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Home » Star Wars » Star Wars: Literature & Expanded Universe » Top 15 Most Powerful Jedi


Top 15 Most Powerful Jedi
Started by: DarthAnt66

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Darth Thor
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Prime Kenobi should do better now post Twin Suns.

Old Post Aug 27th, 2017 01:33 PM
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XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
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Nah. Canon2weak.


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Old Post Aug 27th, 2017 02:59 PM
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Ursumeles
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Registered: Sep 2016
Location: Outside the Universe


 

1. Luke
2. Yoda
3. Anakin

From then on it get's murky. Contenders are:
TotJ: Odan-Urr, Ood Bnar, Baas, Thon, Nomi, Jedi! Ulic, Jedi! Exar, Jedi! Nadd (?).
KoTOR/TOR: Revan, Exile, Barsen'thor, Aryn, HoT, Satele.
PT/OT: Mace, Obi-Wan, Jorus, Yaddle, Dooku, Fay (?), Shaak, Galen (if you want to count him), Vastor (same).
NJO/Legacy: Kyp, Streen, Jaina, Jacen, Corran, Leia, Cade, T'ra Saa, Kyle, Saba, Mara.


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Last edited by Ursumeles on Aug 27th, 2017 at 03:18 PM

Old Post Aug 27th, 2017 03:15 PM
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DarthAnt66
Last of the Jedi

Registered: Feb 2013
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This is top 15, not top 30.


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Old Post Aug 27th, 2017 03:25 PM
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Haschwalth
Senior Member

Registered: Jul 2017
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1.Luke
2.Yoda
3.Revan
4.Mace windu
5.Anakin
6.Ulic/exar jedi
7.Thon
8.HoT
9.Cade
10.Meetra
11.Nomi
12.Jaina
13.Kyp
14.Jacen
15.Obi wan.

Old Post Aug 27th, 2017 03:39 PM
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UCanShootMyNova
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Updated list post shedding of limitations.

1. Luke.
2/3. Galen Marek/Starkiller.
4. Yoda.
5. Anakin.
6. RotS Windu
6. Yarael Poof
7. Thon.
8/9/10. Revan Reborn/HoT/Barsen'thor
11/12. Jacen/Jaina.
13. Kyp Durron.
14. Mara Jade.
15. ANH Kenobi.


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Last edited by UCanShootMyNova on Aug 27th, 2017 at 06:17 PM

Old Post Aug 27th, 2017 06:13 PM
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Darth Thor
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Registered: Apr 2008
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Nah. Canon2weak.



That's why we all love a bit of Power Scaling.

Old Post Aug 27th, 2017 06:16 PM
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thesithmaster
Dark Lord of the Sith

Registered: Jul 2017
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by UCanShootMyNova
Updated list post shedding of limitations.

1. Luke.
2/3. Galen Marek/Starkiller.
4. Yoda.
5. Anakin.
6. RotS Windu
6. Yarael Poof
7. Thon.
8/9/10. Revan Reborn/HoT/Barsen'thor
11/12. Jacen/Jaina.
13. Kyp Durron.
14. Mara Jade.
15. ANH Kenobi.


Starkiller>Yoda? Yeah. Then explain to me how a massively pre-prime Vader picked Starkiller up and threw him around while not utilizing all of his power. Yes, Vader was holding back. Sam Witwer was stating Haden Blackman's words which trump the novel.


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Old Post Aug 27th, 2017 07:15 PM
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UCanShootMyNova
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Because Starkiller had expended a massive amount of energy prior to his fight with Vader and the novel directly states Vader wasn't holding back.

Even though I have asked you nearly half a dozen times you've failed to present evidence that Witwer's statements came directly from Blackman and have been unable to explain to me why a statement from Blackman regarding concepts for a potential sequel would trump a C canon third person statement.


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Old Post Aug 27th, 2017 07:21 PM
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thesithmaster
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by UCanShootMyNova
Because Starkiller had expended a massive amount of energy prior to his fight with Vader and the novel directly states Vader wasn't holding back.

Even though I have asked you nearly half a dozen times you've failed to present evidence that Witwer's statements came directly from Blackman and have been unable to explain to me why a statement from Blackman regarding concepts for a potential sequel would trump a C canon third person statement.


"Expended a massive amount of energy." LMAO. If that really drained him then Starkiller's stamina is pathetic- you know, below Qui-Gon level stamina. And for that Yoda+ level juggernaut to be drained like that proves that he isn't Yoda level at all. A Yoda level guy should have the power to be fine after that.

The novel states it? Too bad Haden Blackman has stated otherwise and the novel has nothing on Blackman.

You want proof? OK. Here you go.

"Yeah, absolutely, I'll give you little tidbits. The story of 3 was going to be as I understand it, thematically the terror of Darth Vader, because, you know, Haden Blackman wasn't about to have you beat this guy two times in a row without making a very strong point at the end of the third one and throughout the third one. That, you know there is, there is a... you know, I shouldn't say too much in case this all happens..."

From Sam Witwer. How would he learn the story? Yeah, from Blackman. He's revealing Blackman's intentions for his story. TFU is Blackman's story. The novel is merely an adaptation of it. The novel is credible, yeah, but it is not as canon as Blackman.

For instance, you have the Star Wars movies. Are the novels valid? Yes. However, if there's anything in the novel that outright contradicts the movie, it's not canon. This is the case here. The novel can state Vader was going full-out all it wants, it's still trumped by Blackman, who put into his story that Vader was playing with Starkiller. Not in TFU III, but in TFU and TFU II given the statement that Vader HAD been gaming Starkiller.

In short, a Starkiller who has no reason to be tired (a guy on Starkiller's level of power will never be drained by charging a cannon) was ragdolled by a toying Vader. This Vader, mind you, is massively pre-prime. How is he Yoda level, again?

Saying Starkiller can stand the tiniest of chances against Yoda is laughable, saying Starkiller is more powerful than Yoda is the best joke of all time.


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Last edited by thesithmaster on Aug 27th, 2017 at 07:59 PM

Old Post Aug 27th, 2017 07:55 PM
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Darth Thor
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by UCanShootMyNova


Even though I have asked you nearly half a dozen times you've failed to present evidence that Witwer's statements came directly from Blackman and have been unable to explain to me why a statement from Blackman regarding concepts for a potential sequel would trump a C canon third person statement.



Have to recheck the quote but IIRC He specifically said "Hayden Blackman" wasn't gonna let this guy beat Vader for a 3rd time. And then goes on to explain he's not a match for Vader.

Sounds like he's more Rebels Ahsoka/Maul level if we were to powerscale.


Edit: Ah just seen Sithmaster has given the quote.

Old Post Aug 27th, 2017 08:12 PM
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UCanShootMyNova
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LMAO. If that really drained him then Starkiller's stamina is pathetic- you know, below Qui-Gon level stamina. And for that Yoda+ level juggernaut to be drained like that proves that he isn't Yoda level at all. A Yoda level guy should have the power to be fine after that.

I'm sorry, but I don't see Qui Gon being able to power a cannon that split a shielded Star Destroyer or destroy half of a 300 meter frigate.

I was hoping it would be obvious, but I don't actually believe Starkiller/Galen to be > Yoda. It was a joke. Granted, nothing Yoda has via scaling or feats would allow him to accomplish feats like those without being drained.

The novel states it? Too bad Haden Blackman has stated otherwise and the novel has nothing on Blackman.

Third person statements from C canon sources > author opinions. Especially author opinions regarding concepts from future works that hadn't even been released.

From Sam Witwer.

That's the key statement here.

How would he learn the story? Yeah, from Blackman.

Now that's a logical leap and a half. Sam Witwer would know the story from his involvement in it. He might know pieces of the planned story from Blackman but to assume that statements like these come directly from Blackman because of that possibility is wrong. I'm going to need you to provide direct evidence that his statements came from Blackman otherwise I can't acknowledge it as anything more then a possibility.

He's revealing Blackman's intentions for his story.

Proof that it's Blackman's intentions rather then his own speculation? And again, an author's speculation on the future of their story doesn't trump a third person canonical statement about the currently completed story.

TFU is Blackman's story. The novel is merely an adaptation of it. The novel is credible, yeah, but it is not as canon as Blackman.

You don't seem to understand. Whether or not the idea originated with Blackman has no bearing on his canonical authority. Leeland Chee and Lucasfilm decide what's canon and the level of canon it has. The novelizations are C canon. Blackman's words outside of clarifications of his own work are not.

For instance, you have the Star Wars movies. Are the novels valid? Yes. However, if there's anything in the novel that outright contradicts the movie, it's not canon. This is the case here.

Please provide a statement that shows this was the policy with EU works and their novelization counterparts. Because this is news to me.

The novel can state Vader was going full-out all it wants, it's still trumped by Blackman, who put into his story that Vader was playing with Starkiller. Not in TFU III, but in TFU and TFU II given the statement that Vader HAD been gaming Starkiller.

First provide proof that Blackman told Witwer to say this and then provide proof that Blackman's clarification > then C canon statements.

In short, a Starkiller who has no reason to be tired (a guy on Starkiller's level of power will never be drained by charging a cannon) was ragdolled by a toying Vader. This Vader, mind you, is massively pre-prime.

How is accomplishing feats which would have required petatons worth of energy not going to tire him? You can't just make an appeal to ignorance like that and expect people to go along with it. That's like saying

"( Nyriss can disintegrate armored soldiers so she'd never had trouble killing somebody with lightning )"

ignoring the fact that Force defenses exist.

Context is imporant. And when you have the cannon shot splitting the Star Destroyer in half where before a shot from it had done no visible damage, well, common sense dictates that Starkiller provided most of the energy that caused that effect and that supplying that much energy is going to indeed tire him out.

How is he Yoda level, again?

Answered above.

Saying Starkiller can stand the tiniest of chances against Yoda is laughable,

How exactly do you figure that?

saying Starkiller is more powerful than Yoda is the best joke of all time.

Thanks.


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"I worked Jack in" - DMB, Gchat, 2017.

Old Post Aug 27th, 2017 08:40 PM
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UCanShootMyNova
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Darth Thor
Have to recheck the quote but IIRC He specifically said "Hayden Blackman" wasn't gonna let this guy beat Vader for a 3rd time. And then goes on to explain he's not a match for Vader.

Sounds like he's more Rebels Ahsoka/Maul level if we were to powerscale.


Edit: Ah just seen Sithmaster has given the quote.


So please explain to me how that shows the statements Witwer is making are going from Blackman and why that's relevant when a third person canonical statement contradicts it.

We can have a debate on the matter if you like. smile


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Old Post Aug 27th, 2017 08:41 PM
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DarthAnt66
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I'm under the impression Witwer made those statements with Blackman also in the call.


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Old Post Aug 27th, 2017 09:09 PM
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UCanShootMyNova
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
I'm under the impression Witwer made those statements with Blackman also in the call.


If that were the case would you know what the official position of canonical third person statements vs author clarification would be?

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f6/t645469.html


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Old Post Aug 27th, 2017 09:14 PM
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Darth Thor
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by UCanShootMyNova
So please explain to me how that shows the statements Witwer is making are going from Blackman and why that's relevant when a third person canonical statement contradicts it.

We can have a debate on the matter if you like. smile



So you're accusing Witwer of making that up?

Old Post Aug 27th, 2017 09:51 PM
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UCanShootMyNova
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Darth Thor
So you're accusing Witwer of making that up?


I'm not accusing him of anything. I'd just appreciate verifiable proof that his statements were representing Blackman's views as was being claimed.


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Old Post Aug 27th, 2017 09:54 PM
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Darth Thor
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by UCanShootMyNova
I'm not accusing him of anything. I'd just appreciate verifiable proof that his statements were representing Blackman's views as was being claimed.



Well he's the one who claimed it. So if you're just going to completely ignore it then you're essentially claiming he's made that whole thing up.

In any case we can see from TFU2, Vader was already pretty impossible for SK to defeat, and story wise the ending was almost definitely a set up.

Old Post Aug 27th, 2017 10:53 PM
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UCanShootMyNova
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I wouldn't say that's accurate. He said Blackman wouldn't let it happen twice. As far as I know, Blackman didn't say anything to confirm or deny this statement. Unless we're taking Blackman's lack of response as tacit approval, I just don't see it.

And there's a difference between "making things up" and assuming something you believe to be true. The former is an active attempt to mislead/lie while the latter is pretty much anyone giving their opinion.

This was a Starkiller who had expended massive amounts of energy beforehand...


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Last edited by UCanShootMyNova on Aug 27th, 2017 at 11:30 PM

Old Post Aug 27th, 2017 11:24 PM
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Darth Thor
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by UCanShootMyNova
I wouldn't say that's accurate. He said Blackman wouldn't let it happen twice. As far as I know, Blackman didn't say anything to confirm or deny this statement. Unless we're taking Blackman's lack of response as tacit approval, I just don't see it.

And there's a difference between "making things up" and assuming something you believe to be true. The former is an active attempt to mislead/lie while the latter is pretty much anyone giving their opinion.



What a strange story for Witwer to just "assume."

He was giving us plot details for TFU3, which had Vader kicking SK's butt, and claiming he was holding back all along to spring a trap. So Witwer would have to be making things up.

From all his Maul comments it's clear Witwer's just brutally herself nest about the limits of his characters.




quote: (post)
Originally posted by UCanShootMyNova


This was a Starkiller who had expended massive amounts of energy beforehand...



I don't recall the novel noting he wasn't at 100% during the fight. You have a quote.

What I do remember is SK noting Vader approached him more cautiously this time hinting Vader was simply caught off guard the first time.

In any case, even if we make him Vader's equal (which he's not), he has no business being placed on par with or above Yoda.

Old Post Aug 28th, 2017 08:43 AM
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