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One interesting thing along those lines that I don't know how in the hell I came up with is this:

The amount of days between Hurricane Charley, and through the onset of Hurricanes Francis, Ivan, and Jeanne, was 40 days and 40 nights.

As far as to the exactness, I came up with it myself, so if I'm off by half a day, sue me.

I've never really taken the stories in the bible literally they are just tales that have some sort of metaphorical meaning

in a way i agree with lydia, but not entirely....Noah's ark and the raining of 40 days and 40 nights has some basis to it... i heard somewhere in one of my classes that all the way around the world there were recorded "documents" or cave writings is the best way to describe it in the mayan and aztec writings of a great rainfall that lasted a about 40 days and 40 nights.

sometimes what we cant believe or what we find hard to believe, it just takes faith. often faith is all we can go by.

...unless that faith directly conflicts with reality.
its possible to keep your faith, yet question the validity of certain stories imo.

Not to mension they found the ark on the news in the mountains a WHILE AGO.

nothing was confirmed, in fact they were probably incorrect or we would have heard much more about it. dont be so quick to post speculation as fact.

You have to remember, that when the book was written, the 'world' didnt extend far beyond the middle east. And at the time of Noah, they would not have been likely to know much of the actual world. So maybe the 'known' world was flooded.

Originally posted by Max Spidey 24
Not to mension they found the ark on the news in the mountains a WHILE AGO.

I would think an event that huge would have recieved a large amount of covereage.

In fact the "boat shaped" object found in turkey that I believe you are talking about has been confirmed as a boat shaped geological formation,

There are tales from different cultures throughout the world of a great flood that destroyed a geat civilization. Many now believe this to be the melting of the glaciers at the end of the last ice age, accellerated by the eruption and worldwide hot ash from the eruption of krakatoa 11'600 years ago. Prior to then, most of where indonesia is now, was above sea level. There was a MASSIVE subcontinent larger than india, larger than australia, that was right on the equator, and had the largest lowlying land that would have had the best conditions for human life. Many believe that a great civilization flourished there before it was submerged

Never liked that story, I always figured food would be a problem.

food was not an issue. they just ate the unicorns and dragons

Unicorns taste great, but dragons are a little tough and gamey.

oh come on!!!!
tastes like chicken!

Originally posted by a1hsauce
in a way i agree with lydia, but not entirely....Noah's ark and the raining of 40 days and 40 nights has some basis to it... i heard somewhere in one of my classes that all the way around the world there were recorded "documents" or cave writings is the best way to describe it in the mayan and aztec writings of a great rainfall that lasted a about 40 days and 40 nights.

sometimes what we cant believe or what we find hard to believe, it just takes faith. often faith is all we can go by.
but they were not all at the same time at all, a1... and it shows how lousy god's aim was if those cultures managed to survive


KD > about the incest... Adam and Eve were the first humans, the story claims so christianity is flooded with incest from the start already

no not necessarily yerssot eleveninches above kinda, i dont wanna say confirmed because i dont have the actual information in front of me, but in my geography classes we found that during the time in which this great flood occured there was something occuring in other parts of the world as well.... a great rainfall that that also demolition many civilizations in central and south america... not out of existence but hurt them significantly...

i dont think Gods aim had anything to do with it... he punished Noah's people for thier actions and the consequence of it drifted out onto the surrounding parts of the world.

So what you are saying is that God just kills people all willy nilly like?

no more like the ones he has a covenant with, who go against him... i hope.. thats wat im thinkin

I'm not a Christian but for number one I think that they measured years differently back then, which is why people lived to be several hundred years old.

Also I've thought about this story many times trying to think of ways it might be possible and it really doesn't seem to add up in any way whatsoever. But I figure that if it happen hypothetically, to try to cut down on as much food and labor as possible of taking care of these animals they would get eggs of each species instead of the actual animal. Like instead of bringing live lizards they would bring lizard eggs. Of course this wouldn't work for mammals and such, but it seems that it would cut down on the food they'd need to bring and stuff like that. For mammals they probably still wouldn't bring full grown animals, just get them at the age where they aren't babies so they don't need constant attention but aren't full grown either so they don't need as much food. Just a guess really..

lol again, i kinda agree with afros idea but still i think it comes down to faith. if you cant believe that Gods power can do anything, ur gonna have problems believing Noah's story as well...

Well I don't believe in the story actually I was just trying to do my best to rationalize it.

Firstly, a chap from MIT once worked out that given the size of the ark mentioned in the bible, there would have been plenty of room for all tyhe animals, and to spare.... if you assume that giving them exercise space was not a priority... as for water needs... hey, theres a flood, and loads of rain... a few bowls and buckets solves that problem... waste disposal... well, let me tell you... they shovelled it over the side.... there was tons of it.... Noah, being a conscientious type of chap, tried to put it all overboard in one place... for forty days and nights he and his sons shovelled.... then the flood was over... the pile of c**p lay there for thousands of years, then Columbus found it and called it America.....

I think the ark thing is real.I mean why would it not had happen?and it could happen again if god wants to rid the world of the evil.Acouse that is half the people right there.JM

Originally posted by big gay kirk
Firstly, a chap from MIT once worked out that given the size of the ark mentioned in the bible, there would have been plenty of room for all tyhe animals, and to spare.... if you assume that giving them exercise space was not a priority... as for water needs... hey, theres a flood, and loads of rain... a few bowls and buckets solves that problem... waste disposal... well, let me tell you... they shovelled it over the side.... there was tons of it.... Noah, being a conscientious type of chap, tried to put it all overboard in one place... for forty days and nights he and his sons shovelled.... then the flood was over... the pile of c**p lay there for thousands of years, then Columbus found it and called it America..... ahahahhaahha big gay kirk youre seriously on my funny list now man

Originally posted by Jackie Malfoy
and it could happen again if god wants to rid the world of the evil. If that's why he did it then it looks like God failed.

no not unless he got the people he wanted

Yeah but if he wanted to rid the world of evil he failed.. if he was just going for those individual people and not all evil then he achieved his goal.

Originally posted by a1hsauce
no not necessarily yerssot eleveninches above kinda, i dont wanna say confirmed because i dont have the actual information in front of me, but in my geography classes we found that during the time in which this great flood occured there was something occuring in other parts of the world as well.... a great rainfall that that also demolition many civilizations in central and south america... not out of existence but hurt them significantly...

i dont think Gods aim had anything to do with it... he punished Noah's people for thier actions and the consequence of it drifted out onto the surrounding parts of the world.
then you need to give your teacher the boot cause the one of the Inca's and the one of Australia alone are already 2000 year apart

That is true.JM

Originally posted by big gay kirk
Firstly, a chap from MIT once worked out that given the size of the ark mentioned in the bible, there would have been plenty of room for all tyhe animals, and to spare.... if you assume that giving them exercise space was not a priority...

I would love to see that study, because it is unrealistic to believe that you could house the male and the female of over 1.4 million species on a 450 foot long woooden boat along with the hundredsof thousands of pounds of food needed to maintain them.



So along with animals they brought a couple of hundred thousand buckets and bowls?



Have you ever been to the zoo or a farm and seen the amount of waste produced by animals in a day, imagine 6-8 people trying to clean up after 2 million animals each day. It ain't gonna happen.

faith

Faith in the mystical works of god? Or suspension of disbelief that on 500 year old man and his family can house, feed and care for millions of animals and then repopulate the earth?

One can have faith, but not to question isblind faith, and blind faith is a scarey thing.

Not to mention that it is impossible to repopulate the world with a breeding population of only two animals of every species.

Hmm...moving to religion.

Over-analyzing the Bible probably isn't the best idea around.

Three points:

-Noah needn't have brought in two of every single species
found today. Remember, he lived closer to Adam than to the
later Biblical figures, to many of the species he brought on could
have gone on to evolve as they spread out over the world.

-He didn't need top bring on water creatures, so that cuts down
on the total number of species.

-God may have lent a helping hand. Keeping the animals alive
without food or intestinal activity.

love how carnivores suddenly went veggie in that story, and think of the amopunt of food they had to store to feed all teh animals

Yeah, the Bible is not the word of God, but of men. I believe in a God, but I don't have a religion. God to me is simply nature/existence as such - the infinity of everything - the great unknown and unknowable of being.

If the Ark story is true, God could have made the animals sleep, or hibernate. Also if the story is true in the garden of Eden, then there were not any meat eaters, so it could be possible that they didn't eat meat at that time on the ark.

even you dont believe this debb if god is so powerful why didnt he create all the animals all over again after the flood

Because you realize that it is impossible. The bible is analyzed in university in theoretical studies all the time, it is only when people come to the conclusion that it is just a storybook that people feel it has been "over- analyzed.



So what you are saying is that evolution is a reality, doesn't that make believing in the whole Bible moot?



Actually I hadn't even put the number of aquatic animals in the equation, but come to think of it, if there was a world-wide flood, that would rais the salinity of all fresh water killing the fresh water species, therefore I guess Noah needed an even bigger ark with aquariums in it.



Come on, that's a cop out, if animals don't eat for 40 days they die. That's just a simple fact.



Carnivores not eat meat? Well if you believed that god made the animals in the first place why would he equipt lions to have all the tools that a carnivore must have to eat and digest meat, but not have the physical ability to sustain itself on vegetation?

I'll work on an answer to this one. And not from Google.

Originally posted by KharmaDog
So what you are saying is that evolution is a reality, doesn't that make believing in the whole Bible moot?

yes and no.

Yes I believe that Evolution is real (see the "True or False"
thread), and no I don't believe that makes the Bible "moot".

Furthermore, the whole point of all this, was for God to
punish a sinful world, so just as He used His powers to
bring on the flood, He also used His powers to help out
the animals, who were not the main target of His wrath.


For me, the story of Noah is my favorite. Not only is it a
story about human pride and stubbornness, as well as
human faith and perseverance. But I also see it as a
message of love and compassion towards animals. God
tells Noah to save all the animals, not just the cute ones,
or the edible ones, or the useful ones, but all the
animals, big and small. That to me is a message that we
humans should take care of animals, and not just those
that we find useful to us, and not hunt them to extinction.

Originally posted by King Burger
For me, the story of Noah is my favorite. Not only is it a
story about human pride and stubbornness, as well as
human faith and perseverance. But I also see it as a
message of love and compassion towards animals. God
tells Noah to save all the animals, not just the cute ones,
or the edible ones, or the useful ones, but all the
animals, big and small. That to me is a message that we
humans should take care of animals, and not just those
that we find useful to us, and not hunt them to extinction.

Too bad God does not show the same love and compassion toward people in this story. Why not save all the people, not just the righteous ones, or the faithful ones, or His favorite ones, but all the people? What kind of message do you take from that?

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
Too bad God does not show the same love and compassion toward people in this story. Why not save all the people, not just the righteous ones, or the faithful ones, or His favorite ones, but all the people? What kind of message do you take from that?


"righteou" and "faithful" don't apply to animals.

And who am I to judge God's decision?

I just said what I see to be one point of the story.

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
Too bad God does not show the same love and compassion toward people in this story. Why not save all the people, not just the righteous ones, or the faithful ones, or His favorite ones, but all the people? What kind of message do you take from that?
Kharma, unfortunately, I cannot produce an answer for you without too much reliance on God. I assume you'll dismiss this, so I won't bother posting it unless you really want that I do so.

Adam, the reason that God flooded everything and killed everyone was because a) they were evil and b), they were the "men of old, men of renown".

Originally posted by King Burger
"righteou" and "faithful" don't apply to animals.

Who said that it does?



Originally posted by King Burger
And who am I to judge God's decision?

You already made a value judgement when you stated how loving and compassionate it was of God to save not all of the animals but just two of every kind.



Originally posted by King Burger
I just said what I see to be one point of the story.

While completely ignoring another.



Originally posted by FeceMan
the reason that God flooded everything and killed everyone was because a) they were evil and b), they were the "men of old, men of renown".

Basically, God did such a poor job the first time around, He killed everyone, guilty and innocent, so that He could start over. However, God was too lazy to recreate all the animals so He had Noah round up two of each kind to repopulate the earth so He would not have to.

Actually is was 7 clean and 7 unclean animals that ended up being rounded up.

Well, that's your opinion.

The point is, for me, is that animals are not judged
by human standards, so they were not to be punished.
Obviously Noah couldn't save all animals, so God had him
save them as a species.

As for the humans killed or spared, as I said, I can not
know how and why God judged them. Maybe they were
sinners, maybe not but God had bigger plans.

The humans who drowned, drowned on purpose. The
animals who were drowned, drowned just because they
couldn't all be saved.

One should look at the fact that God bothered to order
Noah to save these animals, instead of just saving the
usefull or edible ones. This can be taken as a message
to Bible readers that God wants us to preserve and care
for all animals. That is the point I'm making.

Understand? Confused?

Originally posted by King Burger
The point is, for me, is that animals are not judged
by human standards, so they were not to be punished.
Obviously Noah couldn't save all animals, so God had him
save them as a species.

As for the humans killed or spared, as I said, I can not
know how and why God judged them. Maybe they were
sinners, maybe not but God had bigger plans.

The humans who drowned, drowned on purpose. The
animals who were drowned, drowned just because they
couldn't all be saved.

One should look at the fact that God bothered to order
Noah to save these animals, instead of just saving the
usefull or edible ones. This can be taken as a message
to Bible readers that God wants us to preserve and care
for all animals. That is the point I'm making.

Understand? Confused?

I have no confusion about the point you are trying to make. My point is that you are proclaiming this to be a wonderful story of love and compassion for animals and overlooking the fact that it is also filled with human suffering. It is as if you are being confronted with the fact that God drowned innocents including children and are saying "But look at all the good things He did for the animals," as if that is some kind of justification.

Do you know what is being said to have happend then? If he choose not to recreate, I dont see the relevance in that.

Who was innocent?

Originally posted by clickclick
Do you know what is being said to have happend then? If he choose not to recreate, I dont see the relevance in that.

Who was innocent?

He could have chosen not to reform humanity instead of destroy it.

Who was innocent? What about the infants and the children and those who were not wicked? They were drowned along with the guilty.

Granted but God knows the kind of people who were being destroyed. I dont think most people pick up on on the stated reason for the flood. It wasnt simply because men were wicked or doing wrong. It was because the sons of God were marrying the daughters of men and even having children with them. This was a very serious thing and God would not tolerate it.

still one have to presume that a bunch of infants and children got killed in this tale, and they had done notheing wrong. And with only Noahs family left we go back to inbreeding again..........oh and Noahs children and their spouses must represent all the different races we have on earth too.

I've kinda favored inbreeding.

yeah we noticed j/k

So let me get this straight, you are praising Noah for his pride (which is the first of the seven deadly sins which is said to interfere with the individual's recognition of the grace of God and has been called the sin from which all others arise) and his stubbornness, which is a pretty huge character flaw? That doesn't sound quite right.




I appreciate your candidness with your answer. If you are going to answer me with "it's all a matter of faith, then please don't bother to answer the question for I have heard that until my ears bleed. However, if you are going to offer me a new perspective I ask, and encourage you to answer,



Actually it was one of every beast and it's mate in addition to the 7 clean and 7 unclean animals. In laymens terms that's a pair of wild animals each and 7 of each domesticated animal.



So god killed everyone because they were gay and committing incest only to make it so that Noah's family had to commit incest in order to repopulate the world? That being said, if evolution does not exist then how do we have so many different races of people if we all descend from Noah's family?



I have no idea what would posses you to say that

No, not because of incest or homosexuality. And ive never said that micro evolution doesnt exist either. Even macroevolution isnt entirely out of the question, the matter is whether or not it did take place.

Originally posted by KharmaDog
So let me get this straight, you are praising Noah for his pride (which is the first of the seven deadly sins which is said to interfere with the individual's recognition of the grace of God and has been called the sin from which all others arise) and his stubbornness, which is a pretty huge character flaw? That doesn't sound quite right.


No, those were the bad traits in the story, the good being
faith and preseverance.

Capisci?

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
He could have chosen not to reform humanity instead of destroy it.

Who was innocent? What about the infants and the children and those who were not wicked? They were drowned along with the guilty.
They were the Nephilim, the Anakim, etc. Naughty.

Yea naughty....they were doin it with humans..

yeah and Im next in line

Ok Kharmadog,
In your ORIGINAL post, you requested a believer to answer your questions. So far, it doesn't seem that there have been any Christians to answer your questions. Well, here I am. Go crazy, ask away.

Noah's Ark

Is that where they put two of every animal in it, and then the Israelites carried around in the desert?

Originally posted by Gabe314
Ok Kharmadog,
In your ORIGINAL post, you requested a believer to answer your questions. So far, it doesn't seem that there have been any Christians to answer your questions. Well, here I am. Go crazy, ask away.

Answering the original questions would be a start.

The Ark of the Covent that went around the desert was waayyyy to small you know...And it wasn't only 2 of each animal, though it also says that in another verse....But also...

God instructed Noah that He would send two of every unclean animal and seven of every clean animal into the Ark. (See Gen. 6:20)

a long swim for the Penguins then

Where do you put the gnats at...and the poisoness spiders and scorpions, and the fire ants?

in Noahs wifes bed?

....that's why we don't hear much about her after the flood....she died....

scaredrip

Noah killed her.....premeditated.......No wonder he got drunk a lot....and there were suspicions around that one event with his son....If only the Jury was in....He could of got convicted.....

too bad csi wasnt around

Originally posted by debbiejo
The Ark of the Covent that went around the desert was waayyyy to small you know...And it wasn't only 2 of each animal, though it also says that in another verse....But also...

God instructed Noah that He would send two of every unclean animal and seven of every clean animal into the Ark. (See Gen. 6:20)

The Ark of the Covent
Isn't that a big boat with the ten commandments inside?

Little tiny killer boat....the don't touch it or you'll die boat...even if it falls and you try to stop it from hitting the ground....IT'S THE KILLER BOAT!....

Originally posted by Max Spidey 24
Not to mension they found the ark on the news in the mountains a WHILE AGO. You mmust be talking about Ron Wyatts crew. They foundd a rock formation that is vommon to the mountains of ararrarat. He probably made a lot of money out of the movie though. In the 70ss he madee in search of noahs ark. He also claimed to find a thumb print of a giant, the bones of the egiptians and chariott wheels in thhee red sea. noahs and abrahamss houses andd other sttuff. He was aa con artist who gott chrisstians to invest in his reesearchh by makingg a bunch of false claims

still too many animals to fit in the ark

oh really and what time was that then

Originally posted by finti

oh really and what time was that then

Fine fine.... 'In my opinion' the world was drastically different before the flood occured.

Originally posted by Echuu
Fine fine.... 'In my opinion' the world was drastically different before the flood occured.

Fine fine.....

Originally posted by Echuu
I'll take a stab at answering your questions.

1. Times change...and they also didn't have a Wendys or Mcdonalds around every corner back then.
2. By the grace of God??? How the heck are we supposed to know that?
3. I've never said that. How should I know? God instructed him on how to build... we don't have the exact blueprints. Also; for questions 3 and 2 you have to consider that back then people weren't as stupid as we think. Many ancient civilizations had quite advanced technology for their time.
4. Weren't as many animals then. Many of the animals around today have come from crossbreading. For example... look at all the different breeds of dogs there are.
5. Answer for number 4
6. The geography of the world was drastically different at that time.
7. They could throw the exrement overboard(and no I don't mean Feceman)
8. Windows
9. Fewer animals then...they didn't really navigate...they just floated around.
10. If God brought the animals to the ark two-by-two I think he could keep them from killing each other for a while.

So, are you saying that you take the story of the flood literally?

Echuu....didn't you read about Noahs wife on the previous page... Where did Noah put the fire ants?

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
So, are you saying that you take the story of the flood literally?

Yes





hides from mob***

Come back.....

Originally posted by debbiejo
Echuu....didn't you read about Noahs wife on the previous page... Where did Noah put the fire ants?

lol I didn't want to go through all the pages I'm too lazy...

Ummm...he put them near his son-in-laws to scare them into obeying his every command???



looks up from under ark***

ok back!!

Originally posted by Echuu
Yes





hides from mob***


No, don't run and hide. I'm not going to attempt to convince you of anything. That's a total up-hill battle that I can't win. Anyone who would actually believe that story has far too many problems for me to address.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
No, don't run and hide. I'm not going to attempt to convince you of anything. That's a total up-hill battle that I can't win. Anyone who would actually believe that story has far too many problems for me to address.

Well in my opinion truth comes from revalation...if you aren't open to a revelation you won't see the truth... open mindedness is the key.

I am definitely open minded. In studies I have done this ark thing makes sense for me and you are just going to have to respect that but I am completely open to anything you would like to say.

So what are my problems now?

Originally posted by Echuu
lol I didn't want to go through all the pages I'm too lazy...

Ummm...he put them near his son-in-laws to scare them into obeying his every command???



looks up from under ark***

ok back!!

Here it is...

Originally posted by debbiejo
Where do you put the gnats at...and the poisoness spiders and scorpions, and the fire ants?

Originally posted by finti
in Noahs wifes bed?

Originally posted by debbiejo
....that's why we don't hear much about her after the flood....she died....

Originally posted by finti
scaredrip

Originally posted by debbiejo
Noah killed her.....premeditated.......No wonder he got drunk a lot....and there were suspicions around that one event with his son....If only the Jury was in....He could of got convicted.....

Originally posted by debbiejo
Here it is...

awesome

Originally posted by Echuu
So what are my problems now?

I don't HAVE to respect anything you say or believe.

As for your problems, I would think they have something to do with your belief that santa claus ordered this simple drunk to march two of every species on earth into a big boat, so he cold wipe out every living thing, save those on the ark, off the face of the earth.

If you believe that the ark story is true, then you likely don't believe that the earth is more than 6 thousand years old either. So, you've got bigger problems than I can address.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
I don't HAVE to respect anything you say or believe.

As for your problems, I would think they have something to do with your belief that santa claus ordered this simple drunk to march two of every species on earth into a big boat, so he cold wipe out every living thing, save those on the ark, off the face of the earth.

If you believe that the ark story is true, then you likely don't believe that the earth is more than 6 thousand years old either. So, you've got bigger problems than I can address.

lol! No of course you don't HAVE to but it's good for people to repect other peoples beliefs. After all, what it is you guys accuse Christians of again??? Bigotry and hatred?? I think that's it.

I never said the earth was or wasn't more than 6,000 years old so don't lump me into some group please. You seem to lack the openmindedness to consider that I am openminded!!!!!!

Well, I think some Catholics think the world is older...OH, I don't know...there are so many denominations...all with differnt views now..But most churches teach that the earth is 6000 years old and on the 7000 year, then we will have a new earth...Cause they say gods number is 7.

Originally posted by Echuu
lol! No of course you don't HAVE to but it's good for people to repect other peoples beliefs. After all, what it is you guys accuse Christians of again??? Bigotry and hatred?? I think that's it.

I never said the earth was or wasn't more than 6,000 years old so don't lump me into some group please. You seem to lack the openmindedness to consider that I am openminded!!!!!!

It is good. I think my silence in regards to your beliefs is the most respectful thing I can do.

So, you take the Noah story literally, but not the age of the earth. Okay...so how old do you think the earth is? Closed-minded? I never said you were one way or the other.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
It is good. I think my silence in regards to your beliefs is the most respectful thing I can do.

So, you take the Noah story literally, but not the age of the earth. Okay...so how old do you think the earth is? Closed-minded? I never said you were one way or the other.

It's not silence when you come on and say 'You've got bigger problems than I can address.'

No... I have come to the conclusion that the story of Noah is valid and true. I have not come to a definite conclusion as to exactly how old the earth is because various passages of the bible can be interpreted different ways.
I think that generally I would like to slant in favor of it being around 6,000 years old but I have not come to a definite conclusion yet.

debbiejo... I would say that thing about 7000 is almost as silly as the Seventh Day Adventists predicting the end of the earth numerous times.

Originally posted by Echuu
debbiejo... I would say that thing about 7000 is almost as silly as the Seventh Day Adventists predicting the end of the earth numerous times.

Yeah...I know....I know.... ..It's anyday now..

Originally posted by debbiejo
Yeah...I know....I know.... ..It's anyday now..

OOPS!!!!! I think it was last Tuesday!!! Looks like we better have the ushers bump it up to next Friday on the newsletter!!!

Okay...we can get into it.


Tell me what it is about the noah story that lends some measure of legitimacy to it, for you.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
Okay...we can get into it.


Tell me what it is about the noah story that lends some measure of legitimacy to it, for you.

I don't see why I should take that liberty seeing as anything I say will be shot down or scoffed at.

You are gonna run away aren't you?...Don't run away....

Originally posted by debbiejo
You are gonna run away aren't you?...Don't run away....

Nah

Originally posted by Echuu
I don't see why I should take that liberty seeing as anything I say will be shot down or scoffed at.


As you wish...

in other words you cant then

I hate it people run away....Is it something we've said..??

Originally posted by finti
in other words you cant then

No, there's just no point in trying.

Originally posted by Echuu
No, there's just no point in trying.

By all means, don't let my personality keep you from speaking your mind. Whatshername, in another thread, said that you get a second helping of gods love and respect if you are persecuted while defending him.

Whats her name... ..double portion from god......

I tried to defend the ark story once here a long time ago....couldn't do it.....Started talking about animal manna from god....

Originally posted by debbiejo
I tried to defend the ark story once here a long time ago....couldn't do it.....


You couldn't? I wonder why?

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
By all means, don't let my personality keep you from speaking your mind. Whatshername, in another thread, said that you get a second helping of gods love and respect if you are persecuted while defending him.

ok, then fire away... or something like that.

Originally posted by King Burger
yes and no.

Yes I believe that Evolution is real (see the "True or False"
thread), and no I don't believe that makes the Bible "moot".

Furthermore, the whole point of all this, was for God to
punish a sinful world, so just as He used His powers to
bring on the flood, He also used His powers to help out
the animals, who were not the main target of His wrath.


For me, the story of Noah is my favorite. Not only is it a
story about human pride and stubbornness, as well as
human faith and perseverance. But I also see it as a
message of love and compassion towards animals. God
tells Noah to save all the animals, not just the cute ones,
or the edible ones, or the useful ones, but all the
animals, big and small. That to me is a message that we
humans should take care of animals, and not just those
that we find useful to us, and not hunt them to extinction.



So Moses lived in the Middle East...which as far as I could tell the last time I was there hasn't got equitorial jungles, polar ice regions or a lot of standing water areas. I'm also sure that Moses would surely been eaten trying to collect some of the more dangerous animals. And how long would it of taken him to collect all these animals?!?

"Come along Mr and Mrs Rabbit. I've still got to find a pair of Lions by 3:45pm or my whole schedule will go out of whack!!"

Moses???? think you mixing the characters here a bit

Originally posted by finti
Moses???? think you mixing the characters here a bit

Yes sorry about that, had been a long day at work. I am fully aware that Noah in fact "supposedly build the Ark.

does it really matter though, some dude with grey beard would do

Well Moses wouldn't need to build an Ark...He'd use his staff..make a big hole in the ground and suck the water up...

and all the women wailed

And said?

He thinks it's not kosher
Fundamentally he can't take it. You know he really hates it.

Originally posted by Echuu
ok, then fire away... or something like that.


Ugh! Well...DUH! I can't "persecute" you, until you start telling me what you think.

Originally posted by Capt_Fantastic
Ugh! Well...DUH! I can't "persecute" you, until you start telling me what you think.

darn

Um, well I think it's true obviously. I think the flood would explain the extinction of the dinasours. It would also explain climate/geographical changes and the length of peoples lives too.

Dinosaur extinction) Unless they were hunted into extinction beforehand, the flood is a very good theory as to the demise of the dinosaurs.
Also I don't know if you've ever heard of the Paluxy river? Preserved human and dinosaur footprints were found there.

Geographical changes)
It says in the bible that one of the places water came from was 'the deep.' This would be underwater springs. Now you need a ton of water to cover the entire earth obviously; so when these huge springs are empty what would happen to them? They would collapse... I think that's where the continents shapes and oceans came into formation.

Age length) A little while before the flood God declared that mans days will be numbered 120 years. You will notice a slow decline of age in the family lines throughout the bible. God also said before that 'my spirit will not contend with man forever, for he is mortal.'
Notice 'my spirit.' I think that this is what allowed the people to live longer and also start the human race through 'incest' without defects etc. And of course the law was eventually changed from those ways.

Let the persecution begin.........

correct me if Im worng.......you think man and dinosaurs walked the earth together right?

Originally posted by finti
correct me if Im worng.......you think man and dinosaurs walked the earth together right?

Yes why?

Paluxy river. Google it or something.

ok.....................

Originally posted by finti
ok.....................

Yes?

if that was the case we would have been whiped out

That's a scary thought....little running tasty morsels we'd be...I don't think I'd like it.....

Originally posted by finti
if that was the case we would have been whiped out

Lions and tigers and bears oh my!.....there was no extinction.

I don't know exactly how to answer this question because there are many possibilities of what happened.

Basically I'm going to answer your statement with one of these theories...

A) dinosaurs wiped out by the flood(unlikely because God said one of every animal should be brought on board the ark)
B) dinosaurs hunted down before the flood(possible seeing as the animals never attacked Adam or Eve and God brought the animals peacefully to the ark. This suggests that animals were peaceful throughout that time and this could have lasted until a short time after the flood and declined with man's age too)
C) dinosaurs brought along on the ark and killed by humans after the waters receded(possible for the same reasons as B)


I also don't see how we would be annihilated by the dinosaurs. Dinosaurs would tend to go away from villages, towns, and large groups of people wouldn't you think?(look at todays towns; you rarely have large predators like bears and lions go there unless they are desperate)
This would easily allow the people in the towns to go and hunt the
dinosaurs down.

I think that I'm going to go with C) for the most probable answer to your statement. It is also interesting to consider the survival of dinosaurs. There are some references to dinosaurs after the flood and even today we have had 'sightings' of dinosaurs. If you read Job 41:12-34 it gives the description of a 'leviathon' that definitely sounds to be a dinosaur. It is also mentioned again in Psalms 104:26.

Sorry for the long read

big difference between lions and tigers and the predator dinosaurs, big big difference. The weapons man could make in ancient time could kill lions and tigers, against dinosaures though it would be like if you tried to kill a crocodile with a tooth pick

They could run fast too...Big teeth...mean things....Ouch..Don't even want to visualize that.....It'll kinda ruin my mood....and it was a pleasant one too..

Originally posted by finti
big difference between lions and tigers and the predator dinosaurs, big big difference. The weapons man could make in ancient time could kill lions and tigers, against dinosaures though it would be like if you tried to kill a crocodile with a tooth pick

True

But there's still B) and that predatory animals tend to go away from villages and towns and all my other ramblings. My first statement was actually really dumb.

debbiejo>......just think Barney but jurrasic park style...

crap that's horrible

hm I just found this site on my favorites, and must've posted ages ago and forgot about it. Alright, somebody please come up with a legitimate question other than the original 10, they seem to have ran their coarse. Any question that'll at least lead to a long thread...

I have mentioned this in another thread, but where do the Egyptians come into the whole flood story as far as I can tell they just appear. Either god isn't as powerful as first mentioned and couldn't flood the entire world or he's not very good at it and missed some people.

Originally posted by GhostDance
I have mentioned this in another thread, but where do the Egyptians come into the whole flood story as far as I can tell they just appear. Either god isn't as powerful as first mentioned and couldn't flood the entire world or he's not very good at it and missed some people.

You should read the story of Gilgamesh.


http://www.wsu.edu/~dee/MESO/GILG.HTM

Originally posted by GhostDance
I have mentioned this in another thread, but where do the Egyptians come into the whole flood story as far as I can tell they just appear. Either god isn't as powerful as first mentioned and couldn't flood the entire world or he's not very good at it and missed some people. Good point. That would mean that Noah and his 2 daughter in laws and that little group would of been really really busy.. ..I don't think they just materialized did they? Well with blind faith I guess they could.

Originally posted by finti
big difference between lions and tigers and the predator dinosaurs, big big difference. The weapons man could make in ancient time could kill lions and tigers, against dinosaures though it would be like if you tried to kill a crocodile with a tooth pick


ROFL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!
ROFL @tooth pick