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1 Timothy 4:1-3
King James Version (KJV)
Public Domain

Now the Spirit speaketh expressly,
that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith,
giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;

Speaking lies in hypocrisy;
having their conscience seared with a hot iron;

Forbidding to marry,
and commanding to abstain from meats,
which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving
of them which believe and know the truth.

These two commandments can be found in the doctrines of the Roman Catholic Church.

and the point with this is?

Hmmm... To learn the views of Catholics here about those Church's commandment and prohibition... regarding Celibacy and Abstinence.

Perhaps, somebody might respond.

So, anybody out there?

it also says in a new testement verse that if you have enough self control and don't get overwelmed with "passions" then you shoudn't get married

You mentioned "IF".

Meaning, to become celibate is a personal and individual choice.

Celibacy, on the other hand, has been COMPULSORY and is enforced to the priests inside the Catholic Church.

And the Bible suggests that in order to become an effective bishop, he must have a family.

yeah well a priest congregation could be his family

this is more about sex---

The celibacy rule in the catholic church is something admirable but the fact is that many priests cant take it and the sex scandal in the church is proof of that.
I think that priests should be able to become married but if they feel that God has called them to be celibant and they can handle it then that's fine also.

And...they should be able to change their mind if they want to get married.

And that causes grievous INCONSISTENCY in their church doctrines.

PrinceofBlades, as a Catholic, do you also respect the Church commandment regarding Celibacy... and do you observe Abstinence during Lenten Season?

Jury, do you keep the Sabbath? And if not...show me the verse where it was done away with..

I don't have the Bible with me now. And cannot answer that right now. I'll be back for this... I'll just check the exact verse out. ...because I cannot remember the exact Bible verse saying that Christians do not need to observe Sabbath.

I believe it was never changed...I can't find one verse that says it was. If it was never changed and people believe we should follow Gods words, then everyone should be keeping it. Wouldn't you agree?

So why would Jesus proclaimed that out of 10 commandments God has given to Israel before, only two were considered as 'most important' commandments?

Does this mean to disregard the rest?

Actually no. In fact, all commandments were still imposed to the Christian era... EXCEPT... the observance of Sabbath Day.

Jesus Himself didn't observe Sabbath anymore:

For this reason the Jews tried all the harder to kill him; not only was he breaking the Sabbath, but he was even calling God his own Father, making himself equal with God.
John 5:18 (New International Version)
New International Version (NIV)

Also the Apostles:

One Sabbath Jesus was going through the grainfields, and his disciples began to pick some heads of grain, rub them in their hands and eat the kernels. Some of the Pharisees asked, "Why are you doing what is unlawful on the Sabbath?"
Jesus answered them, "Have you never read what David did when he and his companions were hungry? 4He entered the house of God, and taking the consecrated bread, he ate what is lawful only for priests to eat. And he also gave some to his companions." 5Then Jesus said to them, "The Son of Man is Lord of the Sabbath."
Luke 6:1-5 (New International Version)
New International Version (NIV)

This only shows that:

Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day.
Colossians 2:16 (New International Version)
New International Version (NIV)

not only are you biased agains caholics you sound very much like anti semetic as well

If you're going to be so rigid on the Catholics, then you MUST recognize that the Sabbath was not done away with. Show me the verse where JESUS SAID the Sabbath is of no effect. Just because he ate kernels on the Sabbath doesn't mean that they were done away with. Of course the Pharisees would say he was breaking the sabbath...THEY had imposed impossible rules to keep it. Jesus said He was LORD of the Sabbath, which means it is HIS DAY. So, really you could say it is the LORDS day...The Sabbath was changed to Sunday by our buddy Constantine. King of the changes...NOW, I could say that there are some churches that would teach something different than yours, which would be to follow after the Antichrist (Catholic Church), is by keeping IT's laws...and it's said to have changed times and days...Which is said to be the changing of the 4 th commandment. Unless you can show me that a change was made by Jesus, then YOU TOO are breaking it, because it IS written in the Bible.....SO..then are you going to take everything literally? ALSO, the keeping of new moons etc. is not talking about he weekly Sabbath, it's talking about the feast days...

As the Bible says:

Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day.
Colossians 2:16
New International Version (NIV)

So, whether you observe Sabbath Day or not, it doesn't matter in the Christian era anymore.

The covenant made by God with the Israel was changed during the Christian dispensation. Meaning, a new priesthood was replaced. The old covenant, with respect to its term, has its own effectivity... and that was until the birth of John the Baptist. And with a new priesthood, a new covenant stipulated... new laws are imposed.

well if it is a new covenant, why bother with the old one?

Originally posted by Jury
As the Bible says:

Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day.
Colossians 2:16
New International Version (NIV)

So, whether you observe Sabbath Day or not, it doesn't matter in the Christian era anymore.

.

What other commandment would we do away with since we are under the new covenant??? AND look again at what you quoted...

The New Moon celebration or Sabbath..were many...there were other days that were not the seventh day that were concederd Sabbath too. Eating and drink should be a great give away...that had to do with the feast days not the seventh day... OR are you saying that we should throw out the whole OT?....That is before John the B.

The old covenant comprises testimonies and prophecies regarding the second and the last covenants of God. That's why Jesus declared that we should keep up with the scriptures which include the books of Moses, the prophets, and the psalms (meaning apocryphas and deoterocanonicals are not included). However, regarding the new despensation in Christian era, the birth of Jesus is the birth of new priesthood. And there was change in the law. This law was imposed to the second covenant of God - the Christians. Because Israel apostatized. And a new law supersedes the law of Moses in the old covenant. But this doesn't necessarily mean to throw away the old covenant.

Then why did God write it in stone? Your church must also teach dispensations...You seem to be talking with that view...dispensations is not what was taught, that view is only a few hundred years old...very new...man made. The new covenant was not throwing anything out accept the animal sacrifices...The new covenant was Jesus blood covering sins instead of animals (temp. Covering.) That is what was nailed to the cross...Nothing in the commandments at all...

Again show me where it says that a law was chanaged. the 4th especially.

Okay, let's put it this way.

To whom did God really give the Ten Commandments? Weren't they exclusively imposed to Israel?

and Israel is ?

I have always wondered why there are many different denominations considering that they all use the same book for reference.

I also find those that profess catholicism as somewhat odd, because there are many traditions that they continue despite how dated they may seem and how belittling they may be.

Here are my questions:

Why aren't there any women pastors?
Why do they call the pastor father when Jesus directly said not to do this?
Why should a sinner confess their sins and ask forgiveness from another sinner?
Why is the pope considered holier than a member of the congregation. Aren't they both sinners?
Why force celibacy on anyone? Isn't that asking for secret release of pent up frustration?

Originally posted by Jury
Okay, let's put it this way.

To whom did God really give the Ten Commandments? Weren't they exclusively imposed to Israel?

So you're a believer in the NT only.....Nothing else in the OT matters...?

Its the world with traditions and other factors,things that are simple are made so hard, but you have to do what is inside of you , regardless of tradition.

Originally posted by debbiejo
So you're a believer in the NT only.....Nothing else in the OT matters...?
Of course, I believe in the OT ... as Jesus prescribed His followers to do so. The OT speaks about Jesus so Christians must honor the OT... as part of God's calling mission.

yeah eye for an eye..................turn the other cheek

Originally posted by Jury
Okay, let's put it this way.

To whom did God really give the Ten Commandments? Weren't they exclusively imposed to Israel?


Then why do you only follow 9 of them? You said you beieve in the OT and it wasn't just for the Jews.

A while back I stumbled onto a passage in Leviticus (an under-read and completely interesting, and somewhat insane, book of the Bible) that says in no uncertain terms that a priest should marry as long as he marries a virgin. Both sides have their arguments, but I honestly don't think the church has enough solid evidence that priests should remain celibate to enforce it so strictly. If they were to revoke this law, I'm sure the number of priests, and probably Catholics, would grow quite a bit.

-DM

Originally posted by debbiejo
Then why do you only follow 9 of them? You said you beieve in the OT and it wasn't just for the Jews.

Jesus spoke directly against judging people based on whether they followed tradition or not and condemned the pharisees for only following tradition so that men could see them do it and they would gain glory from men.

The coming of Jesus brought about a drastic change in the worlds traditions and the lovers of traditions HATED IT especially because Jesus was saying that ANYONE could be forgiven and worst of all for FREE!!

The lovers of tradition stood to lose both power and money. So they trumped up whatever and persecuted him.

The sabbath is a day of rest so rest. You have to go to work on the sabbath, go because you won't be relaxing when you've lost you're job for not showing up. You're going to do something that's similar to work every day even if your on vacation. Driving is a task.

What's the opposite of rest? Stress.

Let's not be like the pharisees and make mountains out of molehills. Some things HAVE changed since the old testament.

Originally posted by debbiejo
Then why do you only follow 9 of them? You said you beieve in the OT and it wasn't just for the Jews.
The OT doesn't only include the Ten Commandments of God to Israel. To believe in the OT however doesn't necessarily imply that you should obey the Ten Commandments. As I've said the 10 commandments were given by God to Israel... for them to be free. But historically, the Israel didn't remain faithful to these commandments... until God had condemned them to death. But God had promised... the covenant of God must continue... and this was fulfilled through Jesus Christ.

With new priesthood, there is new law... new commandments.
That's why during the Christian era... Sabbath is not mandatory anymore.

Originally posted by Jury
1 Timothy 4:1-3
King James Version (KJV)
Public Domain

Now the Spirit speaketh expressly,
that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith,
giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;

Speaking lies in hypocrisy;
having their conscience seared with a hot iron;

Forbidding to marry,
and commanding to abstain from meats,
which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving
of them which believe and know the truth.

These two commandments can be found in the doctrines of the Roman Catholic Church.

This is a teaching from Paul..You're church doesn't acknowledge Pauls words.

Originally posted by debbiejo
This is a teaching from Paul..You're church doesn't acknowledge Pauls words.

Wasn't Paul a Catholic?

Realy he was a Gnostic.The church made him Catholic

Right Mr.smiley....and Gnostic's abstain from all bodily lust as I know you know....and Pauls teachings were seeming to be gnostic......So, Jury shouldn't be reading Paul at all....he should get the scissors and just cut those parts out.

Reasons like that are what confuse people on Christianity.Paul is made into something he wasn't,yet his orginal teaching still stands.It's kind of funny in a twisted way

Its incredible how this talk about biblic things can be boring, just the sight of those numbers Timothy 4:1, John 5:18 makes me feel sad

pick a happy number....how about.....hmmmmmmmmm 2

I thought he was the bassplayer band

Originally posted by finti
I thought he was the bassplayer band


HAHAHAHAHA.....

NO...Paul was a lunatic...heretic...taz...And the church listens more to him then to what Jesus taught.

Originally posted by debbiejo
This is a teaching from Paul..You're church doesn't acknowledge Pauls words. Paul teaches that upholding "celibacy" and "abstinence" as a strict Church doctrine is likely from "devil".
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Wasn't Paul a Catholic? He was not a Catholic. He was a faithful follower of Judaism. Yet later, he was converted as one of Christ's followers. He became a member of a Church whose Head is Christ.

Originally posted by Jury
He was not a Catholic. He was a faithful follower of Judaism. Yet later, he was converted as one of Christ's followers. He became a member of a Church whose Head is Christ.

Thank you, but I know all of this. Lack of knowledge was not the reason I asked the question.

You're welcome.