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Avatar Aang vs Endeavor
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Henry_Pym
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Avatar Aang vs Endeavor

Replace Ozai with Mr. Todoroki.

How does the young monk fare against the number 1 hero?

Old Post Jun 3rd, 2020 08:47 AM
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NotAllThatEvil
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Avatar state allowed?

Old Post Jun 3rd, 2020 12:22 PM
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Henry_Pym
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Yeah, I don’t think he could damage him without it.

Old Post Jun 4th, 2020 01:36 AM
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Jmanghan
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Avatar State Aang is many magnitudes more powerful then normal Aang, fyi.

If it's Avatar State Aang he wins low-diff.

If you recall correctly NORMAL Aang was able to fight off people using LIGHTNING STRIKES as attacks, which is way faster then anything used in MHA. He was even able to catch it and redirect it in his fight with Ozai.

Normal Aang wins high-diff, his waterbending will be a serious threat. He could even potentially drown him by locking him within stone and flooding it with water. Aang has a lot of ways to kill Enji and Enji can just... idk, burn him or beat him up, and since we've established Aang is faster and multiple ways to neutralize him, he wins.


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Old Post Jun 4th, 2020 11:24 PM
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Henry_Pym
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Jmanghan
Avatar State Aang is many magnitudes more powerful then normal Aang, fyi.

If it's Avatar State Aang he wins low-diff.

If you recall correctly NORMAL Aang was able to fight off people using LIGHTNING STRIKES as attacks, which is way faster then anything used in MHA. He was even able to catch it and redirect it in his fight with Ozai.

Normal Aang wins high-diff, his waterbending will be a serious threat. He could even potentially drown him by locking him within stone and flooding it with water. Aang has a lot of ways to kill Enji and Enji can just... idk, burn him or beat him up, and since we've established Aang is faster and multiple ways to neutralize him, he wins.
One major issue Aang doesn’t kill and Endevor is slower but he is multiple orders of magnitude stronger and more durable. Endevor can destroy Skyscrapers, it is laughable to say a rock prison would do anything but melt.

He literally fell from orbit and got up from it under his own power.

Old Post Jun 4th, 2020 11:54 PM
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Jmanghan
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First off, let's get this out of the way, Avatar State Aang is absolutely low-diffing him if not stomping him.

It wouldn't melt if Aang was filling it with water for 10+ minutes, and if Aang thought he was outclassed in a city, he'd probably take the battle to a forest or some crap, also, it took Ozai awhile throwing everything he had at it before he was able to melt it.

Plus Aang can... y'know, become a living body of water and surround himself with it, use it defensively and offensively.

Also because of that speed and the fact that he can bend fire, there's a very strong chance he could literally redirect an attack back at Enji.

Enji turned a skyscraper into swiss cheese and that's great, but it was one of his more powerful attacks; Aang casually created rock pellets while in the avatar state that casually destroyed the landscape around him while trying to hit Ozai, the landscape wasn't even his target, it was just a side-effect of one of his smaller attacks.

Also, I'm sorry but being faster is more important then being stronger or more powerful, especially when the ultra-fast attacks he WAS dodging had plenty of power behind them, considering they were literally lightning bolts given form that Aang was dodging at point blank range and straight up almost redirecting his attacks back at him.

This isn't even counting the fact that Aang had superior firebending after going Avatar state and had chances to kill Ozai while as normal Aang.

The fact of the matter is, in Avatar State, Aang is better in every way. As normal Aang, he still has the power to redirect elemental attacks, and considering Aang has reacted to attacks just as fast and near-equal in power, he most likely takes it as normal Aang too.

Then, once again, the added bonus of having ways to kill him off IF HE MUST. This is a battle of life or death, no?

The only reason Aang got away without killing was because he had beat Ozai to shit and had the power to take away his bending outright, Aang doesn't have that ability in the MHA universe because... well... the people of MHA aren't benders of any kind, so the Aang has two options: Kill, or be killed.

I'm not confident in Enji's ability to defeat Aang before he can neutralize him, and that's all it'd take, a strong stone encasement concentrated on by Aang and fill it up to his neck in water. If we're going in-character, then Aang would rather die then kill someone, so Enji has a shot, but if we're being realistic Aang has too many defenses on top of his speed, and too many ways to neutralize Enji as a threat.

TL;DR Aang wins.


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Old Post Jun 5th, 2020 05:37 AM
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Henry_Pym
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Jmanghan
First off, let's get this out of the way, Avatar State Aang is absolutely low-diffing him if not stomping him.

It wouldn't melt if Aang was filling it with water for 10+ minutes, and if Aang thought he was outclassed in a city, he'd probably take the battle to a forest or some crap, also, it took Ozai awhile throwing everything he had at it before he was able to melt it.

Plus Aang can... y'know, become a living body of water and surround himself with it, use it defensively and offensively.

Also because of that speed and the fact that he can bend fire, there's a very strong chance he could literally redirect an attack back at Enji.

Enji turned a skyscraper into swiss cheese and that's great, but it was one of his more powerful attacks; Aang casually created rock pellets while in the avatar state that casually destroyed the landscape around him while trying to hit Ozai, the landscape wasn't even his target, it was just a side-effect of one of his smaller attacks.

Also, I'm sorry but being faster is more important then being stronger or more powerful, especially when the ultra-fast attacks he WAS dodging had plenty of power behind them, considering they were literally lightning bolts given form that Aang was dodging at point blank range and straight up almost redirecting his attacks back at him.

This isn't even counting the fact that Aang had superior firebending after going Avatar state and had chances to kill Ozai while as normal Aang.

The fact of the matter is, in Avatar State, Aang is better in every way. As normal Aang, he still has the power to redirect elemental attacks, and considering Aang has reacted to attacks just as fast and near-equal in power, he most likely takes it as normal Aang too.

Then, once again, the added bonus of having ways to kill him off IF HE MUST. This is a battle of life or death, no?

The only reason Aang got away without killing was because he had beat Ozai to shit and had the power to take away his bending outright, Aang doesn't have that ability in the MHA universe because... well... the people of MHA aren't benders of any kind, so the Aang has two options: Kill, or be killed.

I'm not confident in Enji's ability to defeat Aang before he can neutralize him, and that's all it'd take, a strong stone encasement concentrated on by Aang and fill it up to his neck in water. If we're going in-character, then Aang would rather die then kill someone, so Enji has a shot, but if we're being realistic Aang has too many defenses on top of his speed, and too many ways to neutralize Enji as a threat.

TL;DR Aang wins.
Endeavor vaporized a massive cloud and the heat was so intense that people who couldn’t see him could feel the heat.

Also the Fish form wasn’t Aang, he was possessed by the Ocean Spirit. It’s why he turned into a fish.

While Aang isn’t gonna go for the kill probably ever, I don’t see even on his worst day Endeavor starting at that level. It would be Aang’s speed, flexibility, and honesty unique mobility vs Endeavor’s power, durability and pig headedness.

He honestly feels like if Zuko was a D&D rogue with Monk levels, Endeavor is all Barbarian.

On the point of counter bending fire, if Azula the super fire bender can’t do it I’ll just assume it isn’t a thing.

Old Post Jun 5th, 2020 11:33 PM
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Jmanghan
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Henry_Pym
Endeavor vaporized a massive cloud and the heat was so intense that people who couldn’t see him could feel the heat.

Also the Fish form wasn’t Aang, he was possessed by the Ocean Spirit. It’s why he turned into a fish.

While Aang isn’t gonna go for the kill probably ever, I don’t see even on his worst day Endeavor starting at that level. It would be Aang’s speed, flexibility, and honesty unique mobility vs Endeavor’s power, durability and pig headedness.

He honestly feels like if Zuko was a D&D rogue with Monk levels, Endeavor is all Barbarian.

On the point of counter bending fire, if Azula the super fire bender can’t do it I’ll just assume it isn’t a thing.


1. You're suggesting that Endeavor's fire burns so much hotter then a massively boosted Ozai's fire would allow him to burn the rock away in seconds while it took Ozai minutes? Also the fact that Ozai was trying his damndest to get through that rock to kill Aang meant he was throwing everything he had at him to get through it. I don't see any way you could prove, hell that either one of us could prove that one fire was hotter then the other, even if it was, it's likely a negligible boost at best.

2. I understand that, I was talking about the fact that he could surround himself with water at any point, walk on it, create a shield with it, etc.

3. The point is that Aang has too many ways to NEUTRALIZE HIM COMPLETELY as a threat, so even if Endeavor is 10000x more powerful, durable, he literally cannot defeat Aang if Aang decides to hit him with massive amounts of water over and over and over, while trapping him in a rock prison, even if he can melt the rock, he has to focus on pushing back the water and the rock at the same time while having to worry about occasional blasts of air that'll keep pushing him down.

"But why would they push him down?" Because while he's focusing on defending himself from two other very threatening elements, he's getting blasted by extremely powerful blasts of air from the Avatar, the most powerful bender in the world at his time.

4. Azula by all merits should be better, she has blue lightning, Yadda Yadda Yadda, but her fire is more focused, her father's is massive torrents, and shes gone out of her way to attest to her father's power and how she wishes she was as powerful as him. Besides that, if that were the case, then Ozai with Sozin's comet is still WAY above her paygrade. Ozai w/ Sozin's comet is still far above both Iroh and Azula by many magnitudes.

That said, I'll humor you and assume Ozai is normal... Why was Ozai chosen for Sozin's comet then, if Azula was more powerful, she should've been the one to inherit it.

So again, Aang could literally part 1 Gaara him, sand coffin, water, gg Enji. Not really sand but you get my point. Every time Enji would go for some massive fire blast, Aang would just throw more water down. The best it could be is a stalemate. Enji won't eliminate Aang fast enough before Aang finds a way to trap and neutralize him.


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Old Post Jun 6th, 2020 03:22 AM
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Jmanghan
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blue fire*


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Old Post Jun 6th, 2020 03:23 AM
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NotAllThatEvil
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You don't "inherit" sozin's comet. It's a naturally occurring phenomenon

Old Post Jun 6th, 2020 03:58 AM
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Henry_Pym
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Jmanghan
1. You're suggesting that Endeavor's fire burns so much hotter then a massively boosted Ozai's fire would allow him to burn the rock away in seconds while it took Ozai minutes? Also the fact that Ozai was trying his damndest to get through that rock to kill Aang meant he was throwing everything he had at him to get through it. I don't see any way you could prove, hell that either one of us could prove that one fire was hotter then the other, even if it was, it's likely a negligible boost at best.

2. I understand that, I was talking about the fact that he could surround himself with water at any point, walk on it, create a shield with it, etc.

3. The point is that Aang has too many ways to NEUTRALIZE HIM COMPLETELY as a threat, so even if Endeavor is 10000x more powerful, durable, he literally cannot defeat Aang if Aang decides to hit him with massive amounts of water over and over and over, while trapping him in a rock prison, even if he can melt the rock, he has to focus on pushing back the water and the rock at the same time while having to worry about occasional blasts of air that'll keep pushing him down.

"But why would they push him down?" Because while he's focusing on defending himself from two other very threatening elements, he's getting blasted by extremely powerful blasts of air from the Avatar, the most powerful bender in the world at his time.

4. Azula by all merits should be better, she has blue lightning, Yadda Yadda Yadda, but her fire is more focused, her father's is massive torrents, and shes gone out of her way to attest to her father's power and how she wishes she was as powerful as him. Besides that, if that were the case, then Ozai with Sozin's comet is still WAY above her paygrade. Ozai w/ Sozin's comet is still far above both Iroh and Azula by many magnitudes.

That said, I'll humor you and assume Ozai is normal... Why was Ozai chosen for Sozin's comet then, if Azula was more powerful, she should've been the one to inherit it.

So again, Aang could literally part 1 Gaara him, sand coffin, water, gg Enji. Not really sand but you get my point. Every time Enji would go for some massive fire blast, Aang would just throw more water down. The best it could be is a stalemate. Enji won't eliminate Aang fast enough before Aang finds a way to trap and neutralize him.
1.) Yes it is much much hotter than anything in Avatar. A cloud is effectively a sky Lake and Endeavor vaporized it instantly just by flying through it and reduced to cinders the Nomu who was way more durable than modern steel which in turn is more durable than anything Aang has access to it.

2.) cool just wanted to make sure.

3.) we saw the mass amount of water Aang could control in the Avatar state and honestly it’s probably pretty comparable to the cloud that Endeavor vaporized.

4.) Azula (and Zuko) was also Amped by the comet, rewatch her Agni Kai with Zuko. They were both shooting blasts of Fire large enough to be seen from a city wide view which is way more power than normal.

Fully just a tangent

I honestly don’t think Azula would lose to Ozai at all in a fight, Ozai admits Zuko is a stronger martial artist without bending than him and in turn the non insane Azula from the finale shit stomps Zuko in that regard to the point Zuko and Aang together we’re having trouble as a team against her and in her debut she doesn’t even use fire bending at first and keeps up with the Avatar.

Plus she can do the lightning thing, arguably his own advantage is dragon’s breath but she showed she could also use it to a lesser extent when she lost to Katara and was captured.

Old Post Jun 6th, 2020 05:55 AM
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Jmanghan
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Dude, Clouds melt naturally in our own world over time.

I'll respond to everything else at a later date.


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Old Post Jun 7th, 2020 11:51 AM
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Henry_Pym
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Jmanghan
Dude, Clouds melt naturally in our own world over time.

I'll respond to everything else at a later date.
this was in an instant and just by him approaching it.

Old Post Jun 7th, 2020 11:25 PM
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Jmanghan
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Henry_Pym
this was in an instant and just by him approaching it.

Are you implying it's much hotter because he did it in an instant? There's no reason Ozai should not be able to replicate something similar, none at all.

Hasn't done it does not = not able to do it.

In fact melting rocks the way Ozai did was more impressive. Clouds can be melted by hot air, pebbles cannot. You can melt part of a cloud pretty quickly with a ****ing flamethrower.

A flamethrower can't melt rock very quickly compared to something like a blowtorch. Some forms of rock it is almost incapable of melting outright.

Melting a rock shield held together by a master Earthbender, the ****ing avatar, in mere minutes is a phenomenal feat, and if anything, proves his fire burns a lot hotter then Endeavor's.

Aang can redirect lightning which is way WAY hotter then Endeavor's fire.

His building feat is impressive but not overwhelming so. Concrete melts at a staggeringly low 212°F at the lowest: https://www.concreteconstruction.ne...te-under-fire_o

Glass melts at different temperatures - 500°C to 1700°C. Glass panes specifically are melted at 1200°C to 1500°C

THAT SAID, while they are comparable, I'll concede that Endeavor's fire is hotter since he can increase the temperature significantly.

He is his own weakness though. He can't increase the fire forever and he can't fight forever, he appears to have a heat cap that'll kill him if he gets too hot similar to Shishio from Rurouni Kenshin.

Also, Aang can match him in speed and destructive capability (dodged lightning point-blank, caught it and re-directed it, destroyed a landscape in seconds with a bunch of rocks as an aftereffect), Enji's ****ed. That's if... again, Aang decides not to actively trap and encase him with an earth prison then fill it with water for 10 minutes.

Endeavor is not melting the rocks in an instant, he might melt the water though.


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Old Post Jun 15th, 2020 02:01 AM
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Henry_Pym
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Endevor routinely runs up buildings by melting them into footholds in full sprint.

And again Endevor burned the Nomu who is way more durable than anything in the buildings.

And obviously lightning doesn’t destroy clouds. Endeavor turned a cloudy day to blue sky

Old Post Jun 15th, 2020 02:50 PM
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NotAllThatEvil
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Aang back in season one used the avatar state to cause a volcanic eruption that destroyed an island. That seems marginally more impressive than popping some clouds

Old Post Jun 15th, 2020 04:56 PM
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Jmanghan
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by NotAllThatEvil
Aang back in season one used the avatar state to cause a volcanic eruption that destroyed an island. That seems marginally more impressive than popping some clouds
IIRC at some point he evaporated an ocean too.


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Old Post Jun 15th, 2020 09:33 PM
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Melting Clouds isn't impressive.

He needed help to even really touch Nomu. What makes you think he'll do any better with Aang?


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Old Post Jun 15th, 2020 09:35 PM
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Henry_Pym
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Jmanghan
Melting Clouds isn't impressive.

He needed help to even really touch Nomu. What makes you think he'll do any better with Aang?
that is blatantly false, he needed help to get far enough away to not destroy the city. And it was shown more to be a PIS moment as the feathers burned up but he could still fly like a rocket so he never actually needed them. Though you could argue that liftoff probably would have destroyed any building he was on.

Also for the record Aang didn’t cause the volcanic eruptions, Rouku did and Aang blatantly said he couldn’t control them to the point the friendly monk perishes from Rouku’s act. Hell a Volcanic Eruption also killed Rouku, proving even he couldn’t control it.

Not sure what Ocean feat you’re talking about is, but Kioshi did break off a chunk of land to make her own island, but it is way outside of what any other Avatar ever showed including ones who are supposed to be more powerful than her to the point nothing else even comparable has happened so I kinda take that feat as narrative nonsense. I mean even high balling the other Avatars is the difference between lifting a large house and shifting a small tectonic plate. It’s without researching it like thousands of orders of magnitude higher than anything else shown.

Old Post Jun 17th, 2020 04:34 AM
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NotAllThatEvil
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Aang is roku. That's how the avatar state works

Old Post Jun 17th, 2020 04:47 AM
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