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Just a note to anyone who saw xpac's thread on here, about atheiests. I am christian but I respect other religions. What xpac did really hurt the christian religion here on KMC. I just wana say that he was outta line and I hope no one looks down on Christians. This is pretty stupid but I wanted to say it so people would reliase that not all christians are like that. And, also, I know this is a waste of space but I wanted to put it.

Calling attention to his stupidity only keeps that stupidity going. It's been closed and he's been banned, why bring it up again?

Because I feel the need. He really f***ed up with it and I wanted to note it.

Why do you respect other religions when your Bible tells you that Jesus is the only way and unbelievers are going to hell?

I know that all Christians aren't like that. No prob. Many of my friends are Christians.

Originally posted by Punker69
Why do you respect other religions when your Bible tells you that Jesus is the only way and unbelievers are going to hell?

For just a moment, I thought there were good Christian, then this person posted.

I know there are good Christians, but there are bad ones.

If you go around putting forth evil, evil is what you will receive.

People who judge will be judged.

Originally posted by Punker69
Why do you respect other religions when your Bible tells you that Jesus is the only way and unbelievers are going to hell?

That's an awesome philosophy.

My Bible says Christians are going to hell, while 6 of my closest friends and I are the only ones allowed in heaven.

Have fun being sodomized by Satan.

Originally posted by Punker69
Why do you respect other religions when your Bible tells you that Jesus is the only way and unbelievers are going to hell?

What the hell?

What a ****ing Nazi.

Originally posted by MC Mike
What the hell?

What a ****ing Nazi.

That guy is seriously deluded.

I once knew a Christian radical. He wouldn't listen to reason in a debate or argument. Kinda dimmed my respect towards the religion.

I once took a bite out of an apple that had a worm in it. It kind of dimmed my opinion of fruit.

Never had that problem.

Kudos to Punker69 for religious intolerance.

http://img85.imageshack.us/img85/3276/daqueen0pw.jpg

Jesus says watch Star Trek! Star Wars fans are infidels and will be banished to Galaxis Prime Zoidia for their nonbelieving!

Originally posted by MC Mike
What the hell?

What a ****ing Nazi.

He's a strict constructionist of the Bible. That's one issue I don't really understand about Christians. They have a book they claim was written by God, or at least written by Scribes who spoke with God. So why are some parts of it (those parts that are morally acceptable in society) unquestioned gospel, and other parts not worth bringing up.

What the guy said isn't false. The bible does say that Jesus is the only method of salvation.

Originally posted by Illustrious
What the guy said isn't false. The bible does say that Jesus is the only method of salvation.

But the way he it put it forth was assine.

If people refuse to believe then that is their choice. As a Christian he should respect others personal beliefs. Not go around being rude and disrespecful to others just becuase they are not Christian.

Those kind of Chrisitans make a bad name for the rest of us.

Originally posted by Punker69
Why do you respect other religions when your Bible tells you that Jesus is the only way and unbelievers are going to hell?

Because Jesus said to respect everyone, even if their opinion is stupid or wrong?

Originally posted by Ya Krunk'd Floo
I once took a bite out of an apple that had a worm in it. It kind of dimmed my opinion of fruit.
Damn, can one book you for parties and such?

Originally posted by Punker69
Why do you respect other religions when your Bible tells you that Jesus is the only way and unbelievers are going to hell?
This is how intolerance, hatred, and bigotry arises out of religion and religious beliefs.

You don' t deserve any respect.

Originally posted by Storm
This is how intolerance, hatred, and bigotry arises out of religion and religious beliefs.

You don' t deserve any respect.

Ironic.

Originally posted by Punker69
Why do you respect other religions when your Bible tells you that Jesus is the only way and unbelievers are going to hell? Though I've said that many of my friends are Christians, I haven't told many my own views, only because the ones I did tell are hoping I come back to Jesus because they feel I'm also going to hell.......Soooooo I smile and nod a lot and say "Ya know, we shouldn't judge people'...That's gods job................Always shuts them up.

God and Jesus say specifically, do not judge others, for that is their job. Yet Christians judge others ALL the time.

what KIND of Christians are we talking about here? Roman Catholic, Protastant, Lutheran, what? There are lots of little Christian sects.

Originally posted by Punker69
Why do you respect other religions when your Bible tells you that Jesus is the only way and unbelievers are going to hell?


Just in case your parents never told you this I will , your stupid shut your pie hole.

Originally posted by Council#13
what KIND of Christians are we talking about here? Roman Catholic, Protastant, Lutheran, what? There are lots of little Christian sects.

Literal ones, fundamentalist ones, ones who have a fight to pick with anything that doesn't back up their agenda, ones who are narrowminded...

Don't get me wrong; there are very respectable and honest Christians. But they don't argue nonsense, which is why I never address them in my posts.

Thomas More was a very honest Christian...I like him....

So was St. Thomas Aquinas and St Francis of Assisi! To bad the higher ups at the church torqued their "true" meanings.

The Catholic church did and still does have a lot of temporal power. And it tends to stamp down on nonbelievers as "radicals" and "in league with the devil" etc.

What did he say? I'm a jehovah's Witness. *Hides*

Originally posted by Blaxican_Hydra
What did he say? I'm a jehovah's Witness. *Hides*



Something like blah blah blah I'm an idiot blah. The rest I had a hard time understanding.

*Pops head over bar table.* oh. *hides again*

Wow. This sure became a fun topic of discussion.

Listen, I'm a Christian and I feel that if people want to judge, let them. If people want to talk bulls***, let them ramble. I respect all religions that believe in a greater being then ourselves. I believe that, even if you're not christian, you can still go to heaven if you have lead a true and honest life. And if god doesn't like that, let him smite me in my chair.

Originally posted by STARS Nemesis1
Wow. This sure became a fun topic of discussion.

Listen, I'm a Christian and I feel that if people want to judge, let them. If people want to talk bulls***, let them ramble. I respect all religions that believe in a greater being then ourselves. I believe that, even if you're not christian, you can still go to heaven if you have lead a true and honest life. And if god doesn't like that, let him smite me in my chair.

Holla!

All religious people should be like this guy.

I just feel that the bible is wrong on some notes. If you say I'm not a Christian, that's what you think. The only real people I judge are the Nazis, and I hate them because of what they did in WWII. But that's my opinion. Everyone has their own. But I will say this, the bishop of my local area is a loser.

Originally posted by STARS Nemesis1
Just a note to anyone who saw xpac's thread on here, about atheiests. I am christian but I respect other religions. What xpac did really hurt the christian religion here on KMC. I just wana say that he was outta line and I hope no one looks down on Christians. This is pretty stupid but I wanted to say it so people would reliase that not all christians are like that. And, also, I know this is a waste of space but I wanted to put it. dont know why you made a thread but i like your view

Yeah thats what i meant by 'this is stupid' i shouldnt have made a thread but i didnt know where to put this

Originally posted by STARS Nemesis1


I just feel that the bible is wrong on some notes. If you say I'm not a Christian, that's what you think. The only real people I judge are the Nazis, and I hate them because of what they did in WWII. But that's my opinion. Everyone has their own. But I will say this, the bishop of my local area is a loser.

Take some history classes. If the Nazi atrocities offend you, then some other historical purges will offend you just as much.

don't blame the nazis..........blame the head nazi officials making the decisions. Everybody else was just doing their job.....following orders.

Like the Soviets, but they didn't make a scapegoat out of religion as much.

Ill already know of some. Ill learn more in a year or two. But the nazis happened in our time and are still around, just like the kkk. I just said the nazis cause I recently had a run-in with one.

Originally posted by Evil Dead
don't blame the nazis..........blame the head nazi officials making the decisions. Everybody else was just doing their job.....following orders.
True true. Sorry to all those nazis. And ure right. I only truely hate hitler and his higher-ups

Originally posted by STARS Nemesis1
Wow. This sure became a fun topic of discussion.

Listen, I'm a Christian and I feel that if people want to judge, let them. If people want to talk bulls***, let them ramble. I respect all religions that believe in a greater being then ourselves. I believe that, even if you're not christian, you can still go to heaven if you have lead a true and honest life. And if god doesn't like that, let him smite me in my chair.

Now all you have to do is respect the atheists and polytheists and you're set - peaceful and all.

When I first logged on to the KMC forums, my intent was to go and post in the book threads. However, I stumbled across the religion threads and decided to read here. Unfortunatly, the first posts i read were very disturbing to me because of my faith. As well, I have been posting on a different forum that mainly consists of christians, and the content here gave me a shock. Like a culture shock from going to another country. I do however, feel a great need to apologize for not stepping back before posting my feelings. I am trully sorry and I hope I will be forgiven. Shame on me. My head is not always on straight..or at all!

Originally posted by marcu
When I first logged on to the KMC forums, my intent was to go and post in the book threads. However, I stumbled across the religion threads and decided to read here. Unfortunatly, the first posts i read were very disturbing to me because of my faith. As well, I have been posting on a different forum that mainly consists of christians, and the content here gave me a shock. Like a culture shock from going to another country. I do however, feel a great need to apologize for not stepping back before posting my feelings. I am trully sorry and I hope I will be forgiven. Shame on me. My head is not always on straight..or at all! Don't feel bad..........we all like to joke around here........We're all very nice well except for a few of them........lol......but this is a religious site....and it's global.......and you're not the first to feel bad.........don't feel bad...

Originally posted by marcu
When I first logged on to the KMC forums, my intent was to go and post in the book threads. However, I stumbled across the religion threads and decided to read here. Unfortunatly, the first posts i read were very disturbing to me because of my faith. As well, I have been posting on a different forum that mainly consists of christians, and the content here gave me a shock. Like a culture shock from going to another country. I do however, feel a great need to apologize for not stepping back before posting my feelings. I am trully sorry and I hope I will be forgiven. Shame on me. My head is not always on straight..or at all!

There is no need. This forum is like a storm. We through ideas out and voice the anger of life. You have every right, within the measure of your faith, to do the same.

Marcu

I did think you were a bit abrupt. All the same, you stuck around and have posted a number of times. My initial reaction was negative, but you seem to have gotten over the initial shell shock as it were. I personally do not hold grudges, so no hard feelings. Besides, your thread produced a large amount of discussion, that is the point of the forum and your thread accomplished that.

Originally posted by marcu
When I first logged on to the KMC forums, my intent was to go and post in the book threads. However, I stumbled across the religion threads and decided to read here. Unfortunatly, the first posts i read were very disturbing to me because of my faith. As well, I have been posting on a different forum that mainly consists of christians, and the content here gave me a shock. Like a culture shock from going to another country. I do however, feel a great need to apologize for not stepping back before posting my feelings. I am trully sorry and I hope I will be forgiven. Shame on me. My head is not always on straight..or at all!
Religion is a sensitive topic for most people so this understandable.

Originally posted by marcu
When I first logged on to the KMC forums, my intent was to go and post in the book threads. However, I stumbled across the religion threads and decided to read here. Unfortunatly, the first posts i read were very disturbing to me because of my faith. As well, I have been posting on a different forum that mainly consists of christians, and the content here gave me a shock. Like a culture shock from going to another country. I do however, feel a great need to apologize for not stepping back before posting my feelings. I am trully sorry and I hope I will be forgiven. Shame on me. My head is not always on straight..or at all!

No worries. I'm glad you changed your mind. A little culture shock is always good. People need to keep on their feet

You are gracious people...i am humbled!

Can we(I) shock somemore?

Well you've heard it said "I never talk politics or Religion".........and here........we do....

Poltics and religion are inexorably dangerous. I love them both so much.

I do not much like to debate religion.. i would much rather I say what i feel and you all agree with me and we live happily ever after! LOL

Any chance of that happening or do i brush up on my debating skills and have a go at it?

*chuckles to self*

^^

And then marcu woke up....

Originally posted by marcu
I do not much like to debate religion.. i would much rather I say what i feel and you all agree with me and we live happily ever after! LOL

Any chance of that happening or do i brush up on my debating skills and have a go at it?

*chuckles to self*
We'll I dont think anyone has a problem with that...but if you post an opinon...it will be questioned (unless everyone agrees). At which point everyone gets angry and we have a lot of fun!

It seems to me that using quotes from the bible in terms of discussion with people (other than christians) does not seem to hold much water. Which i suppose makes sense, cause if you don't have faith in God or the bible, then why would quoting from it help any. So, my question is, what approach would hold water with those of you who are not Christians here? Just wondering!

Originally posted by marcu
It seems to me that using quotes from the bible in terms of discussion with people (other than christians) does not seem to hold much water. Which i suppose makes sense, cause if you don't have faith in God or the bible, then why would quoting from it help any. So, my question is, what approach would hold water with those of you who are not Christians here? Just wondering!

You are 100% correct. Logic would be the key to the approach for most people. Quoting from the Lotus sutra would have great sway over me personally, but that would mean you would have to read it.

Originally posted by debbiejo
Don't feel bad..........we all like to joke around here........We're all very nice well except for a few of them........lol......but this is a religious site....and it's global.......and you're not the first to feel bad.........don't feel bad...

Marcu your good people.

I changed my mind...I'm pmsing ...I think marcu should leave!!

Originally posted by marcu
It seems to me that using quotes from the bible in terms of discussion with people (other than christians) does not seem to hold much water. Which i suppose makes sense, cause if you don't have faith in God or the bible, then why would quoting from it help any. So, my question is, what approach would hold water with those of you who are not Christians here? Just wondering!

I agree with Shakya. If something is true...it should stand up to all logic. The Bible is only facutal to some Christians...no one has a problem with you using it, but you gotta back it up. "the Bible is fact" isn't going to cut it anymore than "Star Wars is fact."

Originally posted by Alliance
I agree with Shakya. If something is true...it should stand up to all logic. The Bible is only facutal to some Christians...no one has a problem with you using it, but you gotta back it up. "the Bible is fact" isn't going to cut it anymore than "Star Wars is fact."

What I like about the Bible is when I quote it and people don't agree. Then they don't dis-agree with me. I love it! This way, you have to deal with the bible and not me. Cool huh?

Not really...no one like arguing with a book. We can do that on our own time. And you dont personally grow.

Originally posted by Justbyfaith
What I like about the Bible is when I quote it and people don't agree. Then they don't dis-agree with me. I love it! This way, you have to deal with the bible and not me. Cool huh?

Tao te Ching

11
We join spokes together in a wheel,
but it is the center hole
that makes the wagon move.

We shape clay into a pot,
but it is the emptiness inside
that holds whatever we want.

We hammer wood for a house,
but it is the inner space
that makes it livable.

We work with being,
but non-being is what we use.

ARGH

Originally posted by Alliance
ARGH

sorry Alliance. All the same, let's see people argue with that

The stone which the builders rejected has become the chief cornerstone...

Originally posted by marcu
When I first logged on to the KMC forums, my intent was to go and post in the book threads. However, I stumbled across the religion threads and decided to read here. Unfortunatly, the first posts i read were very disturbing to me because of my faith. As well, I have been posting on a different forum that mainly consists of christians, and the content here gave me a shock. Like a culture shock from going to another country. I do however, feel a great need to apologize for not stepping back before posting my feelings. I am trully sorry and I hope I will be forgiven. Shame on me. My head is not always on straight..or at all!

Be afraid...be very afraid...

j/k

Originally posted by Justbyfaith
The stone which the builders rejected has become the chief cornerstone...
Ambiguous metaphors don't count much either.

Originally posted by Justbyfaith
The stone which the builders rejected has become the chief cornerstone...

Is it...

Sorry you feel that way about Jesus.

or

Damn those stupid builders.

jk

I'm new around here so I may not know how everything works, but I happened to stumble upon this forum while searching Google and I spent a couple hours reading posts made in this section of the forum. I noticed a lot of people have a lot of hate for Christianity and Christians, which is understandable given history, current events, and even the Christians we know.

I don't know if I have the authority or the right to do this, but I want to apologize, on behalf of everyone who calls themselves a Christian, for any kind of pain or hurt we may have caused.

Some of my best friends are non Christians and I have personally seen the damage that can be inflicted. I've seen them cry tears over things Christians have said to them. But there are those of us who are truly trying to live our lives to be like Jesus in His love and compassion for others. I may not have answers to a lot of big questions, but for now, I'm doing what I can to love people.

I'm not here to quote scripture, or recite apologetics, but only to ask for forgiveness, from those of you who have received hurt, condemnation, or suffering from Christians, I'm truly sorry.

May a spirit of love and peace fill this place.

Originally posted by madchen
I'm new around here so I may not know how everything works, but I happened to stumble upon this forum while searching Google and I spent a couple hours reading posts made in this section of the forum. I noticed a lot of people have a lot of hate for Christianity and Christians, which is understandable given history, current events, and even the Christians we know.

I don't know if I have the authority or the right to do this, but I want to apologize, on behalf of everyone who calls themselves a Christian, for any kind of pain or hurt we may have caused.

Some of my best friends are non Christians and I have personally seen the damage that can be inflicted. I've seen them cry tears over things Christians have said to them. But there are those of us who are truly trying to live our lives to be like Jesus in His love and compassion for others. I may not have answers to a lot of big questions, but for now, I'm doing what I can to love people.

I'm not here to quote scripture, or recite apologetics, but only to ask for forgiveness, from those of you who have received hurt, condemnation, or suffering from Christians, I'm truly sorry.

May a spirit of love and peace fill this place.

Don't apologize for something you did not do. Most of the talk here is just that, talk. However, I understand what you are saying. Thanks...

Although a few people seem to have been hurt by Christians...

Originally posted by Nellinator
Although a few people seem to have been hurt by Christians...

However, people have been hurt by non-Christians too. The world we live in is known in Buddhism as the Saha world (world of suffering). We cannot escape this suffering; all we can do is learn to have power over suffering.

Originally posted by Punker69
Why do you respect other religions when your Bible tells you that Jesus is the only way and unbelievers are going to hell?


People like you are the EXACT reason why

Originally posted by madchen
I'm new around here so I may not know how everything works, but I happened to stumble upon this forum while searching Google and I spent a couple hours reading posts made in this section of the forum. I noticed a lot of people have a lot of hate for Christianity and Christians, which is understandable given history, current events, and even the Christians we know.

I don't know if I have the authority or the right to do this, but I want to apologize, on behalf of everyone who calls themselves a Christian, for any kind of pain or hurt we may have caused.

Some of my best friends are non Christians and I have personally seen the damage that can be inflicted. I've seen them cry tears over things Christians have said to them. But there are those of us who are truly trying to live our lives to be like Jesus in His love and compassion for others. I may not have answers to a lot of big questions, but for now, I'm doing what I can to love people.

I'm not here to quote scripture, or recite apologetics, but only to ask for forgiveness, from those of you who have received hurt, condemnation, or suffering from Christians, I'm truly sorry.

May a spirit of love and peace fill this place.




A very beautiful post, but you do not owe any of us an apology for something that you did not do.

You cannot represent the entire Christian community, because your sorrow is not shared by everyone who identifies as Christian. However, you have reminded me that there ARE good Christian people who are NOT hypocrits, who are NOT judgemental, and who are sincerely genuine.

Thanks for the refreshing reminder

Originally posted by STARS Nemesis1
Just a note to anyone who saw xpac's thread on here, about atheiests. I am christian but I respect other religions. What xpac did really hurt the christian religion here on KMC. I just wana say that he was outta line and I hope no one looks down on Christians. This is pretty stupid but I wanted to say it so people would reliase that not all christians are like that. And, also, I know this is a waste of space but I wanted to put it. I missed it.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Thomas More was a very honest Christian...I like him....



My favorite Christian is Mother Teresa


I wondor why Christianity doesn't follow her example

Like not distinguishing between curable and incurable patients, so that people who could otherwise survive would be at risk of dying from infections and lack of treatment?

Originally posted by Storm
Like not distinguishing between curable and incurable patients, so that people who could otherwise survive would be at risk of dying from infections and lack of treatment?
Elaborate...?

Originally posted by madchen
I'm new around here so I may not know how everything works, but I happened to stumble upon this forum while searching Google and I spent a couple hours reading posts made in this section of the forum. I noticed a lot of people have a lot of hate for Christianity and Christians, which is understandable given history, current events, and even the Christians we know.

I don't know if I have the authority or the right to do this, but I want to apologize, on behalf of everyone who calls themselves a Christian, for any kind of pain or hurt we may have caused.

Some of my best friends are non Christians and I have personally seen the damage that can be inflicted. I've seen them cry tears over things Christians have said to them. But there are those of us who are truly trying to live our lives to be like Jesus in His love and compassion for others. I may not have answers to a lot of big questions, but for now, I'm doing what I can to love people.

I'm not here to quote scripture, or recite apologetics, but only to ask for forgiveness, from those of you who have received hurt, condemnation, or suffering from Christians, I'm truly sorry.

May a spirit of love and peace fill this place.

Well said madchen - but remember - saying everything that people like to hear is not always loving. The truth may sometimes be uncomfortable, and it may even hurt(briefly of course) But in the end, it is the most efficient - and everlasting remedy, for those with ailing spiritual conditions.

Originally posted by usagi_yojimbo
Well said madchen - but remember - saying everything that people like to hear is not always loving. The truth may sometimes be uncomfortable, and it may even hurt(briefly of course) But in the end, it is the most efficient - and everlasting remedy, for those with ailing spiritual conditions.


Telling someone that they deserve to go to Hell is not factual, it is pure belief, and a very offensive one at best.

Calling someone a sinful, unclean, deviant person is also a great insult, with no factual basis behind it what-so-ever.


You claim that you are telling the "truth", but you have no basis to back your version of truth up. No basis other than an outdated, self-contradicting book.....and you expect people to be stupid enough to just go "ohhh ok.....this book says i should do this, so let me beleive what usagi believes"

Originally posted by usagi_yojimbo
Well said madchen - but remember - saying everything that people like to hear is not always loving. The truth may sometimes be uncomfortable, and it may even hurt(briefly of course) But in the end, it is the most efficient - and everlasting remedy, for those with ailing spiritual conditions.

That is what the terrorists on 9-11 thought.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
However, people have been hurt by non-Christians too. The world we live in is known in Buddhism as the Saha world (world of suffering). We cannot escape this suffering; all we can do is learn to have power over suffering.
Actually, I was referring to certain people on this forum. I think that some of them are obvious, others have said so outright. I think that sometimes an apology on behalf of Christianity is in order as people often feel it is the religion that is persecuting them, not the followers. The message of love is always a good thing too.

Originally posted by Nellinator
Actually, I was referring to certain people on this forum. I think that some of them are obvious, others have said so outright. I think that sometimes an apology on behalf of Christianity is in order as people often feel it is the religion that is persecuting them, not the followers. The message of love is always a good thing too.


My thoughts exactly - it's hard to tell if some of the apologies given on here are genuine or not. Many of the posters on KMC are obvious *non-christian* socks - attempting to play the ol "Christians are responsable for all the problems in the world" speel.

Wasn't really sure myself if that apology was a genuine one - but what the hey, you gotta give everyone the benefit of the doubt, after all - I'm certain we will all be needing *grace* at some point in this life..

Oh no, not the grace thingie again.........

Originally posted by debbiejo
Oh no, not the grace thingie again.........


Amaaaaziing Grace how sweeeet the souund that saaaaved a wretch like me....I once waaas losst but now I'm found, was blind..but nowww I seee. Amen.

Originally posted by usagi_yojimbo
Amaaaaziing Grace how sweeeet the souund that saaaaved a wretch like me....I once waaas losst but now I'm found, was blind..but nowww I seee. Amen.




Usagi, give up already. People are liking you just as much as they like JIA

Grace = unmerited favor....A favor for what? For being created just the way I am and calling it a flaw then sending me to hells kitchen to slave over McDonald's burger flipping for ever and ever with Gandhi?? Having lots of sex and drinking drinks with slices of fruit in them.....popping out babies like little -->

Ohhhh those are demons........baby demons..........Aren't they cute??

DEMONS are DELICIOUS droolio

You're not supposed to eat them!!

Originally posted by Lord Urizen
DEMONS are DELICIOUS droolio
drool

Originally posted by marcu
It seems to me that using quotes from the bible in terms of discussion with people (other than christians) does not seem to hold much water. Which i suppose makes sense, cause if you don't have faith in God or the bible, then why would quoting from it help any. So, my question is, what approach would hold water with those of you who are not Christians here? Just wondering!

Storm said this numerous times, so lets repeat again -

For those who believe, no proof is necessary. For those who do not believe, no proof is possible.

Originally posted by Lord Urizen
My favorite Christian is Mother Teresa


I wondor why Christianity doesn't follow her example


Mother Teressa was a hypocritical and horrible woman. She glorified suffering and poverty, but when she needed the treatment, all the best care was provided.

Originally posted by lil bitchiness
Mother Teressa was a hypocritical and horrible woman. She glorified suffering and poverty, but when she needed the treatment, all the best care was provided.


Only God knows the intentions of her heart, but I do know how simple it is - for one to get caught up in the works, and forget about how salvation is dependant upon Christ alone. I sincerely hope that a woman who did so much for other people, didn't forget this simple(however often times forgotten) principle.

Originally posted by marcu
It seems to me that using quotes from the bible in terms of discussion with people (other than christians) does not seem to hold much water. Which i suppose makes sense, cause if you don't have faith in God or the bible, then why would quoting from it help any. So, my question is, what approach would hold water with those of you who are not Christians here? Just wondering! Science, valid sources, something that isn't (self) contradictable.

Originally posted by lil bitchiness
Mother Teressa was a hypocritical and horrible woman. She glorified suffering and poverty, but when she needed the treatment, all the best care was provided.




What the hell are you talking about ?


She didn't glorify anything....she aimed to help people who suffered and were impoverous, and helped them she did.

Originally posted by debbiejo
You're not supposed to eat them!!

Originally posted by Lord Urizen
What the hell are you talking about ?


She didn't glorify anything....she aimed to help people who suffered and were impoverous, and helped them she did.

What the?

Is this one of those things where people are gonna talk about something based on what they VAGUELY know?

If so, please don't bother.

First motive -

Mother Teresa's stated motive for the work is that of proselytization for religious fundamentalism, for the most extreme interpretation of Catholic doctrine. Do you think multiplying is the answer? Overpopulation and lack of condoms spreading AIDS? No.
Well Mother Teresa's motive lies in exactly that.

Second practice -

She had taken money - over a million dollars - from Charles Keating, the Lincoln Savings and Loans swindler, even though it had been shown to her that the money was stolen.

Second, she has been an ally of the most reactionary forces in India and in many other countries.

Thirdly- she has campaigned to prevent Ireland from ceasing to be the only country in Europe with a constitutional ban on divorce.

I mean wtf?!

She did glorify suffering and poverty. She thought suffering is good, and she doesn't use pain relievers in her clinics and so forth.

One of the most salient examples of people's willingness to believe anything if it is garbed in the appearance of holiness is the uncritical acceptance of the idea of Mother Teresa.

She was a horrible hypocrite!

Originally posted by lil bitchiness
What the?

Is this one of those things where people are gonna talk about something based on what they VAGUELY know?

If so, please don't bother.

First motive -

Mother Teresa's stated motive for the work is that of proselytization for religious fundamentalism, for the most extreme interpretation of Catholic doctrine. Do you think multiplying is the answer? Overpopulation and lack of condoms spreading AIDS? No.
Well Mother Teresa's motive lies in exactly that.

Second practice -

She had taken money - over a million dollars - from Charles Keating, the Lincoln Savings and Loans swindler, even though it had been shown to her that the money was stolen.

Second, she has been an ally of the most reactionary forces in India and in many other countries.

Thirdly- she has campaigned to prevent Ireland from ceasing to be the only country in Europe with a constitutional ban on divorce.

I mean wtf?!

She did glorify suffering and poverty. She thought suffering is good, and she doesn't use pain relievers in her clinics and so forth.

One of the most salient examples of people's willingness to believe anything if it is garbed in the appearance of holiness is the uncritical acceptance of the idea of Mother Teresa.

She was a horrible hypocrite!




Those are QUITE the accusations....I assume you have proof for all of this ?

Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Those are QUITE the accusations....I assume you have proof for all of this ?

{comment}

The Catholic Church is extremely corrupt - and I would not be the slightest bit surprised if Lil B's words carried truth. I'll have to study a bit on what she's posted - however, I must admit I was always under the impression that Mother Theresa was a fairly decent woman.

Despite what she has done(or what anyone has done for that matter), the intentions of her heart, as well as her acceptance of Christ being her Lord and Saviour, and the repentance of any sins she's commited - is the *only* determining factor regarding her *sainthood*(at least before God).

ANY beurcratic institution has some degree of corruption.

Anyone with half a brain can see that.

Mother Teresa being catholic does not determine her actions...id like to see proof for what LIL B claims...

In an article for the British medical journal Lancet, in 1994, a physician who visited and inspected her Calcutta facility observed severe misdiagnoses, administration of improper dosages of medications, and a lack of strong analgesics to control terrible pain. Needles were reused without proper sterilization, systematic diagnostic methods were barred and those who could be helped at a real hospital were never sent there.

The British newspaper Guardian described the hospice as an "organised form of neglectful assistance".

Her actions during the trial of Charles Keating, which resulted in a ten-year sentence for his fraud in the S&L debacle, are particularly illuminating. Mother Teresa wrote to the trial judge and appealed for leniency because Keating had donated a large sum to her projects. Oddly enough, it never occurred to her that the money really belonged to the people Keating swindled it from, and she never responded to a request from the judge that she return the stolen funds.

Her theology of suffering produced the following quote: "I think it is very beautiful for the poor to accept their lot, to share it with the passion of Christ. I think the world is being much helped by the suffering of the poor people."

A critic is Dr. Aroup Chatterjee, a physician who formerly worked with the Missionaries of Charity.

I' m surpised you aren' t familiar with the criticism.

Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Mother Teresa being catholic does not determine her actions...id like to see proof for what LIL B claims...

I think Storm elaborated nicely from my post. You can also do some research regarding this. Im not gonna do it for you.

And her religion has nothing to do with her personality - she was not a model Catholic at any rate, and shockingly so, she was a rather extreme in her ideas ad practices and interpretation of Catholicism.

It is also rather interesting how many non-Catholics praise Mother Teresa.

Storm..LIL B....


This is TOTAL news to me......




I always thought she was this wondorful person. I mean I saw all these documentaries, read all these articles, I had never yet heard anything like this. This is truly heart breaking.


The one Christian figure I think it genuine, loving, and more down to Earth than anyone....and I'm WRONG ?



I thought that among the Christian Figures (Jerry Falwell, Pat Robertson, Ted Haggard, Pope Benedict, Pope John Paul II, Shirley Phelps Roper, etc.) that there was ONE genuine star among them.




I thought that Mother Teresa was true....its very sad that the one Christian I regarded as a great role model is nothing more than a sham....




So as of now, I have NO Christian role models....why does this happen ? This will not help inspire any positive perspective on Christianity for me.

Originally posted by usagi_yojimbo
The Catholic Church is extremely corrupt - and I would not be the slightest bit surprised if Lil B's words carried truth. I'll have to study a bit on what she's posted - however, I must admit I was always under the impression that Mother Theresa was a fairly decent woman.

Despite what she has done(or what anyone has done for that matter), the intentions of her heart, as well as her acceptance of Christ being her Lord and Saviour, and the repentance of any sins she's commited - is the *only* determining factor regarding her *sainthood*(at least before God).





Yes, the Catholic Church IS corrupt, just like the Protestant Church, just like ALL Churches.

Corruption is NOT simply a Catholic thing, so please....cut the bigotry out already.

Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Yes, the Catholic Church IS corrupt, just like the Protestant Church, just like ALL Churches.

Corruption is NOT simply a Catholic thing, so please....cut the bigotry out already.

Never stated that they wasn't corruption at some level. Unfortunately, corruption and sin is now the inherent nature of man(after the fall of course). But the Catholic Church, historically - as well as doctrinally, seems to be extremely pagan in its beliefs(particularly regarding the Trinity, the diefication of Mary, praying to saints, and confessing sins to priests).

Originally posted by usagi_yojimbo
Never stated that they wasn't corruption at some level. Unfortunately, corruption and sin is now the inherent nature of man(after the fall of course). But the Catholic Church, historically - as well as doctrinally, seems to be extremely pagan in its beliefs(particularly regarding the Trinity, the diefication of Mary, praying to saints, and confessing sins to priests).

Corruption and sin is not the inherent nature of man. Corruption occurs because of atrophy. Human nature is far more complex then the over simplified statements, like the one above.

Originally posted by usagi_yojimbo
Never stated that they wasn't corruption at some level. Unfortunately, corruption and sin is now the inherent nature of man(after the fall of course). But the Catholic Church, historically - as well as doctrinally, seems to be extremely pagan in its beliefs(particularly regarding the Trinity, the diefication of Mary, praying to saints, and confessing sins to priests).


You call pagan beleifs the catholic corruption ?


Idiotic.....the REAL corruption was:


1) Selling of Indulgences
2) Spanish Inquisition
3) Crusades



And as for Protestant corruption:


1) Salem Witch Trials
2) near extermination of Native Americans

Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Yes, the Catholic Church IS corrupt, just like the Protestant Church, just like ALL Churches.

Corruption is NOT simply a Catholic thing, so please....cut the bigotry out already.

The church becomes so with time, and as an idea is not what was originally (as far as I graspped) intended for Christianity, or rather what Jesus intended.

If I remember corrctly, the closest thing to Jesus' words said that God is supposed to be everywhere, not in the four walls.

I believe Jesus tried to liberate certain laws, not make them worse. Go figure.

Originally posted by lil bitchiness
The church becomes so with time, and as an idea is not what was originally (as far as I graspped) intended for Christianity, or rather what Jesus intended.

If I remember corrctly, the closest thing to Jesus' words said that God is supposed to be everywhere, not in the four walls.

I believe Jesus tried to liberate certain laws, not make them worse. Go figure.




yes, but seeing as how some of those who claim to follow and devout thier lives to Jesus, don't truly stay loyal to his words, it makes me question Jesus's "divinity"...

Originally posted by Lord Urizen
yes, but seeing as how some of those who claim to follow and devout thier lives to Jesus, don't truly stay loyal to his words, it makes me question Jesus's "divinity"...

No one can completely stay *loyal* to Jesus's words - due to the nature of sin. Jesus and Paul strongly expressed this view, which greatly contradicted the common views of what the Pharisees, Scribes, and other Legalistics had regarding salvation. Faith in Christ - is the only thing that is required in order to obtain true salvation. This faith in Christ, will produce good works in a believer - whom is being lead to do these works by the Holy spirit, not themselves.

Regarding your other statement, the paganistic practices of the Catholic Church - and the pride many of their highest officials and/or priests had regarding these sinful practices, is the predominant reason as to why such abysmal acts were commited. I'm sure you know and understand this - but due to your nature, you(and others like you) purposely fain ignorance in order to project Catholicism and its teachings as being synonomous with the true teachings of Christ. In doing so - you hope to thus diminish the truth and love which his(Christ's) word contains - while at the same time exalting your own doctrinal beliefs(Of course I know you'll now dogmatically and doctrinally respond to the last line - by stating that you follow no religion or doctrine - however, I felt it necessary to put it in there anyway - because if it does nothing else, at least it will serve the purpose of p*ssing you off...He..He..He).

^ Sin does not have a nature.

Originally posted by usagi_yojimbo
Regarding your other statement, the paganistic practices of the Catholic Church
Practices that you still continue.

Originally posted by usagi_yojimbo
and the pride many of their highest officials and/or priests had regarding these sinful practices, is the predominant reason as to why such abysmal acts were commited.
And you are still comitting more.

Originally posted by usagi_yojimbo
I'm sure you know and understand this - but due to your nature, you(and others like you) purposely fain ignorance in order to project Catholicism and its teachings as being synonomous with the true teachings of Christ. Well Catholics have taught about Christ much longer than your religion has. You are the one faining ignorance. Pick up a history book.

Originally posted by usagi_yojimbo
In doing so - you hope to thus diminish the truth and love which his(Christ's) word contains Oh really. Conservative interpretations of liberlal teachings are always flawed. I suggest you reananlyze excatyl what the message of Chirst was.

Originally posted by usagi_yojimbo
while at the same time exalting your own doctrinal beliefs
Athiesm has no doctrine, so you can't be talking to me. Buddhism has a very loose doctrine and traditionally pushes personal interpretation (Something rptesteantism was founded on but irnically, forgot about 10 years later). You can't be talking to Urizen, because he's agnositc and they don't ahve dogma either. Do you even know what the word dogma means?

Originally posted by usagi_yojimbo
(Of course I know you'll now dogmatically and doctrinally respond to the last line - by stating that you follow no religion or doctrine - however, I felt it necessary to put it in there anyway - because if it does nothing else,
Really, because what do you ever do but spew dogma?

Originally posted by usagi_yojimbo
at least it will serve the purpose of p*ssing you off...He..He..He). Yeah, because thats what this forum is about. Exactly.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
^ Sin does not have a nature.
Sure, it does.

HUMAN NATURE...oh, snaps, and whatnot.

Who is Xpac and what did he do? I missed this cause I have been absent for some time.

Originally posted by FeceMan
Sure, it does.

HUMAN NATURE...oh, snaps, and whatnot.

You have it so upside down. A child does not sin; we learn how to do wrong.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
You have it so upside down. A child does not sin; we learn how to do wrong.
Newp. We just learn how to sin better as we age.

Originally posted by FeceMan
Newp. We just learn how to sin better as we age.

What sin does a new born child do? And please don't give me this sins of the father crap.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
What sin does a new born child do? And please don't give me this sins of the father crap.
Newborn chilluns don't do sin.

Once they develop their mental faculties, however, they do.

Originally posted by FeceMan
Newborn chilluns don't do sin.

Once they develop their mental faculties, however, they do.

They learn it...