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Ummm...someone get Logan a beer

lol wtf is iceman gonna do to thor ? freeze his hammer till it crushes ?

Thor.

ytf is wolverine on here?

Iceman's pretty dangerous. It's almost impossible to kill him since he can exist as pure water vapor, meaning the Godblast wouldn't even work here. I don't know is a flashfreeze would work on someone like Thor, but I suppose it's possible.

If Thor doesn't know of Iceman's abilities, or he takes Bobby too lightly then that may be his downfall. However, if Thor IS aware of Iceman's full potential (and Basic Knowledge is part of every battle here unless stated otherwise) then he would act quickly before Bobby did any thing too hazardous. Thor's best bets are to throw his hammer to spin around Iceman until he seals him in a tiny orb like he did to Kang the Conqueror, thermoblast him, transmute his ice body, keep him away with the anti-gravity force, or possibly even take away his soul. There are probably more, but these are all I can think of at the top of my head.

yeah but if iceman could harness his true power he could beat him...he is theoretically in the same league as pheniox...so don't say thor wins so soon...

If Iceman fought to his full potential, he could take this. As he is written now, Bobby himself admits there is a LOT left for him to learn. Thor, 9/10.

Originally posted by jgiant
yeah but if iceman could harness his true power he could beat him...he is theoretically in the same league as pheniox...so don't say thor wins so soon...
I know, I gave Iceman the benefit of the doubt. He possesses seemingly unlimited potential, but so does Thor. The problem is, Thor acts like idiot most of the time. God only knows how many times he could have saved the Avengers a sh!tload of time by pulling one of more exotic powers out of his hammer instead of just whacking things with it.

Current Iceman gets dropped quickly. Uber-Iceman stands a damn good chance, use Thor says "F*ck this!" and uses his powers to the best of his ability.

whats the difference between current and uber? could someone please explain, because the misinformation that I have seen spread around is that Iceman lost his omega powers. But all evidence points to him only losing his secondary mutation.

Wolvie...He's drinkin` a beer foo.

Kill The Mutants!!

I guess I'll play devil's advocate and say Bobby wins a majority. His body, for all intents and purposes, would only act as a dummy target for Thor to concentrate on while Bobby transfers his conciseness into the surrounding water vapor. From there he has several options such as freezing the blood in thor's body
http://img332.imageshack.us/my.php?image=icemanbloodfreeze4zt8la.jpg

or by pulling all of the water out of Thor's body (thus it really is impossible for Thor to eliminate all sources of water vapor in the fighting environment without killing himself)
http://img332.imageshack.us/my.php?image=iceman13gv.jpg
http://img332.imageshack.us/my.php?image=iceman20rs.jpg
http://img332.imageshack.us/my.php?image=iceman32ns.jpg

Iceman is not going to pull all the water out of Thor's body.

Who the f*ck is that chic that controls her body?

Thor melts Bobby with a lightening bolt , then reduces him to vapour with a second. He then controls Bobby to allow his consciousness to fade away.

whats she look like

Originally posted by Wonder Man
whats she look like

http://img332.imageshack.us/img332/6134/iceman20rs.jpg

Originally posted by Milkie
http://img332.imageshack.us/img332/6134/iceman20rs.jpg

WTF ?

She's friggin weird

wish i had followed Generation X they looked better than the New Mutants

Originally posted by Milkie
Iceman is not going to pull all the water out of Thor's body.


What exactly is it about Asgardian physiology or Thor's power-set that would prevent Iceman from using that method of attack against him?

Will Power & Asgardian Physiology

Will power? He can control water now?

sorry I lost that somewhere in the God of Thunder description

Did you read the whole Thor Respect Thread?

No. Id be nice if you could show a scan of him resisting his water molecules from being tampered with.

Can you show scans of Iceman pulling water out of gods on the level of Thor? Commom sense would tell you that he wouldn't be able to do that.

Originally posted by Milkie
Can you show scans of Iceman pulling water out of gods on the level of Thor? Commom sense would tell you that he wouldn't be able to do that.
http://img347.imageshack.us/img347/9789/xmenforever6p268ua.th.jpg

There he is freezing the Stranger who's at least a couple notches above Thor. Common sense would say anyone with water in their body is at risk against Iceman.

And what happened AFTER that scan.

This is 1 ON 1 not 5 or so against 1

Common sense? pffff......this is comic books. Bobby is an omega, and thor gets his ass kicked by mortals all the time. so this is a good fight. Iceman got this easy

Originally posted by Milkie
And what happened AFTER that scan.

This is 1 ON 1 not 5 or so against 1
I wouldn't know but it doesn't matter seeing as Thor is far from being the Stranger. You wanted to see Bobby freeze a high level person and he did.

Originally posted by crucifixio
Common sense? pffff......this is comic books.
Very true.

Couldn't Thor control Bobby in his water vapour form , since Bobby could technically become part of Thor's storm .....

Doubtful, Thor does not have ( or has not shown) that level of control. Bobby fighting to his full potential is a god in his own right.

Dude Thor has gone toe to toe with Ymir. F*ckin Ymir...

This is over Thor 10/10

I think your underestimating a well-written Bobby Drake here kiddo. He could pull all the water out of Thor. Increase his strength and his mass. Transform into water vapor. Virtually indestuctible since he can reform himself with water molecules. He is a true embodiement of an elemental. All Thor does is smash things with his hammer instead of tapping into its true powers.

Originally posted by crucifixio
I think your underestimating a well-written Bobby Drake here kiddo. He could pull all the water out of Thor. Increase his strength and his mass. Transform into water vapor. Virtually indestuctible since he can reform himself with water molecules. He is a true embodiement of an elemental. All Thor does is smash things with his hammer instead of tapping into its true powers.

First off.

Remember your place here noob.

Second.

Are you comparing Iceman to Ymir...

well in the cartoon series Iceman kicked his ass didnt he



But besides the point, Iceman FROZE the Stranger, his heat beams AND his celestial ship. None of the others actually DID anything to Stranger but run around like idiots. So if he can do that to the Stranger (who is a COSMIC being) he can sure as hell do it to Thor.

Way to go Trooper! Just the way to debate!

...

Its a a > b > c therefore a > c situation. Iceman FROZE Stranger (Im not saying he is more powerful but he can control all molecules and it worked on the Stranger!!) so > Stranger (in that technicality) and > Thor


therefore in a fight Iceman > Thor


way to go trooper!! Just the way to debate!

Lol....I believe I upset u . Calling me a "noobie"" still doesn't negate the fact that Thor would have a hard time on his hand with Iceman. Ymir is not the one he's battling here. He took on Stranger who would own Thor. Thor is a "God" who cant even surpass Hulk and Juggs in strength.

Originally posted by crucifixio
Lol....I believe I upset u . Calling me a "noobie"" still doesn't negate the fact that Thor would have a hard time on his hand with Iceman. Ymir is not the one he's battling here. He took on Stranger who would own Thor. Thor is a "God" who cant even surpass Hulk and Juggs in strength.

Calling you a noob had nothing to do with this debate.

But you guys can do whatever you want. In your eyes Iceman beats Stranger meaning he can beat a good amount of gods and even Spectre and Jesus.

Have a good day guys.

Iceman is an Omega Level Mutant. In Xmen Forever that was explained as mutants that have unlimited potential and are the pathway to evolution of mutants being MORE than Cosmic beings. Thats why the cosmic characters were afraid of Jean Grey.

Iceman is powerful now. Learn to live with it. I doubt he can beat Spectre and Im too christain to say Jesus. But he beat Stranger and thats all there is too it.

Originally posted by Accel
I know, I gave Iceman the benefit of the doubt. He possesses seemingly unlimited potential, but so does Thor. The problem is, Thor acts like idiot most of the time. God only knows how many times he could have saved the Avengers a sh!tload of time by pulling one of more exotic powers out of his hammer instead of just whacking things with it.

Stupid Thor

Originally posted by Milkie
Calling you a noob had nothing to do with this debate.

But you guys can do whatever you want. In your eyes Iceman beats Stranger meaning he can beat a good amount of gods and even Spectre and Jesus.

Have a good day guys.

It isn't a matter of only "thinking" that Iceman can use this method of attack, instead is is posting several scans to back up the claim. Now if you disagree please explain why (perhaps in deeper detail that just broad assertions that "since Thor is a god and has lots of willpower the water in his body can't be manipulated".

I like Thor as much as anybody but the nature of Iceman's powers (and his numerous feats) makes him a very difficult opponent to beat. Logically, I can't see what would prevent Thor from being affect by Bobby's mutant power.

If Thor used his full power instead of just his strenght he could win after a hard fought battle but so could Bobby.

I'm going with Thor

Thor likes the cold. Bring it on.
He may get beat by a mutant in the Ultimateverse, but not in 616.

^^Delusional. If Iceman were to use his powers creatively he could hypothetically transform himself into mist, vapor, whatever. Get inside Thors body and destroy him from inside out.

Can Iceman survive in space

Full potential Iceman vs Thor - Iceman

Full potential Iceman vs Full potential Thor + Mjlonir - Thor

Originally posted by Avalonofthewind
Full potential Iceman vs Thor - Iceman

Full potential Iceman vs Full potential Thor + Mjlonir - Thor

The problem with this is that these guys just want Iceman at his full and not Thor. They just say he just smash shit all the time when Iceman hardly ever does the shit they say he can do himself.

That's how it looks

Originally posted by Milkie
The problem with this is that these guys just want Iceman at his full and not Thor. They just say he just smash shit all the time when Iceman hardly ever does the shit they say he can do himself.

I'm perfectly willing to consider high-end feats/abilities of Thor's that might allow him to win the fight. The problem is that no one has taken the time to mention and/or support them with either scans or logical arguments.

If one can take a single-power person, like Iceman, to the Nth degree, such that he defeats the Stranger (and, btw, could he consistently beat the Stranger? doubtful, unless the Stranger is an idiot to the Nth degree), then imagine taking a multiple-power individual, like Thor, to the Nth degree.

All else being equal, Iceman--while having the potential to defeat Thor--is Not Thor's superior.

Thor 8/10.

Iceman freezing the Stranger may have been a feat over his head. Thor's done that; chasing away a hungry Galactus twice, hurting him with his hammer - may have been a stretch. Both these two at full potential, the Omega Level Mutant stills ends up bowing before the God.

Yes that is a very impressive list of feats (which is why you might want to actually give the author credit by including a link or something)
While all of those are impressive feats, only a select few of them have any bearing in this fight whatsoever. To point: soul transmigration, Thor's durability, possible BFR, ability to put individuals to sleep/crowd manipulation (there may a few others that can be argued as well)


Soul transmigration (some actual scans would be helpful to let us understand the nature and scope of this power), BFR, and let's call it any form of mind manipulation would be very difficult with using against Bobby as he there is no "body" in the most basic sense for Thor to attack. Who does he try to put to sleep? Who does he try to banish to another dimension when his opponent is quite literally all around and possible inside of him? Also given the unique nature of Iceman's attacks I'm not sure Thor would have the same level of defense against is as he would to a conventional attack as we are really talking about control over molecules in and around Thor's body.

This is also why the standard blasts, even planet shattering one's, are problematic. The nature of Iceman's power makes it so that to truly defeat him you must remove all surrounding water vapor from the battle field including that which is inside of your own body. Also keep in mind that Thor would have to be doing all of this while the blood in his brain is being frozen or the moisture in his body is being removed.

Now, of course Thor is more powerful, the above listed feats are evidence enough to show that, however this is not the question at hand. Instead the question is: "Is there anything in Thor's repertoire of attacks and abilities that would allow him to kill Iceman before Iceman kills him?" I would say the answer is most likely no given the difficulty anyone would have actually hurting Iceman through none telepathic means.

There you go TheKahn

Everything me and Accel posted is from the Thor Respect Thread go check it out for yourself.

In all honesty, I think that this fight is MUCH closer than the Superman vs. Iceman fight we also have on these boards. Simply because Thor has so many different powers (thermoblast, and the absorbtion of energies).

Originally, I was thinking Iceman would win here the same way he would against Superman, but rethinking this, hmmm.

If we have BOTH characters at their full power, full potential? I'm going to say Iceman CAN win, but not the majority. Thor, 7/10

If we have Thor portrayed like the Hulk (SMASH! being his only thought), then I'll give it to Iceman 10/10 since there is nothing that can physically harm him.

Again, a battle between an ultra powerful character(a God) vs. a powerful character (a mutant). Silly it is.

To those that will argue that Iceman could pull all the water out of Thor's anus or whatever, realize that Iceman would be dead from one single blow before he started, if he even could affect a God in that matter, which is debatable.


Here's the next fight ICEMAN (Omega to the 10th power) Vs. GALACTUS

please. Iceman is unlimited potential. He is an Omega Mutant. Hes one of the most powerful mutants there are. Its not just about making ice. Its about controlling molecular speed. He can slow something to a complete stop, and use moisture to do his bidding. If Thor has mouisture, Iceman can use it against him

Originally posted by Blair Wind
please. Iceman is unlimited potential. He is an Omega Mutant. Hes one of the most powerful mutants there are. Its not just about making ice. Its about controlling molecular speed. He can slow something to a complete stop, and use moisture to do his bidding. If Thor has mouisture, Iceman can use it against him


So by your rational, Iceman is essentially the most powerful being in the Marvel & DC universe? Most characters are some form of biological being and Iceman could use the 'power of moisture' to destroy them?

Unless I am mistaken, why is this silly? The Phoenix can take some Cosmic level characters and is just an omega mutant, why not Bobby?

Realistically though, a single blow from Thor? Doubtful. Yeah, a blow from Thor would shatter iceman. All he would need is some coconut, and some rum and Thor could start making Pina Coladas. However, a shattered Iceman is not a dead iceman. He can survive in any droplet of water, no matter how miniscule. Physically, Bobby is outmatched, but he could take this using his powers, 10/10 if Thor is written the way I've seen him written so often. (Which is a Sad state, as Thor was once my favorite Marvel Character.)

And to your second question (not aimed at me, but regardless...)

Theoretically, yes. This makes Bobby one of the most powerful characters in the Marvel Universe, just because he could pretty much destroy anyone that carries water inside them. And then, survive himself in that other creatures juices. As disgusting as that sounds.

Phoenix is WAY different from Iceman

Originally posted by Robtard
Again, a battle between an ultra powerful character(a God) vs. a powerful character (a mutant). Silly it is.

To those that will argue that Iceman could pull all the water out of Thor's anus or whatever, realize that Iceman would be dead from one single blow before he started, if he even could affect a God in that matter, which is debatable.


Here's the next fight ICEMAN (Omega to the 10th power) Vs. GALACTUS


Since when is Thor ultra powerful? At his maximum level attainable he would only be equal to Odin. Who was killed meaning that Thor is in fact not immortal. Iceman can control water down to a molecular level. Water which is the meaning of all life in existence. His power is potential COSMIC level, way above Thor or any in the pantheon of Earth's "gods".

Well, if Iceman is this powerful then he would kill Superman and Thor.

I like bread

Originally posted by crucifixio
Since when is Thor ultra powerful? At his maximum level attainable he would only be equal to Odin. Who was killed meaning that Thor is in fact not immortal. Iceman can control water down to a molecular level. Water which is the meaning of all life in existence. His power is potential COSMIC level, way above Thor or any in the pantheon of Earth's "gods".

Umm, he's a God and if you take into consideration when he became one with the 'OdinForce', he is beyond ultrapowerful. I never said Thor was immortal, all of the Asgardian gods are destined to die after Ragnarock. But Iceman won't be the one taking him or any other 'God' down. Did you forget that Thor is the Norse god of Thunder, Lightning and Agriculture, he can control water and what is Iceman made up of?

so nowadays mutants beat skyfathers??? what type of lame shit is this?

Originally posted by King KAM
so nowadays mutants beat skyfathers??? what type of lame shit is this?

Haven't you heard? Iceman is potentially the most powerful being ever. Hell, he could look at Galactus and make him cry, then he would use those tears to kill Galactus.

Originally posted by Robtard
Haven't yopu heard? Iceman is potentially the most powerful being ever. Hell, he could look at Galactus and make him cry, then he would use those tears to kill Galactus. sadly, thats the way it seems man, thats the way it seems.

Originally posted by Milkie
I like bread

Be careful, bread has moisture in it, Iceman will use that against you!

Originally posted by King KAM
so nowadays mutants beat skyfathers??? what type of lame shit is this?
Well, it's not like all mutants are automatically street level like Wolverine.

Hell, I think Gambit also has potential to become uber power like Iceman (shown with New Son).

Originally posted by King KAM
so nowadays mutants beat skyfathers??? what type of lame shit is this?

Yep according to these guys Thor doe not stand a chance. They talk like Iceman is going to freeze Thor's balls off right off the bat.

my new sig rocks.

Originally posted by Lethal_Rise
ytf is wolverine on here? good question. Anyways Thor beats the shit out of Iceman it's not even funny. People overrate Booby i mean bobby.

Actually Iceman stands a very good chance, especially if Thor underestimates him. No one here has stated an ability or power of his that he has not demonstrated in the comics.

What comics did bobby appear with this potential. I'm not a constant X-man reader.

most importantly like these levels? Xmen forever. Most of that stuff is in my respect thread. There have been other instances (even in the past)

Thanks Bro

heres most of the stuff I have:

Definition of Omega Level Mutant:
http://img406.imageshack.us/my.php?image=xmenforever3p203wr.jpg

Iceman survives even after the sentinals detect him as terminated and getting even the mousture off them:
http://img406.imageshack.us/my.php?image=xmenforever5p02and033eo.jpg
http://img332.imageshack.us/my.php?image=xmenforeverdrake24dz.jpg
http://img332.imageshack.us/my.php?image=xmenforeverdrake32cy.jpg

Existing as a part of everything while freezing a Celestial Ship:
http://img347.imageshack.us/my.php?image=xmenforever5p192kj.jpg
http://img347.imageshack.us/my.php?image=xmenforever5p208wl.jpg
http://img347.imageshack.us/my.php?image=xmenforever5p217vf.jpg
http://img347.imageshack.us/my.php?image=xmenforever5p227kd.jpg

more iceman unfreezing certain parts without really looking:
http://img347.imageshack.us/my.php?image=xmenforever6p231pp.jpg
http://img347.imageshack.us/my.php?image=xmenforever6p245wn.jpg

rippin mouisture out of someone:
http://img332.imageshack.us/my.php?image=iceman13gv.jpg
http://img332.imageshack.us/my.php?image=iceman20rs.jpg
http://img332.imageshack.us/my.php?image=iceman32ns.jpg

and YES he froze the stranger....
http://img347.imageshack.us/my.php?image=xmenforever6p268ua.jpg

more creativity:
http://img332.imageshack.us/img332/933/monk11gw.th.jpg
http://img332.imageshack.us/img332/1673/monk24ri.th.jpg
http://img332.imageshack.us/img332/7494/monk30kk.th.jpg
http://img332.imageshack.us/img332/7874/monk45nq.th.jpg

explaination of his powers:
http://www.thekeep.org/~tls/omega-bob.htm

Nice, the pics are bad ass.

Originally posted by Milkie
There you go TheKahn

Everything me and Accel posted is from the Thor Respect Thread go check it out for yourself.

Yes, the scans that Accel posted were quite interesting, however I'm not sure if some of them apply in this fight. There were several scans showing Thor absorbing energy from other "godly" or "mystically" powered beings so I don't know if it is safe to assume that he could do something similar to the mutant-powered Iceman (as he really doesn't have any mystical or godly energy to absorb in the first place).

Also, the issue of Thor being able to absorb or transfer souls is also a bit dubious to me. I do not think it has ever been shown that Thor can use the soul transportation ability of Mjolnir in an offensive capacity. It seems likely in the scans shown that he vampire creature had removed the souls (b/c as a rule good-guys tend not to steal souls) and Thor was only transporting them back to their "owners." Now if there is a feat where Thor removes the soul of a being and does something to it, then that is a different story.

All that being said, I still haven't seen a reason why Iceman couldn't manipulate the water molecules in Thor's body, or an explanation of how Thor will actually kill or incapacitate Bobby in some way. Simple explosions won't work and as the scan on the first page shows Iceman can freeze the blood of an individual almost instantly.

wats with all the iceman treads theirs not a hole lot but still iv counted like 3 but i say thor

Originally posted by Wonder Man
Ummm...someone get Logan a beer

Is this silly thread some kind of joke?

Originally posted by crucifixio
Since when is Thor ultra powerful? At his maximum level attainable he would only be equal to Odin. Who was killed meaning that Thor is in fact not immortal. Iceman can control water down to a molecular level. Water which is the meaning of all life in existence. His power is potential COSMIC level, way above Thor or any in the pantheon of Earth's "gods".

Surely you jest.

Originally posted by Mindship
If one can take a single-power person, like Iceman, to the Nth degree, such that he defeats the Stranger (and, btw, could he consistently beat the Stranger? doubtful, unless the Stranger is an idiot to the Nth degree), then imagine taking a multiple-power individual, like Thor, to the Nth degree.

All else being equal, Iceman--while having the potential to defeat Thor--is Not Thor's superior.

Thor 8/10.

Perhaps I should make myself clearer as I'm most definitely not trying to argue that Iceman is Thor's superior by any stretch of the imagination. My thought is that Iceman's single power, much like say telepathy, could grant a character a victory over a superior opponent, if and only if, that opponent doesn't have any effective defenses against it. And I honestly don't think that you would have to push Iceman very far past his normal operating parameters for him to use the types of attacks I'm proposing against Thor.

For example, I still haven't heard a good argument explaining why Iceman couldn't affect the water in Thor's body as he has done to others. Iceman doesn't seem to need very long to implement these attacks and they would have decidedly negative effects on Thor's fighting ability.
http://img332.imageshack.us/img332/1166/icemanbloodfreeze4zt8la.th.jpg

http://img332.imageshack.us/img332/8550/iceman13gv.th.jpg
http://img332.imageshack.us/img332/6134/iceman20rs.th.jpg
http://img332.imageshack.us/img332/7682/iceman32ns.th.jpg

Add these to Iceman's ability to transfer his consciousness and any non-telepathic opponent would have trouble with him. Now I'm certainly willing to reconsider my position if issues like these can be addressed.

Originally posted by TheKahn
Perhaps I should make myself clearer as I'm most definitely not trying to argue that Iceman is Thor's superior by any stretch of the imagination. My thought is that Iceman's single power, much like say telepathy, could grant a character a victory over a superior opponent, if and only if, that opponent doesn't have any effective defenses against it. And I honestly don't think that you would have to push Iceman very far past his normal operating parameters for him to use the types of attacks I'm proposing against Thor.

This is why I say Iceman has the potential to defeat Thor. And frankly, Thor has such an incredible array of powers (which, in itself, is kinda strange, given that 90% of them have nothing to do with summoning storms, but c'est la vie), that I'm not sure he doesn't have an effective defense. I wish I knew that web address which lists all those powers (Thor fans probably know).

Originally posted by Mindship
Thor has such an incredible array of powers (which, in itself, is kinda strange, given that 90% of them have nothing to do with summoning storms, but c'est la vie), that I'm not sure he doesn't have an effective defense.

i'm thinking, i'm thinking . . .

Originally posted by Mindship
This is why I say Iceman has the potential to defeat Thor. And frankly, Thor has such an incredible array of powers (which, in itself, is kinda strange, given that 90% of them have nothing to do with summoning storms, but c'est la vie), that I'm not sure he doesn't have an effective defense. I wish I knew that web address which lists all those powers (Thor fans probably know).

Ask and you shall receive
http://www.comicboards.com/thor/view.php?trd=040224214306&q=oliv

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