matrix-Merlyn baby, don't sleep. ... "cause sleep is the cousin of death"

I agree. ... This is why ol' Stan the man dropped the ball in this story. (or simply confused us)

It seems Stan not only had Surfer (possibly because it's open to interpretation) do it ...

but he definitely had the Adjudicator doing it:

... Reed highlights he's registering it's speed. (so it's traveling)

[img=http://s6d1.turboimg.net/t/32699217_Ad1.jpg]
[img=http://s6d1.turboimg.net/t/32699218_Ad2.jpg]

... "Adjudicator flashes past entire universeS. ... Not in a spaceship. But propelled by a force" ...

---------------------------------------

and, it seems Galactus did it too:

[img=http://s6d1.turboimg.net/t/32699219_Ad3.jpg]
[img=http://s6d1.turboimg.net/t/32699220_Ad4.jpg]

"Time and Space intermingle as the Galaxies speed by"

Although I'll submit, one could interpret this as at-least a warp drive.
But one could see it as physical travel likewise imo.

---------------------------------------

The Adjudicator's feat is without question, the other two, can be debated. (specially Surfer)

But, on the other hand, which is yours,
the fact that Stan described what the Adjudicator did as though it was special,
leans towards the idea that Surfer used a different method, perhaps a more practical method as you're suggesting.
Galactus? well, his take off could easily be perceived as a space warp, (or not) so ...

meh, it's a bit confusing, but I think I agree with you more than not here.
Cool beans.

I was just curious more than anything, as the feat didn't mesh with what I know about Marvel's cosmological layout... Even after I went back and reread that comic, lol.

Thanks. thumb up


__________________

"A great tactician creates plans.
A good tactician recognizes the soundness of a plan presented to him.
A fair tactician must see the plan succeed before offering approval.
Those with no tactical ability at all may never understand or accept the plan.
And when a mind is too deficient in understanding, the resulting gap is often filled with resentment."

-Thrawn

Old Post Jan 26th, 2017 03:25 AM
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Genii96
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How fast does one have to be to cover every inch of a planet on about 3 secs?

Old Post Jan 26th, 2017 07:37 PM
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DarkSaint85
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Depends.

I can, with the help of Google Earth, zoom out and look at every inch of Earth at once.


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Old Post Jan 26th, 2017 07:52 PM
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ghostman
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bump


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Old Post Mar 6th, 2018 01:14 AM
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leonidas
MWHAHAHAHA!

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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Galan007
Cool beans.

I was just curious more than anything, as the feat didn't mesh with what I know about Marvel's cosmological layout... Even after I went back and reread that comic, lol.

Thanks. thumb up


i'd forgotten all about that arc--off topic but one more example of how ludicrously fast the "speed of thought" can be in the comic world. thumb up yet people still argue that speed of thought can't exceed light in comics because it doesn't make sense. laughing out loud


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Old Post Mar 6th, 2018 03:40 PM
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