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The Monitor race v.s. the Beyonder race
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quanchi112
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Philosophía
thumb up

Anyway, Monitors win, even if we exclude the high-end Mandrakk/Nix.
Nah, Beyonders are simply on another level.


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Old Post Sep 25th, 2017 11:57 PM
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Mr Master
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Galan007
See, I'm thinking that Doom needed to 'draw out' the Beyonders, in order to destroy all of them in one fell swoop.

After all, the Beyond Realm is so vast that the entire Marvel multiverse is germ-esque in comparison... And even though the Owen-Bomb was powerful enough to destroy "hundreds of thousands" of universes, blindly dropping it into the Beyond realm would be akin to dropping a grain of sand in the ocean. So I think it kind of makes sense that Doom would need to have physical targets, otherwise he risked wasting the Bomb entirely.

Thoughts?
Its a fair point, but brother G, Each individual Beyonder is gargantuan within the Beyond Realm, atleast bigger than Kubik/Kosmos I would assume, if they're only as big as Kubik/Kosmos became, then next to each individual the Multiverse is an insignificant speck . How much bigger still the actual Beyond Realm itself is, is anyone's guess. (beyond our imagination I'd guess) Remember it was specifically stated they need to take on maliable forms in order to manifest inside the Multiverse. IMO, while within the Beyond Realm they're like unto God. No way, imo, a minute bit (even hundreds of thousands of bits, which are Cube beings) of Beyonder energy was going to affect the grand source (or race) from which it came. "drawing them out" into reality where they're physically susceptible was the key. But knowing the Beyonders' history I found this obvious likewise.


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Old Post Sep 26th, 2017 12:01 AM
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Josh_Alexander
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Re: The Monitor race v.s. the Beyonder race

quote: (post)
Originally posted by DeadpoolXXX
the ENTIRE race of DCs Monitors-
https://static.comicvine.com/upload...7282-img000.jpg
v.s.
The ENTIRE race of marvels Beyonders-
https://static.comicvine.com/upload...0-beyonders.jpg


-monitors get all their tech.


If we are talking about the Beyonders then The Beyonders without a doubt.

If we are talking about the Beyonder, which is the human, then Monitors.

The race of the Beyonders are simply to another level!


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Old Post Sep 26th, 2017 12:01 AM
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TheHulkster
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Re: Re: The Monitor race v.s. the Beyonder race

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
If we are talking about the Beyonders then The Beyonders without a doubt.

If we are talking about the Beyonder, which is the human, then Monitors.

The race of the Beyonders are simply to another level!


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Old Post Sep 26th, 2017 12:06 AM
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Zack M
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quote:
Anyway, Monitors win, even if we exclude the high-end Mandrakk/Nix.


Who are the top Monitors?


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Old Post Sep 30th, 2017 03:53 AM
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SquallX
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Zack M
Who are the top Monitors?


The Primal Monitor
The thought Robot since he was created by the monitors
Mandrakk
Mandrakk 2
Nix
COIE Anti Monitor at the end of time
COIE Anti Monitor after absorbing the near infinite positive verse
COIE Monitor/Anti monitor with the backing of their separate infinite universe

Old Post Sep 30th, 2017 09:47 AM
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Josh_Alexander
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The Beyonders win. They are simply above Monitors.

Monitors are Multiversal i believe. Beyonders are Omniversal.


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Old Post Sep 30th, 2017 02:01 PM
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TheHulkster
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
The Beyonders win. They are simply above Monitors.

Monitors are Multiversal i believe. Beyonders are Omniversal.


This and I have yet to see anyone post Monitor battle feats comparable to The Beyonders.

Old Post Sep 30th, 2017 02:21 PM
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SquallX
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
The Beyonders win. They are simply above Monitors.

Monitors are Multiversal i believe. Beyonders are Omniversal.


laughing out loud

Go read COIE, go read Final Crisis. Then come back and we'll talk.

The only Beyonder that was truly Omni was the original.

Old Post Sep 30th, 2017 03:50 PM
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Josh_Alexander
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by SquallX
laughing out loud

Go read COIE, go read Final Crisis. Then come back and we'll talk.

The only Beyonder that was truly Omni was the original.


I've read it, COIE Antimonitor is Multiversal.


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Old Post Sep 30th, 2017 04:05 PM
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SquallX
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
I've read it, COIE Antimonitor is Multiversal.


Then go back and read it again, for you clearly missed big chunk of the story.

Both Monitor's power were in balance with the Infinte Multiverse they controlled. In the end Anti was backed by his Infinte Multiverse, the Monitor's own Infinite Verse, minus three.

At the EOT, Anti surpassed that level of power.

Also, don't bring up the Supergirl fight, that was a pis moment.

Old Post Sep 30th, 2017 05:24 PM
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Josh_Alexander
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by SquallX
Then go back and read it again, for you clearly missed big chunk of the story.

Both Monitor's power were in balance with the Infinte Multiverse they controlled. In the end Anti was backed by his Infinte Multiverse, the Monitor's own Infinite Verse, minus three.

At the EOT, Anti surpassed that level of power.

Also, don't bring up the Supergirl fight, that was a pis moment.


I believe it's you who should read again.

As you said, Their powers were in balance with the infinite multiverse that places them under a Multiversal scale.

The Beyonders are from outside the Multiverse. Their power lies above that of the Multiverse. We are then talking about an Omniversal state of power.

Omniversal means their power is above the multiverse.


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Old Post Sep 30th, 2017 05:57 PM
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Zack M
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by SquallX
The Primal Monitor
The thought Robot since he was created by the monitors
Mandrakk
Mandrakk 2
Nix
COIE Anti Monitor at the end of time
COIE Anti Monitor after absorbing the near infinite positive verse
COIE Monitor/Anti monitor with the backing of their separate infinite universe


Primal Monitor swallows them all.


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Old Post Sep 30th, 2017 07:09 PM
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quanchi112
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Zack M
Primal Monitor swallows them all.
Nah, Beyonders prevail.


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Old Post Oct 1st, 2017 03:14 AM
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iceman24567
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Monitors win


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Old Post Oct 1st, 2017 09:39 AM
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quanchi112
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by iceman24567
Monitors win
Based on ?


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Old Post Oct 1st, 2017 01:44 PM
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Zack M
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by iceman24567
Monitors win


Clearly.


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Old Post Oct 1st, 2017 04:36 PM
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Galan007
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Mr Master
Its a fair point, but brother G, Each individual Beyonder is gargantuan within the Beyond Realm, atleast bigger than Kubik/Kosmos I would assume, if they're only as big as Kubik/Kosmos became, then next to each individual the Multiverse is an insignificant speck . How much bigger still the actual Beyond Realm itself is, is anyone's guess. (beyond our imagination I'd guess) Remember it was specifically stated they need to take on maliable forms in order to manifest inside the Multiverse. IMO, while within the Beyond Realm they're like unto God. No way, imo, a minute bit (even hundreds of thousands of bits, which are Cube beings) of Beyonder energy was going to affect the grand source (or race) from which it came. "drawing them out" into reality where they're physically susceptible was the key. But knowing the Beyonders' history I found this obvious likewise.
Sorry for the delay... Just saw this post.

Yeah, Hickman's Beyonders should be vastly larger within the Beyond realm, but the realm itself is also vastly larger than the prime multiverse(remember the whole 'drop of water in an ocean' thing..?) So it's all proportional either way, imo.

That said, blindly dropping the Owen-Bomb *somewhere* in the Beyond realm and hoping for the best would have been a poor decision on Doom's part, as it almost certainly would have left most of the Beyonders unscathed. Granted, the Bomb was powerful enough to destroy "hundreds of thousands" of universes, but remember: the entire Marvel multiverse is bacteria-esque compared to the Beyond realm. IOW, the Owen-Bomb detonating there wouldn't even register as a blip on the radar -- it'd be like dropping a firecracker in the ocean, and hoping it killed every fish on earth. /shrug

After reading the pertinent issues multiple times now, I honestly do not believe the Beyonders inextricably became weaker when they entered the multiverse. Drawing the entire race through a single/fixed point and into the multiverse was simply the only way to ensure the *entire* race was destroyed by the Bomb in one fell swoop -- it gave Doom a specific target.

...Just my two cents. smile


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Last edited by Galan007 on Oct 1st, 2017 at 05:28 PM

Old Post Oct 1st, 2017 05:24 PM
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Philosophía
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Galan007
Sorry for the delay... Just saw this post.

Yeah, Hickman's Beyonders should be vastly larger within the Beyond realm, but the realm itself is also vastly larger than the prime multiverse(remember the whole 'drop of water in an ocean' thing..?) So it's all proportional either way, imo.

That said, blindly dropping the Owen-Bomb *somewhere* in the Beyond realm and hoping for the best would have been a poor decision on Doom's part, as it almost certainly would have left most of the Beyonders unscathed. Granted, the Bomb was powerful enough to destroy "hundreds of thousands" of universes, but remember: the entire Marvel multiverse is bacteria-esque compared to the Beyond realm. IOW, the Owen-Bomb detonating there wouldn't even register as a blip on the radar -- it'd be like dropping a firecracker in the ocean, and hoping it killed every fish on earth. /shrug

After reading the pertinent issues multiple times now, I honestly do not believe the Beyonders inextricably became weaker when they entered the multiverse. Drawing the entire race through a single/fixed point and into the multiverse was simply the only way to ensure the *entire* race was destroyed by the Bomb in one fell swoop -- it gave Doom a specific target.

...Just my two cents. smile
thumb up

It's like having a grenade, and throwing it randomly on the battlefield.

You'd rather wait until everybody is gathered in a ditch, and catch them all at once. It doesn't mean that they're immune to the grenade when they're on the battlefield - it just means that the chances of hitting them is much lower.


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Old Post Oct 1st, 2017 05:40 PM
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Josh_Alexander
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Galan007
Sorry for the delay... Just saw this post.

Yeah, Hickman's Beyonders should be vastly larger within the Beyond realm, but the realm itself is also vastly larger than the prime multiverse(remember the whole 'drop of water in an ocean' thing..?) So it's all proportional either way, imo.

That said, blindly dropping the Owen-Bomb *somewhere* in the Beyond realm and hoping for the best would have been a poor decision on Doom's part, as it almost certainly would have left most of the Beyonders unscathed. Granted, the Bomb was powerful enough to destroy "hundreds of thousands" of universes, but remember: the entire Marvel multiverse is bacteria-esque compared to the Beyond realm. IOW, the Owen-Bomb detonating there wouldn't even register as a blip on the radar -- it'd be like dropping a firecracker in the ocean, and hoping it killed every fish on earth. /shrug

After reading the pertinent issues multiple times now, I honestly do not believe the Beyonders inextricably became weaker when they entered the multiverse. Drawing the entire race through a single/fixed point and into the multiverse was simply the only way to ensure the *entire* race was destroyed by the Bomb in one fell swoop -- it gave Doom a specific target.

...Just my two cents. smile


I honestly don't think the beyonders are dead. They are still there probably, looking at the Multiverse, making plans.

One of the things i noticed is that Ivory Kings were not seen when Doom's bomb exploted. Lets remember that the Beyonders we saw in Secret Wars are not the same ones seen at Time Runs Out.

I think it if well the normal/standard beyonder died, we still have to see what happened to the Ivory Kings, cause those ones were A HELL more powerful that the ones faced by Multiversal Avangers.


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Old Post Oct 1st, 2017 05:57 PM
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