Points to his fight with Maul and Vader. Kenobi wasn't stuck on a barren planet for years alone now was he ?? Voice actor already confirmed my claim that Maul was overconfident against Kenobi and thought he'd have an easy win and only realized this guy was on active duty safeguarding the most important guy in the galaxy according to Kenobi.
I never said bad shape I said outside of his prime. Quit making up claims I've never made. He was in good shape just not at his best. Move on indeed.
But kicking Maul is a sign he won yet the same standard when applied in Maul's favor is blindly ignored. Double standards. Kicking a guy isn't winning its just kicking a guy. If I put up a gif of Vader choking Obi in rots that doesn't mean Vader was winning just choking. You're simple.
Kenobi didn't injure maul at all and was bfrd as soon as his brother was injured. Win for Maul. Quit with the double standards and kicks aren't winning you simpleton.
He won the duel and taunted which is what left him up vulnerable to Kenobi. Just citing facts you simpleton. He killed Qui. That's impressive.
Maul was cut in half after he lost the duel and proceeded to taunt him.that's called context. Only due to Maul's arrogance after he won the duel. I'm accurate you're childish. Maul survived.
Bfring is a win. Read the kmc rules. Kenobi didn't want the fight stopped and left himself open to the force push. Not the first time maul force pushed him when he wasn't ready for it. Maul is great.
Uh, did Kenobi's fight with Vader happen during his tenure in the desert? No. And you're seriously going to use his fight with Maul as a reference? What the ****?
So far we've seen zero material that indicates Kenobi was honing his skills or training rigurous or even moderately in any way. You're the one claiming he was, so why don't you provide actual evidence?
Your hypocrisy is more shameless with each post. Since when do you take voice actors' claims/opinions as Canon, hm? Scratch that, I know the answer: since those claims conveniently favor your favorite character, Maul.
In case you didn't notice, Maul realized Kenobi was on safeguarding duty prior to attacking him. So, invalid argument.
It's funny how every time you're backed into a corner you change your argument.
You used the argument 'Maul isn't in a great shape physically' as a way to partially excuse his loss against Kenobi. It's not relevant whether you said he's in a bad shape or outside his prime, because the point here is your argument is absolutely worthless, so you're now turning it into 'I never said this' scenario. Typical.
Seriously, feel free to look it up in our previous debates. If you're too lazy to do so , then yeah whatever you say, Quan. Deep down you know the truth.
You complained that I 'missed the context' in the past, yet here you are missing out on the context once again, lol. You're taking the gifs in an extremely literal context, so you're being the simpleton here, not me btw.
The point is Kenobi managed to duel quite evenly against both Savage and Maul simultaneously for quite a while, and he actually took one of them out of commission before being pushed away. If you seriously refuse to acknowledge how incredibly impressive this feat is, feel free to do so, but the only one looking like an utter biased fool here is you.
Like always, I guess.
Kek, every time you bring this up you look more stupid, did you know that? Yes, TPM Maul is better than TPM Kenobi and TPM Jinn. Everyone knows this. Good for you.
Nothing new here, but you missed the point yet again.
You specifically said Maul got the better of Kenobi a lot of times in the past. Per the argument you constructed, I countered by showing instances in which Kenobi got the better of Maul, as well.
I never argued who lost, who won or who was better. I simply beat you at your own game. Do you understand? Or do I need to keep explaining myself?
During this debate, every single time I've asked you to show actual pieces of evidence. Kek.
"Do not go gentle into that good night"
Last edited by Petrus on Apr 10th, 2017 at 07:55 PM
Kek, no you haven't. You've given excuse after excuse and constantly fail to acknowledge Kenobi's clear superiority.
So you believe his power was enough to actually take on the Pub and the Confederacy and even give them a relatively good fight?
The context in which Palpatine says 'rival' isn't clear-cut, but there definitely are a couple of things we can dismiss quickly:
1. He very evidently did not mean 'rival' in terms of combative prowess, so you saying 'my take on rival is arguable' is complete bullshit. It's not arguable.
2. We know for a fact he was no match for Sidious' in terms of armies, followers, influence, contacts or even to the RoT.
And sure, Sidious realized Maul was beginning to amass considerable support in a short period of time, so he obviously thought he'd need to remove him before he aquired even more resources. However, your fanboyism drives you to overestimate the word 'rival'.
Let's look at facts:
1. Maul was kidnapped and trained as the ultimate tool for Sidious, a purpose in which he was successful until a Jedi Padawan cut him in half and ruined his life.
2. He spent [wasted] years traumatized and completely deranged in a desolate planet, eating what he could find and barely surviving. If it weren't for his brother and Talzin, btw, he would've probably remained there forever. So, starting from this point, Maul had definitely a shitload of help, without which he would've never been able to accomplish what he accomplished afterwards.
3. After Savage took him to Talzin and she 'revived' him, he confronts Kenobi along with his brother and he managed to let Kenobi escape again, with the help of a lesser Force user.
4. When Maul actually faced off against Kenobi for the second time, he ended up being spaced by him and almost dying again, along with his brother.
5. When he finally was beginning to become someone relevant again, in comes Sidious, who crushes his dreams into oblivion and kills the only person in the galaxy he actually cared about.
6. He manages to escape Sidious' grasp only to become a shell of what he once was, become broken and lost and finally die in the hands of his eternal rival in just three moves.
7. A dog managed to get the better of him.
8. A blinded, lesser Force user managed to get the better of him.
Now, you criticize Vader for failing in spite of being 'backed up by Sidious'. Are you conveniently forgetting Maul also had the backing of Sidious for decades and also failed...? Of course you are.
We were never debating this, stupid.
The fact that he wasn't petty and selfish at the point of his death [when he actually couldn't be considered a Sith], is irrelevant. His whole life as a Sith was spent being petty and selfish. Like most Sith. Which was exactly my point.
Uh, when did I ever mention a death scene and what led to it?
This is sooo far off my original point, it's honestly hard to fathom your level of stupidity at this point. Unless you're deviating from my original point on purpose because you've no argument against it, which is also quite enjoyable for me. Win-win.
Oh my ****ing God. It's just impossible for you to move on, isn't it? 'Frailer and older' does not equate to 'not being in a good shape' to you? ****ing make up your mind already.
Comparing Maul to Yoda in terms of physical capabilites is frankly retarded. Yoda does indeed need a cane. He's ****ing 900 years old. Yet he fights like a demon. He's equal to Sidious. So even if Maul is 'frail', as you put it, how truly relevant is it whe someone like Yoda can fight on par with Sidious? Of course, Yoda >> Maul in terms of everything, but the point is he uses the Force very well to compensate his fragile physical state, and as seen in his fight scenes in S2, Maul does too. Either way, he's no where near as frail as Yoda, so dull comparison.
Oh, I almost forgot. You still haven't provided any evidence that shows Maul was way more dependent on his physicality than Obi-Wan. Still waiting.
Do you realize that by being the director and executive producer of Rebels he has actually worked on it, or has your stupidity crossed the line this time? What ****ing hypothetical matchup are you even referring to??
This exact same logic can be used against you whenever you decide to completely ignore Filoni's take on any SW matter he worked on. Being hypocritical is clearly one of your favorite hobbies.
It's still his opinion and not a factual statement. So either use an actual viable source or move on. Or do you fail to comprehend that it being non-Canon makes it irrelevant in a debate?
A third worlder who's kicked your ass countless times in debates, is smarter than you, more objective, less salty and idiotic and better looking.
The evidence I'm interested in is the one that unquestionably demonstrates that the gap in combative prowess between TPM/TCW Maul and Rebels Maul is as significant as you claim.
Again, familiarity can only take you so far, not as far as taking down your opponent in three moves because you're familiar with him, lmao.
Again, whilst broken and lost he was able to put up great fights in S2.
And you didn't answer my question. What else you got? Because both of those arguments have been refuted and you just keep on recycling them.
Sure, kiddo. Whatever you say.
No, you've phrased your arguments in different ways every single time I refute them, KEK.
Filoni also stated other stuff that clearly indicate Kenobi >> Maul, not just because he was 'broken and lost'. Do you conveniently choose to ignore them, or..?
Maul was also 'empowered' by emotions when he got owned by Kenobi, then. Same logic. Are you so stupid?
Maul made Kenobi flee a scenario in which he was nowhere near a good physical state due to the beating Maul and Savage gave him before, so not a clean 1v1 situation you can rely on, lol.
The second time they met Kenobi fought both brothers simultaneously and was able to give them a hell of a fight. So, no.
What does Jinn have to do with anything?
My Maul hate? The most apparent characteristic of anyone on this forum is your incredible Maul fanboyism.
Actually in the SW comic series, it is implied Obi-Wan did train a little bit, though it's also noted that his body wasn't what it used to, that he felt pains and aches through it and this even before he became much older.
On a note, reading through those issues again. People give crap to Owen about being an *******, but damn is he one brave mofo and cares a lot about Luke, given Luke was just handed to him.
__________________ "Imperial troops have entered the base! Imperial troops have entered—"
―Jobin, warning Echo Base' stragglers of the snowtroopers' advance
Also, I would argue that it seemed that Maul had turned away from the dark side right at the end with the questions he asked Kenobi about the chosen one, so he didn't die a Sith either. Have to watch it again I suppose.
__________________ Then lets head down into that cellar and carve ourselves a witch