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I know this sounds cheesy and goes against what I argue about, but let's just check this out. I'm dying to know what arguments people make over this:

In a vast emptiness of space where all powers work, a battle ensues between these All - Powerful Beings:

1) Spectre at Full Power
2) Pre-Retconned Beyonder
3) Thanos with The Heart of the Universe
4) Darkseid with Anti Life Equation
5) Adam Warlock with Infinity Gauntlet
6) The Great Evil Beast
7) Urizen at full Strength
8) Lucifer Morningstar
9) Micheal
10)White Pheonix of the Crown
11) Charon, Solusandra, Danik, and Appolyan united
12) Abraxis with 1000 Ultamate Nullifiers
13)Mr. M

ANYONE ?????

it would be between God/The Presence and The Great Evil Beast. Everyone else does not even come close to them.

{{it would be between God/The Presence and The Great Evil Beast. Everyone else does not even come close to them.}}

Are you sure you're totally familiar with all of them listed up there?

BTW the Presence/God isn't mentioned in the above : )

Beyonder.

Too many huge powers at play here. The problem is placing the spectre and the presence at odds. Spectres out first. There have been many allusions to whether the Supreme being Thanos refers too is God or not in THE END. Beyonders feats are that he is said to have the power over all the universes together. The Phoenix is said to be the force of creation and destruction of the multiverse. I'd say Beyonder, Great Beast, or The Phoenix white crown. But if the God is the God from the references of Thanos than The Beyonder wins. Wow this is a hard determination. I guess it would come to the Phoenix, the Great Beast, or the Beyonder.

I just hope everyone' atleast partially familiar with every character up there. I didn't mean to cause any confusion.

As for me, I think Classic Beyonder (pre retcon) would take it. Not only is he said to have power beyond the Marvel Multiverse, Stan Lee said he was to represent the writer's power to do whatever the hell they wanted to anyone they wanted.

Classic Beyonder wanted to know what "DESIRE" was....imagine a being who never had to want anything before. I bet even the Prescence and TOAA have had goals they wanted accomplished, even though they get lesser beings to do thier will.

Classic Beyonder never had a desire until he reached on of Marvel's Universe and wanted to know what it's like to want things (lol yeah huge oxymoron there)


I think someone who is meant to have the powers of the writers themselves would take this.

Originally posted by Lord Urizen
I just hope everyone' atleast partially familiar with every character up there. I didn't mean to cause any confusion.

As for me, I think Classic Beyonder (pre retcon) would take it. Not only is he said to have power beyond the Marvel Multiverse, Stan Lee said he was to represent the writer's power to do whatever the hell they wanted to anyone they wanted.

Classic Beyonder wanted to know what "DESIRE" was....imagine a being who never had to want anything before. I bet even the Prescence and TOAA have had goals they wanted accomplished, even though they get lesser beings to do thier will.

Classic Beyonder never had a desire until he reached on of Marvel's Universe and wanted to know what it's like to want things (lol yeah huge oxymoron there)


I think someone who is meant to have the powers of the writers themselves would take this. Many of the characters on that list embody a similar role.

I'd assume that Adam with IG, Spectre, Darkseid with ALE, and the union of Solusandra, Charon, Danik and Appolyan would lose first.

Urizen at full strength, it's uncertain what his limits are. He cannot die though, so imprisonment from someone may work.

However, Classic Beyonder may be able to change the REALITY of Urizen's mythos and make it that he CAN die...depending on how powerful a full powered Urizen is.

The Great Evil Beast is extremely powerful being the Presence's evil counterpart, however I'd feel that Urizen is God's evil side (refer to my William Blake post and the Spawn mythos itself), therefore might have equal standing with Urizen at full power, and Classic Beyonder may be able to beat both (IF HE CAN VIOLATE the facts of both characters).


From what i've heard Micheal and Lucifer are below The Great Evil Beast (But correct me if I'm wrong), I think they'd totally go down against Classic Beyonder. From the comic books, Lucifer is a mass manipulator and Micheal is a steady powerhouse. However Beyonder need not manipulate anyone through persuation, only by simply will power, and he is a powerhouse in his own right. I think he takes it.



i don't think Abraxis can beat Classic Beyonder, despite his power, but with 1000 Ultamate Nullifers you think he can DELETE Classic Beyonder? What if that doesnt work on Beyonder since he's above Marvel's laws.
Could go either way


I don't know anything about Mr. M, nor much about White Pheonix of the Crown. Someone else would have to argue on thier behalfs.

Darksied with ALE might be able to FORCE Classic Beyonder under his will, except that ALE is a multiversal power, while Classic Beyonder was said to have the power of many many many many multiverses.

I count Darksied out.

Thanos with HOTU....is it true that he became = TOAA, or is that horse BS ? Would you guys say that Thanos reached the highest in heiraarchy when he became one with the HOTU ?

Either way I think that Classic Beyonder is similiar to TOAA in terms of sheer power.

this is why i think Classic Beyonder takes it

Me.

I'm serious.







































I would head over to the place of work of whichever comic artist wrote such a crappy situation, and burn their drawings of the various characters, and the story in general, thereby winning by default.

:/

MY BAD LOL

Originally posted by Lord Urizen
I know this sounds cheesy and goes against what I argue about, but let's just check this out. I'm dying to know what arguments people make over this:

In a vast emptiness of space where all powers work, a battle ensues between these All - Powerful Beings:

1) Spectre at Full Power
2) Pre-Retconned Beyonder
3) Thanos with The Heart of the Universe
4) Darkseid with Anti Life Equation
5) Adam Warlock with Infinity Gauntlet
6) The Great Evil Beast
7) Urizen at full Strength
8) Lucifer Morningstar
9) Micheal
10)White Pheonix of the Crown
11) Charon, Solusandra, Danik, and Appolyan united
12) Abraxis with 1000 Ultamate Nullifiers
13)Mr. M you forgot wolverine.

you forgot wolverine.

I'd have to go with the Heart Of The Universe... Thanos b!tchslapped every single cosmic & magical entity in Marvel with that without even breaking a sweat

I'd have to go with the Heart Of The Universe... Thanos b!tchslapped every single cosmic & magical entity in Marvel with that without even breaking a sweat

Thanks for you input man. Seriously.

I think some debators are disregarding this thread, because they feel it is impossible to answer when it's not.



I can't argue against you until I know more about the HOTU...im trying to find out more about it, but when i YAHOO and GOOGLE HOTU, it takes me directly to this website lol

Originally posted by Lord Urizen
I can't argue against you until I know more about the HOTU...im trying to find out more about it, but when i YAHOO and GOOGLE HOTU, it takes me directly to this website lol

Basically whoever holds the HOTU has the power of God... they can do wahtever they want whenever they want.... it's like the Infinity Gauntlet times one million... Thanos defeated every powerful being in Marvel (including Galactus, Eternity, Infinity and the Living Tribunal) then uncreated the entire Universe just by thinking about it

If Thanos w HOTU is SUPREMECY personified, then he'd take it. If it is Infinity Gauntlet TIMES Infinity, then yeah its totally unstoppable.

I actually do favor Thanos, gotta admit, but here's what goes against him in my opinion:

1) Some debators claim that HOTU isn't that much more powerful than IG, that it only gives Thanos internal power over the universe, while IG gave external power...meaning HOTU made Thanos ONE with everything in the universe.

2) Is HOTU multiversal in nature, or just universal? LOL

3) Even if he recreated the entire MU with a thought, its only TWICE as impressive as when he destroyed HALF the MU with a snap of his fingers in IG.

Let's just say for arguments sake that Thanos w HOTU is like a million x more powerul than himself with IG, he would probably be equal to Classic Beyonder. Classic Beyonder was said to have had the power of many many multiverses...we don't even know whose more powerful between Classic Beyonder and TOAA for sure.



It might be a Tie between them 2

There is also another factor when you think of the IG. Though it did destroy half of universes population, with a gesture that process was reversed. I am not sure reguarding the ALE. For a supposed multiversal power, its very one dimensional. The situation is even more of a toss up now that the crisis ended the multiverse. The power of across the multiverse may not even be mentioned and therefore be left to the interpretation of the reader. The HOTU has the same problem. Thanos makes many allusions to himself usurping the power of the almighty, yet that power seems limited to others if it only affects on a universal scale. In that case, the almighty appears weaker than the Pre retcon beyonder. The Spectre is another issue regarding his supposed divinity granted by God. If thanos was the almighty then wouldn't the spectre be limited to the whim of Thanos. This arguement is tough considering many of these wins are under the interpretation of the reader. If I had to make a choice, I would take the Beyonder since his powers seemed only limited by the writers.

There is a difference between killing half the population of the universe and destroying the entire universe to where theres nothing left, with a single thought. But I really don't see how you can compare the powers of beings like Thanos with HOTU, Classic Beyonder, Spectre etc.

Originally posted by Lord Urizen
If Thanos w HOTU is SUPREMECY personified, then he'd take it. If it is Infinity Gauntlet TIMES Infinity, then yeah its totally unstoppable.

I actually do favor Thanos, gotta admit, but here's what goes against him in my opinion:

1) Some debators claim that HOTU isn't that much more powerful than IG, that it only gives Thanos internal power over the universe, while IG gave external power...meaning HOTU made Thanos ONE with everything in the universe.

2) Is HOTU multiversal in nature, or just universal? LOL

3) Even if he recreated the entire MU with a thought, its only TWICE as impressive as when he destroyed HALF the MU with a snap of his fingers in IG.

Let's just say for arguments sake that Thanos w HOTU is like a million x more powerul than himself with IG, he would probably be equal to Classic Beyonder. Classic Beyonder was said to have had the power of many many multiverses...we don't even know whose more powerful between Classic Beyonder and TOAA for sure.



It might be a Tie between them 2

1) Thats very true.

2) From what we've seen so far it is very much universal but thats just due to limited appearances. Either way we cant speculate.

3) Please remember that he absorbed the universe first. Its not like he created a new one from scratch. Big difference.

As for your comments pertaining to Classic Beyonder it was claimed he had power a million times greater than the Marvel multiverse, a claim that was never supported on panel by any on panel feat, but was however conflicted by his on panel appearances.

a) Took the majority of his power to take out an abstract and then it was beyond his ability as stated to resurrect Death through an output of power (Therefore conflicting with that "million times" claim.) Just doesnt add up.

b) His power was stolen from him by Doom, with Galactus' power (which by that point he had exhausted) and a power absorption device. Given that the process never endowed Doom with power instantly, that Beyonder had a chance to fight it, that million times claim doesnt add up. Plus if Beyonder was truly omniscient he would have foreseen this. He did not.

Thanos with HOTU was certainly presented as being supreme however if his power stemmed from a universal power source then he most certainly was NOT, considering who we know manifests as the Big Bang.

Feats wise Thanos with HOTU (Its actually HOTI) never did anything beyond what Phoenix has actually done or been claimed by reputable sources to be able to do. So with those two points in mind its really not as clear cut as saying Thanos beat up the abstracts and LT he looked supreme so i think he wins. When all things are taken into consideration its far from as simple as that.

If the Great Evil Beast truly is the polar opposite of the Presence then i cant see anyone beating it. I'll have to researchg into that though as forum talk is far from reliable.

If it isnt then as far as im concerned this is between the Phoenix and the Beyonder

Originally posted by Lord Urizen


I think some debators are disregarding this thread, because they feel it is impossible to answer when it's not.



No. Its cos this thread has been done to death, the last one as recently as last month. I'll post a link later when i can be bothered. No sense in re-treading old arguments.

i agree with gs. geb seems to be top of the food chain, imo.

No. Its cos this thread has been done to death, the last one as recently as last month. I'll post a link later when i can be bothered. No sense in re-treading old arguments.

Understood. My intention here wasn't to try and make a "new" kind of thread hoping it would extend to 100 replies. I said before that even if it only goes to TEN replies I'd be happy, and the fact that it made it to a second page makes me even happier lol

I know, cuz then that would be JUST LIKE another IG...even in its current intepretation.

Feats wise Thanos with HOTU (Its actually HOTI) never did anything beyond what Phoenix has actually done or been claimed by reputable sources to be able to do. So with those two points in mind its really not as clear cut as saying Thanos beat up the abstracts and LT he looked supreme so i think he wins. When all things are taken into consideration its far from as simple as that.


Wouldn't White Pheonix of the Crown actually take HOTI if you think about it? Isn't she the total creative force behind Marvel's Multiverse ? The HOTI kinda just BARGES in on that order.



If the Great Evil Beast truly is the polar opposite of the Presence then i cant see anyone beating it. I'll have to researchg into that though as forum talk is far from reliable.

So true. And I myself have come up short trying to find out more info on beings such as Presence, Great Evil Beast, Lucifer, Micheal, Hotu, etc. Because google and yahoo always bring me back to THIS website, they don't ever reveal to me any valid sources. And even of Vertigo's website, they only have descriptions of graphic novels, not the basic facts of thier characters....its really tricky trying to defend/attack certain characters, so I work with what I already know/hear/read, and i think i always admit when my points were totally mislead.




If it isnt then as far as im concerned this is between the Phoenix and the Beyonder]


Yeah, and then there's no telling who would win how. The ONLY conclusion that I could come up with, is that Pheonix is a REALISTIC part of Marvel's structure while Classic Beyonder is not.

Pheonix plays a major role in Marvel's entire order and structure, universal and multiversal.

Classic Beyonder is an INTRUDER, he supports nothing that has to do with MU's wellbeing or continuity, he just plays with it.

Considering that Pheonix is a more tangible force, while Classic Beyonder is an uber powerful "child" playing with universes, and was said to represent the writer.....

I'd only conclude for myself, that Classic Beyonder would win, because it's like a CARTOON VS REAL LIFE....bear with me. Pheonix is more real than CB, because she plays a valid role in MU, while Classic B just intruded and started effing around with MU.

I doubt Classic Beyonder has a true weakness since he isn't connected to anything, while Pheonix is very real to the MU, and perhaps more vulnerable since SHE HAS AN ORDER.....

I could be wrong, i welcome anyone to correct me.

BUMP