-> Texas doesn't give back the right to vote to people who serve jail-time
-> Woman isn't aware of this
-> Woman votes
-> Is sentenced to five years in prison
-> Denied appeal
Opinion 1: Anyone who supports the enforcement of this legislation should be impeached
Opinion 2: This is cruel and unusual punishment setting aside that this law is a form of oppression
Opinion 3: Voting laws need to be identical nationwide. States have no right to enact special restrictions on people's right to participate in our democracy. Such legislation is the primary injustice that needs to be eradicated in our country.
Gender: Unspecified Location: 30.3322 degrees N 81.6557 degrees S
First off, we're not a democracy.
Secondly, it's quite common that convicted felons can't vote. And Texas restores voting rights after the completion of the sentence, parole, and/or probation. After that time is served, it's automatically restored.
I agree, identical laws. Every state needs to require an ID to register to vote.
__________________ Chicken Boo, what's the matter with you? You don't act like the other chickens do. You wear a disguise to look like human guys, but you're not a man you're a Chicken Boo.
Gender: Male Location: The Proud Nation of Kekistan
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Shadilay my brothers and sisters. With any luck we will throw off the shackles of normie oppression. We have nothing to lose but our chains! Praise Kek!
THE MOTTO IS "IN KEK WE TRUST"
They already are. Stop acting like getting an ID is some massive hassle.
__________________ Chicken Boo, what's the matter with you? You don't act like the other chickens do. You wear a disguise to look like human guys, but you're not a man you're a Chicken Boo.
Opinion 2 is factually incorrect. That's not what "cruel and unusual punishment" means. For examples of what constitutes (pun intended) Cruel and Unusual punishment, as intended by the 8th Amendment, look at at few cases:
Hudson v McMillian (1992):
Compliant and docile man beaten, while in handcuffs, while in prison (beatings are a form of torture and explicitly prohibited under the 8th Amendment). This case would not have ruled this way had the inmate been fighting the prison staff while in cuffs.
Also, in the United States, we do not have to prove means rea for many crimes. Any crime that falls under 'Strict Liability' means that they will get the criminal penalties for violating that law. Almost all felonies fall under this Strict Liability. All you have to prove is that the person was of sound mind. Only when we get into areas of murder do we have to start grading what type of murder it was (proving pure accidents, for example, would be required to get out of a murder charge and that's why people who accidentally kill someone - and gross-negligence is not part of the reason why the death occurred - is why those people are not even indicted).
So, in this case, the USA is more concerned with "actus reus" than it is "mens rea."
Here is the position that you hold:
actus reus non facit reum nisi mens sit rea
Which roughly means "the act does not make one guilty without a guilty mind."
In Canada, in general, you must prove both actus reus and mens rea. Which is what I think you believe:
Also, here is the reason why I do not believe even a little bit that she did not know: there are dozens and dozens of times she was notified that she cannot vote. Forms she had to sign, statements made by people like judges and officers, briefings she would have been given by lawyers, an 'exit' briefing she would have been given exiting prison and the like. Ask any free-felon how many times they were notified that they cannot vote (or what the specific voting laws are for felons) and they will be able to tell you. It's not a secret. This is why the judge threw the book at her. She already committed fraud and she commits it again as soon as she gets out. She should have been in big-doo-doo for committing fraud very quickly after leaving prison for committing fraud.
IMO, there is no defense case, here. But I don't think she should go back to prison. I think she should be fined. Tax fraud? Fines. Voting fraud? Fines. No prison time for fraud or any crimes where no one is physically harmed.
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Last edited by dadudemon on Jun 23rd, 2018 at 07:12 PM
Gender: Unspecified Location: 30.3322 degrees N 81.6557 degrees S
Umm, no. There was vast differences between a republic and a democracy. The founders never believed in democracy. The founders believed in republicanism. The founders despised the idea of democracy. The idea that the people know best in every situation never crossed the founders' minds.
"Remember, democracy never lasts long. It soon wastes, exhausts, and murders itself. There never was a democracy yet that did not commit suicide. It is in vain to say that democracy is less vain, less proud, less selfish, less ambitious, or less avaricious than aristocracy or monarchy." -John Adams, 1814
The entire purpose of a republic isn't to protect the rights of the minority. That happens in a republic, yes. But the purpose of a republic is to have a system of checks and balances that prevent the people from simply usurping all power. If you believe that the people are always right then you wouldn't need a constitution, you wouldn't need a Senate or the House or the Presidency or a judiciary.
The entire purpose of a republic is to create a division of power. There's a division of power among the Executive, Legislative, and Judicial branches of government as well as a division of power among the people. This is why we have things like the electoral college. It was designed to stop the people from putting bad people into high office.
Chief Justice John Marshall said, "between a balanced Republican and democracy, the difference is like that between order and chaos."
A balanced Republic is designed to check out the excesses. James Madison wrote this in Federalist 10 saying, "Democracies have ever been spectacles of turbulence and contention; have ever been found incompatible with personal security or the rights of property; and have in general been as short in their lives as they have been violent in their deaths."
So, no. There's a few major differences between a democracy and a republic.
"The Daemon lied with every breath. It could not help itself but to deceive and dismay, to riddle and ruin. The more we conversed, the closer I drew to one singularly ineluctable fact: I would gain no wisdom here."
Right, so that everyone is afforded basic rights. If the people upsurp power, there's no mechanism to protect people who disagree with or are disagreed with by the people.
And again, none of these distinctions between a direct democracy and a republic are relevant to the thread.
Fair enough then. Guess my outrage was largely directed at the wrong state (5 years is still a ridiculous sentence given that rape offenders have been handed shorter sentences), so I shall redirect the outrage of opinion one towards these states:
#Getmadbros
Last edited by Rockydonovang on Jun 24th, 2018 at 06:20 AM
Wait really? I remember being taught in middle school that "cruel and usual" could be applied to the length of a term or how a court case proceeds. If not, it certainly should be.
Last edited by Rockydonovang on Jun 24th, 2018 at 06:32 AM
Kiddo, nothing there suggests it is a major hassle to get an ID.
Also some of the shit on there seems dumb as hell.
"States exclude forms of ID in a discriminatory manner. Texas allows concealed weapons permits for voting, but does not accept student ID cards."
Lol. Now...list what one needs to get a concealed weapon permit. Go on. Does it involve having an ID?
Do you need an ID to get a student ID card? Think carefully. Do you need to be a legal citizen to obtain a student ID card? Given I've heard about illegals going to college...I'm guessing no. Unless they lied to get the card.
__________________ Chicken Boo, what's the matter with you? You don't act like the other chickens do. You wear a disguise to look like human guys, but you're not a man you're a Chicken Boo.
Last edited by Surtur on Jun 24th, 2018 at 12:23 PM
Some colleges do require you be a citizen to attend. Not all do and it is not law. Do better.
__________________ Chicken Boo, what's the matter with you? You don't act like the other chickens do. You wear a disguise to look like human guys, but you're not a man you're a Chicken Boo.
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Jun 23rd, 2018 04:54 AM
