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If this has been address before feel free to let me know and it will be closed. But there is something about the Skywalker family that I been thinking lately. If Padme is a Queen that would make Anakin a King right? And of course Leia is a Princess. By logic that makes Luke a Prince. So, when Anakin dies the title is of King belongs to Luke. But since Anakin Skywalker was pronunce death in Episode III therefore there is no more king until Luke appears later in the trilogy. Why isn't Luke recognized as a new King? Or all that stuff about Royalty isn't really crucial to the saga? Help Please with clarification.

but padme has a limited term as queen, and once that term is up there is no reference to her as a queen.

luke and leia therefor are not royalty...by blood

the title of this thread brings up another question though...


when did bail organa declare himself king????

he had to if leia was a princess and in ep3 he is but a senator.

isnt it odd that he went from mourning the loss of democracy to declaring himself the omnipotent ruler of his world? THAT is weird imho

Right, I didn't want to get Bail involved because it will open a new can of questions, but you're right. At what moment did he declare himself King? And wouldn't not be better for Bail to keep Luke instead of Leia? Like I mention before Luke by logic is a Prince. When he gets older he can be declare King.

Some believe that "Bail" is an indication of title. It maybe more a title than a kingship.

Originally posted by WindDancer
And wouldn't not be better for Bail to keep Luke instead of Leia? Like I mention before Luke by logic is a Prince.

How is he by logic a Prince?

His father was a Jedi and his mother a Senator.

Jedi+Senator=Royalty?

no no no

Leia being princess had nothing to do with being Padme's daughter. They were hidden as a secret. Leia was a princess because of Bail (senator), Bail's status might have been changed to ruler of Alderaan or something so Leia was declared princess.

Originally posted by Morridini
How is he by logic a Prince?



By bloodline...if Padme is Queen then all her children belong to the royalty.

Originally posted by WindDancer
Right, I didn't want to get Bail involved because it will open a new can of questions, but you're right. At what moment did he declare himself King? And wouldn't not be better for Bail to keep Luke instead of Leia? Like I mention before Luke by logic is a Prince. When he gets older he can be declare King.

depends on their law.

luke is leia's sibling, but leia is adopted.
therefore i dont think luke would legally be the son of bail.
so i think no, luke is not considered heir to the throne in any way.

Originally posted by WindDancer
By bloodline...if Padme is Queen then all her children belong to the royalty.

But she is no Queen, that's where the logic falters.

Originally posted by WindDancer
By bloodline...if Padme is Queen then all her children belong to the royalty.

but thats the point you're missin.
the title of 'queen' on naboo is simply a glorified elected governor with a very limited term. she is not really a queen in the sense that we understand.
temporary royalty you might say

Luke can't be a prince because he wasn't adopted by Bail. King? wtf, Alderaan was destroyed people, along with bail

Originally posted by Robin Darkside
King? wtf, Alderaan was destroyed people, along with bail

somebody take the professor to the back and plug him into the hyperdrive!!!!

its hypothetical, einstein

Originally posted by WindDancer
If this has been address before feel free to let me know and it will be closed. But there is something about the Skywalker family that I been thinking lately. If Padme is a Queen that would make Anakin a King right? And of course Leia is a Princess. By logic that makes Luke a Prince. So, when Anakin dies the title is of King belongs to Luke. But since Anakin Skywalker was pronunce death in Episode III therefore there is no more king until Luke appears later in the trilogy. Why isn't Luke recognized as a new King? Or all that stuff about Royalty isn't really crucial to the saga? Help Please with clarification.

Padme's deferred another term to allow Jemillia become Queen in E2. She was only a Senator in Episode 2, when the two were married.

Bail is King of Alderaan. It was never really made public, not in the movies anyway. So, the lineage makes sense when you go through him.

So for all the queens of Naboo that had kids, are all considered royalty??

Originally posted by PVS
somebody take the professor to the back and plug him into the hyperdrive!!!!

its hypothetical, einstein

no shit

Originally posted by Robin Darkside
So for all the queens of Naboo that had kids, are all considered royalty??

no they are not

Originally posted by Cinemaddiction
Padme's deferred another term to allow Jemillia become Queen in E2. She was only a Senator in Episode 2, when the two were married.

Bail is King of Alderaan. It was never really made public, not in the movies anyway. So, the lineage makes sense when you go through him.

Excellent point! Thank you Cinema that helps clear the fog in the family tree.

Originally posted by Cinemaddiction
Padme's deferred another term to allow Jemillia become Queen in E2. She was only a Senator in Episode 2, when the two were married.

Lucas' royal family tree is way, way out of whack. Leia can't be a Princess, nor Luke a Prince unless Bail Organa was somehow married to little Keisha Castle-Hughes in Episode 3, which he wasn't because he was gabbing about how his wife would take Leia, and he, Luke.

Uncle George lost himself in his own story bigtime.

unless bail and his wife died soon after and leia was then adopted by the queen (if there was another person who was a monarch rather than bail). that would answer some questions, since leia then could have thought that bail's wife was her real mother...she could have been twice orphaned and adopted....would fill that plot hole, wouldnt it?

Don't see what the mystery is here. By birthright or election, Bail Organa is Royalty. His daughter is therefore a Princess.

There exists in the SW Galaxy a clear mix of democracy and aristocracy on some planets.

I will have to watch the film again to check, but I seem to remember Bail being referred to with a deference due to royalty on board the Tantive IV.

Luke isn't a Prince because he hasn't been posing as Bail's son.

I edited my initial response to make more sense. Going through Bail, the lineage is right on the money. He's the unproclaimed King of Alderaan, his wife the Queen. So, Bail and his wifey die, that indeed makes Luke the king and Leia's already the Princess, leaving the future Queen position open to Mara Jade, and the Prince title to Han Solo, I'd imagine.

Betcha didn't know I was that big a SW fan, did ya?

Where's Yuxa when you need him!?!

So Luke does have right to Kingship then?

maybe bails wife is queen of alderaan and that is where leia gets her princess from.

On this planet if a woman is queen and marries her husband is only a prince, not king, but this does not neccisarrily hold true in the starwars universe.

Err... sorry, no, Luke has no claim to Kingship. He is not Bail's adopted son, therefore has no lineage that way, and the Naboo line is elected, not hereditary, so he has no claim there either.

Luke's just a commoner, I am afraid.

Okay, okay, okay...Here is another thought for you guys. Could it be that Bail is nothing more than a "Self-Proclaim King"?

We don't know.

However, by SW logic, Bail is a good guy. So any way he is King is morally acceptable- either elected, or a just and fair ruler. That's how SW works.

Originally posted by darthmaul1
maybe bails wife is queen of alderaan and that is where leia gets her princess from.

On this planet if a woman is queen and marries her husband is only a prince, not king, but this does not neccisarrily hold true in the starwars universe.

She is. You're a little late, lol.

On this planet, that's considered incest.

Originally posted by PVS
unless bail and his wife died soon after and leia was then adopted by the queen (if there was another person who was a monarch rather than bail). that would answer some questions, since leia then could have thought that bail's wife was her real mother...she could have been twice orphaned and adopted....would fill that plot hole, wouldnt it?

yeah, if Leia thought of her real mother being Bails wife at the end of EP III, then she dies, and Bail remarries, that would make sense

Originally posted by Ushgarak
We don't know.

However, by SW logic, Bail is a good guy. So any way he is King is morally acceptable- either elected, or a just and fair ruler. That's how SW works.

I see, so that would take us more into the EU and away from the Skywalker saga.

Except Bail Organa has to be Leia's father in ANH because only he fits the logical description of Leia's message to Obi-Wan.

Originally posted by Ushgarak
Err... sorry, no, Luke has no claim to Kingship. He is not Bail's adopted son, therefore has no lineage that way, and the Naboo line is elected, not hereditary, so he has no claim there either.

Luke's just a commoner, I am afraid.

Bail was def. Leia's dad by definition. Luke was adopted by the Queen of Alderaan, thus entering a royal family BUT then he was adopted AGAIN by Owen and Beru, so I guess he gave up his royalty there...

Sorry, Cine, what are you talking about? Luke was not adopted by the Queen of Alderan ever.

Originally posted by WindDancer
I see, so that would take us more into the EU and away from the Skywalker saga.

Yup. The means of Bail's Kingship (or Emperorship or even Princeship) is not covered by canon. It's also not very important.

Originally posted by Ushgarak
Yup. The means of Bail's Kingship (or Emperorship or even Princeship) is not covered by canon. It's also not very important.

At first I thought it was important because it explains why Leia is given the title of Princess in ANH.

Well, that's nothing to do with the means of why he is King (or whatever). The only important thing is that he has a royal title.

I drew the conclusion that the Organa's would held onto Luke for the time being, not just throwing him right at his grandparents. Oh well. Kind of makes you wonder why they only took one.

As Obi-Wan explains in ROTJ, they were seperated for their own safety.

Yup! Keeping the two together would have been dangerous.

Originally posted by Ushgarak
Except Bail Organa has to be Leia's father in ANH because only he fits the logical description of Leia's message to Obi-Wan.

shit...you're right

*plot hole reemerges*

And that's a plothole how?

Originally posted by Ushgarak
Except Bail Organa has to be Leia's father in ANH because only he fits the logical description of Leia's message to Obi-Wan.

Originally posted by PVS
shit...you're right

*plot hole reemerges*

missing the point, I think

Bail will always be Leia's father, I mean if Bail's wife (The one in EP III) dies, then Bail remarries and the new wife raises Leia. Then in EP VI, when Leia talks about her mother to Luke, where all she remembers is images and feelings. Leia is refering to her first step mother but she actually thinks its her real mother. Because her second adopted mother is still around. Bail has remarried.

Like I said, it would fill the plot hole of Leia remembering her actual real mother (Padme) when she only saw her for 3 seconds before she died

LUKE: Do you remember your mother? Your real mother...

Leia's not referring to the Queen of Alderaan.

Originally posted by Captain REX
LUKE: Do you remember your mother? Your real mother...

Leia's not referring to the Queen of Alderaan.

Just saying

wtf, do you think she was refering to Padme?????

no, she was referring to the other woman who gave birth to her.



ffs

Originally posted by PVS
no, she was referring to the other woman who gave birth to her.



ffs

?????

Ush is right on the money on this one... Luke has no claim to any royal title whatsoever

And yes.. Leia WAS DEFINITLEY talking about Padme in ROTJ

ok, plot hole re-emerges

what friggin plot hole??

sorry but this one seems to be a non issue to me

EP VI

Luke: "Do you remember your mother, your real mother?"

Leia: "just a little bit, she died when I was very young"

Luke: "What do you remember?"

Leia: "Just images really, feelings"

Luke: "Tell me"

Leia: "She was very beutiful, kind, but sad. Why are you asking me this?"

Luke: "I have no memory of my mother, I never knew her"


Leia knows padme pretty good....

yes, major Major plot hole.

although as kinda far fetched as Robin Darkside theory was on leia actually having 2 step mothers, it would take care of this plot hole if leia thought her first adopted mother was her real mother.

this in my mind is the single largest plot hole in the entire SW saga

well yeah the leia thing is my biggest gripe about ROTS .. i thought you meant thewhole Luke as a prince 'plothole' - of which there is none

Big plot hole, I know, it bothers me, I try to come up with my own solution though

Maybe Padme' made a speial bond with Leia when she was born you know, the Force.

Originally posted by PVS
the title of this thread brings up another question though...


when did bail organa declare himself king????

he had to if leia was a princess and in ep3 he is but a senator.

isnt it odd that he went from mourning the loss of democracy to declaring himself the omnipotent ruler of his world? THAT is weird imho

He was a senator in coruscant but ruler of his own world. Like Padme and probably others in the senate

remember at the end of e3 when bail took leia and said that his wife and he always wanted a little girl. his wife was a queen dident u see their palace ?

Originally posted by Robin Darkside
EP VI

Luke: "Do you remember your mother, your real mother?"

Leia: "just a little bit, she died when I was very young"

Luke: "What do you remember?"

Leia: "Just images really, feelings"

Luke: "Tell me"

Leia: "She was very beutiful, kind, but sad. Why are you asking me this?"

Luke: "I have no memory of my mother, I never knew her"


Leia knows padme pretty good....


This actually is'nt all that big a plot hole.

Leia: "Just images really, feelings"

This does'nt mean she knew Padme well. It could be that somehow those images were transferred at birth and she remembered them forever. A really suck connection to the PT, but not a plot hole.

As for Luke having kingship, that is really trivial compared to being potentially responsible for the rebirth of th jedi order.

Originally posted by jerlark386
This actually is'nt all that big a plot hole.

Leia: "Just images really, feelings"

This does'nt mean she knew Padme well. It could be that somehow those images were transferred at birth and she remembered them forever. A really suck connection to the PT, but not a plot hole.

As for Luke having kingship, that is really trivial compared to being potentially responsible for the rebirth of th jedi order.


wtf, is that.

I wish intelliegence and star wars realists, would answer, not u, noob

I like to talk of the real revalence of Star Wars, its waht keeps ya going, I know girls, I;m not a geek, its just that, people dont know the real feeliing of the star wars saga

I'm not going to read through all of the posts in this thread because I have a simple answer:

Bail Organa was the head of the royal family of Alderaan. Because he adopts Princess Leia into the royal family, Leia becomes a princess. It has absolutely nothing to do with Padme being a Queen on Naboo. This is because Padme was no longer a Queen after Episode I. She became a senator. The position of Queen was elected... not inherited.

Luke is not a prince. Leia was adopted... Luke was not. And since Alderaan was destroyed, and the royal family basically destroyed, Leia being a princess really lost all of it's meaning.

Hope that answers the questions.

Originally posted by Robin Darkside
wtf, is that.

I wish intelliegence and star wars realists, would answer, not u, noob

I post a simple ****ing post, atleast as logical as half the shit I see here at KMC and I get this bullshit. If it were physically possible for my hands to travel through this modem and choke you to death I think I would. wtf is a star wars realist? Oh I see, you mean a Star Wars *******. Post shit like that and all your going to get is flamed. You're the one thats a noob. I wish all the people on the earth like you would just die. DIE! DIE! DIE! DIE! DIE! DIE!

ahh, f*ck this noise.
Star Wars will remain in my heart.

I may be noob, but I know shit better than most of the boring as*holes on this KMC, Ken Kenobi must be confused on how to deal with it..with the noobs and the not realists

if you dont know what I mean, go to hell, f8cken low lifes

Robin Darkside, jerlark joined two days after you, you have no right to call him a noob.

So there's a plot hole with Leia remembering Padme even though she was born second. So what? That's been addressed several hundred times, and in the long run, isn't that important.

I don't remember if it's ever said if Bail is a king or prince or whatever of Alderaan, all that's known for certain about him is that he's the Senator. However, I DO remember it being said that his wife is the Queen of Alderaan. Therefore, Leia, being their adopted daughter is a princess, but Luke, having NOT been adopted by the Organas, has no claim to royalty.

I also remember reading somewhere that Padme's family was nobility, but wasn't royalty. Her title of Queen just meant that she was elected ruler of Naboo. She's not actually royalty.

Originally posted by Lana
Robin Darkside, jerlark joined two days after you, you have no right to call him a noob.

However, I have full right to call everyone in this thread a noob, with the exception of Ush and Lana...

*cackles maniacally*

And yeah, Leia was born second and remembers Padme better. Big whoop, I think it completely ruins the movie! I'm going to whine now.

Right, FINALLY checked this out again on the DVD, because I am sure it was said when I saw it in the Cinema.

The Captain calls Bail "Your Highness", so we can be certain that Bail is royal.

If GL is following normal royal tradition, this makes Bail a Prince, not a King (who would be called 'Your Majesty').

So yes, it follows from Bail.