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Now I don't want to sound like a whiny b!tch or anything, but why? I have a lot more to deal with then my friends do. Why does God make me suffer more then them? Why does he hate me more then them?

God doesn't....God is only the creative process whether good or bad.

I see people making other people suffer. God? I don't think so. Maybe people should really stop blammning the deity and start accepting their own mistakes. But we're talking about humans so good luck with that.

Originally posted by BlackC@t
Now I don't want to sound like a whiny b!tch or anything, but why? I have a lot more to deal with then my friends do. Why does God make me suffer more then them? Why does he hate me more then them?

Cause you like Hayden to damn much.

God is a metaphore or personification of ''good'' and Devil is a metaphore or personification of ''evil''

People think that good will always prevail and is better than evil, thus, they see God as creator of everything and more powerful than devil, because of such.

If there is a god, or gods, i highly doubt they are involved in individuals personal life. Its human egocentric nature to believe that such supreme being (if in existance) would care about every single thing he/she does.

Because there is no god.....

God does not make anyone suffer, we do that to ourselves.

the reason we suffer so much is because we blame our own mistakes and the sh!t we have to deal each and every single day. yep life sucks and the only way we can only rest peacefuly is when we die. earth is the real hell, look at all the dumb sh!t we have to put up with each and every single day.

Originally posted by ickeris2003
the reason we suffer so much is because we blame our own mistakes and the sh!t we have to deal each and every single day. yep life sucks and the only way we can only rest peacefuly is when we die. earth is the real hell, look at all the dumb sh!t we have to put up with each and every single day.

Yes, this is hell, however, this is also heaven. While others choose to live in hell I can choose to live in heaven. The difference is you and me.

Yup....the kingdom of heaven/God is within..BUT only if you want it.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
God does not make anyone suffer, we do that to ourselves.

One thing I know for certain is that God hates absolutely no human being. The only thing he does hate is sin and he does so with fiery zeal. I have suffered a lot of tragedies one right after the other, others soon to come. Whenever you suffer however, you are strengthened. The things I have gone through have helped me grow much closer to God. And you also have to understand that God never leaves you. Whenever you say, that God hates you or doesn't care about you, you are turning from him. Maybe God allows you to suffer because he knows your faith in Him strong and you can pull through.

if god hates sin and is all powerful why dont god rid this earht of sin then?


what god?

Originally posted by finti
if god hates sin and is all powerful why dont god rid this earht of sin then?
Without sin, we wouldn't have freewill. Without freewill we would be forced to worship God as opposed to doing so upon our own accord.

Originally posted by WindDancer
I see people making other people suffer. God? I don't think so. Maybe people should really stop blammning the deity and start accepting their own mistakes. But we're talking about humans so good luck with that. It seems like every time something goes wrong people want to blame God for it.

Originally posted by Pyropsycho
Without sin, we wouldn't have freewill. Without freewill we would be forced to worship God as opposed to doing so upon our own accord.

A ture God would offer free will without strings.

^ An excellent post!

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
God does not make anyone suffer, we do that to ourselves.

LIAR!

Originally posted by lil bitchiness
God is a metaphore or personification of ''good'' and Devil is a metaphore or personification of ''evil''

People think that good will always prevail and is better than evil, thus, they see God as creator of everything and more powerful than devil, because of such.

If there is a god, or gods, i highly doubt they are involved in individuals personal life. Its human egocentric nature to believe that such supreme being (if in existance) would care about every single thing he/she does.

I agree, out of everything ive read on this forum, that is the best. except i dont think that god would really care at all. if he created everything, he determined the way everything that did and will happen, you cant anger god, because he is the cause of it all.

Originally posted by debbiejo
A ture God would offer free will without strings. You on one of these threads that you do believe in God. What kind of god do you believe in? Sometimes your posts indicate that you are an athiest and I don't think you are, One time it looked like a muslim post when you said adam and eve were spiritual beinngs that fell. The muslems think they were created in heaven and fell to earth. I get confused over what you believe. How did you come up with the concluusion that they were created in heaven? Do you think mohammed was a prophet?

Originally posted by markie
You on one of these threads that you do believe in God. What kind of god do you believe in? Sometimes your posts indicate that you are an athiest and I don't think you are, One time it looked like a muslim post when you said adam and eve were spiritual beinngs that fell. The muslems think they were created in heaven and fell to earth. I get confused over what you believe. How did you come up with the concluusion that they were created in heaven? Do you think mohammed was a prophet?

What do I believe??? I have my own heretic beliefs...I do believe there is a God/Spirit or Intelligent Nature or something...I think we are part of that something...I think everything is part of it..I think it can communicate with us by many means...I believe you can access it for performing healings and such...I think It wants to help us because we are Part of it. ...I believe that we are also part of the creative process. Much of what I think is based on Wave theory quantum physics..and Spirituality. I don't believe in a punishing God.

I think that Many of the Bible stories are Allegorical, Like the Adam and Eve Story.

Originally posted by debbiejo
What do I believe??? I have my own heretic beliefs...I do believe there is a God/Spirit or Intelligent Nature or something...I think we are part of that something...I think everything is part of it..I think it can communicate with us by many means...I believe you can access it for performing healings and such...I think It wants to help us because we are Part of it. ...I believe that we are also part of the creative process. Much of what I think is based on Wave theory quantum physics..and Spirituality. I don't believe in a punishing God.

I think that Many of the Bible stories are Allegorical, Like the Adam and Eve Story. There's nothhing wrong with being a heritic, most people are. If you believe the bible instead of the preacher you are a heritic. If you think for yourself you are a heritic. What your saying is you think God is a part of his creation, I agree god is in all people, I doubt he's in animals but what about plants?

Hmmm, if he isn't in animals, then I doubt he would be in plants, although as the convetional approach seems to be that God is everything, I see no reason why if he exists he is not in some way part of animals, plants etc, just in a different way from his "chosen"

I believe that God is in every single thing that is created...everything is alive, everything as vibrations and energy to some extent...That's aliveness... And that's what we given from "The One."

so at the weekends I drink god in each sip of beer?

Originally posted by finti
so at the weekends I drink god in each sip of beer?



Well yeah...in a way..parts..

Originally posted by WindDancer
I see people making other people suffer. God? I don't think so. Maybe people should really stop blammning the deity and start accepting their own mistakes. But we're talking about humans so good luck with that.
You hear the one about the couple that were having sex on railroad tracks, got hit by a train (unfortunately suffering few injuries), and sued the train company? And won? 'Cause people pretty much suck a ton and you're absolutely correct.
Originally posted by finti
if god hates sin and is all powerful why dont god rid this earht of sin then?


what god?
He will, in time. A new heaven and a new Earth are coming...
Originally posted by lil bitchiness
God is a metaphore or personification of ''good'' and Devil is a metaphore or personification of ''evil''

People think that good will always prevail and is better than evil, thus, they see God as creator of everything and more powerful than devil, because of such.

If there is a god, or gods, i highly doubt they are involved in individuals personal life. Its human egocentric nature to believe that such supreme being (if in existance) would care about every single thing he/she does.
I disagree with the metaphor about Satan being the personification of 'evil'. If anything, Satan is the personification of purity defiled, of power corrupted, of haughtiness driven low.

If what the Bible says is true--which we're going to assume as long as we're talking about God's motives--then God is involved in our personal lives and cares what happens to us. He sent His son to live with us, to die for us, and to bear the weight of our sins so that we may have everlasting life. Why would God do such a thing if He didn't care what happened to us?

Originally posted by finti
if god hates sin and is all powerful why dont god rid this earht of sin then?

Well, well I almost did not believe my eyes. And if God did get rid of all evil and sin right now you will be the first to jump up and say : But how could God be so evil and unloving for killing innocent people just because they chose not to believe in him!!!" Ooops, sorry you won't be around to complain.

For some who claimes to be christian you sure are judgmental and jump to conclusions that has no grasp in reality at all. If this god got rid of sin and evil sorry to say sonnet I dont think you be around to witness the aftermath either, dont try to act as such a bloody prestine good all faithful christian, all the judgmental attitude you have is also a sin, and bending your knees and head while folding your hands and say "Im sorry" and think that will save you well then that will save us all as well. For if that was to be so then your god suffer from amnesia

Originally posted by sonnet
Well, well I almost did not believe my eyes. And if God did get rid of all evil and sin right now you will be the first to jump up and say : But how could God be so evil and unloving for killing innocent people just because they chose not to believe in him!!!" Ooops, sorry you won't be around to complain.

If he gave some sort of proof that he existed. Indubitable, incorruptible proof, well, I am sure alot of those people who didn't believe would begin to do so. But then supposedly something like this happened before, with Noah. Of course then it is harder to understand.

It was a long time before Jesus, so who at that time spread God's "word"? Technically those never do wells he was so angry with didn't have a chance to realise their mistake and so forth. And besides, God is said to be all powerful, so why can't he get rid of evil and sin without death?

Originally posted by FeceMan
I disagree with the metaphor about Satan being the personification of 'evil'. If anything, Satan is the personification of purity defiled, of power corrupted, of haughtiness driven low.

If what the Bible says is true--which we're going to assume as long as we're talking about God's motives--then God is involved in our personal lives and cares what happens to us. He sent His son to live with us, to die for us, and to bear the weight of our sins so that we may have everlasting life. Why would God do such a thing if He didn't care what happened to us?

Yet he also sent many other prophets, or if he didnt he let them freely develop religions.

He also, according to Torah/Bible/Quran expect us to pick the right religion through faith.

That seems like a very sloppy way to run a universe, to me.

I believe he does so, so we can choose him at the end.

Satan was in paradise, but did he really know better? Kinda like a spoiled child, he had everything, and didn't know the value of it.

God created Eden, another paradise. But why have the same thing happen again that happened in heaven itself? There might of been a meaning to that snake in the garden, that makes us like we are today. We choose him by how we act and treat people, and most importantly, if we love him.

I usually say to people who try so hard to ignore God's existene: If I'm wrong, nothing worse will happen, If you're right, nothing better will happen.

Regardless God wouldn't put us through things we coudn't handle, I definitely know that from experiecne.

Originally posted by CorderaMitchell
I believe he does so, so we can choose him at the end.

Satan was in paradise, but did he really know better? Kinda like a spoiled child, he had everything, and didn't know the value of it.

God created Eden, another paradise. But why have the same thing happen again that happened in heaven itself? There might of been a meaning to that snake in the garden, that makes us like we are today. We choose him by how we act and treat people, and most importantly, if we love him.

I usually say to people who try so hard to ignore God's existene: If I'm wrong, nothing worse will happen, If you're right, nothing better will happen.

Regardless God wouldn't put us through things we coudn't handle, I definitely know that from experiecne.



On point as usual C...

It's all about the word choice...

I used this analogy before and I think it applies here.

If you have a dog then it is your property and as long as you have it in a cage or in the house or on a leash it is not free it is controlled.

If you decide that you want to give the dog freedom then that means that you have given it the CHOICE to do whatever it wants. If it runs away and you chase it then you have not truly freed it, its ability to choose was an illusion.

However, if it is truly free then there is the possibility that it may do things that you don't want it to do and your beloved dog may even get itself killed. It may possibly become so wild that it forgets how much you love it and snap at you while you try to feed it.

If it simply stays at home then you can continue to love and care for it the way you did before and you will both be happy. But if it's free you can only hope that it does this, you can not force it to.

How much sense would it make for the dog to run wild, ignoring all your calls for it to come home, snap at you when you get near, and then think to itself when it's starving and lost, "why does my master allow me to suffer so much?"

None at all

And it's just a loose analogy because we are far more important to God than a dog would be to any human.

We have a free will and we ALL know good from evil, we don't have to be tought it.

So are we caused to suffer or do we find suffering as a consequence of the choices people make?

its like a test. but dont think for 1 second that god just sits up their laughing at us while we are suffering. it is someting he has to do. everyone suffers. whether they show it or not. everyone has gone through something that tests their faith. and thats how it is determined who makes it into heaven. how we deal with those tests of faith. and also, satan plays a little part. he tries to make you do something, and god sees this, but in testing your faith, he lets you decide what you're gonna do. its crazy stuff.

Tests test test....does school ever finish??????? I want to graduate

no, school never finishes. you graduate when you die. pretty sad to think about, ain't it

Originally posted by The MISTER
On point as usual C...

It's all about the word choice...

I used this analogy before and I think it applies here.

If you have a dog then it is your property and as long as you have it in a cage or in the house or on a leash it is not free it is controlled.

If you decide that you want to give the dog freedom then that means that you have given it the CHOICE to do whatever it wants. If it runs away and you chase it then you have not truly freed it, its ability to choose was an illusion.

However, if it is truly free then there is the possibility that it may do things that you don't want it to do and your beloved dog may even get itself killed. It may possibly become so wild that it forgets how much you love it and snap at you while you try to feed it.

If it simply stays at home then you can continue to love and care for it the way you did before and you will both be happy. But if it's free you can only hope that it does this, you can not force it to.

How much sense would it make for the dog to run wild, ignoring all your calls for it to come home, snap at you when you get near, and then think to itself when it's starving and lost, "why does my master allow me to suffer so much?"

None at all

And it's just a loose analogy because we are far more important to God than a dog would be to any human.

We have a free will and we ALL know good from evil, we don't have to be tought it.

So are we caused to suffer or do we find suffering as a consequence of the choices people make?

Also, if you had a robot make up your bed, then it would mean nothing.
If you had a sister make your bed and clean your room for you without being asked, or your daughter, out of kindness. It means so much more...

Originally posted by debbiejo
A ture God would offer free will without strings.

I think debbiejo got it here.....

If a God existed, he'd offer free will without condemning people for using it.

but thats like going through school without ever having homework or any work. its just being there so you graduate?? you have homework and tough test's, just like life. hows god gonna know who to put in heaven, if everyone just coasts through life?

Because there is no hell....It's an invention of man....there are no tests for eternity....only for life and what you can learn from it, to make you and the world a better place (heaven on earth, heaven within), then by your mistakes you CAN LEARN SOMETHING.....

We got to scare them some way. It makes me wonder if they believe in jesus or they just don't want to go to hell.

by they are you talking about christians, or who r u talking about? if they dont wanna go to hell they probably believe in jesus.

a parents responsibility is to teach Independence, to prepare us for the world we live in. They die and the cycle continues. We call G-g "father", our heavenly father. He is preparing us for a heavenly planet so that when we leave this planet we will be prepared to live an eternal life in absolute love and goodness. But how can love and goodness be measured if there is no hatred and evil? And what is heaven without laughter if there is no sorrow to measure it, or praise for doing the right ting when there is no wrong thing? And what about sex, is that in heaven? Is there work in heaven? Somebody has to feed us or is there no food because somebody has to work to prepare it? Maybe this earth is heaven and the messiah was/will be here to teach us to live together in peace. To have been born could be the gift from G-d already. Maybe this is the end of the trail and life on this planet is what you make it

I don't think we eat in Heaven, or do anything physical...that's what life here is for...I believe Heaven is quite different then we could imagine...I don't think it's really a place per say.....I think maybe it has many dimensions to it and you can chose all you want to create and do there......It's not a place like pearly gates type stuff.....unless you create it to be.

Since no one has said it yet:

"Why does God make some people suffer so much?"

Because you touch yourself at night.

Originally posted by WindDancer
I see people making other people suffer. God? I don't think so. Maybe people should really stop blammning the deity and start accepting their own mistakes. But we're talking about humans so good luck with that.
Thats a seriously good point.

so families that have lost their loved ones ,many of them too, due to illness is because of their own mistakes. Of course faithfuls will blame deities, those who doesn't believe take is as it is some are more unfortunate than others ..............then there is environmental issues

Originally posted by FeceMan
Since no one has said it yet:

"Why does God make some people suffer so much?"

Because you touch yourself at night.


and read KMC's "having sex with animals"


BTW...If you did look at it this way....you could say god does.....

God is in and apart of everything...we are part of that everything...we can create our own reality, like little bitty gods...but still have the essence of that "Whole" that god is.....So, even though we do not create all the experiences, hunger, violence....etc....But, come to think of it...some of it we do create as a whole (bunch of people that is)...We can create our reactions to it....

Reactive or Creative

Originally posted by fruits
by they are you talking about christians, or who r u talking about? if they dont wanna go to hell they probably believe in jesus. Most do, some just not want to go to hell.

Originally posted by debbiejo
I don't think we eat in Heaven, or do anything physical...that's what life here is for...I believe Heaven is quite different then we could imagine...I don't think it's really a place per say.....I think maybe it has many dimensions to it and you can chose all you want to create and do there......It's not a place like pearly gates type stuff.....unless you create it to be. So it's like a roll playing game come true where you can create your own reality? Maybe you will be a vulcan with a sense of humour, and I can be a female klion. We said somewhere that's what we want to do.

Originally posted by Chibi Boy
Thats a seriously good point. Who/what caused the tsunami and other natural desasters? I don't see how man had anything to do with it but a lot of people suffered.

Originally posted by markie
Who/what caused the tsunami and other natural desasters? I don't see how man had anything to do with it but a lot of people suffered.


Though this is only a theory I've read.....disasters happen when the world as whole is destructive in their thinking....violence, selfishness...and the elements that we are all connected too react with a negative force.....It's called the law of attraction....you attract what you think about.....do a net search on "The law of attraction with quantum physics, or metaphysics."

Originally posted by debbiejo
Because there is no hell....It's an invention of man....there are no tests for eternity....only for life and what you can learn from it, to make you and the world a better place (heaven on earth, heaven within), then by your mistakes you CAN LEARN SOMETHING.....

So there should be no consequence for our actions, many laws and disciplines, came straight out of religon and the bible.

Don't believe in punishments.....people who inflict wrong is like a butterfly effect kinda....what goes around comes back at you....ON a bigger scale with many people....It will create havoc.....and if you believe in reincarnation, which I'm just not sure about.....it comes at you anyway....

Originally posted by debbiejo
Though this is only a theory I've read.....disasters happen when the world as whole is destructive in their thinking....violence, selfishness...and the elements that we are all connected too react with a negative force.....It's called the law of attraction....you attract what you think about.....do a net search on "The law of attraction with quantum physics, or metaphysics." I don't think anybody was thinking about having a tsunami, but you're right to a certain extent believtng equals receiving. I think that's in the bible.

Originally posted by markie
Who/what caused the tsunami and other natural desasters? I don't see how man had anything to do with it but a lot of people suffered.
That was a natural disaster, god didn't make it himself. It's a sign of Armaggedon, not his fault.

product of gods creation, and god wont take responsible for it?

Originally posted by markie
Who/what caused the tsunami and other natural desasters? I don't see how man had anything to do with it but a lot of people suffered.

Don't you know? The tsunami would not have happened if there had been more Christians living there.

guess Dennis is a menace after all then

Originally posted by markie
I don't think anybody was thinking about having a tsunami, but you're right to a certain extent believtng equals receiving. I think that's in the bible.

What I mean is that negativity creates negative effects....you don't have to think about a tsunami......But as I said it was only a theory.

God do not make us suffer, its our choice. Blaming God for this is just a good way to be free of our responsibility.

so those who suffer from starvation in Africa only has themselves to blame?

but not necessarily God

do they have themselves to blame?

The whole world is to blame....An accumulated effect of all our negative, hateful, selfish thinking emotions and such....and it attracts the negative things that happens, but not all......Science has now been able to measure invisible emotions coming from large cities.....yes, they have....It's been on the Science Channel.

this god of yours doesnt seem to keen on helping those who do worship him there though

reply to lil bitchiness' first post

THERE IS A GOD! THERE IS A DEVIL! AND IF YOU THINK OTHER WISE YOU ARE ONLY INGNORING THE TRUE FACTS AND TRYING TO PROVE OTHER WISE WHEN THERE IS UNDISPUTABLE PROOF ALL OVER THAT GOD EXISTS, AND ON A SIDE NOTE, GOD ALSO DID HAVE A SON WHOM WAS NAMED JESUS!

Bardock42 YOU ARE LOST IF YOU BELIEVE THERE IS NO GOD!

I MOSTLY AGREE WITH Shakyamunison, BUT GOD DOES PUNISH PEOPLE, LIKE A PARENT PUNSHING A CHILD.

why dont you come up with these undisputable proof then..............and stop using capital letters

im so glad you are here to tell us all these new and undiscoverd things

Originally posted by finti
this god of yours doesnt seem to keen on helping those who do worship him there though

If we are talking about that christian god that is in many ways limited, as it is a being separated from us, almost an individual being, and some even imagine him like a old man, even having a human form. Then, I agree with you. I think christianism deals more with politics than spirituality, and to solve this problem about the starvation in africa I think it will be better if we think in a socio-political way, than a religious way. My opinion is that the whole world is to blame, like debbiejo said, and it is just a socio-political problem.

Originally posted by debbiejo
Science has now been able to measure invisible emotions coming from large cities

By the way, where did you saw that ?Are there any sites ?

Debbiejo as wisdom.....the Bible said so.....hehehe......She told me so...



OH....don't know of any sites......just saw it on the Science channel.....

They had these special monitors set all up over the whole world...and it would ONLY register when people were in one accord in their thinking...

they gave examples like at Christmas and other holidays, when Princess Diana died, 911, and others.....when they tried it at a soccer game, it didn't work cause the people were DIVIDED....not in one accord.....

Guess you'd have to do a search on the net about it.

Originally posted by Atlantis001
God do not make us suffer, its our choice. Blaming God for this is just a good way to be free of our responsibility.

Not make, Allow is a better term.

God doesn't want any to suffer.....So I decided to listen......

I'm saying we are responsible for our problems(mostly), god allowed it, to help us in the end. Think of a spoiled child.

Regardless god wouldn't put us through anything we couldn't handle.

Like a friend said, if a dog runs away on its own free will, then the dog shouldn't cry to its master,"why are you making me suffer". when the owner welcomes him back anytime with open arms. At that point the master is allowing the pet to do so, thus its that pet's fault for not seeking help.

People still don't go to church on mothers day, because thier mother died, and is now with god. I try to explain to them, THAT, is the best time to come to church and see god.

Originally posted by JLRTENJAC
I MOSTLY AGREE WITH Shakyamunison, BUT GOD DOES PUNISH PEOPLE, LIKE A PARENT PUNSHING A CHILD.

So God punishes people? And what about rewards and love? Christians says he does that, but I don't see it. Where is the pat on the head, the "you did good". Because I must admit at my cynical times I see no evidence of God's "Good Grace". Or anything to indicate that he is doing anything to help, which, as I have said before, I would expect if he is real, truly powerful, and truly concerned with humanities well being.

I was taklking about many of those victim of the famine is christians and as christians they pray to their god, yet god seem to turn a deaf ear to their problems

hmmmm

Originally posted by Bardock42
Because there is no god.....
not that simple , it isn't.

everythin that God does has a gud reason bhind it.

suppose ur in gud health like normally, d u ever think or thank GOd fr that gud health n condition?

i don't

but when u get sick (lik i m rite nw. i hav a fever) then u realiz what a blessin it was to b in a gud state so God does this 2 u 2 mak u realiz that n keep u pryin 2 Him

Fevers are a good thing though....It's how our body kills off what shouldn't be in it.....without fevers, we would all get very sick, die and have to take medication ....though some do that anyway, but shouldn't..it weakens your immune system.....You're body has to raise it's temp. to kill off what's there...so fevers are a blessing not a curse....I don't take meds. for it myself unless it gets way to high, but even still, you can still get it down....boy is that off topic......The body is a wonderful machine, if you take care of it, and you're genes haven't been too damaged by heredity, or you're environment....I've know many many people who have recovered with cancer with changes they've made in diet (strict) alone....It's all in the knowledge on the way things work in this world......I volunteered at a care facility and heard many testimonials in regards to it......Knowledge is the key to all things.

Shhhhhhh.....the doctors don't want you to know......

Originally posted by maham
everythin that God does has a gud reason bhind it.

What is the good reason for infants being raped in Africa because HIV positive men believe it will cure them of the disease?

What is the good reason a 3 year old was beaten to death because the father believed the child to be gay?

Shall I go on?

Originally posted by maham


everythin that God does has a gud reason bhind it.


You gotta' be ****ing kidding me

maybe it was not God with did it, maybe we put words in his mouth( er... if he have one).

Originally posted by Atlantis001
maybe it was not God with did it, maybe we put words in his mouth( er... if he have one).

I agree.....It's not God...it's us...and since we are all apart of what God is...We are the ones that created what we see, as a whole.

Where do you think negativity goes when it leaves your thoughts....then multiply that by billions....do you think it just evaporates?....Thoughts have substance...they have effect....It's part of quantum physics.