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*these words are coming from a certified 1# fan of Revan*

Ok all you Revan and Luke fanboys listen up!

NJO Luke ain't God.
Revan ain't the most powerful.

And that's all I have to say.

How long did it take you to come up with this thread?

Originally posted by ESB-1138
How long did it take you to come up with this thread?

Not long at all...why?

It's just a friendly reminder to stop fellating a false character, which, in my opinion, hasn't come a moment too soon.

Originally posted by Gryn Jabar
It's just a friendly reminder to stop fellating a false character, which, in my opinion, hasn't come a moment too soon.

I can't disagree.

*waits for the angered reply of the fanboys*

REVAN is God. No one can beat him and I mean no one. Whoever thinks someone cane beat Revan needs to...can't keep straight face. I hate fanboys.

Then stay the hell out of the comic book versus forum.

Originally posted by Gryn Jabar
Then stay the hell out of the comic book versus forum.

This ain't the comic book versus forum.

I think he's warning about all the fanboys in the comic book versus forum. There's a lot of good debate there, but more than its fair share of fanboyism.

Just because Revan and Malak and whoever are 4000 years older than Dooku and Vader and whoever...


DOES NOT ENABLE THEM AS GODS!

And i want proof that Malak is more powerful than Dooku or Vader or Sidious...


AND I want PROOF that Revan can kick Maul, Dooku Palpatine or Vaders shit up.


Hell, i WANT PROOF that Revan or Malak or any other ancient can kick Yoda, Windu or any other Jedi's ass!


C'MON, FANBOYS!


DO YOUR WORST!

Yes Proof!!!!!!!! Oh NJO Luke could beat anyone. Oh Revan could beat anyone cause my turkey sandwich said so! But seriosly They aren't that great.

Nope. They're no more powerful than the next Jedi Master/Sith Lord of notable strength.

Oh yeah? Well my bologna sandwich has a first name!

Darth Revan is THE false god of SW universe. An ugly RPG character, stolen from Vader (constantly changing sides), thought very powerful just because some people here are good gamers.
But in the "Baldur's Gate" game you can kill Drizzt while in the official FR universe he is almost god...
these funny comic Sith heroes are also false gods, all will be forgotten soon, while the true Sith lords (Vader, Maul & Sidious) will be remembered and loved.

Originally posted by Darth Sparhawk
Darth Revan is THE false god of SW universe. An ugly RPG character, stolen from Vader (constantly changing sides), thought very powerful just because some people here are good gamers.
But in the "Baldur's Gate" game you can kill Drizzt while in the official FR universe he is almost god...
these funny comic Sith heroes are also false gods, all will be forgotten soon, while the true Sith lords (Vader, Maul & Sidious) will be remembered and loved.

You realize the comic book heroes have been around longer than guys like Maul, right? They won't be forgotten by EU fans because they ARE EU, and because they have legitimate, official evidence of their capabilities. You are right though, the gameplay aspect of Revan definitely causes him to be overrated.

Originally posted by Sorgo
Hell, i WANT PROOF that Revan or Malak or any other ancient can kick Yoda, Windu or any other Jedi's ass!


Ah well...that's not fair because Yoda might be able to kill any other SW character in a lightsaber duel (argued that once in the Revan vs Yoda topic in the versus forum).

There is of course no proof that the ancient Sith Lords / Revan / Malak or whoever can kick Yoda, Windu, Obi-Wan or Anakin but on the other handside there is also no proof that it would go the other way around.

Originally posted by Nai Fohl
Ah well...that's not fair because Yoda might be able to kill any other SW character in a lightsaber duel (argued that once in the Revan vs Yoda topic in the versus forum).

There is of course no proof that the ancient Sith Lords / Revan / Malak or whoever can kick Yoda, Windu, Obi-Wan or Anakin but on the other handside there is also no proof that it would go the other way around.

Yes, but barely anyone says that any Modern FU can kick an ancient FU in the ass.... It's always the other way around.

Because this EU forum. Most people here are EU fans. I remember that there was a major poll who is the strongest Jedi or Sith, in ign site or something like this with hundreds of votes and Yoda won ahead of Vader. Palpatine was third or something like that.

Originally posted by Sorgo
Yes, but barely anyone says that any Modern FU can kick an ancient FU in the ass.... It's always the other way around.

That has a reason, its called constant fighting and real wars.

Originally posted by Fishy
That has a reason, its called constant fighting and real wars.

Yes. The people in the past lived through wars between Sith and Jedi. The new guys? they lasted through a time of peace.

ya like this thread is underrating the chars even if they are overpowered and have a huige fanboy base doesnt mean that they arent powerful. because the majority of the fans don't like them.

Originally posted by xxxpoppunker182
ya like this thread is underrating the chars even if they are overpowered and have a huige fanboy base doesnt mean that they arent powerful. because the majority of the fans don't like them.

Actually you see people like me, Janus, and Nai rating Revan top 10, it's only NJO that's unranked because he has so many damn incongruities.

Revan is top 10 despite only having a few handfuls of cutscenes and FMVs. I think Revan is very powerful, but I also think it's ridiculous to start rating him over great Sith figures like Sadow, Ragnos, or Simus.

Ok as Revan Ill kick anyones ass here just step outside and ill prove it, nay just kinding you're alright

Originally posted by Illustrious
Actually you see people like me, Janus, and Nai rating Revan top 10, it's only NJO that's unranked because he has so many damn incongruities.

Revan is top 10 despite only having a few handfuls of cutscenes and FMVs. I think Revan is very powerful, but I also think it's ridiculous to start rating him over great Sith figures like Sadow, Ragnos, or Simus.

It is, but thats the problem with this situation..

Some people take Revan overboard and because of that other people think he's absolutely worthless. I mean Revan vs Vader, or Revan vs god knows what weak guy there is. On the other hand we have threads with Revan vs Ragnos that last forever and that without reason as well.

Its hard to find a real balance there. At least for a lot of people, NJO Luke basically contradicts everything GL has ever said and the books the movies as well, however Luke does seem pretty powerful, to powerful. Most people try to limit that into reason, but some don't and refuse to accept that it doesn't make any sense.

Yeah, agreed.

We should write up a treatise on the rating and ranking of all characters for the sole sake of this EU versus subforum.

Or did I already try that earlier this year?

I have no idea what you are talking about...

Originally posted by Fishy
It is, but thats the problem with this situation..

Some people take Revan overboard and because of that other people think he's absolutely worthless. I mean Revan vs Vader, or Revan vs god knows what weak guy there is. On the other hand we have threads with Revan vs Ragnos that last forever and that without reason as well.

Its hard to find a real balance there. At least for a lot of people, NJO Luke basically contradicts everything GL has ever said and the books the movies as well, however Luke does seem pretty powerful, to powerful. Most people try to limit that into reason, but some don't and refuse to accept that it doesn't make any sense. So you are saying that Luke would kick ass?

To be honest I can't see what the urguement is Revan was a very powerful Jedi or Sith as was Luke it would be hard to split them as we dont know Revans full power. Hopefully we will in KoToR 3 so until then Im sitting ion the fence. What is a fact is that they would be a great team

I'm hoping that GL comes out and abolishes the NJO series and that KOTOR III gives us exact limitations on Malak, Revan, and all the KOTOR crew, and that a comic book series is released dealing with Tulak Hord, Marka Ragnos, and others.

then and only then will doubt be removed.

Originally posted by Darth_Janus
I'm hoping that GL comes out and abolishes the NJO series and that KOTOR III gives us exact limitations on Malak, Revan, and all the KOTOR crew, and that a comic book series is released dealing with Tulak Hord, Marka Ragnos, and others.

then and only then will doubt be removed. I agree so sitting on the fence is the best postion for now

More or less. Not exactly comfortable, but gives you a good position to dive for cover either left or right.

Originally posted by Darth_Janus
More or less. Not exactly comfortable, but gives you a good position to dive for cover either left or right. Not comfortable indeed but just ease yourself on it well get better
Dont know who long where have to wait for KOTOR3 thou, but it should give us some of the answers

I'm guessing a year and a half.

but then there will still be the debate that im thinking off that is are the movie jedi/sith weaker because with ageing wont the jedi/sith of fogoting fore powers and not having to live the same life as the old jedi/sith and did anyone notic i was gonefor a bit i didnt think so

Originally posted by Darth_Janus
I'm hoping that GL comes out and abolishes the NJO series and that KOTOR III gives us exact limitations on Malak, Revan, and all the KOTOR crew, and that a comic book series is released dealing with Tulak Hord, Marka Ragnos, and others.

then and only then will doubt be removed.

You guys with your great graphic systems, I can just barely run KOTOR II and I doubt all be able to run KOTOR III.

Another thing...if Revan dies in KOTOR III I will go insane.

Originally posted by Rayvann Sadow
You guys with your great graphic systems, I can just barely run KOTOR II and I doubt all be able to run KOTOR III.

Another thing...if Revan dies in KOTOR III I will go insane.

I will laugh!

Originally posted by Sorgo
I will laugh!


And I will cheer!

Its not poor Revan's fault that he has a whole troupe of fanboys that glorify him beyong preportion.

Originally posted by Rayvann Sadow
Its not poor Revan's fault that he has a whole troupe of fanboys that glorify him beyong preportion.

Words of wisdom. Revan could be a great character, but to openly wish his death is "Character hating" and if you advocate this, please refrain from defending any other character in future debates, since you will be a total hypocrite. People get pissed when I say Vader and Luke suck, or NJO Luke sucks, or Sidious sucks, but Revan bashing is considered okay and massively acceptable. I'm not saying Revan's fanboys aren't annoying; I am saying is don't be so much a hater if you can't take the criticism of your own character.

I don't know, I would like to see a bit more clarification on Revan in KotOR III, but I can't say I would like Revan to be elevated to god pedastal from the game, as that would just be a precursor to NJO Luke. Revan is fine as he is; he is an extremely powerful character that is top 10 -- top 15 if you're pessimistic about him. I think he belongs right where he is. Personally, I'd hope the third installment clarifies him rather than tinkers with him to make him overpowered or underpowered.

Yeah, I don't want hi to be god. I like him the way he is.

Originally posted by Darth_Janus
Yeah, I don't want hi to be god. I like him the way he is.

Same here.

Originally posted by Darth_Janus
Words of wisdom. Revan could be a great character, but to openly wish his death is "Character hating" and if you advocate this, please refrain from defending any other character in future debates, since you will be a total hypocrite. People get pissed when I say Vader and Luke suck, or NJO Luke sucks, or Sidious sucks, but Revan bashing is considered okay and massively acceptable. I'm not saying Revan's fanboys aren't annoying; I am saying is don't be so much a hater if you can't take the criticism of your own character.


Jeeezzz, don't get all serious about it. But really I don't Revan is a strong as we rate him around. One of the greatest force users. He didn't even look like he reached age 50, you don't become stronger in the force just by reading holocrons, at one point you have to understand the force for yourself through meditating and training by yourself one on one with the force. Which is why I think the Moive characters stand a better chance in battle than what they are given credit for. Mace couldn't of created Vaapad had he been fighting people all the time, and Yoda wouldn't be so wise in the force had he not meditated for so long. Revan just isn't old enough to be considered one of the great force users. I'd say he's about on Obi-Wan's level in the force, he may destroy Obi with a lightsaber but he's not going to through him around like Dooku tossed Obi in ROTS. He hasn't learned enough about the force for himself or grown in the force enough to be an all powerful force master. That's just how I see it anyway.

Originally posted by Apex
Jeeezzz, don't get all serious about it. But really I don't Revan is a strong as we rate him around. One of the greatest force users. He didn't even look like he reached age 50, you don't become stronger in the force just by reading holocrons, at one point you have to understand the force for yourself through meditating and training by yourself one on one with the force. Which is why I think the Moive characters stand a better chance in battle than what they are given credit for. Mace couldn't of created Vaapad had he been fighting people all the time, and Yoda wouldn't be so wise in the force had he not meditated for so long. Revan just isn't old enough to be considered one of the great force users. I'd say he's about on Obi-Wan's level in the force, he may destroy Obi with a lightsaber but he's not going to through him around like Dooku tossed Obi in ROTS. He hasn't learned enough about the force for himself or grown in the force enough to be an all powerful force master. That's just how I see it anyway.

Your placing Revan at Obi's Level over how old he is (even when we don't know how old he is?eer

Originally posted by Apex
Jeeezzz, don't get all serious about it. But really I don't Revan is a strong as we rate him around. One of the greatest force users. He didn't even look like he reached age 50, you don't become stronger in the force just by reading holocrons, at one point you have to understand the force for yourself through meditating and training by yourself one on one with the force. Which is why I think the Moive characters stand a better chance in battle than what they are given credit for. Mace couldn't of created Vaapad had he been fighting people all the time, and Yoda wouldn't be so wise in the force had he not meditated for so long. Revan just isn't old enough to be considered one of the great force users. I'd say he's about on Obi-Wan's level in the force, he may destroy Obi with a lightsaber but he's not going to through him around like Dooku tossed Obi in ROTS. He hasn't learned enough about the force for himself or grown in the force enough to be an all powerful force master. That's just how I see it anyway.

Age means nothing.

Yoda had 800+ years of experience in the Force - and Sidious (who is about 60-70) had enough power and knowledge to give him a run for his money, and enough connection in the Dark Side to shield himself from Yoda for over a decade.

It's about Force-connection. NJO Luke has a stronger connection to the Force, as did Anakin, than anyone twice or tripple times their age.

I knew this would happen..

first, how old can Revan really be? Its been speculated before on this forum and it was decided he was under 50 at least, how much older can he be, it's not like the faces on KOTOR were full of wrinkles, and although they're just game faces I'm sure if he was older they would have made him look older. Revan can't be in his 70's.

All I'm saying about Revan is if he's under 50 he'd have to learn almost 10 times as fast as a normal Jedi to have the force potential people on this board say he has. In the Dooku and Mace vs Revan thread people said Revan's great force knowledge would defeat Mace and Dooku, and that's bogus, and so is Revan's force knowledge being greater than people like Dooku.

Originally posted by Apex
I knew this would happen..

first, how old can Revan really be? Its been speculated before on this forum and it was decided he was under 50 at least, how much older can he be, it's not like the faces on KOTOR were full of wrinkles, and although they're just game faces I'm sure if he was older they would have made him look older. Revan can't be in his 70's.

All I'm saying about Revan is if he's under 50 he'd have to learn almost 10 times as fast as a normal Jedi to have the force potential people on this board say he has. In the Dooku and Mace vs Revan thread people said Revan's great force knowledge would defeat Mace and Dooku, and that's bogus, and so is Revan's force knowledge being greater than people like Dooku.

Dude...age has absolutly nothing to do with strength in the Force...its one's connection to the Force and we can be sure that Revan had a very strong connection. Also we know from Zhar that Revan was a very fast learner who drank up everything he was taught.

Originally posted by Sorgo
Just because Revan and Malak and whoever are 4000 years older than Dooku and Vader and whoever...


DOES NOT ENABLE THEM AS GODS!

And i want proof that Malak is more powerful than Dooku or Vader or Sidious...


AND I want PROOF that Revan can kick Maul, Dooku Palpatine or Vaders shit up.


Hell, i WANT PROOF that Revan or Malak or any other ancient can kick Yoda, Windu or any other Jedi's ass!


C'MON, FANBOYS!


DO YOUR WORST!

Whoa Sorgo geez I didn't want this thread to get out of hand like this. Revan would whup Maul's ass or Dooku's or Vader's and Palpatine's.

Originally posted by Rayvann Sadow
Whoa Sorgo geez I didn't want this thread to get out of hand like this. Revan would whup Maul's ass or Dooku's or Vader's and Palpatine's. Yeah, but do you actually have PROOF that he can do that?

Originally posted by Tangible God
Yeah, but do you actually have PROOF that he can do that?

On no not this again! Ahh well no I suppose I don't have proof but this however is not a vs thread anyway. But it is pretty much assumed by most that Revan could take these people just as we assume that Marka Ragnos would waste Revan.

Originally posted by Rayvann Sadow
On no not this again! Ahh well no I suppose I don't have proof but this however is not a vs thread anyway. But it is pretty much assumed by most that Revan could take these people just as we assume that Marka Ragnos would waste Revan. Ya got a point, he did more than the others afterall, Revan did.

And I will say this again after a month's break. It IS spelled MARKO with an O at the end. I played KOTOR again, and I read and heard them say it with an O.

BOO YA!


I'm not black.

Originally posted by Rayvann Sadow
Dude...age has absolutly nothing to do with strength in the Force...its one's connection to the Force and we can be sure that Revan had a very strong connection. Also we know from Zhar that Revan was a very fast learner who drank up everything he was taught.


So your telling me Revan could learn way faster than Mace, Dooku, Yoda, Sidious, and Anakin. He learns faster than Anakin, someone made almost completely from the force?

Of course high potential can over ride age as shown by Yoda and Sidious in the movies, but Anakin couldn't out force Obi-Wan and he has a great connection to the force and also wanted to know everything, so what makes you think Revan can out force Dooku if Anakin couldn't. At one point you need time to get a better control over the force like Dooku, Yoda, Sidious, or Mace did. Anakin had all the potential but not enough time to really focus it, and what allows Revan time to control and focus it all if he's hording holocrons, fighting wars, and searching for the Star Forge?

Dooku beat Anakin with skill gained over the years and most people think he was toying with him the second time they fought which goes to show connection to the force isn't that much stronger than someone who has studied it for decades.

Here's an Example:
A new shaolin monk with great potential can't beat a grand master with little potential whose trained for decades.

Man, SW is great.

GL gave us sorry people the chance to seriously debate about fictional subjects that have only a mild connection to real life aspects.

Originally posted by Tangible God
Man, SW is great.

GL gave us sorry people the chance to seriously debate about fictional subjects that have only a mild connection to real life aspects.

LOL

Originally posted by Tangible God
Man, SW is great.

GL gave us sorry people the chance to seriously debate about fictional subjects that have only a mild connection to real life aspects.


glare Is that the best you can do?

Originally posted by Apex
glare Is that the best you can do? No, but I don't wanna get on ppl's bad side. We all know we're insane.

Originally posted by Apex
So your telling me Revan could learn way faster than Mace, Dooku, Yoda, Sidious, and Anakin. He learns faster than Anakin, someone made almost completely from the force?

Of course high potential can over ride age as shown by Yoda and Sidious in the movies, but Anakin couldn't out force Obi-Wan and he has a great connection to the force and also wanted to know everything, so what makes you think Revan can out force Dooku if Anakin couldn't. At one point you need time to get a better control over the force like Dooku, Yoda, Sidious, or Mace did. Anakin had all the potential but not enough time to really focus it, and what allows Revan time to control and focus it all if he's hording holocrons, fighting wars, and searching for the Star Forge?

Dooku beat Anakin with skill gained over the years and most people think he was toying with him the second time they fought which goes to show connection to the force isn't that much stronger than someone who has studied it for decades.

Here's an Example:
A new shaolin monk with great potential can't beat a grand master with little potential whose trained for decades.

Ok look Apex your a nice guy and are very respectful in your posts but dude your so bias towards movie characters that you could be Nefarous's brother. We know from Zhar that Revan learned at a incredibly fast rate and was always hungering for more knowlage and also Revan stuided the Sith holocrons on Korribon and Malachor V and learned their secrets as can see by the rate he corrupted Jedi.

If Revan was not very knowlagable in the Force then how did he become the Dark Lord in the first place hmm? Malak may have been a brute but he was skilled in the Dark Side and he was way below Revan in knowledge.

Revan as we see corrupted thousands of Jedi (proof for this can be found on the KOTOR II loading screen messages where it says that at the begining of the wars there were thousands of Jedi yet by the end there hardly a hundred because many were killed and many more were corrupted by Revan and sided with him.

Originally posted by Rayvann Sadow
Ok look Apex your a nice guy and are very respectful in your posts but dude your so bias towards movie characters that you could be Nefarous's brother. We know from Zhar that Revan learned at a incredibly fast rate and was always hungering for more knowlage and also Revan stuided the Sith holocrons on Korribon and Malachor V and learned their secrets as can see by the rate he corrupted Jedi.

If Revan was not very knowlagable in the Force then how did he become the Dark Lord in the first place hmm? Malak may have been a brute but he was skilled in the Dark Side and he was way below Revan in knowledge.

Revan as we see corrupted thousands of Jedi (proof for this can be found on the KOTOR II loading screen messages where it says that at the begining of the wars there were thousands of Jedi yet by the end there hardly a hundred because many were killed and many more were corrupted by Revan and sided with him.


All of that's great, and I'm not saying Revan isn't great or anything although that's what it looks like.

I'm just trying to keep it fair, I know somebody like you probably doesn't do this, but in the vs thread Mace and Dooku vs Revan, and Revan can beat them because he can use the force better than both of them as a team? That's bull. Revan may be great in the force but can't equal Dooku and Mace combined.

That's the reason I'm arguing about this. I didn't like that and this thread seemed like an appropriate place to post that, and I wrote it here instead of there. My bad for not making that clear in the first place. Something I tend to do, the whole point of this was just to show that Revan can't beat two of the best PT Jedi/Sith at one time.

And don't worry about making me mad, it's highly unlikely. If we worry about that which I tend to do, then the threads aren't interesting because people avoid good arguments not wanting to hurt other people's feelings. People have to understand that some people's opinion is different than theirs and respect that, not be so critical and think they're being attacked. If you keep it clean and logical and don't attack me, I don't have a problem with you deabating against me.

Originally posted by Darth_Janus
Yeah, I don't want hi to be god. I like him the way he is.
same same same

*Whistles* Force is strong in this one. That makes sense, but I'm still going to be careful of what I say: I'd rather the treads be uninteresting than start flaming.

As for False Gods. Whatever, I don't think I need to add anything. In my mind, anyone in the Star Wars Universe can be killed. They may live for a long time (yoda), but no one is invincible. I don't think the Force would allow it since it does seem to have a will and a sense of balance. I don't know, I should stop now, I'm babbling.....

Why do you people continue with this retarded thread????

Originally posted by Ogami Itto
Why do you people continue with this retarded thread????

Oh this is rich.

if its retardeed why post in it

see the supershadow thread

I do think this thread will only become totally settled when kotor3 gives us the answers until then its just up in the air. But still think Revan is cooler than Luke even in the end if he might not be as strong

Originally posted by Ogami Itto
see the supershadow thread

I think the distinct difference between this thread and the supershadow thread is that here people haven't posted over a thousand times venting their hatred at someone who probably doesn't exist or even care what anyone else thinks. I'm not saying this thread is exactly productive, but the Supershadow thread is the epiphany of unproductive.

Originally posted by Darth_Janus
I think the distinct difference between this thread and the supershadow thread is that here people haven't posted over a thousand times venting their hatred at someone who probably doesn't exist or even care what anyone else thinks. I'm not saying this thread is exactly productive, but the Supershadow thread is the epiphany of unproductive.

I think you mean epitome .

lol! I did. I was multitasking and it -of course- bit me in the ass.

Originally posted by Sorgo
Just because Revan and Malak and whoever are 4000 years older than Dooku and Vader and whoever...


DOES NOT ENABLE THEM AS GODS!

And i want proof that Malak is more powerful than Dooku or Vader or Sidious...


AND I want PROOF that Revan can kick Maul, Dooku Palpatine or Vaders shit up.


Hell, i WANT PROOF that Revan or Malak or any other ancient can kick Yoda, Windu or any other Jedi's ass!


C'MON, FANBOYS!


DO YOUR WORST!

OMG, I agree with the topic but this is ridiculous. You prove to me 100% for sure that Maul can beat ESB Luke, or that ROTS Mace can beat TPM Qui-Gon. YOU CAN'T. 99% of these versus battles require total speculation based off of accomplishments and many other things to try and determine who is more powerful but none of them are true facts. Some have a 99% chance but still aren't facts.

Jeez man, think before you post.

Originally posted by Apex
All of that's great, and I'm not saying Revan isn't great or anything although that's what it looks like.

I'm just trying to keep it fair, I know somebody like you probably doesn't do this, but in the vs thread Mace and Dooku vs Revan, and Revan can beat them because he can use the force better than both of them as a team? That's bull. Revan may be great in the force but can't equal Dooku and Mace combined.

That's the reason I'm arguing about this. I didn't like that and this thread seemed like an appropriate place to post that, and I wrote it here instead of there. My bad for not making that clear in the first place. Something I tend to do, the whole point of this was just to show that Revan can't beat two of the best PT Jedi/Sith at one time.

And don't worry about making me mad, it's highly unlikely. If we worry about that which I tend to do, then the threads aren't interesting because people avoid good arguments not wanting to hurt other people's feelings. People have to understand that some people's opinion is different than theirs and respect that, not be so critical and think they're being attacked. If you keep it clean and logical and don't attack me, I don't have a problem with you deabating against me.

I agree that it is doubtful even Revan has the raw Force power to equal Mace and Dooku combined. That seems to be a reasonable estimate given what we know of his powers thus far. But saying Revan can't beat the two best PT Force Users of all time is venturing into a speculation war without your fanny pack... Revan is, aside from the Exile, one of the largest 'unknowns' in regards to actual duelling ability and actual Force control (Although both atre supposed to be high end as opposed to low end) To say he couldn'y possibly defeat Dooku and Mace at once is a bit misleading; he can (as most people can) under favorable circumstances. ANd perhaps he is like Dooku in that he can use a little bit of distance to rain force hell on his opponents, which would work against their numerical advantage.

And the reason I say this is because you are essentially arguing that Revan himself most likely isn't higher in Force power than Dooku and Mace combined, and from what we know i tend to agree. But that's still a damn large margin there, and you have to keep in mind that a little bit of difference goes a long way. Look at Dooku versus Obi-Wan and Anakin. I highly doubt it that Dooku's Force powers were higher than Yoda's (That is as high as I will acede to for the sake of argument) And he schooled Obi-Wan and Anakin many times. Supposively, even Dooku was weaker in Force potential than Skywalker. So it would be pointless to say that person A can't beat B and C because A's Force powers don't equal double of B and C. Dooku is a very clear example of how a very small advantage in divided Force powers can make the battle go in his favor.

in the words of Rock-pop gods the Beatles, "Let it be" anyone at anypoint can beat anyone under any cercumstances. nothing is definate.

edited: Except death of course.

Originally posted by jedihuh?
in the words of Rock-pop gods the Beatles, "Let it be" anyone at anypoint can beat anyone under any cercumstances. nothing is definate.

edited: Except death of course.

Ah, but can you be so certain? We define death in very limited ways, as we don't fully understand it. If death is lack of brain capacity and function past a certain point, then you could argue that someone kept "alive" with only their brain was never dead.

Originally posted by Darth_Janus
I agree that it is doubtful even Revan has the raw Force power to equal Mace and Dooku combined. That seems to be a reasonable estimate given what we know of his powers thus far. But saying Revan can't beat the two best PT Force Users of all time is venturing into a speculation war without your fanny pack... Revan is, aside from the Exile, one of the largest 'unknowns' in regards to actual duelling ability and actual Force control (Although both atre supposed to be high end as opposed to low end) To say he couldn'y possibly defeat Dooku and Mace at once is a bit misleading; he can (as most people can) under favorable circumstances. ANd perhaps he is like Dooku in that he can use a little bit of distance to rain force hell on his opponents, which would work against their numerical advantage.

And the reason I say this is because you are essentially arguing that Revan himself most likely isn't higher in Force power than Dooku and Mace combined, and from what we know i tend to agree. But that's still a damn large margin there, and you have to keep in mind that a little bit of difference goes a long way. Look at Dooku versus Obi-Wan and Anakin. I highly doubt it that Dooku's Force powers were higher than Yoda's (That is as high as I will acede to for the sake of argument) And he schooled Obi-Wan and Anakin many times. Supposively, even Dooku was weaker in Force potential than Skywalker. So it would be pointless to say that person A can't beat B and C because A's Force powers don't equal double of B and C. Dooku is a very clear example of how a very small advantage in divided Force powers can make the battle go in his favor.

I didn't mean the best two, just two of the best of the PT, and yes Revan may very well succeed, but his chances of succeess appear to be smaller than that of Dooku and Mace combined. I tend not to give Revan full credit because we don't actually see him in action(Which is a bias I need to rid myself of) we just play with him, and gain abilities which are game mechanics, but if we actually saw Revan in battle then we could have a better view of how he would perform in battle.

Originally posted by Apex
I didn't mean the best two, just two of the best of the PT, and yes Revan may very well succeed, but his chances of succeess appear to be smaller than that of Dooku and Mace combined. I tend not to give Revan full credit because we don't actually see him in action(Which is a bias I need to rid myself of) we just play with him, and gain abilities which are game mechanics, but if we actually saw Revan in battle then we could have a better view of how he would perform in battle.

I agree with you on that. I hope Revan is in more cutscenes and FMVs from now on. If anything, playing as him was rather stupid, since the powers and such were so limited on the original KOTOR, and the dialogue could be pretty stupid at times; not reflective of someone capable of anything higher than ninth grade thought.

Originally posted by Darth_Janus
I agree with you on that. I hope Revan is in more cutscenes and FMVs from now on. If anything, playing as him was rather stupid, since the powers and such were so limited on the original KOTOR, and the dialogue could be pretty stupid at times; not reflective of someone capable of anything higher than ninth grade thought.


I concur, if we had more scences of him in action one on one, one on two, and he faired well against his competition he would probably gain more of my support. They just made the game and said Revan was great and didn't show us how, they just told us. When it comes to SW we have to see how, we didn't settle for just knowing Darth Vader was a great Jedi Lucas showed us how with the PT. Hopefully in the next game if you're not him they'll show him in action in some of his earlier fights.

Flashbacks would be nice. Or they could milk the hit with "Knights of the Old Republic: The Mandalorian Wars" series. I'd buy them.

Same here. Though it would be difficult do create, even for bioware.

Not at all. They could let their subcompany of Obsidian deal with one series while they focus with another. The real problem comes from Lucasarts, which has a tendency to shove up deadlines and is mainly responsible for KOTOR II being an incomplete game.

Damn, I'm finally done with phonecalls at work and no one's on here.

Originally posted by Darth_Janus
Damn, I'm finally done with phonecalls at work and no one's on here.

Lol I have been busy playing Balder's Gate II

For PC? Have you already beaten it yet?

Originally posted by Darth_Janus
For PC? Have you already beaten it yet?

As an Evil character yes and I also beat the Throne of Bhaal as evil. Of course I chose to become the next lord of Murder. Thats what I hated about the books is how Abdel just gave up his divine power. He could have been a god! And he threw it away the moron! So still that ass Cyric is still the Lord of Muder canoticly(however that is spelled) I also hated how Jaheria died I mean everyone practicly dies except for Abdel. What shit is that?

Well anyways now I am playing it through as a good character.

Those novels sucked worse than having herpes and being locked in the Playboy mansion.

And I've beaten the original, as good, but never Throne of Bhaal. I lost interest after awhile. Second edition rules are really bland.

Death is death, the person seases to be. there is no more, and trust me you can tell when a person is dead, even if they still have a heart beat and just the machines are keeping them breathing, you can tell when their soal or aura or w/e you want to call it has left them.
that kinda makes me sound psychoitc, but its just that I saw my dad on a machine and you could tell he was gone. its hard to explain, and im babling so I'll stop.

Ceases--Soul--Phsycotic--Babbling.

Yet, I would never consider being an English teacher.

ya I suck at spelling never said I was anygood. you obviously knew what it ment tho. and thanks because I really had no clue how to speal ceases or phsycotic, and now I do.

Spell

(coughs)

Way off topic; closed.