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Home » Star Wars » Star Wars: Literature & Expanded Universe » Sidious Choking Dooku


Did Dooku resist Sidious's Force choke or not?
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He resisted it. 5 29.41%
He didn't. 12 70.59%
Total: 17 votes 100%
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Sidious Choking Dooku
Started by: UCanShootMyNova

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UCanShootMyNova
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Sidious Choking Dooku

Was Dooku resisting Sidious's Force choke or not? Did Dooku believe his position as the leader of the Confederacy of Independent Systems and a valid apprentice within the Banite line make him disposable for simply making a mistake?


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Last edited by UCanShootMyNova on Sep 17th, 2017 at 11:01 PM

Old Post Sep 17th, 2017 10:55 PM
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DarthAnt66
Last of the Jedi

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Talk about a loaded poll question, rofl.


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Old Post Sep 17th, 2017 11:24 PM
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Deronn_solo
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Sidious wouldn't kill Dooku for defending himself from an attack, lmao.

The argument that Dooku could have resisted, but failed to do so because reason, doesn't have a single piece of evidence sans fan-made assumptions.


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Old Post Sep 17th, 2017 11:41 PM
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DarthAnt66
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Re-reading the poll, I realized the question is laughably misleading.

No one thinks Dooku resisted Sidious' choke.


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Old Post Sep 17th, 2017 11:48 PM
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UCanShootMyNova
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Of course he wouldn't kill him. But he would definitely make his punishment worse for doing so.

It's just logic. If Dooku didn't betray Dooku the moment before his death why would he resist a punishment that would only become worse if he did so?


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Last edited by UCanShootMyNova on Sep 17th, 2017 at 11:52 PM

Old Post Sep 17th, 2017 11:48 PM
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UCanShootMyNova
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Re-reading the poll, I realized the question is laughably misleading.

No one thinks Dooku resisted Sidious' choke.


Since you're being nitpicky...

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/...threadid=646035


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Old Post Sep 17th, 2017 11:54 PM
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SunRazer
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Regardless, I think it's clear that they were trying to show that Palpatine and Dooku are in separate leagues. Not a fan of the way TCW tended to portray their relationship since they were more friend-like in AotC and even OCW, but obviously when Palpatine gets pissed Dooku is his b!tch. That's not really up for debate.

As for whether or not he tried to resist, he probably instinctively did to a degree at the very least, but again that's neither here nor there.

Last edited by SunRazer on Sep 17th, 2017 at 11:58 PM

Old Post Sep 17th, 2017 11:56 PM
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Kurk
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by SunRazer
Regardless, I think it's clear that they were trying to show that Palpatine and Dooku are in separate leagues. Not a fan of the way TCW tended to portray their relationship since they were more friend-like in AotC and even OCW, but obviously when Palpatine gets pissed Dooku is his b!tch. That's not really up for debate.

As for whether or not he tried to resist, he probably instinctively did to a degree at the very least, but again that's neither here nor there.
Sheev still called him "my friend" in the first seasons of TCW. From what I've noticed, Sheev became increasingly annoyed with him from mid TCW on.

But you're right; the intent was to show how Dooku is always at his mercy.


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Old Post Sep 18th, 2017 12:02 AM
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UCanShootMyNova
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@Nova: That's not what's being debated. Ant can argue whatever holistic shit he wants in regards to Sidious/Dooku. What I have a problem with is his assumption that Dooku would automatically expect Sidious to execute him for f*cking up despite being his most important tool in keeping the CIS under his control so that he can effectively manipulate both sides of the war ( and Dooku knowing this fact ).


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Last edited by UCanShootMyNova on Sep 18th, 2017 at 12:10 AM

Old Post Sep 18th, 2017 12:07 AM
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DarthAnt66
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That's... not really my stance.

I'm indifferent on if Dooku resisted or not, although I do believe he did and was under the impression he was about to die. That's conveyed through the dialogue and facial expressions of Dooku.

What's more relevant is, as Nova pointed out, the obvious intent of the action, which I find commonly in dispute. The idea Dooku was just caught off guard and stood there and thus the feat means nothing, which many claim, is just idiotic.


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Old Post Sep 18th, 2017 12:10 AM
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SunRazer
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by UCanShootMyNova
@Nova: That's not what's being debated. Ant can argue whatever holistic shit he wants in regards to Sidious/Dooku. What I have a problem with is his assumption that Dooku would automatically expect Sidious to execute him for f*cking up despite being his most important tool in keeping the CIS under his control so that he can effectively carry out the Grand Plan ( and Dooku knowing this fact ).


Yeah, I don't think so. Sidious has been ruthless before, but even some of Maul and Vader's ****-ups haven't prompted an instant kill on Sidious' part. He's cruel, not stupid. The punishment has to be in proportion to the failure, as well as to the value of the subject in this case I don't think Sidious would've killed Dooku over something he was expecting Dooku to resolve, and I think Dooku knew that. This was just to get the adrenaline flowing, lol.

Old Post Sep 18th, 2017 12:10 AM
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UCanShootMyNova
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
I'm indifferent on if Dooku resisted or not, although I do believe he did and was under the impression he was about to die. That's conveyed through the dialogue and facial expressions of Dooku. What's more relevant is, as Nova pointed out, the obvious intent of the action, which I find commonly in dispute. The idea Dooku was just caught off guard and stood there and thus the feat means nothing, which many claim, is just idiotic.


And why is that? Why would it be idiotic to assume that Dooku would not resist Sidious's Force choke when he's shown to be completely subservient to Sidious in YDR and didn't even say anything to prevent his own death in RotS?


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Old Post Sep 18th, 2017 12:15 AM
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UCanShootMyNova
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@Nova: Completely agreed. thumb up


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Old Post Sep 18th, 2017 12:16 AM
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DarthAnt66
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It's idotic to assume that plus the feat is irrelevant and that Filoni wasn't blatantly trying to show Dooku is Sidious' *****.


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Old Post Sep 18th, 2017 12:17 AM
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DarthAnt66
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If you recognize the intent, then whether or not Dooku did this or that is irrelevant.


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Old Post Sep 18th, 2017 12:18 AM
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UCanShootMyNova
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You know I don't give a f*ck about you or anyone else's fan interpretation of author intentions which is why you're being such a stubborn brat about this despite it being clear, not only from Dooku's actions in TCW but other mediums as well, that he wouldn't have offered any true resistance against an admonishment by Sidious.


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Last edited by UCanShootMyNova on Sep 18th, 2017 at 12:21 AM

Old Post Sep 18th, 2017 12:19 AM
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UCanShootMyNova
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
If you recognize the intent, then whether or not Dooku did this or that is irrelevant.


I don't recognize the intent because I don't agree with your fan interpretation of what Filoni was thinking when he wrote that scene.


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Old Post Sep 18th, 2017 12:21 AM
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DarthAnt66
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Hm? You're the one who seems pretty upset I think Dooku is Sidious' ***** - I don't think that's necessarily me being a "brat."

We know from ROTJ that Sidious' method of punishment is "far less forgiving" than someone who executes his subordinates for one mistake.

The line, "you know the price of failure" is a blatant reference to that line, with the context that Dooku had failed Sidious multiple times over.

My apologies that I'm not convinced Dooku would just stand there and allow Sidious to presumably execute him. That's not to say Sidious can automatically choke Dooku, though, since he can't - breaking free of choke and avoiding choke in the first place are distinctively seperate concepts.


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Old Post Sep 18th, 2017 12:24 AM
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UCanShootMyNova
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I think you trying to pass off shitty reasoning you gave less then half a second of though to as fact is pretty "bratty" but maybe that's just me.

The thing is, you're comparing Vader's method of dealing with fodder stormtroopers to Sidious dealing with the person who he maintains control of the CIS with. They're not comparable.

THe line "you know the price of failure" means that Dooku's failed Sidious beforehand and was reprimanded in a way that was obviously not fatal. Even going by your logic and assuming Sidious is capable of carrying out a punishment on Dooku against his will, Dooku gains nothing from resisting since that would only make his punishment worse with Sidious being capable of carrying out these punishments against Dooku's will. Either way your position doesn't make any sense.

It's your assumption that Dooku's retarded enough to think he's be executed for making a mistake that's maddening.


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Old Post Sep 18th, 2017 12:30 AM
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DarthAnt66
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Not at all. I've thought about this since the summer of last year where the counter argument (aka yours) was introduced by Ellimist.

The premise that Dooku just allowed Sidious to do whatever he wanted and yet visibly tried to break free from the choke are mutually exclusive, in my eyes.


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Old Post Sep 18th, 2017 12:35 AM
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