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Who wins? Takes place on a flat open terrain.

Gussy wins this.

This is not a fair fight.

You should probably use Darth Caedus instead of Cade, that would actually be a good fight.

lol. What makes Malgus>>>Cade?

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
lol. What makes Malgus>>>Cade? Better demonstrations of TK, it's hard to gauge where Legacy era characters lie in comparison to anyone else because it's a comic that doesn't really illustrate their feats as well. It's much harder to know where they stand in lightsaber combat, but judging from what I have seen I would not put Cade or Krayt anywhere near SWTOR levels - Krayt was stomped by Obi-Wan, granted he'd probably stronger even before his first death and Cade was able to chop him to bits, there's really no evidence to suggest Cade is quite at Mace Windu, Darth Tyranus, Darth Malgus, or Satele Shan levels. I'd put him more at Starkiller Clone or Dark Clone levels.

Cade threw a large ship at darth talon after not really using the force in 8 years, and was considered to be the most powerful jedi Krayt had ever seen, before his peak. Of course Krayt has seen some of the best jedi ever, such as Yoda and Prime Luke. Then of course Cade defeated reborn krayt, who is far more powerful than you give him credit for.

Most of that info is new to me. Honestly I probably spoke out of turn in this particular thread, because I have not read Legacy yet.

I have a shit load of books, comics, and a few seasons of ST: The Clone Wars to collect, all over the chronology before I have a totally in depth understanding of where everyone ranks in the mythos. So far Plagueis and Luke have helped me picture how the Force works the best. Those two among others. Surprisingly Luke provides more wisdom on the light side than Yoda, and has a lot more to say about light side capabilities especially in the New Jedi Order series, and the many books between ROTJ and NJO.

I will learn where everyone ranks but I will have to learn to to pick my battles in the meantime.

Understood. Cade is underrated and is an incredibly powerful force user. He's also got impressive lightsaber feats, and of course dark transfer.

Cade's got plenty of TK feats, actually his best area all in all.

Late in legacy he was in the middle of a hidden base that self-destructed in a huge explosion. He made a TK barrier and just walked out.




That wasn't even 'Krayt' yet, that was A'Sharad Hett, literally over a decade before he started learning sith ways, a hundred sixty years before Legacy.

Notably, he lost due to Kenobi's skill in the force after smacking Kenobi with the hilt of his saber in the head, and prior he'd also beat up earlier clone wars Anakin. As A'Sharad, he was a newb with external force powers, as Krayt, he was massively powerful and blocked strong TK, lightning, illusions, etc. all with ease.

Krayt also once soloed the crew of a Vong ship unarmed.



On Cade, his sith bodycount is easily in the dozens, maybe more due to a several month stretch between the main Legacy and Legacy War where he worked as a Sith Hunter, killing various sith.


Though that said, Cade is not Krayt's level. He killed Krayt after Krayt outfought him, brought him through death to turn him, and then Cade struck Krayt with his guard down. Then Krayt tried to take over his mind, so Cade threw his body into a sun.


I do think Cade could beat Malgus as-of when Malgus fought Zen, but I think I'd give the nod to Malgus at his best. Not at all easily, though, Cade is a power house.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Cade threw a large ship at darth talon after not really using the force in 8 years, and was considered to be the most powerful jedi Krayt had ever seen, before his peak.
Its is a large object but not a large ship.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Of course Krayt has seen some of the best jedi ever, such as Yoda and Prime Luke. Then of course Cade defeated reborn krayt, who is far more powerful than you give him credit for.
Malgus is in a different league in comparison to Krayt.

These were the points that were brought in favor of Krayt in another thread:

Originally posted by NewGuy01
Oh, and to add to his accomplishments:

-He's turned two stone pillars into rubble with FL, and has also used FL to kill a group of Yuuzahn Vong warriors instantly.

-He's speedblitzed 3 Imperial Knights while suffering from diminished health--The Imperial Knights are a very selective order and practically all of it's members are elite.

-He's ragdolled both Cade and Nihl. When ragdolling the former, the sheer force of when he pulled him brought down a nearby pillar.

-Basically completely outmatched Cade and Wyyrlok as duelists. These two are basically the respective best Jedi/Sith in the galaxy in this regard sans Krayt, so yeah.

He should be a pretty good match for Malgus. These two have very similar levels of ability.

This is the counter-argument:

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
One of the victims of Malgus collapsed two buildings simultaneously with his telekinetic abilities.

Zallow cut down some of the strongest Sith warriors like fodder who participated in the Sacking of Coruscant! And you know what became of him when he fought Malgus.

- Malgus send Zallow crashing in to a large column (made of stone) with such a force that the Jedi broke right through it, landing many feet away. Zallow still had the strength to stand up and continue the fight.

- Malgus once blew apart the portion of rubble in different directions that fell over him during the collapse of two buildings around his position.

- Malgus could send even the mighty Satele Shan packing with his telekinetic abilities.

I am sure their are more examples.

Malgus have more impressive combat record. Krayt lost to cade eventually.

No. Malgus outguns him by a long shot.

Yeah I just figured out the circumstances with which Cade bested Krayt, and i'm giving Malgus the nod. However, as I said earlier, Krayt

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
is far more powerful than you give him credit for.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
I
Malgus is in a different league in comparison to Krayt.

These were the points that were brought in favor of Krayt in another thread:


This is the counter-argument:


The two arguments don't seem to support your conclusion of a different league, and actually make Krayt look the stronger of the two.


Krayt > Cade. Cade's feats are definitely above Zallow's. Cade's also got better TK feats than Malgus, and TK was the area you focused on.





Overlooks how Krayt died. Namely, he killed Cade, then Cade struck him with his guard down in a moment of clarity. He never outfought or even equalled Krayt.


Also,


In cutting down numbers of sith warriors and such, Zallow has nothing on Cade Or Antares Draco, who's weaker than Cade and has a best single-day kill-count of 10, including where a non-fresh Draco killed 7 Sith in a 7-on-1.

And Zallow was a close fight against that Malgus.

Originally posted by Q99
Cade's also got better TK feats than Malgus

Eh?

Originally posted by Nephthys
Eh?

Certainly better than the ones Legend listed there at least. Ship flinging, and:


"Malgus once blew apart the portion of rubble in different directions that fell over him during the collapse of two buildings around his position."

Some rubble from collapsing buildings < Being in the middle of a giant base self-destruct explosion (while, btw, also doing a dark transfer healing).

Still, maybe read his respect thread before making that call.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Still, maybe read his respect thread before making that call.

I'm just totally making the call that Legend's examples make Cade and Krayt look better. Rather than coming across as a decisive argument, it looked more like he was trying to make a point for Cade.




The TK feats in the respect thread seem to be the same... he uses TK a lot, but still, in scale it's no shock that his aren't as big as a Skywalker's.

Cade can't use dark essence as a lethal attack during combat like Krayt can, can he?

Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
Cade can't use dark essence as a lethal attack during combat like Krayt can, can he?

He can use dark transfer to hurt, but I don't think he can flat-out kill as easily/quickly, no. If he had a strangle hold or something it's a potential finisher, but he's not just going to place a hand on an enemy's chest and kill them the way Krayt did to him.


Also, later on he switches to lightside, which helps his healing power, but obviously isn't something to use on an enemy.

"Switches to light side."

I think these writers take video game shit too literally. You'd have a harder time switching party registration from Democrat to Republican than a Force adept changes from light to dark.

Originally posted by The_Tempest
"Switches to light side."

I think these writers take video game shit too literally. You'd have a harder time switching party registration from Democrat to Republican than a Force adept changes from light to dark.


Oh, Cade takes a lot of pounding to get to where he ends up. I should say rather, Cade knows both light and dark side, but he finally figured out how to do 'dark transfer' with light side and committed himself more to the light.

Yeah, I read the comics. But the dark side of the Force can't merely be used without consequence. It's not a simple matter of "lets use force litning just not 2 kill ppl." The dark side clearly and inexorably fvcks with a person's mind the more they use it. Like a metaphysical drug.

Thus I lol good and proper when the EU defies the movies like that. If it were so easy, every Jedi would be using it and few Sith Lords would be raging dicks.

Originally posted by Q99
Oh, Cade takes a lot of pounding

giggle

Remember when Lukes order was casually using Force lightning and torturing people?


Also Kyle Katarn uses lightning as I recall.

Originally posted by The_Tempest
Yeah, I read the comics. But the dark side of the Force can't merely be used without consequence. It's not a simple matter of "lets use force litning just not 2 kill ppl." The dark side clearly and inexorably fvcks with a person's mind the more they use it. Like a metaphysical drug.

Thus I lol good and proper when the EU defies the movies like that. If it were so easy, every Jedi would be using it and few Sith Lords would be raging dicks.

Indeed, indeed.


Heck, think about it- Legacy goes the drug use metaphor much more than most. Even when Cade tries to turn away from the sith, he keeps finding himself drawn to using the dark side and messing stuff up for himself again. For him, being willing to trust the light side rather than dip into the dark is a very difficult thing that he even starts to recognize as a real problem (like he said to his mom).

Originally posted by Nephthys
Remember when Lukes order was casually using Force lightning and torturing people?


Also Kyle Katarn uses lightning as I recall.

I was thinking more of Jaina Solo and Revan gathering streams of light and dark side energy (lol). But Luke and Plo Koon's "electric judgment" is also stupid.

Originally posted by The_Tempest
Yeah, I read the comics. But the dark side of the Force can't merely be used without consequence. It's not a simple matter of "lets use force litning just not 2 kill ppl." The dark side clearly and inexorably fvcks with a person's mind the more they use it. Like a metaphysical drug.

Thus I lol good and proper when the EU defies the movies like that. If it were so easy, every Jedi would be using it and few Sith Lords would be raging dicks.

Beg your pardon but what's the problem? Not all Force-users are identical. It just means Cade is somewhat more resistant to it than most. And even he eventually realised he couldn't just keep using the dark side casually.

Luke dabbled in the dark side as well, after all, and so did Quinlan Vos (Krayt was playing on Cade going Vos's route, but further).