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Animatrix Discussion
Started by: Skittles19

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nickjs21
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well, i'm sure that when a nuke got dropped in a particular area, any machine in that area was destroyed regardless of emp emissions (we're talking strictly the force of the blast here). maybe what they meant when they said that the machines were not harmed by the radiation is that no outlying machines outside of the blast area suffered anything like cancer or bubbling internal organs from the heat. i'm sure the nukes were effective to a degree, just not as much of a kick as if they were used against humans.

but i've got no answer for the emp thing.


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"i don't know half of you half as well as i should like, and i like less than half of you half as well as you deserve." -- Bilbo Baggins

"what we obtain too easily, we esteem too lightly." -- Thomas Paine

Old Post Jun 25th, 2003 10:56 PM
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nickjs21
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Location: Cleveland

ok. i can't post links apparently, but i did find an article about the EMP waves released by a nuke. i skimmed, i'll admit.

but i did find this passage interesting:

"The pulse can easily span continent-sized areas, and this radiation can affect systems on land, sea, and air. The first recorded EMP incident accompanied a high-altitude nuclear test over the South Pacific and resulted in power system failures as far away as Hawaii. A large device detonated at 400500 km over Kansas would affect all of CONUS. The signal from such an event extends to the visual horizon as seen from the burst point."

so, i guess that means the renaissance has a plot hole.


__________________
"i don't know half of you half as well as i should like, and i like less than half of you half as well as you deserve." -- Bilbo Baggins

"what we obtain too easily, we esteem too lightly." -- Thomas Paine

Old Post Jun 25th, 2003 11:08 PM
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zoomonkey
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thanks nick,
those were my points exactly. now why would they overlook such a glaring point as this? i guess if they didn't their whole story would crumble. i am a fan don't get me wrong, and i can overlook some mistakes but this is huge. zero one should have been a wastland from the begining. nuke it a couple times and anything that does survive physically will be incapacitated. humans march in, dismantle the remaining machines, story over. but so is the world of fiction.
still pisses me off though.

Old Post Jun 26th, 2003 01:18 AM
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Dexx
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men aren't stupid either. they could calculate a fire rate, to do A LOT of damage, with several nuclears. ACtually..one would be enough to take zero-one out....that's pretty silly.

World record is my favorite animatrix...what don't you get of it?
It's about an exceptional man...like it says. he manages to wake up by himself, sort of like popper. Only he ends up like a veggie

Old Post Jun 26th, 2003 07:55 PM
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Sifer

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Just looked at some info on Nuclear Blasts and this is what I found on quite a few sites:

Electro-magnetic pulse (EMP) is another effect of an aboveground or air nuclear detonation

They also mention this:

Ground burst detonations may generate EMP up to 2 miles from the point of detonation.

This was also on US Government fact sheets.


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Old Post Jun 27th, 2003 03:31 AM
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nickjs21
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the article i read was referring to nukes strictly detonated far above ground level. so i guess we can assume ground explosions don't spread the EMP much farther beyond the actual blast radius (2 miles isn't wide). that could cover up the plot hole little.


__________________
"i don't know half of you half as well as i should like, and i like less than half of you half as well as you deserve." -- Bilbo Baggins

"what we obtain too easily, we esteem too lightly." -- Thomas Paine

Old Post Jun 27th, 2003 03:44 AM
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Dexx
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why? the good humans thought of not hurting the machines TOO hard adn decided to detonate them far above ground level roll eyes (sarcastic). This doesn't cover anything.
besides...we saw nuclear blasts in there, at ground level....so...the story SIMPLY has holes

Old Post Jun 27th, 2003 04:01 AM
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Sifer

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Dexx you have totally misread m8. THe EMP is GREATER when in the air, not on the ground...read the post properly before replying.


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Last edited by Sifer on Jun 27th, 2003 at 03:05 PM

Old Post Jun 27th, 2003 03:02 PM
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Sifer

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Also, did you notice the word MAY in the ground detonation sentence?


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Old Post Jun 27th, 2003 03:03 PM
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Dexx
wingless

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well..then take it the other way around. Humans are not dumb. i'm sure they would've figured it out todetonate them somehow to take more damage.

Old Post Jun 27th, 2003 07:51 PM
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Ushgarak
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I didn't see 2nd Renaissance as being in any way realistic. Cliched and dreadful, yes, but not realistic. Asimov's Robot series- THAT seemed realistic.

It was just such a poor, shallow imitation of a story. Really poor.


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Old Post Jun 27th, 2003 08:47 PM
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Skittles19
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man, ushgarek I'm getting a vibe that you hated the 2nd renaissance or something.....
just a wild and crazy guess tho


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Old Post Jun 27th, 2003 10:02 PM
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Ushgarak
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Glad you picked it up...


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"We've got maybe seconds before Darth Rosenberg grinds everybody into Jawa burgers and not one of you buds has the midi-chlorians to stop her!"

"You've never had any TINY bit of sex, have you?"

BtVS

Old Post Jun 28th, 2003 12:37 AM
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Sifer

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What do you expect, they had to fit in all that info into 2, 9 minute animations. Not an easy task at all.


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Old Post Jun 28th, 2003 02:46 AM
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zoomonkey
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the point is that the information they tried to provide was grossly inaccurate. if they wanted to put more info in it they could have easily made it longer.

also, how big the emp is is almost irrellivant. the humans have so many nukes at their disposal that they could have carpet bombed the machines with H-bombs if they wanted to.

as ushgarak said, its just a bad story of the cliche apocolyptic furture that we see every where else. the wickowski's created something unique with the matrix but really dropped the ball here.

another thing i missed is the point at which the humans find time to dig 4KM under the surface and create zion. seemed like they hand their hands bussy grabbing their ankles for the machines. i doubt the machines would go to all the trouble just to keep the anomaly of the one in check. why not create a colony on the moon or mars. would be much easier to defend from the machines. that's a little off topic though.

Last edited by zoomonkey on Jun 28th, 2003 at 09:20 AM

Old Post Jun 28th, 2003 09:11 AM
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Sifer

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Thats because the Humans NEVER BUILT ZION. Thats the whole point of the 2nd film - it shows us that the machines do it for them smile It's all just another system of control.


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Old Post Jun 28th, 2003 03:31 PM
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zoomonkey
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they never specifically say that the machines created it for them. what i got from it was that the machines mearly allow it to exist as a system of control of the one.

Old Post Jun 28th, 2003 06:52 PM
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nickjs21
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either way, zion isn't created during the period that second renaissance takes place. morpheus says that the first one (of whom he believes neo is the second coming) came after the matrix, and "freed the first of us."

you've got a point with the carpet-bombing thing, though. oh well. i thought it was entertaining at least, if you can ignore science for a while.


__________________
"i don't know half of you half as well as i should like, and i like less than half of you half as well as you deserve." -- Bilbo Baggins

"what we obtain too easily, we esteem too lightly." -- Thomas Paine

Old Post Jun 28th, 2003 07:25 PM
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Ushgarak
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What Morpheus says is completely irrelevant because that was the fifth One and Sixth Zion; we are interested in the ORIGINAL zion here.


__________________



"We've got maybe seconds before Darth Rosenberg grinds everybody into Jawa burgers and not one of you buds has the midi-chlorians to stop her!"

"You've never had any TINY bit of sex, have you?"

BtVS

Old Post Jun 28th, 2003 08:07 PM
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zoomonkey
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so who created zion origonally is still up for dibate. man, machine who? also, as we saw in matriculated there appear to be some human bases on the surface, so apparently the humans didn't completely abandon the surface.

Old Post Jun 28th, 2003 10:35 PM
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