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My two favourite superhero teams and hopefully yours fihting it out.
Here are the battles tell me if this is close I'm trying to make it as fair as possible

Wildcat Wolverine
Hourman II Puck
Atom Smasher Sasquatch
Dr.Fate Talisman
Stargirl Vindicator
Mr.Terrific II Guardian
Sand Madison Jefferies (Box IV)
Green Lantern Shaman
Flash Northstar
Hawkman Snowbird
Hawkgirl Auroa

If its not fair and Alpha Flight has a big lead add Powergirl and if the JSA has a big lead take away star girls Cosmic Rod so she just has her Converter Belt (I think thats what its called)

Yeah I have to really think about this, tough call. I'm just about to post some more scans in the AF respect thread

wait is it a team match or are the people listed 1 vs 1 ing ?

well its not 1 vs 1 battles but I set it up that way to make the post smaller and also to just compare the members you can do the 1 vs 1 thing to figure out which team wins. Also King Mungi over anyone else looking at this I can't find the Alpha Flight Respect Thread and I'm the one that posted it can some tell me how to get to it I searched the forum but it didn't come up and the archives confuse me.

Wildcat Wolverine. Wolverine
Hourman II Puck. Puck has more experiance
Atom Smasher Sasquatch. Sasquatch
Dr.Fate Talisman. Dr.Fate
Stargirl Vindicator. Stargirl
Mr.Terrific II Guardian. Guardian
Sand Madison Jefferies (Box IV). Box
Green Lantern Shaman. too close
Flash Northstar. Flash
Hawkman Snowbird. Snowbird one word WENDIGO!
Hawkgirl Auroa. Auora

I might be wrong just put done your opinion

Flash takes most of the other team himself.

Originally posted by Juntai
Flash takes most of the other team himself.

yeah after all he is the second fastest man alive.

Northstar and Aurora are capable of going 99% the speed of light, don't count them out. Plus they could blind him with their light attacks or hypntoize him.

Yay. If they want rip themselves to sparse molecules and kill their teammates along with them.

But seriously Flight's most powerful members are nullifed by the JSA's most powerful members and the Flash can just steal the other team's speed, and then lend speed to his teammates for a lightspeed beat-down.

Originally posted by Draco69
Yay. If they want rip themselves to sparse molecules and kill their teammates along with them.

Sure, but they can reach upper levels without harming themselves or the environment.

Originally posted by Draco69
But seriously Flight's most powerful members are nullifed by the JSA's most powerful members and the Flash can just steal the other team's speed, and then lend speed to his teammates for a lightspeed beat-down.

Not really, Talisman is Dr.Strange level and with Flash the wonder twins can emit a light to blind or hypnotize him and get Flash to fight his teammates.

I still havn't decided who wins yet, but what I am saying is give AF more credit.

Originally posted by King_Mungi
Sure, but they can reach upper levels without harming themselves or the environment.

True. Too bad their "upper levels" is a snail's pace compared to the Garrick.



Originally posted by King_Mungi
Not really, Talisman is Dr.Strange level

So is Dr. Fate. Except far more experienced, more powerful and more far more resources at his disposal.

Originally posted by King_Mungi
and with Flash the wonder twins can emit a light to blind or hypnotize him and get Flash to fight his teammates.

Could happen. But incredibly unlikely. This is a far more plausible scenario: Flash steals their speed by looking at them. Flash is now 100 times faster than he was before.

Originally posted by King_Mungi
I still havn't decided who wins yet, but what I am saying is give AF more credit.

I am giving them credit. But only DUE credit. They simply don't have what it takes to take down the JSA.

They can take down the Avengers though...

Originally posted by Draco69
True. Too bad their "upper levels" is a snail's pace compared to the Garrick.

So is Dr. Fate. Except far more experienced, more powerful and more far more resources at his disposal.

Could happen. But incredibly unlikely. This is a far more plausible scenario: Flash steals their speed by looking at them. Flash is now 100 times faster than he was before.

I am giving them credit. But only DUE credit. They simply don't have what it takes to take down the JSA.

They can take down the Avengers though...

Bah! Jay is having problems taping into the speed force lately and his stamina isn't as good due to his old age.

Hector Hall is just learning himself, he is the new Dr.Fate. Talisman could actually form a green glob like she did against Calibur and make Nabu's helmet vanish.

He is not as skilled with the speed force as Wally. He cannot do that easily.

Not really, if it is one. vs one. I would say the matches would be pretty even (Guardian would beat Stargirl or Box just manipulate her staff though.). Most of the AF members fly, so it's not like Jay can easily touch anyone.

Originally posted by King_Mungi
Bah! Jay is having problems taping into the speed force lately and his stamina isn't as good due to his old age.

Which was resolved...4 months ago. .

Originally posted by King_Mungi
Hector Hall is just learning himself, he is the new Dr.Fate.

For about a decade....not mentioning his numerous transdimensional trips that can span eons...

Originally posted by King_Mungi
Talisman could actually form a green glob like she did against Calibur and make Nabu's helmet vanish.

Highly unlikely. Impossible even. Dr. Fate will just blink her puny excuse for a spell and kibosh her with the energies of Shumatar.

And if she DOES somehow, someway remove it. Dr. Fate can just summon it back with a thought.

Originally posted by King_Mungi
He is not as skilled with the speed force as Wally. He cannot do that easily.

True he's not as experienced in the speed force. But in everything else all bets are off. He's done it numerous times before. Particularly during the Black Adam. He did show strain but seriously he can do it without any problems whatsoever.

Originally posted by King_Mungi
Not really, if it is one. vs one. I would say the matches would be pretty even

Hardly. I can only see three possible wins in the chart...

Originally posted by King_Mungi
(Guardian would beat Stargirl or Box just manipulate her staff though.).

Guardian beating Stargirl?! What kind of.... Her Star rod would reduce him to ashes. It's one of the most powerful artifacts in the universe. She's not as experienced but in this case she doesn't NEED to be.

And now way in hell could Box manipulate the rod if Doctor Polaris, Lex Luthor II and even Brainiac all failed miserably.

Originally posted by King_Mungi
(Most of the AF members fly, so it's not like Jay can easily touch anyone.

According to forum rules all characters with flight start off on the ground. Which means Snowbird and numerous other characters go down via speedblitz. Even if they were in the air in the beginning, Garrick can simply run on air currents and blitz them OR he can charge a piece of debris with speedforce and throw it at lightspeed and watch their heads explode like melons.

I won't even go into Green Lantern who could take the down team by his lonesome.

talismans like a walking minjor, she can easily absorb any type of magic, and she is also on stranges level of magic. anything fate does, she could absorb.

Anything Talisman does, Fate can do better. Anything Talisman absorbs, Fate will use the Arc of Nbantu to retrieve.

Believe it or not, the helmet is NOT the only artifact Fate has access to. Ya know that big tower he lives in? With entire dimensions as room? Guess what's in 'em..

It's amazing how underestimated Hector Hall is.

JSA wins this at least 7/10. So many dangerous people on that team.

Originally posted by Draco69
Which was resolved...4 months ago. .

For about a decade....not mentioning his numerous transdimensional trips that can span eons...

Highly unlikely. Impossible even. Dr. Fate will just blink her puny excuse for a spell and kibosh her with the energies of Shumatar.

And if she DOES somehow, someway remove it. Dr. Fate can just summon it back with a thought.

True he's not as experienced in the speed force. But in everything else all bets are off. He's done it numerous times before. Particularly during the Black Adam. He did show strain but seriously he can do it without any problems whatsoever.


Hardly. I can only see three possible wins in the chart...

Guardian beating Stargirl?! What kind of.... Her Star rod would reduce him to ashes. It's one of the most powerful artifacts in the universe. She's not as experienced but in this case she doesn't NEED to be.

And now way in hell could Box manipulate the rod if Doctor Polaris, Lex Luthor II and even Brainiac all failed miserably.

According to forum rules all characters with flight start off on the ground. Which means Snowbird and numerous other characters go down via speedblitz. Even if they were in the air in the beginning, Garrick can simply run on air currents and blitz them OR he can charge a piece of debris with speedforce and throw it at lightspeed and watch their heads explode like melons.

I won't even go into Green Lantern who could take the down team by his lonesome.

I guarntee that the problem will start again.

Talisman is the Indian's jesus, she was even sucked into Shaman's pouch where he gets all his magical objects from. Hell, both her and Strange have worked together opening up realms to battle other people with.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/AlphaFlight020Page10.jpg

Now your giving Fate way to much credit. If anything this match would probally end up as a stalemate.
If he does lose it, that can give Talsiman plenty of time to react and get the spirits to do whatever she wants to him.

The thing is it is hard to steal speed from a object that isn't moving and just floating by lighting up the area. Plus they are flying so what is he going to do to them?

Guardian has taken down Galactus on his own, and he can manipulate the electronegativity and actually take down her shiled down.
He manipulates metal on a molecular level.

He sure did, but does he do it at the start of fights? nope. Besides he has to contend with two speedsters who can hypnotize him or even putting him to sleep.

Oh name them.

Bwahaha what? that is so out of character from them. Guardian, the twins, Shaman (floats), always are flying. They rarely touch ground if they are on a mission or ready to fight. Once again Jay is not that skilled with the speedforce and how often does he even do that? rarely.

Nope, Shaman could shrink him down to size or suck him into his poutch. That would be a good fight. You definetly are not giving them enough credit.

edit: I have to go to work, but I will continue this later.

I have finally deiced on who wins this bout.....the JSA. The reason is they have tons more experience than AF and most importantly, which wins them this fight is they work together better and overall a stronger team. They have been together for years, while AF's roster keeps changing so they don't have the same connection as the JSA do.

My point with Draco is don't underestimate AF since they are indeed strong.

Originally posted by King_Mungi
I guarntee that the problem will start again.

He's old. Whattya expect?

Originally posted by King_Mungi
Talisman is the Indian's jesus, she was even sucked into Shaman's pouch where he gets all his magical objects from. Hell, both her and Strange have worked together opening up realms to battle other people with.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v118/Nidaime-Sama/AlphaFlight020Page10.jpg

That's nice. A pouch...and? Seriously. Talisman is limited to her tribe's magical prowess. Fate...isn't limited at all. If it's magic. He can do it. And Nabu will just tell him a nifty way to nullify all Talisman powers anyhoo.

Originally posted by King_Mungi
Now your giving Fate way to much credit. If anything this match would probally end up as a stalemate.

You're not giving Fate not nearly ENOUGH credit. This guy who goes toe to toe with the Starheart, Spectre and even 5th dimensional imps on a regular basis. Talisman simply doesnt' have his repitoire.

Originally posted by King_Mungi
If he does lose it, that can give Talsiman plenty of time to react and get the spirits to do whatever she wants to him.

Again. He's NOT gonna lose it. Seriously that helmet is crazy-glued on like nobody's business. Even DoV Spectre couldn't get it off.

Originally posted by King_Mungi
The thing is it is hard to steal speed from a object that isn't moving and just floating by lighting up the area.

Everything that is capable of motion, stationary or not, is connected to the speedforce. Which means he can turn the AF into statues.

Originally posted by King_Mungi
Plus they are flying so what is he going to do to them?

Throw a million kinetic grenades at lightspeed. Freeze them. Run on air currents up to them. Unleash speedforce energy at them. Tons of options. You think Garrick hasn't faced flying foes before.

Originally posted by King_Mungi
Guardian has taken down Galactus on his own, and he can manipulate the electronegativity and actually take down her shiled down.

If you're gonna refer to SvFL event....


Originally posted by King_Mungi
He manipulates metal on a molecular level.

So can Doctor Polaris. And he failed. So can Triumph. And he failed.

Originally posted by King_Mungi
He sure did, but does he do it at the start of fights? nope.

Why not? He did it to an army of trolls.

Originally posted by King_Mungi
Besides he has to contend with two speedsters who can hypnotize him or even putting him to sleep.

Two speedsters who ridiculously slower than him due to limitations. Two speedsters who will seem stone-statued compared to him. And two speedsters who will look like tasty morsels for him to steal their speed...


Originally posted by King_Mungi
Oh name them.

Wildcat Wolverine
Mr.Terrific II Guardian
Hawkgirl Auroa

That's about it. AF would most likely win these matchs..but the others are curbstomps.


Originally posted by King_Mungi
Bwahaha what? that is so out of character from them. Guardian, the twins, Shaman (floats), always are flying. They rarely touch ground if they are on a mission or ready to fight.

*shrugs* Forum rules...

Originally posted by King_Mungi
Once again Jay is not that skilled with the speedforce and how often does he even do that? rarely.

If you actually read the Flash comics and the JSA...

Read his feats against Black Flash and Zoom. He was pulling out all sorts of speedforce techs. And this bloodlust. Which means Flash will go at max.

Unless you're going by the popular bias that DC PIS/CIS is allowed while Marvel PIS/CIS IS allowed....

Originally posted by King_Mungi
Nope, Shaman could shrink him down to size or suck him into his poutch.

Oh. Yes. Shrinking him would do the trick The guy can recreate worlds on a whim, tap into ANY magical resouvir in the mulitverse and do anything imaginable with his ring...but a trapping him in a pouch would do the trick? No. It's gonna take more than a two-bit Cherokee with magical fairy dust to take down Alan.

Originally posted by King_Mungi
That would be a good fight.

Sure. For about two or three minutes. Even shorter if Alan simply doesn't feel like fighting and wipes them from existence...

Originally posted by King_Mungi
You definetly are not giving them enough credit.

You're giving them TOO much credit. It's nice to see a AF supporter for once but don't let logic get in the way of devotion.

Originally posted by Draco69
He's old. Whattya expect?

That's nice. A pouch...and? Seriously. Talisman is limited to her tribe's magical prowess. Fate...isn't limited at all. If it's magic. He can do it. And Nabu will just tell him a nifty way to nullify all Talisman powers anyhoo.

You're not giving Fate not nearly ENOUGH credit. This guy who goes toe to toe with the Starheart, Spectre and even 5th dimensional imps on a regular basis. Talisman simply doesnt' have his repitoire.

Again. He's NOT gonna lose it. Seriously that helmet is crazy-glued on like nobody's business. Even DoV Spectre couldn't get it off.

Everything that is capable of motion, stationary or not, is connected to the speedforce. Which means he can turn the AF into statues.

Throw a million kinetic grenades at lightspeed. Freeze them. Run on air currents up to them. Unleash speedforce energy at them. Tons of options. You think Garrick hasn't faced flying foes before.

If you're gonna refer to SvFL event....


So can Doctor Polaris. And he failed. So can Triumph. And he failed.

Why not? He did it to an army of trolls.

Two speedsters who ridiculously slower than him due to limitations. Two speedsters who will seem stone-statued compared to him. And two speedsters who will look like tasty morsels for him to steal their speed...


Wildcat Wolverine
Mr.Terrific II Guardian
Hawkgirl Auroa

That's about it. AF would most likely win these matchs..but the others are curbstomps.


*shrugs* Forum rules...

If you actually read the Flash comics and the JSA...

Read his feats against Black Flash and Zoom. He was pulling out all sorts of speedforce techs. And this bloodlust. Which means Flash will go at max.

Unless you're going by the popular bias that DC PIS/CIS is allowed while Marvel PIS/CIS IS allowed....


Oh. Yes. Shrinking him would do the trick The guy can recreate worlds on a whim, tap into ANY magical resouvir in the mulitverse and do anything imaginable with his ring...but a trapping him in a pouch would do the trick? No. It's gonna take more than a two-bit Cherokee with magical fairy dust to take down Alan.

Sure. For about two or three minutes. Even shorter if Alan simply doesn't feel like fighting and wipes them from existence...

You're giving them TOO much credit. It's nice to see a AF supporter for once but don't let logic get in the way of devotion.

She learned new mystic attacks, and no she isn't. She can gather any Native American artificat and use it. You can't nullify her powers unless you take the talisman off, but they are one in the same now.

Talisman is the same level as Strange who has stalemated the IG, beat In-Betweener, Moondragon, etc. Once again your underestimating her.

Huh? he never tried to take it off. He sucked Hector into the helmet and closed it up trapping him in the helmet's universe. He was not trying at all to remove it

What? I have even seen Wally try to steal speed for an not moving object and was uneffective. The speedforce is not even in the Marvel universe

Once again does Jay frequnetly do all this? no not at all. He mostly just charges head first into a battle.

Naaaa, they have a better chance than that. However, there isn't even a point debating due to I think JSA would win.

If that's the case than I concede Box could not either. I trust your right. I have not read that issue.

and?...that's not exactally a shining example he does that right from the start of fights

They can still go 99% of light speed or close to it, but would cause them and the environment harm. Since it is bloodlust I don't see why they wouldn't do it. Northstar has an ego.

Actually I do have a great deal number of JSA and Flash comics. Hell, when Jay met Zoom again he was quickly beaten and used to power the treadmill [Black Flash is the one of the best looking "death" personna". If it was bloodlust Shaman or Talisman could enter people's mind and do whatever. Shaman is capable of doing this, but he swore he would never alter a persons mind.

When he shrinks them and sticks him in the bag, not even Talisman could get out without the Stranger helping. He has shown to take other people's magic, but he has not been shown to do this much so not sure if he can still do this. He even has the power to banish people to different dimensions

i thought his full-strength was downgraded, since they made him to strong.

No, check most of the recent threads. I have stated multiple times Sasquatch would lose certain battles (Hercules, Juggernaut) and even said they would lose this fight. Get your facts straight.