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Anakin turnng to the darkside, is it his own fault? We have seen him disobey qgj - almost, ob1 literally, maybe he wants the darkside, he seemed to enjoy killing all the sand people, he looked happy when talking to palpatine, he openly tries to disobey the jedi code, was the only way to bring the foce into balance to go from the lightside to the darkside to the lightside?

No. The whole point is that Anakin turned evil of his own free will, even though he had good intentions along the way- the road to Hell, you know?

Letting his emotions run unbridled ... and acting according to them, without thinking about where that would make him end up.

I don't think that its fair that they pinned it on Obi-Wan. What I wonder is what did Obi-Wan do to make Anakin so mad?

Sadly, having never seen his training of Anakin his exact mistakes were unclear.

But if we assume that Anakin fell because he was impatient, over-confident, brash, arrogant and could not control his emotions, in the final analysis bale for that falls on his Master.

But yes, it IS unfair. Obi-Wan clearly warns the Council about the problem and they do nothing. Odd.

"He believes I'm too unpredictable..."
"It's worse... he's overly critical. He never listens! He just doesn't understand!"
well, that's just a tip of the iceberg ofcourses

Its his own fault that hes a whiny litte punk

Whininess runs in his family; quite frankly Anakin's criticisms of his own Master don't impress me at all.

Anakin: He never listens to me! It isn't fair!

Luke: I'm never going to get out of here! It just isn't fair!

well, there are more tiny things of that wich "link" with the OT

" "

Actually, I agree with Ush. So the answer to your question is: yes, it is Anakin's fault, he chooses for it.

This is actually where it tiesin nicely with the OT, where Luke faces the same choice and he chooses differently with his father's terrifying example as guide.

I think the path starts way back in episode I. First he is taken away his mother left in bondage. Then in front of the Jedi council...

YODA: Hmm... how feel you?

ANAKIN: Cold, sir.

YODA: Afraid are you?

ANAKIN: No, sir.

YODA: See through you, we can.

MACE WINDU: Be mindful of your feelings...

KI-ADI: Your thoughts dwell on your mother.

ANAKIN: I miss her.

YODA: Afraid to lose her... I think, hmm?

ANAKIN: (a little angry) What's that got to do with anything?

YODA: Everything. Fear is the path to the dark side... fear leads to anger... anger leads to hate.. hate leads to suffering... I sense much fear in you.

Even still in episode II Anakin's ego is getting the best of him. The death of his mother does not help. The massacre of the Sand People reminded me of the scene in Lawrence of Arabia where they massacred the retreating Turkish army 'Take no prisoners!!!'. Like Lawrence as much as Anakin abhorred killing he very much enjoyed the power to do it.

Hmmm, I understand what you're trying to say. But I don't have the same feeling, Lawrence is quite different.

GL said that if you would be Anakin you would do the same thing, so give it a rest and think y'all would be Sith Lords

Oh I know....

Then again, Luke didn't turn.

ow yes, king of the winers didn't turn; jolly

Should appeal to you.

the king part? definitly

I wouldn't've done it.

i think it is possible to blame other people other than anakin. i wouldn't say it was ob1's fault, if i were to blame amyone it would be the council and qgj. see how you feel when you hear that you're the chosen one and the greatest jedi that there will ever be. if that wouldn't make you big headed and egotisititical then what would. Palpatine just massaged these emotions and showed anakin the route to take.
it is not possible to just blame anakin or ob1 or th council, i think there were a lot of contributing factors, not least padme looking so fit and tempting anakin to break the code.

They contributed, but Anakin made the choice.

"He has to choose his own path, no one can choose it for him." - Leia Organa

I'd prefer to say that he was pushed down the road as oposed to just simply walking it.

He was faced with certain circumstances and people and he made a choice. Simple as that.

i wanna believe it was his choice, makes anakin so much cooler, less dependant and defines much more his strong character.

It losesd all impact if it is not clearly something Anakin does of his free will. Otherwise what we have here is something closer to a possession than a genuine turning to evil, which is far more rubbish.

There was a fork in the road and Anakin chose his path. Sure there was something someone could've done to change his mind, but it was his choice and therefore his fault.

OB1 did, if we are to believe ROTJ: "Luke, I once believed as you did."

Did he actually say that? I can't remember. I remember Vader saying he once thought like that, though (he being Obi-Wan, not Vader, which would be silly).

nah, OB1 said it in RotJ when they were talking about Luke confronting Vader. It was about Luke with the "There is still good in him, I've felt it"

Vader says it too. I have no reason to believe he was lying there. And how can OB1 NOT try to bring his padawan back to the light side. That seems rather obvious.

watched RotJ a few days ago, but I think I got it wrong, don't think that OB1 said it... Vader did though "OB1 once thought as you did"
EpIII related, I think

It's in the script though. Doesn't that count at least a little bit?

here are the lines:

LUKE
There's still good in him.
BEN
I also thought he could be turned back to the good side. It couldn't be done. He is more machine now than man. Twisted and evil.
LUKE
I can't do it, Ben.

Counts a little bit, but we all know that ain't good enough these days. Especially the bits that were cut out of THAT conversation.

Obviosuly he DID think that way but literally speaking we do only have Vader's word for it.

and what's wrong with believing him on this one?

Nothing.

so it's going to make EpIII?

no, its not Obi-Wans fault that Anakin turned to the dark side...but, at the time, they were in the middle of the clone war, he was weak and beaten down at the time and they offered him to turn to the dark side to keep his life, he really didn't have a choice so he did...but it was definately NOT Obi-Wans fault, but Obi-Wan did blame himself for Anakin not being trained enough and turning to the dark side *wow, i admitted something bad about anakin and something good about obi-wan, and this is coming from the girl who would give her life for him, a character, well...i would for hayden too, but i wont go there now*

Have you ever considered reality therapy?

Sarea goes for film characters eh? Interesting...

ROTJ - Vader said "Obi Wan once thought as you do" to Luke. Thats how it went.

Yes? So? I think we passed that.

Well I just had to throw my 2cents in. Why isn't there a cents symbol on this stupid keyboard ?

Probably because Yerss made the keyboard. He only deals in dollars ...

Yes yes professor, but my point was, at any rate, cents do not enter the picture ....

of course not! sense+yerssot? ha!

If you want to say something in cents, then you go $.02

I prefer girls actually

You sure?

not really... hate them too... so ...let's say I'm still in denial

Thought so.

no comment

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight.

ok...wat i said before came out really wrong...i dont go for characters, wat i should have said was that i would give my life for HAYDEN..i was tired and having a really blonde day...

VERY blonde day.

Magnificently blonde.

i have blonde days too often...i think i should dye my hair blonde

Don't! At least real blondes can't be blamed for being blonde. Choosing to BE blonde really makes me doubt your intelligence.

woohoo!

wat intelligence?

Hey look, honesty.

well, hey, its tru, i have no inteligence

Is that Anakin's fault too?

no, GL's

is what anakin fault corran? if ur talking about me having no inteligence, no, thats not anakins fault, thats haydens fault, but, i dont miss my mind that much, id go crazy if i was told that i wasnt allowed to watch nething with hayden in it or ever look at his pic. again (especially cause hes in SW)but, no my lack of intelligence is not anakins fault, it is haydens...and im hyper and its 11:22 at night, i got up a 6 am too, so if i am being annoying, remember, its not my fault, its because of lack of sleep...

You're blonde and you have no intelligence? Better send us a pic of you then.

im not blonde, i just should be blonde...

I'm not dumb, but I bump into things a lot. Does that mean I should be blonde?

sounds like me...

No that's just clumsy.

umm...i dunno, but i bump into things alot too...especially tables for some reason

you're a midget?

no...lol, i never said i hit my head on the table, i just kinda walk into it cause i never pay attention to where im walking...

must be a girl thing... my sister always destroyed my toys that way!

i never said i destroyed things, except for the puzzle the other say, but my mom left the water on the table, and it tipped over, ruining the puzzle, the thing was, it was mine, so i had to replace it because it was an SW puzzle...

all sisters are bad!

but i dont even have any siblings, except for in my fake family, but im not gonna search them out and destroy their stufff, y would i want to??...

because they're very very evil

hey! my "siblings" r not evil! except for clara and ester...but i wont go there, and jena, well, i got mad at her for LAH, and i was a little mad at natalie for AOTC for a while, ok, maybe i hated her (before lari corrects me), but still, i wouldnt destroy their things...and now ive gone crazy because in reality i am in no way related to these people, as far as i kno neway...

oh believe me! they're very very evil!!

Hey, I'm a sister!

yea! and im a sister too (well, in my fakefamily, not in reality, but still)!!...

ah, my point still stands

Okidokey, can we return this one on-topic, please?

What was the topic again?

sisters dont destroy things, ok, not like ive met the people in my fake family or anything, but the only stuff ive destroyed was my own, and i was always by mistake...

umm...i think the topic was if it was anakins fault that he turned to the dark side or not, which it wasnt, er, not completely neway...

Of course it was his fault. He made the decision. I'm pretty sure that nobody held a gun to his head and said turn to the darkside or die. Even then he should've chosen death.

There is a growing trend to think that Anakin was somehow 'fooled' into becoming evil. I hope to God this is not so; the whole story loses its power if he did not turn evil out of his own free will.

anyway, if he didnt chose out of his own free will, y would he have stayed with the dark side for soo many years??

"Once you start down the dark path, forever will it dominate your destiny" - Yoda in ESB. Hope that answers your question.

You have some extensive sig line there, Sabrea.

well y did he choose the dark side in the first place?!?! isnt there like a jedi saying 'kill me and i will become even more powerful' or something like that???

WHY he chose for the dark side is what we'll find out in EpIII. I think he just wants his way and the Jedi don't like everything Anakin wants.

And the person who said that line was OB1, referring to his newly acquired disappearing act, which is also to be explained in EpIII.

well, Anakin going bad with killing the tuskens was the first step

Exactly. He chose to do that himself as well.

yea, well, he did that because of his mother...but that wasnt the right thing to do, anyway, ur not supposed to get attatched to any1...

that's he's too old, so you could say it's qgj's fault

yea, u could say that...but if qgj hadnt found anakin, then there eould br no plot to SW, there would be no luke and leia, or darth vader...

Too late I guess... yet he chose that path and there's always a reason to go bad. That's the entire point GL is trying to make.

But was that the whole reason?

Oh no.... that is typically female to say such a thing.

This information has been donated by Raptor Master. I can't confirm or deny if it's true, but it sounded good, so I am putting it up.


This is what he sent me:

"I have read part of a top secret copy of the Episode III screenplay. In it, Anakin falls into a lava pit while fighting Obi-Wan (lightsaber battle). The Emperor rescues him in the form of 5 monks, and gives him the suit if he promises to serve him. Anakin says he will only if he can see Amidala for one last time. The Emperor conjures up a fake image of the Jedi killing Amidala. Anakin becomes so angry he destroys the holo cube with his lightsaber and becomes Darth Vader.
At the very end, Obi-Wan leaves Luke with his brother Owen, and walks off into the deserts of Tatooine."

Thing is George just started writing the story so how can there be any screenplays???

Finti hits the nail on the head there... of course, there are some broad strokes that are known that could, at the edges of probability, have been exposed, but a screenplay? Non, monsieur.

just found it on a sw site... kill him

What's that supposed to mean?

it means.....aaaa....look! SUPERMAN!
*drags queeq away while lauren's not looking*

GL has bits and pieces of Ep.III writen already, ive already read some of it, its gonna be a good movie...

you read it, yeah right.... and you are what? shadow on the wall

no, i got it from a website...

post the link here

if i can find it again, if not try going to google.com and type in Star Wars Episode IIIin the search bar, thats how i found it...

what's with Obi?

i dont kno, i just went into my SW folder and clicked on a pic. to attatch, it was labled '3-' and i had no clue wat it was...

i have about 2500 pics in my sw folder.....it's hard to pic just one.

That's a good picture of Anakin

no, it's ugly

evry pic. of anakin is a good one, maybe not when jake played anakin, but when hayden did...i cant even find any pics. of jake now, only when ep.I came out internet these days...

the amaizing anakin

i cannot believe u did that!!!! poor anakin *hugs her anakin bear*...

whaaat?...he looks better. Kinda like a tusken rider without the helmet thinggie

Ok, I think this here thread has done its task... closing.