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Yup, it was inevitable that i'd make this right? lol


Wut do you ppl think? I think this is pretty even now since cable is without the techno-organic virus.

All three = full control + full power + all experiences

well stryfe was never nearly as strong as cable is now, cable was even to him with the virus, he would go down first,

Great thread. You already know who I'm picking. He's beaten both of them without the full extent of his powers. Now if he's done that -- imagine what he could do with those abilities at hand? The Man Called CABLE.

Btw. He still has the virus since it's a part of his DNA. He can just supress it better and use the full extent of his powers. ;]

cable takes this one imo, stryfe is really no big deal against the other two

oops, clicked x-man by accident

Well, stryfe is very powerfull...i thought some would support him since hes extremely evil - which has its own benefits in battle. as for Nate and Cable, i kno for a fact that cable isn't as powerfull as nate...back in tha day even cable mentioned that if he didn't have to hold back his techno-organic virus, he couldn't equate to nate's full power.

However, i said "experience" because all three have a very different set of 'em. So any of tha three could have an edge.

I like your idea a bother /colne battle. I call them brothers, just beacause. I go with cable though

Yeah, i called them brothers before and i think someone said to me they weren't....they are technically brothers, since cable and stryfe are clones and nate grey is son of jean grey who is madelyne prior's clone.

However, Cable and Stryfe were actual births whereas Nate Grey was created after a perfect offspring of full power was calculated. = So when it comes to raw power, without considering anything else...X-Man wins. However with experience...stryfe's got a huge edge.

i think cable has the most experiance here, hes faught in like 3 differant certuries, against apocolypse magneto and basicaly every other xmen bad guy, he has the edge there

Harmonic, You X-Man fan boy. Rofl. How many times am I going to have to explain to you that in terms of SHEER power ( potential ) that Cable and X-Man are equals. Stryfe, Cable and X-Man are made from the SAME template. That means they each posses the same range and potential for power. There is not a SINGLE difference in their genetic make ups. Save for the fact that CABLE has the techno organic virus. They all have the EXACT same raw power as one another. NONE of them are different when it comes to possessing RAW POWER.

Also. Doesn't it mean a lot that Cable despite the fact that when he began was the WEAKER of the three due to his virus? And yet in each encounter that he's had with Stryfe and X-Man -- he's kicked their asses without using a shred of his own muted powers. With his powers Cable would just out right eradicate Stryfe and X-Man. They'd have to double team him if they wanted to win. Besides -- Cable gets more bonus points because he's the " CHOSEN " One.

In terms of double teaming : I think stryfe would somehow pursuade Nate Grey or Cable to turn on tha lone man - then backstab him. He is not only tha most evil out of tha three, i've read that he even shocked apocalypse.

But then again, they are all telepaths...perhaps stryfe would block it out or something.

That's merely an embellishment. Onlines sites don't always give the entire story. If you read the actual comic it never makes any mention that X-Man has greater potential, besides the fact that he's uninhibited by the techno-organic virus, in comparison to Cable.
On the 6th page of X-Man #14 and I quote;

" Now he's learned of a boy named Nate Grey who shares his bio-signature and psionic ability -- but whose power is not checked by the techno-organic virus. A boy lost and alone..with a God-like capacity for destruction. "rifle

Also, If you READ Cable #31 in which they battle...it ends this discussion. On the 3rd page AND I QUOTE!

"His name is Nate Grey. Torn from a timeline that has since been erased -- he is GENETICALLY IDENTICAL to Cable in EVERYWAY...including MUTANT POWER. But there is one striking and disturbing difference. Since infancy, Cable has struggled with a techno-organic virus which " diverts " his power, as he must use it to hold his ravaged body together. Nate Grey knows no such limits and, like a cancer, his OWN power is slowly ending what precious life he has left. "
sniper

That right there ends the entire debate about X-Man being more powerful than Cable. It's just not true however much you want to believe it. They're the SAME. And with the recent issues of Cable and Deadpool -- it just shows that fact even more-so. Every comic with X-Man always states that he's got LITTLE control over his immense power. EVERY COMIC. Why do I know this? Because I have all 75 issues. Anyway, Cable has show a GREATER control of his abilities than either X-Man or Stryfe. He's controlled people and stopped wars and cured folks half-way across the globe with a mere blink of his eye. I'd say that a greater step above either Stryfe or X-Man. Besides -- Cable is the ORIGINAL. By default he's going to be the greater of the three.

cable and stryfe have the same genotype...Nate Grey is his own

Incorrect. Cable, Stryfe and X-Man are all genetically the same creature. Over and over it's stated that X-Man and Stryfe share the EXACT same psi-signature and "genotype " as Cable. As well as the same unimaginable power. This is all confirmed in the Blood Brothers story arc; X-Man #46, Cable #63 and X-Man #47. When you read a few more X-Man or Cable comics ( Not read an inaccurate website ) please don't hesitate to return with a viable comment.gunsmilie

I trust your qoutes are fully accurate, so you've ended that debate.

However, leme say this : X-Man has always been known to be superior when it comes to power. tha three are SUPPOSED to differ from one other when it comes to their purpose for being created.

Cable - Original
Stryfe - Complete clone of cable. Extremely evil.
X-Man - Tha summers' son with tha most power.

When X-Man's series was still being sold, he was defined as tha most powerfull being. cable - regardless of potential...simply was NOT even near that mutant power. also, x-man had gained more and more control over his powers as his series reached higher numbers whereas cable suddenly exhibits full control over his powers.

As much as i like cable, that's ludicrous. that level of control cable has now, was earned by Nate over a very long period. Not to mention he was "dispersed" off in to every living thing on earth years back...whereas cables storyline has continued. so who knows wut benefits could have been added to X-Man.

In an all fair battle, imagine if Nate didn't "die", and he fought cable. who would logically have more control? one who gradually learned to use his powers or one who BAM lost tha techno-organic virus and BAM can display enormous control?

Its like doing basic addition, man. also, same goes to tha two if tha subject wasn't "Who has more power" but rather "Whos better at wielding a weapon" - in that debate cable would win hands down as he's gradually been trained so in his childhood upbringing.

In conclusion : Cable may be equal to Nate's potential, but logically he cannot wield tha same amount of control due to his being new to tha power - Whereas X-Man has had full access since issue #1.

acualy, u are incorrect. cabel and stryfe are the same because stryfe is a clone of cable. nate is from a differant timeline, where he is made from the genetic material of scott and jean. but cables mother is Madelyne Pryor-Summers therefore, differant genetic make up

heres proof
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Stargate/5981/cablebio.html

http://www.marveldirectory.com/individuals/c/cable.htm

Hope that was viable enough for ya man. smiliehttp://www.geocities.com/Pentagon/Quarters/3759/links2.jpg/smilie

u say nate has mutch more control? because cabel never used his full extent because of the virus?

the virus didnt hold back any off cables power, it didnt prevent him from using his amazing power, he just needed 99% of his power to stop it from killing him 24/7. cable has mutch more control, he was constantly channeling all of that power into stoping his virus, so when it was finaly gone, he had gotten very very very good at controlling and channeling his power

"the virus didnt hold back any off cables power, it didnt prevent him from using his amazing power, he just needed 99% of his power to stop it from killing him 24/7"

WUT A CONTRADICTION. USING HIS POWERS TO STOP THA VIRUS DID PREVENT HIM FROM USING HIS POWERS IN TERMS OF RAW EXTERNAL POWER. WUT GOOD IS SO MUCH POWER IF ALL YOU ARE DOING WITH IT IS PREVENT IT FROM KILLING YOU? HOW CAN YOU WIN A FIGHT WITH IT?

STOPPING A VIRUS FROM KILLING YOU IS NOT EVEN CLOSE TO BEING THA SAME AS READING/CONTROLLING SOMEONES MIND OR TELEKINETICALLY MANIPULATING OBJECTS.

Just cuz he used his powers to stop tha virus, doesn't mean he should know how to use his psyonic powers with greater control than Nate Grey....who slowly got better and better at controlling his immense power.

If someone is extremely intelligence , would he/she know ever language on earth? you have to LEARN that language and GRADUALLY become fluent in it. that is tha kind of reasoning you are using.

Fact - You are a moron. are you retarded? if not you're under 13...i know it. your idiocy annoyes me...truly does. you didn't even know nate died and then you said you weren't "up-to-date" with your X-Man comics. LOL he died years back buddy.

If my response offends you, good. Your stupid response sure offended me.

edit

if you work out all the time in your room, or once a week u show every one u can lift 200lbs you will eventualy be stronger if u work out in your room right?

cabel was using his power way more than nate so it got more "exersise" so it was more powerfull when his virus was gone

999

Stryfe is a clone of Cable, so they have the same genotype...X-man is a creature created by Jean Grey and Cyclop's DNA...arranged for optimum power, He has at least 50% the same genotype but not identical. I am confident in my knowledge of both of them and Biology, I think you are confused about the definition of genotype.

LOL please tell me you're kidding and i'll have a little more respect for you.

Look, edit. when you work out, you are actually engaging in a physical activity which increases your strength. doesn't matter if you do it in a room. HORRIBLE ANALOGY. YOU'RE PATHETIC. www.dictionary.com look tha words up]

Stopping a virus from killing you has nothing to do with telepathy or telekinetics .

Just Stop. Log Out, and Go To Bed.

wow dude, calm down, you totaly missed what i said there, it was way over your head. i used the "in your room" example because no one can see that cable is using his power to fight the virus.

and if u are right, give me one logical explanation why cable was able to do all of those things when his virus was gone is he couldnt control them.

HarmonicFlo88 & crazyspinz: keep the discussion without calling names

According to the MARVEL Universe all three of these characters are composed of identical genetic material. This fact was established in Cable issues # 29, page 14 in which Charles Xavier states and I quote;

" He calls himself Nate Grey -- although what relationship he has to our own Jean Grey and her family remains uncertain. Moira's tests on him reveal that he is not a clone -- and yet paradoxically, has EXACTLY the same DNA makeup as Cable. " ( note: No mention of a 50% difference in genotype. )

Wynndar, please do enlighten us all. According to the fictitious Marvel Universe in which the impossible occurs -- Cable and X-Man are composed of identical genetic makeup. But wait! That can't be right! You're confident in your knowledge so that would logically lead to the assumption that X-Man creator(s) Steve Skroce and Jeph Loeb are INCORRECT. - GASP- It's a conspiracy! They've laid out this decade old plan to discredit your " knowledge " on the subject of biology!

I agree with you on many points, Harmonic.

Yes, Cable was during that time inferior to X-Man in power due to the fact he was hindered by the techno-organic virus.

Yes, by definition he was considered to be one of the single most unfettered sources of displayed psionic energy in the galaxy.

Yes, With time he did learn more about his powers than he previously knew upon his arrival into the 616 Universe.

As to your comments regarding that Cable merely stumbled upon his powers? That's not so. He didn't merely stumble out one day and have complete control over his powers. In Cable #100 he supposedly purged himself of the virus but he didn't have the ability to totally control his powers. Ie; He killed a group of people when merely attempting to shut down a single persons mind. It wasn't until issue #109 where he displayed any semblance of control which was MONTHS after his initial purging of the virus. And he did it because he was able to apply his Askani training ( ASKANI'SON #1-4 ) which helped to heighten his control and awareness. Something which Nate Grey never hand. And when you finally come to Soldier X #1 it's nearly 2 years later and he's still perfecting his powers. So he's earned his control through a few rough years of training.

Okay Paola, but it is very hard to not state tha obvious when they make a comment about a character they know nearly nothing about AND make no sense in wut they're saying WHILE contradicting himself all at tha same time....but i do apologize.

Originally posted by ****spinz
wow dude, calm down, you totaly missed what i said there, it was way over your head. i used the "in your room" example because no one can see that cable is using his power to fight the virus.

and if u are right, give me one logical explanation why cable was able to do all of those things when his virus was gone is he couldnt control them.

No, "dude" i didn't miss wut you were saying. you were trying to say that cable was using his powers to hold back his techno-organic virus from killing him, so when he lost tha virus - his control over his vast powers was intact. however tha inside of your body or a virus, is incredibly different from EVERYTHING outside of your body.

dont get it? or dont believe me? cut yourself open and see if our world looks like wuts in your body...or watch ER.

Sigh, i'm gona have to repeat myself - read this next paragraph a few times to ensure your comprehension, spinz.

Keeping a virus from taking over your body and PSIONIC powers such as telepathy and telekinetics have NOTHING to do with each other. lifting weights EXERCISES your muscles which make you stronger...cable DID NOT exercise his telepathy or telekinesis because he was fighting a virus INSIDE his body. are there people inside his body for him to EXERCISE his telepathy on? or fly? or move objects? OF COURSE NOT

Damn, your "perspective" is a dumbass.

Oh man. well you seem to state facts. even though i think "askani training" helping him gain control of a sudden enormous increase in psionic powers centuries in tha past, is a little absurd.

Still, it took X-Man a lot more than it took Cable...as it appears. unless that askani training is wut made tha learning curve way shorter.

Nevertheless, if Nate wasn't killed off - i'm sure his control would match cable's current level of control. then of course power potential comes to consideration - which you say is equal. so perhaps they would be equal when it came to mutant power level?

The Askani training was damn near pivotal in aiding Nathan to control the immense power he was given. First you have to understand that the Askani Sisterhood was created by someone with an immense psi talent, namely Mother Askani ( Rachel Summers ) who had experience wielding the Phoenix Force. She in turn trained the Askani to focus their abilites and powers through intense meditation which balanced the mind body and spirit. ( This can all be read in the Book of Askani & ASKANI'SON #1-4 and all takes place nearly 3,000 years in the future.) All the training he went through allowed him to focus what energies he had as well as keep his body held together. I mean -- think about it. Every day of every moment CABLE had to focus his powers on the techno-virus in his body to keep it from taking him over. That's a lot of mental strain and takes a great deal of focus. So he's had plenty of experience in focusing his mind -- due to the Askani training which isn't to be taken lightly. In the future the Askani are considered to be the greatest telepathic & telekinetic warriors. That's by no means absurd.

And I don't like to think of Nate as being " dead ". What immense psionic really stays dead? X-Man is just physically dispersed at the moment. Without shape or form. He joined with all life on earth which means he could very well be ressurected with a decent writer in place -- of course.

But yeah. Power vs. Power they'd be equals but I figure the fight would come down to physical prowess which we both know Cable dominates X-Man in. After all he's the one who's been in over 100 battles and has seen more war than all of the X-Men combined. I doubt X-Man could match Cable's strategic and battle ready skills.

Proof? The only proof I saw there was that you're a complete idiot like Harmonic previously stated. If Stryfe and Cable are clones and they've got the same genotype that means that Madelyne -- being a CLONE of Jean Grey has the same genotype as her. What does that tell you? -GASP- That regardless of Madelyne being Cable's mother she's still got the SAME genetic make up as JEAN GREY who inturn supplied the same genetic material for who? I can't HEAR you! WHO? X-Man you dunce.

rifle :: shoots Crazyspins credibility full of holes.:: Get out my face, son.

wow that was harsh........

and if they where the exact same wich they obvoiusly are.. why does cable have that virus? and why is stryfe evil?

they change as they age u fool, cable has a virus, that was ingected into him, witch changed his genetic material, stryfe was raised evil, so he bacame evil
and as for the same parents debate

i have a brother, is he the exact same as me, no, does he act just like me, no, we have simiaraties but we are differant. maybe as babies they where the same, but now they are differant.

nuff said

Homie, you really need Jesus in your life or something. I've never met anyone so moronic online that their very internet presence gives me a migrane. Please. Seek professional help before you hurt yourself attempting to think.

I'm done with that. Peace.

well apparently there are conflicts in the story from writer to writer...aren't Nate Grey's self destructive powers hardwired into his genes?...genetic material not present in Cable or Stryfe?...then that would mean there is a tiny difference in their genetic structure, making their genotypes different. One's genotype is their actual genetic sequence. NOT the expression of that material, such as psi-signature, that would be their phenotype. Having a different genotype doesnt mean one will will have a different phenotype or expression of genetic material. Thus I feel some writers may be confused when they say identical genetic make up. Additionally, Sinister created X-man from Scott and Jean's DNA in an attempt to make the ultimate mutant...if all he had to do was clone Cable i dont see why he wouldnt or at least mention that Cable was the template for X-man...maybe it was just coincidence that they were very similar, and do have the same phenotype. However, with the self destruct function of X-man's powers embedded in his genes, it means he has a different genotype.

Of course Steve Skroce and Jeff Loeb could be incorrect when they try to involve biology into their stories, they're comic book writers that does not make them a credible source for scientific information...I dont use comic books as a source when Im in my genetics lab.
Comic writers are not doctors or biologists. They write comic books... maybe you take them too seriously. Would you have a comic book writer perform surgery on u?....Well I dont have any interest in being as inflammatory as you were in your last two posts and I just want u to understand why I made the previous posts...Again, Im confident in my knowledge of biology. By the way I just got back from California, over the weekend I was visiting med schools.

I agree.

well, my father is a minister....

and i admit i dont know as mutch about these guys as you guys do, u di have there name and there pic in your name/avatar

Are you kidding me? You've gone off into an entirely different tangent which has no semblance of the conversation we were having. Our discussion revolved around the ongoings within the MARVEL UNIVERSE which you've apparently dismissed with your inane prattling of misplaced reason and logic. Who said anything about comic book writers being well versed in the realm of genetics or biology? Certainly I didn't. But if for some reason you MISINTERPRETED my comments for ones that you've apparently fabricated -- I duly apologize.

No, I don't take comic book science as literal mandate but I do take serious misinformation which you apparently have an abundance of when concerning these particular characters. You cannot apply scientific REASON to the mechanics of comic book characters -- that was the point that you seem to have brushed over. Btw, WB. Hope you had fun. And I hope we can continue to have more debates.

On subject -- Cable would still kick both of their a$$es.

I'm going to pray for you, yo. And your ENGLISH composition teacher.

I thought I clearly addressed the first argument in this paragraph. By the way, why didnt u quote this paragraph too? The other paragraph was in response to u bringing up the writers. My message was that a very central element to the X-Man story is his self destructive powers and impending death; although this is conflicting to the "identical genetic structure", I still feel it takes precedence since it is a more important theme of the story, and the writers DID contradict themselves.

Yes Nathaniel, i agree that cable is physically a better fighter than X-Man. that is, since we are applying issues other than just power - so we have to also apply stryfe's evil factor.

Nate Grey or Cable, though more powerfull...couldn't possibly think of things Stryfe can think of. simply because they aren't as evil. he is also, if i'm not mistaken..highly intelligent.

In a realistic battle, stryfe is a pretty large threat.

__

Yeah, they should really bring Nate back....could it one day happen?

I don't think Stryfe being " evil " is a factor. In past issues of Cable's comic he's always done what was neccesary in order to get his mission complete. Even if it meant KILLING someone he considered an ally. For example -- in Cable's first mini series he shot his ally from Six Pack " Hammer " in order to stop Stryfe from getting some precious intell. Even now Cable does what he has to do because he's a soldier first and foremost. This isn't to say that he's got a blatant disregard for life like Stryfe does -- but Stryfe being evil? Come on. Cable whooped his a$$ during the X-Cutioners Song. He's of little consequence in my own eyes. That's just my opinion.

Read that and shut up about it Wynndar.

Nathaniel, do you see Marvel ever resurrecting X-Man in tha future?

u are just repeating urself...I agreed that writers had called them 100% genetically identical... that means they have contradicted each other...

I doubt that Marvel would ressurect X-Man. He's not like Wolverine, Magneto or Jean Grey -- he didn't bring that much money to the table. But anythings possible.

We should try writing for Marvel...seriously. wut'd ya say Nate?

I've already sent in several letters and e-mails to Marvel attempting to petition the ressurection of Nathan Grey. It's not going to happen. They didn't even grace me with a response so unless THOUSANDS of people have a desire to see him in the comics again...it's a lost cause my friend.

Hmm...can you give me their email address?

Lol, i must add that at one time i IMed "marvel appreances" about bringing nate back...but later i discovered that it was just someone checking emails on that username for questions/comments about any marvel character appearing around tha country in stores and such. its funny cuz they used to sign off as soon as i would say "hey, you guys should bring X-Man back".

i dont care that its closed. i would go for my main villain stryfe!

cable get s my vote n e day.....cable's power's have increased EXPONENTIALLY since he first appeared....sure...x-man was supposed to be the 'strongest' one....only because he wasnt held back by the TO virus...but since his power increased after the virus was taken out....when it came back he states: "the time i spent realising my mutant potential more fully has made controlling the T-O almost an AFTERTHOUGHT...like breathing...and that's allowed my powers to expand further..."

thus i think cable is now the strongest and most capable of the three....as he was able to stand pretty much toe to toe woth his counterparts when he was still diverting a significant amount of his power to the TO...now that its become ez...he'll axe dem

Young Cable:
http://www.uncannyxmen.net/images/spotlight/cable002.jpg

Hm...who he resembles?

I've always taken issue with the fact that Nate Grey is supposed to be genetically identical to Cable. Why? They're from separate realities and the only thing they have in common are common parents. Not even! Saying that the son of Cyclops and Jean Grey in one world is identical to the son of Cyclops and Jean Grey in another world is like saying the child a couple had in 1985 is genetically identical to a child that same couple has in 1995. They're not. They're siblings, not clones. Different years, different times, different spaces, different environments, different realities, different conception methods all play a role in the final outcome of a child. ALL of those factors are different in AOA than in 616.

There's proof of that right IN the Summer's line. Rachel is the child of Scott and Jean - she's not a boy, she's not Cable, and she's not blessed with the same immense power as the other three. So I take severe issue with the idea that Cable and Nate are the same person.

That said, unchecked Cable beats Stryfe and X-man. *shrug*

/\good point.

yeah man great point. they are different. tha difference though is that x-men is more powerfull - X-Man wins.

nate IS more powerful, and as far as the argument about him beeing physically inferior goes, well nate demonstrated the ability to create a psionic armour against the fight with holocast which granted him physical victory and holocast has no known upper strength level{need i remind again that nate was not really in control of his powers at the time}, looking at this i have to say that even in a fist to fist fight, nate wins this{and ofcourse, in a psionic fight he takes this one defintaely}

What was it that killed nate?

Its all the same DNA

But Cable is way more skilled.

Cable wins.

cable is the only one still alive

Ummm I think stryfe made a comback about a month or so ago in the x-force mag. I didn't see what happened after he first appeared so assuming he didn't die again in the very next issue than he is definitely still kickin......and i give this fight to X-man, although experience would play a huge factor here.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v34/USAgent/5.jpg

WHAT GAME IS THAT USAGENT???

That would be Freedom Force. And those 3 characters there-Nate Grey,Stryfe, and Cable are custom made characters for that game

It was actually domino in disquise

Yeah, Nate coming back would be cool. He was awesome as Shaman.

how did nate die?

He sacrificed himself to beat the Harvester(s?) who was threatening the whole Earth.