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Vader all the way!!

(ahem)............................(cough)...................MORON!

Been done before... And next time try thinking before you make a thread...

But just for you I will answer and in a very simple way because you probably wouldn't understand otherwise

Palpatine/Sidious = The Master
Vader/Anakin = The apprentice

So who do you think would win, the chosen one that doesn't necessarily have to be powerful and who's prophecy doesn't matter at all in this thread. Or the Master who ruled the phatetic little boy for god knows how long until he was eventually backstabbed but still managed to take him out? Vader does not have a chance in hell of beating Palpatine.

K got it? Now start thinking instead of making threads please...

Amen, Fishy.

The Joy-Roc guy should be banned just for saying that.

um fishy ever heard of the phrase "apprentice surpass the master"

Hmm dude ever think that maybe if that was the case the apprentice would have killed the master?

Tell me something did the apprentice kill the master? No.. why didn't he? Because he didn't surpass the master.

Damn straight, the apprentice caught up the master from behind while said master was so focused on killing is biggest threat.

The apprentice was gone anyway, the 23 year old l'il freak was back.

This is directly from Lucas:


"Due to his injuries on Mustafar, Darth Vader was far less powerful than he could have been. As Vader, he possesses about 80% the strength of the Emperor. Had he not been so injured, he would've been TWICE as powerful."

80% is enough for a decent fight, but Palpatine would take this one most likely as Vader is not nearly as manuverable as he once was.

Well okay Vader/Anakin did kill Sidious...

But he could never defeat Sidious in a fair fight, not even in an unfair fight. Unless of course Sidious was to distracted with torturing other people.

Yeah I read that somewhere, suit-Vader sucks.

Word...

Originally posted by Tangible God
Yeah I read that somewhere, suit-Vader sucks.

He didn't suck, he was still more powerful than all save the Emperor in this form. He still probably killed a fair share of Jedi in this form, believeable since not all Jedi were on Coruscant/on the Front at the time.

However, had he not been burnt by lava, he would've been even greater than the Emperor. A "Force god" as it were.

He sucks in the OT by comparison to the PT Jedi. By all respects, if THAT'S what Vader was like in the OT, then what were the Old Republic Jedi like?

What is this god craped based on... Even if he was 160% emperor he would not have been close to Sadow, Ragnos, Kun, Revan... Seriously he might be the chosen one but that doesn't make him god.

Originally posted by Darth_Emodas
He didn't suck, he was still more powerful than all save the Emperor in this form. He still probably killed a fair share of Jedi in this form, believeable since not all Jedi were on Coruscant/on the Front at the time.

However, had he not been burnt by lava, he would've been even greater than the Emperor. A "Force god" as it were.

Why does everyone assume that Anakain would be a Force god had he reached his full potential? For all we know Anakin's full potential could be less than Kun's power or stonger than Marka Ragnos.

AS I always say (not really) It's all a big What If.

I disagree. Fishy, you simply don't know enough about Revan as to where to rank him on the scales of power. We've seen nothing of him that is truly remarkable, only tales from citizens and Kreia - who is a dubious source within herself.

So do not presume to know where Anakin would be if he reached his full potential. He may very well be ABOVE Malak and Revan. You don't know.

Now. As for Sadow and Marka, I can agree. But even then - you STILL don't know.

Well, remember that those Sith Lords you mention are EU, not canon.

Anakin's midichlorian count was higher than all others because he was conceived by them. Remember he had no mortal father.

What other logical conclusion is there?

Originally posted by Darth Somebody
I disagree. Fishy, you simply don't know enough about Revan as to where to rank him on the scales of power. We've seen nothing of him that is truly remarkable, only tales from citizens and Kreia - who is a dubious source within herself.

So do not presume to know where Anakin would be if he reached his full potential. He may very well be ABOVE Malak and Revan. You don't know.

Now. As for Sadow and Marka, I can agree. But even then - you STILL don't know.

Yes you do, by all we know all those guys were more then twice as powerful as Sidious. Anakin would not have been.

Why does everyone think Kreia cannot be counted as a sorce for Revan? She might be manipultive, but I must be an idiot because I cannot find any reason that she would lie about what Revan did.

You are all confused, Darth Vadar is the evil twin of Darth Vader, he really pawns Sidious!1!

Originally posted by Fishy
Yes you do, by all we know all those guys were more then twice as powerful as Sidious. Anakin would not have been.

Once more - you do not KNOW that Revan was twice as powerful as Sidious. Pardon, are you using your own logic and speculation, or do you have some sort of PROOF to indicate it.

Originally posted by Darth_Emodas
Well, remember that those Sith Lords you mention are EU, not canon.

Anakin's midichlorian count was higher than all others because he was conceived by them. Remember he had no mortal father.

What other logical conclusion is there?

Please do not bring this pathetic canon argument into this thread that is the last thing we need...

Originally posted by Darth Somebody
Once more - you do not KNOW that Revan was twice as powerful as Sidious. Pardon, are you using your own logic and speculation, or do you have some sort of PROOF to indicate it.

Forget about Revan then, I don't feel like going into a debate about that again the rest still stands.

Originally posted by Veneficus
Please do not bring this pathetic canon argument into this thread that is the last thing we need...

Lol pathetic? You're arguing about characters that were never mentioned in the movie. Remember, if it contradicts the films, it is FALSE.

But continue, it is quite amusing to watch all the supposition.

Originally posted by Darth Somebody
Once more - you do not KNOW that Revan was twice as powerful as Sidious. Pardon, are you using your own logic and speculation, or do you have some sort of PROOF to indicate it.

DS is right here...we have no proof to indicate Revan's abilities(save Kreia and the rest of the Ebon Hawk crew who never seemed to shut up about Revan)...while I think he was more than twice that of Sidious power that is my opinon so it counts for crap.

Originally posted by Darth_Emodas
Lol pathetic? You're arguing about characters that were never mentioned in the movie. Remember, if it contradicts the films, it is FALSE.

But continue, it is quite amusing to watch all the supposition.

So you are saying KOTOR is false? Or the comic books about Kun and Ragnos?

Originally posted by Veneficus
So you are saying KOTOR is false? Or the comic books about Kun and Ragnos?

I shouldn't need to remind you about the difference between EU and the films, my friend.

KOTOR is a good game nonetheless.

Originally posted by Darth_Emodas
I shouldn't need to remind you about the difference between EU and the films, my friend.

KOTOR is a good game nonetheless.

Look both Janus and I have been lectured by Ush more than once on the whole EU can not be counted as canon bla bla bla and I don't need it from you. But canon or not it does not matter this an EU forum and we do not include the whole messed up concept of canon that GL has claimed to support. The OT was great the PT sucked and I then lost all my respect for GL.

Now. The Expanded Universe and the movies differ widely. Haven't you ever really wondered why the great Master Yoda - who spent more time studying the Force than Marka Ragnos, NJO Luke, or Kun - has a hard time fighting off a sixty-something year old Sith Lord?

Haven't you ever WONDERED why Yoda - for all of his knowledge and reverance - doesn't chuck a planet at someone, doesn't control black holes, and can't transport people from one planet to another with a wave of his little green hand?

Because the Expanded Universe - as a whole - imbues characters with abilities beyond ALL of the movie characters. I don't know about you, but if I went into Revenge of the Sith and saw Palpatine chuck a black hole at someone - I'd be a little mad. If he could do that, he'd be too powerful to defeat.

Kyp Durron could beat Yoda by the logic of the Expanded Universe. Perhaps all of Luke's Academy. I like the Expanded Universe - like the Thrawn Trilogy and so forth. But the Expanded Universe as a whole is full of much too powerful characters.

But that's MY opinion.

Originally posted by Darth_Emodas
Lol pathetic? You're arguing about characters that were never mentioned in the movie. Remember, if it contradicts the films, it is FALSE.

But continue, it is quite amusing to watch all the supposition.

First off, if you don't think EU is a viable source, you are in the wrong section. This is an EU subforum.

Second, them not being in the movie isn't a contradiction. Learn how to use words better.