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I was at another forum and saw this thread and thought its a really good one, If flash went crazy completely crazy and just started killing people who excluding cosmic beings and magic users could stop him? Keep in mind he moves faster than thought so telepathy wouldnt work either. Also this is wally going all out with no morality.

And with two knifes? Please include the knifes!

He would probably kill most of them in thirty-five seconds.

If that happens, call in the Bat, he has a plan when any of the JL members go rouge, I think he has the best chance.

Yeah, but Flash would probably realize that in half a nanosecond and kill Batman during the first three seconds. (That makes Batman the 368th guy he eliminates. )

yea but considering flashes speed and this happening out of no where, would batman have time to act?

Batman is dead before he knows it.

There's a difference between having a plan to stop someone and going head to head with them. Geeze, people. Anyway, Wonder Woman beat Flash in League of One. There are other speedsters they could call in. Superman is almost as fast as Flash. Green Lantern's power ring would protect him from Flash's attacks. He wouldn't even be able to see Martian Manhunter, thanks to invisibility. Flash would be smacked down. And Flash does get tired, you know--he literally collapsed after evacuating a town durring some JLA story.

And it's a matter of record that Flash is not immune to telepathy. That alien probe went into his mind telepathically and made him forget how to slow down durring another JLA story.

Oooh, what if he would be the Kingdom Come Flash?

No, really, probably they could stop him. (I mean normal Flash)

KC Flash owns all.

These instances you mentioned like wonder woman, flash wasnt a rouge hell bent on killing was he? And green lantern isnt faster than thought so how can he make a armor set up before flash pummels him to death, Manhunter yea thats true though, Superman also would be a big problem. But these fights are not all at the same time i mean one on one.

People who are invulnerable like Juggernaut won't be taken down, characters who can become intangible like Shadowcat or Manhunter wouldn't be affected, reality manipulators like Franklin and Proteus would beat Flash down.

I think GL could take him.

Batman has beaten the Flash in hand to hand combat in the comics before.

Yeah but thats the comics. Does not mean he actually can.

I belive Batman's will can over come the Flash, I would think Bats would be the man to bring down the Flash.

When the Joker was dealing with the JL in Wild Card.

When the super heros were fighting the card gang(Working for the Joker)

Which guy got to the Joker and defeated him??

Superman, nope
Flash, nope
Wonder Woman nope
Man Hunter again nope

It was Batman that took out the Joker while the other members were being driving insane by Ace.

And was Flash a killer maniac? No.

I'm not sure. Flash is fast which can be bad for the bats. Although I would rather see batman win. I'm not sure he could or not.

In Identity Crisis #3 Deathstroke Took out flash which kinda surprized me and I know Bats is not as Leathal and Slade but I could See Batman doing something insane to stop Wally.

I know someone who would probably beat Flash, they are from marvel though. Its Nightcrawler.

*Cough*Hulk*cough*

flash could vibrate through hulk

Nightcrawler is not fast enough to teleport from Flash. If Flash was actually killing everyone he would'nt waste his time fighting them he would just vibrate through them and take out their heart.

far as i know juggernaut wouldnt be hurt i think flash would try to vibrate through him n fail miserably.

same with the asgardian destroyer.

Wally now wears a costume made of concentrated speed force energy. Unable to wait for both broken legs to heal and inspired by a then-recent Justice League case, he gained enough control over the speed force to create a costume which would support him and enable him to run despite his injury (Flash #131, 1997).

Overview: There is little doubt today that Wally West is considered to be one of the fastest living things on the face of the Earth. There are a few superhumans who can sustain levels of superhuman speed on par with the Flash. Superman, Captain Marvel, and Impulse can reach speeds that can compare with the Flash, but few other than Impulse have the wide range of powers available to the Flash.

After Wally's adjustment, Wally's powers began to increase and eventually approach their previous levels. Recently, Wally West has reached new speed plateaus and is actually believed to have passed beyond into the Speed Dimension, the now-believed source of many speedsters powers. After his cross-over into this dimension, Wally seemed to possess all of the powers of his predecessors and a range of abilities never before exhibited by any Flash.

Powers:

Speed Force Aura: The Flash's body is surrounded by what he calls his "speed force aura". This aura protects him and anyone who is running with him or carried by him, from the effects of using his speed. This includes friction and airborne particulate matter. It may also protect him from injury from high speed impacts such as punches he delivers and receives from his opponents. He does seem to possess some level of superhuman resistance to injury but this does not extend far past normal physical interactions, as received from normal combat.

Molecular Control: The Flash's powers allow him to perform a number of speed-related feats. The Flash has always possessed the ability to control his speed and angular momentum at the MOLECULAR level, and control his molecular interactions to allow his body to pass through any substance. There have been only a few superdense materials that the Flash has not been able to penetrate with this power. Certain forcefields also seem to negate this power. His power allow him to run along the surface of bodies of water and up the sides of buildings.

Increased Perceptions: The Flash possesses the ability to alter his perceptions so that falling objects can appear to be standing still and can be caught and moved back to their normal position. He can do this so quickly as to have it happen invisibly to the normal human eye. The Flash's reaction time is so increased as to perform feats of speed such as removing the momentum from bullets and fast moving objects thrown at him or at others.

Supercharged Brain Activity: The Flash's mental abilities are also increased in speed, simple computations can be done at lightning speeds, and his ability to perform normal feats at increased speeds has allow him to build hundreds of force field generators in a matter of hours, move sandbags to cover a beach or search an entire area for something as small as a paper clip. Wally can also read as superspeed, but rarely takes advantage of his ability to learn at increased speeds, although, Jay Garrick has done so and has become a jack of all trades in several disciplines and languages.

Super Speed Running: It appears that the Flash may run at any speed that he thinks is possible, but there may be physical limits to his speed. Theorectically, speeds greater than Mach 10, are dangerous to the people and to the environment. This speed would still be the equivalent to approximately 128 miles per second; allowing him to cross the United States in about 23 seconds, or circle the world in about 3 minutes. The Flash rarely achieves such speed in populated areas due to the effects of sonic disruptions and air displacements. His cruising speeds are probably around 90-150 miles per hour (1.5 - 2.5 miles per second). This is fast enough to move through most cities and around people without causing too much disruption to the population and slow enough for him to register everything he sees clearly. If he choses, Wally can approach the speed of light, and doing so, enters the Speed Force dimension. If he chooses to continue to run at light speed, he can use the Speed Force dimension for a form of haphazard Time Travel.

Sharing the Force: Since his interaction with the Speed Force, he may also lend his speed and angular momentum to another object or person. This may allow others to run alongside with the Flash. He may still allow his molecular structure to pass through object but now after he passes through an object, the object is now supercharged with a chaotic energy, and explodes seconds after his passing through it. His range of powers seems to have been increased significantly and he is now the fastest Flash to have ever lived. If he shares the Speed Force with another meta with superspeed capabilities such as Superman, that metahuman can now exceed the speed of light but does not become aware of the Speed Dimension.

Speed Feats: The Flash can also perform a variety of superspeed feats such as:
He can strike a single opponent hundreds of times in a second or multiple opponents two or three times in a second.

He can disarm, or jam any number of opponents weapons before they are even aware of his movement.

Hurl small projectiles at hypersonic velocities.

Pluck speeding projectiles from the air.

The creation of wind based vortecies that can act as barriers to movement, funnels for toxic gasses, or vacuum chambers.

He can spin his arms to create directed funnels of hurricane speed air that can knock down barriers or reduce the speed of a falling object. Now with his control of inertia, he can probably reduce the speed of a falling object directly by applying the speed force in reverse, to leech momemtum from the object.

He can run across bodies of water, up the sides of buildings, and by spinning like a helicopter, he can even perform a limited kind of flight. Since his power is a quantum/molecular phenomenon, it is theoretically possible for the Flash to be able to fly just as other metas do, (and there have been other flying speedsters in the past, such as the deceased Johnny Quick,) because he can control his absolute molecular energy and direction and force it in the direction he wished to move without running.
He can also impart molecular energy to a target to increase molecular movement, as he did against the water being called Flow, boiling him into steam for a short time

Those info are from hyperborea.org and STARNET Metahuman Database.

He's not a god-lik being like in Kingdom Come, but with his powers, if he goes mad, not crazy, and wants to kill the Earth heroes he can.
How can you attack something you cannot see?
GL, Wonder Woman, Plastic Man, Batman, gets killed.
Superman and Martian Manhunter?He can vibrate through them and make them explode.Can't he?

Yes

omg...i always knew flash was reaaly powerful....but duuude....this guy could take out ALOT of ppl in a very short amount of time.....does n e one have any more info on KC flash?
sounds koool...

KC flash like exists on all dimensions at once and he patrols keystone city at all times hes so fast hes constantly vibrating or something becuase hes red and translucent. Im of course not reading this from something this is just what i remember. I remember reading like hes too fast to be stuck on one plane of existence, so thats pretty badass.

batman and mabe wonderwoman gets killed, i agree with that, but superman and green lantern? i highly doubt it, green lantern can erect a force field around himself that the flash can niether pass nor vibrate through, and super man, i just dont think that flash could vibrate through him and make a being as powerful as superman{not just physically} "explode"

And only Superman can hear Kingdom come Flash talking.

I think.

He was able to pull Norman McCay out from another dimension when he was basically an ghost.

but does he have the shield up ALL the time??? if he doesnt... i believe the question is could he erect the shield FASTER than flash can get to him??? how would he even know when flash was comming?? i dont think he would know what hit him... literally.

u dont realize how gay flash is until some guy talks about him

My, God.

I just realized how gay YOU are.

guys please.... be nice.

I am very nice guy.

(Just not to idiots)

actually, if there is a writer that can fully explore the flash's ability we would learn that he should be able to beat anyone.

flash fact #1: he has mach punches. all he has to do is swing his arms at whatever mach he chooses and the resulting shockwave can dust anything. that would be eqivalent to when those big guns like superman,hulk or grundy does that sonic hand clap thing.and thats if flash chooses not to hit somebody. i remember in a really old school issue of barry Allen racing superman across the world they chopped down a few trees to help out some loggers and flash leveled half a forrest with a few karate chops.

Flash fact #2: according to coventional science whenever an object approaches the speed of light, its mass increases to infinty. and whatever it collides with will be met the the force of infinty.(think, getting hit with a bullet thats thrown at you, and a bullet thats shot at you) In fact flash has used this trick before, in the first issue of the current JLA series. the trade is New World Order vol.1

so unless he's completely taken by surprise, which is impossible, or some writer apporaches with stark fanboyism and believe that just becuase a charcter is stronger he's gonna beat him, flash can beat anybody period.

Not really. A reality warper could alter their speed and reaction time to what it is flash has. Other beings are near the speed of flash but indesctrubile and with more powers like superman, silver surfer, gladiator etc. Cosmic beings are simply out of his class aswell.



Im pretty sure that comics are not in accordance with conventional science. How do you even expect to explain how Flash's body can take punishment under such speeds or even continue to exist? The speed force is a pretty lousy explanation. Its a given that reality is suspended within comic books.

good one , thas what ive been sayin for ages, dont look at physics too much in comics, and anyway if your talkni about conventional science, ud also know that when the object's mass gets to infinite, time stops around it, n when it reaches speeds of over the speed of light, the mass goes beyond infinte n the universe cant hold it since its greater than the critical limit of the universe n the object travels through time, u cant expect flash to hit things while hes travellin through time can u, because he wont be in the same reality anymore{according to conventional science

and anyway, while looking at things that are "in accordance with conventional science" the ,mach punches dont make any sense, there are two very simple rules in physics, the first being newton's third law of motion{every action has an equal and opposite reaction}, lets say that if flash creates a shockwave from mach punches that can create enough force to destroy a whole forest then the reaction force from that will be equal to the applied force, meanind that the flash would be hit back{more accuractely the the hand flash mach punched with} by the same amount of force that destroyed a whole forest, do u think that flash could really survive that. the second is impulse, which is the amount of force u get because of the length of time over which that force was delivered, simply mass*velocity, well if flash mach punches at the speeds he is capable of{lets say the speed of light}, then the impulse would be so damn great that id be surprised if it doesnt make superman unconcious!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!, let alone flash. but since these are comics, we shouldnt look at PHYSICS too much.

Physics isn't totally applicated in comic books, but the mass increasing at infinity trick has been used by Flash on various occasions, against the HyperClan speedster he use it to hit him with a so strong punch that the martian land in Africa from Asia.

yea but thas crap though isnt it, if his mass increased to infinite, time would stop, n u cant punch things which are frozen in time, secondly even if by some miracle that was possible{which it isnt} i dont think that the martian would land in africa, i think hed be punched out of existance or somethingg, scondly what happens to flash when the reaction of infinite force hits him{and considering that it hits in no time at all what kinda impulse would that generate}

he certainly wouldnt end up in africa.

He was send from Asia and in the table where is shown is bod flying and starting to fall down he's near Africa.Anyway Flash's punch make him crossing a great distance and knockdown him for a long time.

yes but if someone was punched with INFINITE force, id think that theyll end up a helluva lot further than the distance between asia and africa.

lol yea theyd just like disintigrate

yes they will disintigrate, Can the Flash relly do this?

Look at teh post a few above me, he can and has done that.

whoa whoa dudes, first off ive always been one of the few on these threads who try to steer ppl away from referencing "real" scince. i only said "according" to conventional science about the whole speed of light thing. cuz according to "conevtional" science objects mass would increae to infinty once they reach the speed of light, ergarless of whether or not time slows or stops around them.

besides i wasnt talking about mach punches in that sense. but of course it all isnt real dude, its just comic science, i was elaborating on what they have shown flash doing, not my own speculation. we've seen him travel at the speed of light all the time, and as ive mentioned ive seen him chop down half o forrest w/his bare hands.

I believe that GL's ring protects him automatically; he doesn't have to do anything.

a testament to why Hal is the greatest lantern he was the first one t program his ring with that feature, and to translate all languages, spectral scanner, and a universal calculator.

Hal rocks!

im talking about realistically. The concept of the flash itself is obviously completely unrealistic though.

You referenced it to suggest the additional possibilities for his powers, to which im saying his powers simply arent actually possible. One trip anywhere near the speed of light and hed cease to exist.

wasn't the ATOM orginally written to have super speed also?

Depends on if they know Wally went rouge. He wouldn't be able to hurt a few heroes but only about Bart would be able to actually catch up to him to fight him.

If Wally just went rouge, Bats would die, and ring be off any GL's finger before they knew what happened.

very true those characters wouldnt know what hit em.

and to reply to GRIMM THING .. i dont know about Atom but i know for a fact hes not powered by the Speed Force.

Atom could possibly beat him. Cause he can go as small as he wants, and Wally wouldn't even know he was around, and go into his brain, and kill him. Like he did during Rock of Ages storyline in JLA when Green Arrow shot an arrow he was on towards Darkseid.

found this cool old cover.........Atom was probably fast but obviosly not FLASH fast........

well maybe Atom could kill him if he Flash stoped at the same place and time as atom and then took his time ordering a pizza or something.

and from the looks of that Comic Cover it dosent look like Atom would escaped that blob With out Flash's speed. (oh and thats Barry Allen) on that Cover.

Flash could defeat the majority of superheroes.

Flash is perhaps along with ElasticMan the most underrated JLA member.
Truth is if he really knew the full extent of his abilities which are godlike. he would own even Supes. His potential are exponential.

"he would own even Supes" i hardly doubt that

yes flash is faster than sups what sups ain't no slow poke , flash can never beat superman.

WW - her power but even greater
Flash- HIs speed but lower
heat vision , hearing , can fly

i see no way flash can beat man of steel.

It's possible to use the Speedforce's raw power to increase all of your abilities. Supes heat vision, breath, and flight would be gone cuz Flash would create a vacuum that would suck out the oxygen around him leaving those abilities useless. So now the playing field is leveled.

He might be able to vibrate thru the Hulk, or Wonder Woman, or whatever, but he will not be able to vibrate thru Juggernaut. Juggy almost always has this magical shield in addition to his invulnerable hide. That's what saved him from Thor's full power blast in the team up battle with New Warriors. He said it kinda tickled or something like that. I'm not a Superman friend or genius here, but doesn't Supes have some kind of skin tight shield or something like that? I don't know if he still has it or not, but I'll let DC fanboys elaborate on that. Flash will come running near full speed and go splat like a mosquito on a car windshield is what I see happening. Flash can beat a majority of heroes, but Juggy? Supes? C'mon, theoretically he could do it, but we know that's bull$^&t.

"He might be able to vibrate thru the Hulk, or Wonder Woman, or whatever, but he will not be able to vibrate thru Juggernaut. Juggy almost always has this magical shield in addition to his invulnerable hide. That's what saved him from Thor's full power blast in the team up battle with New Warriors. He said it kinda tickled or something like that. I'm not a Superman friend or genius here, but doesn't Supes have some kind of skin tight shield or something like that? I don't know if he still has it or not, but I'll let DC fanboys elaborate on that. Flash will come running near full speed and go splat like a mosquito on a car windshield is what I see happening. Flash can beat a majority of heroes, but Juggy? Supes? C'mon, theoretically he could do it, but we know that's bull$^&t."

nicely put.

the info u provided Sentry clearly says that the man has control of his body on a molecualr level.My GOD man!!!! doesn't that mean anything to you? Where has it ever mentioned Supes having this skin tight whatever? I never heard of it?

Man superman's aura is like standard comic book knowledge. They needed it to explain why he is so ridiculously powerful and where superboy powers come from. It is impenetrable. This what if tread is good. But we should give every one the time to discover the flash has gone rogue. Like they did in JSA when Jay Garrick had to take out a speedster, a bunch of people died but Garrick triumph in the end. otherwise this could be if what if batman went rogue and no one knew or martian manhunter or even plastic man. They would kill everyone because no one would expect it. Now I imagine wally causing all this carnage on earth. Well the JLA would be on the moon, so any of those heroes could take him out. Wonder Woman, Manitou Raven(JLE--and God only knows where there little clubhouse is at), batman/plasticman, coldcast, greenlantern, of course superman and martian manhunter. Flash is very powerful, but he can be beaten because, unlike all the ones, Ijust named he is too one-dimensional. i.e. his weakness is his own power. He's impulsive. If he was a killer, he would just be a compulsive killer.

Oh and i put plastic man with batman, because plastic mand and the huntress took out the future flash from the jla 1 million with relative ease.

Are you serious......THESE PEOPLE ARE NOT REAL. What happens in the comics IS their reality!

I disagree. It doesn't just take people like Doomsday to best Supes impenetrable aura or not I don't give a sh**. Wally because of what I stated earlier would take Supes out if he really knew the full extent of his powers period. And just for the record Flash is not just a little faster than Supe screw that bogus race. He is a speedster and that's what he does period.

To my knowledge, Flash has only done the infinite mass punch once against another speedster because he was siphoning off their speed.

people keep underrating everybody in JLA except for Supes and Bats I mean c'mon folks. The Flash jokes around cuz that's his nature but if serious could whup crazy ass!!

Hey people. Go see the "Michael Myers vs Jason vs Freddy: a lil surprise" thread! Trust me, it'll be worth it!

And they usually overestimate Bats. I still think Wally could be stopped but it'll take another speedster who can do anything he can like Bart.

If Flash just decided to start getting rid of everyone, just out of the blue, he could destroy pretty much the entirety of the superheros in the DC universe. They would have no idea what he was up to. It's not "Flash vs. everyone trying to destroy him" it's Flash vs people who think he's their ally. He could defeat Superman in this way. He could defeat Batman and Martian Manhunter and GL in this way. THEY DO NOT KNOW HE WANTS TO KILL THEM. That gives him every advantage in this scenario. If you add Marvel characters into the mix, this theory doesn't really work out, but even still, there aren't that many who could do anything about it.

Supes aura is vulnerable to extended, super powered beatings, energy draining (characters with abilities like Surfer), magic (extradimensional energy), and spirit/life force energy (posessions, soul ebbing, "The Source", etc). If Flash could hit him billions of times at maximum velocity before Supes knew what was going on, he might be able to exhaust the strength of Supes' biomatrix field to make him vulnerable like Doomsday did. It would be very hard for Flash considering his physical strength is low, but his impact velocity would be immense. Also, he could steal Supes speed by using reverse speed force on him and slowing his momentum to a crawl while simultaneously hyper light speed blitzing him and weakening his biomatrix.

It could be done, even though unlikely.

Kryptonite

I don't know if this statement is gonna cause waves, but I'd think Spawn would have a better shot at beating the likes of Juggs and Superman because I remember one issue where Spawn like teleported into this dude's body and then burst out of him. Made a huge mess. Can Flash do something like that w/ his molecular control? But I still say Supes and Juggs could kill Spawn