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Ok, feats CAN NOT be applied here. No saying that Sidious did a whole bunch of **** with the Clone Wars. We all know he did, it dosnt matter.
What im interested in, is how they explained their power in 1. lightsaber combat. 2. Force affinity. 3. A duel. Thats it, only those 3, no manipulations. AND NO SIDIOUS/BANE FANBOYISM

Sidious=most powerful sith in history.

Sidious wins, he according to several sources is the most powerful sith lord in history and has demonstrated more devastating dark side power.

Sidious wins, ifwhen Sidious breaks through Bane's saber defense a simple jolt of lightning, and Bane's out for the count.
Sidious has shown well simply epic Force feats and has a few saber feats to go with that.

I don't see Bane winning this.

Power doesn't always equal a win, and it especially won't equal one here.



I disagree, Bane has matched him in lightning and telekinetic powers. All Sidious has going for him is his mental powers, which Bane has in fact demonstrated a high level of resistance to.



I disagree again. It will take alot for Sidious to trump Bane in pure blade-to-blade combat, seeing as Bane arguably has more skill in that area and has displayed comparable speed. The Orbalisks also ad a considerable advantage to Bane.



Not only has Sidious never displayed the ability to utilize lightning mid-combat, but it requires a hell of a lot to overcome Banes orbalisks- an excess of a million volts, so its doubtful Sidious could do so simply or without effort.

It really should be specified what Bane and Sidious this is. A Revenge Sidious would probably tie with A Rule of two Bane, but a Dark Empire Sidious would possibly edge it.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Power doesn't always equal a win, and it especially won't equal one here.
Yet the quote is backed up my NUMEROUS sources regarding his power.




While Bane DOES have nice force lightning abilities, they are hardly on par with Sidious'. Furthermore, Sidious owns Bane in force knowledge and techniques.




Arguably more skill? Still making up bullshit here Nebaris jr? Sidious WILL have a lot of trouble with Bane but judging from his fights with Mace and Yoda, while not picking up a blade for almost 13 years, he'll win this one.




Mid-combat? You mean when he sprayed Yoda on the senate pods? Bane might be ridiculously powerful but not enough to defeat Sidious.


A ROTS Sidious would win with much difficulty. A DE Sidious will win with little difficulty.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Power doesn't always equal a win, and it especially won't equal one here. Either power, skill, or mastery does. Sidious has them all.





During Sidious' sithisis ritual he reduced a giant sith worm to ash with lightning (note: this was about months prior to ROTS). After Vader's fight with Maul, Sidious reduced three highly trained dark prophets to charred bone, at the same time, and using only one hand. While dying and unable to call upon his full power, Sidious was able to put Leia on her ass, mortally wound Brand (even protected with armor), and Instantly kill Rayf with lightning.

Sidious has also demonstrated great control over his lightning. He took out maybe over 40 stormtroopers with lightning, while controling the bolts to go around his royal guards.

Sidious was incredible with TK. Not only was he able to levitate and throw senate pods with great speed and ease, but he also ripped them out of durasteel restraints like ripping leaves from a tree. Sidious also disintigrated a lightsaber with the wave of his hand.



Prove Bane's skill is above Sidious'. Sidious did kill some four of the best swordsmen the jedi order ever produced, in seconds. He then went on to force Windu back, a jedi who was fast enough to land six blows to Vastor before Vastor could blink, and strong enough to tear battle droids with his bare hands. Don't forget that Sidious matched Yoda in speed and skill with the blade.



Far lesser beings have shown to utilize lightning in mid-combat, such as one of Krayts minions (her name's at the tip of my tongue), but you're telling me Sidious, who is a far more powerful and skilled user of the technique, could not?

While Bane can take an awful lot with his orbalisk, Sidious too can take a lot of blows. During his contest with Galen, Sidious took a full force explosion, and seemed to be unharmed by it. In DE Leia tried to kill Sidious by dropping a cooling unit on him, who "shrugged off the crushing impact of over a ton of machinery." Also during his fight with Windu, Sidious took the full affects of his own lightning without being weakened at all.

Both are superior to Bane.

Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
Far lesser beings have shown to utilize lightning in mid-combat, such as one of Krayts minions (her name's at the tip of my tongue)

Darth Talon.

Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
While Bane can take an awful lot with his orbalisk, Sidious too can take a lot of blows. During his contest with Galen, Sidious took a full force explosion, and seemed to be unharmed by it. In DE Leia tried to kill Sidious by dropping a cooling unit on him, who "shrugged off the crushing impact of over a ton of machinery."

Really? I haven't read DE for years, but I was under the impression that he stopped the cooling unit before it hit him.

Originally posted by Incanus
Ok, feats CAN NOT be applied here.

How the heck can that work?

How are we supposed to debate any "vs." without providing examples of what each side can do?

Well the DE handbook said he shrugged off the crushing impact, so i took it that it must of hit him. But to me, it looked like it disintigrated upon contact with his body.

Incanus
Ok, feats CAN NOT be applied here. No saying that Sidious did a whole bunch of **** with the Clone Wars. We all know he did, it dosnt matter.
What im interested in, is how they explained their power in 1. lightsaber combat. 2. Force affinity. 3. A duel. Thats it, only those 3, no manipulations. AND NO SIDIOUS/BANE FANBOYISM no feats lol

1. bane wins because he is big and has armor and sidious is old and hasn't used a lightsaber in a really really long time

2. sidious is the most powerful sith evar the book says so

3. bane wins because he is big and has armor and sidious is powerful but i dont think he is more powerful than bane is big or armored

...

Basically, you make no ****ing sense.

It looked to me like it broke apart when it made contact with his shield. That would also fit with the sourcebook's description of what happened.

Originally posted by chilled monkey
How the heck can that work?

How are we supposed to debate any "vs." without providing examples of what each side can do?

by feats i mean as in manipulation of the Clone Wars,and making a galaxy spanning network of spies, etc. making srry about the confusion but thats what i ment. And what about Bane holding back an ECHANI jedi weapons master fighting Jar'Kai, which he can not effectivly counter, and another jedi master, and jedi knight, and all that after barely using a lightsaber after 20 YEARS. Bane is also like fighting a force of nature, he is incredibly strong in both the force and physically. He is also technically a perfect being. And no its not a feat to be the Sith'ari.

Originally posted by Incanus
by feats i mean as in manipulation of the Clone Wars, making a galxy network of spies. etc.

http://static.pyzam.com/img/funnypics/0/pyzamOmgWtf.jpg

Lol kitty with a rubix cube. where did you get that? but Sidious 66 asked

Huh?

You asked how we can do a vs forum without applying feats, i was alking a about Sidious manipulating the Clone Wars, Bane making a galaxy spanning network of spies, that stuff. I wanted like, combat feats posted, not other feats.

Never asked that.

Originally posted by chilled monkey
How the heck can that work?

How are we supposed to debate any "vs." without providing examples of what each side can do? [/QUOTE

heres your post dude.

Chilled monkey = SIDIOUS 66?

DS, get off his account please.

English please?

Ok i double checked it was chilled monkey

by Incanus
And what about Bane holding back an ECHANI jedi weapons master fighting Jar'Kai, which he can not effectivly counter, and another jedi master, and jedi knight, and all that after barely using a lightsaber after 20 YEARS. Bane is also like fighting a force of nature, he is incredibly strong in both the force and physically. He is also technically a perfect being. And no its not a feat to be the Sith'ari.

So he killed a featless echani weapons master, Revan beat the best featless echani warrior of his time in H2H combat. we cannot compare how good either echani was because we have no feats to go with them. Also the gap between POD and ROT i think is 10 years not 20.

Now sidious killed 3 jedi master in under 60 seconds all of which had their lightsaber drawn and ready for such an attack. and sidious hasn't used his lightsaber in 20+ years.

that>besting a featless echani weapon master.

and all of the feats bane has compared to all of the feats sidious has all comes down to absolutley nothing when multiple CANON sources state that sidious is the most powerful, Sith to have ever lived, and is more than likely the second most powerful being that ever lived in the univers next to luke.

Actually Sidious had used his lightsaber in that 20 year span, and the i htink 1 feat is listed, maybe 2, i will say the one i remember: And Farfalla remembered how she cut swaths through the lines of the Sith' Her blades seemed to be everywhere' and she was accurated enough to hit a small junction of maybe 1 cm or 2 mm posibly with a lightsaber. And she mastered every single form of lightsaber combat. ever.

What an excellent thread idea! This is an extremely interesting question that has never been asked or debated before in any other thread!

I hope your being sarcastic............

by Incanus
Actually Sidious had used his lightsaber in that 20 year span, and the i htink 1 feat is listed, maybe 2, i will say the one i remember: And Farfalla remembered how she cut swaths through the lines of the Sith' Her blades seemed to be everywhere' and she was accurated enough to hit a small junction of maybe 1 cm or 2 mm posibly with a lightsaber. And she mastered every single form of lightsaber . ever.

When did sidous use it? Ya in training maul he did but bane did the same with zannah. other than that though he didn't use his lightsaber at all.

GL himself stated the PT was the golden era of the jedi in Lightsaber combat so those masters (according to cannon) > the ones bane fought.

Sidious wins.

Originally posted by xxxpoppunker182
and all of the feats bane has compared to all of the feats sidious has all comes down to absolutley nothing when multiple CANON sources state that sidious is the most powerful, Sith to have ever lived, and is more than likely the second most powerful being that ever lived in the univers next to luke.

True enough, but being more powerful doesn't always guarantee victory.

Just saying.

Originally posted by xxxpoppunker182
GL himself stated the PT was the golden era of the jedi in Lightsaber combat so those masters (according to cannon) > the ones bane fought.

Yeah but he only meant that "the PT was the golden era of the jedi in Lightsaber combat" compared to the OT (in which the only Jedi present are an elderly man, a cyborg and a rookie). Basically he said that to explain why the lightsabre fighting in the PT was so different to that in the OT (from an is-story perspective).

GL himself has stated that he doesn't read the books, comics etc.

I read somewhere else Sidious used his lightsaber to kill some things i cant remember what though............. somewhere in these very forums............

Originally posted by chilled monkey
True enough, but being more powerful doesn't always guarantee victory.

Just saying.
It helps a lot



Doesn't matter. GL's word is still canonical to everything

Originally posted by Lightsnake
It helps a lot

Not denying that. I'm simply pointing out that it isn't an absolute guarantee of victory.

Originally posted by Lightsnake
Doesn't matter. GL's word is still canonical to everything

Read between the lines. When GL is only talking about the movies, his word doesn't take into account EU characters.

Originally posted by chilled monkey
Read between the lines. When GL is only talking about the movies, his word doesn't take into account EU characters.


Wrong. It encompasses everything. Let's saying in the EU contradicts what GL said or had in mind. That means it's wrong. GL is inconsistent and a walking contradiction, but his word is absolute and final.

Wait, IS Bane an EU character? i mean, he cant be because Sidious was part of Banes order so.......... WHA???????????

by chilled monkey
True enough, but being more powerful doesn't always guarantee victory.


You do have a good point and even though on paper sids>bane as of feats and power there are still certain SCENARIOS that bane COULD beat sids but in a neutral setting there is nothing bane can do against the most powerful of sith lords darth sidious second most powerful being in that the galaxy has ever seen.

Originally posted by Incanus
Wait, IS Bane an EU character? i mean, he cant be because Sidious was part of Banes order so.......... WHA???????????

Bane is an EU character who cares if Sids is part of his rule of 2. And GL invented bane when he wrote the story for the pt. but bane is still an eu character.

an EU character is someone who was invented outside of the movies. Like quin vos he is an EU character based off of a random guy in ep1 even though he is in ep1 he is still an eu character.

Ok, thnx for clarifying........

Originally posted by xxxpoppunker182
You do have a good point and even though on paper sids>bane as of feats and power there are still certain SCENARIOS that bane COULD beat sids but in a neutral setting there is nothing bane can do against the most powerful of sith lords darth sidious second most powerful being in that the galaxy has ever seen.

You said it perfectly.

Originally posted by xxxpoppunker182
You do have a good point and even though on paper sids>bane as of feats and power there are still certain SCENARIOS that bane COULD beat sids but in a neutral setting there is nothing bane can do against the most powerful of sith lords darth sidious second most powerful being in that the galaxy has ever seen.
The hell? And what scenarios would those be?





Actually Bane is part of the Order of the Sith Lords/Rule of 2 and there are numerous sources saying that as of TPM, Sidious is the most powerful of Bane's order, including Bane.

I just remembered the one thing about Banes order: Every apprentice must become stronger than the master. So since him they have gotten steadily stronger. So i guess yeah, Sidious is stronger than Bane. What i want to know, in lightsaber and force combat, who would win. In lightsaber combat, no force feats may be applied. In force, no lightsaber feats may be applied. In all out any. World killers cant at all though, because they are on a world so Sidious would kill himself.......

Originally posted by Incanus
I just remembered the one thing about Banes order: Every apprentice must become stronger than the master. So since him they have gotten steadily stronger. So i guess yeah, Sidious is stronger than Bane. What i want to know, in lightsaber and force combat, who would win. In lightsaber combat, no force feats may be applied. In force, no lightsaber feats may be applied. In all out any. World killers cant at all though, because they are on a world so Sidious would kill himself.......


Not this again. Why do people misinterpret this rule for "sidious must be miles ahead of bane because every apprentice must be stronger than the master and it's been a thousand years since Bane started the sith order!!"

Well, every apprentice must be stronger than the master, and so as time passes they would have to find more powerful people.... but not miles, he would probably be only a little bit ahead of him. Bane would give Sidious the fight of his life. Possibly kill him, thats up to debate.

Bane's Order actually made becoming more powerful than the master a moot point. One only needed to kill them in their sleep to take the mantle, it didn't necessarily require combat and overwhelming power.

Well, i think Sidious may still be weaker than Plageuis because of that, as most apprentices most likely confronted their masters.

Originally posted by Incanus
Well, i think Sidious may still be weaker than Plageuis because of that, as most apprentices most likely confronted their masters. Gideon did a marvelous job at proving Sidious (especially his DE self) as the most powerful Sith in Star Wars.

Well, no one knows how powerful PLageuis is, but can Sidious create life? Plageuis is rumored (emphasis on rumoured i do not know for certain) to have created Anakin. As Anakin had no father, it does make a very small bit of sense. Sure, Palpatine could make that wormhole thingy (source for that anyways?) and Plageuis creates life by being able to influence midi-chlorians, hence why Anakin had more than Yoda, he was created by Plageuis as a pure creation of the Force.

Originally posted by Incanus
Well, no one knows how powerful PLageuis is, but can Sidious create life? Plageuis is rumored (emphasis on rumoured i do not know for certain) to have created Anakin. As Anakin had no father, it does make a very small bit of sense. Sure, Palpatine could make that wormhole thingy (source for that anyways?) and Plageuis creates life by being able to influence midi-chlorians, hence why Anakin had more than Yoda, he was created by Plageuis as a pure creation of the Force. Yes. But what's your point?

Plageuis may be slightly more powerful. No one knows about Plageuis at all. Only how he died.

Originally posted by Dr McBeefington
The hell? And what scenarios would those be?


Well for example look at tpm obi-wan vs maul in all hinestly maul an paper>tpm obi but obi wan in that scenario won.

something that we cannot gauge in hypothetical situations are mistakes and luck. For example I could fight a black belt in Judo 10 times and lose all 10 times but say i fight him 100 times and for some reason that time i get one lucky shot when he messes up and that causes me to win.

I'm just saying there is never an absolute definitive this person ALWAYS wins against this person.

Originally posted by Incanus
Plageuis may be slightly more powerful. No one knows about Plageuis at all. Only how he died.

He can't be more powerful when multiple scources say that palpatine>every other sith who ever lived......

sorry for the double post

Can some1 plz give those sources? i havnt read them, and where did it say he can create a WORMHOLE??????

by Incanus
Can some1 plz give those sources? i havnt read them, and where did it say he can create a WORMHOLE??????

About 90% if not every piece of literature that sidious is in.......

the wormhole thing i believe was in the DE comics

Originally posted by Incanus
Can some1 plz give those sources? i havnt read them, and where did it say he can create a WORMHOLE?????? The Dark Empire comic books, published by Dark Horse Comics sometime in the mid 90s. Palaptine comes back like 6-7 years after Return of the Jedi in a clone body he had secretly prepared on a planet in the Deep Core. He amasses a huge fleet including several Star Destroyers with Death Star-style superlasers in them, turns Luke to the Dark Side, takes back a large portion of lost Imperial territory, and can summon a giant wormhole in space which obliterated an entire New Republic fleet of thousands of ships.

And those are considered canon? HOW THE HELL CAN HE DO THAT?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?

Because he is more powerful than bane and yes, it is canon.

Damn LL, you have never ending patience.

Originally posted by Incanus
And those are considered canon? HOW THE HELL CAN HE DO THAT?!?!?!?!?!?!?!? Apparently it's a horribly drawn and filled with terrible dialogue, but it's C-canon. To Lucas, none of the EU ever really happened, but for the fan's sake he allows us to have this.

Oh and he's killed when Luke, Leia, and Anakin combine their Light Sided goodness to send Palpatine's wormhole (he had previously admitted that even he couldn't control it) out of whack and it killed him when it destroyed his superlaser-firing Eclipse and his secret planet, Byss. He would return a short while later in another clone and do his whole "evil" thing. This one was killed when Han shot him in the back, and as his spirit was trying to possess the unborn Anakin's body, a cyborg Jedi form the Clone Wars, Empatjayos Brand, sacrificed himself to drag Palpatine's spirit in to the "Force Underworld" forever.


Horrible story which ruined the Chosen One prophecy and only served to remind us all that, even as Lucas demonstrated unoriginality with a 2nd Death Star, so do authors who are trying to capitalize on Star Wars' success.

Originally posted by Dr McBeefington
Damn LL, you have never ending patience. It's a virtue.

Wait, he you cant apply the wormhole in single combat then. That would be face to face, and if he cant control it, then he is screwed if he uses it, he would kill himself, and then there would be no winner.

Originally posted by Incanus
Wait, he you cant apply the wormhole in single combat then. That would be face to face, and if he cant control it, then he is screwed if he uses it, he would kill himself, and then there would be no winner. Essentially yes, but the ability to manifest such an unimaginably destructive technique at his own will (unlike Nihilus' Drain which is a result of animalistic instinct) is indicative of tremendous knowledge, power, and Force reserves. Apparently his Force Lightning seared the armor and flesh right off a group of Stormtrooper's bones.

Yeah, i can believe that with no knowledge of the source or anything. Could Sidious produce millions of volts 2? i bet he can but just want to make sure. I know Banes lightning is like that, but unless we have Bane vs 1,000,000 stormtroopers thread, we will never know. No im not gonna make that thread, Bane would own their asses.

Originally posted by Incanus
Yeah, i can believe that with no knowledge of the source or anything. Could Sidious produce millions of volts 2? i bet he can but just want to make sure. I know Banes lightning is like that, but unless we have Bane vs 1,000,000 stormtroopers thread, we will never know. No im not gonna make that thread, Bane would own their asses. I don't know if Papatine's Lightning is ever measured. Drew Karpyshyn definitely isn't one of my favorite Star Wars authors; the guy has a thing for statistics that really detracts from the literary flow of the story.

What, you think he overpowered Bane? Bane would have to be very powerful not only because he was the Sith'ari, but because he is, he was ment to destroy the Sith and rebuild them to be even stronger. He would have to be very strong if he was gooing to do that.....

sideous wins. this has been done before with the same result.

Originally posted by Incanus
What, you think he overpowered Bane? Bane would have to be very powerful not only because he was the Sith'ari, but because he is, he was ment to destroy the Sith and rebuild them to be even stronger. He would have to be very strong if he was gooing to do that..... I've got nothing against his power. In truth, if I had the power to rewrite Star Wars as I see fit, every successive generation of Sith and Jedi would get steadily weaker and weaker until we reach Anakin fulfilling the prophecy, but hey that's just me.

The problem I had was Karpy's writing style. Reading the novel, I felt that it was written purely to placate the fans who love lots of Force powers and lightsabers, and tediously baseline backstabbings and schemes. It all felt a bit forced and maladroit. Now compare the Bane novels to Cloak of Deception or the Revenge of the Sith novel... hmm mm! They're pure literary gold by comparison.

It has? I mean, i know Sidious has an almost certantty of victory, but he could be suprised to see the man who made his order. Maybe even respect him or something, because i think we can all agree Bane is no pushover.

Again. Shock and awe at the time travel factor, just isn't a factor.

Look, I know im losing this, but Sidious is NOT all powerful, or he wouldnt have been killed by a blaster shot in the back by Han, he ould have stopped it somehow. Bane obviously has a small chance of victory, in every vs thread both have a chance of victory. But i think we should wait for a more developed Bane character before we make any solid conclusions. Right now we have 3 books, and a comic i think. Another is coming out, and maybe more.

Originally posted by Incanus
Look, I know im losing this, but Sidious is NOT all powerful, or he wouldnt have been killed by a blaster shot in the back by Han, he ould have stopped it somehow. Bane obviously has a small chance of victory, in every vs thread both have a chance of victory. But i think we should wait for a more developed Bane character before we make any solid conclusions. Right now we have 3 books, and a comic i think. Another is coming out, and maybe more.

Sids isn't all powerful no one is all powerful in SW with the exception of one thing which is the force itself.BUT sids is second ONLY to Luke end of story.

the blaster shot didn't kill sidious at all it was the jedi cyborg friend of luke and all the jedi that whent before them that took sids out.

and lets say more is developed on bane to the point where he is uber awesome in the end Sids>bane ALWAYS its CANON now stop being a fanboy.

Dude, canon can change, anything can. If Lucas changes his mind and wants Bandon to be the strongest sith ever then it is. I just have NOT READ ANY MATERIAL THAT WOULD SUGGEST SIDIOUS IS LIKE THAT. I have only read the Bane books, but have been looking for some time, about a year, for stuff like what you are saying.

heh. noob considers himself a canon expert.

G cannon. George lucas himself said it. Which means until someone say something else, Darth Sideous is the most powerful sith in the universe.

Originally posted by Incanus
Dude, canon can change, anything can. If Lucas changes his mind and wants Bandon to be the strongest sith ever then it is. I just have NOT READ ANY MATERIAL THAT WOULD SUGGEST SIDIOUS IS LIKE THAT. I have only read the Bane books, but have been looking for some time, about a year, for stuff like what you are saying.

Canon can change but guess what it Sids being the most powerful sith will NEVER be retconned and Bane will NEVER be the most powerful sith Ever.

Here is a thought for you though who do you think is BETTER than bane? like who in your opinion can kill bane.

Ok then. Sidious kills Bane, but with considerable effort. Im ok with that dude, im just trying to see if there are some things i may be reminded of that would kill Sidious, but I got nothing.

Originally posted by ~:Mr.Anderson:~
heh. noob considers himself a canon expert.

G cannon. George lucas himself said it. Which means until someone say something else, Darth Sideous is the most powerful sith in the universe.

the only way for G canon to be retconned is if GL himself or Leeland chee says so.

Originally posted by Incanus
Ok then. Sidious kills Bane, but with considerable effort. Im ok with that dude, im just trying to see if there are some things i may be reminded of that would kill Sidious, but I got nothing.

sidious kills bane with little effort.

again guys sorry for the double post

Wait, so one of the most powerful sith lords in history, and the most powerful, Bane is killed with little effort? Every one knows that Bane is well versed in lightning, Sidious wont pull that on alot. Sidious cant use a wormhole on Bane, because then they would both die. It would take alot of effort dude, Sidious would always have a hard time killing him. No argument. And anyways i lost but there is the odd chance that Bane wins. Out of say, 100 fights, i would say Bane would win at least 1 through an odd mishap. But there would be effort, dude, lots of it.

DE Sidious will do Bane in. Not "easily", but it won't be challengiung enough for Palpatine to contemplate the possibility he may lose. Or break a sweat.


1/100, sure. But that's 99% odds stacked against him.

Originally posted by Incanus
Wait, so one of the most powerful sith lords in history, and the most powerful, Bane is killed with little effort? Every one knows that Bane is well versed in lightning, Sidious wont pull that on alot. Sidious cant use a wormhole on Bane, because then they would both die. It would take alot of effort dude, Sidious would always have a hard time killing him. No argument. And anyways i lost but there is the odd chance that Bane wins. Out of say, 100 fights, i would say Bane would win at least 1 through an odd mishap. But there would be effort, dude, lots of it.

nope. Bane may be one of the greats but sids in all his power is just THAT much more powerful than Bane so is yoda and caedous and Luke and cade. Possibly ragnos as well but ragnos is my opinion.

Ragnos IS more powerful than Bane, at least in force lightning. But Yoda has a 50/50 chance with Bane, as both are like, uber jedi/sith. Caedus has practiacally nothing i am aware of that would give him the win, so can you state some combat feats? And Luke is a force god, he cant die except from old age because the ppl at lucasarts thought it would be great to make a guy that pwnz all and can destroy the galaxy when he perverted the jedi order. Ragnos covered an entire PLANET in his froce lightning from orbit. I heard it from a friend who reads a whole bunch of stuff and probably saw it in a comic/book.

Originally posted by Incanus
Ragnos IS more powerful than Bane, at least in force lightning. But Yoda has a 50/50 chance with Bane, as both are like, uber jedi/sith. Caedus has practiacally nothing i am aware of that would give him the win, so can you state some combat feats? And Luke is a force god, he cant die except from old age because the ppl at lucasarts thought it would be great to make a guy that pwnz all and can destroy the galaxy when he perverted the jedi order. Ragnos covered an entire PLANET in his froce lightning from orbit. I heard it from a friend who reads a whole bunch of stuff and probably saw it in a comic/book. What? Where is this Lightning covered planet coming from? The guy's got less sources on his feats and abilitites than Revan or the Exile.

Originally posted by Incanus
Ragnos IS more powerful than Bane, at least in force lightning. But Yoda has a 50/50 chance with Bane, as both are like, uber jedi/sith. Caedus has practiacally nothing i am aware of that would give him the win, so can you state some combat feats? And Luke is a force god, he cant die except from old age because the ppl at lucasarts thought it would be great to make a guy that pwnz all and can destroy the galaxy when he perverted the jedi order. Ragnos covered an entire PLANET in his froce lightning from orbit. I heard it from a friend who reads a whole bunch of stuff and probably saw it in a comic/book.

YOur friend lied to you about ragnos the ONLY time you see him is when he is dead. he has NEVER been shown using lightning you know NOTHING about ragnos

Yoda is the most devastating foe the darkside has ever known. if you watch ep3 he beats sids in the lightsaber fight. but all this is for a different time

and i'm fairly sure I know how luke will die after reading OMEN. I highly doubt its of old age.

as for caedous read his wookieepedia entry

Ok, i did a while back but i can not think of any truly exceptional feats. Bane fought an echani jedi battlemaster, a jedi master, AND a jedi knight, to a standstill while they were empowered by a jedi masters years-of-perfecting battle meditation.

Originally posted by Incanus
Ok, i did a while back but i can not think of any truly exceptional feats. Bane fought an echani jedi battlemaster, a jedi master, AND a jedi knight, to a standstill while they were empowered by a jedi masters years-of-perfecting battle meditation.

how is it you FAIL to see that ISN'T anything considerable in comparison to yoda?

I was comparing to Caedus.

by Incanus
I was comparing to Caedus.

o ok still go read his page on wookiee

No.

Just make it easy on us: what feat of his that is in combat, matches fighting an enhanced echani jedi weapons master, a jedi master, and a jedi knight to a standstill? Killing Mara Jade? Bane would own her ass in an instant.

how about being second to LOTF luke in lightsaber combat (THE most powerful being in sw aside from the force itself)

but make it easy on me and just go read his page i'm goin to bed.

The fact remains that...

Originally posted by OOBAEW

Control: Displayed the precision to use the Force on a subatomic scale, a completely unparalleled display of control.

Lol what? All Sith who created Holocrons did this...

I

am

'tarded

Guys, stop double posting the edit time limit is 15 minutes, you guys are posting within 1-3

The amount of Sidious wankery in this thread makes me sad. I stand by my original decision- ROTS sidious ties, possibly losing, DE sidious edges it with difficulty.

Originally posted by Nephthys
The amount of Sidious wankery in this thread makes me sad. I stand by my original decision- ROTS sidious ties, possibly losing, DE sidious edges it with difficulty.

Wankery? That's hilarious coming from somebody that refuses to offer any kind of evidence.

Oh gee, I'm 'hilarious', didn't see that one coming.

And I argued this a year ago with Crimson. It took ages and eventually we agreed upon my above statement.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Oh gee, I'm 'hilarious', didn't see that one coming.

And I argued this a year ago with Crimson. It took ages and eventually we agreed upon my above statement.


Sure you did. I haven't seen someone take so many credits and yet win no debates before. You're definitely a funny guy. Not to mention if MC DID agree with you, it doesn't make it any more right. Try again.

@ Dr McBeefington

To you actually think even Sidious would kill BANE with no problem at all?

This is the second thread in which you have used the word "wankery" in such an ambiguous manner. Elaborate. Why is saying that Sidious will win this fight "wankery"?



Nobody cares.

This statement, in fact, is a demonstration of "wankery" at its finest. You provide a conclusion and don't bother attempting to corroborate or prove it, simply to fellate one of your favorite characters.

I don't care if you have to have a certain sock PM you the argument for you, if you're going to indulge in condescension and throw words like "wankery" into the fray, you'd best be damn willing to back up what you say.







I haven't been checking up on your other arguments with DS, but here, his foot is wedged firmly between your rosy red cheeks.

Bane would win 1/100 fights maybe 2

This stuff never gets old.

Originally posted by Incanus
@ Dr McBeefington

To you actually think even Sidious would kill BANE with no problem at all?

How many fallacies can you make? I never stated anything of the sort. You're going from one extreme to the other.

Originally posted by Gideon

I haven't been checking up on your other arguments with DS, but here, his foot is wedged firmly between your rosy red cheeks.

It's nice to see you're still alive Gideon, I was wondering where you went.

by Incanus
Bane would win 1/100 maybe 2

ya by luck either way sidious takes bane with little effort.

Originally posted by Slash_KMC
This stuff never gets old.

I agree completely.

@Gideon nice to see you around again.

Thanks.

But it isn't permanent. I just wanted to point that out to Exodus.

Ciao.

Originally posted by Gideon
Thanks.

But it isn't permanent. I just wanted to point that out to Exodus.

Ciao.

Good, i'm glad you're getting out and socializing with humans(especially females) again. Kudos.

I want to remind everyone (Icanus) that we do not interact with socks. It is a warnable offense. Thank you.

I just saw how Rex changed neb's posts to I AM TARDED.

That was awesome Rex.

Originally posted by OOBAEW
'tarded ROFL

Originally posted by xxxpoppunker182
ya by luck either way sidious takes bane with little effort.
There is no way Bane would kill Sidious without uber effort, and an odd mishap to give him the win.

Originally posted by Incanus
There is no way Bane would kill Sidious without uber effort, and an odd mishap to give him the win.

I agree completely

Saying that he does so with 'little effort', 99 times out of a 100, and simply becuase he's 'the most powerful evar!!', without any consideration of extraneous circumstances, is what I count as 'wankery'. It would be like if I argued that Sidious would own Mace Windu simply becuase he's 'Da Boss', without taking into consideration Vaapad or Shatterpoint.



That's unnecessarily rude. I was merely stating that I'd already argued this fight, explaining why I was disinterested in doing it again.



How is saying Bane ties and losses 'fellating' him? How is simply stating an opinion 'wankery at its finest'? People do it all the time in just about every thread. I just don't want to get into the arguments and flame wars of the old days over Bane v Sids.



You should, its pretty interesting, if you can stomach the snipping, and your opinion is always appreciated.

Unnecessarily rude? No, I think it was necessary enough. I'll be happy to explain the situation to you.



You mentioned Sidious wankery. What Sidious wankery? So people are assuming that he would spank Bane; you haven't exactly provided the counterargument of ages to prove them wrong. It's been established through multiple sources that Palpatine was more powerful than Bane as of the prequel trilogy.

...

I want to pause to relish the sensation of Palpatine's unflinching superiority over Bane.

...

All right. Now, this fact is important because it establishes something important: even at his canonical "weakest," Palpatine has an advantage on Bane; he's stronger in the Force and his manipulations of it surpass Bane's by a frightening degree. Because this is a combat scenario and Bane has certain advantages of his own (i.e. orbalisk armor and maintained lightsaber prowess), power might not mean the deciding factor.

But you don't bother to offer such an argument. You come in and blindly assert that "Bane will tie or possibly win" or "he'll lose with extreme difficulty" against two different incarnations of a Force user who is more powerful than Bane in either form.

That is wankery. Though power is not necessarily a deciding factor, it is the exception, not the rule. Coming in and promoting one character, saying he'll win, without backing it up is wankery when the character is established to be weaker than the other character without question.

For example: Yoda vs. Ventress.

Now, it's annoying when people just spam the thread "lawl Yoda." But it's not like such a fight requires an intricate argument as to why Yoda will win, does it? He's established to be more powerful than Ventress, he's the favorite, the expected victor.

Now if someone waltzes in and shouts "Ventress," we expect him or her to explain themselves.

You lectured the rest of the group because they didn't come to the conclusion that you reached, and you don't even bother to explain how you came to that conclusion in the first place?

I see a glaring double standard. Which is what I called you out on. If you want to lay into people for just assuming Sidious will win, go ahead. But the "lulz Bane ties and possibly wins and then loses with extreme difficulty" doesn't fly either.

Originally posted by Gideon
Unnecessarily rude? No, I think it was necessary enough. I'll be happy to explain the situation to you.



You mentioned Sidious wankery. What Sidious wankery? So people are assuming that he would spank Bane; you haven't exactly provided the counterargument of ages to prove them wrong. It's been established through multiple sources that Palpatine was more powerful than Bane as of the prequel trilogy.

...

I want to pause to relish the sensation of Palpatine's unflinching superiority over Bane.

...

All right. Now, this fact is important because it establishes something important: even at his canonical "weakest," Palpatine has an advantage on Bane; he's stronger in the Force and his manipulations of it surpass Bane's by a frightening degree. Because this is a combat scenario and Bane has certain advantages of his own (i.e. orbalisk armor and maintained lightsaber prowess), power might not mean the deciding factor.

But you don't bother to offer such an argument. You come in and blindly assert that "Bane will tie or possibly win" or "he'll lose with extreme difficulty" against two different incarnations of a Force user who is more powerful than Bane in either form.

That is wankery. Though power is not necessarily a deciding factor, it is the exception, not the rule. Coming in and promoting one character, saying he'll win, without backing it up is wankery when the character is established to be weaker than the other character without question.

For example: Yoda vs. Ventress.

Now, it's annoying when people just spam the thread "lawl Yoda." But it's not like such a fight requires an intricate argument as to why Yoda will win, does it? He's established to be more powerful than Ventress, he's the favorite, the expected victor.

Now if someone waltzes in and shouts "Ventress," we expect him or her to explain themselves.

You lectured the rest of the group because they didn't come to the conclusion that you reached, and you don't even bother to explain how you came to that conclusion in the first place?

I see a glaring double standard. Which is what I called you out on. If you want to lay into people for just assuming Sidious will win, go ahead. But the "lulz Bane ties and possibly wins and then loses with extreme difficulty" doesn't fly either.

That........that was just beautiful.

Gideon can't possibly stay retired.

Yeah I agree, that would be bad, if I had done that. However, I actually made the basis for an argument including factors I think would be applicable on the very first page-

Originally posted by Nephthys
Power doesn't always equal a win, and it especially won't equal one here.



I disagree, Bane has matched him in lightning and telekinetic powers. All Sidious has going for him is his mental powers, which Bane has in fact demonstrated a high level of resistance to.



I disagree again. It will take alot for Sidious to trump Bane in pure blade-to-blade combat, seeing as Bane arguably has more skill in that area and has displayed comparable speed. The Orbalisks also ad a considerable advantage to Bane.



Not only has Sidious never displayed the ability to utilize lightning mid-combat, but it requires a hell of a lot to overcome Banes orbalisks- an excess of a million volts, so its doubtful Sidious could do so simply or without effort.

It really should be specified what Bane and Sidious this is. A Revenge Sidious would probably tie with A Rule of two Bane, but a Dark Empire Sidious would possibly edge it.

As you can see, I didn't just waltz in here and scream 'Bane wins!', I originally posted reasons behind my opinion, which you obviously didn't notice.

How has Bane matched him in lightning and TK powers? While Bane's lightning is powerful, it's not on the level of Sidious' lightning. TK powers? Someone must have forgotten to play TFU.




This calls for proof. Simply stating it doesn't make it so. Sidious was able to defeat some of the Order's finest swordsman and then go toe to toe with Mace while not picking up a blade for 13 years. He was able to make a cutout of Darth Maul faster than Maul could follow. While Bane is good, there's no evidence that his blade skills are on the level of Sidious.




Sidious vs. Yoda. Sidious vs. Marek. He HAS displayed the ability to utilize lightning mid combat and has done it rather successfully. And the Orbalisks? A million volts? What are you smoking exactly? We saw what Bane did to himself with his own lightning, just imagine what Sidious would do.


This is nothing more than baseless speculation.

Originally posted by Nephthys
I just don't want to get into the arguments and flame wars of the old days over Bane v Sids.

Originally posted by Nephthys


So wait, you're inserting your unvalidated opinion but when someone explains to you that you're wrong, you bring this up? If this was the case, you wouldn't have posted in the thread.

Originally posted by Nephthys
As you can see, I didn't just waltz in here and scream 'Bane wins!', I originally posted reasons behind my opinion, which you obviously didn't notice.

You didn't bother to corroborate or prove any of it. Bane arguably has more skill than Sidious in lightsaber combat?

Prove it.

Bane can resist Sidious's mental powers?

Prove it.

It requires effort for Sidious to produce lightning over a million volts?

Prove it.

So, no. You simply said a long-winded, baseless version of "Bane wins lawl!"

Proof, Exodus. Proof.

Fine.



Both of them have shown the capacity to vaporise beings with their lightning. Sidious' has shown the power to force Mace Windu back, and Bane's has torn through Force shields like paper. They're relatively matched as far as lightning goes in my books.

And yes I have played TFU, and seen Sidious lift a small shuttle. So? Bane has blown beings apart with his, as well as that temple, they're reasonably matched there too.



All of which he did by simply being faster than his opponents, and stronger in the force, which as POD shows allows people to muffle the pre-cognition of your opponents, and as Kas'im points out is the real factor in a saberfight. Bane has displayed force and speed cose or level with that of Sidious and Banes orbalisk armour should pick up the slack for discrepancies between them.



I meant mid saber fight, Dooku-style. Both times you mentioned he clearly had lulls in which to unleash his power, but he's never done it when hes locked in a duel with someone, as the original poster said he would easily do. If sidious does unleash a lightning barrage at him outside of saber dueling, he could block or evade it adequately.



http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f38/pooligan/Mr_Mackey.jpg



Well now we simply have a difference of opinion. I felt like I had done enough to warrant an opinion (as much as anyone had) and so I gave it, you feel I didn't, so you disagree. I already explained, I really didn't want to get into an argument on this subject. But whatever, judge me all you want. If you think I'm a terrible person for it, thats your bussiness.

Ironically, I have the ultimate weapon for this situation.

Is it Love and Fellowship?

Originally posted by Nephthys
Is it Love and Fellowship?

It is my beloved essay.

Fine, I'll go get it from the bathroom and re-read read it.

In the interest of fairness, one cannot cite Palpatine's manipulations of the Rogue Shadow as concrete evidence of his abilities, given that the cutscene is non-canon.

On the other hand, objectively, since the cutscene represents a "what if" scenario had Marek opted to finish off Vader, one could argue that it is certainly within the realm of Palpatine's abilities.

That's a nice little tug-o-war that I'll let DS and Exodus handle, since legitimate points can be made for both.

Likewise, I have to mention three cases of the Emperor's use of lightning that didn't make it into my essay:

a.) In Betrayal, after a renegade stormtrooper shoots Palpatine's drink out of his hand, Palpatine turns and unleashes Force lightning upon his enemies -- managing enough control to avoid the Royal Guardsman -- and killing all fifty of them.

b.) In Resurrection, Palpatine obliterates three Sith acolytes with Force lightning. This is of particular note because the force of his attack left nothing but a charred skeleton. And such energy came from one hand. It should also be noted that Sith alchemy is an art reserved only for the most powerful practitioners of the dark side, according to the Dark Side Sourcebook. So the acolytes were pretty hardcore.

c.) In Dark Empire, despite being on the verge of death, Palpatine singlehandedly overpowers Leia Organa Solo with lightning and mortally wounds two Jedi with a single burst each.

Who's Gideon's sexy essay and why haven't I seen him post before.

Originally posted by Gideon
In the interest of fairness, one cannot cite Palpatine's manipulations of the Rogue Shadow as concrete evidence of his abilities, given that the cutscene is non-canon.

On the other hand, objectively, since the cutscene represents a "what if" scenario had Marek opted to finish off Vader, one could argue that it is certainly within the realm of Palpatine's abilities.

That's a nice little tug-o-war that I'll let DS and Exodus handle, since legitimate points can be made for both.

Likewise, I have to mention three cases of the Emperor's use of lightning that didn't make it into my essay:

a.) In Betrayal, after a renegade stormtrooper shoots Palpatine's drink out of his hand, Palpatine turns and unleashes Force lightning upon his enemies -- managing enough control to avoid the Royal Guardsman -- and killing all fifty of them. Yes, Sidious has an enormous knowledge of lightning, but so does Bane. Bane kill 3 people at on time with one hand in the air and he barely used it.. He threw his lightsaber about 50 meters or longer, while shooting that lightning. I must givve you the mechanics of lightsaber throw: It is a very difficult thing to pull off, as it requuires the user to blend both force push and force pull, to make the saber spin then arc back to the user. Bane did that while casting lightning that left nothing but ashes i think to 3 people in battle armor, but there may have been corpses i cant remember.

b.) In Resurrection, Palpatine obliterates three Sith acolytes with Force lightning. This is of particular note because the force of his attack left nothing but a charred skeleton. And such energy came from one hand. It should also be noted that Sith alchemy is an art reserved only for the most powerful practitioners of the dark side, according to the Dark Side Sourcebook. So the acolytes were pretty hardcore.

c.) In Dark Empire, despite being on the verge of death, Palpatine singlehandedly overpowers Leia Organa Solo with lightning and mortally wounds two Jedi with a single burst each. Bane has proved to show a mastery of lightning as well. I will explain what he did with it and lightsaber throw in a bit, typed it but didnt show up =-(

Don't bother, everyone already knows. And I posted it on the last page. And Banes never done Lightsaber throw to my knowledge. In the comic maybe?

No, Rule of Two. He threw it at some mercenaries.

Oh yeah. Chalk up one thing Banes better than Sidious in then. Lightsaber throw- the real mans force lightning.

Yeah, has Sidious demonstrated lightsaber throw? How about force Wave? Force Storm? he has demonstreted force wtf-where-the-hell-did-that-wormhole-come-from-Sidious-made-that-oh-****-we-are-all-gonna-die-he-took-out-a-whole-fleet-of-ships power...............

Originally posted by Nephthys
Oh yeah. Chalk up one thing Banes better than Sidious in then. Lightsaber throw- the real mans force lightning.

Actually, it's depressing to note that Sidious is better than Bane in just about everything. He's smarter, more powerful, more successful. Hell, he's even something of a ladies man.

And I say depressing because it's true. We're heading into Gary Stu territory.

Githany> Empire-digging skanks.

Ysanne Isard > Githany.

Wait, Bane was also a genius.............. He was the one who knew how to hide 2 very powerful dark side users from the jedi for a long time............. over 10 years........... And yes, he is more powerful. Successful, not sure. Bane destroyed the sith, rebuilt them from the ashes, made a galaxy network of spies, and set the bar that would even allow Sidious to be a sith and do what he did. Sidious did alot by himself with no influence from Banes stuff, but he would have had a harder time without it.

http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/thumb/8/88/YsanneIsard.jpg/220px-YsanneIsard.jpg

And that is supposed to be.................. who exactly?

Ysanne Isard

and her competition-

http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/3/34/BaneAndGitha.jpg

(not the Bald guy, though he is dreamy and they do make a cute couple)

Thats Bane i think............ The face suggests it, mainly the forhead, and jaw.........

facepalm

Originally posted by Incanus
And yes, he is more powerful.

No....no he isn't we have shown you this multiple times Sidious>bane.

Originally posted by xxxpoppunker182
No....no he isn't we have shown you this multiple times Sidious>bane. Dude, i know Sidious is more powerful, did you take thatfrom the beggining? Inever posted that recently, i just said that Bane has his succeses to, his genius/cunning, and the power, no.

Originally posted by Incanus
Dude, i know Sidious is more powerful, did you take thatfrom the beggining? Inever posted that recently, i just said that Bane has his succeses to, his genius/cunning, and the power, no.

I was referring to your post on page 7 toward the bottom you said this

Originally posted by Incanus
Wait, Bane was also a genius.............. He was the one who knew how to hide 2 very powerful dark side users from the jedi for a long time............. over 10 years........... And yes, he is more powerful. Successful, not sure. Bane destroyed the sith, rebuilt them from the ashes, made a galaxy network of spies, and set the bar that would even allow Sidious to be a sith and do what he did. Sidious did alot by himself with no influence from Banes stuff, but he would have had a harder time without it.

sorry if i misread that.

oopos, didnt mean to make it sound like Bane is more powerful, i ment to say Sidious was............... i was trying to say that Bane is also considered a genius and successful.

Originally posted by Nephthys
http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/thumb/8/88/YsanneIsard.jpg/220px-YsanneIsard.jpg


Better than...
http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii296/Valoo834/blz21.jpg

Who the hell is that? Is that Githany's final seconds?

Yep, and from a certain (albeit, incredibly perverse) point of view, she's still more attractive than Gideons girl.

Do you mean Isard or Ashley?

Isard. Ashley beats Githany by merit of being real, which is apparently quite important in the bedroom.

And pretty much every area known to man...