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They can both take on practically anything and/or anyone. So who wins?

Poor Juggernaut just another punching bag again

doomsday just because he has superspeed

I don't think that there is anything they can do to each other to get a win.

been done...juggs becomes dd's ***** till the end of time...

he might evolve to the point where he could bypass the power of cyttorak,,,,,,,he evolved to go beyond gogs powers who is above skyfather

Draw. DD is much more powerful, but can he actually hurt Juggernaut ? I'm not sure.

Dooms power is just too great, even for the great avatar of cyttorak gem. I think he would just keep evolving until he surpassed Cains power

How would Doomsday go about and defeat Cain. He is invulnerable to all physical attacks. he could bring up his shield and shit. Cain doesn't have the power to put Doomsday out, but the same goes for Doomsday about Juggernaut.

its gonna be a draw, but juggy is again gonna become a punching bag unless he's sheilds are up.

Cain is not immortal, and Doomsday ability to evolve after every fight will eventually become 2 much 4 him

Originally posted by jgiant
been done...juggs becomes dd's ***** till the end of time...

cosign

How will Doomsday evolve to become too much for Cain. Doomsday is all strength and speed. There is nothing that he can do to hurt Cain. Since Cain won't be doing anything to Doomsday, how will he evolve. Juggernaut is going to be an eternal punching bag for Doomsday, who won't get a kink in Juggernaut.

Doomsday is just a walking plot device whose fanboys annoy me more than Superman's. In fact, some of them say he could take on Galactus. Give me a damn break.

Cain shows Doomy the power of the Crimson Bands of Cyttorak and rips him in two, then throws him into outer space. Then he gets drunk.

All they will do is whop each other ass for the east of time. Im sure that Juggernaut will do a much better job against DD, because Juggernaut cant be hurt. So as long as Juggernaut never kills DD, they will stalemate each other.

Well Doomsday hit J'onn while he was intangible, and he's beaten a being of pure energy in Hunter/Prey. Its asuumable that he'd evolve to be able to hurt Cain. But thats just my assumption.

People, people, people! are we all forgetting the critcal facts? it would be a good match but it would NOT be a draw. Of COURSE doomsday could hurt Juggernaught!!!!
because:
1) Juggernaughts power relies on the deity cyttorak, if that power is intercepted i.e. magically, by destroying the tablet, or the deity revoking it. On the other hand - Doomsdays power is his to command.
2) Doomsday can evolve beyond any kind of defeat. Juggernaught would initally be weaker. he is all kinds of dead after that.
3) Doomsday escaped the phantom zone. The PHANTOM ZONE. His power goes WELL beyond Juggernaughts.
4) Juggernaught has a weakspot. his head - which doomsday has the power to SMUSH between his hands.
and finally
5) Does everyone remember when Juggernaught took on Gladiator? he was made to look like a BABY. He got WELL STOMPED. Gladiator has only some of the abilities of superman meaning superman would be stronger - and doomsday is the superior of supes. thus the higherarchy is set with Juggernaught at the bottom and DD at the top. that's several leagues of difference.

Conclusion - DD would make Juggernaught his b****. end of.

He cant evolve if he doen't die

Well first round, Juggernaut wins. Second round is a never-ending battle or until they cause so much destruction that it is Judgement Day for the universe they are in.

Originally posted by Kon El
People, people, people! are we all forgetting the critcal facts? it would be a good match but it would NOT be a draw. Of COURSE doomsday could hurt Juggernaught!!!!
because:
1) Juggernaughts power relies on the deity cyttorak, if that power is intercepted i.e. magically, by destroying the tablet, or the deity revoking it. On the other hand - Doomsdays power is his to command.
2) Doomsday can evolve beyond any kind of defeat. Juggernaught would initally be weaker. he is all kinds of dead after that.
3) Doomsday escaped the phantom zone. The PHANTOM ZONE. His power goes WELL beyond Juggernaughts.
4) Juggernaught has a weakspot. his head - which doomsday has the power to SMUSH between his hands.
and finally
5) Does everyone remember when Juggernaught took on Gladiator? he was made to look like a BABY. He got WELL STOMPED. Gladiator has only some of the abilities of superman meaning superman would be stronger - and doomsday is the superior of supes. thus the higherarchy is set with Juggernaught at the bottom and DD at the top. that's several leagues of difference.

Conclusion - DD would make Juggernaught his b****. end of.

As much as I'm tempted to vote against DD out of spite just because people seriously beleive he could defeat Big G, DD wins this for reasons stated by Kon El.

One thing though...the only time I ever know of Glads manhandling Juggernaut was on the cartoon, which isn't cannon.

Superman is not superior to Gladiator

Originally posted by Kon El
People, people, people! are we all forgetting the critcal facts? it would be a good match but it would NOT be a draw. Of COURSE doomsday could hurt Juggernaught!!!!
because:
1) Juggernaughts power relies on the deity cyttorak, if that power is intercepted i.e. magically, by destroying the tablet, or the deity revoking it. On the other hand - Doomsdays power is his to command.
2) Doomsday can evolve beyond any kind of defeat. Juggernaught would initally be weaker. he is all kinds of dead after that.
3) Doomsday escaped the phantom zone. The PHANTOM ZONE. His power goes WELL beyond Juggernaughts.
4) Juggernaught has a weakspot. his head - which doomsday has the power to SMUSH between his hands.
and finally
5) Does everyone remember when Juggernaught took on Gladiator? he was made to look like a BABY. He got WELL STOMPED. Gladiator has only some of the abilities of superman meaning superman would be stronger - and doomsday is the superior of supes. thus the higherarchy is set with Juggernaught at the bottom and DD at the top. that's several leagues of difference.

Conclusion - DD would make Juggernaught his b****. end of.

Are you serious?

Originally posted by soujaboy09
Are you serious?

yes.

Originally posted by soujaboy09
He cant evolve if he doen't die

yes he can.

Originally posted by Kon El
People, people, people! are we all forgetting the critcal facts? it would be a good match but it would NOT be a draw. Of COURSE doomsday could hurt Juggernaught!!!!
because:
1) Juggernaughts power relies on the deity cyttorak, if that power is intercepted i.e. magically, by destroying the tablet, or the deity revoking it. On the other hand - Doomsdays power is his to command.
2) Doomsday can evolve beyond any kind of defeat. Juggernaught would initally be weaker. he is all kinds of dead after that.
3) Doomsday escaped the phantom zone. The PHANTOM ZONE. His power goes WELL beyond Juggernaughts.
4) Juggernaught has a weakspot. his head - which doomsday has the power to SMUSH between his hands.
and finally
5) Does everyone remember when Juggernaught took on Gladiator? he was made to look like a BABY. He got WELL STOMPED. Gladiator has only some of the abilities of superman meaning superman would be stronger - and doomsday is the superior of supes. thus the higherarchy is set with Juggernaught at the bottom and DD at the top. that's several leagues of difference.

Conclusion - DD would make Juggernaught his b****. end of.

1. Doomsday couldn't disrupt his powers, so I don't know where on earth you're getting that. If you're thinking of the event where Onslaught ripped the gem out of him, then you need to realize that Onslaught >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Doomsday.
2. Juggernaut doesn't run out of energy or power, and can enhance it through focus. He's not going to weaken. Doomsday, however, would weaken beforehand. It may take hundreds of years, but he would weaken. Juggernaut is going to stay at the same level.
3. Everbody and their mother is getting out of the Phantom Zone nowadays. I'm beginning to think it's not what it's cooked up to be, or just SBP punching the heads of DC writers. I think Jimmy Olsen just punched out of it right now.
4. Actually, he has a weakness to psychics, nimrod. Bit of a difference. Even if Doomsday got that helmet off, it wouldn't help him one bit. Now he's just gotta look at Cains ugly mug the whole time.
5. That was in a cartoon, genius. Even then, Gladiator is far more powerful than Superman. This guy can rip apart stars when he's fully confident. He's crazy powerful, and not many can best him. Also, Gladiator has ALL of Superman's abilities aside from T-vo, and powerset does not make someone less powerful.

The end result: Doomsday get ripped into two halves, and thrown into space by Juggernaut. Then Cain decides to go ape shit on the Superman fanboys tha think Doomsday could take Galactus.

Originally posted by Kon El
People, people, people! are we all forgetting the critcal facts? it would be a good match but it would NOT be a draw. Of COURSE doomsday could hurt Juggernaught!!!!
because:
1) Juggernaughts power relies on the deity cyttorak, if that power is intercepted i.e. magically, by destroying the tablet, or the deity revoking it. On the other hand - Doomsdays power is his to command.
2) Doomsday can evolve beyond any kind of defeat. Juggernaught would initally be weaker. he is all kinds of dead after that.
3) Doomsday escaped the phantom zone. The PHANTOM ZONE. His power goes WELL beyond Juggernaughts.
4) Juggernaught has a weakspot. his head - which doomsday has the power to SMUSH between his hands.
and finally
5) Does everyone remember when Juggernaught took on Gladiator? he was made to look like a BABY. He got WELL STOMPED. Gladiator has only some of the abilities of superman meaning superman would be stronger - and doomsday is the superior of supes. thus the higherarchy is set with Juggernaught at the bottom and DD at the top. that's several leagues of difference.

Conclusion - DD would make Juggernaught his b****. end of.

It's more like this

1. There is not a way in the world that Doomsday could mess with Cains connection with Cyttorak. So I don't know where you got that from, but it's wrong.

2. Juggernaut never gets weak. he is always at 100%, and will never go below. Yes Doomsday has the ability to evolve, but Juggernaut can increase his powers through focus. So there thats kind of even

3. So, Juggernaut has been sent away to difrrerent dimensions and realms all the time, he was even sent to Oblivian by Eternity. You know what though he always finds a way back.

4. Juggernaut doesn't have a weak spot when it comes to physical combat. The only problem is telepathic attacks, and he has shown the ability to overcome them with enough focus. See 8th day saga

5. That was the cartoon so it's not cannon

Conclusion: They fight until the end of time or one of them is bfr'd

Juggernaut wins because he can turn into a tank!!!

Originally posted by Milkie
Juggernaut wins because he can turn into a tank!!!

Of course! The tank is undeniable. Beware the evil!

Originally posted by Kon El
4) Juggernaught has a weakspot. his head - which doomsday has the power to SMUSH between his hands.

That's a serious miscalculation most people make. Juggernaut's head is only weak to psychics. Other than that, it's just as strong as the rest of his body, if anyone remembers his fight in the jungle with Hulk (which he won, by the way).

Originally posted by Kon El
5) Does everyone remember when Juggernaught took on Gladiator? he was made to look like a BABY. He got WELL STOMPED. Gladiator has only some of the abilities of superman meaning superman would be stronger - and doomsday is the superior of supes. thus the higherarchy is set with Juggernaught at the bottom and DD at the top. that's several leagues of difference.

That fight never happened in the comics, and isn't canon. Rogue gave Gladiator a fight in that same series, how serious can you take that?

Anyway, I don't know if Doomsday could ever hurt Juggernaut, but his superspeed alone tips the scales in his favor.

But, I still cheer for Juggernaut, cause he's the Juggernaut b*tch!!

Originally posted by crucifixio
Superman is not superior to Gladiator

These days, I'd say he is.

Originally posted by Thunderstrike
4. Actually, he has a weakness to psychics, nimrod.

How about we keep the insults to a minimum? Thank you.

Juggernaut could fall a sleep untill DD gets tired. Then Juggs could **** him.

Originally posted by samishe
Juggernaut could fall a sleep untill DD gets tired. Then Juggs could **** him.

I think Doomsday has evolved past the point of fatigue, so I doubt it. Remember, he made a road trip through different parts of the universe whuppin' superpowered beings left and right.

Originally posted by Tron
I think Doomsday has evolved past the point of fatigue, so I doubt it. Remember, he made a road trip through different parts of the universe whuppin' superpowered beings left and right.

DD has unlimited stamina?

I haven't read too much into Doomsday as most on here, but it wouldn't surprise me. The ability to evolve past just about anything is a pretty convenient plot device to have. Someone else could probably break it down a little better than I can though.

I've actually thought about this fight before and how it would play out.
Basically it starts out slow Doomsday is wrecking a city Cain is wrecking the same city they see each other and of the bat hate each other. People always seem to dislike that which is similar to them and cain and DD are very similar creatures.
Cain: "Alright you walking freak get out of my way before I crush you."
Before Cain can blink though a grey blur stands where Doomsday was and before Cain can realize what is going one he is flying backwards through buildings at lighting speed.
Cain goes to stand up one hand on his knee before he sees another grey blur coming once again once again his feet are off the ground hurtling towards wherever.
Once Juggernaut lands though he is fed up with this and begins to walk forward once again the grey blur comes this time though cain feels something but keep walking forward. He hears buildings crashing all around as Doomsday rockets from Juggs into the surrounding city. This repeats a couple of times.
Cain(Laughing): "Don't ya know I'm the Juggernaut Unstoppable get it"
Doomsday stands there wondering how to stop Cain as he is getting closer doomsday gets a thought.
As Cain gets close Doomsday doesn't stop Cain's momentum but uses it coming around Cain he kicks him in the back straight forward throwing Cain out of the city for miles and miles he is flying until he hits the ground causing quite a ditch to be made some hundred miles long. Now this repeats until Cain is standing at a beach.
Cain looks up and sees the creature standing in front of him.
Cain Stands up and is immediately pushed back into the water waist deep.
Cain: "I'm through meshing around"
Just then Doomsday grey blur slows down and he is now moving exactly at Cain's speed. Doomsday stops for awhile wondering how this can be.
Cain: "Thats my shield and can take away inertia great little thing for speed demons like you"
Next they Stand looking at each other neither one making a move they both know that all tricks are gone this is gonna come down to fist o cuffs and sheer determination.
Dooms day makes the first move and lays a blow into Cain that causes the Earth to shake. The Ocean behind Cain surges backward from the force created. Though Cain doesn't budge then Cain throws a counter connecting with Doomsday Shaking the Earth once more causing the ground behind DD to split open. Lava begins to spew from it it went that deep it.
Soon the begin to Rain Blow upon blow shaking the Earth to its foundation force like this has never before been seen.

well eventually this leads to the planet begin destroyed and them just standing there looking at each other not able to move and get to each other.

Interesting.

look I'm sorry but in my experience of avid fandom in both DC and Marvel, Juggernaught needs the helmet to block attacks that go for the mind and also for his eyes (because the helmet is stated to protect him from surges of bright light). As proven, however, in x-men on multiple occasions - the helmet can be removed. This unveils a weakspot in Juggernaught. Doomsday could easily lobotomize him and without a brain brute force is useless. None of this would work vice versa because Doomsday as already surpassed such limitations.

As a side-point I wasn't stating that DD would suddenly develop magical abilities, I was simply saying that Juggernaught as those limitations in place and when anyone reads the incantation from the ruby of cyttorak THEY receive the power meaning it is funnelled out of Cain Marko's body and into whoever is using the magic at that point in time. This takes with it his ability to heal any injury previously inflicted and I think that considering DD evolves constantly AND comes from a highly superior race that he would figure this out during the battle and use that limitation to his advantage. All I meant was that Juggernaught's power is dependent on someone else - i.e. Cyttorak, whereas DD's power is all his own. This makes him superior.

Originally posted by Kon El
look I'm sorry but in my experience of avid fandom in both DC and Marvel, Juggernaught needs the helmet to block attacks that go for the mind and also for his eyes (because the helmet is stated to protect him from surges of bright light). As proven, however, in x-men on multiple occasions - the helmet can be removed. This unveils a weakspot in Juggernaught. Doomsday could easily lobotomize him and without a brain brute force is useless. None of this would work vice versa because Doomsday as already surpassed such limitations.

As a side-point I wasn't stating that DD would suddenly develop magical abilities, I was simply saying that Juggernaught as those limitations in place and when anyone reads the incantation from the ruby of cyttorak THEY receive the power meaning it is funnelled out of Cain Marko's body and into whoever is using the magic at that point in time. This takes with it his ability to heal any injury previously inflicted and I think that considering DD evolves constantly AND comes from a highly superior race that he would figure this out during the battle and use that limitation to his advantage. All I meant was that Juggernaught's power is dependent on someone else - i.e. Cyttorak, whereas DD's power is all his own. This makes him superior.
According to that logic, Wolverine > Superman, since Logan's abilities are his own and Supes's powers are dependant upon the sun.

Juggernaut's helmet protects him from telepathy, his only weakness. His head is still physically invulnerable without it. Unless DD develops the power to mind-rape someone, removing the helmet wouldn't do him any good.

Really, the only way for DD to win would be a ring-out.

Well once Doomsday can go as fast or faster then the speed of light I don't see how Juggernaughts shield can prevent him from a ring out anyway...................DD will BFR him.

That technicality is insufficient though. Superman's extended power is based on presence of yellow light *(and variations as far as can be seen with light at similar wavelengths). Being however that he is kryptonian his cellular biology and general physiology are already more efficient than homosapien/superior. Plus by extension of the reliance of power if you want to take it THAT far, Wolverine has nothing that would be particularly useful in a fight outside of adamantium that was grafted to his bones (ok bone-claw but I mean, bones are breakable). This too can be seen as a reliance. What I meant was that in actual fact Juggernaught has COMPLETE reliance on magically enhancing his power. This DOES make him inequal because unlike having a naturally occuring gene mutation or being born of an alien race or being a tormented clone of a superior race... he is in essence human.

Ok first off where has the conception that Cain's head is weak his head is just as tough as his body and his helmet's only use is to protect him from telelpathic attacks.

How is DD gonna BFR Cain hmm. Superman could do it becuae let's see he can what FLY thats right last time I checked DD couldn't do that and hasn't shown to be able to do it.

Next Cain is about as Human now as Superman is, Cain is no mortal human anymore.

Incorrect. Cain is only greater than human when he is the Juggernaught which involves manipulating the Ruby of Cyttorak. As I understand it though, his powers were lately revoked by Cyttorak leaving only an increase in his physical strength at a base level, but he has to breath etc so that's wrong for a start.

Secondly, even if we aren't talking about that version, the ruby does not protect Cain's head from penetrating attacks. He could be lobotomized.

Thirdly, The usage of the helmet is to filter strong light and protect his head. Not ONLY from telepathy but also from attack. That is WHY the helmet is there. In many versions his helmet is removed and he's using a different version that can not only not block telepathy but also can't block super-strong physical attacks. The head was always designed as the only possible weak point in his body.

Forthly, the constraint of his power is to foes not native to this planet. a la Glads, a la phoenix, and I'm guessing a la DD. He would be STOMPED. He has no way or means of defeating DD and I notice that everyone is hopping on the bandwagon of how DD couldn't defeat him, I have given many ways in which he could in fact defeat him - but conversely how could Juggernaught defeat DD? answer - he couldn't.

Originally posted by Kon El
Incorrect. Cain is only greater than human when he is the Juggernaught which involves manipulating the Ruby of Cyttorak. As I understand it though, his powers were lately revoked by Cyttorak leaving only an increase in his physical strength at a base level, but he has to breath etc so that's wrong for a start.

Secondly, even if we aren't talking about that version, the ruby does not protect Cain's head from penetrating attacks. He could be lobotomized.

Thirdly, The usage of the helmet is to filter strong light and protect his head. Not ONLY from telepathy but also from attack. That is WHY the helmet is there. In many versions his helmet is removed and he's using a different version that can not only not block telepathy but also can't block super-strong physical attacks. The head was always designed as the only possible weak point in his body.

Forthly, the constraint of his power is to foes not native to this planet. a la Glads, a la phoenix, and I'm guessing a la DD. He would be STOMPED. He has no way or means of defeating DD and I notice that everyone is hopping on the bandwagon of how DD couldn't defeat him, I have given many ways in which he could in fact defeat him - but conversely how could Juggernaught defeat DD? answer - he couldn't.
Firstly Cain has gone toe to toe with the Hulk without his helmet on he did just fine without it the helmet was never meant to protect him physical attacks just mental where you are getting this I have no idea.

Secondly yes his current version is weaker but no one really debates with that version and instead uses the Classic version mostly unless he is stated to be another version.

Finally he has tangled with creatures outside of planet before. A La Nightmare a creature that imprisoned Eternity and Dr. Strange. He has beaten Thor and took Thor's best shots last time I checked Thor isn't from Earth. Glads only happened in the cartoon and Phoenix one of the highest powers in the MU. DD is a physical brick that was given the biggest Plot Device but still is beaten isn't he. DD can't d anything to Cain to hurt him.
How could Cain beat DD well if you read my story I didn't say he would did I. I said Stalemate.

LOL a discussion about Cain vs Doomsday lol yeah this is the creature that evolved past Gogs!

Originally posted by Soleran
LOL a discussion about Cain vs Doomsday lol yeah this is the creature that evolved past Gogs! You lauhg like this is a joke you know what Cain has handled Superman level beings before with ease Thor anyone.

Originally posted by newjak86
You lauhg like this is a joke you know what Cain has handled Superman level beings before with ease Thor anyone.



Yeah yeah yeah I keep hearing this focus crap and in reality it happened in 2 comics Avengers 3rd series and issues 24 and 25! I mean lets get real here 2 comics THATS IT.

Juggernaut doesn't focus his powers the way people keep yammering about, he was being partially controlled by Cytorrak and it states that in the comic itself.

Doomsday will just get to the point he will drag cain along and bounce him around like a fun bouncy ball.

Originally posted by Soleran
Yeah yeah yeah I keep hearing this focus crap and in reality it happened in 2 comics Avengers 3rd series and issues 24 and 25! I mean lets get real here 2 comics THATS IT.

Juggernaut doesn't focus his powers the way people keep yammering about, he was being partially controlled by Cytorrak and it states that in the comic itself.

Doomsday will just get to the point he will drag cain along and bounce him around like a fun bouncy ball. Yeah it only happens a few actually. Cain did it when he fought D'Spayre. You see D'Spayre even managed to drain Cain of some of his power but when he got angry guess what he basically powered up. When fighting one team of X-Men his friend Black Tom got hurt he decided to end the fight right then and there. He clapped his hands and it was over. Most of the time he just throws people out of his way if they get in his way he hardly ever tries but to say he only got focsed twice then you don't know what your talking about. So yes he can focus his power without being controlled.

Actually he wasn't defeated, everyone in the DCU was smart enough to realise they couldn't beat him and so they just displaced him to the phantom zone. If we're using classic, the incantation can still be removed just by reciting the incantation and after that he has nothing.

going toe-to-toe with the Hulk is no big deal, strategy over force. This is where he would fall (and Hulk can be taken down by a 17 year old girl no less. I've read it happen). Also... Thor is from Valhalla which is in MU supposedly just over Earth, but I digress.
During several back-issues of Avengers, it is stated that Thor exercises restraint on his power whilst on Earth because of the damage he could inflict so that battle is again no big deal.

Oh, and the thing about the weakness in his head... that was purposely placed by Cyttorak (deity).

Physically and especially strategically, the fight is in DD's favour. Cain doesn't stand a chance.

Originally posted by Kon El
Actually he wasn't defeated, everyone in the DCU was smart enough to realise they couldn't beat him and so they just displaced him to the phantom zone. If we're using classic, the incantation can still be removed just by reciting the incantation and after that he has nothing.

going toe-to-toe with the Hulk is no big deal, strategy over force. This is where he would fall (and Hulk can be taken down by a 17 year old girl no less. I've read it happen). Also... Thor is from Valhalla which is in MU supposedly just over Earth, but I digress.
During several back-issues of Avengers, it is stated that Thor exercises restraint on his power whilst on Earth because of the damage he could inflict so that battle is again no big deal.

Oh, and the thing about the weakness in his head... that was purposely placed by Cyttorak (deity).

Physically and especially strategically, the fight is in DD's favour. Cain doesn't stand a chance. Going toe to toe with the Hulk is no big deal well yeah I guess your right everyone and there mother can beat Hulk right
Thor is from Asgard which is the nine worlds basically a different dimension. It also states When he is fighting Cain that he must cut loose all his power nad it still does nothing to Cain doesn't hurt him at all. Actually the incantation can't be taken away or they would have done it already.
The weakness in the head doesn't exist I would like to know where you got this from exactly.

Originally posted by newjak86
Going toe to toe with the Hulk is no big deal well yeah I guess your right everyone and there mother can beat Hulk right
Thor is from Asgard which is the nine worlds basically a different dimension. It also states When he is fighting Cain that he must cut loose all his power nad it still does nothing to Cain doesn't hurt him at all. Actually the incantation can't be taken away or they would have done it already.
The weakness in the head doesn't exist I would like to know where you got this from exactly.


This is where I step back and say its sad to see someone grasping for straws and attempting to hold onto something

Doomsday powers up FAR FAR beyond anything Juggernaut has ever done.

Originally posted by Soleran
This is where I step back and say its sad to see someone grasping for straws and attempting to hold onto something

Doomsday powers up FAR FAR beyond anything Juggernaut has ever done. really so now Doomsday can punch through deminsions now.
Oh wait no he doesn't thats right.

Yeah. everyone and their mother can - Laurie Collins could, and she's a 17 year old girl from New x-men with the ability to control pheremones.

Secondly, the classic series and one of the old back-issues ran a story-line in which an architect stumbled across the ruby and the tabulet, read the inscription and Cain was left for dead... only to be saved by the x-men oh and eh btw this is the classic version of Juggernaught.

can you say outclassed?

Originally posted by newjak86
really so now Doomsday can punch through deminsions now.
Oh wait no he doesn't thats right. `


LOL do I need to post the rules of this forum for you, lol.

Juggernaut was possessed when that happened, just like in 8th day he was partially controlled by Cytorrak, just stop the fanboyism.

Originally posted by Kon El
Yeah. everyone and their mother can - Laurie Collins could, and she's a 17 year old girl from New x-men with the ability to control pheremones.

Secondly, the classic series and one of the old back-issues ran a story-line in which an architect stumbled across the ruby and the tabulet, read the inscription and Cain was left for dead... only to be saved by the x-men oh and eh btw this is the classic version of Juggernaught.

can you say outclassed? Outclassed because a guy stumbles upon the ruby and reads where exactly is Doomsday gonna get this ruby.
Yeah a mutant girl that can control Pheromones that makes the Hulk so bad when Hulk has fought being like Hercules Thor the avengers together yeah he is such a weak oppenent becuase of one thing.
Don't get me wrong Doomsday is a beast but I know both and nothing shows me more than a stalemate.

This isn't fanboyism. It's logic. I actually happen to really like Juggernaught as a character and would be vaguely aware of Doomsday part in DC. The fact is, he is still stronger, and it's ludicrous to suggest otherwise. The classic episode version had nothing to do with possession of Cain/Juggernaught. The power was up for grabs, and it was no longer his but instead someone elses. That is one serious limitation, and any that Doomsday even would have, he'd overcome. How exactly could that result in a stalemate? DD plays on that weakness, and Cain is done.

Oh come on I know it's a side-point but the Hulk could be beaten by wolverine (and has in a what-if), rogue, wallflower and a variety of people. I'm not saying he isn't a power-house, what I'm saying is that strategy prevails.

Originally posted by Soleran
`


LOL do I need to post the rules of this forum for you, lol.

Juggernaut was possessed when that happened, just like in 8th day he was partially controlled by Cytorrak, just stop the fanboyism. Yeah I know forum rules and I hate to tell you this but your supposed to take characters at there best. He was controlled but all that power he was using he can use without being controlled get me the more he focuses the more power he can obtain basically its how much he wants something.
Fanboyism am I now what exactly have I done I have given facts about a character that you can not disprove at all. Your picking at straws trying to break them down. Oh he was told to do something being possessed after all, when Cain has stopped fooling around well he is called a demigod for a reason.

Originally posted by Kon El
This isn't fanboyism. It's logic. I actually happen to really like Juggernaught as a character and would be vaguely aware of Doomsday part in DC. The fact is, he is still stronger, and it's ludicrous to suggest otherwise. The classic episode version had nothing to do with possession of Cain/Juggernaught. The power was up for grabs, and it was no longer his but instead someone elses. That is one serious limitation, and any that Doomsday even would have, he'd overcome. How exactly could that result in a stalemate? DD plays on that weakness, and Cain is done. Um let me get this straight are you using the T.V. show when describing when he lost his powers I think you are because I watched that one.
Hulk has also been shown to be a top contender in the scheme of things as well. Technically Cain has never been given a limit to his strength and his durability is limitless when it comes to physical power.

Originally posted by newjak86
Yeah I know forum rules and I hate to tell you this but your supposed to take characters at there best. He was controlled but all that power he was using he can use without being controlled get me the more he focuses the more power he can obtain basically its how much he wants something.
Fanboyism am I now what exactly have I done I have given facts about a character that you can not disprove at all. Your picking at straws trying to break them down. Oh he was told to do something being possessed after all, when Cain has stopped fooling around well he is called a demigod for a reason.

'Demigod'? has the word been redefined lately? Because I'm pretty sure a demi-god is someone with one parent who is a god, and the another who isn't. I was always fairly certain his powers were mystical and he was in fact a human and never called a demi-god by anyone who acknowledges the meaning of the word. However, you are correct if by saying 'cannot disprove' you actually mean cannot disprove the premise whereby you change the meaning of words for no particular reason.

It is also assumed that the characters fight at their optimum levels of ability - not explicitly weakened or unusually powered up for those who have variable power levels.


See where it says unusually powered up? Yeah thats where Trion and 8th day Juggs goes south because its a one time limited showing with him being unusually powered up.

DD as I said makes Cain his bouncy ball, the end.

PS reread the rules you skipped a few lines.

Originally posted by Kon El
'Demigod'? has the word been redefined lately? Because I'm pretty sure a demi-god is someone with one parent who is a god, and the another who isn't. I was always fairly certain his powers were mystical and he was in fact a human and never called a demi-god by anyone who acknowledges the meaning of the word. However, you are correct if by saying 'cannot disprove' you actually mean cannot disprove the premise whereby you change the meaning of words for no particular reason. He was called a demi-god in the 8th Day saga to show that his power is derived from a God that is the way Marvel used it then. Infact in that saga he was shown to well lets say he got in a fight that was said to be shattering the Earth and that no force had ever before been shown.

Originally posted by newjak86
Um let me get this straight are you using the T.V. show when describing when he lost his powers I think you are because I watched that one.
Hulk has also been shown to be a top contender in the scheme of things as well. Technically Cain has never been given a limit to his strength and his durability is limitless when it comes to physical power.

Yes, both the hulk and cain are top contenders underneath everyone who could beat them. that list stands at:

The Collins
every telepath
silver surfer
Thanos
Galactus
Terrax

and more that I can't be bothered to continue the list using. Physical strength and durability is pointless in mentioning at this point because the same has been stated for Doomsday, only his power isn't mystical.

Originally posted by Soleran
It is also assumed that the characters fight at their optimum levels of ability - not explicitly weakened or unusually powered up for those who have variable power levels.


See where it says unusually powered up? Yeah thats where Trion and 8th day Juggs goes south because its a one time limited showing with him being unusually powered up.

DD as I said makes Cain his bouncy ball, the end.

PS reread the rules you skipped a few lines. Um 8th Day has been proven to not be stronger than Classic just more focused as stated by the editors at the time. Basically 8th Day is Classic and therefore valid. Is also stated that he can call upon the limitless power opf Cyttorak to boost his strength.

Originally posted by Kon El
Yes, both the hulk and cain are top contenders underneath everyone who could beat them. that list stands at:

The Collins
every telepath
silver surfer
Thanos
Galactus
Terrax

and more that I can't be bothered to continue the list using. Physical strength and durability is pointless in mentioning at this point because the same has been stated for Doomsday, only his power isn't mystical. Yeah and basically all those characters aren't Doomsday right and have other means of attacking besides physical power, they have BFR telepathy all that. Doomsday has none of that. Doomsday is just like Cain in that they can't be beat physically all Doomsday has on Cain is Speed and guess what Cain has a shield that can slow down Momentum so no one has an advantage.

LOL did you not read that comic! Juggernaut is partially controlled by Cytorrak in that comic and is driven to his purpose.

Whatever it doesn't follow the rules, 2 comics thats it he has never again done that. Its a limited time showing but I mean bring in Gog wars Doomsdy if you want 8th day.....................Gogs war Doomsday would eat Cains heart

psst and after you reread the rules go reread the comic where it states Cain is being controlled by Cytorrak.

Originally posted by Kon El
Incorrect. Cain is only greater than human when he is the Juggernaught which involves manipulating the Ruby of Cyttorak. As I understand it though, his powers were lately revoked by Cyttorak leaving only an increase in his physical strength at a base level, but he has to breath etc so that's wrong for a start.

Wrong, Cytorrak's power put him in the 100+ class, right up there with Hulk and Thor, which had been shown many times.

Originally posted by Kon El
Secondly, even if we aren't talking about that version, the ruby does not protect Cain's head from penetrating attacks. He could be lobotomized.

No, he can't. The power physically protects the skin around his entire body, that includes his head. Sure, you could stab him in the eye like Shatterstar did, but he would heal from that almost instantly, like it never happened.

Originally posted by Kon El
Thirdly, The usage of the helmet is to filter strong light and protect his head. Not ONLY from telepathy but also from attack. That is WHY the helmet is there. In many versions his helmet is removed and he's using a different version that can not only not block telepathy but also can't block super-strong physical attacks. The head was always designed as the only possible weak point in his body.

I don't know where you got that from, but it's only function over the years was against psionics. Now, THAT is why the helmet's there. His head has never been shown to be susceptible to physical attacks (if it has, give me an example).

Originally posted by Kon El
Forthly, the constraint of his power is to foes not native to this planet. a la Glads, a la phoenix, and I'm guessing a la DD. He would be STOMPED. He has no way or means of defeating DD and I notice that everyone is hopping on the bandwagon of how DD couldn't defeat him, I have given many ways in which he could in fact defeat him - but conversely how could Juggernaught defeat DD? answer - he couldn't.

The constraint of his power? Are you talking about the same Juggernaut that laid out the Stranger? That alone makes that point kinda mute.

Now, this is all referring to classic Juggernaut, of course. Not saying he would win, just making a point.

Originally posted by Soleran
LOL did you not read that comic! Juggernaut is partially controlled by Cytorrak in that comic and is driven to his purpose.

Whatever it doesn't follow the rules, 2 comics thats it he has never again done that. Its a limited time showing but I mean bring in Gog wars Doomsdy if you want 8th day.....................Gogs war Doomsday would eat Cains heart

psst and after you reread the rules go reread the comic where it states Cain is being controlled by Cytorrak. Cain is being called upon to due his duty he still Cain but with a purpose even though he was doing what Cyttorak wanted.
secondly towards the end he is not being controled and instead beats up on the other Exemplars. In which case then he fights someone else where the earth is said to Shatter resists the telepathic attacks of Bedlam and basically destroys the God machine. And if you want to bring in Gogs war Doomsday well all it is is him just immune to Gogs attacks but still a physical power Cain is basically unlimited in those areas.

I got your back Newjack, you'll just have to wait a minute.

Actually it'd be logical that after any great length of fighting, DD could evolve beyond the mystical power of cyttorak that sheilds Juggernaught, and then you know... pulverise him.

Yea, I don't think he can gain the ability to wield magic. Magic isn't of this world so he couldn't evolve with that power

Well it wouldn't be that he'd be able to wield it, it would just be that it became ineffective against his attacks. Which is a possibility.

You see thats impossible, it goes out of his design. The only counter against magic is stronger magic.

Originally posted by soujaboy09
You see thats impossible, it goes out of his design. The only counter against magic is stronger magic.


LOL even Thanos says VETO to that. Odin and Thanos fight, Thanos uses science to counter Odin's magic energy....................energy is energy.

He overcame GL's and for practical purpose that is magic...............science driven by willpower..................err yea ok.

I don't think GL wields magic, and if he does it's not touching the magic that runs through Cains veins.

Comics state that their version of magic are simply laws of science that cannot be quantified. Using this as the premise there is no reason for magic to become ineffective against DD's cellular structure.

Where is that stated?

In comics thus far magic> science

Perfect example is Dr.Strange vs Reed Richards

Originally posted by soujaboy09
Where is that stated?

In comics thus far magic> science

Perfect example is Dr.Strange vs Reed Richards


Uh What about Thanos vs Odin? That fight's ALOT bigger

You can use that fight to

Yeah Thanos used science and stayed even with Odin in Asgard..................................so apparently science can = magic.

Ok then so according to you then DD can overcome magic alrighty thanks for clarifying!

Don't make me go get the scans. Odin wasn't even using his full power and he was beating Thanos down, Thanos did no damage to Odin whatsoever.

Ok I will look for the exact strip and send it in, but basically after Superman is brought back from the dead Bruce Wayne corners him and questions how he managed it. The dialogue entails Batman telling him that this is unnatural because he has managed to grasp concepts of theortical quantum physics, and also magic which is generally other-dimension science, but cannot understand this feat. Also it is stated by Mr Fantastic in comics which I do not unfortunately own.. but you can see it for yourself on his biography in wikipedia.

Link: - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mr_Fantastic

extract: - He has admitted, on more then one occasion, to being incapable of understanding magic, as he cannot begin to fathom an aspect of science (as he calls it) that is not based in quantifiable laws and rules.

That is what magic is based on and there is no reason why it would even be a limitation that DD could not overcome.

I don't think magic is based on science, it could be that science is based on magic.

How can Mr. Fantastic make a judgement on magic if he doesn't understand it?

Originally posted by soujaboy09
Don't make me go get the scans. Odin wasn't even using his full power and he was beating Thanos down, Thanos did no damage to Odin whatsoever.


LOL oh you silly boy, get so sidetracked and fixated. Thanos doesn't have to win to show science can have a large impact on magic, he did it in that fight.

Tyrant uses science and he would DESTROY Odin with his magic.


Doomsday uses science and can and will overcome Juggernaut.


I mean for all the Cyttorak crack talk he has hardly any showings of power and he also got humiliated by his own avatar. Now seriously what kind of punk god gets beat by his templar lol....................I don't see Thor beating Odin, Hercules stompin Zeus.................nope only Cytorrak.

Furthermore the war between science and magic is too inconclusive to draw a decision from alone. For instance during the battle between Solomon Grundy who had been revived using choas magic and was levelling a city, the fight was ended by the nth metal that hawkgirl carries in the form of a mace.

Originally posted by Kon El
Furthermore the war between science and magic is too inconclusive to draw a decision from alone. For instance during the battle between Solomon Grundy who had been revived using choas magic and was levelling a city, the fight was ended by the nth metal that hawkgirl carries in the form of a mace.

They don't consider the series canon in these forums.

That wasn't just mr Fantastic's view on magic. The point was, DC and Marvel use their characters as an expression point for how their universe works. Being that as the premise they set, DD would win.

The difference between science and magic seems to be paradoxical at best. One is based on logical understanding of set laws and rules, and the other breaks them but as far as can be seen they are derived from eachother.

When has science ever been able to tear through dimensions with sheer force? You think that Tyrant could defeat Odin in a bloodlusted battle? I find that funny.

Cyttorak is at least on the same level as Death, and Eternity so how do you figure Cyttorak is weak?

Cyttorak isn't what is under discussion, the power he imparts to his lackey is, and it doesn't seem sufficient to stop DD from crushing him.

Originally posted by soujaboy09
When has science ever been able to tear through dimensions with sheer force? You think that Tyrant could defeat Odin in a bloodlusted battle? I find that funny.

Cyttorak is at least on the same level as Death, and Eternity so how do you figure Cyttorak is weak?


Thats ok I find most of what you say amusing seeing as a fully powered Tyrant is practically on tiers with Galactus who is leagues above Odin.


LOL Cyttorak isn't on the level of abstracts, derp derp once again Cyttorak has ONE high showing BIG woop. I didn't say Cyttorak was weak, please slow down and read more carefully. Cyttorak hasn't had enough showings for jack.

Point is Doomsday will evolve beyond, Cain. DD evolved past Gogs and they are so much more powerful then Cain its retarded. Doomsday wins

Yet he stopped Eternity from crushing him, you underestimate his power. He wields the power of a whole dimension, that is beyond the power of many.

Yeah and if this thread was DD vs Cyttorak the outcome might be different, being that it's Cain Marko, DD would win.

Cyttorak never put a limit on Juggernauts power, thats why it's always stated that Juggernaut can call on the limitless power of Cyttorak.

Originally posted by soujaboy09
Cyttorak never put a limit on Juggernauts power, thats why it's always stated that Juggernaut can call on the limitless power of Cyttorak.



here comes another DERP DERP Cyttoraks power isn't limitless............................its called hyperbole (an exageration)

Cain HAS NEVER shown feats greater then DD's period just hasn't done it. Poor Cain is just a slow tank with MOSTER durability and strength and thats not gonna help him vs DD.

Acknowledge and move on or show Cain feats greater then a Gogswar DD.

Difference is there's no reason for DD to not be able to evolve past the strength and sheilds of Juggernaught, whereas there is the possibility of Cyttorak trapping DD in a pocket dimension, J could not. DD could kill Juggernaught, limitless strength or not.

How is it Hyporbole? do you have a scan showing that it's not true? has cain ever had a problem with anything when he needed it?

He hasn't shown feats as good as DD's? Do you need scans

Bring in Gog wars DD, and ill bring up Trion Juggernaut

Originally posted by Kon El
Difference is there's no reason for DD to not be able to evolve past the strength and sheilds of Juggernaught, whereas there is the possibility of Cyttorak trapping DD in a pocket dimension, J could not. DD could kill Juggernaught, limitless strength or not.

Saying Juggernaut can die is like saying that DD cant evolve

Originally posted by soujaboy09
How is it Hyporbole? do you have a scan showing that it's not true? has cain ever had a problem with anything when he needed it?

He hasn't shown feats as good as DD's? Do you need scans

Bring in Gog wars DD, and ill bring up Trion Juggernaut


Trion Juggernaut isn't Classic Juggs he was possessed Gogwars Doomsday was still just Doomsday.

Show me a scan with cain and his UNLIMITED POWER, not even Odin is unlimited nor Galactus nor Death etc etc..................being in the Crimson Cosmos in a pocket universe makes it impossible to have unlimited because its just a pocket and he doesn't have that much power.

Doomsday is beyond Juggernaut, he has never done anything (as Cain Marko not possesed by Cyttorak) that rivals anything remotely close to DD.

Yeah ok, I used to strong a word, maybe he wouldn't kill him, but he would certainly defeat him.

**too

Originally posted by Soleran
Trion Juggernaut isn't Classic Juggs he was possessed Gogwars Doomsday was still just Doomsday.

Show me a scan with cain and his UNLIMITED POWER, not even Odin is unlimited nor Galactus nor Death etc etc..................being in the Crimson Cosmos in a pocket universe makes it impossible to have unlimited because its just a pocket and he doesn't have that much power.

Doomsday is beyond Juggernaut, he has never done anything (as Cain Marko not possesed by Cyttorak) that rivals anything remotely close to DD.

Cyttorak doesn't have that much power? why do you just state things without any proof? That same power gave Juggernaut the ability to destroy dimensions is the same power you render "weak"

Cain hasn't done anything that rivals DD? post a scan of something DD has done and I will see if I can get a scan of Juggernauts the rivals it.

Do you have proof that Cyttoraks power isn't unlimited?

oh my at fanboy's wits ends, how about the fact he was able to facilitate Superman's demise, destroy Green Lanterns etc etc

Juggernaut is taking a big BFR on this, something you just need to sit back take a deep breathe and realize.

Oh and no you want to play split hairs semantics with me and Cyttorak show me he is UNLIMITED in power......................which would be IMPOSSIBLE because Juggernaut took him out! Think about it, how paradoxical!

Ok, and Juggernaut almost killed Thor, took the god blast with no problem, nearly destroyed the world by pushing someone ext, ext.

How is DD going to BFR Juggernaut without the ability to fly?

I think this is a Stalemate, because they cant kill eachother period, untill you can prove otherwise this is how it's going to be.

Show me DD can overcome magic

Small fractions of Cyttoraks power

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e101/Soujaboy/tapping1.jpg

lol nope and you know why Superman knocked out Thor...............DD was the piece that killed Superman.

DD doesn't have to fly to BFR him, DD moves as fast or faster then Superman and is stronger...................Juggernaut won't even know what hit him, he'd just be flying......................he wouldn't have time to even see DD.

Once again read the rules soujaboy, something you can never understand Trion Juggs isn't valid he was possesed by Cyttorak and it isn't his normal powers.

Originally posted by soujaboy09
Ok, and Juggernaut almost killed Thor, took the god blast with no problem, nearly destroyed the world by pushing someone ext, ext.

How is DD going to BFR Juggernaut without the ability to fly?

I think this is a Stalemate, because they cant kill eachother period, untill you can prove otherwise this is how it's going to be.

Show me DD can overcome magic

Doomsday can't overcome Juggernaut's magic? :

Powers and Abilities
Doomsday was created and evolved through cloning an infant and having it killed over and over again by some of Krypton's most dangerous prehistoric wildlife. As such, he returns to life every time he dies and becomes resistant or immune to what killed him before. An example of this was how Doomsday was immune to the Radiants energy after being killed by the Radiant the first time they fought. Doomsday can also become resistant to whatever injures or harms him which was demonstrated in the Superman/Doomsday: Hunter/Prey series. Superman used a sound gun to paralyze Doomsday but Doomsdays auditory canals simply closed up making him impervious to Superman's weapon. Doomsday also has a highly accelerated healing ability that allows him to heal and regenerate from damage almost instantly. Like Superman, Doomsday also absorbs solar radiation and can store it for thousands of years. As a result of his engineering Doomsday does not need to eat, drink, breathe, or sleep and his body is almost solid mass.

Doomsday's physical abilites perhaps even surpass Superman. Doomsday's strength has no known limits and is such that he can easily move weight in excess of 200 tons. His other abilities include extreme resistance to heat, cold, and injury allowing him to survive on the most inhospitable worlds as well as survive in the vacuum of space. Doomsday possesses almost inexhaustable endurance and stamina. Superman once remarked on Doomsday, "We've been fighting all day and Doomsday doesn't seem to have slowed down". Most surprising is his reflexes and speed for his size. In a matter of seconds Doomsday mananged to render most of the Justice League incapable of fighting and Booster Gold stated "This guy's faster than Flash!".

There is no point of debating with you, because you just ignore the facts.

You always preach about the rules and the you bring up a non cannon situation.

Now your saying that Juggernaut can take full powered blows from Thor's hammer with no prblem but will be sent flying from a punch by DD?

Originally posted by soujaboy09
There is no point of debating with me, because I just ignore the facts.




I couldn't agree more

Wow so now you edit my post? are you trying to say I ignore the facts when im the one giving them? silly boy how can that be?

Originally posted by Soleran
I mean for all the Cyttorak crack talk he has hardly any showings of power and he also got humiliated by his own avatar. Now seriously what kind of punk god gets beat by his templar lol....................I don't see Thor beating Odin, Hercules stompin Zeus.................nope only Cytorrak.

Actually, in Dr. Strange: Sorcerer Supreme #49 (I believe that's the number if I rememeber right), he was shown punking other entities like him. Don't believe it? Look up that issue. And it's almost common knowledge that he held Galactus in his dimension.)

Originally posted by Tron
Actually, in Dr. Strange: Sorcerer Supreme #49 (I believe that's the number if I rememeber right), he was shown punking other entities like him. Don't believe it? Look up that issue. And it's almost common knowledge that he held Galactus in his dimension.)

There no reson to tell him anything, he will just ignore it

stalemate. When soujaboy and soleran get in a forum together it goes down hill. No offense to either of you but darn...
post editing and reciting of the same stuff over and over. Don't bring up trion he doesn't count. However, Soleran's stubborn refusal to accept the fact that juggernauts has the ability to boost his strength with focus is extremely irritating. It has occured in more than the 8th day get over it.

Kon-el all i can say is read a few comics when you post here, cartoons don't count. Still can't believe that you argued with NEWJACK, when all you had for a basis was cartoons.

Booster Golds "OPINION" was that doomsday was faster than flash but, we can't know that because they haven't raced. And i doubt he is because flash is built on speed and can tap the speed force!

bad end to a worse day...

Im sorry

Originally posted by outarddwarf
stalemate. When soujaboy and soleran get in a forum together it goes down hill. No offense to either of you but darn...
post editing and reciting of the same stuff over and over. Don't bring up trion he doesn't count. However, Soleran's stubborn refusal to accept the fact that juggernauts has the ability to boost his strength with focus is extremely irritating. It has occured in more than the 8th day get over it.

Kon-el all i can say is read a few comics when you post here, cartoons don't count. Still can't believe that you argued with NEWJACK, when all you had for a basis was cartoons.

Booster Golds "OPINION" was that doomsday was faster than flash but, we can't know that because they haven't raced. And i doubt he is because flash is built on speed and can tap the speed force!

bad end to a worse day...


Is strength going to beat a monster that evolves past whatever it faces?

Also DD is still as fast as Superman and that is leagues above Juggernauts speed which is why its a BFR, regardless of Juggernauts strength which is moot due to DD's strength and speed combo.

He's not going to punch Juggernaut into space

It will be a stalemate, you cant evolve past magic

Originally posted by soujaboy09
He's not going to punch Juggernaut into space

It will be a stalemate, you cant evolve past magic


Spiderman with unipower punched Hulk into space DD can do the same thing. DD has Superman Speed levels and Strength levels and its going to end up a BFR, Juggernaut cannot touch DD unless he lets him.

We have already been over this, Juggernaut's durability dwarfs Gray Hulk, and any Hulk incarnation for that matter. If Juggernaut is even moving he's not going in any direction he doesn't want to. He can counter Doomsday's superspeed with his magical force field. Doomsday wont touch Juggernaut unless he lets him.

This fight would end up more than likely a stalemate, I see Juggernaut wearing Doomsday down at first, but then Doomsday will adapt to the beating. Since neither will be beaten in terms of strength or verstility, neither will win.

I don't think there is a comic book company in the world that would take a definate stand on this.

The pit the two up against each other and it's up to the resident heroes to stop the two from destroying everything in the area.

HARD to call two incredible beings but because of his protection i would have to say the juggernaut .

Originally posted by soujaboy09
We have already been over this, Juggernaut's durability dwarfs Gray Hulk, and any Hulk incarnation for that matter. If Juggernaut is even moving he's not going in any direction he doesn't want to. He can counter Doomsday's superspeed with his magical force field. Doomsday wont touch Juggernaut unless he lets him.


Has the Hulk ever thrown Juggernaut?

WHEN JUGGERNAUT USES HIS FORCE FIELD HE CAN'T BE MOVED

Originally posted by juggernaut66666
WHEN JUGGERNAUT USES HIS FORCE FIELD HE CAN'T BE MOVED
and please someone rate my sig

Originally posted by Soleran
Has the Hulk ever thrown Juggernaut?

Yes Hulk has thrown Juggernaut. Juggernaut just flew into a mountain, got back and called Hulk stupid because he couldn't comprehend that Cain couldn't be hurt.

Originally posted by juggernaut66666
and please someone rate my sig

8/10

Originally posted by soujaboy09
Yes Hulk has thrown Juggernaut. Juggernaut just flew into a mountain, got back and called Hulk stupid because he couldn't comprehend that Cain couldn't be hurt.


Once again my point isn't to illustrate that Juggernaut can be hurt its that he can be thrown.


Doomsday moves as fast or faster then Superman. So Doomsday is able to move faster then Juggernaut can even perceive and since we know Juggernaut can be thrown by the Hulk. Doomsday is much stronger and much faster so it is fairly reasonable to assume Doomsday can move before Cain can even think to put up a shield and DD will throw him into space

Doomsday can only list as much a Superman or less, and we keep telling you that Juggernaut can slow Doomsday down with his forcefield.

Originally posted by soujaboy09
Doomsday can only list as much a Superman or less, and we keep telling you that Juggernaut can slow Doomsday down with his forcefield.


Yes and I keep telling you the reality is that Juggernaut regardless of his immense strength and durability only thinks at speeds equal to humans us! About this fast..............It's said that the speed of thought is about 30 m/s thats in meters per second.


The speed of light as about 185,000 miles per second (298,000 kilometres per second. this is a conservative measurement.
Superman was about 99% the speed of light at the time and was pushing himself to keep up with Doomsday so about 183,150 miles per second for DD's speed.

30 m/s is what low hundreds for speed, and my point here is IN no way shape or form can Juggernaut intercept DD in his actions. He is moving as quickly as the rays of light bounce back to juggernauts eyes to see!

Hence DD BFR's Juggernaut by speed and strenght. Juggernaut won't even know to put up a shield.

ok

Anyways it's a stalemate

Originally posted by soujaboy09
ok

Anyways it's a stalemate

how is Juggernaut going to overcome DD's speed. I have already illustrated how Juggernaut's shield is no good, simply due to lack of ability to react in time.

Sometimes you just gotta take one for the team and this team (Juggernaut) is BFR'd to space and beyond

Originally posted by outarddwarf
stalemate. When soujaboy and soleran get in a forum together it goes down hill. No offense to either of you but darn...
post editing and reciting of the same stuff over and over. Don't bring up trion he doesn't count. However, Soleran's stubborn refusal to accept the fact that juggernauts has the ability to boost his strength with focus is extremely irritating. It has occured in more than the 8th day get over it.

Kon-el all i can say is read a few comics when you post here, cartoons don't count. Still can't believe that you argued with NEWJACK, when all you had for a basis was cartoons.

Booster Golds "OPINION" was that doomsday was faster than flash but, we can't know that because they haven't raced. And i doubt he is because flash is built on speed and can tap the speed force!

bad end to a worse day...

Thanks for the refresher course, but I don't think I need it considering I know the rules of this forum. I think you'll find that nothing about this fight can be based on fact, and basically everyone involved in the debate are using logical steps based on premises - that's what a debate is. I might have mentioned Juggernaught vs Gladiator in one of about 5 points, but the logic from it still stands. Also I don't agree with you that the debate went downhnill after Soujaboy and Soleran entered - they made interesting points. What I think you will find is against the rules is personal bashing, which is actually what you've just done and I don't speak for Booster Gold but again his 'opinion' as you called it is based on the premise that Doomsday evolved beyond the speed of the Flash, so it wasn't unfounded. Again, thanks for interjecting but I doubt any of us needed personal attacks.

Originally posted by Soleran
how is Juggernaut going to overcome DD's speed. I have already illustrated how Juggernaut's shield is no good, simply due to lack of ability to react in time.

Sometimes you just gotta take one for the team and this team (Juggernaut) is BFR'd to space and beyond I want to see a feat where DD jas knocked someone into space from the ground thruth is you can't he has never done it. I would be willing to say Supes could do it becuase he has speed and flight but the lack of flight for Doomsday I don't see it.

This is what speed gets you against Juggernaut

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e101/Soujaboy/wolverine093_17.jpg

It is said that Thor can swing his hammer at the speed of light, well we see that it does nothing.

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e101/Soujaboy/thorvsjuggernaut2b9li.jpg

For such a big guy, Juggernaut has very keen reflexes. Truth be known, Thor hardly ever goes all out, but it's still a great showing against a guy who's so powerful it's ridiculous.

Show me someone in Marvel that Juggs faces that goes 99% speed of light aside from Northstar and Aurora...................yeah exactly.

Those 2 pictures you have shown are jack compared to DD. Seriously its said Thor can swing his hammer the speed of light when he is traveling behind it, not just whacking someone with it.

You have yet to show me ANYTHING that would lead me to believe Juggernaut can handle someone that moves roughly 183,000 miles per second and is strong enough and tough to off Superman.

Which once again let me reiterate why Juggernaut gets the big BFR into space because he cannot do anything about it.

Actually, Soler, he can swing that hammer at light speed. Hardly ever does though.

Has Doomsday ever faced an opponent who cant be physically damaged?

Who cares how fast he can move if he doesn't go anywhere when you hit him?

Originally posted by soujaboy09
Has Doomsday ever faced an opponent who cant be physically damaged?

Who cares how fast he can move if he doesn't go anywhere when you hit him?


All he has to do is run at Juggernaut and uppercut him with his super speed and strength then Juggs becomes a satellite around earth

Either that or run and grab him and throw him into space.............its his speed combined with strength that makes him a lousy match up against Juggernaut.

Juggernaut is a one shot pony like Hulk with more durability.

DD is Dc's Hulk

So your saying that Juggernaut can take a full powered hit from Thor's hammer at light speed without even budging, but will get knocked into space by one hit from DD? Other than that he can take the god blast and the only thing that happens is he gets moved back a little, but DD can send him to space with a punch? doesn't that sound like dumb logic to you?

DD is far beyond Hulk in DC universe.

The only thing beyond logic is why for instance in your Thor scan he uses his hammer and slams him down instead of up.

Thats all great but as we both discussed earlier even Hulk has thrown Juggernaut. It can be done and it will be done again with a guy thats exponentially faster and more powerful then the hulk in that scan.

BFR is far from out of the question, its just you would hate to see Juggernaut floating in space. I guess it just hard for you to realize he is out done by DD due to DD's IMMENSE speed advantage.

So, DD would only stand a chance against Juggernaut if gets read of him.

So if you believe that Doomsday is far stronger than Hulk then you also believe that Juggernaut is far stronger than Hulk.

Know I think it would be a stalemate, ending when the planet there fighting on is destroyed.

I Juggernaut wouldn't be thrown into space because he has his shield. Even if Doomsday could manage to throw him he wouldn't be flying through the air at the speed of light so all Juggernaut would have to do is put up his shield.

Juggernauts strength and durability aren't a factor simply due to the speed combined with DD's strength are overwhelming.

Did you read about the speed soujaboy are did you just not understand it? Seriously I am not trying to be mean here but it seems as though you don't grasp it and I can explain it again for you because you overlook it at every available opportunity. Cain cannot react to DD's speed period.

Ok, Im saying that even of Doomsday go's and punches Juggernaut at light speed Juggernaut still isn't going to move.

Now if he grabs him he can throw him, but even if he's moving at light speed when he throws him that doesn't meen that Juggernaut will be flying at light speed through the air. Thus while in the air Juggernaut can then summon his shield because it takes less than a sec.

Originally posted by Soleran
Juggernauts strength and durability aren't a factor simply due to the speed combined with DD's strength are overwhelming.

Did you read about the speed soujaboy are did you just not understand it? Seriously I am not trying to be mean here but it seems as though you don't grasp it and I can explain it again for you because you overlook it at every available opportunity. Cain cannot react to DD's speed period. Your how theory on light speed is correct but since when has this ever been used in a comic before oh wait ti hasn't.
Let me put this into perspective for you Cain has often been as unmovable as he is unstoppable. Standing there and taking peoples best shots. If you add real world physics into it then a blow from rouge that can shatter every window witnin a block should be able to lift Jugg's wieght from the ground but it doesn't well why comics. He will probably send Cain flying but he will not be able to produce the force needed to BFR Cain.

Also your really looking into this whole 90% speed of light thing to much yes Supes can fly at that speed but there is difference between fight and flight speed. Supes while he does have some good fights showing good speed there is nothing to suggest he can fight at anything near the speed of light. So in turn it can be said that Doomsday wasn't even fighting at lightspeed.

When Superman fought one of the weaker versions of DD it was all he could do to keep up and fight him at the same time.....................no of course not SM and DD were fighting fast enough no one could track them.

They don't have to fight that fast to move faster then thought and handle Juggernaut period juggs reacts at 30 m/s thought thats a stand still for DD. Also with the speed comes power and mass the force required to move a 900lb man t outer space wouldn't mean much to DD................you like science the force would blow up alot of things around where DD hits Juggs but DD doesn't care its in character.

Originally posted by Soleran
When Superman fought one of the weaker versions of DD it was all he could do to keep up and fight him at the same time.....................no of course not SM and DD were fighting fast enough no one could track them.

They don't have to fight that fast to move faster then thought and handle Juggernaut period juggs reacts at 30 m/s thought thats a stand still for DD. Also with the speed comes power and mass the force required to move a 900lb man t outer space wouldn't mean much to DD................you like science the force would blow up alot of things around where DD hits Juggs but DD doesn't care its in character. Thats where your loosing it right there Cain has withstood forces before that should move a 900 pound man no problem and while DD may be moving fast enough for Cain not to see him really it doesn't change the fact that he won't BFR him in any case.
If you re-read the fight I posted then basically your just saying the same things I was. Cain starts off not being able to react to Doomsady until he puts up his shield then they throw punches the eventually destroy the planet.

Exactly

Originally posted by newjak86
Thats where your loosing it right there Cain has withstood forces before that should move a 900 pound man no problem and while DD may be moving fast enough for Cain not to see him really it doesn't change the fact that he won't BFR him in any case.
If you re-read the fight I posted then basically your just saying the same things I was. Cain starts off not being able to react to Doomsady until he puts up his shield then they throw punches the eventually destroy the planet.


Yup and there have been times he has been dropped and thrown I hear what your saying, doesn't change the fact it can happen.

Just like street lvler's all dodgeing bullets who are "peak" human, yeah doesn't work that way. That doesn't invalidate the fact it can happen because he has been knocked down and thrown with alot less

Originally posted by Soleran
Yup and there have been times he has been dropped and thrown I hear what your saying, doesn't change the fact it can happen.

Just like street lvler's all dodgeing bullets who are "peak" human, yeah doesn't work that way. That doesn't invalidate the fact it can happen because he has been knocked down and thrown with alot less Not really he gets thrown around very few times as classic. Yes people like the Hulk have thrown although not very far. Now idea that BFR can happen well judging from what Cain has taken and just the force that would be needed to remove him from the atmosphere I don't see it happening. And like I said in my post I see Cain hurtling backwards from the punches but nothing near what it would take to remove him the planet.

He has taken a lot more than just a punch from Doomsdays, and just stood there.