It is entirely valid as it demonstrates he isn't the top tier being, as we know objectively that there are entities aside from TOAA who are above the LT.
LT is far more likely in the high skyfather rangem or abstract range.
It's pretty bad when a writer doesn't even try a halfassed "It was a Skrull" explanation.
I mean, if you realize you should never have written something, at least own up to it, instead of just ignoring it and hoping everyone forgets it ever happened.
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I have just about every appearance of the Beyonder.from sw1,2,and even the one off three.I hate to say this,but in the mid to late 80`s he made the Tribunal his wench,and every other cosmic for that matter.And guess what,he`s coming back in 2015.And I bet he will have his original bad ass power back!
LT has also become more powerful.
Classic Beyonder was Multiversal or maybe above it. LT is omniversal and has Megaverses in his hand or whatever. He is more powerful than his former Multiversal self, like Beyonder later was weaker than his previous self.
So LT for the win, till we learn who or what killed him.
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Easy. LT during the time of classic beyonder operated on Multiversal scale, because Marvel was just a Multiverse. Beyonder came from, well Beyond. Later the Multiverse was just a part of an Megaverse and that of an Omniverse and this is the new scale where LT operated. Hence he is more powerful now than before.
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Actually false.....
Beyonder realm is beyond time,space, and all realities and is a total omnilock away from LT/TOAA he basically has no authority over the beyond realm as Beyonder is still absolute in the multiverse and which beyonder realm is a technical larger...x3 then the marvel multiverse place the fact both are infinitely larger and by this logic
Beyond Realm>>>>Marvel Multiverse
Beyonder (Pre-Retcon) >xInfinity The Living Tribunal
Beyonder (Pre-Retcon)=The One Above All
Gender: Male Location: somewhere within time & space
Re: Re: L.T vs.both versions of Beyonder
The LT has always been the same LT of always.
There is no evidence of any kind even via allusion that concretely suggests the LT was upgraded in "power."
The LT operated on a "multiversal" scale back in 84-85' cause as you pointed out,
that was all of "canon" Marvel at the time.
But,
this doesn't take away from the fact
that the LT was the most powerful entity in all canon Marvel likewise. (excluding 84-85 Owen)
It's not Beyonder's fault he was retconned before the Marvel cosmic territory expanded.
That aside, it really doesn't matter anyway.
Because Eternity-Infinity's consciousness only extends across the prime trans-infinite Multiverse. (one multiverse)
This means ... I'd say 99% of all power in Marvel
is concentrated in this single multiverse which houses the 616 universe.
Which is almost an indentical copy of the Prime infinite multiverse of 1985.
Yes ... there are NO sentient universes (Eternity-Infinity) outside this single multiverse.
In truth, after years of after thought,
I don't even know how the "Brothers" (so called megaverses) fit into Marvel cosmology anymore.
Then again, after all, these Marvel/DC Brothers were meant to be retconned
as being below the LT and Spectre in Adventures of the X-Men,
and this project was assited and approved by Mike Carlin who's name appears in the credits.
It could be, that the LT's bio we all mis-interpreted it years ago,
and suppose,
that the Megaverses were Marvel and DC (Brothers)
and the Omniverse was the greater beyond. (other companies)
In fact, the LT's bio doesn't really appoint the "omniverse" solely to Marvel.
It was the 2007 bios that did that.
So, imo, again, perhaps the LT's bio was referring to the "megaverseS" that were Marvel and DC at the time, (2005 bios literally state this)
and the LT fashioned them in his hand, and Spectre was in cahoots with LT in this project.
This would put both the LT and Spectre above all of Marvel and DC,
since the BrotherS represented both companies supposedly.
Interestingly enough, the LT and Spectre almost obliterated both Brothers in the orginal DC vs Marvel garbage, hmm, funny.
At some point, this entire understanding was just ... forgotten/dismissed,
because again, the 2007 bios and beyond associate Marvel with its own "omniverse."
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Last edited by Mr Master on Dec 14th, 2014 at 09:32 PM
The scale of the MU became bigger and he grows with it. That's normal, that comics evolve.
So he was Multiversal back than, like Beyonder was Multiversal+. And the recton happened because Beyonder is still a part of the whole MU (Marvel Comics that is). It's not his fault is not a valid argument tbh, no offense. The territory was expanded, the true power of the beyonder was shown and it was smaller than the combined new territory.
It matters. The Universal concepts changed, became bigger, got more important or less important roles. With new territory comes new responsibility.
We don't know the rest of the infinite 99% of the MU, it can change with a new writer, we might get more insights, so I disagree with your point.
The brothers from the crossover are differen't from those in the X-Men comic. The Marvel Brothers are created by marvel, the crossover brothers by both companies, an hence only both companies have the "right" to recton them. apart from this, the brothers even look different, it is more like an experiment of LT from his past experience of the crossover instead of your implied real brothers being created by Spectre and LT.
Last but not least, the Brothers are not canon as far as i know, not the Marvel brothers, i mean the real deal, the stronger than Spectre and LT Brothers from DC AND Marvel.
Marvel can appoint only things to Marvel tbh. The Ominverse, as oxymoronic as it sounds, from Marvel is a differen't one than that of DC or Valiant. Maybe there is someone dreaming about having the "authority" to decide what is a FACT for other companies but it will stay just a dream ^^.
DC is it's own Omniverse, like Marvel is it's own. The Brothers (Megaverses) are hence only in Marvel and not a part of DC, as they were created in a Marvel comic by Marvel. The real brothers as said are a one time shot and I don't think even canon.
I disagree with your opinion to 100% with the reasons I already named. But to each his own.
LT and Spectre just succeeded to stop the brothers for a time but never defeated them, and the brothers were not even paying attention but fighting each other, where we might assume most of their power was concentrated. Neither LT nor the Spectre had the power to kill/defeat them, it was obivious that they were below them.
But then again, I don't see this Spectre and this LT as canon.
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Nov 16th, 2014 10:19 PM
