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zamasu invades marvel with the intention of ruling the universe with an iron fist-

https://i.postimg.cc/500jySBK/fused-zamasu.jpg


does he succeed or can he be stopped?

hulk smash

If we're using the version in the OP pic, then...
-His raw power was nearly on par with SSB Vegito(so beyond most anything in the MU.)
-He was fully immortal, with nigh-instant regen(not even a Destroyer could kill him.)
-When 'dispersed'(or whatever you want to call it), he entered an ethereal form that threatened to not only overtake the universe/multiverse, but ALL timelines as well.

In the end, the only power that could actually destroy Infinite Zamasu was Zen-Oh's absolute erasure... So Marvel would probably need something like the UN or IG to truly defeat him.

Originally posted by MrMind
hulk smash

Squirrel Girl wins

Originally posted by Galan007
If we're using the version in the OP pic, then...
-His raw power was nearly on par with SSB Vegito(so beyond most anything in the MU.)
-He was fully immortal, with nigh-instant regen(not even a Destroyer could kill him.)
-When 'dispersed'(or whatever you want to call it), he entered an ethereal form that threatened to not only overtake the universe/multiverse, but ALL timelines as well.

In the end, the only power that could actually destroy Infinite Zamasu was Zen-Oh's absolute erasure... So Marvel would probably need something like the UN or IG to truly defeat him.

So you're saying Hulk could punch him

More or less.

Originally posted by Galan007
If we're using the version in the OP pic, then...
-His raw power was nearly on par with SSB Vegito(so beyond most anything in the MU.)
-He was fully immortal, with nigh-instant regen(not even a Destroyer could kill him.)
-When 'dispersed'(or whatever you want to call it), he entered an ethereal form that threatened to not only overtake the universe/multiverse, but ALL timelines as well.

In the end, the only power that could actually destroy Infinite Zamasu was Zen-Oh's absolute erasure... So Marvel would probably need something like the UN or IG to truly defeat him. I see DB is still bonkers af.

Originally posted by Parmaniac
I see DB is still bonkers af.

Power levels are crazy, but the quality of the storytelling... don't get us started on that.

I remember when you were confident Super would turn out to be just as good as Z... facepalm

Originally posted by Parmaniac
I see DB is still bonkers af. The Zamasu arc(which, tbf, was actually quite good) ended like 6 years ago now, and the unbounded power-scaling has only become exponentially worse since then.

Although I will say that Zamasu is still the most 'unbeatable' opponent the Z Fighters have ever faced, even though he's far from the most powerful.

Parm still hasn't watched a single Super episode. Even though he was looking forward to it and had huge hopes.

Let him stay that way.

I'll say it.

Shadow King defeats him.

can we make threads with more interesting anime like fate/zero or hunter x hunter? dragon ball is like the basic ***** you had a crush on in high school

I will say that Zamasu, like most DB characters, is hard to pin-down when it comes to the effectiveness of TP shenanigans, as offensive telepathy is borderline non-existent in Dragon Ball.

So if he appeared on Marvel earth without taking TP into consideration, then he runs the risk of swiftly getting mindraped. Now, if Zamasu was aware of the potential danger posed by Marvel's telepaths, he would likely just finger-flick the planet into atoms from the onset.

Originally posted by Galan007
I will say that Zamasu, like most DB characters, is hard to pin-down when it comes to the effectiveness of TP shenanigans, as offensive telepathy is borderline non-existent in Dragon Ball.

So if he appeared on Marvel earth without taking TP into consideration, then he runs the risk of swiftly getting mindraped. Now, if Zamasu was aware of the potential danger posed by Marvel's telepaths, he would likely just finger-flick the planet into atoms from the onset.

Which shouldn't matter to Shadow King as he has no physical body anyway; but he's trying to rule it, rather than destroy everything....

Originally posted by MrMind
can we make threads with more interesting anime like fate/zero or hunter x hunter? dragon ball is like the basic ***** you had a crush on in high school

That makes it the very best, my friend. Never underestimate the power of nostalgia.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Which shouldn't matter to Shadow King as he has no physical body anyway; but he's trying to rule it, rather than destroy everything.... I know virtually nothing about SK. How does he win, iyo?

Mindrape, basically, or possessing Zamasu.

He's basically a Xavier level telepath (ok, probably lower? But in Chuck's ballpark) but an evil spirit.

Ah, okay.

Yeah that could work, as Zamasu has no real TP resistance feats to speak of.

But what happens if SK's physical host is destroyed? Admittedly I got this from a quick Google search (), but it says that if his host is destroyed it could take months(or longer) for SK to reenter the physical plane. Is there any truth to that?

We dont know if Zamazu is resistant to telepathy.

lets take things like tp or body control out of the picture. my intent here was to see if marvel has the power to straight up overpower zamasu to take him down.

Originally posted by Galan007
Ah, okay.

Yeah that could work, as Zamasu has no real TP resistance feats to speak of.

But what happens if SK's physical host is destroyed? Admittedly I got this from a quick Google search (), but it says that if his host is destroyed it could take months(or longer) for SK to reenter the physical plane. Is there any truth to that?

So he once possessed Cyclops and was fighting Storm. Storm killed him, he laughed and jumped into her, then was eaten by the Panther God who was hiding in Storm's mind. Then Storm gave first aid to Cyclops who came back to life.

In short - if his host is killed, he just body hops (like Deadman). Complete destruction of the host body? Not seen anything about that, but it's not like he returns to that body.

Originally posted by DeadpoolXXX
lets take things like tp or body control out of the picture. my intent here was to see if marvel has the power to straight up overpower zamasu to take him down.

So just punching and energy blasts?

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Parm still hasn't watched a single Super episode. Even though he was looking forward to it and had huge hopes.

Let him stay that way. I watched the first one, on the internet that makes me an expert.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
So just punching and energy blasts? or getting ahold of some other power that might allow then to beat zamasu directly.

Ghost Rider (they can come back from having their entire body destroyed) using a Penance Stare?

If you're just looking for someone/thing in Marvel that could perma-kill Zamasu, then It's like I said in my first post: you'd probably need the UN or IG.

He'd end up losing during the commercial break to a bunch of squirrels lol

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Ghost Rider (they can come back from having their entire body destroyed) using a Penance Stare? might work if he could get close enough.

Originally posted by Galan007
If you're just looking for someone/thing in Marvel that could perma-kill Zamasu, then It's like I said in my first post: you'd probably need the UN or IG. the un i can understand because its erasing power seems to work just like zeno's. but has the ig ever erased a completely immortal character?

Originally posted by darthgoober
He'd end up losing during the commercial break to a bunch of squirrels lol hard to argue that.

Originally posted by Galan007
If you're just looking for someone/thing in Marvel that could perma-kill Zamasu, then It's like I said in my first post: you'd probably need the UN or IG.

Can he not kill himself? I'm thinking with the PS.

Granted I have zero idea if he's actually done anything bad lol, but he's a villain so I assume so.

Originally posted by DeadpoolXXX
hard to argue that.
I think it'd be funny if Marvel had a special unofficial "Year of Squirrel Girl" where the heroes get their ass kicked though multiple giant events only to have Squirrel Girl bear them off panel in the last 2 pages of the arc. As ridiculous as the premise is on the surface, it be a fun way to let the villains beat their typical heroes and prove they're legitimate threats without backing the writers into a corner

Originally posted by DeadpoolXXX
the un i can understand because its erasing power seems to work just like zeno's. but has the ig ever erased a completely immortal character? Well the IG essentially makes you God within your universe. So I'm assuming that level of 'authority' would be sufficient to override a wish from the Super Dragon, and kill Zamasu.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Can he not kill himself? I'm thinking with the PS.

Granted I have zero idea if he's actually done anything bad lol, but he's a villain so I assume so. Oh Zamasu was a complete genocidal megalomaniac. So the PS would likely effect him, but I don't know what'd happen after. /shrug

That said, I doubt Zamasu would actually be able to kill himself, as he was granted true immortality by the Super Dragon -- and as far as we know, Zen-Oh's erasure was the only force in DB that was capable of perma-killing him. As I mentioned earlier, Zamasu was beyond even Beerus' ability to outright destroy.

Mindphuckery and the like would work. Some sort of esoteric containment might work as well(until Zamasu went 'ethereal-mode', at least), but those tactics seem to be off the table here.

https://i.ibb.co/KrFqxKZ/maxresdefault2-jpg.png

Doom says no

Originally posted by Parmaniac
https://i.ibb.co/KrFqxKZ/maxresdefault2-jpg.png

100yo grandma, Anna Watson, suffering from Alzheimer's vs. Puny Micropenis Parker and his shitty web-spam tactic:

https://i.ibb.co/5rMmW94/RCO029-1691268075.jpg

Originally posted by Galan007
Well the IG essentially makes you God within your universe. So I'm assuming that level of 'authority' would be sufficient to override a wish from the Super Dragon, and kill Zamasu. but isn't zeno literally THE god in dragon ball? the ig might make you the most powerful being in the universe, but it doesn't literally make you THE god in marvel. so i'm not sure how that authority compares?

Originally posted by DeadpoolXXX
but isn't zeno literally THE god in dragon ball? the ig might make you the most powerful being in the universe, but it doesn't literally make you THE god in marvel. so i'm not sure how that authority compares? Not exactly.

You're correct in saying that within the world of DB, Zen-Oh is at the absolute top of the hierarchy:
https://ibb.co/4YTb4Jz

But he is nowhere near the level of the Supreme Being(as Marvel/DC have depicted them.) Zen-Oh is neither omnipresent, omniscient, or omnipotent(in the true sense.) Zen-Oh's biggest(and perhaps *only*) claim to fame is his ability to casually erase absolutely anything in the DB multiverse. That is why everyone(even Destroyers) are scared shitless of him.

However, even Zen-Oh's erasures can be undone by a wish from the Super Dragon:
https://ibb.co/jV5f8gx
https://ibb.co/w7H62Rc
And if his erasures can be undone, then his power isn't truly absolute... Which further indicates that he isn't Supreme Being-level. I like to think of Zen-Oh and the Super Dragon as opposite sides of the same coin: whatever the Dragon creates, Zen-Oh can destroy(and vice versa.)

Anyway, trying to compare manga to comics is often a futile endeavor(especially when discussing hierarchies or w/e.) Regardless, the IG generally puts its user at *the* top of the totem pole within their universe -- giving them absolute mastery over ALL aspects of reality(to the point where even the UN's energies can be manipulated with an incomplete IG.) That said, I see no reason why it wouldn't garner the same level of 'authority' that Zen-Oh wields within DB..?

...Or to put it another way: if the IG user wanted Zamasu dead, and then gestured to make it happen, I don't see that just... Bouncing off of Zamasu. If Zen-Oh was able to perma-kill him, the UN and IG should be able to as well. /shrug

From The Incredible Gulk volume 2 issue 69:

Originally posted by Galan007
If The Presence met Zen-Oh? He'd blink him out of existence.

Zen-Oh is a 'multiversal' power within DB, but the DB multiverse is also limited to just 12 universes(possibly 18 universes now, IF #17's wish at the end of the ToP also brought back the other 6 universes that Zen-Oh destroyed beforehand.)

The Presence is an omniversal power, and presides over an infinite amount of infinite multiverses. He's on a much higher level.


Aside from that, Zen-Oh isn't really a "Supreme Being" in the same way The Presence/TOAA are. His powers really just seem limited to destroying shit at this point, there is evidently a different 'version' of him in every timeline, he doesn't appear to be omniscient, and his erasure can be undone by the Super Dragon.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
From The Incredible Gulk volume 2 issue 69: https://anthonymychal.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/01/dbz-fist-bump.gif

Originally posted by DeadpoolXXX
but isn't zeno literally THE god in dragon ball? the ig might make you the most powerful being in the universe, but it doesn't literally make you THE god in marvel. so i'm not sure how that authority compares? No, Dragon Ball more or less consists of a linear scale of green lantern powerset dudes (I say green lantern rather than flying bricks because their physical capabilities are ludicrously below their power output; Goku in the Buu Saga literally needed to go Super Saiyan to be able to move with ten ton weights on his arms and legs, this is a guy who can destroy planets who has trouble with Spider-Man tier weights) who just scale above one another but very rarely show more versatility. Actually honestly calling them green lantern-esque isn't really accurate either: your average green lantern is considerably more versatile than most DB fighters.

Zeno is the ultimate example of this, literally just being a dude with a presumably extremely high power level who can destroy more stuff more thoroughly than anyone else. But IIRC he actually has demonstrated less finesse or versatility with his power than the Angels who are subservient to him or even the Kais well below him. I think it's even implied that he's not really much of a fighter himself and actually has trouble following the faster fighters in-universe despite dwarfing them in power.

He'd get folded by any cosmic in Marvel who is in the same general weight class because they simply have vaster powersets than he does. And as Galan pointed out, ultimately DB is a rather small Multiverse, with just 12 (formerly 18) known universes he can destroy.

Originally posted by MrMind
can we make threads with more interesting anime like fate/zero or hunter x hunter? dragon ball is like the basic ***** you had a crush on in high school Kinda true ngl, and most of these plebs have only watched the anime when the manga is by far the superior version of the story simply because it shows how incredibly skilled Toriyama really is as a draftsman, especially for a shonen artist. Almost no one in manga can convey time and movement the way he does.

TBH, I feel Fate series(or Type-Moon to be more accurate) would be more in-line with the power-scaling of comics, especially Star Wars series
Both of them have multiple writers, games, novels. So its power scaling seems to be akin to comics rather other anime/manga

Originally posted by NemeBro
Goku in the Buu Saga literally needed to go Super Saiyan to be able to move with ten ton weights on his arms and legs, this is a guy who can destroy planets who has trouble with Spider-Man tier weights) For whatever reason, Toriyama seems to view lifting strength and striking strength as two completely different things.

On one hand, Goku evidently needed SS to lift a total of 40 tons(10 tons on each extremity.) On the other hand, he can kick you so hard into a mountain that it shatters on impact. The disparity between these two 'forms' of physical strength has never made sense to me, but that's Tori for you. /shrug

Originally posted by NemeBro
But IIRC he actually has demonstrated less finesse or versatility with his power than the Angels who are subservient to him or even the Kais well below him. I think it's even implied that he's not really much of a fighter himself and actually has trouble following the faster fighters in-universe despite dwarfing them in power.

Apart from whipping up that gadget out of thin air which allowed Goku to summon him, Zen-Oh has only ever shown the ability to destroy things(albeit to a much greater extent than anyone else in the franchise.) And yeah, he isn't a fighter(as confirmed by Whis and Beerus), and required a "GodPad" to follow the movements of the noteworthy fighters during the ToP. He has also never displayed resistance to any external attacks, ever... So toss a coin regarding his overall durability. /shrug

The only reason why Zen-Oh seems to be regarded as DB's #1 is because he can erase anything he wants on a whim. Aside from that, he hasn't demonstrated any noteworthy versatility at all.

He's basically like if you gave a little boy the UN, and told him to just click the button whenever he didn't like something -- most still wouldn't dare challenge him out of fear of being erased, even if they could beat the shit out of him one on one.

Originally posted by NemeBro
Kinda true ngl, and most of these plebs have only watched the anime when the manga is by far the superior version of the story simply because it shows how incredibly skilled Toriyama really is as a draftsman, especially for a shonen artist. Almost no one in manga can convey time and movement the way he does.

one punch man manga has good fight scenes

i just think there are so many more anime/manga that have characters with way more interesting powersets than db, for example naruto for much of its faults are much better at depicting their world and the shinobi's powers. it makes much better fight because it's not just flying punching and shooting beams. there are strategies involved in their fighting

they are also less absurd with their power levels so you can match up naruto characters with meta level comic people.

also unrelated note check out spy x family such good show

Originally posted by Galan007
For whatever reason, Toriyama seems to view lifting strength and striking strength as two completely different things.

On one hand, Goku evidently needed SS to lift a total of 40 tons(10 tons on each extremity.) On the other hand, he can kick you so hard into a mountain that it shatters on impact. The disparity between these two 'forms' of physical strength has never made sense to me, but that's Tori for you. /shrug



Apart from whipping up that gadget out of thin air which allowed Goku to summon him, Zen-Oh has only ever shown the ability to destroy things(albeit to a much greater extent than anyone else in the franchise.) And yeah, he isn't a fighter(as confirmed by Whis and Beerus), and required a "GodPad" to follow the movements of the noteworthy fighters during the ToP. He has also never displayed resistance to any external attacks, ever... So toss a coin regarding his overall durability. /shrug

The only reason why Zen-Oh seems to be regarded as DB's #1 is because he can erase anything he wants on a whim. Aside from that, he hasn't demonstrated any noteworthy versatility at all.

He's basically like if you gave a little boy the UN, and told him to just click the button whenever he didn't like something -- most still wouldn't dare challenge him out of fear of being erased, even if they could beat the shit out of him one on one. so if zeno is so weak, they why hasn't someone tried to kill him and take the spot??

Originally posted by DeadpoolXXX
so if zeno is so weak, they why hasn't someone tried to kill him and take the spot??

1) He can one-shot-kill you faster than Bada can.

2) Maybe that's why he has bodyguards?

https://dragonball.fandom.com/wiki/Zeno%27s_Attendants

Originally posted by DeadpoolXXX
so if zeno is so weak, they why hasn't someone tried to kill him and take the spot?? Zen-Oh isn't 'weak'. He can effortlessly erase absolutely anything in DB. I'm just saying that he has never displayed any real versatility aside from pure destruction, and seems rather finite in many other areas. So trying to put him on the level of actual Supreme Beings(ala Marvel/DC) doesn't work.

As for why no one has tried to usurp Zen-Oh's position, there are a few main reasons:
1.) If he gets wind of your treachery, he'll casually erase you.
2.) He resides in a 'realm' that is completely separate from the mainstream multiverse(only Supreme Kais and Angels can even access this place.)
3.) He has the strongest Angel(along with a few guards of yet undisclosed power) protecting him.
4*.) It is also possible that he might have staggering physicals and a bunch of other esoteric abilities, and we have just never seen him resort to those.

That said, Zen-Oh is pretty safe/untouchable while in his palace.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
1) He can one-shot-kill you faster than Bada can.

2) Maybe that's why he has bodyguards?

https://dragonball.fandom.com/wiki/Zeno%27s_Attendants

Originally posted by Galan007
Well the IG essentially makes you God within your universe. So I'm assuming that level of 'authority' would be sufficient to override a wish from the Super Dragon, and kill Zamasu.

Oh Zamasu was a complete genocidal megalomaniac. So the PS would likely effect him, but I don't know what'd happen after. /shrug

That said, I doubt Zamasu would actually be able to kill himself, as he was granted true immortality by the Super Dragon -- and as far as we know, Zen-Oh's erasure was the only force in DB that was capable of perma-killing him. As I mentioned earlier, Zamasu was beyond even Beerus' ability to outright destroy.

Mindphuckery and the like would work. Some sort of esoteric containment might work as well(until Zamasu went 'ethereal-mode', at least), but those tactics seem to be off the table here.

*Checks thread stips, sees what's banned*

"Oh, yeah, I'm sure those would have a good chance of working, but they're forbidden, alas."

I see your games, Galan-chan.

Originally posted by Galan007
The disparity between these two 'forms' of physical strength has never made sense to me, but that's Tori for you. /shrug

...

You're saying that is if it wasn't a common thing in other fictional universes, DC and Marvel included.

Karate Kid, Iron Fist and Karnak say hello. Mandarin. Temugin.

Ffs, Bats and Cap too.

Or even guys like Nick Fury:

https://i.ibb.co/J7BXpQD/stonewall.png

^ Most definitely.

But in DB, I feel like the disparity between lifting strength and striking strength is even more pronounced. Like Goku can struggle to lift 10 tons with one arm, but can then use that same arm to punch his opponent so hard that they go flying through mountains like a hot knife through butter. I dunno, the math has just never math'd to me when it comes to 'strength feats' in DB... I suppose it's just better to just treat lifting and striking as two completely different areas of physical strength. /shrug

Thought Universe 6 was infinite in size with unlimited Galaxies.

https://ibb.co/JpPcM3T

https://ibb.co/6mf5s6x

https://ibb.co/2Z8H8dm

Okay?

Originally posted by Galan007
^ Most definitely.

But in DB, I feel like the disparity between lifting strength and striking strength is even more pronounced. Like Goku can struggle to lift 10 tons with one arm, but can then use that same arm to punch his opponent so hard that they go flying through mountains like a hot knife through butter. I dunno, the math has just never math'd to me when it comes to 'strength feats' in DB...



Sure, because DB characters operate on much higher power levels.

Originally posted by Galan007
I suppose it's just better to just treat lifting and striking as two completely different areas of physical strength. /shrug

Most of us here have already been doing that with many characters.

So no reason not to apply it to DB.