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Home » Star Wars » Star Wars: Literature & Expanded Universe » Star Wars Versus Forum » How long would Obi-Wan last against Sidious?


How long would Obi-Wan last against Sidious?
Started by: Jmanghan

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Stealth Moose
Umbrella Elite

Registered: Apr 2011
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Nephthys
Under 1 second.


Force choke takes at least this long, so yes.


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Old Post Oct 27th, 2015 12:09 PM
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Beniboybling
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Nephthys
Revan and Vitiate had a whole duel in a few seconds, with Revan running back and forth across a large room a few times.
No, they didn't. Context is key. thumb up


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Old Post Oct 27th, 2015 12:18 PM
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AncientPower
The Chosen One

Registered: Aug 2014
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Darth Thor
Yeah I suppose special effects haven't reached that level yet where they can depict combat at super speed erm


Except I'm 99% sure it was confirmed that they massively slowed down the combat speeds of the prequels and even TCW for obvious viewer reasons.

I imagine Lucas' original vision of Jedi reflexes is far better resembled in OCW and the movie novels.


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Old Post Oct 27th, 2015 12:52 PM
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Darth Thor
Senior Member

Registered: Apr 2008
Location: Asgard


 

quote: (post)
Originally posted by AncientPower
Except I'm 99% sure it was confirmed that they massively slowed down the combat speeds of the prequels and even TCW for obvious viewer reasons.

I imagine Lucas' original vision of Jedi reflexes is far better resembled in OCW and the movie novels.



Slowed down for the movies is one thing. I know Darth Sidious vs Mace Windu wasn't as slow as depicted by Ian and Sam. They wanted to go Practical for the Saber fights in the movies. I get that.

However there's no excuse for TCW.

In any case, going from what we've been shown to "they do hundreds of moves in 1 second" is just seriously stretching, especially given people like Pre-Vizsla going toe to toe with the likes of Darth Maul.

Smallville used to depict that sort of speed all the time, so I don't see why at least TCW couldn't. Well actually I know why. Because Jedi/Sith simply aren't that fast. I mean they are fast, but Spider-Man or Blade type fast. Not Flash, Quicksilver or Superman type fast, which is what people are suggesting with entire fights happening in under a second.

Old Post Oct 27th, 2015 01:06 PM
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Nephthys
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Darth Thor
Yeah I suppose special effects haven't reached that level yet where they can depict combat at super speed erm


Your mistake is in assuming Lucas is a talented director.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Beniboybling
No, they didn't. Context is key. thumb up


Imma let Ant have this one. :I


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Old Post Oct 27th, 2015 01:08 PM
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Darth Thor
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Nephthys
Your mistake is in assuming Lucas is a talented director.





He is. People b**** about him using too much CGI, then they b**** more when he goes practical for the Saber fights.


In any case my point rests on more than just the live action movie. There was also TCW. And there's the Cut Scenes from the Games as well.

Old Post Oct 27th, 2015 01:12 PM
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Beniboybling
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Darth Thor
Slowed down for the movies is one thing. I know Darth Sidious vs Mace Windu wasn't as slow as depicted by Ian and Sam. They wanted to go Practical for the Saber fights in the movies. I get that.

However there's no excuse for TCW.

In any case, going from what we've been shown to "they do hundreds of moves in 1 second" is just seriously stretching, especially given people like Pre-Vizsla going toe to toe with the likes of Darth Maul.

Smallville used to depict that sort of speed all the time, so I don't see why at least TCW couldn't. Well actually I know why. Because Jedi/Sith simply aren't that fast. I mean they are fast, but Spider-Man or Blade type fast. Not Flash, Quicksilver or Superman type fast, which is what people are suggesting with entire fights happening in under a second.
Lol, Force sensitives of their caliber are supposed to move too fast for the standard human eye to see.

Does it need to be explained why that would make for bad entertainment?


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Last edited by Beniboybling on Oct 27th, 2015 at 01:17 PM

Old Post Oct 27th, 2015 01:14 PM
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Nephthys
The Gr8est!!!!!!!!

Registered: Dec 2007
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Darth Thor
He is. People b**** about him using too much CGI, then they b**** more when he goes practical for the Saber fights.


In any case my point rests on more than just the live action movie. There was also TCW. And there's the Cut Scenes from the Games as well.


Oh man, you're totally right bro. I guess the movie characters are just pathetically slow compared to the rest of the mythos. Johun blitzes Sidious GG.

Lucas did show that Jedi had superspeed in TPM and Sidious blitzing the B team makes literally no sense unless either he's moving at superspeed or they were inexplicably stricken braindead.


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Old Post Oct 27th, 2015 01:16 PM
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Beniboybling
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Nephthys
Imma let Ant have this one. :I
I'll provide the context so you can draw you're own conclusions:

Revan's astromech launched a jet of flame at the Emperor, freeing Revan, who collapsed to the ground. In retaliation, the Emperor disintegrated the offending droid, strode over to where Revan lay, and picked the vanquished Jedi's lightsaber up off the floor.

It all happened in the space of only a few seconds.


It's only referring the above paragraph, not to the entirety of the conflict that takes place over separate paragraphs, sections, chapters etc.

Basically Ant can't read. thumb up


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Old Post Oct 27th, 2015 01:20 PM
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Darth Thor
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Nephthys
Oh man, you're totally right bro. I guess the movie characters are just pathetically slow compared to the rest of the mythos.



Where did I even hint they were slow?


quote: (post)
Originally posted by Nephthys
Lucas did show that Jedi had superspeed in TPM and Sidious blitzing the B team makes literally no sense unless either he's moving at superspeed or they were inexplicably stricken braindead.



Again where did I even hint they don't have super speed?

It's your "entire fights in 1 second" I have an issue with, given the entire TCW series never depicted or even hinted at such a thing. And given people like Pre-Vizsla go toe to toe with Darth Maul (confirmed as one of the deadliest Sith in history in both the old and new canon).

Old Post Oct 27th, 2015 01:40 PM
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Darth Thor
Senior Member

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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Beniboybling
Lol, Force sensitives of their caliber are supposed to move too fast for the standard human eye to see.



And yet Vizsla could clearly see Maul.

Jango Fett could clearly see Kenobi.


quote: (post)
Originally posted by Beniboybling
Does it need to be explained why that would make for bad entertainment?



You telling me Invisibe Speed has never been depicted on screen in live action or in animation? Lol

I suggest you watch a Superman movie. Or Days of Future Past. Or just an episode of The Flash or Smallville.

Old Post Oct 27th, 2015 01:42 PM
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FreshestSlice
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Registered: May 2014
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Beniboybling
I'll provide the context so you can draw you're own conclusions:

Revan's astromech launched a jet of flame at the Emperor, freeing Revan, who collapsed to the ground. In retaliation, the Emperor disintegrated the offending droid, strode over to where Revan lay, and picked the vanquished Jedi's lightsaber up off the floor.

It all happened in the space of only a few seconds.


It's only referring the above paragraph, not to the entirety of the conflict that takes place over separate paragraphs, sections, chapters etc.

Basically Ant can't read. thumb up

To be fair, I haven't actually seen Ant argue this. It was Ancient. Not saying he hasn't, but still.

Old Post Oct 27th, 2015 01:54 PM
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AncientPower
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Registered: Aug 2014
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I've argued that given the indication that said action lasted only a few seconds then the entire battle would itself only have lasted a good 30 seconds tops.

Ant has once or twice argued that said statement could indicate Revan vs Vitiate as a whole would've been similarly fast.


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Last edited by AncientPower on Oct 27th, 2015 at 02:00 PM

Old Post Oct 27th, 2015 01:57 PM
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FreshestSlice
Eternal Commander

Registered: May 2014
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You argued the entire battle happened in a few seconds to wank Revan and Vitiate's speed. On more than one occasion.
For reference:
quote: (post)
Originally posted by AncientPower
Given that Revan and Vitiate waged an entire battle in three or four (definition of 'a few') seconds. Which included:

1.Revan charges.
2.Vitiate knocks him back with a Force wave.
3.Revan charges at a slower pace.
4.Vitiate attacks him with his will.
5.Revan counters with Force Purity knocking Vitiate over.
6.Revan charges Vitiate down.
7.Vitiate rolls over and blasts Revan with energy.
8.Revan intercepts it with his blade.
9.Vitiate fires three more in succession.
10.Revan deflects the third into Vitiate's chest.
11.Vitiate gets pissed, stands up and then summons his power.
12.Vitiate unleashes an FLS which Revan attempts to Tutaminis.
13.Revan holds this off.

I will request that you prove Plagueis can move faster than doing all of that in 3 or 4 seconds let alone blitz past it. Or I must assume you are trolling and/or have no argument and accept your unspoken concession on the matter.

Valkorion wins.

Last edited by FreshestSlice on Oct 27th, 2015 at 02:08 PM

Old Post Oct 27th, 2015 02:04 PM
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AncientPower
The Chosen One

Registered: Aug 2014
Location: The balance of the Force


 

Yeh.. because y'know, given how that part lasted 3 seconds and the rest of their battle wasn't that much bigger then it was undoubtedly seconds. The entire battle as a whole was certainly less than a minute long and was -doing the theoretical math- about 30 seconds.


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Last edited by AncientPower on Oct 27th, 2015 at 02:27 PM

Old Post Oct 27th, 2015 02:21 PM
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Beniboybling
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by FreshestSlice
To be fair, I haven't actually seen Ant argue this. It was Ancient. Not saying he hasn't, but still.
Yah it's in his respect thread:

The entire battle between Revan and Emperor Vitiate, including the aftermath, all happened in only a few seconds. This included crossing a 120 foot walkway twice, releasing pulses of energy, defending against immense lightning attacks, and the destruction of T3-M4.

"It [his fight with the Sith Emperor] all happened in the space of only a few seconds."

―Star Wars: The Old Republic: Revan


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Old Post Oct 27th, 2015 02:52 PM
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Sinious
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Registered: Nov 2013
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Darth Thor
Yeah I suppose special effects haven't reached that level yet where they can depict combat at super speed erm
Obi-wan managed to hit almost 20 strikes per second in one fight and there are characters much faster than him. Do you really want them to be depicted that fast? The speed we saw in the last movie is pretty good imo. Perhaps it can be a bit faster but if they overdid it, it would look ridiculous and if they made them move as fast as they actually are, we wouldn't even be able to perceive them. So its not about special effects. erm


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Old Post Oct 27th, 2015 02:54 PM
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Beniboybling
Worst Member

Registered: Jul 2014
Location: United Kingdom


 

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Darth Thor
You telling me Invisibe Speed has never been depicted on screen in live action or in animation? Lol

I suggest you watch a Superman movie. Or Days of Future Past. Or just an episode of The Flash or Smallville.
No, I'm asking you whether you'd be satisifed if every importantly lightsaber duel ever visually depicted in Star Wars was done so invisibly.

"What's you're favourite lightsaber duel."

"Lol, don't know, can't see any."

You see my point?


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Old Post Oct 27th, 2015 02:56 PM
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Nephthys
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Registered: Dec 2007
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Darth Thor
Where did I even hint they were slow?

Again where did I even hint they don't have super speed?

It's your "entire fights in 1 second" I have an issue with, given the entire TCW series never depicted or even hinted at such a thing. And given people like Pre-Vizsla go toe to toe with Darth Maul (confirmed as one of the deadliest Sith in history in both the old and new canon).


You're arguing they don't move at superhuman speeds where they can perform dozens of actions in a second. They can.

The TCW series never depicted that because they didn't depict superspeed. We know that Maul can move faster than the human eye can see and various characters can move so fast they appear to be in multiple places at once or wielding a dozen lightsabers. Leneer was experiencing seconds as minutes or something. Vizsla can keep up with Maul partially because Maul was likely holding back and partially because non-force sensitives can reach superhuman (by our standards) levels in star wars.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Sinious
Obi-wan managed to hit almost 20 strikes per second in one fight


Nah.


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Last edited by Nephthys on Oct 27th, 2015 at 03:06 PM

Old Post Oct 27th, 2015 03:04 PM
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Sinious
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Registered: Nov 2013
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Nephthys

Nah.
Explain.


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Old Post Oct 27th, 2015 03:10 PM
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