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I don't know about you, but the time I saw this fight I got a small feeling that Boss didn't go all out, especially since she had a mission to die at her disciples hand. But there is also the possibility that she would have lost anyway or that she never faked it. Well, tell me what you think.....

Nah snake would have owned her anyway

Care to explain why?

well like i said she's only gd at CQC and snake can reverse it PLUS snake was awesome with guns and stealth anyway and the boss couldnt hide for shit as she wouldnt shut up... plus she kept shooting at you even when ur hiden behind a tree... lol what a spaz

but gentlemen... lets change the rules a bit! maybe a different scene or limitations... anyone have any suggestions??

Well I at least agree with some of that, but most are gameplay mechanics. The Boss pretty much tore apart Naked Snake when they fought in CQC every other time, I don't see this sudden boost of strenght in him. Also, she is said by her superiors to be killed by her disciple, and she always obeyed orders. Did she really go all out?


Let's not change anything until we reach a conclusion...

thats not the point because when she was losing she tryed to toughen up but still got owned and i think snake learned a bit about her teqniches through the game!

and i think she was going all out because she wanted to give her most beloved student the fight of his life!

Probably, but he still had a tough match with Ocelot in the end, who was only taught slightly by the Boss, I don't think Snake in the matter of a day could possibly match her.....

But where does it say that the Boss tried to win?

no but i think the Boss would at least try because this is her death moment... and snake is her most BELOVED pupil so i guess she would want this to be a moment to remember for snake and not give up without a fight!

Hmm well actually, she sacrafised everything she had ever fought for, the name she had built up for herself, and betrayed the people she loved, just because she was told to. She had already given up so much, and now she was said to be killed by her most beloved pupil, that was her final mission, wouldn't she do that as well?

and when you say snake had a hard time with ocelot when the boss barely taught him ... Ocelot is The bosses son so he would have some of her genes

But that doesn't make you a good fighter. If I am the son of the strongest man in the world, but I myself doesn't search to become the worlds strongest, I don't become that by exercising for 2 days....

no i meant that boss is a natutral fighter and ocelot would maybe inherit that

In the matter of days? Snake was the one who helped her develop it, I think he has more experience to CQC than Ocelot and his new taught techniques. I mean, common, you can't possibly think that Ocelot would beat the Boss in a CQC battle?

no Ocelot would be in crap lol

Originally posted by kamikz
I don't know about you, but the time I saw this fight I got a small feeling that Boss didn't go all out, especially since she had a mission to die at her disciples hand. But there is also the possibility that she would have lost anyway or that she never faked it. Well, tell me what you think.....

I wondered about that too.
She had an order, so i believe she faked it. But who knows what the outcome would be if she fought at her best. In all previous their fights Snake was too careless because he had to fight someone he loves very much...

Agreed. Snake never wanted to kill Boss, I mean, in both his first fights with her he could have shot her, but as she said, "you don't dare to pull the trigger". Snake never really wanted to kill her until the end, when he knew that there was no other thing, and she told him to stand as a Patriot, to obey his orders. (As shown in the beginning, he takes the Boss hand instead of fighting her, but she tosses him into the water. In the end, he is prepared to kill her). I still don't think he could take her in a CQC without some damn luck or anything else (although he came closer and closer to beating her, and I don't think he was really that serious with Ocelot). Thing is, the last fight was a gunfight, it had nothing to do with melee unless the player choose to confront her that way. Also, if the Boss wanted to loose I doubt she would even use a gun since that is no good way of faking, by shooting someone. She also gave him a time limit, if he didn't succeed he would die by bombs.

I belive she faked but I belive that she might have tried more than enough to win as well, I belive Big Boss had a chance of winning in an all around fight....

Originally posted by kamikz
I don't know about you, but the time I saw this fight I got a small feeling that Boss didn't go all out, especially since she had a mission to die at her disciples hand. But there is also the possibility that she would have lost anyway or that she never faked it. Well, tell me what you think.....

1. It doesn't matter, he blew her head off in the end.

2. It was his time to win. EVA was full of shit anyway. I'm glad she got lost in the jungle and was never heard from again.

Originally posted by kamikz
Well I at least agree with some of that, but most are gameplay mechanics. The Boss pretty much tore apart Naked Snake when they fought in CQC every other time, I don't see this sudden boost of strenght in him. Also, she is said by her superiors to be killed by her disciple, and she always obeyed orders. Did she really go all out?


Let's not change anything until we reach a conclusion...

If you noticed in the very first cutscene where they fought each other, Snake was in disbelief, and he was holding back against her.

Originally posted by batdude123
1. It doesn't matter, he blew her head off in the end.

2. It was his time to win. EVA was full of shit anyway. I'm glad she got lost in the jungle and was never heard from again.



Actually it does. If the Boss wasn't told to loose she might not have lost.... And as I said above, I know Snake was in disbelife the first time, but the two last times (before the final battle) he wasn't holding back, still got kicked though.....


Agreed, **** EVA.

Originally posted by kamikz
Actually it does. If the Boss wasn't told to loose she might not have lost.... And as I said above, I know Snake was in disbelife the first time, but the two last times (before the final battle) he wasn't holding back, still got kicked though.....


Agreed, **** EVA.

By the end of the game, he realized his flaws in his style. If you notice that when they fought in the cut scenes, he only "locked up" with her. When you actually fight her at the end, you have to use punches and kicks to disable her. CQC is useless against her, and he knew this, so he took his advantage. Btw, she has a kickass gun.

I thought it was bullshit at the very end that Ocelot was stalemating Snake when they fought. How the hell did he get so good?

Actually, Snake won or would at least have won against Ocelot (remember, he just had the fight of his life, I think he was damn tired). But he remembers the Boss saying "use some of the basics of CQC". Now if he was supposed to face the Boss and win with the "basics of CQC" he wouldn't stand a chance. And no, Snake did kick against her in the cut scenes as well, but she deflected it. Look at the one where he fights her when he has knocked down Volgin, then again before he faces Volgin (after he planted the C4).


Yeah I hated the scene with Ocelot fighting Snake, I was like "lol Ocelot is going to be pwned" but when the fight began and they tossed eachother around I was like "WTF!!!!".

Originally posted by kamikz
Actually, Snake won or would at least have won against Ocelot (remember, he just had the fight of his life, I think he was damn tired). But he remembers the Boss saying "use some of the basics of CQC". Now if he was supposed to face the Boss and win with the "basics of CQC" he wouldn't stand a chance. And no, Snake did kick against her in the cut scenes as well, but she deflected it. Look at the one where he fights her when he has knocked down Volgin, then again before he faces Volgin (after he planted the C4).


Yeah I hated the scene with Ocelot fighting Snake, I was like "lol Ocelot is going to be pwned" but when the fight began and they tossed eachother around I was like "WTF!!!!".

No, but I mean when you fight the boss at the very end, you can't use any means of CQC, or else she'll counter it, and brake your arm or something like that. So, all you can do is throw kicks and punches at her. The majority of the times they fought against each other in the cut scenes, he used grabs and holds native to CQC. Well, that's pretty stupid to do against the CREATOR of CQC. So, at the end, it kinda made sense that he won. She only TRULY fulfilled her mission when she asked Snake to put a bullet in her when she was lying on the ground.

Volgin and Ocelot were both fruits.

No, that is more of a gameplay statistic, Volgin can't be punched, only CQC'd, The Boss can only be punched, not CQC'd. But the thing is that Snake does indeed throw a punch, a kick and an eldbow against the boss, which she easily deflects and almost breaks his arms. Snake doesn't use other unarmed combat than CQC and I don't think he would suddenly change in the end. If he beat her in something it gotta be a gunfight, but as I said before, "where is the proof she didn't fake"?



I'd like Snake to win, but I need someone to find a source to where the Boss actually tried to win before I belive he did...

Originally posted by kamikz
No, that is more of a gameplay statistic, Volgin can't be punched, only CQC'd, The Boss can only be punched, not CQC'd. But the thing is that Snake does indeed throw a punch, a kick and an eldbow against the boss, which she easily deflects and almost breaks his arms. Snake doesn't use other unarmed combat than CQC and I don't think he would suddenly change in the end. If he beat her in something it gotta be a gunfight, but as I said before, "where is the proof she didn't fake"?



I'd like Snake to win, but I need someone to find a source to where the Boss actually tried to win before I belive he did...

If you noticed in the very end of the fight, she said "You're worthy of the title 'Big Boss' now." She wasn't holding back against him at that time. She needed to test him and to not hand him anything easy. We can safely assume that he won because she handed the title of "Big Boss" to him after they fought. The times that they fought in the cutscenes, Snake commented on how he really couldn't fight her because he thought of her as a mother. Although, the Major kept telling him that it was his mission in the end to stop her AT ALL COSTS. So, he finally realized he needed to not hold back against her at that time. There were plenty of times in the cut scenes where he caught her arm, and could've knocked her out, but he hesitated. So, finally in the end going all out, they proved who the superior soldier was, and it was Snake.

At least that's my take on it...

Yes, she was comforting him, and she only said "your a wonderful man, there can only be one Snake and one Boss". And the Boss was told to die against her favourite pupil, she could not return to America. What would Boss have done after she BETRAYED the country she actually fought for, and was told that she could never return to America, and was wanted by Russia as well.... The Boss had no reason to be alive any longer, and her whole mission was based on this, she wouldn't stop just to think "I need to give him a good match".....


Snake said that in the beginning, but as we see in the cut scenes, he both throws punches, kicks and tries to overcome her with techniques, all which miserably fails..... You can't belive that Ocelot (who Snake had a pretty tough match with, although he won or would have) would stand near a chance against Boss in CQC....

Originally posted by kamikz
Probably, but he still had a tough match with Ocelot in the end, who was only taught slightly by the Boss, I don't think Snake in the matter of a day could possibly match her.....

But where does it say that the Boss tried to win?
where does it say Volgin tried to win? How about the Pain? Now how about every soldier in the game? It really doesn't but when you have thousands of bullets flying at your head along with grenades and being bashed the hell out of with a shield. You kinda get the idea they are trying to kill you

Originally posted by kamikz
Yes, she was comforting him, and she only said "your a wonderful man, there can only be one Snake and one Boss". And the Boss was told to die against her favourite pupil, she could not return to America. What would Boss have done after she BETRAYED the country she actually fought for, and was told that she could never return to America, and was wanted by Russia as well.... The Boss had no reason to be alive any longer, and her whole mission was based on this, she wouldn't stop just to think "I need to give him a good match".....


Snake said that in the beginning, but as we see in the cut scenes, he both throws punches, kicks and tries to overcome her with techniques, all which miserably fails..... You can't belive that Ocelot (who Snake had a pretty tough match with, although he won or would have) would stand near a chance against Boss in CQC....
he would've done his mission anyway. They both would've died so therefore she obviously wouldn't have anything to do. Maybe she knew Snake had what it would take to beat her. If you notice everytime they fought Snake was surprised caught off guard.
1st fight on the bridge
Doesn't no what to do and probably doesn't want to try and kill his former master

2nd fight
Surprised to find she has caught him and still is confused by her actions

3rd fight
Attacked while knocking the shit out of Volgin

4th fight
once again caught off guard but manages to keep up a good fight

5th and final fight
prepared to carry out his duty if he doesn't he's as good as dead and boss has told him to give her a good fight.
the fifth fight seems like motivation to me. What reason would she have to hold back might I ask you none. She's smart though and there are many mistakes you could fake like I tried using the death pill and she just yelled at me to gwt up and stop faking she could've walked over to help you out but she didn't she gave her all.

Does every guard in the game have an order NOT to win? Does every guard in the game have an order to DIE at the hands of Snake? Hmmm not really....

Actually yeah they do.

Originally posted by FG725
he would've done his mission anyway. They both would've died so therefore she obviously wouldn't have anything to do. Maybe she knew Snake had what it would take to beat her. If you notice everytime they fought Snake was surprised caught off guard.
1st fight on the bridge
Doesn't no what to do and probably doesn't want to try and kill his former master

2nd fight
Surprised to find she has caught him and still is confused by her actions

3rd fight
Attacked while knocking the shit out of Volgin

4th fight
once again caught off guard but manages to keep up a good fight

5th and final fight
prepared to carry out his duty if he doesn't he's as good as dead and boss has told him to give her a good fight.
the fifth fight seems like motivation to me. What reason would she have to hold back might I ask you none. She's smart though and there are many mistakes you could fake like I tried using the death pill and she just yelled at me to gwt up and stop faking she could've walked over to help you out but she didn't she gave her all.



1st fight. Yes, Snake didn't want to shoot her or anything. Though he wields a knife while she is unarmed....

2th fight. They stand and talk for a long time, she tells him that he was foolish to come back and that he should go home. Then she attacks, she kicks his ass.....

3th fight. She disarms Snake. He gets on his feet while the Boss trashes his gun, at this point, they are both on even ground, as the 2th fight. Boss disables Snake....

4th fight. Same deal, disarms him, then he attacks, she again disables him...

5th and final fight. They are both fighting....


So seriousley, how can you guys even consider Snake to win in a CQC fight when he has gotten his ass kicked by her every time. And he was trying to hit her, he was the one throwing punches against her in the cutscenes, she just defended or countered, or disabled his guns. And she was a master of CQC at this point, forgot the scene IN THE END where Snake remembers Boss saying "try to remember the basics of CQC". Now who wins, the one who uses the basics of CQC or the master of CQC?

Again, she was ordered to die against him. She couldn't go back anywhere, and the whole "I am defecting to the Soviet Union" was because she was told to. She had already got the name "betrayer" amongst other names, she still carried out her duties. She would not try to kill the man she loved, even less when she is told to die at his hands....

Originally posted by kamikz
1st fight. Yes, Snake didn't want to shoot her or anything. Though he wields a knife while she is unarmed....

2th fight. They stand and talk for a long time, she tells him that he was foolish to come back and that he should go home. Then she attacks, she kicks his ass.....

3th fight. She disarms Snake. He gets on his feet while the Boss trashes his gun, at this point, they are both on even ground, as the 2th fight. Boss disables Snake....

4th fight. Same deal, disarms him, then he attacks, she again disables him...

5th and final fight. They are both fighting....


So seriousley, how can you guys even consider Snake to win in a CQC fight when he has gotten his ass kicked by her every time. And he was trying to hit her, he was the one throwing punches against her in the cutscenes, she just defended or countered, or disabled his guns. And she was a master of CQC at this point, forgot the scene IN THE END where Snake remembers Boss saying "try to remember the basics of CQC". Now who wins, the one who uses the basics of CQC or the master of CQC?

Again, she was ordered to die against him. She couldn't go back anywhere, and the whole "I am defecting to the Soviet Union" was because she was told to. She had already got the name "betrayer" amongst other names, she still carried out her duties. She would not try to kill the man she loved, even less when she is told to die at his hands.... yes she won all of the fights except the last but you can move around in the cutscenes it's just close up combat you can't move far away at that point. But you can use all weapons and blend with the environment plus use thermal goggles in the last level giving you a good advantage. You know your duty she will die anyway if you do lose this they share a special bond so they both would naturally want to hold back at least I would. But snake had to fulfill his duties at the end.

But you don't get it, she would not kill him because she wasn't allowed (except if you find a quote from Hideo or anyone else confirming that she was) and her last duty was to be killed by him. Snake might have been able to win that fight (because it was a fight with guns and overall survival) but the Boss was holding back as the game describes it in the end. Is there any proof that Big Boss is above the Boss except in this last fight?

Originally posted by kamikz
But you don't get it, she would not kill him because she wasn't allowed (except if you find a quote from Hideo or anyone else confirming that she was) and her last duty was to be killed by him. Snake might have been able to win that fight (because it was a fight with guns and overall survival) but the Boss was holding back as the game describes it in the end. Is there any proof that Big Boss is above the Boss except in this last fight?
there's actually proof against it when snake is talking about the mission and says something about not standing a chance.

Originally posted by kamikz
Yes, she was comforting him, and she only said "your a wonderful man, there can only be one Snake and one Boss". And the Boss was told to die against her favourite pupil, she could not return to America. What would Boss have done after she BETRAYED the country she actually fought for, and was told that she could never return to America, and was wanted by Russia as well.... The Boss had no reason to be alive any longer, and her whole mission was based on this, she wouldn't stop just to think "I need to give him a good match".....


Snake said that in the beginning, but as we see in the cut scenes, he both throws punches, kicks and tries to overcome her with techniques, all which miserably fails..... You can't belive that Ocelot (who Snake had a pretty tough match with, although he won or would have) would stand near a chance against Boss in CQC....

Why would Boss want to die anything other than an honorable soldier's death? She tried her hardest, and lost. Snake may have been fighting her in the cut scenes, but can we honestly say he was trying his hardest until the very end of the game? I doubt it. She also wouldn't give him the title of "Big Boss" if she didn't think he deserved it. It's the classic tale of an apprentince finally over coming his master. That's all it is. Not to mention in the final encounter they were BOTH using guns. Tell me this: If she was going easy on him, then why the hell was she shooting at him? Exactly, she didn't want to give him an easy fight. She tried her hardest; he tried his hardest and he fulfilled his mission to take her out. In the end, it was proven that he was the superior soldier.

Originally posted by batdude123
By the end of the game, he realized his flaws in his style. If you notice that when they fought in the cut scenes, he only "locked up" with her. When you actually fight her at the end, you have to use punches and kicks to disable her. CQC is useless against her, and he knew this, so he took his advantage. Btw, she has a kickass gun.
ctually CQC was not useless, you could still counter her attacks with it.
And what's wrong with EVA?

Originally posted by batdude123
Why would Boss want to die anything other than an honorable soldier's death? She tried her hardest, and lost. Snake may have been fighting her in the cut scenes, but can we honestly say he was trying his hardest until the very end of the game? I doubt it. She also wouldn't give him the title of "Big Boss" if she didn't think he deserved it. It's the classic tale of an apprentince finally over coming his master. That's all it is. Not to mention in the final encounter they were BOTH using guns. Tell me this: If she was going easy on him, then why the hell was she shooting at him? Exactly, she didn't want to give him an easy fight. She tried her hardest; he tried his hardest and he fulfilled his mission to take her out. In the end, it was proven that he was the superior soldier.



An honorable death? LOL! She had already made herself the reputation of the most dishonorable crook in history, why would she disobey their last order? And Boss NEVER killed Snake, she always kept him alive although she had hundreds and hundreds of oppertunities to kill him. She even gave him the fake death pill (by shooting a fake bullet which was a death pill into his leg) and disarmed Volgin when he was about to kill him. Boss had an order that he would kill her, I mean, why else would she WAIT for him to come, she would have escaped if she really wanted to live. I don't get this, she had an order, she was a patriot, she followed her orders blindly, and she was told to loose against Snake, why would she suddenly not`? And she never said he had to defeat her to get the rank of Big Boss, damn, Boss didn't even know there was a rank of BIG Boss, it was the president that made it up....



And we never see Boss shooting at him, she readys herself in melee fight (I didn't remember that before). Besides, every time she runs to him she yells "GET READY". She is literally preparing Snake to do it. And you CAN fake miss, you don't need to aim, and if you don't aim to hit, you don't hit...

Originally posted by Sam Z
ctually CQC was not useless, you could still counter her attacks with it.
And what's wrong with EVA?

It's useless to ATTACK her with it, of course you can still counter her with it, but if you attack her with it, she'll end up countering you and breaking your arm.

What's wrong with EVA??? What's NOT wrong with EVA? She scams you, has sex with you, almost KILLS you, and then takes off with the philosophy income thingy for China. WHAT A ****!!!

Originally posted by Sam Z
ctually CQC was not useless, you could still counter her attacks with it.
And what's wrong with EVA?
I thought EVA was okay mainly because of the motorcycle chase with her and ocelot that was sooooooooo awesomeOriginally posted by batdude123
Why would Boss want to die anything other than an honorable soldier's death? She tried her hardest, and lost. Snake may have been fighting her in the cut scenes, but can we honestly say he was trying his hardest until the very end of the game? I doubt it. She also wouldn't give him the title of "Big Boss" if she didn't think he deserved it. It's the classic tale of an apprentince finally over coming his master. That's all it is. Not to mention in the final encounter they were BOTH using guns. Tell me this: If she was going easy on him, then why the hell was she shooting at him? Exactly, she didn't want to give him an easy fight. She tried her hardest; he tried his hardest and he fulfilled his mission to take her out. In the end, it was proven that he was the superior soldier.
Yeah, besides it's just a game. I try to enjoy the games I get don't think to much on this stuff. But does anyone know if the three sons of big boss snakes were poisonous never got the chance to throw them at the boss she so damn fast and deflects everything

Originally posted by batdude123
It's useless to ATTACK her with it, of course you can still counter her with it, but if you attack her with it, she'll end up countering you and breaking your arm.

What's wrong with EVA??? What's NOT wrong with EVA? She scams you, has sex with you, almost KILLS you, and then takes off with the philosophy income thingy for China. WHAT A ****!!!
tough love man, tough love. And did they really have sex on that hard floor because he has his pants on in the morning. But yeah she was a filthy **** I wanna know what exactly happened to her.

Originally posted by kamikz
An honorable death? LOL! She had already made herself the reputation of the most dishonorable crook in history, why would she disobey their last order? And Boss NEVER killed Snake, she always kept him alive although she had hundreds and hundreds of oppertunities to kill him. She even gave him the fake death pill (by shooting a fake bullet which was a death pill into his leg) and disarmed Volgin when he was about to kill him. Boss had an order that he would kill her, I mean, why else would she WAIT for him to come, she would have escaped if she really wanted to live. I don't get this, she had an order, she was a patriot, she followed her orders blindly, and she was told to loose against Snake, why would she suddenly not`? And she never said he had to defeat her to get the rank of Big Boss, damn, Boss didn't even know there was a rank of BIG Boss, it was the president that made it up....

An honorable death meaning she would try her best against the guy she loved. Why would she take it easy on him if she loved him so much? Hell, do you know how many times Snake had the opportunity to kill her ass as well? He pointed a gun to her at least three times in the game, and he could've pulled the trigger. Not to mention the fact that he hesitated in nearly every single one of their encounters. He could've easily hit her, but he didn't.

She wouldn't patronize Snake like that. She wouldn't give him the shame of beating her without her trying her best. She went out in a bang; meaning that she knew she had to do what was necessary, but fought her hardest against her favorite pupil. Why exactly wouldn't she? He mentions in some cut scenes that he can't bring himself to beating her because she's like a mother to him. Although, at the very end, the Major asks him if he's ready to do what is necessary. He finally stopped holding back and beat her fair and square. She even admitted to it by saying he's the master now and gave him the title of Boss.

Originally posted by kamikz
And we never see Boss shooting at him, she readys herself in melee fight (I didn't remember that before). Besides, every time she runs to him she yells "GET READY". She is literally preparing Snake to do it. And you CAN fake miss, you don't need to aim, and if you don't aim to hit, you don't hit...

Yeah, right. She shot me plenty of times in that encounter. She was trying to hit him.

Originally posted by FG725
Yeah, besides it's just a game. I try to enjoy the games I get don't think to much on this stuff.

Thank you.

Originally posted by batdude123
An honorable death meaning she would try her best against they guy she loved. Why would she take it easy on him if she loved him so much? Hell, do you know how many times Snake had the opportunity to kill her ass as well? He pointed a gun to her at least three times in the game, and he could've pulled the trigger. Not to mention the fact that he hesitated in nearly every single one of their encounters. He could've easily hit her, but he didn't.

She wouldn't patronize Snake like that. She wouldn't give him the shame of beating her without her trying her best. She went out in a bang; meaning that she knew she had to do what was necessary, but fought her hardest against her favorite pupil. Why exactly wouldn't she? He mentions in some cut scenes that he can't bring himself to beating her because she's like a mother to him. Although, at the very end, the Major asks him if he's ready to do what is necessary. He finally stopped holding back and beat her fair and square. She even admitted to it by saying he's the master now and gave him the title of Boss.



Yeah, right. She shot me plenty of times in that encounter. She was trying to hit him.



No. Goddamn, when will you understand. She was told to loose, if she wanted to she would kill him earlier. She told him all those things to encourage him to kill her, she wanted him to find an emotion in battle, she wanted him to "finish his mission", like she said to him... (This also explains that she knew he was ordered to kill her, she knew perfectly well what she had to do) If she wanted to give him a battle then why the hell would she have gone through all of that shit? And trying to kill him because she loves him, doesn't make sense...... I would rather fight my hardest against a stranger that wants to kill me rather than my mom....



No, the Major never says that before he is to fight her. He talks to him during an EARLY conversation and he says that he doesn't want to do that mission, but the Major says he has to, and explains the reasons. Snake was ready to do it. And no, The Boss could have shot Snake when he pet her horse, she could have let the Cobras kill him while he was walking on the bridge, she could have used the transmitter to locate then hunt him down with several guards or do it herself, or she could have told the Cobras to go together and kill him.... I mean, common, even The End seems to fake. Why the hell would he have tranqualiser shots if he wanted to kill Snake? Why would he carry him back to the laboratory if he wanted to kill him? She said herself he was the most capable of killing him, thus she did the same as she did with EVA and Ocelot, TOLD HIM NOT TO KILL HIM!!!!!


Oh lord, are you comparing game play now to? Would you think it was an entertaining battle if you couldn't die or be hit in the battle? No didn't think so.....

Originally posted by kamikz
No. Goddamn, when will you understand. She was told to loose, if she wanted to she would kill him earlier. She told him all those things to encourage him to kill her, she wanted him to find an emotion in battle, she wanted him to "finish his mission", like she said to him... (This also explains that she knew he was ordered to kill her, she knew perfectly well what she had to do) If she wanted to give him a battle then why the hell would she have gone through all of that shit? And trying to kill him because she loves him, doesn't make sense...... I would rather fight my hardest against a stranger that wants to kill me rather than my mom....



No, the Major never says that before he is to fight her. He talks to him during an EARLY conversation and he says that he doesn't want to do that mission, but the Major says he has to, and explains the reasons. Snake was ready to do it. And no, The Boss could have shot Snake when he pet her horse, she could have let the Cobras kill him while he was walking on the bridge, she could have used the transmitter to locate then hunt him down with several guards or do it herself, or she could have told the Cobras to go together and kill him.... I mean, common, even The End seems to fake. Why the hell would he have tranqualiser shots if he wanted to kill Snake? Why would he carry him back to the laboratory if he wanted to kill him? She said herself he was the most capable of killing him, thus she did the same as she did with EVA and Ocelot, TOLD HIM NOT TO KILL HIM!!!!!


Oh lord, are you comparing game play now to? Would you think it was an entertaining battle if you couldn't die or be hit in the battle? No didn't think so.....

I guess we're going to have to agree to disagree on this one then. I don't buy that she would manipulate and patronize him like that in their final battle.

OK..... But why would she not do that? I guess I can't talk you into changing your mind, I'm not trying to force you, but seriousley, I don't see how she can try her best if she is told to loose. I want Snake to win, but I can't see how he did it fair, I would be glad if someone could say that he did. Of course, he might have won even if she tried, but there is not enough facts to say that for me...

Okay, anyone, can someone prove, without assumptions or anything else, that the Boss did NOT fake against Snake? I want to find proof about it, was the whole last battle in Snake Eater fake? Was the Boss forced into loosing because she was told to?

Originally posted by kamikz
OK..... But why would she not do that? I guess I can't talk you into changing your mind, I'm not trying to force you, but seriousley, I don't see how she can try her best if she is told to loose. I want Snake to win, but I can't see how he did it fair, I would be glad if someone could say that he did. Of course, he might have won even if she tried, but there is not enough facts to say that for me...

However, here's a question:

If she didn't want to try her best and test to make sure Snake was worthy of the "Boss" title, then why would she have even fought him in the first place? She could've killed herself or she could've had him shoot her right as they were facing off. Instead, integrity on both parts made them have a final encounter with both going all out and so he could pass her.

That is a very good point. But I belive this is the answere.....


The Boss was told to die by the hand of her beloved disciple. The world was not to know that she actually was a patriot, they were supposed to belive she was a betrayer, thus he would end her life in a battle.....
Besides, she knew that if Snake knew she was a patriot, if Snake knew that she really wasn't bad, Snake would not have killed her. This is shown in the end, where the Boss has told EVA to tell him this. If she really wanted it that way then she would have told him before they fought. But she knew Snake would never kill her if that was the point.



And another thing that aims towards that the Boss was faking. She told EVA not to kill Snake AFTER the mission. This proves that she knew Snake would complete the mission...

Originally posted by kamikz
That is a very good point. But I belive this is the answere.....


The Boss was told to die by the hand of her beloved disciple. The world was not to know that she actually was a patriot, they were supposed to belive she was a betrayer, thus he would end her life in a battle.....
Besides, she knew that if Snake knew she was a patriot, if Snake knew that she really wasn't bad, Snake would not have killed her. This is shown in the end, where the Boss has told EVA to tell him this. If she really wanted it that way then she would have told him before they fought. But she knew Snake would never kill her if that was the point.



And another thing that aims towards that the Boss was faking. She told EVA not to kill Snake AFTER the mission. This proves that she knew Snake would complete the mission...

She knew what she had to do in the end, but why does that automatically consitute to her not trying her hardest against Snake? If they would have a final encounter, she could complete his training and make him fulfill the title of Boss, replacing her in that spot. It was only until he ACTUALLY disabled her, that she made him put a bullet in her head. Besides, you could tell his technique had improved the way he could counter her attacks and such.

Since she was told to loose this battle, and she followed her orders blindly, I just can't see how she would fight the battle her hardest. She might have given him a hard battle, but did she really aim to kill, do we have any proof?

And Snake still only had the basics of CQC (because he had forgotten the rest). A user of Basic CQC can not and should not defeat a master. And it is just the game mechanics. Do you really think it would be fun to be defeated every time she went to CQC you?



Actually, the only thing I see Snake (at this point) is capable of defeating her in would be a gun battle. We have never seen the Boss in a gun battle, and Snake defeated all of the Cobras with a gun, Snake might have won there, faking or not faking.....

I wonder, have anyone seen the air-raid scene? When Snake doesn't have time to defeat her and both die in an air-raid? I haven't seen that one, can someone tell me what happens in that scene?


Also, I have found out that although she was not allowed to kill herself or tell anyone about her real mission, non could assure that Snake would survive this whole operation, so in all honesty, it would not matter so much if Snake died at the end. Also, Snake must have been damn tired at that point. Let's see......

In the BEGINNING of the Snake Eater mission he almost fell on the ground of exhaustion. He was beaten to near death by Volgin, then tortured and lost an eye. He was shot in the leg by the Fear, and he has been running around for hours in the jungle...... He had beaten the Shagoohod and Colonel Volgin in battle... Right after that he is sent to destroy the boss. Even there, the Boss had much better weapons and camoflauge for that terrain. The scales were not even.... If they were, Snake might have prevaild anyway, faking or not....

Originally posted by batdude123
It's useless to ATTACK her with it, of course you can still counter her with it, but if you attack her with it, she'll end up countering you and breaking your arm.

What's wrong with EVA??? What's NOT wrong with EVA? She scams you, has sex with you, almost KILLS you, and then takes off with the philosophy income thingy for China. WHAT A ****!!!

Yeah she is. But "sex" part is good anyway.

Lol!


Oh and I changed my mind now, I think Big defeated her fair. I completed the game today (lol, started a new game and completed it ini 1,38 hours) and I tried to wait until the time was up. The MIG's come in and bomb them, the Boss says "this is the end". If she really wanted him to win then she would have allowed him to kill her before that time.... Well it works for me...

Originally posted by kamikz
Lol!


Oh and I changed my mind now, I think Big defeated her fair. I completed the game today (lol, started a new game and completed it ini 1,38 hours) and I tried to wait until the time was up. The MIG's come in and bomb them, the Boss says "this is the end". If she really wanted him to win then she would have allowed him to kill her before that time.... Well it works for me...

You've seen the light my friend.

Originally posted by kamikz
I wonder, have anyone seen the air-raid scene? When Snake doesn't have time to defeat her and both die in an air-raid? I haven't seen that one, can someone tell me what happens in that scene?


Also, I have found out that although she was not allowed to kill herself or tell anyone about her real mission, non could assure that Snake would survive this whole operation, so in all honesty, it would not matter so much if Snake died at the end. Also, Snake must have been damn tired at that point. Let's see......

In the BEGINNING of the Snake Eater mission he almost fell on the ground of exhaustion. He was beaten to near death by Volgin, then tortured and lost an eye. He was shot in the leg by the Fear, and he has been running around for hours in the jungle...... He had beaten the Shagoohod and Colonel Volgin in battle... Right after that he is sent to destroy the boss. Even there, the Boss had much better weapons and camoflauge for that terrain. The scales were not even.... If they were, Snake might have prevaild anyway, faking or not....

Lol why is he naked? Can't he be clothed like normal? hahaha

Lol it's his codename. He is described as "naked" when he does not wear any camoflauge....