Wow, seriously? You couldnt quote anything firstly, and also, I've stated several times that Meetra is superior in sabers since Vitiate is featless and said that making any comments on Vitiate's saber skills is pure assumption. What we are debating here is whether Meetre would stomp Vitiate in a duel or not in case you haven't read the prior posts.
Not really. You have failed again bro.
You presented 3 options and Ive stated my opinion. Yet its either A or C.
Yes, HoT is very powerful. This doesn't change the fact that he is a dueling based character and his saber skills are his main area. Vitiate being able to duel with him for a decent amount of time should at least give hints about whether he would be stomped by Meetra or not. Speed factor is very important as well and in favor of Vitiate in this case.
The healthiest way to approach this subject would be accepting the uncertainty which is what I've been defending from the beginning.
What does the hero of Tython's fighting style have to do with Vitiate's? In almost every encounter with him, he keeps distance and attacks with the Force. So I'm sure, that when he meets one of the best duelist in the galaxy, the last thought on his mind is that he should go saber to saber with them, especially since he didn't even have a saber out during the end of duel. It's not like he chose that one random moment to put it away.
No it's not. It's an indication that Vitiate used the Force to maintain distance, illusions, Lightning, TK, etc. These are all things we see him use, in cutscene to maintain distance between himself and the Hero of Tython.
The healthiest way to approach this is to treat Vitiate like literally everyone else is treated here and saying that unless he even has the accolade, which he doesn't, he won't compare in something the Exile is proven to have excelled in.
None of the things you have listed proves Vitiate's lack of dueling skills. This was exactly the case with Sidious before the PT came out and look how it turned out to be.
Lack of knowledge doesn't mean that a character is lacking skill in that area. As I've said before countless times, due to feats, the Exile takes sabers but when a character is this powerful in the force and comes from the sith culture, lack of info on his saber skills shouldn't be an excuse to say that he would be stomped by an opponent.
I was only stating my opinion on the matter, I didn't quote anything because I knew there wasn't anything to quote, Vitiate's duel with HoT is full of speculation and as such is subject to debate. I wasn't saying anything that went against you. you are defending his lightsaber abilities aren't you? How am I in the wrong?
Honestly, I've been nice, I haven't implied or even stated that Meetra would stomp Vitiate - how about you read my second post?- nor have I even stated that she'd even win. Everything I said in chat was a joke, im surprised you took it to heart and I never even said she'd win the whole fight and stomp!. I'm feeling kind of attacked by you dude even though I - in my opinion - haven't said anything that's bad or contradictory. but If you feel I did, then I sincerely apologize, it was not my intention to get you mad or attack you.
Not at all. I was replying with the same sarcastically mean attitude you had which I knew was entirely a joke.
I didn't take it to heart and I also apologize and sorry to see you feel attacked here. My reaction was to you stating that I claimed Vitiate would win in a duel where I have said Meetra has the upper hand due to feats several times.
Even if you didn't present counter arguments, you have said that what I claim is foolish and wrong. My claim was that Meetra wouldn't be able to stomp Vitiate so I think its pretty organic that I thought you believe Vitiate would get stomped. Other than that, nothing bothered me. (Except this spite thread)
And no, Im not defending his saber abilities. Im simply saying that we have information on this matter.
Last edited by Sinious on Aug 22nd, 2014 at 08:49 PM
You mean the part where Sidious was shown to be bellow both Mace and Yoda in sabers, so resorted to the Force? Yeah. I remember that.
The absence of evidence is indeed is not the evidence of absence. But the fact is, plenty of "powerful people" in the sith culture have risen through the ranks while being well below the Exile in sabers. In a pure sabers fight, they would be stomped. I'm not going to assume Vitiate would be any different just because he's Vitiate. He has to prove himself just like everyone else, and the Exile has proved herself to be among the best in sabers. At least in KotOR II.
Great power does tend to make you better in lightsaber combat. Kas'im claimed that in general it was the most important factor in a duel, with exceptions. All I meant that I doubt a being as immensely powerful as Vitiate is truly the limp-wristed weakling that many on these boards make him out to be.
Vitiates exact abilities in close combat are vague, true. All we have is him losing to the HoT in a duel while possessing Kira, keeping up with the HoT in their fight and a vagfue story of him disarming and killing one of his best fights with his own sword. But still, with his power I doubt he's shit.
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Last edited by Nephthys on Aug 22nd, 2014 at 08:59 PM
Agree, Surik relied on her companions for her strength. DK may or may not have weakened her but without her companions she really isn't anything special.
True. People make Vitiate out to be garbage with a lightsaber. He most likely isn't an elite swordsman but I'm sure he can at least hold his own against accomplished duelists.
The Exile and Kreia are some of my favorite characters in the Star Wars mythos. I place KotOR2 Exile slightly above Revan.
WIth that being said, Vitiate should win this. The Exile got ragdolled by Nihilus before he tried to devour her. I don't think Vitiate could duplicate this feat, but I believe he could overwhelm her with his lightning just like he did to Revan.
In a pure saber match, Vitiate is unknown, while the Exile has been proven to be extremely talented.
I do think it's foolish to assume that Vitiate isn't a skilled duelist though. Sidious had a few gaps where didn't use his lightsaber for years and he still kicked ass. I feel that someone as powerful as Vitiate would be somewhat skillful.
KotOR II Exile has nothing that puts her on Revan's level.
I'm loling at the prospect that Vitiate couldn't ragdoll her. He hasn't been static for 300 years. He's been constantly growing stronger. Either way, he was comparable to Nihilus before. I doubt he couldn't replicate his TK feat, which Nihilus did while weakened not at full strength.
Last edited by FreshestSlice on Aug 22nd, 2014 at 11:59 PM
Registered: Aug 2014
Location: The balance of the Force
Their primary teacher.
It was always Revan and the Exile, they won the Mandalorian Wars, the Exile was forgotten about due to the Jedi Civil War taking place directly afterwards.
It was always clear to me that Revan was the famous poster-boy but everyone forgets he had help.
Meetra was a dedicated Light Side master, her abilities confirmed well before the novel. Though I see that debating such is just going to be sideswiped with 'lolgamemechanics' when that is not strictly true at all.
Meetra has exceptional feats, even her Force Ghost was powerful enough to feed Revan the required energy and mental fortitude to control Vitiate in subtle ways. All of this on Dromund Kaas, for three centuries.
But people love to low-ball KotOR characters as much as their fans love to place them on an unreachable pedestal.
It's a shame that all the characters bar Revan get ignored in terms of genuine feats.
Registered: Aug 2014
Location: The balance of the Force
Funny because Meetra has access to the most powerful Light Side techniques where Revan doesn't. But let's not allow some form of debate to jog our memory.
All of her feats and accolades from KotOR 2 are at the bare minimum on par with the feats for Revan from KotOR. IMO the Exile is more impressive than Revan.
Nihilus doesn't have Vitiate's knowledge and mastery of the Dark Side, but he has much more raw power. Without prep, and without a nexus, we haven't seen Vitiate replicate Nihilus' feats. We've only seen Vitiate surpass Nihilus with prep and sorcery. And I'm not trying to take away anything from Sith Sorcery.
Nihilus did that before he tried to drain the Exile. He was hungry because Kreia tricked him sure, but he was still very powerful.
Force Enlightenment is more gameplay mechanic than the saber forms you were just denouncing. As for the other Light Side techniques, Revan actually does have access to them, as he has complete mastery of both sides of the Force. It may not make sense, but he has shown that feat.
Revan Reborn is more powerful than KotOR Revan. Her being on par with KotOR Revan doesn't make her more powerful than Revan at his peak.
After Nathema, Vitiate grew considerably in power, and aside from godly TK Nihilus is an unknown. What I can say is that given the Exile was able to hold off Nihilus for a long amount of time, the one she faced was below the Vitiate Revan, Scourge, and she faced.
No, Nihilus is constantly starving, draining himself, and was weakened before KotOR II began. By the time he faced the Exile, he was in agony and was weakened considerably. Even then he completely dominated the duel with the Exile and only finally died when his accelerated self drainage became too much for him to continue defending himself.
Aug 22nd, 2014 08:02 PM
you are defending his lightsaber abilities aren't you? How am I in the wrong?
They were on the Maelstrom Nebula, not Dromund Kaas.
