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The Matrix: Resurrections
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Darth Thor
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I liked Matrix Reloaded. I think it gets a worse rep than it deserves due to the third one.

Anyway they won't ignore the sequels. That would be stupid.

Old Post Sep 16th, 2021 11:35 AM
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-Pr-
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Patient_Leech
I only played some of Enter The Matrix back in the day and barely remember it. So I don't know to what you're referring.


See? You didn't even name the right game. stick out tongue

I'm talking about the Path of Neo. A game I enjoyed, but here's the clip i'm talking about :



In the space of 30 seconds they lay out the ending of Revolutions more clearly than the movie does. FFS.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Darth Thor
I liked Matrix Reloaded. I think it gets a worse rep than it deserves due to the third one.

Anyway they won't ignore the sequels. That would be stupid.


For years I was fully of the opinion that Reloaded had the best action sequences of any Hollywood movie in that era and after. And imo there is a lot to like about it.


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Old Post Sep 16th, 2021 11:41 AM
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Patient_Leech
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by -Pr-
See? You didn't even name the right game. stick out tongue

I'm talking about the Path of Neo...


I am familiar with Path of Neo, but I just never played any of it because it came out after-the-fact, right? And I'm not a gamer really.


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Old Post Sep 16th, 2021 12:51 PM
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Ridley_Prime
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Despite being the worst overall film, the final fight between Smith and Neo in the 3rd one was pretty much my favorite fight in the series. Maybe too drawn out but was fun with how DBZ kind of over the top it was. Some of the fighting shots with the machines beforehand were cool to look at too.


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Old Post Sep 16th, 2021 02:02 PM
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-Pr-
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Patient_Leech
I am familiar with Path of Neo, but I just never played any of it because it came out after-the-fact, right? And I'm not a gamer really.


It came out later yeah. Don't worry, a lot of people didn't play it. It doesn't even have proper controller support on PC.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Ridley_Prime
Despite being the worst overall film, the final fight between Smith and Neo in the 3rd one was pretty much my favorite fight in the series. Maybe too drawn out but was fun with how DBZ kind of over the top it was. Some of the fighting shots with the machines beforehand were cool to look at too.


thumb up The Revolutions fight is fantastic. And it did set the stage for what a lot of superhero movies do now, I think.


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Old Post Sep 16th, 2021 02:51 PM
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StiltmanFTW
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by -Pr-
It doesn't even have proper controller support on PC.


Like great many other pc games converted from playstation, xbox, etc.

Funny how it's sometimes better to pirate a game and launch it in an emulator rather than buy the pc version...


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Old Post Sep 16th, 2021 05:04 PM
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Patient_Leech
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by -Pr-
I'm talking about the Path of Neo. A game I enjoyed, but here's the clip i'm talking about :



In the space of 30 seconds they lay out the ending of Revolutions more clearly than the movie does. FFS.


First, thanks for posting that because I've not seen it and it's actually fun, shows their sense of humor.

But I'm not sure I understand your point. You think Revolutions would have been better if they popped up like 1-bit characters and spewed a rant explaining the entire "Neo journey"? Uuuhh... do I even need to explain why that's not how films are supposed to work?


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Old Post Sep 16th, 2021 09:25 PM
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jaden_2.0
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by -Pr-
See? You didn't even name the right game. stick out tongue

I'm talking about the Path of Neo. A game I enjoyed, but here's the clip i'm talking about :



In the space of 30 seconds they lay out the ending of Revolutions more clearly than the movie does. FFS.



For years I was fully of the opinion that Reloaded had the best action sequences of any Hollywood movie in that era and after. And imo there is a lot to like about it.


Path of Neo was awesome. Probably my 2nd favourite fight mechanics of any martial arts game after Sleeping Dogs


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Old Post Sep 17th, 2021 01:32 AM
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-Pr-
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Like great many other pc games converted from playstation, xbox, etc.

Funny how it's sometimes better to pirate a game and launch it in an emulator rather than buy the pc version...


Yup.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Patient_Leech
First, thanks for posting that because I've not seen it and it's actually fun, shows their sense of humor.

But I'm not sure I understand your point. You think Revolutions would have been better if they popped up like 1-bit characters and spewed a rant explaining the entire "Neo journey"? Uuuhh... do I even need to explain why that's not how films are supposed to work?


No. no expression

I'm saying that the most clear and straight-forward explanation is in a video game, whereas in the movie it isn't really clear at all. The movie lets you draw your interpretation, sure, but it doesn't, imo, do a great job of getting across the Wachowski's aim in their execution. And sure, you can say they wanted us to interpret it our own way, but it still needs to stand up on its own. And if it does, I think it barely does if at all.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by jaden_2.0
Path of Neo was awesome. Probably my 2nd favourite fight mechanics of any martial arts game after Sleeping Dogs


It was awesome. Outside of the controller issue the only problem I really had with the game was the lack of the movie soundtrack when it was most needed.


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Old Post Sep 17th, 2021 01:52 AM
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Patient_Leech
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by -Pr-

No. no expression

I'm saying that the most clear and straight-forward explanation is in a video game, whereas in the movie it isn't really clear at all. The movie lets you draw your interpretation, sure, but it doesn't, imo, do a great job of getting across the Wachowski's aim in their execution. And sure, you can say they wanted us to interpret it our own way, but it still needs to stand up on its own. And if it does, I think it barely does if at all.


Well, you said it yourself, of course it's supposed to open to interpretation. Films aren't supposed to sum up a single meaning/interpretation at the very end. The Matrix Trilogy is so full of philosophical, religious, literary, psychological, etc. references that of course it has to be open to interpretation. The final film wrapped up grand character arcs that make the series much more rich and interesting than the first film ever could do on its own. Stand on its own? It stands on its own as a complex modern work of art. It doesn't matter how many plebeians say, "The sequels sucked." That's what it is.


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Old Post Sep 17th, 2021 10:17 AM
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-Pr-
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Patient_Leech
Well, you said it yourself, of course it's supposed to open to interpretation. Films aren't supposed to sum up a single meaning/interpretation at the very end. The Matrix Trilogy is so full of philosophical, religious, literary, psychological, etc. references that of course it has to be open to interpretation. The final film wrapped up grand character arcs that make the series much more rich and interesting than the first film ever could do on its own. Stand on its own? It stands on its own as a complex modern work of art. It doesn't matter how many plebeians say, "The sequels sucked." That's what it is.


I don't agree with your summation of Revolutions, but that's me.


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Old Post Sep 17th, 2021 11:42 AM
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Patient_Leech
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He gets it (see below). He also covers some of the annoying things about the films...

And I can't remember if I mentioned it or not, but I think it was also troublesome that Tank and the Oracle had to be recast. That worked against the sequels a bit because we had to adjust to even more new characters.


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Old Post Sep 17th, 2021 10:30 PM
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Old Man Whirly!
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Matrix 1 like Highlander 1 needed no sequels

Old Post Sep 17th, 2021 10:47 PM
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-Pr-
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Patient_Leech
He gets it (see below). He also covers some of the annoying things about the films...

And I can't remember if I mentioned it or not, but I think it was also troublesome that Tank and the Oracle had to be recast. That worked against the sequels a bit because we had to adjust to even more new characters.



I wanted to give the benefit of the doubt, so I watched it...

Starting the movie off with a couple of bad takes about the original is not a good start.

It's not a bad video, to be fair. But it is one of many "this is what the Wachowskis were going for, and how the movies are good because of this long explanation about the fight between free will and control" videos.

The problem is not the ideas. Lucas's ideas for the Star Wars prequels and the force in general are amazing. They blew my ****ing mind. But the execution is a ****ing mess.

Just like Lucas, the Wachowskis had great ideas. Some of them come through. But some of them really, really don't, and all it leads to is a bunch of people on youtube projecting their own interpretation of it to fill in the blanks (and this video has that too). Not that it's inherently bad, but us filling in blanks is just that. On a personal level? Sure, it's fine. We all fill in the blanks to cover up the shit in the stuff we love. But that doesn't make the film automatically good.

The execution in Revolutions isn't great, imo. Regardless of how good their ideas are.

Put simply: You can have the best ingredients in the world, but you still have to bake the cake. And I think they ****ed up the cake.

Also, he didn't watch the Animatrix. WTF.


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Last edited by -Pr- on Sep 17th, 2021 at 11:23 PM

Old Post Sep 17th, 2021 11:20 PM
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Patient_Leech
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by -Pr-
I wanted to give the benefit of the doubt, so I watched it...

Starting the movie off with a couple of bad takes about the original is not a good start.

It's not a bad video, to be fair. But it is one of many "this is what the Wachowskis were going for, and how the movies are good because of this long explanation about the fight between free will and control" videos.

The problem is not the ideas. Lucas's ideas for the Star Wars prequels and the force in general are amazing. They blew my ****ing mind. But the execution is a ****ing mess.

Just like Lucas, the Wachowskis had great ideas. Some of them come through. But some of them really, really don't, and all it leads to is a bunch of people on youtube projecting their own interpretation of it to fill in the blanks (and this video has that too). Not that it's inherently bad, but us filling in blanks is just that. On a personal level? Sure, it's fine. We all fill in the blanks to cover up the shit in the stuff we love. But that doesn't make the film automatically good.

The execution in Revolutions isn't great, imo. Regardless of how good their ideas are.

Put simply: You can have the best ingredients in the world, but you still have to bake the cake. And I think they ****ed up the cake.


Yeah, I've seen a few videos like that one (it may not even be the best one), but he seemed pretty fair in covering some of what was good and what was not so good.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by -Pr-
Also, he didn't watch the Animatrix. WTF.


I understood that he just didn't see The Kid's story. Hm.. Anyway, I'm pretty meh on most of the Animatrix except 2nd Renaissance 1-2, Final Flight of the Osiris, and Matriculated.


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Old Post Sep 18th, 2021 01:14 PM
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jaden_2.0
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by -Pr-
I wanted to give the benefit of the doubt, so I watched it...

Starting the movie off with a couple of bad takes about the original is not a good start.

It's not a bad video, to be fair. But it is one of many "this is what the Wachowskis were going for, and how the movies are good because of this long explanation about the fight between free will and control" videos.

The problem is not the ideas. Lucas's ideas for the Star Wars prequels and the force in general are amazing. They blew my ****ing mind. But the execution is a ****ing mess.

Just like Lucas, the Wachowskis had great ideas. Some of them come through. But some of them really, really don't, and all it leads to is a bunch of people on youtube projecting their own interpretation of it to fill in the blanks (and this video has that too). Not that it's inherently bad, but us filling in blanks is just that. On a personal level? Sure, it's fine. We all fill in the blanks to cover up the shit in the stuff we love. But that doesn't make the film automatically good.

The execution in Revolutions isn't great, imo. Regardless of how good their ideas are.

Put simply: You can have the best ingredients in the world, but you still have to bake the cake. And I think they ****ed up the cake.

Also, he didn't watch the Animatrix. WTF.


Remember the conspiracy theory that the Wachowskis actually plagiarised/stole The Matrix from someone else.

I always thought the sequels gave credibility to those rumours because the original comes across as being written by someone who understood the philosophical themes they were trying to portray where as the sequels seem written by someone with only a shallow understanding of what they wanted to include.


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Old Post Sep 18th, 2021 05:49 PM
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Dusty
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by jaden_2.0
Remember the conspiracy theory that the Wachowskis actually plagiarised/stole The Matrix from someone else.

I always thought the sequels gave credibility to those rumours because the original comes across as being written by someone who understood the philosophical themes they were trying to portray where as the sequels seem written by someone with only a shallow understanding of what they wanted to include.


Well, that first movie brought all of those philosophical themes to their logical conclusion. And once that's done, what do you do? And that's where the rest of the trilogy went: into "I guess let's do this" territory.

Old Post Sep 19th, 2021 01:04 PM
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Darth Thor
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by -Pr-
For years I was fully of the opinion that Reloaded had the best action sequences of any Hollywood movie in that era and after. And imo there is a lot to like about it.



thumb up

Old Post Sep 19th, 2021 01:15 PM
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Patient_Leech
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Dusty
Well, that first movie brought all of those philosophical themes to their logical conclusion. And once that's done, what do you do? And that's where the rest of the trilogy went: into "I guess let's do this" territory.


Well, that's actually entirely wrong. They conceived the whole thing when asked to come up with the idea for a comic. The entire trilogy was birthed at once. They knew that the Architect's screens would show up in Reloaded, so they are shown in M1 here...

(please log in to view the image)

Hence all the word play at the beginning of M1, "It's like you need to unplug, man. You know, get some R & R." (Reloaded and Revolutions). Watching M1 again after you've digested the plot progressions from the sequels is a very different experience. When you know that "The One" was just another system of control, the first film plays very differently. The Oracle's manipulations are more clear. "What's really going to bake your noodle later on is, would you still have broken it if I hadn't said anything?"

Now I think it's safe to say that M4 is an afterthought. They didn't plan it out 20 years in advance and decide to finally do it now.


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Old Post Sep 19th, 2021 02:33 PM
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Patient_Leech
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Another pretty fair defense video. It covers some legit criticisms, too. Some good corrections in the comments also because I think the person who made the video was legitimately confused about a couple things...


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Old Post Sep 21st, 2021 05:37 PM
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