Namor Vs Thing

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DarkCrawler
Hand to hand fight, no other powers allowed.

Will Namor own him? I say yes.

Namor is straight from water.

willRules
Namor wins, If he can fight the whole FF then Thing needs help...........

olympian
Namor all the way.

jrodslam
C'mon DC. Namor always owns Thing.

snoopdogg
Just asking.

Has Thing ever beaten Namor?

jrodslam
Not that i know of.

If someone knows anyone instance, id like to know and see it.

armandovalles
What happens in every fight between the Thing and Namor is that the Thing is always kicking his ass but then either the Thing accidentally knocks him into water or Namor runs away to the water, and then the Thing follows and gets his ass kicked. If Namor didnt always get to water the Thing, in my opinion, would win practically every time.

jrodslam
Wrong. Explain Namor #50. FF Unlimited #6. Both victories without Namor wet at all.

Also in Marvel Age FF #4. Eventhough it was a re-print of old, the others however were not.

Wet or dry, Thing is Namor's b**ch. Past present and future. laughing

bakerboy
The thing did beat namor sometimes in the fantastic four series. In water, namor clearly wins, but on earth, the battle is more equal, but the thing normally beat him.

jrodslam
Originally posted by bakerboy
The thing did beat namor sometimes in the fantastic four series. In water, namor clearly wins, but on earth, the battle is more equal, but the thing normally beat him.

Id really like to see proof of this. Thing normally beat Namor? Bah!

bakerboy
In one of the first fantastic four numbers, i didnt remember the exact number, but i think that was one of the first 15, namor and thing battled in a beach, and namor was wining because he was touching the water with his feet, but thing take and elevate him and then he won.

Dizzle
If he's straight from the water, Namor beats his ass. If he's been out of the water for a while, I'd still give him quite a few. Thing would be stronger, but flying's a b**** to get around.

jrodslam
Originally posted by bakerboy
In one of the first fantastic four numbers, i didnt remember the exact number, but i think that was one of the first 15, namor and thing battled in a beach, and namor was wining because he was touching the water with his feet, but thing take and elevate him and then he won.

I could have sworn Namor won that battle. Thing was wondering how was he so strong while still on land. How did Thing "elevate" Namor and beat him? Did he hold him in the air with one hand, and pummeled him with the other?

In Marvel Age #9, which is the re-print of old, Namor won. I dont own it, but plan on getting it. I did read it however.

bakerboy
Exactly, he hold him in the air with one hand and punched him with the another.

Tony Stark
Originally posted by jrodslam
Wrong. Explain Namor #50. FF Unlimited #6. Both victories without Namor wet at all.

Also in Marvel Age FF #4. Eventhough it was a re-print of old, the others however were not.

Wet or dry, Thing is Namor's b**ch. Past present and future. laughing



rolling on floor laughing




Outside of comics that have been redone with a new artist from stories from the 60's-70's When The THING was CL5-10 and Namor was somewhere in between CL60-100.

And outside of Namor's own book. Where in a limited series he's not going to give a bad showing.

Over the last 25-30yrs Namor has never kicked Ben's ass (per say knocked him out or was the clear winner after the fight was truly over and not stopped by someone or something else).

and I will personally send $1 to anyone that can prove me wrong with an actual real fight in a real Marvel comic between THING vs. Namor that namor kicks Ben's ass.

The fight cannot be not a remake or one of Namors limited series books.

I'm betting that I'll be keeping my $1.

99% of all fights with Namor and Ben out there are from the 60's and 70's or remakes done with a newer artist.

(again Ben CL5-10 vs. Namor CL60-100 = 60's-70's stats)

That being said with The THING now being as strong or stronger than Namor.

Namor undoubtedly would be going down now against any version 616, Ultimates or MK THING.

Now Ben is 10x to 20x stronger then he was when they fought where Namor only had a slight advantage over him during those 60's-70's fights.

Call me crazy or just call me logical.

But please it's OK to tell me i'm right.

When i'm right.


big grin

DarkCrawler
Their feats still show that Namor is both stronger, faster and more durable, more skilled, and WAY more experienced then Thing.

bakerboy
Stronger?? in water yes, outwater not.

Faster, yes.

More durable, never.

More experienced, maybe.

More skilled, i doubt it.

Its curious, i remember the thing beating namor, but not namor beating the thing.

jrodslam
First off, where has it been stated than in first encounters between Namor and Thing, Thing was only class 5-10? Prove this.

In FF #'s 25,26, 112 which were all 60's as well. Thing held his own until getting beat by Hulk. If he was cl 5-10, he wouldnt last half as long as he did.

To decide on a victor during a fight, one doesnt have to be knocked out. There are times when someone is getting dominated, and the fight is stopped. Other times opponents are evenly match and the fight is stopped. Namor and Thing seem to get their fights stoped alot due to either Reed or Torch saving him or some other reason.

99% of all their fights have been remakes? How many times do you think theyve fought? About 5 maybe 6 all together.

That cover scan you posted proves what?

This is no remake nor a Namor comic. Nor was Namor wet.
http://img226.imageshack.us/img226/4824/namorvsthingalternate1wj.th.jpg
http://img226.imageshack.us/img226/9050/namorvsthingalternate29ev.th.jpg

There isnt a clear knock out here, but its is clear that Namor is getting the best of think no? Up until the fight was interrupted, who would you say was winning? Namor.

DarkCrawler
Originally posted by bakerboy
Stronger?? in water yes, outwater not.

Outwater he is as strong if he is fresh from water. His strenght doesn't immediatly decrease...

Originally posted by bakerboy
Faster, yes.

Agree.

Originally posted by bakerboy
More durable, never.

Yes, he is more durable if coming straight from water.

Originally posted by bakerboy
More experienced, maybe.
Namor: 100 years old. First character of Marvel Comics.

Thing about 40 years old. Not close to first character.

It isn't "Maybe".

Originally posted by bakerboy
More skilled, i doubt it.

Best training fighting training of Atlantis, the world's OLDEST kingdom who has had time to hone the fighting techniques, experienced swordsman and 100 years of fighting experience. WAY more skilled.

Dizzle
Originally posted by bakerboy
Stronger?? in water yes, outwater not.

Faster, yes.

More durable, never.

More experienced, maybe.

More skilled, i doubt it.

Its curious, i remember the thing beating namor, but not namor beating the thing.

Stronger: With water, yes, without, no.

Durable: I'd say around the same...

Experienced: Hell yes. Namor's been at it for over a century... I forget how long exactly, but it's quite a while.

Skilled: It comes with experience.

jrodslam
Who is that in your sig Dizzle?

CorderaMitchell
Originally posted by bakerboy
Stronger?? in water yes, outwater not.

Faster, yes.

More durable, never.

More experienced, maybe.

More skilled, i doubt it.

Its curious, i remember the thing beating namor, but not namor beating the thing.

Namor is more experienced, he's fought his life, which is longer than bens existence.

bakerboy
Namor is faster than the thing, yes , clearly.

Out of water, the thing is as strong as him, level 85.

The thing skin is much more durable than namors, he can take much more punishment than namor.

More experienced and skilled, yeah, agree. Namor is one of the oldest characters in comics and he is very skilled.

DarkCrawler
Namor out of water is still Class 100. Like I said, his strength doesn't immediatly decrease. He broke through the crimson bands of Cyttorak and knocked out Doctor Strange in the process. How do you know that the Thing is more durable? Hulk has NEVER knocked out Namor, not depending on did they fight on land or water. (And most of their fights happen on land). Namor took miniature nuke that exploded WHILE he was carrying him, and it only stunned him.

Cathy X-23
Aquamans Son is namor....could some one make a Namor vs Starfre, please.

DarkCrawler
Originally posted by Cathy X-23
Aquamans Son is namor....could some one make a Namor vs Starfre, please.

WTF you are talking about...Namor existed two years before Aquaman...Aquaman has only one son and he is infant...

And Namor would so kick Starfire's ass.

Aquaman = Lousy copy of Namor...

SUE DC!

Cathy X-23
No he wont. Make a thread please. I cant because I made more than 4 today. Make me ONE.

Hulk Power
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
WTF you are talking about...Namor existed two years before Aquaman...Aquaman has only one son and he is infant...

And Namor would so kick Starfire's ass.

Aquaman = Lousy copy of Namor...

SUE DC!

Isn't Aquaman from DC and Namor from Marvel?

DarkCrawler
Originally posted by Hulk Power
Isn't Aquaman from DC and Namor from Marvel?

Yes...

bakerboy
The hulk stuff has nothing to do here. one of the best thing abilities is his durance. His stone skill is way more durable and harder than namors. Even the hulk skin isnt as durable as the thing's.

About his strength, yeah maybe you are right. But ben is a great and experienced fighter too, because he always give namor hard troubles. Its curious, but namor normally did better against the hulk than against the thing. The thing is less powerful than the hulk but is more difficult for namor. I dont know why, maybe because he is a better figther and smarter than hulk.

DarkCrawler
Originally posted by bakerboy
The hulk stuff has nothing to do here. one of the best thing abilities is his durance. His stone skill is way more durable and harder than namors. Even the hulk skin isnt as durable as the thing's.

About his strength, yeah maybe you are right. But ben is a great and experienced fighter too, because he always give namor hard troubles. Its curious, but namor normally did better against the hulk than against the thing. The thing is less powerful than the hulk but is more difficult for namor. I dont know why, maybe because he is a better figther and smarter than hulk.

Namor is still better fighter and smarter then Thing is. And stronger. And at least as durable as Thing, since rubble from Thing's skin always flies when he fights people - Namor doesn't even get wounds.

Namor
If Ben Grimm could keep Namor out of the water long enough to have a considerable impact on his strength then I could see Thing taking down Namor. Otherwise I agree with Darkcrawler - Namor is a superior tactician and combatant in comparison to The Thing. But the Namor not receiving wounds thing? That's a bit of a stretch.

olympian
"Stronger?? in water yes, outwater not."

Until he starts to weaken due to being out of water, yes he is.

"More experienced, maybe."

No. Its more experienced = sure.

"More skilled, i doubt it."

He is higly skilled. One of the most skilled bricks Marvel has. Who of the two is more i dont know. Namor is more for grappling skills and Thing its more for boxing. If you count battle experience then Namor surely edges him.

K3VIL
Namor usually fight with Thing without always knocking the crap outta him cause they fight in FF4 issues, so obviously there's the motivation of not showing Thing as a weak guy compared to him.
Namor's durability granted him to survive in space, Namor's strenght was sufficient to battle a Hulk controlled by a magical being and showing his own really good, Namor is more a wreckin machine than Thing.
Namor use skills, speed, brain and strenght, when he fight Hulk.
Thing use "skills", strenght, and nothing more.

olympian
Pretty much, agreed.

Thing always does good against Namor. In fact he does pretty good against practically all the high bricks at Marvel. Its the underdog persona.

Helding its own against them tho, doesnt spell winning. Thing against Namor its a case like that. They share a friendly rivality, he did pretty good against him once underwater (tho it semmed namor was holding a bit) he does good againt him out of it. Against Hercules the same. Against Champion the same. Against Hulk the same. More than tho, its another story.

Tony Stark
Originally posted by jrodslam
First off, where has it been stated than in first encounters between Namor and Thing, Thing was only class 5-10? Prove this.

In FF #'s 25,26, 112 which were all 60's as well. Thing held his own until getting beat by Hulk. If he was cl 5-10, he wouldnt last half as long as he did.

To decide on a victor during a fight, one doesnt have to be knocked out. There are times when someone is getting dominated, and the fight is stopped. Other times opponents are evenly match and the fight is stopped. Namor and Thing seem to get their fights stoped alot due to either Reed or Torch saving him or some other reason.

99% of all their fights have been remakes? How many times do you think theyve fought? About 5 maybe 6 all together.

That cover scan you posted proves what?

This is no remake nor a Namor comic. Nor was Namor wet.
http://img226.imageshack.us/img226/4824/namorvsthingalternate1wj.th.jpg
http://img226.imageshack.us/img226/9050/namorvsthingalternate29ev.th.jpg

There isnt a clear knock out here, but its is clear that Namor is getting the best of think no? Up until the fight was interrupted, who would you say was winning? Namor.



These stats are from the Marvel directory 1986

Strength Level: The Thing possesses superhuman strength, enabling him to lift (press) 85 tons. The Thing's strength grew considerably over the initial years of his career. At one early point in his life as the Thing, for example, he could only lift (press) 5 tons.

Yea Ben was hurt so much by Namors punches he was joking about it while in the air.

Wynndar
In that issue of Marvel two in one i think the Thing wins that fight...even though it is underwater. I certainly dont remember Namor having the advantage.

Thing and NAmor have both fought Blackbolt back to back. Namor got knocked the F-out and embedded in a Dam while the Thing actually nearly put BB down immediately after.

Thing and Namor have fought a lot but i dont see Namor having an edge, certainly not against the modern Thing who is clearly bigger/stronger/tougher.

DarkCrawler
Originally posted by Wynndar
In that issue of Marvel two in one i think the Thing wins that fight...even though it is underwater. I certainly dont remember Namor having the advantage.

Thing and NAmor have both fought Blackbolt back to back. Namor got knocked the F-out and embedded in a Dam while the Thing actually nearly put BB down immediately after.

Thing and Namor have fought a lot but i dont see Namor having an edge, certainly not against the modern Thing who is clearly bigger/stronger/tougher.

Bigger, maybe. Stronger or tougher? No.

Issue numbers for Black Bolt and underwater fights, please?

Wynndar
Underwater i was refering to that Marvel two in one #28 there. Ill find the issue number with Blackbolt...one sec

DarkCrawler
This?

http://img224.imageshack.us/img224/6281/image197ip.gif

Namor is not fighting to his fullest.

Wynndar
I have the comic book i dont need to see scans of one page. Even though the fight is underwater, this clearly doesnt give Namor any kind of strength advantage.

Wynndar
Ah FF #411

DarkCrawler
Originally posted by Wynndar
I have the comic book i dont need to see scans of one page. Even though the fight is underwater, this clearly doesnt give Namor any kind of strength advantage.

Namor isn't fighting to his fullest...he tries to make Thing listen to reason.

Wynndar
yea its not very conclusive ill admit...all those old school fights were like that.

Dizzle
Originally posted by jrodslam
Who is that in your sig Dizzle?

Drizzt Do'Urden. Who is even more badass than Namor... And would beat either! big grin

But Namor though... Yeah. In/fresh from water his strength's a lot better (when underwater, he outmuscled hulk...) He eventually gets down to something like class 40 though... He's still much the better fighter, in either case. I'd give him 9/10 fresh from water and 4/10 when he's dry for a while. Underwater, he should be owning all 10, cuz Ben should get a lot weaker and slower in addition to Namor's boost... (not saying he always has, but he definitely should)

DarkCrawler
Originally posted by Dizzle
Drizzt Do'Urden. Who is even more badass than Namor... And would beat either! big grin



Argh. Namor and Thing would school the whole Menzoberranzan. mad

Drizzt is badass though. wink

Wynndar
Originally posted by Dizzle
Drizzt Do'Urden. Who is even more badass than Namor... And would beat either! big grin

But Namor though... Yeah. In/fresh from water his strength's a lot better (when underwater, he outmuscled hulk...) He eventually gets down to something like class 40 though... He's still much the better fighter, in either case. I'd give him 9/10 fresh from water and 4/10 when he's dry for a while. Underwater, he should be owning all 10, cuz Ben should get a lot weaker and slower in addition to Namor's boost... (not saying he always has, but he definitely should)

Well there's no need to say what could or should happen. Thing and Namor have fought in and out of water and they were both always tough and basically even.

Dizzle
Underwater Namor beat Hulk very decisively. Thing hasn't come close to that anywhere. I was also counting the fact that water would make Ben slower and effectively weaker, while it just boosts Namor and gives him a lot more mobility.

DarkCrawler
Water replenishes Namor constantly. He is hit, he is almost immediatly healed. I don't see how Thing could beat him underwater.

Wynndar
Originally posted by Dizzle
Underwater Namor beat Hulk very decisively. Thing hasn't come close to that anywhere. I was also counting the fact that water would make Ben slower and effectively weaker, while it just boosts Namor and gives him a lot more mobility.

But they have fought underwater and it did not make Grimm slower or weaker. I dont understand the first assumption that the water should make him slower or weaker. The Thing's exterior allows him to survive unprotected in the vacuum of space.

jrodslam
Noone beats Namor underwater. NOBODY! At least not any hero ive seen. And not counting his villains.

yahman
Originally posted by jrodslam
Noone beats Namor underwater. NOBODY! At least not any hero ive seen. And not counting his villains.

I think Ice man would have something to say abut that, as well as about a thousand cosmic characters. smile

jrodslam
Originally posted by yahman
I think Ice man would have something to say abut that, as well as about a thousand cosmic characters. smile

Has he fought Iceman? No. I was talking about everyone hes already fought. Even though Iceman is my all time favorite comic character, I wouldnt mind him beating my no.2. Which is Namor. Most likey if they did, Namor would win. And you know its true.

Wonder Man
Sorry. I'm a Namor fan but the thing is 15 to 20 tons stronger.
Course Namor's flight may tip the scales in his favor.
The Thing is tough but being dropped form the stratosphere a few dozen times can rattle a guy.

DarkCrawler
Originally posted by Wonder Man
Sorry. I'm a Namor fan but the thing is 15 to 20 tons stronger.


What the f**k?

Let me direct you to this.

Namor is way faster, stronger, better or as good fighter, more experienced and as durable.

Namor wins 9/10.

DarkCrawler
Originally posted by Wynndar
Well there's no need to say what could or should happen. Thing and Namor have fought in and out of water and they were both always tough and basically even.

And by the way, the fight in the comic with Thing and Namor was staged by those two to help free Alicia.

In Fantastic Four #14, Thing tries to grab Namor, but Namor is slippery as eel, and gets out of his grasp with extreme ease. So grappling doesn't apply either.

Tony Stark
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Their feats still show that Namor is both stronger, faster and more durable, more skilled, and WAY more experienced then Thing.




Per Marvel's site it gives these rating which go from 0-7

Namor STR 6 DUR 6 Fighting skills 3

THING STR 6 DUR 6 Fighting skills 5



smile

DarkCrawler
Originally posted by Tony Stark
Per Marvel's site it gives these rating which go from 0-7

Namor STR 6 DUR 6 Fighting skills 3

THING STR 6 DUR 6 Fighting skills 5



smile

Just the fact that Marvel site is sometimes wrong.

Namor has better training and twice more fighting experience then Thing has.

Tony Stark
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Just the fact that Marvel site is sometimes wrong.

Namor has better training and twice more fighting experience then Thing has.




"Namor has better training and twice more fighting experience then Thing"

If that statement is true.

Then this.

Per Marvel's site it gives these rating which go from 0-7

Namor STR 6 DUR 6 Fighting skills 3

THING STR 6 DUR 6 Fighting skills 5

Just means that Namor just didn't have the physical nor mental tools that Ben did to start with...

And thats ok...

Because he's still the "chicken of the sea"

...Ur... i mean "Prince of the sea"

olympian
" Sorry. I'm a Namor fan but the thing is 15 to 20 tons stronger. "

pirate

That would imply he is a match to Hulk/Thor and Herc.

Find me a comic that shows him above Namor with that difference. A full power Namor that is.

Altho i suspect you meant....weaker? Something its not right here.


"Per Marvel's site it gives these rating which go from 0-7

Namor STR 6 DUR 6 Fighting skills 3

THING STR 6 DUR 6 Fighting skills 5

Just means that Namor just didn't have the physical nor mental tools that Ben did to start with..."


Per the comics, the wonderful Marvel Site as well the famous handbooks have errors.

jrodslam
Originally posted by olympian
Per the comics, the wonderful Marvel Site as well the famous handbooks have errors.

Youre 100% correct.

Wynndar
Marvel site if freequently really wrong with the fighting skills too. In the fighting department they r so close, but I still say Grimm edges him out by 5%. Namor has the Speed though. This fight is waaay too close...maybe they will fight in Thing's new series.

K3VIL
Namor is around from over 70 years, his mastery on his abilities and his fighting skills are above those of Thing.
Namor's durability granted him to survive even when throwed in outerspace.His reflexes, reaction time and flight speed outclass Thing, who is knowed for being quite slow.
Namor when fresh out of water, still is a mid level Class 100, then he begins to get weaker, but against Thing he'll need few if he goes for the K.O. and achieve a victory.This man battled an Hulk possessed from a magical being and was still on his feet, and has sayed from him during the Avengers VS Mindless Hulk battle, Namor has faced the savage creature before, AND TRIUMPHED!
IMPERIOUS REX!

Wynndar
So being around longer makes him a better fighter eh? So is he better than deadpool or T'Challa too? Hell no, thats no kind of reasoning at all. Thing and Namor have both survived in space. However Thing has survived in space AFTER Ego was blown up while the Thing was still inside him. This isnt a argument about who can survive a bigger explosion though, even if Thing is clearly tougher there. Thing's taken blows from Hulk, Gladiator, Terrax, Occulus, The Destroyer, and Black Bolt and quickly shaken it off. He survived one of the worst beating ever by Champion and still refused to go down. Black Bolt KO'd Namor in one punch and then immediately went toe to toe with the Thing and was taken down. Thing is slow? since when? one fo his powers is superhuman spped. Last month's Marvel Knights 4 made a reference to this. Thing can create enough speed with his arm to throw or punch an object into orbit. He has ran down the Rhino who can run 155mph. Slow? sorry man but thats just a lack of knowledge.

Simply saying Namor can beat Thing cuz he "said" he could beat the Hulk in Hulk issue #316 doesnt mean anything. Hulk and Thing are intirely different characters. By the way what happened to Namor after he said that? the Hulk nearly killed him. No ones demonstrated they know how to fight the Hulk like the Thing...even the underpowered 5 ton strength Thing was able to keep him busy.

Like I said, Namor does have the speed advantage. He's one of the fastest strong guys around. Thing isnt slow though.

Namor has no strength advantage against the modern Thing.

Thing is clearly tougher than Namor...although they are both extremely durable. But taking punches is what Thing does.

Fighting, they are both great fighter. Marvel.com is underrating Namor's fighting ability. But like someone else has mentioned, Ben Grimm was already an exceptional fighter before ever becoming the Thing. And simply being old doesnt make Namor any more skilled.

Basically the fight is a draw...but I think if Namor and Thing met one on one in a comic next month Thing would edge him out barely.

DarkCrawler
Originally posted by Wynndar
So being around longer makes him a better fighter eh? So is he better than deadpool or T'Challa too? Hell no, thats no kind of reasoning at all. Fighting, they are both great fighter. Marvel.com is underrating Namor's fighting ability. But like someone else has mentioned, Ben Grimm was already an exceptional fighter before ever becoming the Thing. And simply being old doesnt make Namor any more skilled.


No.

His age compared with the best training of a warrior nation that was fighting things thousands of years before the first Native Americans were in the America makes him skilled. He is a royal, and royals get lot more better training then normal soldiers.

Originally posted by Wynndar
Thing and Namor have both survived in space. However Thing has survived in space AFTER Ego was blown up while the Thing was still inside him. This isnt a argument about who can survive a bigger explosion though, even if Thing is clearly tougher there. Thing's taken blows from Hulk, Gladiator, Terrax, Occulus, The Destroyer, and Black Bolt and quickly shaken it off. He survived one of the worst beating ever by Champion and still refused to go down. Black Bolt KO'd Namor in one punch and then immediately went toe to toe with the Thing and was taken down.

KO'ed him? No, I think he only punched him far away...he was back few seconds after that.

And he wasn't taken down by Thing, he played uncouncious. Read the comic more carefully.

Check out all the enemies Namor has fought with Defenders. He has taken blows from them and has not given up. He has taken blows from Thor, Savage Hulk, Hercules, The Nameless One, and many more...(Well, most people in Marvel, he IS, after all the FIRST character of Marvel).

Originally posted by Wynndar
Thing is slow? since when? one fo his powers is superhuman spped. Last month's Marvel Knights 4 made a reference to this. Thing can create enough speed with his arm to throw or punch an object into orbit. He has ran down the Rhino who can run 155mph. Slow? sorry man but thats just a lack of knowledge.

So? Namor is fast enough to catch rockets going on Mach 2.5 on air. Namor is faster.

Originally posted by Wynndar
Simply saying Namor can beat Thing cuz he "said" he could beat the Hulk in Hulk issue #316 doesnt mean anything. Hulk and Thing are intirely different characters. By the way what happened to Namor after he said that? the Hulk nearly killed him. No ones demonstrated they know how to fight the Hulk like the Thing...even the underpowered 5 ton strength Thing was able to keep him busy.

?

Namor has beaten the Hulk. Three times.

Thing?

None.

Originally posted by Wynndar
Like I said, Namor does have the speed advantage. He's one of the fastest strong guys around. Thing isnt slow though.

Namor is faster.


Originally posted by Wynndar
Namor has no strength advantage against the modern Thing.

Thing is clearly tougher than Namor...although they are both extremely durable. But taking punches is what Thing does.

I think they are equally though. Why would thing be tougher? Maybe after Namor is dehydrated, but in this fight he is straight from water.

And strenght...what is the greatest strength feat of Thing?

Originally posted by Wynndar

Basically the fight is a draw...but I think if Namor and Thing met one on one in a comic next month Thing would edge him out barely.

I think that Namor would defeat him...superior speed and experience...equal or better strength and durability...twice as much fighting experience and as good or better skills then Thing has.

Wynndar
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
No.
His age compared with the best training of a warrior nation that was fighting things thousands of years before the first Native Americans were in the America makes him skilled. He is a royal, and royals get lot more better training then normal soldiers.


Like I said before, if this made Namor the more skilled fighter then u could also say he's better than Wolverine, Deadpool, Ironfist, Daredevil, Black Panther...But it doesnt.

I still say Namor is a better fighter than Marvel.com gives him credit for. He should have the same rating as the Thing. However, I still say Thing is depicted at using fighting technique more often than Namor.

Originally posted by DarkCrawler
KO'ed him? No, I think he only punched him far away...he was back few seconds after that.

And he wasn't taken down by Thing, he played uncouncious. Read the comic more carefully.


I know he was faking, regardless, no one was able to lay a finger on him except Grimm. Namor got abused, running his mouth and got knocked a mile right through a dam. He showed up later...when they were leaving I think, but not the next panel or second like ur implying here.

Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Check out all the enemies Namor has fought with Defenders. He has taken blows from them and has not given up. He has taken blows from Thor, Savage Hulk, Hercules, The Nameless One, and many more...(Well, most people in Marvel, he IS, after all the FIRST character of Marvel).


Im not arguing this, Namor has a great list. Just not as good as the Things.

Originally posted by DarkCrawler
So? Namor is fast enough to catch rockets going on Mach 2.5 on air. Namor is faster.


Uhh...I said Namor was faster..calm down. I was refering to someone saying Thing was slow, which he's not

Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Namor has beaten the Hulk. Three times.
?

Thing?

None.


Namor beat the Hulk underwater in Avengers 3 and Hulk 118...other than that Im unaware. It was recently revealed that Thing beat Hulk in their second encounter. He also trashed Hulk exceptionally bad in F4#320.

Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Namor is faster.


Again...no argument here. I think I said it myself that Namor is one of the fastest guys on Earth.

Originally posted by DarkCrawler
I think they are equally though. Why would thing be tougher? Maybe after Namor is dehydrated, but in this fight he is straight from water.

And strenght...what is the greatest strength feat of Thing?



Namor is tough. Just not as tough as the Thing. Like I said, Thing survived the Ego explosion...not many Earthers have a feat to match. Im not sure what Thing's greatest feat of strength is...he's lifted a ton of sh!t. Im not really impressed with anything I've seen Namor lift, but he did break the compramised bands of Cytorrak and that is truly very impressive.

Originally posted by DarkCrawler
I think that Namor would defeat him...superior speed and experience...equal or better strength and durability...twice as much fighting experience and as good or better skills then Thing has.


I just Think the Thing edges him out in strength, durability, and fighting skills. Namor would be better at fighting some other people...but in a fist fight Thing's just a bit higher on the food chain.

Good debate man.

DarkCrawler
Originally posted by Wynndar
Like I said before, if this made Namor the more skilled fighter then u could also say he's better than Wolverine, Deadpool, Ironfist, Daredevil, Black Panther...But it doesnt.

I still say Namor is a better fighter than Marvel.com gives him credit for. He should have the same rating as the Thing. However, I still say Thing is depicted at using fighting technique more often than Namor.

Hmm. I disagree. I have quite a lot of Fantastic Four comics...and Thing never shows any exceptional fighting skills...he just, you know...clobbers away. And Namor really doesn't show them either. So, equal skill showing.

But it is just the fact that when Thing's grandma was changing the diapers of Thing's father, Namor was already taking out WWII airplanes and fighting all kinds of enemies with the Invaders. Before Fantastic Four was even established, Namor was going hand to hand with Thor. Namor has defeated Captain America in h2h fight before Thing's father even enrolled in army.

Namor's experience dwarfs Thing's - and experience matters a lot in a fight. I said the same thing when they were discussing about who would win, Thing or Colossus. And maybe Colossus was harder or stronger, but Thing's experience also dwarfs Colossus's.

Originally posted by Wynndar
I know he was faking, regardless, no one was able to lay a finger on him except Grimm. Namor got abused, running his mouth and got knocked a mile right through a dam. He showed up later...when they were leaving I think, but not the next panel or second like ur implying here.

Actually, he came back one panel later.

http://img387.imageshack.us/my.php?image=vsin70vj9pb.jpg

http://img387.imageshack.us/my.php?image=vsin92dx3nt.jpg

And Namor also laid his hands on Black Bolt:

http://img387.imageshack.us/my.php?image=vsin69jf2pj.jpg

Originally posted by Wynndar
Im not arguing this, Namor has a great list. Just not as good as the Things.

He has fought every major villain and hero in Marvel, and you say that his list is not as good?

I would say it is better...

Originally posted by Wynndar
Uhh...I said Namor was faster..calm down. I was refering to someone saying Thing was slow, which he's not

Yeah. He is not.

Originally posted by Wynndar
Namor beat the Hulk underwater in Avengers 3 and Hulk 118...other than that Im unaware. It was recently revealed that Thing beat Hulk in their second encounter. He also trashed Hulk exceptionally bad in F4#320.

Namor also beat Hulk in this issue:

http://img363.imageshack.us/img363/8007/namorfeat265gs.gif

And in 118, he physically knocked him out with a punch. With the same force he would have when he is straight from water.

Originally posted by Wynndar
Again...no argument here. I think I said it myself that Namor is one of the fastest guys on Earth.

Yep.

Originally posted by Wynndar
Namor is tough. Just not as tough as the Thing. Like I said, Thing survived the Ego explosion...not many Earthers have a feat to match. Im not sure what Thing's greatest feat of strength is...he's lifted a ton of sh!t. Im not really impressed with anything I've seen Namor lift, but he did break the compramised bands of Cytorrak and that is truly very impressive.

Can you get the issue number for the Ego explosion?

Originally posted by Wynndar
I just Think the Thing edges him out in strength, durability, and fighting skills. Namor would be better at fighting some other people...but in a fist fight Thing's just a bit higher on the food chain.

Good debate man.

How does he edge him out in strength? I haven't still seen any proof of that.

And I would still say that their durability is the same...taking on account that Namor has taken a full force Mjolnir throw from Thor, blasts from Silver Surfer, miniature nukes, and lot of other things during the sixty years he has spend in comics. And even if Thing would be more durable, Namor's greater speed enables him to dodge more hits then Thing.

Yeah, this is a good debate. smile

Wynndar
Yea, I'll have to read that comic next time Im bak home. Anyway I think we've exhausted this argument for the moment.

jrodslam
Namor is faster, stronger, more experienced. He wins.

LandShark
I say if the marvel site said thing is a little better then you cant argue until they admit they made a mistake, they do have the say so last word in it. Besides I always thought namor was boring anyway

jrodslam
Marvel site does nothing but copy and paste old attributes. They have no knowledge of what goes on in the comics whatsoever. Going by feats and battles, Namor beats Thing everytime. Whether hes boring or not.

Tony Stark
Originally posted by LandShark
I say if the marvel site said thing is a little better then you cant argue until they admit they made a mistake, they do have the say so last word in it. Besides I always thought namor was boring anyway



You're 100% correct



It's not as if it's Calvin's Comics web site.

It's MARVEL Comics own website. They actually pay people REAL $ to input all the information and make sure it's correct.

They've made upgrades on characters listed on the site so they obviously know whats on there. If they felt it was wrong information they would change it.

Just because it doesn't show your favorite character in favorable light in comparison to another character or in a way you feel it should doesn't mean that the information is wrong... It means you are.

Dizzle
Da hell? Marvel Directory is wrong constantly. Namor's strength feats (oil tankers, punching out Hulk) are more impressive than Ben's really. Namor has most of the advantages... Fighting skill, strength, speed, and a LOT of mobility. Once again, flight rules.

What really bothers me is all those people taking a dose of Black Bolt's voice from basically point blank... And most of them stay conscious. A whisper's knocked out Hulk and Gladiator, but oh no, not Invisible Woman... Yeesh.

Oh yeah, go Namor.

jrodslam
^ thumb up

kgkg
well let's see

Namor over 100 000 tons vs
Thing ( what's max 100 tons at most)

speed Namor under water gives blows in moments over mach vs
Thing Superman human

Namor wins

LandShark
I dont care spiked thing would dust namor any day you guys are trying to build namor into like pre crisis superman or something superman prime heh namor is a joke and aquaman flattened him with a little whale!

jrodslam
Thing is probably the most defeated powehouse ever. Thing is Namor's bi**h. Although Namor has never fought the spikey version, hed probably beat him as well. You nay think Namors a joke, and thats your perogative, but his track record is better than Things.

And you think Aquaman beating Namor is valid? I guess the same goes for Lobo and wolverine, Batman and Hulk too ehh? You can defent Thing all you want. I meaneven though he gets his ass beat, he still has heart right? Lol. Happy Dance

LandShark
Spike Thing could have taken Namor in the water, And considering the people voted on the outcome of the Aquaman Namor battle and both Marvel and Dc were okay with whatever the people said I say its valid, although I dont think Aquaman could have taken him without the whales help, LOL But I do agree with you Thing does get knocked around constantly and his track record of finished major character fights isnt that good

Wynndar
regular Thing and Namor fought to a draw UNDERWATER. Grimm is not the Hulk, Doesnt fight like him, doesnt think like him, their both strong and tough...thats about it. Namor has great feats and so does the Thing...there is no conclusive evidence one is better than the other...its just too close. We can all have our opinions...but anyone who says there's an obvious outcome to this fight is not being objective.

jrodslam
^ A draw to where Namor was holding back and trying to talk some sense into Thing? True theeir both strong and tough, but Namor is stronger and tougher. I personally dont think its close at all. Considering who Namor has fought and beaten and even stalemated. Namor has and will always be too much for Thing to handle. Thing will always be considered because of his heart and the team hes on.

Wynndar
Yea Thing hasnt beaten or stalemated anyone significant

DarkCrawler
Originally posted by Tony Stark
You're 100% correct



It's not as if it's Calvin's Comics web site.

It's MARVEL Comics own website. They actually pay people REAL $ to input all the information and make sure it's correct.

They've made upgrades on characters listed on the site so they obviously know whats on there. If they felt it was wrong information they would change it.

Just because it doesn't show your favorite character in favorable light in comparison to another character or in a way you feel it should doesn't mean that the information is wrong... It means you are.

Ah.

Do you think that the guy who wrote Namor's bio was Stan Lee?

There is no guy named "Marvel". There are just some random guys who make research...and those guys can make mistakes.

DarkCrawler
Originally posted by LandShark
I dont care spiked thing would dust namor any day you guys are trying to build namor into like pre crisis superman or something superman prime heh namor is a joke and aquaman flattened him with a little whale!


HAHAHAHAHAHAH!

You are actually taking Marvel VS DC as canon!?!

Marvel VS DC where LOBO got beaten by WOLVERINE?!

laughing out loud eek! laughing laughing

The fight was fan-voted. Come back when you have gone past puberty.

yahman
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
HAHAHAHAHAHAH!

You are actually taking Marvel VS DC as canon!?!

Marvel VS DC where LOBO got beaten by WOLVERINE?!

laughing out loud eek! laughing laughing

The fight was fan-voted. Come back when you have gone past puberty.

That was maybe a slight over reaction !!!!!! smile

DarkCrawler
Originally posted by yahman
That was maybe a slight over reaction !!!!!! smile

Yeah...but it still sickens me that after all these years people still think that Marvel VS DC is credible proof in Versus threads.

Do they even read the forum rules before writing? smile

yahman
Originally posted by Wynndar
So being around longer makes him a better fighter eh? So is he better than deadpool or T'Challa too? Hell no, thats no kind of reasoning at all. Thing and Namor have both survived in space. However Thing has survived in space AFTER Ego was blown up while the Thing was still inside him. This isnt a argument about who can survive a bigger explosion though, even if Thing is clearly tougher there. Thing's taken blows from Hulk, Gladiator, Terrax, Occulus, The Destroyer, and Black Bolt and quickly shaken it off. He survived one of the worst beating ever by Champion and still refused to go down. Black Bolt KO'd Namor in one punch and then immediately went toe to toe with the Thing and was taken down. Thing is slow? since when? one fo his powers is superhuman spped. Last month's Marvel Knights 4 made a reference to this. Thing can create enough speed with his arm to throw or punch an object into orbit. He has ran down the Rhino who can run 155mph. Slow? sorry man but thats just a lack of knowledge.

Simply saying Namor can beat Thing cuz he "said" he could beat the Hulk in Hulk issue #316 doesnt mean anything. Hulk and Thing are intirely different characters. By the way what happened to Namor after he said that? the Hulk nearly killed him. No ones demonstrated they know how to fight the Hulk like the Thing...even the underpowered 5 ton strength Thing was able to keep him busy.



This is all very ambigous evidence. What you say is all true, but in the wrong context. I.e. 'Thing has taken blows from Hulk, Gladiator etc'

Yes he has taken blows from them, but not very well !!!!!!!!!!

I think the punch from Gladiator nearly killed him ???????

True the 5 ton Thing was able to goe toe to toe with the Hulk. But in those days the Thing was marvel number 2 power house. Of course the writer was going to make it a close fight, what would be the point in the comic otherwise ?????

You made reference to Mavel Knights ?????? Did this happen recently ????

yahman
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Yeah...but it still sickens me that after all these years people still think that Marvel VS DC is credible proof in Versus threads.

Do they even read the dorum rules before writing? smile

No .... What do the 'dorum' rules say about DC vs Marvel ???? (Nah seriously I'm interested)

DarkCrawler
Originally posted by yahman
No .... What do the 'dorum' rules say about DC vs Marvel ???? (Nah seriously I'm interested)

*F*orum Rules... stick out tongue

Edited.

Written by Tron:

xmarksthespot
Been reading the Namor feat list you made DC. thumb up Just a couple of things, in Strength Feats for #08, is 200 tons stated? Because it sounds like an underestimate, submarines generally weigh in the thousands if not tens of thousands of tons. #13 a ship of that size should probably be thousands of tons too.

I see Namor most likely winning - considering in most if not all physical categories he's equal or superior to Thing.

yahman
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
*F*orum Rules... stick out tongue

Edited.

Written by Tron:

Your too quick for me man !!!!!!!!!

Oh right. I always wondered what PIS meant.

IMO Namor is faster, stronger and has simillar fighting skills. Thing has greater durability. smile

DarkCrawler
Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Been reading the Namor feat list you made DC. thumb up Just a couple of things, in Strength Feats for #08, is 200 tons stated? Because it sounds like an underestimate, submarines generally weigh in the thousands if not tens of thousands of tons. #13 a ship of that size should probably be thousands of tons too.

Namor would most likely win.
Nah...I just put that 200 tons as a rough estimate.

yahman
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Nah...I just put that 200 tons as a rough estimate.


IMO lifting feeds seem superior to fighting feats, i.e they are alot easier to gauge. Namor's lifting feats are far superior to Things. But they are listed in the same category, and are generally accepted as not as strong as the other Heavy weights. After considering all this one comes to the conclusion that Namor is stronger, but not by much. smile

Tony Stark
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Ah.

Do you think that the guy who wrote Namor's bio was Stan Lee?

There is no guy named "Marvel". There are just some random guys who make research...and those guys can make mistakes.




eek!

Do you actually think that some guys off the street write this info down, paste it on the MARVEL site and the uppers of MARVEL (Stan Lee included) have no idea of whats being put out into the world as far as their livelihood (The Characters of MARVEL) and their canon stats, and they don't have any say in it? And they don't care if it's correct or not...?


Please tell me you don't...

Any version of a current THING will beat a current Namor...

Worst case scenario 7/10

jrodslam
^ What does current Thing do thats so impressive? What are his feats? And any true mature fan of comics here knows that bios and stgats from sites dont mean much. Its the comics that define the character. Most of the people who do bios now hardly read most or even some of the books with the characters strengths and weaknesses. They just uses old stats for the most part.

DarkCrawler
Originally posted by Tony Stark
eek!

Do you actually think that some guys off the street write this info down, paste it on the MARVEL site and the uppers of MARVEL (Stan Lee included) have no idea of whats being put out into the world as far as their livelihood (The Characters of MARVEL) and their canon stats, and they don't have any say in it? And they don't care if it's correct or not...?


Please tell me you don't...

Any version of a current THING will beat a current Namor...

Worst case scenario 7/10


Yep, thats pretty much it.

Read any list of writers of Handbooks...you are not seeing "Stan Lee" there.

I doubt that Stan Lee, a owner of multi-billion dollar Empire would have time to say: "Hey, you wrote that wrong, he can lift 70, not 75 tons." The guys who write it do mistakes. Read through the handbooks and you can see the mistakes they make.

(If you really want to go with handbooks, Thing is still Class 85 and Namor Class 100. Is the 85 tons correct?)

Namor 8/10.

Tony Stark
Originally posted by DarkCrawler
Yep, thats pretty much it.

Read any list of writers of Handbooks...you are not seeing "Stan Lee" there.

I doubt that Stan Lee, a owner of multi-billion dollar Empire would have time to say: "Hey, you wrote that wrong, he can lift 70, not 75 tons." The guys who write it do mistakes. Read through the handbooks and you can see the mistakes they make.

(If you really want to go with handbooks, Thing is still Class 85 and Namor Class 100. Is the 85 tons correct?)

Namor 8/10.




You don't see Stan the Man's name on the list of writers because he doesn't actually write them, but your seriously kidding yourself if you think that he doesn't over see what goes on the MARVEL website as far as character information since they are all his property.

How strange would it be if they actually had guidelines to follow per characters. OOOOO... that would be weird Uh?

And I'm not quoting any handbook I'm quoting MARVEL's website...

I can show many of handbook that puts Namor at CL40 out of water for more than 2-3 hours and CL85 in the water also so we can use that too.

If you'd like.


THING 7/10


stick out tongue

xmarksthespot
Considering Stan Lee is only the Chairman Emeritus of Marvel, and doesn't actually have any to do with the day to day running of Marvel or creative control over characters that now belong to Marvel Entertainment Inc. I highly doubt he has - or would bother to have - input into what goes on Marvel.com or into the handbooks.

jrodslam
I really want someone posting a fight where Thing beats Namor. I really dont think he ever has. People always mention Thing always got the better of Namor, but its never been proven. Just alot of talk. If anyone has, can a scan please be posted?

Until then, Thing will always be Namor's b**ch.

DarkCrawler
Originally posted by Tony Stark
You don't see Stan the Man's name on the list of writers because he doesn't actually write them, but your seriously kidding yourself if you think that he doesn't over see what goes on the MARVEL website as far as character information since they are all his property.

How strange would it be if they actually had guidelines to follow per characters. OOOOO... that would be weird Uh?

And I'm not quoting any handbook I'm quoting MARVEL's website...

I can show many of handbook that puts Namor at CL40 out of water for more than 2-3 hours and CL85 in the water also so we can use that too.

If you'd like.


THING 7/10


stick out tongue
No. Stan Lee hasn't probably done anything to the handbooks for ten years. He doesn't care what they write in the handbooks. Same with Marvel's site. There is mistakes. Lots of them. That's why we should follow comics...

And if you really want to go with handbooks, I can show you the NEWEST handbooks that put Namor at class 100. And Thing is still 85. That's making Namor fifteen tons stronger then Thing at his best days.

If you'd like.

Namor 8/10. With handbooks or not.

Wynndar
Hmm thats odd...there's a handbook that explicitely state's Thing has class 85 strength?

The latest handbooks have class 6 that goes from 75-100 tons and Thing is in that category. It also mentions that his strength increases and has fluctuated in the past.

DarkCrawler
Latest class given to Thing is 85, however. 2005 Handbook doesn't state his exact strength class, though. But it has never been stated that he would have been gone over it, unlike Namor.

Wynndar
Hmm yea Im not sure what u just said there. Last time Thing was stated at 85 tons was 1986. The nature of his powers is that he is constantly getting stronger from absorbing more radiation and further radiation. His body constantly evolves; the most dramatic manifestation of this fact was demonstrated in F4 volume 3 #58-61. If ur not aware of this its ok...Im not sure how much F4 u read especially since I THINK u just said Thing's strength has never increased.

DarkCrawler
Originally posted by Wynndar
Hmm yea Im not sure what u just said there. Last time Thing was stated at 85 tons was 1986. The nature of his powers is that he is constantly getting stronger from absorbing more radiation and further radiation. His body constantly evolves; the most dramatic manifestation of this fact was demonstrated in F4 volume 3 #58-61. If ur not aware of this its ok...Im not sure how much F4 u read especially since I THINK u just said Thing's strength has never increased.

I just stated that the latest number given to Thing is 85. I'm not saying that he isn't over it. It just has never been stated. But if we go by comics, Thing has some feats (I think) that would put him in low Class 100. Just not as high as Namor.

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