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I'd say Phoenix would win (sadly)

Lets see how long this thread lasts before its closed.

Agianst the REAL Darkseid?

He hits he with the Omega beams and shes toast. The Shi-ar have killed her and wounded the phoenix force itself with beams from their ships. The Omega Beams are way beyond that.

Darkseid ftw, Sorry fanboys but you have to admit to this one.

in a non-canon, dark phoenix threw his ass straight to the source wall. that said, it's hard to tell, because both of them have wildly varying power levels. certainly not a curbstomp in either direction.

That was

1. Non canon
2. That was a darkseid AVATAR, not even close ot the real thing.

Originally posted by PlasticMan411
I'd say Phoenix would win (sadly)

it honeslty depends if you mean current whimp jobberside?

then heck yes..phoenix ftw

if you mean pc darkseid? then absolutely not...he'll anhilate her

bear in mind mangneto has killed or saverly beaten phoenix jean three times and while eric lensher is no push over he is certainly not pc dakrseid

avatar? what makes you say that?

ah man, that was non-canon? if i'd known, i would have said something about it being non-canon when i mentioned it! stoop.

DC retconned it so all previous Darkseid fights were with AVATARS and not the real thing, i found it annoying when i first found out to but it's true.

Originally posted by Ext@nt
DC retconned it so all previous Darkseid fights were with AVATARS and not the real thing, i found it annoying when i first found out to but it's true.

when did this happen? i'm not doubting you or anything just curious

Originally posted by What If...
Lets see how long this thread lasts before its closed.

Contact Bigbran, he should have the scan for you.

Originally posted by Ext@nt
Contact Bigbran, he should have the scan for you. Yes, it was retconned.

But, the current one that got his ass beat by Superman, I'm pretty sure is the real thing.

Phoenix wins. She is essential to the universe. The OE won't be able to erase her. Phoenix is powerful in her own right. Often she gets extremely overated, or extremely downplayed.
There is usually no middle. She wins this fight.

Phoenix in a curbstomp.

Originally posted by manorastroman
in a non-canon, dark phoenix threw his ass straight to the source wall. that said, it's hard to tell, because both of them have wildly varying power levels. certainly not a curbstomp in either direction.


Actually, what people never mention is that he mind-controlled her earlier in the same comic. She reached out her hand to his, Cyclops yelled "Nooo!", their hands met with some energy thing around them, and Darkseid says "You are too late. She is mine." That's why she was doing his bidding for most of the comic.


Anywho, Darkseid could take Phoenix as she USUALLY appeared (see her fights with Magneto and Firelord). If it's the full Phoenix entity, though, he's toast.

He would waste the avatar with the OB, all he has to do it beat the host to the phoenix force to win. Cause once the host is gone the bird is inert.

Originally posted by Ext@nt
He would waste the avatar with the OB, all he has to do it beat the host to the phoenix force to win. Cause once the host is gone the bird is inert.
And all SHE has to do is blast the shit out of him with the full power of the Phoenix Force, and he's toast, so what's your point?

Ive gotta go with the Phoenix on this one......

DS just really cant compare

Originally posted by darthgoober
And all SHE has to do is blast the shit out of him with the full power of the Phoenix Force, and he's toast, so what's your point?

My point is the OB are very very fast and would hit her BEFORE her sheilds are up. Keep in mind I'm saying HER and NOT the phoenix force itself.

And she does not have her sheilds up already unless your giving her prep.

With prep, DP wins.

Without prep DS wins.

Originally posted by Ext@nt
My point is the OB are very very fast and would hit her BEFORE her sheilds are up. Keep in mind I'm saying HER and NOT the phoenix force itself.

And she does not have her sheilds up already unless your giving her prep.

With prep, DP wins.

Without prep DS wins.
And what speed feats does DS have that suggest that he can launch an attack before she can even THINK about getting her shields up?

(I'm not saying that DS has no speed feats by the way, I just don't know of any in particular)

Originally posted by Ext@nt
My point is the OB are very very fast and would hit her BEFORE her sheilds are up. Keep in mind I'm saying HER and NOT the phoenix force itself.

And she does not have her sheilds up already unless your giving her prep.

With prep, DP wins.

Without prep DS wins. The Force would kind of protect Phoenix. Plus Superman has had enough time, to block the OE.

All Thanos has to do is put up his hand and his shield is up. Do you really think Phoenix is any different?

Plus, if they are standing and facing each other, she will have the force up, and therefore, she will have her shield up.

If she has her shield up it means she has prep.

Darksied's beams would fire at the speed of light.

Originally posted by Ext@nt
Darksied's beams would fire at the speed of light.

but you do understand that the speed of light is nothing to a cosimc entity such as the Phoenix right?

Originally posted by Ext@nt
If she has her shield up it means she has prep.

Darksied's beams would fire at the speed of light.
And what makes you think that a being like DP DOESN'T have lightspeed reflexes?

Really? On atleast 2 seperate occasions the thing has been hit by beams from starships and wounded by it.

Originally posted by Ext@nt
Really? On atleast 2 seperate occasions the thing has been hit by beams from starships and wounded by it.
That's called PIS. DS has been beaten 3 times SINCE his avatar recton by Supes, so does that mean people like Supes SHOULD be able to beat him?

I'll have to go with DPh here. She can basically do any thing she wants with her mind plus strong and fast as hell. she'll hand D.S his ass blowup

Originally posted by darthgoober
That's called PIS. DS has been beaten 3 times SINCE his avatar recton by Supes, so does that mean people like Supes SHOULD be able to beat him?


It's not PIS just casue you don't like it

In the first issue of Phoenix Endsong I believe is one such occasion.

Originally posted by Ext@nt
It's not PIS just casue you don't like it

In the first issue of Phoenix Endsong I believe is one such occasion.
So your saying Darkseid<<<Superman ?

Im saying Darkseid > Phoenix Host. Given the proof I've provided above.

Originally posted by Ext@nt
Im saying Darkseid > Phoenix Host. Given the proof I've provided above.
PIS isn't proof. To think a cosmic level entity(right under Eternity remember) can't dodge a laser blast if she wants is absolutely ludicrous.

Thats in YOUR opinion.

Originally posted by Ext@nt
Really? On atleast 2 seperate occasions the thing has been hit by beams from starships and wounded by it. Come on, this is PIS to the greatest degree. If you think this makes any sense, its like saying that it makes sense that Black Panther beat Mephisto, or Wolvie cut through Thanos and Galactus, we all know that these events are PIS.

I dont like Phoenix, but i dont let my personal oppinions bleed into my debating. Phoenix wins this 10/10

Well then we are at an impasse here. We both have opinions about this and proof to back up our respective points of view. However since it is obvious nethier of us will ever believe the other it would seem pointless to debate at this point.

Originally posted by Ext@nt
Thats in YOUR opinion.
And all you have is YOUR opinion to the contrary, so what's your point?

Also, you've yet to provide proof that he's faster than her.

Originally posted by Galan777
but you do understand that the speed of light is nothing to a cosimc entity such as the Phoenix right?

has she ever been proven to use lightspeed

also pc darkseid kept pace and out manevoured pc superman

you know pc superman twie flue to the edge of all the universe then physically grabbed the frabic of reality then repaired it with his eye beams

eye beams that dont bother pc dakrseid

thats a pretty damn impressive feat..out pacing a guy who in secondd flies to the edgte of all the universe..physically dominating a guy capable of grabbing the fabric of reality..and shaking off eye beams that could repair the fabric of reality..

phoenix has no feats to sugjest she can handel that

Originally posted by TheWatchdog
has she ever been proven to use lightspeed

also pc darkseid kept pace and out manevoured pc superman

you know pc superman twie flue to the edge of all the universe then physically grabbed the frabic of reality then repaired it with his eye beams

eye beams that dont bother pc dakrseid

thats a pretty damn impressive feat..out pacing a guy who in secondd flies to the edgte of all the universe..physically dominating a guy capable of grabbing the fabric of reality..and shaking off eye beams that could repair the fabric of reality..

phoenix has no feats to sugjest she can handel that

Originally posted by TheWatchdog
has she ever been proven to use lightspeed

also pc darkseid kept pace and out manevoured pc superman

you know pc superman twie flue to the edge of all the universe then physically grabbed the frabic of reality then repaired it with his eye beams

eye beams that dont bother pc dakrseid

thats a pretty damn impressive feat..out pacing a guy who in secondd flies to the edgte of all the universe..physically dominating a guy capable of grabbing the fabric of reality..and shaking off eye beams that could repair the fabric of reality..

phoenix has no feats to sugjest she can handel that
He's also LOST to current Supes three times now. So I guess he's getting old.

Originally posted by darthgoober
He's also LOST to current Supes three times now. So I guess he's getting old.

again refering to pre crisses dakrseid

not the jobberseid dude who apears in the comics now

Originally posted by Galan777


yea right..sersiouly though when has she ever done that?

i'm not mocking if you can provide me a scan..i'll conceed..

Originally posted by TheWatchdog
again refering to pre crisses dakrseid

not the jobberseid dude who apears in the comics now
Pre Crisis and Post Crisis DS are the same character. And anyway, we're discussing the CURRENT incarnation of DS.

Originally posted by TheWatchdog
yea right..sersiouly though when has she ever done that?

i'm not mocking if you can provide me a scan..i'll conceed.. Are you attempting to say that the phoenix cant move at lightspeed?

Originally posted by darthgoober
Pre Crisis and Post Crisis DS are the same character. And anyway, we're discussing the CURRENT incarnation of DS.

they are? one jobs like a chimp..the other was constantly man handeling the ubber superman of that era..

i dont like to call them the same guy

any ways isent current darkseid human or something? wsell either way..current jobbersied is gonna loose

Originally posted by Galan777
Are you attempting to say that the phoenix cant move at lightspeed?

hell no..i'm attemtping to say she never flew to the utter end of the universe in a matter of seconds

pre crisses superman did..and he was still nothing comapred to pc darkseid

phoenix is ls sure..but not that fast..

Originally posted by TheWatchdog
hell no..i'm attemtping to say she never flew to the utter end of the universe in a matter of seconds

pre crisses superman did..and he was still nothing comapred to pc darkseid

phoenix is ls sure..but not that fast.. hmmm whatever u say, sorry but i just dont feel like getting into this right now

Originally posted by Galan777
hmmm whatever u say, sorry but i just dont feel like getting into this right now

you can have faster then light reflexes and still get blitzxed bye some one with faster then your own reflexes

the runner doing it to thanos is a good example.

dont get into it then? it just comes off like your bailing from the argument..

Originally posted by Galan777
but you do understand that the speed of light is nothing to a cosimc entity such as the Phoenix right?
I didn't know that Wolverine can attack above the speed of light

Originally posted by juggernaut66666
I didn't know that Wolverine can attack above the speed of light

that might be bad writing..or PIS unless it has happend alot

Didn't DP throw his silly ass at the source's wall in some crossover?

Darkseid eats her.

Originally posted by jffxex1980
Didn't DP throw his silly ass at the source's wall in some crossover?

yep. and then she flew into the source and said something about going home.

That isnt a canon story and it was an Avatar not the real Darksied as has been explained to you already.

Darksied OB's her host, end of story.

hush, boy. use discretion and don't butt in to conversations that have nothing to do with you. yeah, we know it's non-canon. i stated it was non-canon before you did, and if you knew how to read, you would know this. and the avatar thing is a little fishy, considering it's a non-canon crossover. regardless, supes has beaten the "true" darkseid, so it doesn't matter anyway.

the omega effect wouldn't likely work on phoenix, considering she's far more essential than superman.

LOL,

Sorry if the truth hurts. The key to beating your little bird is killing the Host which Darkseids OB can easily accomplish.

On more then one occasions starships with less fire power then him have wounded the Phoenix Force itself so he can definatly take care of its host. And if these weapons can get past it's sheilds, so can Darkseid.

LOL I think the Phoenix Fanboyism is stronger then the Force itself. LMAO

Here we go again.

Because you defend a character doesn't make you a fanboy.

Because you defend the character aganst horrible chances (such as ion vs DC universe....and you saying extant would be the one to save it) and absoltuely ignore everything (for example 23 different people in that thread telling you your stupid and a fanboy, with NO ONE agreeing with you)

YOU are the FANBOY.

I'm not, check the threads I just defended the bird on a thread.

So this proves I'm not a Phoenix Hater, just a Phoenix Fanboy hater.

And you ignore all points and proof anyone brings up that doesnt support your bird.

You still don't get it...what a shame.

DP takes this EVERY time.The OE won't effect her(cause the Phoenix Force is essential to the universe).

And again I repeat, it doesnt effect the FORCE itself. Merely its host. And it could wound the force just like many other starships have with beam weapons.

Originally posted by Ext@nt
And again I repeat, it doesnt effect the FORCE itself. Merely its host. And it could wound the force just like many other starships have with beam weapons.
Jean Gey is CONNECTED to the Phoenix Force. That's why SHE keeps coming back. So the OE WOULDN'T affect her, because SHE'S the prime host. And DP could EASILY use TK blast to PHYSICALLY beat on Darkseid, just like Supes does with his fist.

And you've yet to prove that he could blast her before she got her shields up anyway.

The Omega Beams move at the speed of light.

Her sheilds go up at the speed of thought.

Light>Thought

And shes been killed before (In non suicide ways) that are weaker then the omega beams.

Yes but you've provided no proof that DS himself moves faster than she. So it's thought>thought+Light.

And DS has been taken down by less than DP also, like Superman. And didn't Batman once take on DS using tech?

He got in a lucky punch using miracle man's tech.

I think the OB can penetrate her sheilds the way laser blasts have in the past on more then one occasion.

Originally posted by Ext@nt
He got in a lucky punch using miracle man's tech.

I think the OB can penetrate her sheilds the way laser blasts have in the past on more then one occasion.
It doesn't matter. If your going to use the Shiar, I can use Batman.

And I think her own blast could deflect the OE just like Supes heat vision has done.

It does matter. Bats got one shot in that bearly even fazed DS.

The OB are faster then her blasts. She shoots fire which does not move at the speed of light.

Sorry your having such a hard time with this but he takes it.

Originally posted by Ext@nt
It does matter. Bats got one shot in that bearly even fazed DS.

The OB are faster then her blasts. She shoots fire which does not move at the speed of light.

Sorry your having such a hard time with this but he takes it.
The fact that Bats was able to tag him means that he probably doesn't move faster than she does. So he launches the blast while she puts up her shields, that means that his blast hit her shields. Or, he fire's his blast while she launches her own, and even if his are really close to her, her blast will deflect it.

Lol...phoenix shoots fire...

The OB are stronger then her blast, her blast burns off flesh, his vaporizes.

And Darkseid was distracted with Supes when Bats landed his "punch"

Plus the OB can move around her blast and still tag her.

Anything else?

Originally posted by Ext@nt
The OB are stronger then her blast, her blast burns off flesh, his vaporizes.

And Darkseid was distracted with Supes when Bats landed his "punch"

Plus the OB can move around her blast and still tag her.

Anything else?
Supes deflected the OE, so would DP.

Really too bad it hasnt defleted the weaker beam attacks from ships that have wounded and killed it's host in the past.

Supes is also invulnerable Phoenix is far from.

Anything else?

Originally posted by Ext@nt
Really too bad it hasnt defleted the weaker beam attacks from ships that have wounded and killed it's host in the past.

Supes is also invulnerable Phoenix is far from.

Anything else?
I was talking about when Supes deflected the OE with heat vision. ANd DS was beaten up with Supes punches, which are less powerful than DP blast.

Supes has had his ass handed to him as well, being pushed into the source wall as I recall.

And Darkseid was trying to match his beams with Superman's if he wanted to he couldve made the OB go around them liek he has on so many other occasions.

Phoenix has died and been wounded by blasts of far less intesity on more then one ocassion.

Anything else?

Originally posted by Ext@nt
Supes has had his ass handed to him as well, being pushed into the source wall as I recall.

And Darkseid was trying to match his beams with Superman's if he wanted to he couldve made the OB go around them liek he has on so many other occasions.

Phoenix has died and been wounded by blasts of far less intesity on more then one ocassion.

Anything else?
I'll come back to all this after I get all my AM stuff ready for the other thread.

Don't bother it wont convince me.

Phoenix wins.

In your opinion. Sorry but shes been killed and wounded by shots from starships far less powerful then the OB.

Originally posted by darthgoober
The fact that Bats was able to tag him means that he probably doesn't move faster than she does.


Batman punching him started the fight, though. As soon as he retaliated, Batman was unable to dodge, attack, or do anything other than get destroyed. Although I'm not saying Darkseid is faster.




Originally posted by darthgoober
So he launches the blast while she puts up her shields, that means that his blast hit her shields. Or, he fire's his blast while she launches her own, and even if his are really close to her, her blast will deflect it.



Again, this depends how much of the Phoenix Force she's weilding at the time. In the original story, Jean had a tusssle with Firelord which, while she held the advantage in it, was of decent length. She also lost to Magneto. OTOH, Rachel with the Phoenix Force beat a weakened Galactus after a good fight. If Jean is accessing the FULL Phoenix Force, of course she wins. Otherwise, it depends how much she's accessing at the time.

Originally posted by Ext@nt
In your opinion. Sorry but shes been killed and wounded by shots from starships far less powerful then the OB. In my opinion? What are you implying with this?
So you think that DP is just going to stand in front of the OE, and just let it hit her?
Plus, what the hell is it going to do anyway, since Darky is going to be focused on erasing her? Does essential to the universe mean anything to you?
Does a shield mean nothing to you?

Originally posted by Jimmy-Chan
Again, this depends how much of the Phoenix Force she's weilding at the time. In the original story, Jean had a tusssle with Firelord which, while she held the advantage in it, was of decent length. She also lost to Magneto. OTOH, Rachel with the Phoenix Force beat a weakened Galactus after a good fight. If Jean is accessing the FULL Phoenix Force, of course she wins. Otherwise, it depends how much she's accessing at the time.


Well for this particular fight we're talking about Dark Phoenix. That was the stage when the Phoenix Force itself was pretty much in control, had lost all restraint and was doing things like eating stars. I agree that the 'regular' Phoenix that took on Firelord would probably lose from lack of knowledge about her powers, but DP is a whole different story.

Originally posted by bigbran
In my opinion? What are you implying with this?
So you think that DP is just going to stand in front of the OE, and just let it hit her?
Plus, what the hell is it going to do anyway, since Darky is going to be focused on erasing her? Does essential to the universe mean anything to you?
Does a shield mean nothing to you?

We;ve been over all of this already and you know it, so why are you bringing up poitns that uif you read over this thread I've adressed already.

Originally posted by Ext@nt
We;ve been over all of this already and you know it, so why are you bringing up poitns that uif you read over this thread I've adressed already. You really haven't shot down nothing. (sorry if I offend you)

So, tell me, how when Darkseid is going to try and erase her, is he going to kill her? Is she just going to let him hit her? She's bonded to a damn abstract like character. Is she not going to think of even putting up a defense?

Dark Phoenix had telepathy and telekinesis that was probably around God's level.
Dark Phoenix FTW.

Originally posted by RSSR
Dark Phoenix had telepathy and telekinesis that was probably around God's level.
Dark Phoenix FTW. NO, NO NO!!! Where did you get this from anyway?
God's level??

The Phoenix Force simply amplifies its hosts powers infinitely.

Originally posted by RSSR
The Phoenix Force simply amplifies its hosts powers infinitely. So, you think she is on God's level?
Where do you get your info?
Where's Extant?

I have a question, this is off topic but it does relate to Phoenix.
becuase that whole thing confuses me

My friends got into a debate and one of my freinds asked me if Phoenix could kill the majority of Jedis in the star wars universe, not all at the same time, but like any jedi vs phoenix, who would win. And i speciffically mean phoenix. I didnt know how to answer because all that phoenix force/phoenix/dark phoenix sutff confuses me and Phoenix has strange showings.

What is the extent of phoenix'es powers? and could she infact defeat most jedi? some insight would be extremely appreciated
(i posted this question ni the other phoenix thread as well incase someone didnt see it there)

Originally posted by bigbran
So, you think she is on God's level?
Where do you get your info?
Where's Extant?

Oh now you come begging when the Fanboys annoy you? You were the one defending the bird and now you have to live with the fanboys.

Originally posted by Ext@nt
Oh now you come begging when the Fanboys annoy you? You were the one defending the bird and now you have to live with the fanboys. When I was defnding her, she wasn't compared to god.

Oh well, I'll just take out the pawning by myself.

I don't have time to read all of the post but unless it's already has been stated the OE isn't going to do jack to the phoenix for the simple reason that phonenix is essenchal to the universe (a sort of steller tool of sorts) so with out that darkseid gets smashed.)

one thing I would like to point out is that while Dark Phoenix beats darkseid she doesn't beat every one and does not have infinit power.

Originally posted by jasofisc
I don't have time to read all of the post but unless it's already has been stated the OE isn't going to do jack to the phoenix for the simple reason that phonenix is essenchal to the universe (a sort of steller tool of sorts) so with out that darkseid gets smashed.)

one thing I would like to point out is that while Dark Phoenix beats darkseid she doesn't beat every one and does not have infinit power. Of course.

Originally posted by jasofisc
I don't have time to read all of the post but unless it's already has been stated the OE isn't going to do jack to the phoenix for the simple reason that phonenix is essenchal to the universe (a sort of steller tool of sorts) so with out that darkseid gets smashed.)

one thing I would like to point out is that while Dark Phoenix beats darkseid she doesn't beat every one and does not have infinit power.
I'll second that.

Originally posted by bigbran
When I was defnding her, she wasn't compared to god.

Oh well, I'll just take out the pawning by myself.

You act like its a hard thing to do, these headcases are compring her to GOD, how hard is that to disprove?

Comon Darth, take the claws out on this one.

But I still say Darkseid can take the host.

Originally posted by Ext@nt
You act like its a hard thing to do, these headcases are compring her to GOD, how hard is that to disprove?

Comon Darth, take the claws out on this one.

But I still say Darkseid can take the host.
I didn't bother responding, because that guy was dilluisional, and bigbran addressed it nicely.

And Darkseid coudn't. I don't know if you realize, but DP wasn't Jean Grey. It WAS the Phoenix Force in a copy of Jeans body and mind. So the OE wouldn't work on it.

It still took a mortal form, in essence it created a Jean Grey homonculus (I love that word and I never get to use it, thank you) for it to inhabit and that shell (I don't like to over use the word it takes away from its coolness) is as vulnerabl;e and mortal as the real Jean.

Originally posted by darthgoober
I'll second that. Wouldn't it be thirded?
Because he stated it, then I seconded it?Originally posted by Ext@nt
You act like its a hard thing to do, these headcases are compring her to GOD, how hard is that to disprove?

Comon Darth, take the claws out on this one.

But I still say Darkseid can take the host. It's not hard to disprove. I was just waiting for him to comeback. I just wanted to see your take on that one, since it is quite a bit worse than saying that she could beat Galactus.

I think you know my take on it LOL

Drug induced insanity

Originally posted by Ext@nt
It still took a mortal form, in essence it created a Jean Grey homonculus (I love that word and I never get to use it, thank you) for it to inhabit and that shell (I don't like to over use the word it takes away from its coolness) is as vulnerabl;e and mortal as the real Jean.
Supes has a mortal form also, but the OE doesn't work on him because he's essential to the universe. DP WAS the Phoenix in a self made copy of Jean Grey's body. So the OE wouldn't work.

Well the many times weapons from ships of lesser strength that have hit her and wounded the phoenix have proved that wrong.

And no one's asked me about the Phoeinx in the DCU yet cause I can prove there is one.

Originally posted by Ext@nt
Well the many times weapons from ships of lesser strength that have hit her and wounded the phoenix have proved that wrong.

And no one's asked me about the Phoeinx in the DCU yet cause I can prove there is one. Does the one in DCU really matter though?

Originally posted by Ext@nt
Well the many times weapons from ships of lesser strength that have hit her and wounded the phoenix have proved that wrong.

And no one's asked me about the Phoeinx in the DCU yet cause I can prove there is one.
Supes has been injured PLENTY of times by things far less than the OE as well. It doesn't mean anything.

Supes is invulnerable, Jean or the "Shell" isn't shes been killed and the Phoenix Force itself has been wounded.

Darkseid can effectively kill what I will reffer to as the Phoenix "Husk". I agree he cannot kill the Phoenix Force. but he could drive it off.

Originally posted by Ext@nt
Supes is inulnerable, Jean or the "Shell" isn't shes been killed and the Phoenix Force itself has been wounded.

Darkseid can effectively kill what I will reffer to as the Phoenix "Husk". I agree he cannot kill the Phoenix Force. but he could drive it off.
Supes invulnerability has NOTHING to do with his resistance to the OE. The ONLY reason he is able to survive it is because he's essential to the universe.

And DP's 'husk' was still the Phoenix Force. So the OE won't work.

Then your giving allot of credit top the many Weapons and Starships that have fried her and wounded the Force over the years.

Originally posted by Ext@nt
Supes is inulnerable, Jean or the "Shell" isn't shes been killed and the Phoenix Force itself has been wounded.
I don't really remember a time when the Force has been hurt... driven off, but not hurt.
Originally posted by Ext@nt
Darkseid can effectively kill what I will reffer to as the Phoenix "Husk". I agree he cannot kill the Phoenix Force. but he could drive it off. You do realize this is a vs fight, don't you?
That means that Phoenix is going to be going after Darkseid, while Darkseid attempts to erase her to no avail.
I don't think in a full on fight where Phoenix is already a phsycopath, and do you see any option in this fight where it says, "Phoenix will sacrifice her for the X-Men/Scott"?
I don't either, because that is usually how she loses.

Didn't a weaker Phoenix knock over Galactus, and all that shanagans?
I'de bring up Wolverine, but then you would also be claiming that Wolverine has beat Lobo, slit the shit out of Thanos, Thing, Surfer (what if), etc. That would be like Batman beating Darkseid under his own powers, and me bringing it up in this thread?

Now, pre tell again, how Darkseid is going to beat her? If all you have is the OE, then I don't think Darkseid has a chance really.

Originally posted by Ext@nt
Then your giving allot of credit top the many Weapons and Starships that have fried her and wounded the Force over the years.
Plenty of villains have done plenty of damage to Supes also. So what's your point? The OE won't work on a being that's essential to the universe, it's as simple as that.

Well other less powerful beams have done the job.

Originally posted by Ext@nt
Well other less powerful beams have done the job.
That may be, but his won't work. It's that simple.

DS ftw

if not being able to control her mind or erase her from existance, which he can probably easily do, he can simply transmute her into anything he pleased, this being anywhere from a hamster to a strand of lint.

I'm not undermining pheonixes powers, but to compare them to a being such as darkseid isnt fair

Originally posted by Ext@nt
Well other less powerful beams have done the job. Do you see prep, or the Shi'ar, X-Men in this thread?

Originally posted by great_dane
DS ftw

if not being able to control her mind or erase her from existance, which he can probably easily do, he can simply transmute her into anything he pleased, this being anywhere from a hamster to a strand of lint.

I'm not undermining pheonixes powers, but to compare them to a being such as darkseid isnt fair
The OE won't work on DP.

Originally posted by great_dane
DS ftw

if not being able to control her mind or erase her from existance, which he can probably easily do, he can simply transmute her into anything he pleased, this being anywhere from a hamster to a strand of lint.

I'm not undermining pheonixes powers, but to compare them to a being such as darkseid isnt fair No, I don't mean to be rude, but why don't you read this thread, and see how stupid really your answer is.
Phoenix can't be erased by him. She is essential to the universe.
I doubt he will beat her in a mind battle either.
No, I'm not even going to deal with you.
You also said that Darkseid could make 1 million Zoom's to fight Galactus.

Define "essential" to the universe? you guys throw that term around allot and I'm 90% sure I get what you mean I just wanna make sure.

Originally posted by Ext@nt
Define "essential" to the universe? you guys throw that term around allot and I'm 90% sure I get what you mean I just wanna make sure.
"Necessary(for what ever reason)"

Originally posted by great_dane
DS ftw

if not being able to control her mind or erase her from existance, which he can probably easily do, he can simply transmute her into anything he pleased, this being anywhere from a hamster to a strand of lint.

I'm not undermining pheonixes powers, but to compare them to a being such as darkseid isnt fair
If he cant transmute Supes, No way he can transmute a force of nature on a cosmic scale, whose essential to marvel universe... Itd probably be the other way around..

he can create life and matter from absolutely nothing as well as destroy it just as easily. being able to break apart molecules of any organisms without even touching them. the oe is a very powerfull attack, but is mostly used for teleporting others to any part of the universe he pleases. erasing them from existence and bringing them back if he pleases is an ability he has. he can erase pheonix from existance before she thought of anything to do

Originally posted by darthgoober
"Necessary(for what ever reason)"

I ment more the context ofthe word, is she a part of the Universe itself?

Originally posted by great_dane
he can create life and matter from absolutely nothing as well as destroy it just as easily. being able to break apart molecules of any organisms without even touching them. the oe is a very powerfull attack, but is mostly used for teleporting others to any part of the universe he pleases. erasing them from existence and bringing them back if he pleases is an ability he has. he can erase pheonix from existance before she thought of anything to do
No he can't. She's essential to the universe(as much if not more so than Supes), so it won't work on her anymore than it will work on him.

Phoenix can do all that as well as repair a universe...
But you cant see that so you win... Its pointless...

Originally posted by Ext@nt
I ment more the context ofthe word, is she a part of the Universe itself?
She's one of the fundamental forces of the universe. Ask Mr. M if you need further explanation(it gets complicated).

Anyway, I have a job a need to apply for in the morning, so we'll have to pick all this up tomorrow.

Darth or BB, by essential do you mean part of the universe as in it can't function without it?

he resurected dark pheonix from the deaed and in attempt to stop him from finding out the ALE, she had herself sacrificed. if hes powerfull enough to resurect someone "essential" to the universe, i think he can easily erase her from it. not only that, but the only way to stop him was by sacrificing herself, which did not kill darkseid. this is lame by the way, if she sacrificed herself, whats stoping him from saying
" whats her beef?? let me ask again"
and reasurecting her again?

he's way to powerfull for her

Originally posted by Ext@nt
Darth or BB, by essential do you mean part of the universe as in it can't function without it?
its a manifestation of the primal force of the universe, Child of Eternity..
So i say its part of the Universe...

Darkseid for the win

Of course he does and SS beats Darksied..lol

lol.

not really

Yeah he does, SS absorbs OB sysnthesis it and makes it his own, he then OB's the source wall or create a super boom tube directly to the source, he knows this via CA then absorbs some of the source energy and become Silver Omega Takion and beats Darkseid w/ his newfound power...

how about DS goes into a different dimension or the future, seeing as how can willingly do both, and from there, where SS can't reach him, erases him from existence. erases him from the time line. Either that, or instead of trying to hit him with the OE, he simply manipulates his matter and molecules ( which would fall under matter) and turns him into a mattress.

SS by his lonesome can travel to diff. dimension... With his new acquired might, by synthesis the PC/OB/Source it now becomes The COS (cosmic omega source) he should be immune to any of Darkseids powers.. Darkseid is given life by the source and SOT (Silver Omega Takion) is now in control/part of those powers.. Complete curbstomp.. Darkseids gets matter manipulated and given new powers and a totos outfitt w/ an S... He becomes the new clone of Superman but still retains his physical form..

All new powers and abilites added??

DS knows the ALE which he used to control the universe. the very equation responsible for life and the power to destroy it. (all)

and lets just say all this were to happen. I don't think SS would be able to do anything to DS seeing as how he's erased from the universe. part of the source or not, he wouldnt exist. completely erased from time. DS has the ability to do this, with this, SS can have all the powers and abilities he wants, once he gets them, DS (with a wave of the hand)
erases him from existence.

Yes you shot SS w/ OB, and i said he sythesized, absorbs it to his own.. He does this by just staying a little faster than the force he then sythesized/sampled and absorbed it.. the rest is history...
w/ PC and now synthesized OB he blast or open a boom tubed in the source wall, he does desame thing with it. Now his acquired the power of the PC/OB/Source, cosmic omega source and changed his name to Silver Omega Takion... Darkseid w/ ALE should be nothing compared to SOT.. He slaps him silly and steals ALE form Darkseid, he does this via Omniversal telepathic attacks, projecting his consciousness by channeling it through the omniversal energy that is the Source backed by PC/OB.. SOT w/ ALE... No force in Marvel/DC would be able to stop this guy....

i dont understand how he'd able to do this while being non-existant. and if you want to take it to the extreme, then seeing as how DS can create energy and matter from nothing, he'd simply create a being bigger. stronger, faster, and better than SS. one that would drain him of any power and ability and leave him powerless.

none of this would need to take place because your not getting that DS can make SS non-existant. (meaning he wouldnt exist)

he wouldnt be able to absorb anything because he wouldnt be in the time line.

this is a darkpheonix and darksied thread.

dont turn it into something else.
especially something as stupid as trying to say SS is on the same level as DS. because he's no where near it

Yah, sorry...lol got to sleep.. later..

Originally posted by Ext@nt
My point is the OB are very very fast and would hit her BEFORE her sheilds are up. Keep in mind I'm saying HER and NOT the phoenix force itself.

And she does not have her sheilds up already unless your giving her prep.

With prep, DP wins.

Without prep DS wins.

And to add your point. Shields won't do her any good since the OE can transceden time and space. Going through any barriers and time and through many universes. Plus Dark Phoenix can be easily mind controlled. And Darkseid's mind control ability is top notch. Lastly, Darkseid's durability against energy projection is not to be underestimated (Even the avatar's). Plus he can erect extremely durable force fields himself for further protection.

Read this
http://www.dcdatabaseproject.com/wiki/index.php/Darkseid#Powers

and this
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darkseid#Powers_and_abilities

I wouldnt say easily, but my point is he can take out her host and thats all he needs to do.

Originally posted by Ext@nt
I wouldnt say easily, but my point is he can take out her host and thats all he needs to do. Can't the force itslef attack. I have seen the force without a host fight Galactus

When was this? I have never seen the force itself attack without a host body to channel the offensive power through.

Originally posted by Ext@nt
When was this? I have never seen the force itself attack without a host body to channel the offensive power through. Its an old Excalibur issue. I'll look for it. One of the fights is when Rachel is battling Galactus, the other is when the Phoenix fights without a host.

Its in an old Excalibur issue. There were two fights between Phoenix and Galactus in Excalibur. The first is between Rachel and Galactus. The second is the Phoneix without a host.

No, the second one was with rachel as a host but the force was in control of her mind cause she was brain dead at the time until the phoenix repaired it.

Originally posted by Ext@nt
No, the second one was with rachel as a host but the force was in control of her mind cause she was brain dead at the time until the phoenix repaired it. I'll re-check but I remember a battle with a host and Galactus.

nope I know the one you mean. The was only 2 battles.

Once during the "Cross-Time" thing and once after she defeated Neron.

Originally posted by Big Sexy
I'll re-check but I remember a battle with a host and Galactus. Is this the battle ure talking about?

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e2/Galactus.jpg

You had to show that one instead of the other full page pic didn't you? LOL

Originally posted by Galan777
Is this the battle ure talking about?

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e2/Galactus.jpg Yes

She still has a host, she was just in control of the host, but in order to attack offensively she requires a physical form.

Originally posted by Ext@nt
You had to show that one instead of the other full page pic didn't you? LOL Yeah admittedly Big G was in the Middle of feeding in that scan, so basically the Phoenix beat a weakend version of Galactus

Galan777 do you have the other full page pic where she just nearly avoids his eye beams?

Originally posted by Ext@nt
Galan777 do you have the other full page pic where she just nearly avoids his eye beams? i have the whole issue, but not on my computer

damn I love that pic.

yeah its a good one

severely weakened? nah. for one, we don't know how weak he was when he started feeding, nor how much he fed. but judging by his size, that was a moderately well-fed galactus.