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My new Defenders.

Silver Surfer
Strange
Champion of the universe w/gem
Hulk
Captain Mar-vell.

48 hours prep, against the whole Marvel Earth.
Bloodlust, but trying not to kill innocents.

Against every single hero on earth!

Id use Hercules to slug out with Hulk. Thor to keep Silver Surfer occupied or even beat him. Drax and current She Hulk to go against Champion. Quasar to go against Mar-vell.

Now Stranger is a bit complicated...Chaos Scarlet Witch. And Ghost Rider in case its needed.

For prep Dr Doom all the way. And Tony stark.

How about it

i wouldnt consider Quasar nor Drax Marvel Earth, and Doom is no Hero, at least not to most.

SS can kill Thor with one blast, Thor has admitted it. Drax would be eaten by Champ, but Draz isn't on Earth, neither is quasar.


Earth doesn't get prep, just the Defenders.

I think they could do it.

Originally posted by long pig
SS can kill Thor with one blast, Thor has admitted it. Drax would be eaten by Champ, but Draz isn't on Earth, neither is quasar.


Earth doesn't get prep, just the Defenders.

I think they could do it.
When did Thor admit this Longpig

Thor being killed with one blast by the Surfer? How if they already fought like two times and Surfer never won. Granted he can win but since he never had it easy he wont have it here.

Surfer attacked The Avengers with a "warning blast" and Thor said "That blast would have killed me AND the rest of the Avengers!"

Surfer could easily beat Thor if he wanted, verrrryyyy easily. I don't think anyone actually doubts that a Bloodlust Surfer would have problems with Thor.

I'm thinking Marvel is going down!

'SS can kill Thor with one blast, Thor has admitted it'

Yaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh When did that Happen?

'Surfer could easily beat Thor if he wanted, verrrryyyy easily. I don't think anyone actually doubts that a Bloodlust Surfer would have problems with Thor.'

What that doesn't really make any sense but what do i know ?


Dude im warning you don't back the Heralds it makes you a fanboy

Apparentlly
Well thats the impression i was given any way

Surfer is backed as being able to beat most people because, well.....he really can. Surfer, by nature is a pacifist, he doesn't kill and doesn't want to fight. A bloodlusted Surfer could blow the entire earth up if he wanted, he's blown planets up before.

Ya'll want scans of when Thor admits it? I have them somewhere.

' bloodlusted Surfer could blow the entire earth up if he wanted, he's blown planets up before'

I read a debate recently where this was covered over and over again. No proof was given to suggest that Silver Surfer could actualy blow up a planet Except an old issue where some Dude uses his powers to cover the Surfer in Asteroids.

Although the bad guy refers to Surfer being in the centre of his own plane, the size of the object he is enclosed in is no where near the size of a planet.

A blast capable of destroying that sized object is unlikely to really hurt Thor.

"A bloodlusted Surfer could blow the entire earth up if he wanted, he's blown planets up before"

And Thor hasent? Any guy at Top levels have pretty much plenetary level feats.

Has Thor ever blown a planet up?

'And Thor hasn't? Any guy at Top levels have pretty much planetary level feats.'

Good Shout Mann

He's got far more examples of doing damage on a celestial level than Surfer.

I still reckon surfer is more powerful
but apart from transmuting stuff and flying through stars i haven't really seen him do anything ?????

Could somebody help me here what badass stuff has surfer done???????????????

long, thor has STOMPED ss twice, (though it was mad thor, he CRUSHED SS, ko'ing him on 2 occasions) and regular thor stalemated a loki-enhanced ss because he held back knowing ss was a 'noble soul'. in that same issue thor easily smashed a power cosmic force field with one blow, and absorbed ss blasts. mjollnir is at skyfather level don't forget and so its magics are well beyond ss. god blast has chased off galactus and once staggered EXITAR the celestial when thor blasted his 'brain'!! if thor did indeed say what you say he did (and i don't doubt it) i'm gonna guess he meant if he didn't have his hammer or if he and the others had been caught by surprise. i can even show a scan of IRON MAN absorbing ss's power then returning it at him and ko'ing him! course, im was ko'd in the process . . ..

ss is tough, no doubt, but thor takes ss down unless ss gets a sneak attack in somehow.

sentry could probably take champ (if he's as tough as they say) if not, add hercules and shehulk to the mix. wanda, agatha harkness, doom, ghost rider could team up on strange (doom is a wicked powerful sorcerer in his own right), juggs, thing, colossus could all work together to take hulk, xavier, cable, jean and a host of others could eliminate marvel.

your group is tough, long, but their are a LOT of tough characters left out. they'd do damage, but no way they take over the world in my opinion.

<<Has Thor ever blown a planet up?>.

recently bill has. if bill can, thor can. and i'm sure thor HAS, i just can't think of where at the moment. wouldn't matter - even a blast THAT powerful could theoretically be absorbed by thor's hammer.

Um.

Surfer is wrapped in a Planet, it's called a Planet, he blows the Planet up.
The End.

How can you tell it's not the size of "A planet"? It is a planet, therefore it is the size of one. Not much there to discuss.

Didn't Thor have the powergem when he beat Surfer? Didn't Surfer hold back each time? Did he speed blitz Thor?

'<<Has Thor ever blown a planet up?>.

recently bill has. if bill can, thor can. and I'm sure thor HAS, i just can't think of where at the moment. wouldn't matter - even a blast THAT powerful could theoretically be absorbed by Thor's hammer.'

Planetoid asteroid that was about to hit Asgard was destroyed by him

He dragged the Midgard serpent off earth which is the size of a planet

He apparently did serious damage to Ego with his God Force. (I'm not to sure about this) - And Ego was protecting itself with shielding. He also created weather effects on a planetary level which did damage to Ego.

He recently re made the moon after it had been destroyed.

I read recently that he lifted Twilight which is a sword made out of a neutron star. This apparently would weigh more than a planet.

We're forgetting they are working at a team, and have prep and suprise.

Strange can protect his teammates from telepathic assaults with his Eye, he can also invoke a nigh impenetrable shield for himself and others. He can mind attack anyone.

Strange can teleport anyone away to Deaths realm as long as he can see them. Surfer is zipping around lightspeed. Champ and Hulk are beating everyones asses in h2h, with no fear of telepathic assault.

CM is just reeking friggin havok on everyone else.

Team effort, not just a buncha guys causing havok.
I see no reason why they couldn't take over.

'Strange can protect his teammates from telepathic assaults with his Eye, he can also invoke a nigh impenetrable shield for himself and others. He can mind attack anyone.'

Like charles xavier the most powerful telepath on the planet.

Strange can teleport anyone away to Deaths realm as long as he can see them.

Invisible woman comes along and plants a force field in his lungs. Slight expansion and boom

Surfer is zipping around lightspeed.

'As is Quasar and thor' and together they take this

I call on warlock to take care of Champion and the destroyer (sent by Odin) and Juggernaught to take care of Hulk

CM is tough, but can he handle wanda and her reality warpingpowers???????????

<<Didn't Thor have the powergem when he beat Surfer? Didn't Surfer hold back each time? Did he speed blitz Thor?>>

no gem. thor didn't get that until after he fought the whole watch. did ss blitz? does ANYBODY EVER blitz? he did charge and attack once, for what that's worth, but ss also had WARLOCK with him!! he crushed both warlock AND ss at the same time.

thor can definitely handle the ss.

Quasar isn't marvel Earth. Thor can't fight at lightspeed, only hold his hammer can his hammer travels near light speed, he doesn't have the reactions.

And yes, Strange can attack Charles, the most powerful natural telepath on the planet, because Strange is a more powerful telepath than Charles.
How? Well, Strange's EOA can be used to ampilfy his already substantial magical-telepathy, it's basically a portable Cerebro, and with it, he is above Xavier.
Strange also can shoot blasts that have K.O'd a full powered Galactus and knocked Death herself on her ass, lets not forget that.

Warlock isn't on Earth, neither is the Destroyer.
Jugs can die pretty easily now, he's depowered down to the level of Colossus.

Invisible woman wouldn't be able to penetrate his shield, his shield took hits from Galactus/Death/Hulk and didn't faulter, he can create a shield that is three times stronger than his normal shield as well.

<<<does ANYBODY EVER blitz?>>>

Not in comics, no.
But they do in this match. Thor can't handle fighting at above light speed. He dies, quick.

<<<but ss also had WARLOCK with him!! he crushed both warlock AND ss at the same time.>>>
Was this mad Thor?
Explain what Mad Thor is.

<<Team effort, not just a buncha guys causing havok.
I see no reason why they couldn't take over.>>

partly my bad - i forgot about the prep. even still, there are simply too many other enormously powerful beings out there. since they want to rule the world, you need to assume all the villains also join in. dude, there is just too many. doom and richards and stark can do pretty well on the fly as well. i suppose your crew might have a chance if strange could teleport ss in and out of everywhere so he can strike before anyone knows he's there. even still, the other heroes would catch on and make defenses. i just don't see it happening . . .

again, from what i've read, sentry alone could wreak havoc with these guys.

<<But they do in this match. Thor can't handle fighting at above light speed. He dies, quick.>>

tell that to kg because he took care of gladiator who's a 100x FTL.



and mad thor is just thor overcome by warrior madness. makes him . . . difficult to deal with.

by the way, in these 'bloodlust battles' i don't understand why thor isn't ALWAYS considered 'mad'.

"But they do in this match. Thor can't handle fighting at above light speed. He dies, quick."

If guys that fly faster than light can fight here with that speed, Thor should as well. Since you know he does fly gaster than light speeds as well.

"Strange also can shoot blasts that have K.O'd a full powered Galactus and knocked Death herself on her ass, lets not forget that."

When did he ever knocked down a full powered Galactus? Or Death for that matter.



"Was this mad Thor?
Explain what Mad Thor is"

He was talking about Rune Thor i think. He beat the entire infinite watch ( surfer included ) without any problems.

If they need more prep, they all go back to Strange's mansion. I'd love to see anyone try to get in there with intent to harm.

Remember, Strange can make illusions of himself and his teammates that can fool anyone, even Loki was fooled by his illusions.

Hulk, with no fear of mental attack is unstoppable.

Surfer takes out Dooms whole country by himself.

Reeds building can be sealed to where they cant leave.

Strange can stop/slow time and time travel.

CM beat King Thor, why couldn't he beat regular Thor?

I think my Defenders can do it.

"recently bill has. if bill can, thor can. and I'm sure thor HAS, i just can't think of where at the moment. wouldn't matter - even a blast THAT powerful could theoretically be absorbed by Thor's hammer.'"

Thor has at least blew off a planet asteroid sized before if i recall correctly.

"CM"

captain mar-vell beat King Thor?? when?

<<<tell that to kg because he took care of gladiator who's a 100x FTL.>>>

I don't get what you're saying. Thor beat Gladiator who was going 100xFTL? Thor can't go that fast, and only did once when reed invented a machine that made him able to fight at lightspeed.

<<<<<
If guys that fly faster than light can fight here with that speed, Thor should as well. Since you know he does fly gaster than light speeds as well. >>>>
Thor doesn't "fly" he travels. He hold onto his Hammer, and the hammer pulls him. He doesn't have lightspeed reactions, he has godly reflexes.

<<<When did he ever knocked down a full powered Galactus? Or Death for that matter.>>>
Ah, want a scan?
He's taken out Galactus twice, once with one blast, and another with a mind attack.

Scans-are-a-comin'

http://img265.echo.cx/img265/540/strange73ou.th.png

Knocks Death on her ass....but of course, Death says "you can't kill Death!", and Strange says "And you can't kill me!" cuz he's immortal, connected to Eternity yada yada.

http://img265.echo.cx/img265/6862/strange106gv.th.png
Galactus demands help from Strange, Strange refuses, Galactus attacks, Strange attacks back, Galactus is on his ass, falling to earth.

And yes, he could handle Wandas reality powers, he negated the IG's power to control reality twice.

yeah i want to see them if thats true my respect for Galactus drops even more.

Is the mind atack the one he used before the Thing knocked him down?

"I don't get what you're saying. Thor beat Gladiator who was going 100xFTL? Thor can't go that fast"

he can and he has before. Thor vol 1 with Kirby has. Afterthat one as well. Thats how he can cross galaxies. By going FTL speeds. - With- the hammer of course, not without.

Those scans are impressive.

Third Force of the universe my hell.

"recently bill has. if bill can, thor can. and I'm sure thor HAS, i just can't think of where at the moment. wouldn't matter - even a blast THAT powerful could theoretically be absorbed by Thor's hammer.'"

Thor has at least blew off a planet asteroid sized before if i recall correctly.

Dude read my posts

They came out small.

here's the link.

http://img265.echo.cx/my.php?image=strange106gv.png <---Galactus

http://img265.echo.cx/my.php?image=strange73ou.png <---death

For shits and giggles, heres when he negated the effects of the IG against himself and his team.

http://img99.echo.cx/img99/9060/strange148ak.th.png

Are you sure he was at full power? Galactus doesnt usually asks for help when he is. At least in the stories i read.

"Thor has at least blew off a planet asteroid sized before if i recall correctly.

Dude read my posts"

I did. It says what i said.

Mann those scans are impressive
Dude can you make them bigger???????

Galactus needing Strange's help is impressive

Wow i have a whole new respect for Strange
Not even the God blast knocked over Galactus
I've only seen thanos knock over galactus

<<<<Is the mind atack the one he used before the Thing knocked him down?>>>

He used Images of Ikonn to make Galactus feel all the pain he's dealt to the people he's killed. It's a more powerful version of Ghost riders penance stare.

<<<<if thats true my respect for Galactus drops even more.>>>>
It shouldn't, Strange is just that powerful. He is the Avatar of Eternity, and when he becomes the Avatar of Eternity, well......he could make Galactus his herald.

Yeah whats even more impresive is the "Marvels third force of the universe " always asking for help. Stranger, Fantastc Four, Thor, Hercules.

bah.

And while Stranger was amazing he wasent in the verge of ever defeat Death...but it was impressive for sure.

"It shouldn't, Strange is just that powerful. He is the Avatar of Eternity"

Didnt knew about this one. That should explain it.

Thanos knocked over a highly weakened Galactus, Strange K.O'd a full powered Galactus who was ready for a big fight with one of the Vishanti, Agamotto.

Man didnt knew Stranger was - that - powerful.

Have more impressie scans to share?

" impressive......"

'Yeah whats even more impresive is the "Marvels third force of the universe " always asking for help. Stranger, Fantastc Four, Thor, Hercules.

bah.'

I never thougt of it like that but good point

and sorry about earlier

Sorry about what? I should had payed more attention. We end up saying the same thing.

What the bloddy hell are the Vishanti, Agamotto.??????????

I heard strange going on about them in the spiderman cartoon (Lame heh???????)

He reffered to them as neing opnipotent but that is a term thrown about alot

I didnt think the Thanos thing was even that impressive. It didn't really hurt galactus

I got a few more. I always dug this one where he finds out he is indeed, immortal, that's why Death couldn't kill him.

http://img265.echo.cx/img265/9373/strange83qz.th.png
http://img265.echo.cx/img265/6648/strange65kr.th.png

These are a fight between Strange and Dormmamu, Dorm's power is on a scale high enough that Eternity himself had trouble fighting him.
He defeats him in his own realm, where D' is basically Omnipotent.

http://img34.echo.cx/img34/9713/strange18zs.th.png
http://img34.echo.cx/img34/9260/strange28fq.th.png
http://img34.echo.cx/img34/5910/strange34dd.th.png

<<<<What the bloddy hell are the Vishanti, Agamotto.??????????>>>

The Vishanti are a group of gods(Agamotto is one of them) from which Strange gets some of his power from, they are near omnipotent beings.
He can call upon them to give him power, and they always do, except when he refused to fight in a war for them. They then stripped him on his powers and he had to learn catastrophy magic and other magic.

The Vishanti came back after seeing that he learned so much without his other powers and forced him to fight for them
He ended up fighting a few thousand years in that war for them and he got his powers back.

'<<<<What the bloddy hell are the Vishanti, Agamotto.??????????>>>

The Vishanti are a group of gods(Agamotto is one of them) from which Strange gets some of his power from, they are near omnipotent beings.
He can call upon them to give him power, and they always do, except when he refused to fight in a war for them. They then stripped him on his powers and he had to learn catastrophy magic and other magic.

The Vishanti came back after seeing that he learned so much without his other powers and forced him to fight for them
He ended up fighting a few thousand years in that war for them and he got his powers back.'

Are these guys Skyfather level or bigger. Dude and can you make those scans bigger i can hardly read them. But im loving all this info.

I've always heard how powerful strange was but finding any info on him is quite hard

Yeah, they're a bit above Skyfather, I'm pretty sure.

I don't know why these pics are so small, usually they're huge.

I'll just link you to them.

Dormammu fight.
http://img34.echo.cx/my.php?image=strange28fq.png
http://img34.echo.cx/my.php?image=strange28fq.png
http://img34.echo.cx/my.php?image=strange34dd.png

Death fight.
http://img265.echo.cx/my.php?image=strange83qz.png
http://img265.echo.cx/my.php?image=strange73ou.png
http://img265.echo.cx/my.php?image=strange65kr.png

Galactus fight.
http://img265.echo.cx/my.php?image=strange99rp.png
http://img265.echo.cx/my.php?image=strange106gv.png
http://img265.echo.cx/my.php?image=strange118bw.png

Here is the one where he negates the power of the Infinity Gauntlet, if you know what that is, you'll know why it's so damn impressive to me.
http://img99.echo.cx/my.php?image=strange148ak.png

long, the thing has toppled g by smashing the ground under him. strange is impressive, but g is weak against magic. his mind attack happened when g was VERY weak. he appears to have done nothing against death except blast her. i'm not saying strange isn't tough - he's very tough, but i can show scans where he was getting rocked by the executioner and enchantress! strange even admits he could take them seperate, but not together. clea had to come in and save his ass!

and you're forgetting that molecule man is on earth. him, sentry and juggs, along with thor, hercules, shehulk, iron man (with asgard armor, perhaps. . . .) the list goes on and on. fraid i still don't see it happening, long.

that battle against dormammu was fought along with ss and clea and there was someone else, i'm almost sure. i could check, but it wasn't like ds beat dorma on his own. that battle sucked, by the way. i was looking for a great fight. what we got was sort of a confusing mess.

again, i reiterate - strange is powerful, but there are a LOT of powerful beings out there to oppose him and his gang.

He blasted her, knocking her over. Then she blasts him twice, his shields block them. She says she could possibly kill him, but it isn't worth the supreme effort it'd take to beat him.

Galactus, after being K.O'd for a second, wonders outloud what would it take for him to beat Strange.

I'd like to see the scans, is it Defenders #20?

What exactly can Molecule Man do against Strange who is in the Astral plane? Strange, while in astral form has no molecules to effect, and can still use his Eye and attack MM's soul.


Agreed, the Dorm fight sucked, I was hoping for more myself.

I think my Defenders can take all of em, definatly not at the same time, but they could take everyone of earth heros out a few at a time, teleport somewhere else.....yadayada.

How can the Avatar of Eternity be more powerful than Galan full powered when Galactus is nearly as powerful as Eternity when he is full powered.

I was just bullshitting about that, didn't litterally mean he could make Galactus his pet.
But I don't think Galactus is as powerful as Eternity........I could be wrong, but that sounds iffy.

Strange invoking E' and becoming the Avatar of Eternity is a pretty big deal, imo.

Are we forgetting about the others?

Champ w/gem
Captain M
Surfer
Hulk

No one is taking Hulk out, or Champ in a brawn fight, they are there to reek some hella havok, kicking all types of ass.

Surfer and Cap' are the speed blitzers, they're gonna kill 50% of the big guys with the blitz's.

Strange's biggest role is leader and playing supreme defence, by giving the other protection and sending out hords of demons on earth to attack.
Relocating the true heavy hitters, Thor and the like, to another dimention.

Originally posted by long pig
I was just bullshitting about that, didn't litterally mean he could make Galactus his pet.
But I don't think Galactus is as powerful as Eternity........I could be wrong, but that sounds iffy.

Strange invoking E' and becoming the Avatar of Eternity is a pretty big deal, imo.

Are we forgetting about the others?

Champ w/gem
Captain M
Surfer
Hulk

No one is taking Hulk out, or Champ in a brawn fight, they are there to reek some hella havok, kicking all types of ass.

Surfer and Cap' are the speed blitzers, they're gonna kill 50% of the big guys with the blitz's.

Strange's biggest role is leader and playing supreme defence, by giving the other protection and sending out hords of demons on earth to attack.
Relocating the true heavy hitters, Thor and the like, to another dimention.
Champ w/gem - will take THor easily
SS will take care of anyone on earth
Captain M - another bad mofo

<<Champ w/gem - will take THor easily>>

easily my arse. thor went toe to toe with drax when drax had the gem, and herc did the same. could champ survive a full unleashed god blast? ss put champ down, so i'm guessing not . . .

xavier, nate, cable, emma frost can work together (xavier may be able to do it alone) to take out ss.

cm is a bad mofo, but again, too many other powerful mofos out there. of course this group could take on most small groups of heroes. but you said they want the world - heroes and villains would team up to stop them. and i'll grant it's debatable what mm could do to strange, but molecule man could waste the others. he's above skyfather.

and here are the scans - dr strange #12

this one shows strange being pummeled by the executioner, but his shields are still holding. enchantress is also pestering him.

the second one shows his shields fading. in the first panel he claims he could take either alone, but that he doesn't think he can beat them together. near the end, his shields are fading, he says he can only stand a couple more hits then that's it. then clea (unseen til the next page) blasts the enchantress and saves strange's arse. i've always loved strange, long . . .

Originally posted by leonidas
<<Champ w/gem - will take THor easily>>

easily my arse. thor went toe to toe with drax when drax had the gem, and herc did the same. could champ survive a full unleashed god blast? ss put champ down, so i'm guessing not . . .

xavier, nate, cable, emma frost can work together (xavier may be able to do it alone) to take out ss.

cm is a bad mofo, but again, too many other powerful mofos out there. of course this group could take on most small groups of heroes. but you said they want the world - heroes and villains would team up to stop them. and i'll grant it's debatable what mm could do to strange, but molecule man could waste the others. he's above skyfather.

and here are the scans - dr strange #12

this one shows strange being pummeled by the executioner, but his shields are still holding. enchantress is also pestering him.
thor went toe to toe with drax when drax had the gem , and herc the same issue number? please

Originally posted by leonidas
<<Champ w/gem - will take THor easily>>

easily my arse. thor went toe to toe with drax when drax had the gem, and herc did the same. could champ survive a full unleashed god blast? ss put champ down, so i'm guessing not . . .

xavier, nate, cable, emma frost can work together (xavier may be able to do it alone) to take out ss.

cm is a bad mofo, but again, too many other powerful mofos out there. of course this group could take on most small groups of heroes. but you said they want the world - heroes and villains would team up to stop them. and i'll grant it's debatable what mm could do to strange, but molecule man could waste the others. he's above skyfather.

and here are the scans - dr strange #12

this one shows strange being pummeled by the executioner, but his shields are still holding. enchantress is also pestering him.
(xavier may be able to do it alone) to take out ss. -God like Cable couldn't

SS will smoke most of them , with his speed , and if he gets mad he will just blow them up

how do you think thor GOT the gem?? thor fought drax AND maxam at the same time! herc and drax only went at it for a couple moments, then he eliminated maxam and then he beat down warlock. i've showed scans before. its an IW book - they both are i think. (i can never keep track of that blood and thunder storyline!)

Originally posted by leonidas
how do you think thor GOT the gem?? thor fought drax AND maxam at the same time! herc and drax only went at it for a couple moments, then he eliminated maxam and then he beat down warlock. i've showed scans before. its an IW book - they both are i think. (i can never keep track of that blood and thunder storyline!)
Are you talking about mad thor?

Drax got his stone jacked

Chap is another Story , he is not that dumb

like i said he will rip THor pretty easily , and then go on a rampage

thor hit drax and he, er, coughed it up in that fight. i'll grant there's a chance champ SHOULD win that fight, but it wouldn't be easy, with or without the gem. seriously, you think he'd take a full godblast after seeing ss put him down? i'm not saying thor would win a slugfest, but a few lightning bolts then a godblast? yeah, i still think thor has a chance to win that fight. he's battled the destroyer for a prolonged period of time in the past, and i'd put the destroyer above champ even with the gem. (that, by the way, would be a GREAT fight!!)

later

Originally posted by leonidas
thor hit drax and he, er, coughed it up in that fight. i'll grant there's a chance champ SHOULD win that fight, but it wouldn't be easy, with or without the gem. seriously, you think he'd take a full godblast after seeing ss put him down? i'm not saying thor would win a slugfest, but a few lightning bolts then a godblast? yeah, i still think thor has a chance to win that fight. he's battled the destroyer for a prolonged period of time in the past, and i'd put the destroyer above champ even with the gem. (that, by the way, would be a GREAT fight!!)

later
you have no idea how powerful Chamption is do you.

Thor hit drax ( this was mad thor , remember he was a lot more powerful than your average thor)

Drax --- without gem --- can go head to head with hulk , infact hulk said darx was more powerful

ss put him down? ---- SS whould put down thor pretty easily , in a what if he stoped his hammer.

SS has way too many powers to handle enimes.

for example

SS vs Hulk --- he defeated Hulk like he was nothing
--- He can take his gamma
SS vs Gladiator ---- Again , Gladiator speed won't help him here
------ SS has been said to be stonger than him , Brb multiple times
SS vs Quasar -------- In recent issue Quasar couldn't do jack shit to SS
SS vs Captain Marvel --------- He tarped his ass.
SS vs Firelord ------------------- He says that nothing Firelord does can hurt him since he can just absorb it if he wants.
SS vs Chamption ------------SS used his speed , to help him out
SS vs Korvac ------------------ World Destoying attacks had to effect on him.

SS now with all his power is way above Thor and can do so much more.
that's why SS is able to defeat people that thor might not.

as for Chap with power Gem ------------- Is near THanos's level

He will beat thor badly , thor attack won't do much damage

and you know what genis did to asgard?

That's either when he was stripped of power(88ish somewhere around there), or some crazy circumstances were a-happenin'.

He isn't invincible, but his shields were fading? C'mon, they've taken multiple hits from death and galactus and a manifistation of Eternity without weakening.
Something is really wrong there.

Anyway, a well written Champ would smash Thor, with ease. And yes, he could take a GodBlast, he's taken hits from Thanos without any sign of pain.
I'd be hard pressed to believe even SS or Thanos should have beaten him.
But, the plot must go on!

<<<Do you know what Genis did to Asgard>>

I do!!

"you have no idea how powerful Chamption is do you."

Apart from his first appearance when did he even looked impressive? We didnt even saw him fighting the strongest guys because he eliminated them before they actually fought. Then Ben broke his ribs.

Powerful? yes but lets not exagerate. He was portraited dumb as a door against Thanos.

"thor went toe to toe with drax when drax had the gem , and herc the same issue number? please"

Ill try to find the number. Both Thor and Herc where mind controlled i think and thus not holding back. Herc did the same to rax what Maxan did once. Tussed him into the ocean. Then he beat down the rest of infinite watch Warlock included.

"you have no idea how powerful Chamption is do you."

Apart from his first appearance when did he even looked impressive? We didnt even saw him fighting the strongest guys because he eliminated them before they actually fought. Then Ben broked his ribs.

Powerful? yes but lets not exagerate. He was portraited dumb as a door against Thanos.

"thor went toe to toe with drax when drax had the gem , and herc the same issue number? please"

Ill try to find the number. Both Thor and Herc where mind controlled i think and thus not holding back. Herc did the same to drax what Maxan did once. Tussed him into the ocean. Then he beat down the rest of infinite watch Warlock included.

"he's taken hits from Thanos without any sign of pain. "

Infinite Crusade. Prof Hulk and Hercules double team against Thanos. Both took punches and wherent down after the first.

Sorry for the doble post. Just wanted to add the last bit.

That's what I mean by a "well written Champ'", you can not be as dumb as he is portrayed and still manage to master every single fighting style to ever exist.

I mean, really.

He's billions and billions of years old, and spends all his time training, for christs sake, it takes massive ammounts of intelligence to master any complex martial art, and he knows them all.

The best showing was when he put Drax,Gladiator,Surfer,Beta ray and Hulk in hospitol beds after fighting each one in a row.

He can have limitless strength, speed and basically limitless any power he wants with the power gem. So, yeah, (a well written Champ)he'd eat Thor.

My Defenders are going to own Marvel Earth!

In this thread someone already said it before me. Thor has blow a planet before ( no not that kind of blow ).

The size of the planet ( and in this i agree wth long pic ) doesnt matter. Its a planet noneless.

Both Surfer and Thor have that kind of feats. Combat feats tho Thor has more. Surfer with all his powers is at heart a pacifist not a warrior.

"That's what I mean by a "well written Champ'", you can not be as dumb as he is portrayed and still manage to master every single fighting style to ever exist."

Thats my complain the guy practically is always written as dumb considering the experince he has.

Alot more than Thor us written like that and Herc. And both have theyr moments

" alot more than Thor has been written..."

If you post wrong or what not, you can Edit it by clicking the edit button at the bottem right edge of your post.

Looks like after the 30th billion year with the power gem, he'da figured out "wow, I can give myself any physical power I want! wee" or something, jesus...

Sometimes, he's used to make another guy look better, but Champion ALWAYS deliberately reduces his natural constitution to give his opponents a fair chance in his battles, so whatever.

I always thought about him ending up being a martial arts teacher for super beings, that'd be sweet.

Anyways, my defenders own Marvel Earth......no one shall thwart the will of swarthy five!


-edit- In reference to the fight with Thing and Champ...

He fought the Thing and defeated him, but the Thing would not surrender; when forced to choose between killing his defeated opponent or yielding, the Champion yielded.

"If you post wrong or what not, you can Edit it by clicking the edit button at the bottem right edge of your post"

Its a matter of getting used to but i will.

And yeah Champion was created to job. Hes the defination of Jobber at Marvel. In fact all the elders except the Gamesmaster and Runner dont look impressive at all. To me at least.

True, but for some reason, I'm some how oddly a fanboy of him.

I like the fact he has honor and he's the greatest fighter to ever exist, and he is billions of years old.
Me and quickfreeze have a claim to fame as being a fanboy of a super abscure character.

The Elders should be impressive, but they aren't written well.

The runner is faster than Flash.
Champ w/gem is stronger(he punched a planet in half accidently)/faster/more durable than Superman, so on and so forth.

There is no single being capable of beating (a well written)Champ in a pure h2h fight. All of his powers are limitless.
Doesn't tire can become infinitly strong and can do multiples of light speed.
His body is powered by something that is compaired to a nuclear engine.

He has the power primordial, which is >>power cosmic.

He's only held back by morals and absurd PIS.

But, he seriously owns.

My Defenders own even harder

oh, yeah, champ'd eat thor.

maybe you're not too sure how powerful THOR is. here's a reminder

and yes, that IS EXITAR whom thor 'jostles'. surfer's blasts do literally NOTHING to odin and galactus. surfer has beaten champ and thor has STAGGERED the second most powerful of the CELESTIALS!!

oh, yeah, ss and champ would eat thor. you guys must be ^%$#in' kidding . . .

and molecule man and sentry are supposedly ABOVE thor!! long, your defenders go down. thor, sentry and molecule man alone could do it.

Originally posted by leonidas
oh, yeah, champ'd eat thor.

maybe you're not too sure how powerful THOR is. here's a reminder
That proves what?

Champion with power Gem = Thanos (at prime) ---- In power at least > Silver Surfer
Champion without Power Gem, power P =< Silver Sufer( when actually trying)

Silver Surfer > Gladiator (confident) > Thor > Hulk

Champion > Hulk, Thor, Thing, Namor etc

Thing of Champion a cosmic Juggernaut ( when he has his power gem ) ---- he can’t be hurt , as you have seen in Thanos vs Champion

Don’t bring mad Thor, normal Thor can't match champion, even Mad thor would last against Champion with power gem.

As you know all the heros were holding back when they battle mad thor before power gem.

Because when thor jacked the power gem from drax --- Silver Sufer said we can’t hold back like we did before.

Ya he can always try to jack it, but Champion is not Drax.


I can't believe you say Thor won't get own here ( with someone like Chap (with power gem), but superman would have a chance thor? That’s just funny

champ doesn't have supes speed, or anywhere NEAR his brains. he'd run in looking to slug it out and eat a godblast that staggered at friggin' celestial. and thor would certainly beat supes as well. just not everytime. and don't forget, you're saying thor would get KILLED by champ - i'm saying thor has a chance to win the fight. and what does the scan prove??? dude, sometimes i wonder about you . . . it proves thor has power enough to stagger a friggin' celestial!! you gotta at LEAST admit thor could last long enough against champ for molecule man and sentry and juggs and any of the eternals who felt like getting into the mix, to wipe out the other 'defenders'. if you actually think like long that these defenders can take over earth, you're as crazy as he is. if you want more convincing, read the thread i started about 10 000 WHITE MARTIANS (you know, 10 000 MARTIAN MANHUNTER level guys - major telepathy, light speed attacks, . . .) trying to take marvel earth. some people convinced me that even THEY couldn't do it. but these 4 will??? not a chance in hell . . .

and where exactly did you got it into your head that ss is more powerful than thor? it certainly has never been shown in a book. world breaking feats? that's it? do you know what that godblast that staggered a celestial (who stand around as galaxies are destroyed in their presence!) would do to a planet!? even throwing out mad thor, thor HELD BACK and stalemated a LOKI-ENHANCED ss! if thor chose to, he could simply sit around absorbing ss power cosmic all day long! there is even precedent (though it is never brought up here for some reason) for thor being able to CONTINUALLY drain an opponents energy once it has been directed at him. ss blasts, thor absorbs and KEEPS absorbing - same as he did to vector of the u-foes - and drains him or weakens him so badly thor crushes him.

energy types don't do well against thor. ss is no different. ss can't do jack sh!t to thor and mjollnir.

champ doesn't have supes speed ---- his speed will match Thor's thats all there is to it.

Power Gem = Infinite Power

you have seen what drax did with powergem
you have seen what madthor did with powergem
you have seen what champ did with powergem

it's almost imposible to beat them in fights when they have these gem

Yes thor's attack are stong ---- i have said this myself , now you go on saying Thor could hurt a friggin' celestial , but supes with mach speed will be able to beat thor?

and supes weakness is Magic


and by the way a celestial were just toying with him , Celestial whould own all skyfathers.

Molecule man---- he is a hero buddy? this guy whould own them all by himself.

who are the top marvel heroes(stonngest)?

that SS at his early days

In a what if SS power cosmic actually stops his hammer , like I said he can to that all day , or just knock his hammer out of his hand using his speed.

Thor's hammer will hurt even surfer (only few things can)

But let’s see
- Beyond light speed, and reaction -------- this would put thor down every time
- Manipulate matter ---- at a cosmic level
- Time Travel
- Dimension Travel
- Exit Eternity
- Force field
- Change his form
Etc his power list goes on……………

SS has too many powers he can do virtually anything

Thor vs Hulk ----- Hulk puts good fight
SS vs Hulk --------- SS with cosmic blast easily defeats Hulk.

Thor vs Korvac ----------- Thor couldn't last
Korvac had to use world destroying attack on Silver Surfer

Thor been severely damage by Physical attacks (like hulk), while SS doesn’t

etc SS would own Thor in speed , and power department.

Ok i've been reading your posts and these are my reactions

'SS vs Gladiator ---- Again , Gladiator speed won't help him here
------ SS has been said to be stonger than him , Brb multiple times'

In the strength department Surfer has never done anything that is on the same level as Glads, If im wrong please prove it. He's definately more powerful but stronger I don't think so!!!!!!!!


'Anyway, a well written Champ would smash Thor, with ease. And yes, he could take a GodBlast, he's taken hits from Thanos without any sign of pain.
I'd be hard pressed to believe even SS or Thanos should have beaten him.'

Take a God blast what the F@(k ????????

Didn't Thing break one of Champ's ribs when he had the power Gem
In the recent She Hulk serries everyone who whent up against Champ before She Hulk thought they could have beaten Champ if they had been able to use all there powers.

Pip even says that Warlock blasted him with the soul Gem and was Quoted as saying 'he didn't even know what hit him!!!!!!!!'

Thanos recently used his most powerful blast to knock Galactus over and even he admited that his attack was far short of Hurting Galactus!!!!!!!!!!!!

The God blast made Galactus piss his pants

'you can not be as dumb as he is portrayed and still manage to master every single fighting style to ever exist'
Then how the **** did She Hulk beat him ????????????

thanks yahman, i thouhgt it was just me . . .

I mean more powerful sorry


No Chap was toying with the Thing, and champ beats him badly.

He easily overpowers: Thor , Hulk , Thing etc at the same time

Champ vs She Hulk ---- Champ powers were removed.

Galactus piss his pants --- When not looking, and ignoring Thor

Thor hammer couldn't even get pass, a weak Galactus’s shield , let alone hurt him

Thor can never hurt G when he thinks thor is more than a insect

but kg, i'm glad you agree. these defenders have no chance.

by the way, that celestial damaging attack took forever to summon - it'd never hit supes. and what ifs are evidence of NOTHING. wolovie killed hulk. nuff said.

Originally posted by leonidas
but kg, i'm glad you agree. these defenders have no chance.

by the way, that celestial damaging attack took forever to summon - it'd never hit supes. and what ifs are evidence of NOTHING. wolovie killed hulk. nuff said.
no chance against MM --- there are other fu@kes like Gaea

who made the Defender look like kids

what ifs are evidence of NOTHING --- of course , i was just showing you what power cosmic can do.


like you said Thor has hard time hitting Spiderman , he isn't touching SS when going faster than light.

I was thinking it was against heroes lol

Marvel earth owns them

MM would own all of them

'thanks yahman, i thouhgt it was just me . . .'


Its alright dude

'No Chap was toying with the Thing, and champ beats him badly'

So he let all his defenses down and let the Thing break his ribs. Well if that is the case you've just gone and proved someone elses post that he is a complete moron !!!!!!

I've seen wolverine and Cap go against peeps who are thousands of times stronger than them and still fair well. This is down mainly to their fighting Skills. If Champion is a master of all fighting Skills in the universe how did She Hulk have a chance against him??????????

I mean i know she is alot stronger than she was but how much stronger can weight training make you. Champ has always been a Class 100 character, even without the power gem so even with She hulks new found strength they can't be that far apart.

Surely his immense fighting Skills would tip the scales in his favour???????????

'you have seen what drax did with powergem
you have seen what madthor did with powergem
you have seen what champ did with powergem'

I aslo have read about Titania with the power Gem and she Sucked!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Originally posted by yahman
'thanks yahman, i thouhgt it was just me . . .'


Its alright dude

'No Chap was toying with the Thing, and champ beats him badly'

So he let all his defenses down and let the Thing break his ribs. Well if that is the case you've just gone and proved someone elses post that he is a complete moron !!!!!!

I've seen wolverine and Cap go against peeps who are thousands of times stronger than them and still fair well. This is down mainly to their fighting Skills. If Champion is a master of all fighting Skills in the universe how did She Hulk have a chance against him??????????

I mean i know she is alot stronger than she was but how much stronger can weight training make you. Champ has always been a Class 100 character, even without the power gem so even with She hulks new found strength they can't be that far apart.

Surely his immense fighting Skills would tip the scales in his favour???????????

'you have seen what drax did with powergem
you have seen what madthor did with powergem
you have seen what champ did with powergem'



are you saying Thing whould put Cham down or give him any touble?

Champ easily overpowered : Hulk , THor , THing

read when SS fights Champ ---- Champ broke his ribs , and he was sent to hospital.





Champ had the gem for years he is expericed , you won't be able to hurt him.

She hulk ---- i already told you he was powered down(by LT).

'are you saying Thing would put Champ down or give him any trouble?'

'Champ had the gem for years he is experienced , you won't be able to hurt him.'

No I'm not saying that Benn would give him any trouble. I thought i made i perfectly clear what i meant but my England is not exactly tip top!




If Benn broke his ribs, then he is very hurt-able (if that is even a word)

Your excuse for Benn breaking his ribs was that he was holding back.

Well if thats the case i kinda backfired pretty badly!!!!!! Which suggests he's not the sharpest tool in the box's.

This was a point which was made quite evident in the fight against thanos. I mean he broke a planet in half by mistake what a Friking Ret@rd!!!!!!!


Who the hell is L.T ???????? You don't mean the Living Tribunal????????

Well even if that is the case he is unlikely to have taken away all his fighting knowledge. Knowledge he should have been using to beat She Hulks @sss.

heheh. it's kind of fun being on the OUTSIDE and watching someone ELSE beat kg in a debate.



just kidding, kg . . .

ps-yes LT is living tribunal. and nice titania reference!! yep, power gem made her a cosmic threat . . . hehehh

Didnt she became now a cosmic judge for living tribunal?

'heheh. it's kind of fun being on the OUTSIDE and watching someone ELSE beat kg in a debate.'


Cheers mate i appreciate that

I can't believe how many obvious points people are failing to mention.

There's no way the Defenders are going to take over the entire Marvel Earth. There are WAY too many powerful heroes there. People have already mentioned the likes of Sentry, Molecule Man, and Wanda. Additionally, there are people like:

Beta Ray Bill (now on earth)
Photon
ALL of the Eternals (Sersi, Gilgamesh, Ikaris, Hyperion, Thena, etc. etc.)
ALL of the Inhumans (including Black Bolt)
ALL of the Externals, each of whom is herald level
ALL of the Omega Mutants (Iceman, Mr. M, who is just like Molecule Man, Magneto, Rachel with Phoenix Force, Cable, Mimic, the billion or so super telepaths)
We don't know the current status of Rune King Thor, who last we checked, is still a super, mega skyfather

Additionally, current Captain Marvel isn't very powerful. He was beaten down by Atlas and doesn't seem all that competent. Only Insane Cap marvel is uber.

Combine these resources with people like Reed Richards, Black Panther, Xavier, Captain America, Forge and Tony Stark - who exemplify leadership, intelligence, strategy and toughness and...well...the Defenders got no chance.

Hell, think about it - Magneto, Reed, Tony, Forge and Xavier all mind-melding - they could exchange designs at the speed of thought and channel it all to magneto to build instantly. Need a time-machine? 2 minutes. Need a cosmic energy absorber? 1 minute. Need a light-speed accelerator for your fighters? 30 seconds. Need to restore Cable's full power? DONE!

No - no chance.

yah, that's kind of what i said. seemed ridiculous to even begin mentioning everyone that would work together to crush this group - though i did include the eternals in there with sentry and molecule man. the eternals along with those 2 would be WAYYYYYY overkill. hell, as i said, molecule man himself should be able to dispatch long's defenders posthaste!

Originally posted by yahman
'are you saying Thing would put Champ down or give him any trouble?'

'Champ had the gem for years he is experienced , you won't be able to hurt him.'

No I'm not saying that Benn would give him any trouble. I thought i made i perfectly clear what i meant but my England is not exactly tip top!




If Benn broke his ribs, then he is very hurt-able (if that is even a word)

Your excuse for Benn breaking his ribs was that he was holding back.

Well if thats the case i kinda backfired pretty badly!!!!!! Which suggests he's not the sharpest tool in the box's.

This was a point which was made quite evident in the fight against thanos. I mean he broke a planet in half by mistake what a Friking Ret@rd!!!!!!!


Who the hell is L.T ???????? You don't mean the Living Tribunal????????

Well even if that is the case he is unlikely to have taken away all his fighting knowledge. Knowledge he should have been using to beat She Hulks @sss.
BEn broke Champ big when he had powergem and power prom? Issue number. #######

when champ battled Silver Surfer , Thing said he Champ broke his ribs hmmmmmmmmm

Champ with powergem still owns Thor.

Thor couldn't effect Jugs ( who is protect) powergem also does the same , if You know how it works

Originally posted by leonidas
heheh. it's kind of fun being on the OUTSIDE and watching someone ELSE beat kg in a debate.



just kidding, kg . . .

ps-yes LT is living tribunal. and nice titania reference!! yep, power gem made her a cosmic threat . . . hehehh
beat ohhh


when did i say the power gem is a cosmic threat.

chap with power gem is > Thor that's all am saying

You fools, you don't understand the power of the swarthy five!

I think they can do it maybe...

Tiamut FTW