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ok this fight would be good imo. people need protection before they hit penance and ww might not know that so she hits penence and cutd her self and penance doesn't even feel it. so ww's strength wouldn't work. who wins??

I say penance cause she will still cause damage even though she is gettin hit

No contest. So what if WW gets cut when she hits Penace. One Class 100 punch and Penace is out like a light.

Penance is hard to touch, but she still is in every sense a frail. Wonder Woman might cut herself, but the blow she inflicts will knock Penance out.

penance doesn't really feel anythinf because she is made of diamond, and she is also durable

You are thinking of Emma in her other form. Penance has a hardened body, but it doesn't stop her from getting a concussion.

Diamond or not. WW's strength is way too much for her. Add her faster than sound superspeed, flight, indestructible bracelets and lasso, and her uncanny fighting prowess and Penance goes down very easily.

yeah ur right

Since when is Penance frail? Her molecular structure is atrophied, that means she's as durable as diamond without being as brittle. Wonder Woman's strength and speed don't matter when the tendons and nerves in her hands are getting shredded. Penance doesn't have to be as fast as her opponent, she just has to wait while WW pounds on her and tears up her own hands, then cut her up with her fingers.

thats why i put these two together because penence is durable and won't really feel it so why ww hits her ww also hurts herself

The hell? Do you honestly believe that a Class 100 character with powers to rival Superman will actually lose against Penance? The argument is incredibly flawed. Do really think that WW is stupid enough to keep hitting Penance while her flesh gets teared away? Please! WW would either A) stop hitting her with her fists and instead use her FEET or B) use her superspeed to suck the air out of her lungs. There's hundreds of ways WW could defeat Penance. Penance is incredibly outclassed.

Why does nobody give WW the respect she deserves?

...Or he just drops an skyscraper on her.

Exactly. Durable my @$$. She's Class 5 according to the Marvel Encyclopedia. Which is "Bulletproof".

wonder woman has been hinted to be bullet proof. or just plain invulnerable. she would need only one good shot to put penance down. A better fight would be penance versus x-23

She's hard to touch, but that doesn't mean she can take a hit. Penance has taken down a true sasquatch not because she can withstand the creature's hits, but because she evaded his attacks and was primarily offensive in the fight. I think she was knocked down before by a lesser strength character (I think M).

Of course she was knocked DOWN, she isn't super strong. Being knocked down doesn't mean you've been hurt, though. And dodging blows doesn't mean she's vulnerable, it just means she doesn't want to get slowed down.

Which does nothing to prove that she is capable to take on WW. A flick of her wrist, and all of sudden Penance finds that she cannot breathe with the lasso around her neck.

And ten bucks her magic lasso, used as a whip, can pierce Penance's hide. It worked on way more durable foes (i.e. Mongul, Superman)

Who says she even needs to breathe? Her body is ATROPHIED. It's a miracle she can even move at all. Look at Colossus, whose entire body turns to organic steel, he doesn't have to eat or breathe.

He lasso is magical, that explains why it hurts Superman. Are you saying Mongul's skin is tougher than diamond? If so, why was Green Lantern able to beat the hell out of him with a sledge hammer when Superman returned?

Once again, Mongul beat WW in the CARTOON. The breathing argument is conceded. However, her durability is not as strong as you think. The Official Marvel Dictionary rates her not as invulnerable but only bulletproof.


Her lasso is magical. So....conceivably is can pierce Penance's skin. The lasso was powerful enough to decapitate an Imperiux armour probe. Which was WAYYYY tougher than Penance's skin.po

It's really a no brainer. Against a Class 100 character with powers to rival Superman, Penance doesn't stand a chance in hell.

Uhh, I'm not sure why you're bringing up the cartoon. I didn't say Mongul beat up WW, I said Green Lantern did. With a sledge hammer. Which was my way of proving that his skin is not as durable as diamond.

Sorry I got it confused with another thread.

Of course, GL beat Mongul with a sledgehammer. The most powerful weapon in the world vs. Mongul. No contest. The sledgehammer was backed by willpower.

Mongul got thrown in to a sun. He's been nuked. He's far more durable than diamond.

Actually, the ring would have had no effect on him. He's yellow. That's why Hal took such a mean beating putting him down.

I'm referring to Kyle Rayner. Anyway, back on topic, Penance kicks her ugly mute @$$ kicked.

this fight could go either way

No way in hell. I've seen only how Penance can WITHSTAND her attacks. But not how PENANCE could ACTUALLY WIN.

you can't fight if your bleeding to death

You're assuming that Wonder Woman is stupid enough to continuously hit Penance with her fists if she's getting hurt in the process.

A whipcrack of her lasso or a faster than sound Class 100 punch will take Penance out. This is not even a debate.

k penance is durble and she is a lot faster than anyone gives her credit for

She has enhanced speed. Is she as fast as WW? Not a chance. Is Penance durable enough to withstand WW's hits? Not a chance. Diamonds are hard but not unbreakable.


WW's lasso was able to pierce the Imperiux Armour. Penance's skin is no contest.

Fine. Wonder Woman throws just one high velocity punch at Penance. Do you KNOW what happens when you punch somethign harder than you are with sharp edges as hard as you can? Your hand gets ****ed up. Nerve damage, bleeding, maybe broken but at least badly bruised knuckles. For the rest of this fight, Wonder Woman has to deal with this excruciating pain coming from her hand. Wonder Woman can try choking her, but using the lasso one handed isn't gonna be fun and it won't work anyways. Using the lasso as a whip isn't guaranteed to work, because Penance doesn't have any special vulnerability to magic. Meanwhile, the second she gets close enough to Penance, it only takes one burst of speed and WW is gutted.


Yup. Good thing Penance isn't made of diamond. Her body as the same HARDNESS as diamond, the same durability, but none of the brittleness. WW isn't going to be shattering Penance.

kell said it all

Sweet Jesus. Your bias against DC is staggering. Who says WW cannot pierce Penance's skin? Superman has shattered diamonds before. Even She-Hulk. Ten bucks WW can. The lasso pierced Imperiux's armour. That should say enough. You're completely underestimating WW. One whipcrack of her lasso and Penance goes down. Penance has Level 5 durability. She's bulletproof. That's it. She's not completely invulnerable. She's far from it. WW has nigh invulnerability. I seriously doubt that Penance's sharp edges can even pierce her skin. Penance would not be able to land a single blow to WW. Her armour is magically endowed. It cannot be pierced.

It's really quite sad. WW is completely on another level. WW has thousands of years of experience. Near Superman level strength and invulnerability, and faster than sound superspeed. Diamond? So what. Ten bucks she one punch is all she needs. She managed to destroy (and pierce) several Imperiux probes whose armour is far more durable than Penance's skin. Any blow that Penance tries to inflict will be deflected by WW's bracelets. WW can also use her bracelets as weapons. Hell, if she wants Diana can open a hidden compartment in her belt and unleash the Lansarian technology. Penance gets owned.

Sweet Jesus it's funny watching you get this worked up over a fictional character.


I do.


Wonder Woman isn't Superman and Penance isn't diamond. What's your point?


Actually, it doesn't say anything. I've had no idea what you're talking about when you repeatedly bring that up.


An you're completely underestimating Penance. I don't think the lasso is strong enough, on it's own, to hurt Penance. It could hurt Superman because he's culnerable to magic, and it hurt Mongul because that mook can get beat down by a friggin SLEDGEHAMMER.


Diamond hard blades with razor sharp edges? Oh yeah, Wonder Woman will be fiiiine... Penance only needs one blow. No JLA character with the exception of Flash goes through a fight without being hit at least once.


All of which makes her horribly overconfident against one tiny little red skinned girl wearing leather. Besides, she isn't like the Flash, whipping around her opponents at superspeed. Her speed is limited to very very short bursts.

She-Hulk has shattered diamonds when she was class 75. WW is Class 100. No contest.

The lasso has pierced Imperiux's armour. His armour was impenetrable. Superman's blows couldn't pierce it. GL couldn't pierce it. Hell a nuclear blast couldn't pierce it. Not only did the lasso pierce the armour, it damn well shattered it.

Penance is a subpar fighter. WW has superhuman reflexes, superspeed, nigh-invulnerability, and eons of fighting experience. Penance would be moving at snail's pace to her. Her armour is magically endowed. By Zeus no less. Diamond claws ain't getting through.

WW is never overconfident. She knows better than to underestimate an opponent.

WW has raced the Flash several times. There is no "short bursts". I have no idea where you got that from. She can move at Mach 10 if she wishes.

This is no debate. You're just denying the truth.

Good for She-Hulk. What you aren't seeming to understand is that Penance isn't crystallized carbon. She isn't a crystal at all, thus she isn't going to be shattered. Her body, on the hardness scale, is at least equal with diamond. This does not mean she is prone to shattering.


Well it wasn't THAT impenetrable, now, was it???


Yeah... but she's MEAN! And quick. Wouldn't hesitate to gut WW the first chance she got.


All of which gets considerably dulled when she's got a torn open fist.


She's just below Superman fighting a little girl with weird hair who won't ven be standing in a proper fighting stance when they meet. Wonder Woman has no reason to suspect Penance is about to kick her ass.


Starnet Database. It's a source you yourself have cited when talking about Wonder Woman's power.


It feels like a debate to me. I'm denying YOUR truths. You're denying mine. Thats how this thing works, except we're both too stubborn to give in.

If Penance is equal to that of diamond than she can be shattered. Please.

Do you even know who Imperiux is? I'm arguing with a child. Imperiux is DC's Galactus. The destroyer of galaxies. Do really think that if WW's lasso can pierce an armour that withstood the combined assault of the Darkseid and Superman, than Penance's skin cannot be pierced?

So Penance has emotional problems. So what? She's nowhere near as fast as WW. Any blow would be deflected by her bracelets (which she can use as weapons), and her armour is magically endowed by Zeus. It's nearly impenetrable. Not even Zauriel's sword could pierce it.

"She's just below Superman" That's the key sentence. WW usually lassos her enemies first. (she's a pacifist after all). The lasso can not only force people to tell the truth but it can force them to do anything the wielder of the lasso wishes. WW lassoes her. She commands her to surrender. Penance surrenders.

I have comical reference. You have a profile. Don't waste your time.

This isn't a debate. It's like trying to teach mathematics to cow. You have no argument. Just sarcasm and zero facts.

Also, WW has the Lansarian technology. She can summon a huge Wonderdome the size of a city. If she's harmed, the Lansarian technology will automatically heal her. Not to mention the Lansarian technology can teleport in any weapon and/or armour she desires.

You aren't understadning the idea that diamond gets shattered because it's a brittle crystalline structure, are you? Oh well, I'll keep saying it until you uderstand it.


I go no diea who he is. I sorta already admitted that, ya know? I'm not a child, I just don't read as much DC as you so obviously do.


Well I OBVIOUSLY believe that or I wouldn't still be arguing this. For all we know, the armor was vulnerable to Olympian magic. OR magic period.


She doesn't need to be as fast, she has to catch her off guard. Make that braceLET, by the way, since WW has a badly injured fist, that whole arm is basically useless. I love this. You're telling me Wonder Womanis going to go into battle against ONE opponent deacked out in full armor?? One opponent who isn't even a master fighter? Now who's giving Penance too much credit?


Penance uniform consists ofa bunch of leather straps. All she has to do is wriggle around till a couple slip free and she's out. Besides, Penance is actually two mind in one very chaotic jumble. There's no guarantee her mind CAN be controlled.


Don't worry, I'm not wasting my time. This is fun.


I actually have several facts, you just want to ignore them. And hey, at least I'm being FUNNY and not getting frustrated and insulting.

Sweet Lord. It's like arguing to a wall. A foam wall at that. Not much inside.

You haven't responded to the Lansarian technology by the way.

You said you don't know who Imperiux is. Imperiux's armour is like Galactus's armour. It's quite tough. Penance's skin is nowhere as tough.

The Imperiux armour was not vulnerable to ANY magic. Not even Dr. Fate could pierce it.

Catch her off guard my butt. She's spars with Batman. She knows better than to underestimate an opponent. She analyzes all of her opponents. Even losers like the Riddler. WW has reflexes on par with Jesse Quick. She deflects machine gun fire with ease. A girl with limited training would not catch her off guard. WW's armour is her costume. Not the Golden Eagle armour. WW's fist wont be injured. Nigh-Invulnerability remember?

Wiggle her way out of WW's lasso? You crack me up. As if WW is gonna stand there, watching Penance struggle her way out of the lasso. Like she can. The lasso is being held by Class 100 character remember. The lasso mentally controlled the Joker. His mind is WAYYYYY more chaotic than Penance.

This is annoying.

I'm ignoring your "facts" because they're highly implausible. You completely ignore my facts as well as your own common sense.

You ARE wasting your time.

Sticks and stones may break my bones, but Penance will still gut Wonder Woman.

Wonder Woman's fist WILL be injured. Penance is harder than she is, remember?? And of course she doesn't get caught off guard by Batman. He's freaking BATMAN. Penance is just some random girl.

Fine, so Penance slashes open one of Diana's exposed thighs since her vaunted invulnerable armor is a pair of cosmic short shorts. Thigh gets cut open, ateries are severed, Diana is boned.

I didn't respond to the Lansarian Technology because you edited it in while I was replying and I didn't feel like editing my post. I seriously doubt itcould heal all wounds, or else Diana wouldn't need her awesome armor and bracelets.

Joker's mind is still only one. Penance is two minds in one body. Okay, so maybe Wriggle was the wrong word. It only takes one sharp twist and she's free. Besides, she IS prettyfast herself, and the lasso doesn't have superspeed. She could dodge it.

How do you know the armor was invulnerable to ALL magic? Did Fate use Olympain God magic?

Gut Wonder Woman? Not a chance in hell.

Wonder Woman's will NOT be injured. Please. Superman's forcefield is harder than Wonder Woman. So is titanium warheads. But are her fists injured? No. Wonder Woman has nigh-invulnerability. It would take more than a diamond edged little girl to injure WW.

As if Penance will actually manage to slash Diana's exposed thigh. She deflects bulletfire. A clawed girl moving at human speed won't be able to hit her. WW's reflexes are on par with Jesse Quick, the fastest woman in DC universe.

The Lansarian technology healed Diana when her arm was broken by an Aztec God. It contains the Purple Healing Ray. All injuries are instantly healed with it. It can even cure cancer.

Diana is trained warrior. The "awesome armour and bracelets" are part of her heritage. She's like a mix of Batman and Superman. Superman's powers with Batman's fighting skills and ingenuity.

Joker is incredibly insane. The Spectre had trouble contain his mind. Penance would not be able to wrest herself free of the lasso. It's held far more powerful opponents like Superman, Captain Marvel and even 4D energy. A whip wielded by a normal human hand moves at nearly the speed of sound. The lasso wielded by a Class 100 character moves incredibly fast. WW can also telekinetically control the lasso. Penance wouldn't be able to dodge the lasso. Wonder Woman has been able to capture the Flash moving at near-lightspeed. Penance is nowhere near that league.

Dr. Fate has access to all types of sorcery and magic. Everything he tried failed. Diana beseeched the Greek Gods and they said that the lasso was an effective weapon against Imperiux.

Penance loses. Period. Give up. You're making a fool of yourself.

So titanium warheads are harder than Wonder Woman but skin as hard as diamond isn't?? Okay. Sure. If you think about the velocity and force behind a punch you're saying she will throw her hand IS getting f*cked up. If she's standing over or even close to Penance, who is lying on the ground playing possum (she doesn't have to breathe, so it would look pretty convincing), at some point she stops being able to see all of the girl over her own chest. then Penance is free to attack her legs. Slash a kneecap, open arteries in her thighs, slash her achilles heel or any combination of the three and Wonder Woman is in trouble. Even if the Lansawhatsis start to heal, the sheer pain of a torn up hand and sliced leg(s) will provide Penance all the opening she needs to get at Wonder Woman's neck.

You jsut PROVEd that Olympian magic is especially effective against Imperiux' armor. Strange obviously didn't try everything, or he would have beaten him. A WHIP travels at nearly the speed of sound. A lasso, a big ring of rope, travels much much slower. Have you ever had someone try and lasso you? I have when I was a kid, it's not hard to dodge because one can only throw it so fast. It only works on cows because they don't see it coming.

Captain Marvel's powers are magic-based and Superman is vulnerable to magic, it's no surpriseshe could hold them. And Flash is just a regular human strength-wise, anyone could get a lasso around his neck with the right timing.

Penance has a chance. Comma. YOU give up. Period, exclamation point.

Originally posted by Khellendros
Who says she even needs to breathe? Her body is ATROPHIED. It's a miracle she can even move at all. Look at Colossus, whose entire body turns to organic steel, he doesn't have to eat or breathe.

He lasso is magical, that explains why it hurts Superman. Are you saying Mongul's skin is tougher than diamond? If so, why was Green Lantern able to beat the hell out of him with a sledge hammer when Superman returned? that's because his attacks depend on will power and he must have had a bunch of will power to hurt mongul

Yes, Superman-level people like Mongul are tougher than diamond.



No, WW's tougher than both. An attack that destroys, say, a titanium armored tank, will not cause all that much damage to WW.



You might not be aware, but Wonder Woman's flesh is highly dense and resistant to damage (her bones even more-so), and she heals fast.

Diana has caught enchanted spears wielded by super-strong Amazons bare handed.

She's got super-speed and high skill, Penance can attack all she wants Diana'll just block or dodge every time. All day if necessary.

If she let Penance cut her, the cuts would close. WW has been impaled by swords of deities and kept fighting.

This is a stomp.

Originally posted by Khellendros
Fine. Wonder Woman throws just one high velocity punch at Penance. Do you KNOW what happens when you punch somethign harder than you are with sharp edges as hard as you can? Your hand gets ****ed up. Nerve damage, bleeding, maybe broken but at least badly bruised knuckles. For the rest of this fight, Wonder Woman has to deal with this excruciating pain coming from her hand. Wonder Woman can try choking her, but using the lasso one handed isn't gonna be fun and it won't work anyways. Using the lasso as a whip isn't guaranteed to work, because Penance doesn't have any special vulnerability to magic. Meanwhile, the second she gets close enough to Penance, it only takes one burst of speed and WW is gutted.


Yup. Good thing Penance isn't made of diamond. Her body as the same HARDNESS as diamond, the same durability, but none of the brittleness. WW isn't going to be shattering Penance.

Superman, Doomsday, and many others are all far, far more durable than Penance, but Diana doesn't hurt her hand punching them. Sure, I could see Penance's skin cutting-up Wonder Woman's hand, but breaking it or coming even close? nah You don't know what you're talking about.

And unless you can provide an example of Penance easily tanking a punch from Thing, there's no reason to doubt that Wonder Woman only needs one punch to end the fight.