You make it sound like as if breaking Revan and Malak was an easy task and any accomplished telepath could pull it off against them. This is a logical fallacy in itself. Being closer to the Dark Side doesn't makes you weak-willed.
Anakin Skywalker was slowly lured to the Dark Side, the process lasted several years.
Luke Skywalker willingly embraced the Dark Side during the events of DE and Palpatine knew that the former would betray him at some point. Palpatine had to defeat Luke in single combat in order to break him.
But there isn't a single example of someone successfully resisting Vitiate's telepathic assault in the first encounter.
I am fully aware of telepathic powers of UnuThul and Lord Nyax and I find Vitiate's telepathic abilities more intense in comparison. Even The Son doesn't seems to have edge over Vitiate in this area. This is not just based on number of individuals successfully possessed but some "inner details" as well.
Assuming that the Outlander is Hero of Tython, he have experienced Vitiate's telepathic powers beforehand and apparently developed countermeasures against them. But I wouldn't put much stock in the assumption that Vitiate couldn't affect the Outlander with his telepathic powers at all. We witness Vitiate manipulating Outlander (of any class) in the same manner.
Last edited by S_W_LeGenD on Apr 28th, 2016 at 01:49 PM
And that's not my point, my point is that when Luke and Anakin were on the precipe of the dark side, as Revan and Malak were, they were mentally instable, and easily influenced. Anakin to slaughtering innocents, turning against his friends and almost murdering his wife, Luke to striking down his father and becoming Palpatine's apprentice, which would have led to the death of all his friends, and then in DE, under the dark side's influence Palpatine made him forget his name.
Being close to the dark side doesn't make you weak willed, but being between worlds as they were does. How they got into that state being entirely beside the point.So? You're appealing to ignorance, what there is not a single example of Vitiate dominating someone of Caedus' caliber without extenuating circumstances.
And lmao at putting him above the Son when he know nothing of the latters TP.Apparently? Can you clarify on that with a source? And with the HoT alone he is particular in admitting the Outlander is too powerful for him to dominate, why ignore that?
Does SWL seriously think that Vitiate's telepathy is some "special technique" that nobody who hasn't specifically encountered it before can possibly combat, no matter how powerful? And his reasoning for this is that Revan taught Meetra and Scourge methods to defend against it - and this must mean that you have to have learned these methods. To call this a bad leap in logic would be quite the understatement.
I suppose Caedus just oneshots with shatterpoint then. Vitiate's never seen it, right?
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Revan and Malak were on the precipice of the Dark Side at that time, I agree. However, Vitiate broke them with barely an effort.
Vitiate demonstrated the capability to influence an entire planet's populace alongside Jedi Masters, Sith and battle-hardened troops with his telepathic powers. And you still question his prowess in telepathy.
Another revelation is that Vitiate can telepathically influence even the most powerful Jedi.
You think that I lack knowledge of Mortis story arc?
The Son possessing Ahsoka Tano is not something that Vitiate could not replicate. I'd say that Vitiate could break/possess even the likes of Anakin Skywalker and Obi-Wan Kenobi.
That is what I make of the Hero of Tython's implied invulnerability to telepathic influence. I don't buy it.
Vitiate managed to bind himself to the Outlander (Hero of Tython) against the wishes of the latter? Check
Vitiate could make the Outlander (Hero of Tython) see developments across the galaxy through powerful illusions? Check
If a player chose Vitiate's assistance during battles, the latter would begin to force his decisions upon the Outlander (irrespective of the Class) at some point? Check
Considering Vitiate's telepathic abilities, you never know for certain.
Lana Beniko managed to resist Vitiate's telepathic influence with great difficulty by strengthening her mental defenses beforehand (since the events of SoR) but Jedi (and/or Sith) far stronger then her couldn't.
The Emperor's Wrath had shatterpoint abilities.
Last edited by S_W_LeGenD on Apr 28th, 2016 at 05:02 PM
You recall wrong because Lana isn't on the Council, but since neither is the Wrath or the Hero of Tython, and neither of the Councils were hardly ever based on power alone, that's some pretty shit logic to begin with.
Minister of Sith Intelligence. Whatever its not like there was ever a replacement for Zhorrid so she might as well have been the Councillor for the Sphere of Imperial Intelligence. Regardless, she was barely strong enough to get such a high position, whereas Braga and the HoT are among the strongest Jedi alive. Act II HoT would stomp Lana.
Lol @ the Dark Council not being predicated on strength, noob.
Because of the reason Beni gave, which is the reason the book gave. Do not forget this.
The Hero of Tython? Yes. Tol Braga? Not really.
Except for having an exception connection to the Force that impresses her peers and the Dark Council. Sounds like you just made up a list of names because you don't actually have any gauge to judge her, or anyone in TOR really, by.
You still haven't given what this is based on. She's literally a one off, who's only impressive showings are under Vitiate's control.
Because she was a vegetable. It's kind of hard to grow when you can barely think.
Braga was the head of a team comprised of the "strongest" "most powerful and most resolute Jedi in the Order" and is clearly second only to the Hero on that team. He also fought a Dark Councillor for several days. Obviously he's among the top Force Users in the era.
"Exceptional" connections to the Force are nothing to the Hero getting called the strongest Jedi from Tython onwards. Her impressing the Council is nothing compared to Braga and the Hero being Dark Council+.
The team comprised of a nutjob and someone with a weakening connection to the Force, who can't even keep up with droids by his own admission, is apparently, "the strongest in the Order" or that statement isn't accurate. Especially since the only person there that is the strongest in the Order is the HoT and Braga.
Which isn't even true, but let's pretend for a while it is.
Why? Being felicitated by the Jedi Council is more impressive than being felicitated by the Dark Council why again?
And since we're talking about the HoT and Braga, I'll take that as a concession.
Well I wrote the Respect thread that says it is true, but ok.
Being called exceptional isn't the same as being called the strongest Jedi alive. Duh. Also Braga and the HoT both actually beat Dark Council member level opponents so its not just being called anything.
Over 300 years ago, the great Jedi heroes Revan and Malak stumbled upon long-hidden Sith Empire's capital of Dromund Kaas, and its ruler - a mysterious, almost godlike avatar of the dark side. They argued briefly over whether to alert the Republic and Jedi Council, but Revan was already too consumed by arrogance and anger to consider the possibility of defeat. By the time Revan and Malak approached the Emperor in his throne room, they were already at the precipice of the dark side. It took only a fraction of the Emperor's loathsome power to complete their fall. The Jedi succumbed utterly to the Sith leader's domination and returned to the Republic to spark a new conflict: the Jedi Civil War.
From (Star Wars: The Old Republic: Encyclopedia)
Intended message is that while Revan and Malak were on the precipice of the Dark Side at that time, Vitiate didn't had to exert to break them either. Therefore, even in a more fair scenario, the end-result would have been the same.
I don't see the possibility of Lana Beniko dominating Hero of Tython in a confrontation like this:
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Raw power aside, Tol Braga was also among the most strong-willed Jedi of the era. He was recognized as the conscience of the Jedi Order.
Lana is above average. I give you that.
Vitiate didn't augment powers of any individual under his influence on Ziost. Other 'possessed' hosts were dropping like flies but Surro withstood all kinds of abuse in her path.
This is your assumption.
Vaylin's powers began to manifest when she was in the womb of her mother.
Apr 28th, 2016 01:44 PM
