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Neutral setting. No retarded "saburz only", because that kind of fighting does not reflect common sense. The setting is an empty basketball court. It's assumed that Nox is at the end of their storyline, ghosts intact, and that Kun has Kun-mulets.

FIGHT!

Kun

I'm gonna go with Nox after a tough fight.

Nox would have to overpower Kun with the force, and even then Kun has amulet blasts.

I think Nox can tank Kun's amulet blasts quite well given that they shrugged off Thanatons lightning. I'd give them a better chance of overpowering Kun than Kun does them.

No. Amulet blasts are basically impossible to defend against, much like Zannah's Tendrils. Amulet Blast>>>Lightning

Uh, what? No, they're not.

But what would make you think that Nox can simply block the blast, considering they're much stronger than Thanaton's lightning?

Apparently Exar Kun can use Dark Side tendrils, too.

I wouldn't say they're much stronger than Thanatons lightning, but I'd think that because Nox swatted Thanatons lightning aside one-handed and even when they let Thanaton charge up and hit them without resisting they just walked through it unharmed.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
Apparently Exar Kun can use Dark Side tendrils, too.

So can Nox.

Except that the Blasts have a vastly more dangerous power output, and Kun has performed superior feats with his blasts than Thanaton with his FLS.

When has Nox used Tendrils?

Kun's blasts have blown through walls and a Leviathan as I believe their top destructive feats, while Thanatons lightning cracked the floor with just the impact of hitting Nox. I wouldn't say theres much of a disparity there. Even if Kuns blasts are superior to Thanatons lightning, the ease with which Nox handles Thanatons lightning makes me think they can handle the amulet blasts with difficulty.

Furthermore, Thanaton was able to shred through Nox's barrier while it was empowered by 2 Sith Lords, which is indicative of his power. That Nox walked through his best efforts at the end of the game suggests huge defensive capabilities imo.

HubbiJYONeQ

At the start.

I'd have to give it to Nox too although it would be a tough fight. His battle with Thanaton was incredible and the fact that he's got those 4-6 ghosts in him make him even more formidable, as well as better at defending against force attacks.

I don't think Nox easily dealt with the FLS, she was struggling with it for a time. Perhaps, but Kun has much more up his sleeve than blasts.

was that crystal amping Nox in any way?

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
I don't think Nox easily dealt with the FLS, she was struggling with it for a time. Perhaps, but Kun has much more up his sleeve than blasts.

was that crystal amping Nox in any way?

She wasn't hurt by it and literally just shrugged it off with the ghosts.

I dunno, it looks like a ritual or something.

I forgot that Darth Thanaton could fly.

I don't think that was Nox, I believe that was the Crystal activated by Nox's power. I'm going to assume he can't actually utilize it on his own.

Gotta go with Exar Kun on this one.

Nox comfortably.

Definitely not comfortably.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Nox comfortably.

Nox is unprecedentedly powerful by all accounts; he is among the anomalies of Force-users with insane supernatural capabilities/talents. Khem Val regarded him as equal to Tulak Hord and he literally humiliated a "supremely powerful" Sith Lord with his insane capabilities.

As good as Kun is, he doesn't holds a candle to Nox. The latter will demolish majority comfortably.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Amulet Blast>>>Lightning
Really? Think again.

Thanaton have destroyed a "large structure made of metal" with just a normal burst of his lightning during his encounter with Exal Kressh; his FLS is a class of its own in sheer potency.

Nox endured Thanaton's overwhelming FLS barrage because of his Sith Sorcery augmented defensive capabilities which made his body virtually indestructible.

Nox is hardly unprecedented in terms of power considering Nihilus and Vitiate. Also I believe Khem merely says that they're worthy of being Tulak Hords successor, not that Nox is as powerful as he was.

As an aside, Legend, TOR era combatants aren't all the best ever. There are powerful beings in other eras. Kun is one of them.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Nox is hardly unprecedented in terms of power considering Nihilus and Vitiate. Also I believe Khem merely says that they're worthy of being Tulak Hords successor, not that Nox is as powerful as he was.
Nihilus and Vitiate do not qualify as "normal" either. Like these two, Nox isn't natural as well, capabilities and talents wise.

Khem's statement doesn't dismisses the possibility of Nox being equal or superior to Tulak. It reveals how damn good Nox is.

Originally posted by Nephthys
As an aside, Legend, TOR era combatants aren't all the best ever. There are powerful beings in other eras. Kun is one of them.
I am not asserting that other eras didn't witness gifted and talented warriors but TOR seemingly literally peaked in bad@ssry department on the whole with emergence of lot of extraordinarily gifted Force-users simultaneously.

I do not underestimate Kun actually; he subdued Luke which says a lot about his dark side mastery. On the whole, he have impressive achievements under his belt. I rank him above Dooku and even Vader.

Nox possesses sufficient power and talents to overcome Kun. The latter might be superior duelist then the former but Nox have beaten one of the greatest duelists of all times as well, if I am not mistaken. I mean, up against Nox, Kun would be contending with combined might of several powerful Force-users which is too much for a single legitimately powerful Force-user unless he or she is an anomaly as well.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Nihilus and Vitiate do not qualify as "normal" either. Like these two, Nox isn't natural as well, capabilities and talents wise.

Khem's statement doesn't dismisses the possibility of Nox being equal or superior to Tulak. It reveals how damn good Nox is.

Ok, so Nox is predicated. I'll assume this is a language thing, as saying something is unprecidented means that there hasn't been anything like it in the past. So obviously Vitiate and Nihilus came before Nox and set the precedent.

It doesn't bring up the possibility of Nox being equal to him either.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
I am not asserting that other eras didn't witness gifted and talented warriors but TOR seemingly literally peaked in bad@ssry department on the whole with emergence of lot of extraordinarily gifted Force-users simultaneously.

I do not underestimate Kun actually; he subdued Luke which says a lot about his dark side mastery. On the whole, he have impressive achievements under his belt. I rank him above Dooku and even Vader.

Nox possesses sufficient power and talents to overcome Kun. The latter might be superior duelist then the former but Nox have beaten one of the greatest duelists of all times as well, if I am not mistaken. I mean, up against Nox, Kun would be contending with combined might of several powerful Force-users which is too much for a single legitimately powerful Force-user unless he or she is an anomaly as well.

That might be so, but that doesn't mean that the top warriors in other eras can't compete with those of the TOR era. Exar Kun was the strongest of his era and is the equal to any of the TOR era barring Vitiate/HoT maybe.

So then you rank Nox greatly above Dooku and Vader as well? Does that mean you place her as an equal or superior to Sidious or Luke?

That last sentence just isn't true though, as proven in TOR by the Hero of Tython and the Barsen'thor. The HoT beat Vitiate, one of your anomalies and the Barsen'thor defeated Vivicar while he was drawing power from hundreds of Jedi Masters. Neither of the Jedi were anomalies, merely extremely powerful Jedi.

Yeah, it's the same argument you use to try to say vitiate is superior to Luke, Legend. Just because they have to power of many sith lords, doesn't make them some "entity" or godlike being.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Ok, so Nox is predicated. I'll assume this is a language thing, as saying something is unprecidented means that there hasn't been anything like it in the past. So obviously Vitiate and Nihilus came before Nox and set the precedent.

It doesn't bring up the possibility of Nox being equal to him either.
Hmm! Maybe "unprecedented" is not the correct term. However, Nox have set the bar too high by stomping another "supremely powerful" Sith Lord. If the entire mythos is considered, only select few Force-users would be a match for Nox.

Originally posted by Nephthys
That might be so, but that doesn't mean that the top warriors in other eras can't compete with those of the TOR era. Exar Kun was the strongest of his era and is the equal to any of the TOR era barring Vitiate/HoT maybe.
I disagree! Exar Kun was fantastic in his era but he would have faced "massive competition" in TOR era; his chances of being a "big player" may have gone down dramatically in TOR era accordingly as well. Just look at the case of Revan who have been even a bigger player than Kun but surprisingly failed to click during TOR era. Please keep in mind that I am not asserting that Kun cannot do well in eras in addition to his own but TOR era have set the bar of competitiveness too high for any single Force-user to claim all of the glory for himself.

Originally posted by Nephthys
So then you rank Nox greatly above Dooku and Vader as well? Does that mean you place her as an equal or superior to Sidious or Luke?
Competitive situation in SW isn't so black and white.

- Nox could be a match for Dooku and Vader (OT) in natural form. But with his Sith Sorcery talents, he literally trumps them.

- Nox might be able to match someone like Luke with Sith Sorcery talents.

- As far as Sidious is concerned, he is the only individual who can outgun Nox in legitimate fashion if his DE incarnation is considered. Sidious himself is unnatural and extremely capable Sith Sorcerer as of DE.

Originally posted by Nephthys
That last sentence just isn't true though, as proven in TOR by the Hero of Tython and the Barsen'thor. The HoT beat Vitiate, one of your anomalies and the Barsen'thor defeated Vivicar while he was drawing power from hundreds of Jedi Masters. Neither of the Jedi were anomalies, merely extremely powerful Jedi.
Vitiate's fall is circumstantial actually. Now I am not trying to discredit HoT because his performance on the whole is so impressive that he have canonically dealt with "impossible odds" and "changed galactic history forever." However, Vitiate was caught with his pants down on Dromund Kaas.

Competitiveness of a Force-user depends not just on the raw power but also on additional factors such as talents and intelligence.

HoT, Barsen'thor and Luke acquired lot of talents and experience to undermine opposition with passage of time and could not just depend on their immense raw power to succeed in difficult situations. Luke specially have history of failures which taught him well; in-fact, his story reveals that he would have lost or died on several occasions without aid of his companions.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Yeah, it's the same argument you use to try to say vitiate is superior to Luke, Legend. Just because they have to power of many sith lords, doesn't make them some "entity" or godlike being.
Vitiate is actually superior to Luke.

Keep in mind that Kun's amulets explicitly double in power with each strike. How much can Nox tank, realistically? It's been some time since I played the campaign (basically a year or more) but I recall being impressed by the FLS tank. However, Kun's amulets increase his rage exponentially, and he is able to obliterate pretty much every Force user in the era with a wave of his hand, regardless of whether or not he engages in amulet spam. It's worth noting that he does not even bother with it except for against Aleema and the Sith wyrm.

Problem with the amulet blasts is that we haven't seen them used during a fight. It's not like Kun can point and click and walla!

Originally posted by Nephthys
Uh, what? No, they're not.

Yep, an adept force user can absorb them or block with TK.

Kun takes him imo.

I'd forgotten that the blasts double in power. I still think Nox has a chance if she can attack decisively at the start before he gains momentum with the amulets.

Revan isn't a bigger player than Exar Kun, Legend.

Originally posted by SJones91109
Problem with the amulet blasts is that we haven't seen them used during a fight. It's not like Kun can point and click and walla!

Kun used them while actively dodging attacks from the Sith Wyrm. It wasn't like FF Tactics where he had to 'charge' before it worked. Also, it's simply amplifying his energy and rage and turning both into a blast of sorts. Hell, he does it to Aleema while talking shit.

Also, why do people treat Kun as if he's a one-trick pony with the amulet blasts?

Originally posted by NewGuy01
Revan isn't a bigger player than Exar Kun, Legend.
Revan have influenced galactic history more so than Kun.

Now that actually is true.

um, we're talking about power...

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
um, we're talking about power...
You don't have a clue about Revan's power?

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
You don't have a clue about Revan's power?

Yeah, and it doesn't match Kun's

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Yeah, and it doesn't match Kun's
So you don't have a clue about Revan's power?

I'll let Neph be the grammar expert here. Anyways, we may as well discuss this in the kun vs. Revan forum

Kun is not a one trick pony but the amulet blasts keep being brought up and I can't see him using them in actual combat.

Other than against the worm and Aleema.

I don't recall him and Aleema having an actual battle. He had one with Ulic and Vodo.

She attacked him, he wasn't phased by it and one-shot her. It might not have been a lengthy fight but it was a fight in my books.

He didn't use it against Vodo because he didn't need to. He had the need to prove himself the more skilled warrior or whatever.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
He didn't use it against Vodo because he didn't need to. He had the need to prove himself the more skilled warrior or whatever.

Astute observation. Kun was arrogant and secure in his power. He doesn't use the amulet blasts against any of the Jedi Masters of renown, instead preferring to destroy Vodo in saber combat (as Vodo was an exceptional duelist) and Odan-Urr with the Force (Odan-Urr being basically the de facto Force sage of his era). While people have indicated that Odan-Urr is too old and weak in the Force to be of merit (something they would never level against Yoda), this argument doesn't hold water. Exar Kun is intended to be beyond the reaches of anyone as DLotS. The comics pretty much nail that point home.

Odan-Urr states that he's old after Kun smites him and seems to be attributing his easy loss to that fact imo.

Right, it doesn't matter if Urr created a force severing technique. The guy is almost 1,000 years old and doesn't age as gracefully as Yoda.

Exar Kun honestly had a lot more up his sleeve than we saw during the comics. This assumption is proved in Dark Apprentice, which shows him using powers he didn't do in his lifetime, and it's again heavily implied we haven't quite seen everything. Though, some examples from Dark Apprentice that he didn't use in the comics are:

-Dark Side Tendrils
-Soul-Ripping Ritual
-TK ability on level to Force Choke 12 Jedi Knights at once
-Heavily implied mastery of Force Illusions

Doesn't Jolee consider (Darth) Revan and Malak as vastly inferior to the duo of Kun and Droma?

Yeah.