luke cage vs. sabretooth

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baddspellahl4
I'm with luke on this one

lightaxe
same here hes got dang near indestructible skin right?

ScarletSpider
Steel hard skin, aye.

crazyspinz
who be this luke cage?

Arsenal
Luke Cage AKA Hero for Hire AKA Power Man AKA the shiznatt

ScarletSpider
Wrongfully sentenced ex-con who underwent an experimental procedure in prison. One of the guards who hated him tried to sabotage the experiment, but it ended up making Cage super strong and resiliant.

He hit his hay-day back in the 70's as Marvel's chief Blaxploitation character, what with his afro, chain belt, yellow shirts with massive collars etc..

Later partnered up with Iron Fist for awhile. Was a member of the Heroes for Hire team. Was hired by Moon Knight as part of the original Marvel Knights team awhile back. Had his own mini-series in 2002 I believe. Recently he's been appearing in Daredevil off and on as a supporting character. As he is one of Bendis' pet characters, he's going to be in New Avengers starting in a bit. He is also currently appearing in the Pulse (prior to that he guested in Alias a lot, again by Bendis) and Secret War (more Bendis, yay!)

His skin is steel hard--lending itself to bullet proof resiliance and is nigh-unbreakable. His super-strength has never been approximatly gauged. It wavers from 4 ton range, to trading blows with the Thing unfazed.

crazyspinz
o that guy, ya he totaly kicks ass

manjaro
luke cage dude, Creed would run away while his healing factor can still save him

Maelstrom
Sabertooth would rip him from the inside out.

baddspellahl4
is his skin literally hard as steel? he can frggin lift 40 tons which is more than enough to smash sabes

ScarletSpider
Yes it is as hard as steel. If continuity is taken into effect, and Sabretooth has is adamantium skeleton and claws, he could pose a bigger threat.

baddspellahl4
I also read that luke cage has the recovery time about 1/3 time faster than humans

lightaxe
yea, like all things considered Cage would probably whoop sabretooth. But in an actual comic Luke would probably lose.

Tron
How does Luke's skin fair against adamantium? Cause if Creed gets to biting and scratching, it might suck for Cage.

ScarletSpider
It's steel hard, so it is capable of being cut, you just need some rather abnormal instruments to do so.

crazyspinz
like adimantium claws?

Tron
And teeth?wink

Abaddon
Marvel is discrediting Sabretooth. Bad wiriting is seriously weakening his character. He is a big wuss in Ultimate X-men (can barely fight Wolverine). He gets wailed by Agent Zero (Why God? Why?). It's a sad day for anyone when one of their favorite characters is getting turned into a less than crap support character (who gets his ass kicked to show how cool other crappy characters are) *SIGH* no no Am I going crazy or does anyone else notice this?

Arsenal
You're going crazy.

Abaddon
I hope so...Sabretooth rules

ScarletSpider
Sabretooth was always more of wild brute force fighter. He has had a good deal of training, but over all ignores it and prefers to go at his opponent in a more primal manner. Agent Zero turned out to be Maverick, so I didn't mind that he whipped Sabretooth's ass, as I really like Maverick. As far as the story went, Weapon X had given him the ability to shoot a corrosive enzyme blast, as we later found out, this enzyme was specifically engineered to counteract Sabretooth's healing factor. There was nothing Creed could do.

Abaddon
If Agent Zero was Maverick then I don't mind, I couldn't finish that story because I thought it sucked. Who wants to see a team composed of Sauron, Wild Child, and some other craptastic characters (Marrow was cool though). To the topic, are Sabes and Luke in the same strength level?

lawest9
Cage cleans his clock!!!

occultdestroyer
Sabretooth.
I can bet that if I make a thread right now, Wolverine VS Luke Cage, most of you will agree that Wolverine will win.
Let's lay off the weed.
Sabretooth wins.

Phantom Zone
If sabretooth doesnt have adamantuim Luke might win.

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
If sabretooth doesnt have adamantuim Luke might win.

Co-signed.

Silent Guardian
Luke Cage pounds him into the dirt.

srankmissingnin
Originally posted by Silent Guardian
Luke Cage pounds him into the dirt.

That would be a Christmas Miracle. big grin

Silent Guardian
Originally posted by srankmissingnin
That would be a Christmas Miracle. big grin

Tis the season big grin

Apolloknight
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
If sabretooth doesnt have adamantuim Luke might win.

Eternal Idol
Sabertooth would kick Cage's ass.

FOOM
"I can bet that if I make a thread right now, Wolverine VS Luke Cage, most of you will agree that Wolverine will win.
Let's lay off the weed." Damn right.
It's been done and the thread didn't last long because it went exactly as you said. Most everyone considered it a joke to pit Luke against Logan.

Creed (so similar to Logan) would chew through Cage.

rotiart
Creed with adamantium 10/10
Creed witout 0/10

Creed can't hurt cage but cage can cripple and temporarily win the fight by breaking every bone in sabs body. With the metal cage gets cut and his brute strength ain't outing creed down with that healing factor

Phantom Zone
Originally posted by rotiart
Creed with adamantium 10/10
Creed witout 0/10

Creed can't hurt cage but cage can cripple and temporarily win the fight by breaking every bone in sabs body. With the metal cage gets cut and his brute strength ain't outing creed down with that healing factor

Agreed.

Eternal Idol
Originally posted by rotiart
Creed with adamantium 10/10
Creed witout 0/10

Creed can't hurt cage but cage can cripple and temporarily win the fight by breaking every bone in sabs body. With the metal cage gets cut and his brute strength ain't outing creed down with that healing factor

I disagree with the 0/10 call. Sabertooth still has superhuman strength without the adamantium. I don't know if he's as strong as Cage, but he's definitely faster and more skilled. His healing factor and damage soak are through the roof, and his bones are a lot denser than that of a normal human. Even if he can't cut Cage with his claws, he could still smack him around and put a hurting on him.

Phantom Zone
Originally posted by Eternal Idol
I disagree with the 0/10 call. Sabertooth still has superhuman strength without the adamantium. I don't know if he's as strong as Cage, but he's definitely faster and more skilled. His healing factor and damage soak are through the roof, and his bones are a lot denser than that of a normal human. Even if he can't cut Cage with his claws, he could still smack him around and put a hurting on him.

I dunno man. Carnage was raking Luke with his claws and it didnt do a damn thing. Hiriom also sent him flying a long distance into the air he got right back up like ntohing happened. I really dont think hes going to be able to hurt Luke.

Apolloknight
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
I dunno man. Carnage was raking Luke with his claws and it didnt do a damn thing. Hiriom also sent him flying a long distance into the air he got right back up like ntohing happened. I really dont think hes going to be able to hurt Luke.

Carnage? Thats pretty impressive. Carnage is what, a 40 tonner right?

Nestical
creed

Phantom Zone
Originally posted by Apolloknight
Carnage? Thats pretty impressive. Carnage is what, a 40 tonner right?

Yeah its in New Avengers. I dont think Luke tagged Carnage but basically from what I can remember Carnage claws werent doing anything.

Not sure how strong he is but as you know hes strong enough to fight Venom and some of Venoms feats seem class 50.

Eternal Idol
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
I dunno man. Carnage was raking Luke with his claws and it didnt do a damn thing. Hiriom also sent him flying a long distance into the air he got right back up like ntohing happened. I really dont think hes going to be able to hurt Luke.
Cage's skin is resistant to cuts, but blunt trauma seems to work just fine against him. I can accept the Carnage feat, but Hiroim... that's a different story. I just can't take most of the WWH storyline seriously. Hiroim's strength level was pretty vague. He shattered Iron Fist's hand while he was using the Iron Fist attack, but Cage managed to shrug off a haymaker?

I think Spider-Man has enough strength to hurt Cage, but lacks the durability to do so without hurting himself. My guess is that upgraded Sabertooth is anywhere between 8-20 tons power level, and he doesn't have to worry about hurting himself while decking Cage.

carver9
adamantium sabertooth 10/10
Non adamantium 6/10

Phantom Zone
Originally posted by Eternal Idol
Cage's skin is resistant to cuts, but blunt trauma seems to work just fine against him. I can accept the Carnage feat, but Hiroim... that's a different story. I just can't take most of the WWH storyline seriously. Hiroim's strength level was pretty vague. He shattered Iron Fist's hand while he was using the Iron Fist attack, but Cage managed to shrug off a haymaker?

I think Spider-Man has enough strength to hurt Cage, but lacks the durability to do so without hurting himself. My guess is that upgraded Sabertooth is anywhere between 8-20 tons power level, and he doesn't have to worry about hurting himself while decking Cage.

Hes taken punches from orka and Ironclad and been just fine, so yeah I can see him shrugging off Hiriom. Prior to his upgrade Luke took the Iron Fist and got back up pissed.

Eternal Idol
I guess Cage has been upgraded a hell of a lot more than I originally thought.

Phantom Zone
Originally posted by Eternal Idol
I guess Cage has been upgraded a hell of a lot more than I originally thought.

Dont get me wrong the punches hurt but he was just fine afterwards.

Silent Guardian
Cage wins no question

Wild Shadow
sabe wins both fights his claws are strong enough to rend steel. luke doesnt have the brute strength to keep him down. giving sabe the chance for a throat cut/bite.

Silent Guardian
Originally posted by Wild Shadow
sabe wins both fights his claws are strong enough to rend steel. luke doesnt have the brute strength to keep him down. giving sabe the chance for a throat cut/bite.

Woah! Woah! Woah! Really! Sabs is strong but no where near Cage's level. Luke tools him. When is the last time anyone saw Saabertooth win a fight! He is way overrated. Just watch him in the Hulk vs. Wolverine movie, he looks weak.

Wild Shadow
Originally posted by Silent Guardian
Woah! Woah! Woah! Really! Sabs is strong but no where near Cage's level. Luke tools him. When is the last time anyone saw Saabertooth win a fight! He is way overrated. Just watch him in the Hulk vs. Wolverine movie, he looks weak.

their is more to it then brute strength, i honestly think sabe can take better hits from hulk lvl beings then wolverine.

also sabe has the tools to kill cage while cage is missing all the tools to effect sabe, it will take more then a couple of blows from a 40 to 50 tonner to knock out sabe. the reason sabe loses is because in comics he is the bad guy.

if i were in a fight and had to sets of knifes against a line backer chances are i will win because i hold the bigger advantage with lethal strikes.

Silent Guardian
Originally posted by Wild Shadow
their is more to it then brute strength, i honestly think sabe can take better hits from hulk lvl beings then wolverine.

also sabe has the tools to kill cage while cage is missing all the tools to effect sabe, it will take more then a couple of blows from a 40 to 50 tonner to knock out sabe. the reason sabe loses is because in comics he is the bad guy.

if i were in a fight and had to sets of knifes against a line backer chances are i will win because i hold the bigger advantage with lethal strikes.

I understand where you are coming from, but without adamantium he has no way of hurting Cage. Second of all would adamantium even penetrate Cage's skin? I am seriously asking. I honestly, feel Luke would just take Sabertooth by the neck drag him to a nearby stream, and drown him. But who knows maybe you are right. The healing factor makes it tricky.

Wild Shadow
Originally posted by Silent Guardian
I understand where you are coming from, but without adamantium he has no way of hurting Cage. Second of all would adamantium even penetrate Cage's skin? I am seriously asking. I honestly, feel Luke would just take Sabertooth by the neck drag him to a nearby stream, and drown him. But who knows maybe you are right. The healing factor makes it tricky.


pretty sure sabe can penetrate his skin he possess superhuman strength limit unknown, because it has never bn explained. it is enough to back up his slashes to penetrate his skin.

Silent Guardian
Originally posted by Wild Shadow
pretty sure sabe can penetrate his skin he possess superhuman strength limit unknown, because it has never bn explained. it is enough to back up his slashes to penetrate his skin.

okay, when you say limit unknown it sounds like you are talking about Hulk class or God class. And no way he is that strong. Sabertooth is stronger than wolverine, and besides that we do not know. But he is obviously weaker than heavy weights like Colossus, The Thing and Luke. So just take a guess he can only be so strong. And I highly doubt he could pierce Luke's skin without adamantium.

Wild Shadow
Originally posted by Silent Guardian
okay, when you say limit unknown it sounds like you are talking about Hulk class or God class. And no way he is that strong. Sabertooth is stronger than wolverine, and besides that we do not know. But he is obviously weaker than heavy weights like Colossus, The Thing and Luke. So just take a guess he can only be so strong. And I highly doubt he could pierce Luke's skin without adamantium.


didnt mean to make it sound like he was uber strong just that no one knows his actual strength but i say at least in the ten ton range. smile

Jynocidus
I could have sworn I seen a comic where Sabretooth had the upperhand against Luke from aloooooong time ago. Anybody know what I'm talking about? The OLD Sabretooth, like first showings

either way I'm going with Creed.

jinzin
Creeds Organic claws can't cut Luke Cage and I don't know if he has enough stopping power to harm Luke since his upgrade.

IMO Creed needs his Adamantium claws to even make this a fight. He'd win with them, lose without.

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by jinzin
Creeds Organic claws can't cut Luke Cage and I don't know if he has enough stopping power to harm Luke since his upgrade.

IMO Creed needs his Adamantium claws to even make this a fight. He'd win with them, lose without.

What about Luke's eyes? Are they as durable as the rest of his body?

complexbrother
Luke lifts 40 tons

Sabertooth lifts 2 tons

Sabertooth was trained by the foregner

Cage was partially trained by Iron Fist and Captian America


Cage wins.

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by complexbrother
Sabertooth lifts 2 tons

False.

Juk3n
Originally posted by complexbrother

Sabertooth lifts 2 tons



you're missing a digit there pal, srsly!!

Zoron
Luke cage takes it 1 cause of the super strength I saw someone say he could lift 4 tons yeah at first he wasn't that strong but niow I think hes up in the 45-50 ton range now 2 his steel hard skin whick sabertooth could probaly slice thru but still creed can't take the blows from luke for long healing will only stop u from dying not getting knocked the **** out! & last cause luke is in my top 10 fav marvel chars thats why

Eternal Idol
Originally posted by Zoron
Luke cage takes it 1 cause of the super strength I saw someone say he could lift 4 tons yeah at first he wasn't that strong but niow I think hes up in the 45-50 ton range now 2 his steel hard skin whick sabertooth could probaly slice thru but still creed can't take the blows from luke for long healing will only stop u from dying not getting knocked the **** out! & last cause luke is in my top 10 fav marvel chars thats why

awesome

Wild Shadow
luke can still take it with organic claws, so what if luke has steel like skin not like sabe doesnt rend through stuff like that hell he has gone through harder stuff like archangels wings.

Survivor19
There are another ways to KO/kill Luke. Like drown him. Or blow him up with a bomb. Grenade to throat will suffice just fine.
If we let Sabes use his head, he can take Luke out just fine. 7/10

Serious Impact
Originally posted by Survivor19
There are another ways to KO/kill Luke. Like drown him. Or blow him up with a bomb. Grenade to throat will suffice just fine.
If we let Sabes use his head, he can take Luke out just fine. 7/10

By that logic, the same can be said for Creed. Luke can drown him, put a grenade down his throat, etc...and he's got more of a chance of doing it, given his strength advantage (of course, he has to catch him first, but it only takes one slip up). I'm happy to see that they've upgraded Cage beyond the rather lousy 2 ton early days.

If Creed doesn't have adamantium, Luke takes the majority. I just don't see Luke taken much, if any damage. he was hard to hurt before his upgrade, he must be a beast to hurt now.

With Adamantium, Creed takes the majority. I can see him hurting Cage, if he's got adamantium claws and teeth. I can also see him taking more of beating, without going down.

Either way, this would be a good fight for a comic.

Mindset
Originally posted by Wild Shadow
luke can still take it with organic claws, so what if luke has steel like skin not like sabe doesnt rend through stuff like that hell he has gone through harder stuff like archangels wings. His skin is harder than steel.

StiltmanFTW
It's titanium hard.

Wild Shadow
titanium is still not stronger then steel unless i missed some scientific advancement.

either way sabe should be able to tear through him.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Titanium

Commercial (99.2% pure) grades of titanium have ultimate tensile strength of about 63,000 psi (434 MPa), equal to that of some steel alloys, but are 45% lighter



i think i just burst a lot of ppls bubble. :P

Mindset
His skin is harder than titanium

That's just a descriptor, actually go by his feats. erm

Wild Shadow
Originally posted by Mindset
His skin is harder than titanium

That's just a descriptor, actually go by his feats. erm


so do we go by sabes feats showing he can rend through near like adamantium wings made by celestial science?

Mindset
I meant go by Luke Cage's feats of durability, nub.

Wild Shadow
Originally posted by Mindset
I meant go by Luke Cage's feats or durability, nub.

dont call me a nub, because i punched holes through ppl's defense.

Mindset
I don't care what you think you did to ppl who aren't me, nub.

Wild Shadow
so cages skin is stronger then titanium which leaves sabe still able to rend through steel.

unless you think that the only feats that count are cages durability and not sabretooths cutting ability.

Mindset
Cage's skin is stronger than titanium and steel, which is why I told you to look at his feats.

I don't care if Sabretooth can cut through god, that doesn't have anything to do with my post.

KingD19
He does have a point nub, I mean Wild Shadow.

Badabing
I don't want to see any more reports from this thread. People need to stop trolling and have thicker skin.

jinzin
Originally posted by Wild Shadow
so cages skin is stronger then titanium which leaves sabe still able to rend through steel.

unless you think that the only feats that count are cages durability and not sabretooths cutting ability. Sabretooth has failed to cut him multiple times with his organic claws. he knows they're pretty much worthless against Luke. His only chance would be to go into slugfest mode like he did with rogue and Ms. Marvel. Unfortunately we have no idea how he'd do because he's never tried that.

jinzin
Originally posted by Badabing
I don't want to see any more reports from this thread. People need to stop trolling and have thicker skin. reported. no expression

Phantom Zone
Originally posted by Wild Shadow
titanium is still not stronger then steel unless i missed some scientific advancement.

either way sabe should be able to tear through him.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Titanium

Commercial (99.2% pure) grades of titanium have ultimate tensile strength of about 63,000 psi (434 MPa), equal to that of some steel alloys, but are 45% lighter



i think i just burst a lot of ppls bubble. :P

Doesnt matter anyway hes suposed to have had an upgarde the titanuim thing is from wiki.

It's Face
Prob Cage, although I've never been impressed with Cage's speed and reaction time.

snoopdogg
Cage wins.

Scoobless
Originally posted by Badabing
I don't want to see any more reports from this thread. People need to stop trolling and have thicker skin.

Just like Luke Cage...?


stick out tongue

Starscream M
sabretooth can't win this fight.

Wild Shadow
Sabretooth even with bone claws would tear Cage a new one... Cage's 20 ton strength isnt going to help him against sabretooth.

sabretooth 8/10

Starscream M
Originally posted by Wild Shadow
Sabretooth even with bone claws would tear Cage a new one... Cage's 20 ton strength isnt going to help him against sabretooth.

sabretooth 8/10 sabretooth can't harm cage.

darthgoober
Originally posted by Wild Shadow
Sabretooth even with bone claws would tear Cage a new one... Cage's 20 ton strength isnt going to help him against sabretooth.

sabretooth 8/10
Has Sabretooth's bone claws ever cut Cage before when they fought?

Wild Shadow
Originally posted by darthgoober
Has Sabretooth's bone claws ever cut Cage before when they fought? no. but cage never fought multiple upgraded versions of sabe other then his earlier versions.

bone clawed Sabe was able to rip the shiva robot apart after it had fought logan and they are suppose to be adamantium resistant at the time....

bone clawed sabretooth has also injured Rogue twice when she had her Ms. Marvel durability.

His claws didnt penetrate her skin but the claws combined with his strength was still enough to hurt her and knock her out.

redhotrash
As much as I hate Cage, he isnt losing this.

darthgoober
Originally posted by Wild Shadow
no. but cage never fought multiple upgraded versions of sabe other then his earlier versions.

bone clawed Sabe was able to rip the shiva robot apart after it had fought logan and they are suppose to be adamantium resistant at the time....

bone clawed sabretooth has also injured Rogue twice when she had her Ms. Marvel durability.

His claws didnt penetrate her skin but the claws combined with his strength was still enough to hurt her and knock her out.
Yeah Sabretooth's been upgraded since they fought, but then again so has Cage. If he couldn't cut Cage back in the day and he couldn't cut Rogue, what makes you think he can cut Cage now unless Marvel's specifically said that his claws are stronger/sharper than they were before? The Shiva thing could be impressive(I haven't seen the feat myself to judge), but hen again if he was cutting through something that couldn't be cut through by adamantium it reaks of BS writing.

If Jinzin says Victor can't beat Luke without adamantium, then it's pretty safe to say he can't...

dmills
Luke's skin is as durable as titanium right?

Trackz
Originally posted by dmills
Luke's skin is as durable as titanium right? moreso I'm not sure exactly what level, but more than titanium

dmills
Originally posted by Trackz
moreso I'm not sure exactly what level, but more than titanium Makes sense. His durability feats suggest so.

Wild Shadow
Originally posted by darthgoober
Yeah Sabretooth's been upgraded since they fought, but then again so has Cage. If he couldn't cut Cage back in the day and he couldn't cut Rogue, what makes you think he can cut Cage now unless Marvel's specifically said that his claws are stronger/sharper than they were before? The Shiva thing could be impressive(I haven't seen the feat myself to judge), but hen again if he was cutting through something that couldn't be cut through by adamantium it reaks of BS writing.

If Jinzin says Victor can't beat Luke without adamantium, then it's pretty safe to say he can't...

i said adamantium resistant not immune... aside from that he still ko'ed rogue which anyway you cut is superior to cage in his most recent upgrade.

both logan and sabe tear through metal and steel easily in bone pre adamantium.. Sabretooth having superior superhuman strength should be cutting more then wolverine bone clawed version.

darthgoober
Originally posted by Wild Shadow
i said adamantium resistant not immune... aside from that he still ko'ed rogue which anyway you cut is superior to cage in his most recent upgrade.

both logan and sabe tear through metal and steel easily in bone pre adamantium.. Sabretooth having superior superhuman strength should be cutting more then wolverine bone clawed version.
Who cares if he KO'd Rogue, he traded shots with Ms. Marvel too but still wasn't able to cut Cage. Even before his upgrade Cage hopped right up after being on the recieving end of the Ironfist and that's more impressive as far as pure durability goes to anything from Rogue that I'm aware of.

And Sabretooth could tear through metal back in the day too, but still wasn't able to cut through pre upgrade Cage. Unless you have proof of Sabretooth's claws now being more durable than Cage's skin, all Sabretooth's strength upgrade does is open up the possibility of Victor's claws shattering against Cage's skin. No matter how strong you are, you can't slash through a piece of steel with an iron knife because the knife is going to give first...

Wild Shadow
Sabretooth in his mini fought some russian super soldiers with adamantium resistant skin ans superhuman strength, reflex and high military fighting skills..


Sabretooth took a beaten kept on coming his adamantium claws simply left welds and small scratches so he started grappling them snapping arms. joints and necks.... this was after he was being the one having his body dislocated by them on one to one fights.

so when Sabretooth focused and started fighting smart knowing scratching biting werent doing it he was using skills and there own weight to help snap and break them... same would happen here.


Cage is what a 20 tonner that isnt sh#$ to Sabretooth and sabe can still go for the eyes and work him and break him after exhausting him in one on one.

darthgoober
Originally posted by Wild Shadow
Sabretooth in his mini fought some russian super soldiers with adamantium resistant skin ans superhuman strength, reflex and high military fighting skills..


Sabretooth took a beaten kept on coming his adamantium claws simply left welds and small scratches so he started grappling them snapping arms. joints and necks.... this was after he was being the one having his body dislocated by them on one to one fights.

so when Sabretooth focused and started fighting smart knowing scratching biting werent doing it he was using skills and there own weight to help snap and break them... same would happen here.



Cage is what a 20 tonner that isnt sh#$ to Sabretooth and sabe can still go for the eyes and work him and break him after exhausting him in one on one.
How does ANY of that indicate that Sabretooth can cut Cage(which is what we're actually debating about)?

If you're saying that he can break Cage's limbs, we'll need to start comparing strength feats between the two and I'm willing to bet that Sabretooth's going to fall behind in that department. If you're using the super soldier's as proof, then what strength feats do they have to indicate that they're as strong as Cage(as having a limb broken like you're describing has more to do with strength than durability)?

And how is Victor going to exhaust him H2H if he can handle the Ironfist? Surely you don't see Sabretooth's punches as having more stopping power...

KingD19
Cage has tussled with Hulk, Rhino, Iron Fist, Wonderman. He even got knocked a couple blocks away by Hiroim and was just fine. Hell, he took Wreckers crowbar from him. He can take Sabretooth.

Wild Shadow
exhausting is having Cage trying to hit him while Sabretooth plays with him and just weights out his energy reserves... the best I see cage holding up is maybe an hour trying to hit and pound Sabretooth. Sabe can just keep his distance and the beating he does take he can just as easily wait it out and escape from them.. from tripping him or using grappling techniques which strength has less to do and more to do with skill.

aside from that saying luke can take the IF doesnt mean anything.. the IF he took was the old school one which was nowhere near the modern version of it and its train busting lvls.

Sabe doesnt have to rely on just brute strength and punching like i said grappling, twisting and having Cage fall on his arm and snap it with his own weight should be enough..

you dont think Cage can Ko Sabe with 20 ton lvl punches do you, what will sabe being doing standing there letting him unload on him till he succeeds?

darthgoober
They've fought before, did Sabretooth successfully "play with him" without getting tagged?

It may not have been train busting, but even back then it was train wrecking...
http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr347/darthgoober/kungfu1848-49.jpg
http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr347/darthgoober/kungfu1850.jpg
http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr347/darthgoober/kungfu1851.jpg
http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr347/darthgoober/kungfu1852.jpg

...and Cage still took it. So I ask again, you don't really think that Sabe's punches have more stopping power do you? He's also taken shots from the Rhino, Hulk, and I don't even know who all else, so even if you somehow think that Sabretooth's punches do more damage than the Ironfist, do you really think they do more damage than someone like that?

Proof that Luke falling on his arm would break it? Do you have any idea of how rediculous that is...

Eventually yeah. The thing is that eventually Victor's healing factor would max out and Cage could KO him, but no realistic amount of punches or slashes from Sabretooth would KO Luke unless Creed has some kick ass punching feats that I'm unaware of.


Also, the true subject of our debate seems to have changed. This whole thing started because you were saying that Victor's bone claws would tear Luke up despite their being unable to in the past, what evidence do you have to support that claim?

Wild Shadow
http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/Sabretooth-MaryShelleyOverdrive0-23.jpg
grappling and bone breaking skills and techniques.

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/sabretooth_redzone_p24-25.jpg techno organic wings nearly as strong and durable as adamantium above steel or titanium.

http://s662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/?action=view&current=shivasabes1.jpg

http://s662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/?action=view&current=shivasabes2.jpg

shiva shell

TheTyrant
Sabretooth.

darthgoober
Originally posted by Wild Shadow
http://s662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/?action=view&current=Sabretooth-MaryShelleyOverdrive0-23.jpg
grappling and bone breaking skills adn techniques.

http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/sabretooth_redzone_p24-25.jpg techno organic wings nearly as strong and durable as adamantium above steel or titanium.

http://s662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/?action=view&current=shivasabes1.jpg

http://s662.photobucket.com/albums/uu345/jinzin2008/?action=view&current=shivasabes2.jpg

shiva shell
Don't know what the first scan's supposed to mean since I don't even know who that guy is.

When has Warren's wings been described as nearly as strong as adamantium? Also, did you not notice Sabretooth saying that Warren's wings are thinner and weaker than last time?

He doesn't claw through Shiva in the third. Plus like I said before, if he's damaging adamantium it stinks of BS writing.

Wild Shadow
Originally posted by darthgoober
Don't know what the first scan's supposed to mean since I don't even know who that guy is.

When has Warren's wings been described as nearly as strong as adamantium?

He doesn't claw through Shiva in the third. Plus like I said before, if he's damaging adamantium it stinks of BS writing.

during the Cable & Deadpool when DP took cable's future sword for a pan dimensional adventure.. he sliced through an alternate version of angel.. he said something like cool sword nice balance cuts through almost adamantium type material ....

also in other instances Wolverine has tangled with cable and did minor damage to cables arms at times.. cable using it to parry and block attacks and at times only suffered minor scratches and surface damage...

i am only saying that Techno wings and metal is superior to steel and titanium... and one of the few best things next to such material as adamantium and carbonadium


explanation of who they are..

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=509407&pagenumber=4

darthgoober
Originally posted by Wild Shadow
during the Cable & Deadpool when DP took cable's future sword for a pan dimensional adventure.. he sliced through an alternate version of angel.. he said something like cool sword nice balance cuts through almost adamantium type material ....

also in other instances Wolverine has tangled with cable and did minor damage to cables arms at times.. cable using it to parry and block attacks and at times only suffered minor scratches and surface damage...

i am only saying that Techno wings and metal is superior to steel and titanium... and one of the few best things next to such material as adamantium and carbonadium
Not proof that Warren's wings are almost as tough as adamantium. I haven't seen the feat in question to examine it in detail, but if nothing else you'd need to prove that 616 Archangle's wings=Alternate Archangle's wings.

Not proof of Victor being able to cut Cage. Sabretooth's claws don't=Wolverine's claws and to my knowledge Archangle's wings don't = Cable's arm.

Proof? Like your scan said, Warren's wings were thin and weak in that instance.

Wild Shadow
also the scan of Shiva fighting sabe you can see sabe manage to do small damage scratch to it and that was b4 his multiple upgrades in strength and durability and he still ripped the shiva apart with his strength.

aside from that the super spetsnaz who had adamantuim resistant skin still got their butts kicked by sabretooth. i dont see Cage's skin being close to the spetsnaz and they were able to rip his arm and dislocate his joints ripping out of his skin with their superhuman strength.

my point is if he can do that to various types of materials prior to some upgrades he will do even worse to someone who's lvl of durability is only steel or titanium..

Even if Sabretooth said his wings were thin and weaker doesnt mean much since that is sabretooth just being sabretooth and goating him enjoying the pain he has caused warren.

i am not saying he will win by just scratching Luke but he will win by tearing his eyes tripping him and grappling him using his fighting skills..

Luke has no real hope of getting the majority here if you read more Sabretooth comic appearances in his mini's and other books where he isnt just fighting the title hero you will see he isnt a pushover to the likes of cage.

Sabretooth manage to fight and pummel some of sinister Submariner clones and finally manage to stick his claws into one of them b4 he got jumped by more....

Sabe can eventually weaken Cage with just minor cuts and running him ragged after he has ripped his eyes.

Original Smurph
Originally posted by darthgoober
Proof? Like your scan said, Warren's wings were thin and weak in that instance. It looks like Victor's referring to the blood, not the wing metal.

darthgoober
Originally posted by Wild Shadow
also the scan of Shiva fighting sabe you can see sabe manage to do small damage scratch to it and that was b4 his multiple upgrades in strength and durability and he still ripped the shiva apart with his strength.

aside from that the super spetsnaz who had adamantuim resistant skin still got their butts kicked by sabretooth. i dont see Cage's skin being close to the spetsnaz and they were able to rip his arm and dislocate his joints ripping out of his skin with their superhuman strength.

my point is if he can do that to various types of materials prior to some upgrades he will do even worse to someone who's lvl of durability is only steel or titanium..

Even if Sabretooth said his wings were thin and weaker doesnt mean much since that is sabretooth just being sabretooth and goating him enjoying the pain he has caused warren.

i am not saying he will win by just scratching Luke but he will win by tearing his eyes tripping him and grappling him using his fighting skills..

Luke has no real hope of getting the majority here if you read more Sabretooth comic appearances in his mini's and other books where he isnt just fighting the title hero you will see he isnt a pushover to the likes of cage.

Sabretooth manage to fight and pummel some of sinister Submariner clones and finally manage to stick his claws into one of them b4 he got jumped by more....

Sabe can eventually weaken Cage with just minor cuts and running him ragged after he has ripped his eyes.

You want to compare general durability feats between Shiva and Cage? I bet Cage wins...

So you're saying that Sabretooth's adamantium claws couldn't damage the guy even though they could cut through pretty much anything short of adamantium itself, but Sabretooth pushed the guys bones through his skin... poor writing somewhere. Either he should have been able to cut them or he shouldn't have been strong enough to push the bones through. Unless you're off the opinion that Sabretooth is somewhere in the Hulk's strength range of course.

"Only steel or titanium"... you're ignoring feats in favor of description now. By the same token someone could say that Sabretooth can't even cut through regular iron since his claws are only as durable as whatever the Hell fingernails/claws are made out of. But think about this, when Cage's skin was stated to be as tough as steel he was resisting the claws of Sabretooth... who's claws could cut through steel. Look at Cage's feats and you'll see that his durability goes far beyond the descriptor. What's more, you're ASSUMING he can cut Cage based on the fact that Creed was upgraded without accounting for the fact that Cage has been upgraded repeatedly also.

It means that we can't assume Archangles wings were nearly as durable as adamantium in that instance is what it means. We don't know how tough they were right then, so it's not proof that Sabretooth can cut Cage.

Grappling with someone stronger than you is never a good idea. Sabretooth tried that before against Cage, and paid the price for it.

Cage's durability far exceeds his strength level just as Colossuss's does. Submariner is definately stronger, but I don't know if he's necessarily more durable. And I highly doubt that a Submariner clone would be, if nothing else I know one was KO'd by Cap in just a few panels.

Don't see him cutting Cage at all, and going for the eyes typically means coming right within arm's reach of the person you're attacking, which again isn't smart when the person you're fighting is stronger than you.

darthgoober
Originally posted by Original Smurph
It looks like Victor's referring to the blood, not the wing metal.
Re-reading it I guess it's possible, but to me it came off as him talking about the wings themselves.

psycho gundam
it's the blood bro, there is no way to interpret it differently.

Mindset
Originally posted by darthgoober
Re-reading it I guess it's possible, but to me it came off as him talking about the wings themselves. It's the blood, he's talking about how it tastes.

darthgoober
Originally posted by psycho gundam
it's the blood bro, there is no way to interpret it differently.
Yeah there is, as the wings. I mean I know he mentions the blood, but that didn't seem like the primary focus of the statement. Like I said you guys may very well be right about what he's saying, but that's not how it came off to me when I first read it.

psycho gundam
well, it's kinda sabretooth's thing to remark the taste's of opponents blood, he once said gambit's blood was spicier than last time after slashing his chest.

his blood as archangel is not as "human" as it once was before alteration

OneDumbG0
Cage is more durable than people give him credit for. I was also one of those people before reading more of him post-Bendis.

Wild Shadow
the submariner that Sabe fought was a suped up version it had cyke eye blast, regeneration, TP.. and a few added gene splicing to it....

I am aware of Cage's durability and i am actually factoring them to my argument. pirate

again When sabretooth was Grappling them he used their own weight and momentum to break their bones and joints.... also i was referring to them ripping sabretooth Ada. bones through his skin via their strength lvl.

in comics strength doesnt matter too much when it comes to grappling skill... Captain america was able to toss and flip Thunderstrike easy in their training sessions and even held his own for a few panels fighting amped up bloodstrike who was a high end 100+ tonner.

Cap also was able to fight and counter guys easy with ten ton strength as well..like US.Agent

saying that Sabe can grapple and have Cage hurt himself via using his own strength and leverage isnt that hard to believe especially since i posted link showing him do just that.

ever seen guys train and practice and have their arms bend back and drop their weight and use leverage to pull it off? and in the sabe mini that was all he was doing as strong as they were they couldnt stay up right and fight. sabe used leverage and their own strength while holding their arm out in the desired position while they land on their own arm using their own strength and weight..

it had nothing to do with sabretooth strength and it is just as realistic maneuver in real life as well not just a comic feat. if we want to talk how strong Cage is he really isnt that strong either at least not to the point where Sabe would struggle to pull his arms with his two arms and position his body for tosses and drops... Cage strength and durability really doesnt add to his overall weight which sabe can still easily pull and position for his manuevers.

also your reference of how bad Sabe did when he tried to grapple Cage when was this?

also how strong is Cage now, 20 tons?

SamZED
If its adamantium ST he wins 10/10

killfrenzy
i dont get it whats so hard to understand that if its adamantium sabretooth he takes it 10/10 he is able to cut luke if its a bone claws sabretooth then cage wins 10/10

Warlord
creed gets a healthy majority with adamantium
cage gets majority without

killfrenzy
well even without adamantium i guess creed can cut his eyes and its a victory

ankur29
cage wins 10/10 against organic claw sabretooth


sabretooth 10/10 with adamantium

darthgoober
Originally posted by Wild Shadow
the submariner that Sabe fought was a suped up version it had cyke eye blast, regeneration, TP.. and a few added gene splicing to it....

I am aware of Cage's durability and i am actually factoring them to my argument. pirate

again When sabretooth was Grappling them he used their own weight and momentum to break their bones and joints.... also i was referring to them ripping sabretooth Ada. bones through his skin via their strength lvl.

in comics strength doesnt matter too much when it comes to grappling skill... Captain america was able to toss and flip Thunderstrike easy in their training sessions and even held his own for a few panels fighting amped up bloodstrike who was a high end 100+ tonner.

Cap also was able to fight and counter guys easy with ten ton strength as well..like US.Agent

saying that Sabe can grapple and have Cage hurt himself via using his own strength and leverage isnt that hard to believe especially since i posted link showing him do just that.

ever seen guys train and practice and have their arms bend back and drop their weight and use leverage to pull it off? and in the sabe mini that was all he was doing as strong as they were they couldnt stay up right and fight. sabe used leverage and their own strength while holding their arm out in the desired position while they land on their own arm using their own strength and weight..

it had nothing to do with sabretooth strength and it is just as realistic maneuver in real life as well not just a comic feat. if we want to talk how strong Cage is he really isnt that strong either at least not to the point where Sabe would struggle to pull his arms with his two arms and position his body for tosses and drops... Cage strength and durability really doesnt add to his overall weight which sabe can still easily pull and position for his manuevers.

also your reference of how bad Sabe did when he tried to grapple Cage when was this?

also how strong is Cage now, 20 tons?
Ok well what enhancement's to his durability did he have? If anything it being something of an amalgam clone actually supports it's abilities being portrayed below those of the original characters.

But their poor durability in the situation doesn't reflect on Cage. Regardless of leverage, there's no way Luke's own weight(450 lbs) is going to break his arm given his level of strength and the fact that he can be uninjured after falling off a sky scrapper...

http://a.imagehost.org/t/0598/Untitled-Scanned-11-12.jpg http://a.imagehost.org/t/0198/Untitled-Scanned-15.jpg http://a.imagehost.org/t/0401/Untitled-Scanned-16.jpg

Now the guys you mentioned may very well have had adamantium resistant skin but that doesn't mean that they're as durable as Cage all around. They may have been tougher on the outside, but that doesn't mean that they were tougher on the inside...

http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr347/darthgoober/Thunderbolts137017.jpg

Cap wasn't grappling Eric, he was tossing him around with Judo and stuff. I'm one of the biggest Cap supporters on the board and even I have no problem admitting that if Cap ever actually tried to lock up with someone that much stronger than him he'd have his ass handed to him. Hell even classic Beast(I'm talking human form) easily put Black Panther on his ass T'challa tried wrestling with him. I have no doubt that Sabretooth could throw Luke around some, but that's a little different than what you're talking about.

That's Cap, not Sabretooth. Cap's the exception, not the rule. Put Creed up against a double with 10x his strength and durability but with less skill and Creed would get his ass handed to him.

He's never done it against someone with durability like Cage. Now if Cage just stood there and LET Sabretooth do it then Sabretooth might be strong enough, but if he grabs on to Cage's arm Luke's first reaction will most likely be to slam him into the ground(or at the very least "lock" his arm). If he can grab Mr. X out of the air I'm pretty sure he's at least got the reflexes enough to do that.

Right here...
http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr347/darthgoober/PowerManIronFist084-21.jpg
http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr347/darthgoober/PowerManIronFist084-22.jpg
http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr347/darthgoober/PowerManIronFist084-23.jpg

And that was pre upgrade cage, post upgrade may very well be strong enough to crush Victor's throat in the same situation.

I'm pretty sure he was at 20 tons before his upgrade, so he should be beyond that at this point.

Wild Shadow
Cage isnt 10x stronger then sabe not even on his best day. aside from that the nervous system gun and the antman feat is pis since that is not how Lukes powerset is suppose to work at all.. and also Sabe has taken bigger falls then Cage and gotten right up...i am talking falls from planes low atmosphere type sh#$...
either way Lukes inside arent that Tough and shouldnt be. his Upgrade wasnt his internal durability but his actual strength lvl.. even if we assume his insides are tougher now it wasnt enough all it did was allow him to not get ko'ed and he struggled from the blast anyways..

figured the sabe cage fight was the early version of sabe b4 his retcons and added abilities b4 he was turned into a wolverine foe.

darthgoober
Originally posted by Wild Shadow
Cage isnt 10x stronger then sabe not even on his best day. aside from that the nervous system gun and the antman feat is pis since that is not how Lukes powerset is suppose to work at all.. and also Sabe has taken bigger falls then Cage and gotten right up...i am talking falls from planes low atmosphere type sh#$...
either way Lukes inside arent that Tough and shouldnt be. his Upgrade wasnt his internal durability but his actual strength lvl.. even if we assume his insides are tougher now it wasnt enough all it did was allow him to not get ko'ed and he struggled from the blast anyways..

figured the sabe cage fight was the early version of sabe b4 his retcons and added abilities b4 he was turned into a wolverine foe.
I never said Cage was 10x stronger than Sabretooth, but US Agent is easily 10x stronger than Cap. Point was, Sabretooth's not Cap.

Cage has also had a bomb go off inside his stomach I believe, so it's not like it's the only time his insides have been portrayed as being super durable. His organs aren't as durable as his skin just as your's and mine aren't, but they're far more durable than those of the average man.

I never said Sabretooth hadn't taken bigger falls, I was pointing out one of several reasons it's rediculous to think that Cage's arm could be broken by him falling on it.

Proof that his insides AREN'T super durable to counter the direct evidence that they are? I know it's not normally cool to ask for proof of a negative, but without it you're basically just imposing your own idea of what you think the character SHOULD be capable of, and that's hardly a reflection on what he IS capable of. And him resisting an attack like that(and the bomb I brough up earlier) is simply proof that his insides are super durable, what proof do you have from the super soldier's to indicate that they could survive the same?

Wild Shadow
i never claimed their insides werent super durable just as likely resistant compared to their strength minus the skin density..

Cage on the other hand has bn severely injured from blunt trauma needing surgery in order to repair him even IF has had to Use his chi on him as well to fix him..

doctors have only needed adamantium scalpel or even high lasers to open him up once open his inisdes or no more durable then maybe a enhanced person but nothing doctors cant operate on with standard tools.. aside from that his powerset itself claim his limits and abilities which those scans comic feats ignored.

aside from that it doesnt matter how strong a person is individually if a person lands wrong their own strength, leverage, gravity and physical limits will take care of the rest... especially when a person rips tears or hyper extent their own joints... it isnt that hard to grasp nor im[possible it happens all the time and various heroes have done that to guys far above luke cages strength and at time durability... spider fighting Hyde springs to mind when he webbed him just the right angle leaving Hyde vulnerable and worried of injuring himself with his own strength weight and leverage he was afraid not to move..

oops my bad it was Scorpion but my point still stands.

darthgoober
Originally posted by Wild Shadow
i never claimed their insides werent super durable just as likely resistant compared to their strength minus the skin density..

Cage on the other hand has bn severely injured from blunt trauma needing surgery in order to repair him even IF has had to Use his chi on him as well to fix him..

doctors have only needed adamantium scalpel or even high lasers to open him up once open his inisdes or no more durable then maybe a enhanced person but nothing doctors cant operate on with standard tools.. aside from that his powerset itself claim his limits and abilities which those scans comic feats ignored.

aside from that it doesnt matter how strong a person is individually if a person lands wrong their own strength, leverage, gravity and physical limits will take care of the rest... especially when a person rips tears or hyper extent their own joints... it isnt that hard to grasp nor im
Are these incidents you're refering to of Cage's injuries from before or after his upgrade?

So doctor's need either an adamantium scalple or high intensity lasers to cut Cage... kinda blows Sabretooth cutting Cage without adamantium claws all to Hell doesn't it? Anyway, you want to compare the number of times his insides have been portrayed as less than super durable to the number of times they've been portrayed as being so? I'll start fetching scans if you will...

If Hyde was tangling with Spidey, I'm willing to bet that it was far from his best showings as far as durability goes. After all, Hyde's level fluctuate's as much as anyone's and more than most. You keep on coming up with these people who lack Cage's extensively fleshed out feats of all around durability as if they're relevant to Cage but I'm afraid that's not the case.

And if you mean it was Scorpion not Hyde, it REALLY doesn't prove you're point as Scorpion doesn't even have Hyde's high end durability feats going for him.

Deadline
Originally posted by Wild Shadow


aside from that it doesnt matter how strong a person is individually if a person lands wrong their own strength, leverage, gravity and physical limits will take care of the rest... especially when a person rips tears or hyper extent their own joints... it isnt that hard to grasp nor im

facepalm

Rage.Of.Olympus
Sabertooth isn't cutting Luke Cage. Definitely not with his regular claws. Under Bendis, in the Avenger's there was apparently doubt that Wolverine with his Adamantium claws could cut Cage when they met. His gotten a pretty decent push. Luke Cage is like Bendis' pet.

Sabertooth might be able to wear him down with his blows etc. but I personally don't see it happening or him hurting Cage much right now. His definitely faster and more skilled but eventually he has to come in close and Bendis Cage puts him out of his misery.

Luke Cage is an alright character, but man, someone needs to tell Bendis just "no". Enough of Cage, and Spider-Woman etc. These characters no one actually gives a shit about from what I've seen. Not when characters like Wonderman need a push, and have pretty decent potential. We get it Bendis, his black, he talks smack and he doesn't need a uniform.

Battlehammer
This fight would last forever.

Wild Shadow
then Cage would tire out and it be over for cage shifty

Battlehammer
lol

Wild Shadow
Originally posted by Battlehammer
lol i wont budge, even with ppl trying to suggest his durability is a lot higher then it once was and even trying to insinuate he maybe resistant to adamantium. cool

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Wild Shadow
i wont butch, even with ppl trying to suggest his durability is a lot higher then it once was and even trying to insinuate he maybe resistant to adamantium. cool
It deffiently not adamantium resistant. He was damage before by explosions and if not mistaken with operated on with adamatiun knifes and needles. He also was killed by being slashed and stabbed in enemy of the state what if which diverges from 616 time line right after wolverine is mind wiped. Though it not cannon it gives you an idea of what would happen if adamatium came against his skin.

Deadline
Originally posted by Wild Shadow
i wont budge,

It just shows how dense you are, theres nothing admirable about it. Not sure if anybody was REALLy trying to say hes adamantuim resistant just that he might be.

Wild Shadow
it has nothing to do with one's density on a subject but willingness to share one's opinion and let others know that is how he views it. aside from that i am fully aware of Cage's abilities and it doesnt change my opinion which is just as valid as anyone elses.

Deadline
Originally posted by Wild Shadow
it has nothing to do with one's density on a subject but willingness to share one's opinion and let others know that is how he views it. aside from that i am fully aware of Cage's abilities and it doesnt change my opinion which is just as valid as anyone elses.

Its up to you to decide what you want to think but the logic you use is pretty hilarious (Comparing scorpion to Luke for starters) any credible debator can see that. Im just too tired to point it out in detail. Assuming you're always right doesn't make you a genuis anybody can do that.

Wild Shadow
Originally posted by Deadline
Its up to you to decide what you want to think but the logic you use is pretty hilarious (Comparing scorpion to Luke for starters) any credible debator can see that. Im just too tired to point it out in detail. Assuming you're always right doesn't make you a genuis anybody can do that. i am not claiming i am anymore right then anyone else. that is not the point of debating anyways but to learn and try to get others to see from their point of view. do i think Cage can beat Sabretooth? yes i do. i just think Sabretooth can beat him more often.

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