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For me it was the "I have the higher ground" as an excuse for why OB1 defeats Anakin. Considering that in EP1, OB1 is hanging by one hand from a ledge over a pit, force pulls himself up, force grabs his light saber, and sliced Darth Maul(?) in half, it's pretty rediculous to think "higher ground" ever made a diference in a light saber battle, especially when the higher ground was only a few feet.

I would have done the scene so that there was just some lava accident buring up Anakins legs.

It also seemed unrealistic for OB1 to just stand there and watch Anakin burning away. Either help him or finish him off.

A better way to have done this would have been for Darth Siddius to show up sooner, grab Anakin, and rushing away, too busy to fight OB1.

Obviously EP4 forces EP3 to end a certain way, but they could have done a better job. Yoda fails in one battle and goes into exile? Taking a que from EP4 and OB1, Yoda could have mentioned that he was just getting too old for this (maybe the start of his life force draining away) and had to leave and rest in order live long enough to be able to train Luke.

Why is it that of all the people struck by force lightning, that only Darth Siddious's face is disfigured. It doesn't happen to OB1 or Luke. Again, my suggestion would have been for a slow transition over time from just using the dark force.

In EP6, the "perhaps sister will" (be turned to the darkside), seem a bit weak as an excuse for Luke to re-engage his father in a battle, but "higher ground" is going to be at the top of my most annoying plot line.

How is it that the entire Jedi council can't sense the presence of the dark force in Palpetine in EP1, EP2, and EP3? OB1 is told about the republic being led by a Darth Lord and still can't sense it (apparently he develops the ablity to sense the dark force in EP4 and later).

If Anakin is so concerened about losing Padme during childbirth, why doesn't he stay with her when she's so close to giving birth?

Originally posted by jeffr

Why is it that of all the people struck by force lightning, that only Darth Siddious's face is disfigured. It doesn't happen to OB1 or Luke. Again, my suggestion would have been for a slow transition over time from just using the dark force.


Being struck by it doesn't disfigure you, it's the using it that does. To be able to use 'Force Lightning'(total game reference), you have to be on the path of the Dark Side. Palpatine was obviously trying reeeaaalllyyy hard to whoop the wrong BMF Jedi's butt and he suffered the ultimate cosmetic faux pas.

I think Ben was trying to tell Anakin to stop when he jumped to the high ground. I'm no military tactician but I always thought 'Higher Ground' meant better 'Tactical Advantage'. By the end of it, whose limbs were severed?

Ben couldn't finish him off. Anakin was like a brother to him.

One thing that annoyed me...
Damn that Palpatine whines a hell of a lot more than Anakin ever did.
Mace - I'm gonna kick your ass!
Palpie - Oh no, I'm old and weak!
Mace - Oh, okay.
Palpie - *lightning*Take that Jules!
Mace - Why you little!
Palpie - No, don't! I'm brittle!
*rinse and repeat*

Originally posted by jeffr
How is it that the entire Jedi council can't sense the presence of the dark force in Palpetine in EP1, EP2, and EP3? OB1 is told about the republic being led by a Darth Lord and still can't sense it (apparently he develops the ablity to sense the dark force in EP4 and later).
Because the Dark Side clouds everything...

Originally posted by jeffr
If Anakin is so concerened about losing Padme during childbirth, why doesn't he stay with her when she's so close to giving birth?
Maybe it was premature because, he choked her and he was really peeved.

Originally posted by jeffr
So why isn't Count Dokoo horribly disfigured when he uses it?
Because he didn't use it quite as much or as close as Palpie did. Think of it as being 'burned', maybe? The closer you are to the fire, the more damage it will cause.

So why isn't Count Dokoo horribly disfigured when he uses it?

Maybe it was premature because, he choked her and he was really peeved

She was close to giving birth. He already had a vision of her dying. The whole point of this was his fear of losing yet another person he loved turning him to the darkside, yet he leaves to go off on some quest?

After losing his mother, you'd think he wouldn't leave Padme for an instant until after she gave birth. Palpatine has promised to give him the power to keep her from dying, but Anakin doesn't insist on learning this power right away and staying with Padme? My point is that after what Anakin has been through, he'd do anything to prevent another loved one dying, and would have stayed with Padme.

Originally posted by Justice Pie


One thing that annoyed me...
Damn that Palpatine whines a hell of a lot more than Anakin ever did.
Mace - I'm gonna kick your ass!
Palpie - Oh no, I'm old and weak!
Mace - Oh, okay.
Palpie - *lightning*Take that Jules!
Mace - Why you little!
Palpie - No, don't! I'm brittle!
*rinse and repeat*

This was already answered. He was faking. He knew anakin was coming. It was kind of his strategy to pi** off mace so he would want to kill him when anakin arrives.

Originally posted by jeffr
So why isn't Count Dokoo horribly disfigured when he uses it?

Palpatine was supressing the dark side power so no one could sense it. Remember that he was always surrounded by jedis

Originally posted by Darth_Rankkor
This was already answered. He was faking. He knew anakin was coming. It was kind of his strategy to pi** off mace so he would want to kill him when anakin arrives.
Oh I know. I wasn't asking a question, just commenting on the situation. During the scene, I was just rolling my eyes, like "C'mon Mace! Do it!"

Since when has higher ground even made a difference in any other light saber battle in any of the SW movies? In this case, higher ground was maybe 2 or 3 feet? It never seemed to be an issue with Yoda, who is 3 feet shorter than the people he fights.

Originally posted by Darth_Rankkor
Palpatine was supressing the dark side power so no one could sense it. Remember that he was always surrounded by jedis
That's a good interpretation of it.

Originally posted by jeffr
Maybe it was premature because, he choked her and he was really peeved

She was close to giving birth. He already had a vision of her dying. The whole point of this was his fear of losing yet another person he loved turning him to the darkside, yet he leaves to go off on some quest?

After losing his mother, you'd think he wouldn't leave Padme for an instant until after she gave birth. Palpatine has promised to give him the power to keep her from dying, but Anakin doesn't insist on learning this power right away and staying with Padme? My point is that after what Anakin has been through, he'd do anything to prevent another loved one dying, and would have stayed with Padme.

It was all just an excuse for him to gain more power. Just use your imagination to fill in the gaps.

Originally posted by jeffr
Since when has higher ground even made a difference in any other light saber battle in any of the SW movies? In this case, higher ground was maybe 2 or 3 feet? It never seemed to be an issue with Yoda, who is 3 feet shorter than the people he fights.
I don't think higher ground has ever been a factor in any other lightsaber battle.

Here's a question...
Why do YOU think Ben says this to Anakin?

Originally posted by jeffr
Since when has higher ground even made a difference in any other light saber battle in any of the SW movies? In this case, higher ground was maybe 2 or 3 feet? It never seemed to be an issue with Yoda, who is 3 feet shorter than the people he fights.

Since ever. In PM doesn't because GL wanted to be that way. But Obi1 would have died in PM. Anakin Jumped Right to Obi1's lightsaber. He never had a chance. He should have waited.

Because GL couldn't come up with a better reason for Anakin to lose in a battle against OB1 and end up horribly disfigured and needing the mask to survive.

The battle scene, although nice, wasn't even necessary to explain Anakins disfigurement. It could have just been a horrible accident, like a speeder blowing up, or the lava splashing onto to him during the fight, or his cape catching fire before he jumps.

Originally posted by Darth_Rankkor
Since ever. In PM doesn't because GL wanted to be that way. But Obi1 would have died in PM. Anakin Jumped Right to Obi1's lightsaber. He never had a chance. He should have waited.
Being the stronger Jedi, he should have waited. But being that consumed with the Dark Side, he was impatient and wanted to prove to Ben how badass he was.

Instead, he became the butt of all no-leg/no-arm jokes.

Ben - "What do you call a Jedi with no legs and 1 arm?"
Cantina Bartender - "Uh, I don't know?"
Ben - "Anakin."
*laughter*

hahahahaha

Originally posted by jeffr
Because GL couldn't come up with a better reason for Anakin to lose in a battle against OB1 and end up horribly disfigured and needing the mask to survive.

The battle scene, although nice, wasn't even necessary to explain Anakins disfigurement. It could have just been a horrible accident, like a speeder blowing up, or the lava splashing onto to him during the fight, or his cape catching fire before he jumps.

Granted, you are entitled to your opinion, but when you have enough money to buy the rights to this franchise, then you can make all the changes you want.
GL wrote the story the way he wanted to write it. He didn't ask for your permission and he didn't seek your counsel.
In the meantime, criticize away. His feelings are a few million dollars thick.

But isn't why forums exist? To question and discuss diferent opinions? To wonder what could have been or not? If everyone just thought the same, the existence of these forums would be for nothing

Originally posted by Darth_Rankkor
But isn't why forums exist? To question and discuss diferent opinions? To wonder what could have been or not? If everyone just thought the same, the existence of these forums would be for nothing
Of course it is!
I give \m/\m/(two bull horns) because this forum is too much cool for one hand!
I just wish the reiteration of the same opinion could be filled with something...refreshing?
How many times can you answer the same gripe?

Maybe it's because I'm new here and I didn't noticed that same threads are repeated billions of times and you're already tired of it. You could be right....

I think he just wanted to get it over with, and didn't put in the time to really come up with a good transition into EP4 plot line. As you mentioned, the movie is going to make millions anyway, inspite of any weaknesses, but I stil have the right to gripe about it. The movie could have been better, but it's good enough that I'll buy the dvd once it's out. I don't plan on watching it at the movies again (my wife didn't like EP3 very much at all).

Still I'm going to place "higher ground" well above "magic ticket" (last action hero) for weakest excuse for the plot line of a movie.

.... and why does Padme go along with seperating the twins and choosing to stay with Leah instead of Luke (maybe because Luke would be with his relatives?), oh that's right, they just kill her off instead, ignoring the fact the Leah remembers her "real mother" in a later episode. Then again, the funeral scene could have been just a ruse to keep Darth Vader from looking for Padme.

Well, i think you have some point on "higher ground" thing... but your comment about "Last action hero"... excuse me, but it make me think you don't really understand movies...

Why are people complaining about this higher ground crap?

Look; Anakin was on that tiny little platform...Lava to the left of him, lava to the right of him, lava behind him. Obi-Wan clearly DOES have an advantage againt him.

If Anakin were to jump to either side of that hill to try to gain some sort of flanking advantage to outmaneuver him Kenobi would just have to advance slightly and he would still have the advantage.
If Anakin were to have just jumped down right in front of him he would still have gotten chopped up.

You have to remember that for all the duels in the saga this is one of the very few times there has been a clear "height advantage."
It is almost always done on level ground.
Of course there are some platforms and such like in the case of Qui-Gon, Obi-Wan, vs. Maul.
Maul didn't take advantage of his higher ground. Same goes with Luke after he kicked Vader down the steps, or with Dooku in ep3 backing up the steps away from Anakin.

And Yoda being small....his speed makes up for that.
Yoda was able to use his speed to get and upper hand against Dooku and even some 'higher ground.' Notice how he jumps off of that wall and surprises him.
Palpatine had great height advantage against Yoda and had him on the run throwing the senate pods at him. Yoda finally countered after he put his saber away and used the force.

Edit: Post removed.

Originally posted by jeffr
For me it was the "I have the higher ground" as an excuse for why OB1 defeats Anakin. Considering that in EP1, OB1 is hanging by one hand from a ledge over a pit, force pulls himself up, force grabs his light saber, and sliced Darth Maul(?) in half, it's pretty rediculous to think "higher ground" ever made a diference in a light saber battle, especially when the higher ground was only a few feet.

I would have done the scene so that there was just some lava accident buring up Anakins legs.

It also seemed unrealistic for OB1 to just stand there and watch Anakin burning away. Either help him or finish him off.

A better way to have done this would have been for Darth Siddius to show up sooner, grab Anakin, and rushing away, too busy to fight OB1.

Obviously EP4 forces EP3 to end a certain way, but they could have done a better job. Yoda fails in one battle and goes into exile? Taking a que from EP4 and OB1, Yoda could have mentioned that he was just getting too old for this (maybe the start of his life force draining away) and had to leave and rest in order live long enough to be able to train Luke.

Why is it that of all the people struck by force lightning, that only Darth Siddious's face is disfigured. It doesn't happen to OB1 or Luke. Again, my suggestion would have been for a slow transition over time from just using the dark force.

In EP6, the "perhaps sister will" (be turned to the darkside), seem a bit weak as an excuse for Luke to re-engage his father in a battle, but "higher ground" is going to be at the top of my most annoying plot line.
well duh it forces it to end in a certain way.

Originally posted by Justice Pie
Oh I know. I wasn't asking a question, just commenting on the situation. During the scene, I was just rolling my eyes, like "C'mon Mace! Do it!"

Yes I was thinking the exzact thing. And for Obi1 leaving Anakin there because he couldnt finish him off is kinda dumb. I would of put him out of his misery and force pushed him in to the lava.

Nah, Anakin was being a prick.

I woulda gone up to him and rubbed his burned and blistered head, causing him even more pain. Then sliced off each of his ears, then his nose...

Then left him writhing in pain.

MUAHAHAHA!