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Systematic Issues
Started by: Rockydonovang

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Emperordmb
LSDMB

Gender: Male
Location: The Proud Nation of Kekistan

quote: (post)
Originally posted by socool8520
Well, don't get caught using illegal drugs and it won't show up anywhere lol.

Well that's part of the point I'm making. I don't think it should be a crime and thus don't think it should be involuntarily made a matter of public record as a consequence of my position that it shouldn't be a crime.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by socool8520
If it becomes legal, then don't do anything stupid and it won't be reported. No issues.

Agreed, if you do drugs and commit crimes those crimes should appear on public record.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by socool8520
If you are blabbing it on social media (I'm not meaning you directly) then it becomes public record and I would factor into my decision making process.

Fair enough, but that's more in the realm of what a person voluntarily reveals.


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Old Post Nov 15th, 2017 05:46 PM
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socool8520
Life's a garden, Dig it

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^ That's my thing. If it shows up, i'm using it


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Old Post Nov 15th, 2017 05:47 PM
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Surtur
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I've never been caught with illegal drugs. This is because I will not walk around with that shit in my pocket. I take precautions too. I always place it in my trunk. This way if you get pulled over a cop won't smell it. The shit I get SMELLS. It smells good, but you can tell it's weed immediately.


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Old Post Nov 15th, 2017 06:02 PM
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Rockydonovang
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by SquallX

Voting is not a right, it is a privilege.

That's absolute nonsense.

Voting being a right is the fundamental foundation our democracy is based on.

Last edited by Rockydonovang on Nov 15th, 2017 at 11:36 PM

Old Post Nov 15th, 2017 11:31 PM
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Rockydonovang
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Emperordmb


Agreed, if you do drugs and commit crimes those crimes should appear on public record.


Fair enough, but that's more in the realm of what a person voluntarily reveals. [/B]

Why? If you're going to be branding someone for life, then why are they doing time?

Why should the government actively aid in the sabotaging of people's lives?

And BTW, part of the reason we have so many criminals is because those who get out are always coming back, largely because of how hard it is to get back on your feet once you've already paid for your crimes.

Old Post Nov 15th, 2017 11:36 PM
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Surtur
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Rockydonovang
That's absolute nonsense.

Voting being a right is the fundamental foundation our democracy is based on.


Interesting article:

http://reclaimdemocracy.org/right_to_vote/

Seems we do, but at least one ruling said we don't. Or rather, there is a qualifier.

"In its 2000 ruling, Alexander v Mineta, the Court decided the 600,000 or so (mostly black) residents of Washington D.C. have no legal recourse for their complete lack of voting representation in Congress (they have one “representative” in the House who can speak, but cannot vote). The Court affirmed the district court’s interpretation that our Constitution “does not protect the right of all citizens to vote, but rather the right of all qualified citizens to vote.” And it’s state legislatures that wield the power to decide who is “qualified.”


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Chicken Boo, what's the matter with you? You don't act like the other chickens do. You wear a disguise to look like human guys, but you're not a man you're a Chicken Boo.

Old Post Nov 15th, 2017 11:40 PM
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Rockydonovang
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by socool8520


Because one can be rectified by obtaining an ID (easy to get and makes things legal) while the other puts a restriction on an illegal activity. That's not hard to think through.

It's not easy to get for tens of thousands of people state by state, that's the point.

The only way you can argue for this policy is pragmatically, and that's going to get you nowhere since you're actively doing a lot of bad for an unknown amount of good.

You can implement voter id once you've made sure voter ID's are easy and free for everyone to access. Untill then though, it's just bad policy.

Old Post Nov 15th, 2017 11:42 PM
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Rockydonovang
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quote:
Interesting article:

http://reclaimdemocracy.org/right_to_vote/

Seems we do, but at least one ruling said we don't. Or rather, there is a qualifier.

"In its 2000 ruling, Alexander v Mineta, the Court decided the 600,000 or so (mostly black) residents of Washington D.C. have no legal recourse for their complete lack of voting representation in Congress (they have one “representative” in the House who can speak, but cannot vote). The Court affirmed the district court’s interpretation that our Constitution “does not protect the right of all citizens to vote, but rather the right of all qualified citizens to vote.” And it’s state legislatures that wield the power to decide who is “qualified.”

Are you fcking kidding me?

Old Post Nov 15th, 2017 11:44 PM
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Surtur
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Well no. I'm not saying that is correct. The ruling was from 2000 so maybe more recent ones changed?


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Chicken Boo, what's the matter with you? You don't act like the other chickens do. You wear a disguise to look like human guys, but you're not a man you're a Chicken Boo.

Old Post Nov 15th, 2017 11:47 PM
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Rockydonovang
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Surtur
Well no. I'm not saying that is correct. The ruling was from 2000 so maybe more recent ones changed?

I know you don't think that. Doesn't change how utterly retarded that is.

Though no, unfortunately that still seems to be the case and is unlikely to change with a conservative supreme court,

Another really depressing article on this:
https://www.theatlantic.com/nationa...ivilege/262511/

The judges conceded Indiana Voter ID laws were partisan but said it was ok because it wasn't "excessively burdening".

Old Post Nov 15th, 2017 11:57 PM
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socool8520
Life's a garden, Dig it

Gender: Male
Location: Louisiana

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Rockydonovang
It's not easy to get for tens of thousands of people state by state, that's the point.

The only way you can argue for this policy is pragmatically, and that's going to get you nowhere since you're actively doing a lot of bad for an unknown amount of good.

You can implement voter id once you've made sure voter ID's are easy and free for everyone to access. Untill then though, it's just bad policy.


How is it not easy? It doesn't cost much, and the worst part about it is hanging out at the DMV. I got a state ID when I was 17 in like an hour for 25 bucks


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Old Post Nov 16th, 2017 10:40 AM
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Rockydonovang
freedom fighter

Gender: Male
Location:

quote: (post)
Originally posted by socool8520
How is it not easy? It doesn't cost much, and the worst part about it is hanging out at the DMV.

Again, for some people, depending on how much they make, what you consider "not much" can be "a lot". That's the problem with using personal anecdotes as the basis of policy.

For certain parts of the population, voter ID laws can make voting very difficult:
https://www.aclu.org/other/oppose-v...tion-fact-sheet
quote:
Underlying documents required to obtain ID cost money, a significant expense for lower-income Americans. The combined cost of document fees, travel expenses and waiting time are estimated to range from $75 to $175.2


quote:
The travel required is often a major burden on people with disabilities, the elderly, or those in rural areas without access to a car or public transportation. In Texas, some people in rural areas must travel approximately 170 miles to reach the nearest ID office.3


quote:
States exclude forms of ID in a discriminatory manner. Texas allows concealed weapons permits for voting, but does not accept student ID cards. Until its voter ID law was struck down, North Carolina prohibited public assistance IDs and state employee ID cards, which are disproportionately held by Black voters. And until recently, Wisconsin permitted active duty military ID cards, but prohibited Veterans Affairs ID cards for voting.


Not to mention voter ID laws are used to suppress certain types of voters for political gain:
https://www.theatlantic.com/nationa...ivilege/262511/
quote:
In voter ID cases all over the country, courts are considering the proper level of "scrutiny" to apply to "burdens" on the right to cast a ballot. In 2008, the Supreme Court approved an Indiana voter ID law, even conceding that it had a partisan basis, because it was not "excessively burdensome" to most voters. (Justice Antonin Scalia, writing for himself and Chief Justice John Roberts and Justice Samuel Alito, concurred separately to suggest that the proper level of scrutiny was more like "whatever the legislature wants.")

As a result:
quote:
A 2014 GAO study found that strict photo ID laws reduce turnout by 2-3 percentage points,4 which can translate into tens of thousands of votes lost in a single state.5


Unless
A. Voter ID is something that is universally easy and free to receive

B. We get evidence of voter fraud on the scale of tens of thousands per state

Voter id laws have no justification for their existence.

Last edited by Rockydonovang on Nov 16th, 2017 at 09:35 PM

Old Post Nov 16th, 2017 09:32 PM
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