cap vs spider-man

Soljer

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Sea King

cap only landed what one hit??

anyways i say spiderman without his new iron suit wins

Validus

Cap 10/10

batdude123

Originally posted by Validus
Cap 10/10

Cosigned. jockey

Skeets

Originally posted by Validus
Cap 10/10
srug

Soljer

Read the text.

"He's hit me three times. I didn't get him once. Elapsed time - - Ten Seconds. The man knows more about hand-to-hand fighting than I'd ever learn in a hundred years. Makes me feel like a chump."

I'm not saying that Cap wins 10/10. Nor am I saying that he even wins a majority. I just don't believe that Spiderman will curbstomp him.

Arahan

From which comic are these scans????

x man25

caps wins oh hi vincent

Skeets

Originally posted by x man25
caps wins oh hi vincent
wave Hey Preston.

Dinalfos

batdude123

Originally posted by Soljer
Read the text.

"He's hit me three times. I didn't get him once. Elapsed time - - Ten Seconds. The man knows more about hand-to-hand fighting than I'd ever learn in a hundred years. Makes me feel like a chump."

I'm not saying that Cap wins 10/10. Nor am I saying that he even wins a majority. I just don't believe that Spiderman will curbstomp him.

You honestly think that Spider-man would be depicted beating the shit outta Captain America in a comic book? laughing

Hardly anybody can overcome his jobber aura. ninja

Hell, even Namor is given a hard time. However, that kind of stuff is thrown out the window here. Spider-man 9/10.

H. S. 6

Originally posted by Dinalfos
Spiderman wins, ofcourse. No PIS, no CIS, no jobbing......10/10.

Bada bing. thumb up

Soljer

Originally posted by batdude123
You honestly think that Spider-man would be depicted beating the shit outta Captain America in a comic book? laughing

Hardly anybody can overcome his jobber aura. ninja

Hell, even Namor is given a hard time. However, that kind of stuff is thrown out the window here. Spider-man 9/10.

I understand that many many people job to Captain America. But I think that SO many people Job to Captain America, that he is under rated at times.

Come now, Batdude, you know I am reasonable. I'm not ABOUT to give Cap the majority. But can he edge out a few wins? I'd say so.

Arahan

I still want to know which issue that scans are from.

H. S. 6

Originally posted by Soljer
I understand that many many people job to Captain America. But I think that SO many people Job to Captain America, that he is under rated at times.

Come now, Batdude, you know I am reasonable. I'm not ABOUT to give Cap the majority. But can he edge out a few wins? I'd say so.

I'm not so sure about that. With them both at full potential, no PIS, CIS, or jobbing, Cap shouldn't even be able to touch Spidey, let alone pull off a win.

Arahan

What i dont get is that Spiderman is very fast much faster than a human can ever get, and after The Other Story his speed was upgraded.

So why in hell can Cap hit Spidey, and why doesnt he just dodge his attacks.

Cap has superior H2H skills but Spidey has superior speed, strength reaction that must count for something. Unfortunately Spidey is often used as a punching bag to make things more interesting.

rotiart

Spiderman's not an amateur. In the scans he says that cap has studied spiderman's style and cap knows to keep it close, thats why spidey tried to get a distance... between him and cap, but cap kept it close.

cap vs. spiderman, based on those showings, cap 10/10
cap vs. iron spidey, iron spidey 5/10.

H. S. 6

Originally posted by Arahan
What i dont get is that Spiderman is very fast much faster than a human can ever get, and after The Other Story his speed was upgraded.

So why in hell can Cap hit Spidey, and why doesnt he just dodge his attacks.

Cap has superior H2H skills but Spidey has superior speed, strength reaction that must count for something. Unfortunately Spidey is often used as a punching bag to make things more interesting.

"Fear Captain America's jobbing aura of DOOM!" wink

batdude123

Arahan

Come on guys someone must know which issue this is.

complexbrother

Originally posted by H. S. 6
I'm not so sure about that. With them both at full potential, no PIS, CIS, or jobbing, Cap shouldn't even be able to touch Spidey, let alone pull off a win.

box I agree !

rotiart

I don't. Parker's a pansy for taking off his mask. Cap keeps his on and kills him.

H. S. 6

Originally posted by rotiart
I don't. Parker's a pansy for taking off his mask. Cap keeps his on and kills him.

You just lost about all credibility you had on this forum.

Soljer

Originally posted by H. S. 6
You just lost about all credibility you had on this forum.

I definitely can agree with you on this note.

Brining stuff like that into debates makes you sound like an idiot.

You might as well say "Cap wins cause he is cooler!"

Crease

Originally posted by batdude123
You honestly think that Spider-man would be depicted beating the shit outta Captain America in a comic book? laughing

Hardly anybody can overcome his jobber aura. ninja

Hell, even Namor is given a hard time. However, that kind of stuff is thrown out the window here. Spider-man 9/10.

What he said.

rotiart

Okay.

Cap wins cause he's cooler.

yawn.

rotiart

So you're saying all the wins. All the fights. Even the recent ones. Nothing ever showing EVER a retcon of the base character, he's now someone with no skill. And that EVERYONE jobs to him. Right.

Even on panel spiderman is stating that he couldn't win hand to hand against cap. The only advantage he had is that cap didn't know what that new suit of his could do, and if it wasn't for that, spiderman would have lost.

Cap's just a man. Yet he's fought the whole wrecking crew. hulk. namor. terrax. defeated at least 10 shield against at pointblank range. tossed his shield into an aircraft from hundreds of feet away.

eh. and parker annoys me. when tony told parker what he was going to do, peter was up at odds with himself. But tony pushed him, and peter folded. You can tell peter was one of those kinds of characters that was going to go either way. but tony pushed him his way.

Btw watching everyone just say spidey spidey spidey starts to get annoying. iron spidey wins, parker would have lost without the suit, and admitted it on panel. and comparing their track records of villains, you have to admit that its too similar to say that captain america is NOT on spiderman's level as an opponent.

Soljer

Originally posted by rotiart
So you're saying all the wins. All the fights. Even the recent ones. Nothing ever showing EVER a retcon of the base character, he's now someone with no skill. And that EVERYONE jobs to him. Right.

Even on panel spiderman is stating that he couldn't win hand to hand against cap. The only advantage he had is that cap didn't know what that new suit of his could do, and if it wasn't for that, spiderman would have lost.

Cap's just a man. Yet he's fought the whole wrecking crew. hulk. namor. terrax. defeated at least 10 shield against at pointblank range. tossed his shield into an aircraft from hundreds of feet away.

eh. and parker annoys me. when tony told parker what he was going to do, peter was up at odds with himself. But tony pushed him, and peter folded. You can tell peter was one of those kinds of characters that was going to go either way. but tony pushed him his way.

Btw watching everyone just say spidey spidey spidey starts to get annoying. iron spidey wins, parker would have lost without the suit, and admitted it on panel. and comparing their track records of villains, you have to admit that its too similar to say that captain america is NOT on spiderman's level as an opponent.

There. Now you make a few good points. It is a LOT better than "Cap wins cause Pete's nothing but a puss."

Also, this isn't the first time Captain America has been able to keep up with Peter.

rotiart

sorry but i'm at work whenver i'm here. and when I type a lot. it means i have almost no work. when i type little comments like that (after reading all those other no debate comments) i have lots of work.

rotiart

have LOTS of work this week. sigh.

Soljer

Understandable. Good luck, and try not to smother yourself 'neath all that work.

srankmissingnin

What issue are those scans from?

Skeets

The scans should be from Amazing spider-man #534

Grimm22

Originally posted by Dinalfos
Spiderman wins, ofcourse. No PIS, no CIS, no jobbing......10/10.

10/10?!?! What the f**k?

You underestimate Cap

Grimm22

xmarksthespot

Spider-Man 9.99/10. There's probably a 1/1000 chance that Spider-Man has a spontaneous seizure.

batdude123

Spider-man would win the healthy majority in a non PIS/CIS filled fight.

Skeets

Originally posted by Grimm22
Thats a pretty acurate description of how a fight between them would go erm

No it's not.. no expression

Soljer

Originally posted by Grimm22
10/10?!?! What the f**k?

You underestimate Cap

I'm glad at least a FEW agree.

Grimm22

Originally posted by batdude123
Spider-man would win the healthy majority in a non PIS/CIS filled fight.

as Iron Spidey 7/10

as Regular Spidey 5.5/10 wink

batdude123

Originally posted by Grimm22
as Regular Spidey 5.5/10 wink

Wow, now that's severly underestimating Spider-man... What the f**k?

Soljer

Oh, and yes, that is from Amazing Spider-Man 534. Sorry I didn't respond with the issue number sooner.

Skeets

Originally posted by Grimm22
as Iron Spidey 7/10

as Regular Spidey 5.5/10 wink

Nope Spidey naked beats Cap 8-9/10

Grimm22

Originally posted by Skeets
Nope Spidey naked beats Cap 8-9/10

Grimm22

Originally posted by batdude123
Wow, now that's severly underestimating Spider-man... What the f**k?

No its just Cap is good wink

The Fake Macoy

Spidey should take the clear majority, since he's stronger, faster, and has his spider sense.

Grimm22

Originally posted by The Fake Macoy
Spidey should take the clear majority, since he's stronger, faster, and has his spider sense.

True, however Cap is more skilled and is smarter (tacticly), plus he has more experience

xmarksthespot

Originally posted by Grimm22
as Iron Spidey 7/10

as Regular Spidey 5.5/10 wink

So so wrong...

Skeets

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
So so wrong...
tell em ma!

xmarksthespot

Originally posted by Skeets
tell em ma! Quiet pa, you'll wake the youngin's

Wolverine2006

This is really off topic but does anyone here have Mugen? And if so can u help me in the Computer/Video Games discussion forum, please the thread I started is called Windows Mugen. Thanx if u do.

P.S. Spidey wins

H. S. 6

Originally posted by Grimm22
True, however Cap is more skilled and is smarter (tacticly), plus he has more experience

Not going to help him when he's webbed down and getting wailed on by a person with 20 ton+ strength.

Tell me, what makes you think Cap should even be able to hit Spidey? Peter's speed is far greater than Cap's, he's much stronger, and he's got his Spider-Sense.

badabing

This goes against all logic, but I'm giving Cap 3 wins out of 10.

mustachio

I think some of you are a little one sided. I personally would go for Spidey. He would definitely pull out a few wins under normal circumstances, but because of Cap's fighting experience, he would neutralize some of Spiderman's best offenses. Spiderman's best way to go is to use his amazing strength and speed to his advantage (and in conjunction with one another) and confuse Captain. But Cap may be familiar with Spidey's style, so in my opinion, the fight could go either way. What I'm trying to say is this would not be a quick and easy fight. Spiderman would actually have to think about how he's going to win because if he goes into the fight thinking he will woop Cap, he will get hurt. Really, if written correctly, and Spiderman is fighting at full potential, Spiderman should win the majority without hesitation, but NEVER underestimate Captain America... or your a Commie in my eyes... shifty

iceman13

and did you see civil war#3 ,cap kicked spider man ass, and he did'nt have hes shield cap 8/10

H. S. 6

Originally posted by iceman13
and did you see civil war#3 ,cap kicked spider man ass, and he did'nt have hes shield cap 8/10

Are you freakin kidding me? What the f**k?

Spidey punked him with his own shield. no expression

Soljer

Originally posted by H. S. 6
Are you freakin kidding me? What the f**k?

Spidey punked him with his own shield. no expression

I just looked at it. All it showed was Cap getting hit once with his own shield, and then him punching Spider-man twice. Then it was kinda broken up.

Metalmanx

Originally posted by Soljer
I just looked at it. All it showed was Cap getting hit once with his own shield, and then him punching Spider-man twice. Then it was kinda broken up.

Twice? I thought it was just once? As stupid as that is.

Metalmanx

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Spider-Man 9.99/10. There's probably a 1/1000 chance that Spider-Man has a spontaneous seizure.

Co-Signed.

Metalmanx

Originally posted by batdude123
You honestly think that Spider-man would be depicted beating the shit outta Captain America in a comic book? laughing

Hardly anybody can overcome his jobber aura. ninja

Hell, even Namor is given a hard time. However, that kind of stuff is thrown out the window here. Spider-man 9/10.

Another co-sign.

Metalmanx

Originally posted by Soljer
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My lord.

It's in the comic, I can't argue that. But that is just insane. Don't get me wrong, I love Cap. But he just can't hang with Spidey. Iron Spidey, Normal Spidey, Naked Spidey. They all win relatively easy. Even with someone as skilled as Cap.

Spidey wins 9.5/10.

H. S. 6

Originally posted by Soljer
I just looked at it. All it showed was Cap getting hit once with his own shield, and then him punching Spider-man twice. Then it was kinda broken up.

First of all, it was once. Secondly, it shouldn't have happened. Look at the facts: Spidey's speed/reaction time is so far above Cap's that Mr. America should be like a slug to Peter.

Not to mention his Spider-Sense.

I don't see how anyone can doubt this.

jinzin

Originally posted by H. S. 6
Are you freakin kidding me? What the f**k?

Spidey punked him with his own shield. no expression

once...

of course there was one occasion where an angry spiderman went after captain america cause he thought he wasn't getting due respect and cap respected him with a punch that sent him airborne and knocked him on his ass...

in civil war issue 3 spiderman goes after cap again! and cap is winning the fight before iron man interjects...

and then here.. where spiderman admits that up close cap has his number.. and they said that batman couldn't take him in a strict hand to hand.. pfffft. roll eyes (sarcastic)

H. S. 6

Cap is winning the fight? If anything, it's the other way around. blink

Soljer

Originally posted by jinzin
once... confused

Exactly. This is three times that Captain America has managed to not only TAG spider man, but prove to be his superior in close quarters combat.

What can we infer? That cap can, at the VERY least, hang with Spider-man. There is NO way, based on these three showings, that Spider-man wins ten, nine, or even eight times out of ten.

EDIT: Oh, and let me apologize about the "twice" thing. It was my mistake, I was merely confusing the punch that Spider-man manged to block with one that connected. Regardless of this fact, as both Jinzin and I have mentioned, Cap and Spiderman have tangled three times, and Cap has came out on top each and every time.

Apolloknight

Normal Spidey, Capt gets 1 win, There is no answer against spidermans webbing. H2H doesnt matter, Spiderman isnt the grestest H2H combatant and he knows it, so why would he fight someone up close who he knows is better then him, come on, we all know spiderman is smarter then that. wink

Against Iron Spidey, man cap gets lucky to pull of 1/2 a win, now he has to deal with his webbing, 3 stringers, 2 arms, and two legs, plus peters massive speed agility and strength advantage.

JOE NUNEZ

As the fight goes on, it favors Spidey..Cap was bleeding, and if that fight goes on any longer Cap could have been seriously hurt.

H. S. 6

Originally posted by Soljer
Exactly. This is three times that Captain America has managed to not only TAG spider man, but prove to be his superior in close quarters combat.

What can we infer? That cap can, at the VERY least, hang with Spider-man. There is NO way, based on these three showings, that Spider-man wins ten, nine, or even eight times out of ten.

EDIT: Oh, and let me apologize about the "twice" thing. It was my mistake, I was merely confusing the punch that Spider-man manged to block with one that connected. Regardless of this fact, as both Jinzin and I have mentioned, Cap and Spiderman have tangled three times, and Cap has came out on top each and every time.

And what happens when Cap gets hit by a fifteen-ton punch? He drops like a sack of potatoes. And then the fight's over. confused

Originally posted by Apolloknight
Normal Spidey, Capt gets 1 win, There is no answer against spidermans webbing. H2H doesnt matter, Spiderman isnt the grestest H2H combatant and he knows it, so why would he fight someone up close who he knows is better then him, come on, we all know spiderman is smarter then that. wink

Against Iron Spidey, man cap gets lucky to pull of 1/2 a win, now he has to deal with his webbing, 3 stringers, 2 arms, and two legs, plus peters massive speed agility and strength advantage.

thumb up

Soljer

Originally posted by H. S. 6
And what happens when Cap gets hit by a fifteen-ton punch? He drops like a sack of potatoes. And then the fight's over. confused

...Cap can't take a punch, now?

jinzin

Originally posted by H. S. 6
Cap is winning the fight? If anything, it's the other way around. blink

whao. who said "cap wins" I'm just pointin shit out here.. stop jumping the gun.

H. S. 6

Originally posted by Soljer
...Cap can't take a punch, now?

You think a "peak human" is going to take that kind of a punch well?

Honestly. I want to know if you think his face won't be turned to a bloody mess (especially after multiple hits).

As far as I know, Cap's durability is no more than a human's at the best possible level.

H. S. 6

Originally posted by jinzin
whao. who said "cap wins" I'm just pointin shit out here.. stop jumping the gun.

You said:

Originally posted by jinzin
in civil war issue 3 spiderman goes after cap again! and cap is winning the fight before iron man interjects...

So I said:

Originally posted by H. S. 6
Cap is winning the fight? If anything, it's the other way around. blink

Got it now?

xmarksthespot

Who is faster?
Spider-Man
Who is stronger?
Spider-Man
Who is more agile?
Spider-Man
Who is more durable?
Spider-Man
Who heals faster?
Spider-Man
Who has better reflexes?
Spider-Man
Who is precognitive?
Spider-Man
Who is more intelligent?
Spider-Man
Who would win the vast majority?
Spider-Man

Closing...

Apolloknight

Originally posted by H. S. 6
You think a "peak human" is going to take that kind of a punch well?

Honestly. I want to know if you think his face won't be turned to a bloody mess (especially after multiple hits).

As far as I know, Cap's durability is no more than a human's at the best possible level.

Cap has shown a little more then peak human durability to be honest. His chainmail suit helps him slighty also, but it wont matter even still.

I say he could take 2, maybe 3 or spideys full strength punches at the most.

But I hold my point I keep eairler, spiderman webs him up, there is no way for capt to break free, then he spins him around into say, a pole, a dumbster, a car, through a store window, through a building, into the street, swings around town, then drops him from a 70 story building in downtown New York.

H. S. 6

Originally posted by Apolloknight
Cap has shown a little more then peak human durability to be honest. His chainmail suit helps him slighty also, but it wont matter even still.

I say he could take 2, maybe 3 or spideys full strength punches at the most.

But I hold my point I keep eairler, spiderman webs him up, there is no way for capt to break free, then he spins him around into say, a pole, a dumbster, a car, through a store window, through a building, into the street, swings around town, then drops him from a 70 story building in downtown New York.

Yep. thumb up

jinzin

Originally posted by H. S. 6
And what happens when Cap gets hit by a fifteen-ton punch? He drops like a sack of potatoes. And then the fight's over. confused

you mean like when he fights hyde? no you must mean when he fights namor? no i got it! when he's fighting the wrecking crew?!?! no that can't be it... no how about when he fights scorpion? hmmmm wait... you mean like when he fights cosmic cube induced red skull right? wait..... okay.... what DO you mean?

what happens when he gets hit with a 15 ton punch? probably the same thing that always happens.. he rolls with it... or uses it to expose his enemy to an attack.. or spiderman holds it back so it doesn't matter anyway. confused

cap does have some degree of superhuman durability though. I mean hell the guy's head as been used as a wrecking ball to drop an apartment building on his noggin.

H. S. 6

Originally posted by jinzin
you mean like when he fights hyde? no you must mean when he fights namor? no i got it! when he's fighting the wrecking crew?!?! no that can't be it... no how about when he fights scorpion? hmmmm wait... you mean like when he fights cosmic cube induced red skull right? wait..... okay.... what DO you mean?

what happens when he gets hit with a 15 ton punch? probably the same thing that always happens.. he rolls with it... or uses it to expose his enemy to an attack.. or spiderman holds it back so it doesn't matter anyway. confused

cap does have some degree of superhuman durability though. I mean hell the guy's head as been used as a wrecking ball to drop an apartment building on his noggin.

Or what about when he's webbed up so he can't move? Hmm... seeing as how Spidey's got a major speed advantage, I don't think that'd be too hard. After all, what's Cap going to do to stop it? Throw his shield? Ah, well, that won't work. I mean, we've all seen what happens then. confused

Spider-Man isn't holding back, either.

jinzin

Originally posted by H. S. 6
You said:

So I said:

Got it now?

oh wait you're reffering to the civil war issue? you need to have your eyes checked... spidey jacks his shield does some shifty camo mode stuff and then tries to take cap out with his own shield... doesn't work they engage in hand to hand.. before iron man interferes spearing cap through a brick wall at high speeds from behind (which is by the way another testament to cap's superhuman durability..) we get a nice little shot of cap landing a haymaker on spidey's face AGAIN, sending spidey flying again and this time in "spread eagle" lol.. he was certainly winning there.

Apolloknight

cap does have some degree of superhuman durability though. I mean hell the guy's head as been used as a wrecking ball to drop an apartment building on his noggin.

Even still there is no answer for Spideys webbing.

jinzin

Originally posted by H. S. 6
Or what about when he's webbed up so he can't move? Hmm... seeing as how Spidey's got a major speed advantage, I don't think that'd be too hard. After all, what's Cap going to do to stop it? Throw his shield? Ah, well, that won't work. I mean, we've all seen what happens then. confused

Spider-Man isn't holding back, either. well now you're just changing the subject... so then do you conceed a spider punch isn't all that you thought it was going to be here?

and yes.. cis is applicable to these fights. sorry.

jinzin

Originally posted by Apolloknight
Even still there is no answer for Spideys webbing.

i wasn't answering a question based on spiderman's webbing.. What the f**k?

H. S. 6

Originally posted by jinzin
well now you're just changing the subject... so then do you conceed a spider punch isn't all that you thought it was going to be here?

and yes.. cis is applicable to these fights. sorry.

No. But I'm saying: what's going to happen when Cap's webbed down, and he gets hit with a couple 15 ton punches?

Got that picture in your head? Good. wink

(From the forum rules: )

Doesn't sound like that would include Character Induced Stupidity to me, but maybe I'm reading it wrong. confused

Apolloknight

Originally posted by jinzin
i wasn't answering a question based on spiderman's webbing.. What the f**k?

Your were arguing points on Capts durability, and I said, its not going to matter. confused

Soljer

Originally posted by H. S. 6
You think a "peak human" is going to take that kind of a punch well?

Honestly. I want to know if you think his face won't be turned to a bloody mess (especially after multiple hits).

As far as I know, Cap's durability is no more than a human's at the best possible level.

If he can take hits from Mr. Hyde who is currently Class 80, or Iron-Man (In the very same scans), who is, even at base level, much stronger than Spider-man, then yeah. I think Cap could take a punch or two. How about against Namor? The Controller? Man-Ape?

What about a hung-over Cap easily keeping up with Beast's speed and agility, a character that is often compared to Spider-man in those departments? Scoprion? Doc Ock? The Executionar?

How about the Spidey robot that Kang created in the future? It had every one of Spider-man's powers, it easily matched Spider-man in combat, and when it engaged Cap, it analyzed his Spider strength and speed, and calculated that he would not be able to match Cap in hand to hand combat.

Does none of this make a difference? erm

.

EDIT: Shit. I notice I took too long to post, and thus, Jinzin already pointed out much of what I have written. Regardless, I believe my (our?) point still stands.

jinzin

Originally posted by H. S. 6
No. But I'm saying: what's going to happen when Cap's webbed down, and he gets hit with a couple 15 ton punches?

Got that picture in your head? Good. wink

that MIGHT be what you're saying now. you had no mention of the webs in your "sack of potatoes" post....

how cap does this?

http://img3.freeimagehosting.net/image.php?8198d2fc17.jpg

got THAT picture in your head? good! wink

jinzin

Originally posted by Apolloknight
Your were arguing points on Capts durability, and I said, its not going to matter. confused

yep I WAS arguing points on cap's durability. cause aparently you don't think any of his feats that suggest his superhuman durability mean that he infact has superhuman durability... so then you defect to webbing? it's a copout.. do you then conceed you were wrong about his durability?

H. S. 6

Originally posted by jinzin
that MIGHT be what you're saying now. you had no mention of the webs in your "sack of potatoes" post....

how cap does this?

http://img3.freeimagehosting.net/image.php?8198d2fc17.jpg

got THAT picture in your head? good! wink

How long do you think he's going to be dodging webs before Spidey overwhelms him?

Apolloknight

Originally posted by Soljer
If he can take hits from Mr. Hyde who is currently Class 80, or Iron-Man (In the very same scans), who is, even at base level, much stronger than Spider-man, then yeah. I think Cap could take a punch or two. How about against Namor? The Controller? Man-Ape?

What about a hung-over Cap easily keeping up with Beast's speed and agility, a character that is often compared to Spider-man in those departments? Scoprion? Doc Ock? The Executionar?

How about the Spidey robot that Kang created in the future? It had every one of Spider-man's powers, it easily matched Spider-man in combat, and when it engaged Cap, it analyzed his Spider strength and speed, and calculated that he would not be able to match Cap in hand to hand combat.

Does none of this make a difference? erm

.

Dont get me wrong, you bring up very good points, if spiderman would engage capt in Purely H2H it be a better fight, but Spidey would still take the majority 7-8/10 due to his superhuman qualitys alone.

But Parker is not that dumb, he knows capt is a better fighter then him, there is no answer for capt being webbed up and tossed around like a rag doll.

See what I mean?

jinzin

.

EDIT: Shit. I notice I took too long to post, and thus, Jinzin already pointed out much of what I have written. Regardless, I believe my (our?) point still stands. punk

see the good we can do when we join our forces together instead of bickering against one another? lol. good work.

jinzin

Originally posted by H. S. 6
How long do you think he's going to be dodging webs before Spidey overwhelms him? probably not long at all no cap might try to close the gap but if spidey fights smart he won't let him.

jinzin

Originally posted by Apolloknight
Dont get me wrong, you bring up very good points, if spiderman would engage capt in Purely H2H it be a better fight, but Spidey would still take the majority 7-8/10 due to his superhuman qualitys alone.

But Parker is not that dumb, he knows capt is a better fighter then him, there is no answer for capt being webbed up and tossed around like a rag doll.

See what I mean? well of course there's no answer for it when you've already given spiderman the benefit of the doubt to say that cap would be so helpless in the first place.

Apolloknight

Originally posted by jinzin
yep I WAS arguing points on cap's durability. cause aparently you don't think any of his feats that suggest his superhuman durability mean that he infact has superhuman durability... so then you defect to webbing? it's a copout.. do you then conceed you were wrong about his durability?

Originally posted by Apolloknight
Cap has shown a little more then peak human durability to be honest. His chainmail suit helps him slighty also, but it wont matter even still.

I say he could take 2, maybe 3 or spideys full strength punches at the most.

But I hold my point I keep eairler, spiderman webs him up, there is no way for capt to break free, then he spins him around into say, a pole, a dumbster, a car, through a store window, through a building, into the street, swings around town, then drops him from a 70 story building in downtown New York.

How was I wrong about his durability........and in a real fight, Capt is not closing the gap on spiderman, who is leaps and bounds faster then him.

H. S. 6

.

EDIT: Shit. I notice I took too long to post, and thus, Jinzin already pointed out much of what I have written. Regardless, I believe my (our?) point still stands.

I don't know much about Mr. Hyde, but if Captain America's taking hits from him, and he really is 80 ton strength level, there's something up there. Either PIS, or Cap is rolling with them. I can see Cap taking hits from Iron Man, sure; Namor, okay. The others I don't know much about.

By the rest of your post: are you really trying to say that Captain America's speed is on par with Spider-Man? blink

Soljer

Exactly. Assuming Cap simply dodged the first barrage of webs, and closes the gap, he will take it to Spider-man up close, and need not worry too much about the webs. Assuming Spider-man does an acrobatic leap backwards, Cap can tag him in mid-air. He has been able to perform much more difficult feats with his shield than hit a falling spider-man, afterall.

And, if he can chunk his shield through the engine of a tractor trailer, I think Iron-Spidey may feel it.

H. S. 6

Originally posted by jinzin
probably not long at all no cap might try to close the gap but if spidey fights smart he won't let him.

Exactly.

Thank you. At least we're getting some headway here. stick out tongue

Soljer

Originally posted by Apolloknight
Capt is not closing the gap on spiderman, who is leaps and bounds faster then him.

Good point, considering Captain America has managed to do it, what, three times now?

In the very scans I posted, it showed that Captain America has studied Parker to a T. He knows what is going to happen, he knows Spider-Man's likely responses, offensives, and defensives. Captain America is not only a MASTER combatant, he also knows all about strategy and tactics. He'll place himself where he needs to be placed. He'll make Spider-man fight HIS fight, and then get the upper-hand.

jinzin

Originally posted by Apolloknight
How was I wrong about his durability........and in a real fight, Capt is not closing the gap on spiderman, who is leaps and bounds faster then him. well for starters you said he's nothing higher in durability than a human.. on the other hand cap has taken superhuman loads of punishment on dozens of occasions...

jinzin

Originally posted by Soljer
Exactly. Assuming Cap simply dodged the first barrage of webs, and closes the gap, he will take it to Spider-man up close, and need not worry too much about the webs. Assuming Spider-man does an acrobatic leap backwards, Cap can tag him in mid-air. He has been able to perform much more difficult feats with his shield than hit a falling spider-man, afterall.

And, if he can chunk his shield through the engine of a tractor trailer, I think Iron-Spidey may feel it. he certainly seemed to be feeling those punches just fine on their own.

Apolloknight

Originally posted by Soljer
Good point, considering Captain America has managed to do it, what, three times now?

In the very scans I posted, it showed that Captain America has studied Parker to a T. He knows what is going to happen, he knows Spider-Man's likely responses, offensives, and defensives. Captain America is not only a MASTER combatant, he also knows all about strategy and tactics. He'll place himself where he needs to be placed. He'll make Spider-man fight HIS fight, and then get the upper-hand.

Thats fine, he trys to close the gap, then spider-man leaps, with his 2 football field standing long jump abilities, away from him.

Your underestimating spider-man here, Capt may be smart and know tactics, but tactics can only take you so far against a much more powerful opponent who has much more options then Capt.

Soljer

Originally posted by jinzin
he certainly seemed to be feeling those punches just fine on their own.

I aware. I was being a slight bit sarcastic.

If the shield can hurt someone like the HULK, yeah, I'm pretty sure Spider-man'll notice it.

jinzin

Originally posted by Soljer
Good point, considering Captain America has managed to do it, what, three times now?

In the very scans I posted, it showed that Captain America has studied Parker to a T. He knows what is going to happen, he knows Spider-Man's likely responses, offensives, and defensives. Captain America is not only a MASTER combatant, he also knows all about strategy and tactics. He'll place himself where he needs to be placed. He'll make Spider-man fight HIS fight, and then get the upper-hand. careful soljer.. you've just been victimized by the vs.-spider-fan-symptom

you'll start off just trying to make good points and clear up misconceptions about things at one moments, a few spidey fan posts later and you're arguing in favor of against spidey lol.. just be careful I've fallen to this trap a number of times in the past.. which is why people think I hate spidey now.

Grimm22

Cap dodges bullets no expression

bullet speed >>>> Web speed wink

jinzin

Originally posted by Soljer
I aware. I was being a slight bit sarcastic.

If the shield can hurt someone like the HULK, yeah, I'm pretty sure Spider-man'll notice it. lol no i know. i was just being jovial.. in my own way.

Soljer

Originally posted by Apolloknight
Thats fine, he trys to close the gap, then spider-man leaps, with his 2 football field standing long jump abilities, away from him.

Your underestimating spider-man here, Capt may be smart and know tactics, but tactics can only take you so far against a much more powerful opponent who has much more options then Capt.

Good tactic, however, Captain knows Spider-man, and his abilities. He will expect this.

Besides, look at simple physics, for someone to jump that FAR, they would also have to jump a bit HIGH. Spiderman is an amazing dodger, but he cannot fly. If he is simply falling, then Cap can VERY easily tag him.

Apolloknight

Originally posted by Grimm22
Cap dodges bullets no expression

bullet speed >>>> Web speed wink

And Spidey dodges laser at point blank range and has pre-cog

Point Blank Range Laser>>>>Capts fist Speed.

jinzin

Originally posted by Grimm22
Cap dodges bullets no expression

bullet speed >>>> Web speed wink

zactly.. a point that was attempted to be made in the trio thread and the wolvie thread for months.

Soljer

*laughs* I hope everyone remembers all the times I've argued in FAVOR of Spiderman.

I ALSO hope everyone remembers that I am arguing, not that Cap will WIN this confrontation, but that he won't lose as often as some are making it out to be.

jinzin

Originally posted by Apolloknight
And Spidey dodges laser at point blank range and has pre-cog

Point Blank Range Laser>>>>Capts fist Speed. "AND HAS PRECOG"

exactly.... he has precog which allows him to dodge lasers..

lazers and bullets can't use his precog against him.. good fighters however can.. and have...

Soljer

Originally posted by jinzin
"AND HAS PRECOG"

exactly.... he has precog which allows him to dodge lasers..

lazers and bullets can't use his precog against him.. good fighters however can.. and have...

*nods* Lasers aren't aware of his spider sense. Lasers can't predict Spiderman's moves, and Lasers can't throw fifteen different (pressure point) follow up attacks.

Apolloknight

Originally posted by Soljer
Good tactic, however, Captain knows Spider-man, and his abilities. He will expect this.

Besides, look at simple physics, for someone to jump that FAR, they would also have to jump a bit HIGH. Spiderman is an amazing dodger, but he cannot fly. If he is simply falling, then Cap can VERY easily tag him.

Spider-man jumps around and dodges lasers and bullets in mid-air on a daily basis, you think he isn't going to be able to control himself when he jumps in this case.

And try not to apply simple physics to comics, Spiderman is far beyond that with is equilibrium. And Just because Capt does manage to get spidey in h2h doesnt equal a win for capt, spiderman has 7 freaking limbs moving at superhuman speeds 3 of which could kill cap with a simple stab through his torso or head.

H. S. 6

Originally posted by Soljer
Good point, considering Captain America has managed to do it, what, three times now?

In the very scans I posted, it showed that Captain America has studied Parker to a T. He knows what is going to happen, he knows Spider-Man's likely responses, offensives, and defensives. Captain America is not only a MASTER combatant, he also knows all about strategy and tactics. He'll place himself where he needs to be placed. He'll make Spider-man fight HIS fight, and then get the upper-hand.

And what, while Spidey sits back and lets Cap hit him?

Okay, so let's say we do get in close. What is Cap going to do, exactly, assuming he'll be able to keep up with him? Punch him? But wait, the armor is bullet-proof. I suppose that's not going to work. Throw his shield at him? We all know what happens then.

Please tell me how Cap's going to "get the upper hand" before Spidey either A) lays him out, or B) webs him down.

Soljer

Originally posted by Apolloknight
Spider-man jumps around and dodges lasers and bullets in mid-air on a daily basis, he think he isn't going to be able to control himself when he jumps in this case.

But you fail to realize that Cap tags people who, on a daily basis, dodge bullets and lasers like it's his job.

Apolloknight

Originally posted by Soljer
But you fail to realize that Cap tags people who, on a daily basis, dodge bullets and lasers like it's his job.

None quite as fast or as agile as spiderman.

And dont bring up quicksilver, everybody and comics has tagged him, heck, I probably could.

H. S. 6

Originally posted by Soljer
But you fail to realize that Cap tags people who, on a daily basis, dodge bullets and lasers like it's his job.

And will it do him any good?

Like I said, with Spidey's durability, along with his semi-bulletproof armor, I doubt he's going to be feeling these "tags" much.

Oh, and the same can be said about Spidey. wink

Soljer

Originally posted by H. S. 6
And what, while Spidey sits back and lets Cap hit him?

Okay, so let's say we do get in close. What is Cap going to do, exactly, assuming he'll be able to keep up with him? Punch him? But wait, the armor is bullet-proof. I suppose that's not going to work. Throw his shield at him? We all know what happens then.

Please tell me how Cap's going to "get the upper hand" before Spidey either A) lays him out, or B) webs him down.

Wait, so now 'bullet proof' means totally impervious? Go tell that to Kevlar.

And what is he going to do in close? How about...dodge spiderman's first punch, follow up with a body shot, slap his shield across spidey's face, and then hit him with a right hook. In ten seconds. Like he did in the scans I showed.

Soljer

Originally posted by H. S. 6
And will it do him any good?

Like I said, with Spidey's durability, along with his semi-bulletproof armor, I doubt he's going to be feeling these "tags" much.

Oh, and the same can be said about Spidey. wink

Oh, and with his semi-bulletproof armor...so? Look at the hundreds of foes cap has tackled who were bulletproof. The shield is VERY superior to a bullet.

H. S. 6

Originally posted by Soljer
Wait, so now 'bullet proof' means totally impervious? Go tell that to Kevlar.

And what is he going to do in close? How about...dodge spiderman's first punch, follow up with a body shot, slap his shield across spidey's face, and then hit him with a right hook. In ten seconds. Like he did in the scans I showed.

I'll admit that that fight is closer than I would expect it to be (in my opinion, closer than it should be.) After all, with Spider-Sense and far greater speed, should Cap really be landing those punches, or is it just making it for a good read? wink

jinzin

Originally posted by Apolloknight
Spider-man jumps around and dodges lasers and bullets in mid-air on a daily basis, you think he isn't going to be able to control himself when he jumps in this case.

And try not to apply simple physics to comics, Spiderman is far beyond that with is equilibrium. And Just because Capt does manage to get spidey in h2h doesnt equal a win for capt, spiderman has 7 freaking limbs moving at superhuman speeds 3 of which could kill cap with a simple stab through his torso or head. so if physics don't count then "outside logic" is irrelivant to this comic book debate and we use comic books as a standard of evidence.. that being said.... cap's put spidey on the recieving end of an asskickin 3 times.. he can at least get 3 out of 10.

jinzin

Originally posted by H. S. 6
And what, while Spidey sits back and lets Cap hit him?

Okay, so let's say we do get in close. What is Cap going to do, exactly, assuming he'll be able to keep up with him? Punch him? But wait, the armor is bullet-proof. I suppose that's not going to work. Throw his shield at him? We all know what happens then.

Please tell me how Cap's going to "get the upper hand" before Spidey either A) lays him out, or B) webs him down. well for one cap has more stopping power than a bullet, he's punched through solid steel doors and punched wolvie's admantium skull so hard he flew 15 feet back....

ALSO it's bullet proof cause it works on nano fiber technology.. it's still VERY vulnerable to pressure points...

the military has a jacket like this right now.. you can't crack it with a sledgehammer it just reverts the concussive force back out.. but you poke it with your finger and it leaves intdentations..

and finally cap's hits have already registered on spidey 100% of the time...

H. S. 6

Originally posted by jinzin
so if physics don't count then "outside logic" is irrelivant to this comic book debate and we use comic books as a standard of evidence.. that being said.... cap's put spidey on the recieving end of an asskickin 3 times.. he can at least get 3 out of 10.

These 3 out of 10... you're counting the Civil War fight and the most recent fight that Soljer posted?

jinzin

Originally posted by Soljer
Oh, and with his semi-bulletproof armor...so? Look at the hundreds of foes cap has tackled who were bulletproof. The shield is VERY superior to a bullet. well if we're talking about the shield.. if cap threw that at spiderman without holding back and it connected.. shock

that sheild has gone through an admantium coated ultron construct... it would go through spiderman just as well.

xmarksthespot

Originally posted by jinzin
cap does have some degree of superhuman durability though. I mean hell the guy's head as been used as a wrecking ball to drop an apartment building on his noggin. That's not superhuman durability. That's a jobber aura.

jinzin

Originally posted by H. S. 6
These 3 out of 10... you're counting the Civil War fight and the most recent fight that Soljer posted? yes.. to be honest I would have said that well before civil war happened though....

H. S. 6

Originally posted by jinzin
well if we're talking about the shield.. if cap threw that at spiderman without holding back and it connected.. shock

that sheild has gone through an admantium coated ultron construct... it would go through spiderman just as well.

Too bad it wouldn't connect.

In fact, that brings up an interesting point. What happens if Spidey were to hit Cap with his shield the same way he hit Daredevil and Vision in Civil War?

You see? There's too many ways for Cap to go down. erm

jinzin

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
That's not superhuman durability. That's a jobber aura. so his feats don't count no expression

H. S. 6

Originally posted by jinzin
so his feats don't count no expression

I think he meant the specific one about the apartment dropping on his head. wink

jinzin

Originally posted by H. S. 6
Too bad it wouldn't connect.

In fact, that brings up an interesting point. What happens if Spidey were to hit Cap with his shield the same way he hit Daredevil and Vision in Civil War?

You see? There's too many ways for Cap to go down. erm

spiderman DID hit him with his shield.... confused

jinzin

Originally posted by H. S. 6
I think he meant the specific one about the apartment dropping on his head. wink

he didn't specify..

xmarksthespot

Originally posted by H. S. 6
I think he meant the specific one about the apartment dropping on his head. wink

Someone gets me. happy

H. S. 6

Originally posted by jinzin
spiderman DID hit him with his shield.... confused

Yeah, and Cap's head wasn't taken off. So I guess it wouldn't cut through Spidey, huh?

H. S. 6

Originally posted by jinzin
he didn't specify..

Um, he did. He quoted that exact line.

jinzin

Originally posted by H. S. 6
Um, he did. He quoted that exact line. he quoted a line that started out with "captain america has some degree of superhuman durability" he could have been talking about the specific feat OR the durability in general... he didn't specify... well until now.. but not when he first posted.

H. S. 6

Originally posted by jinzin
he quoted a line that started out with "captain america has some degree of superhuman durability" he could have been talking about the specific feat OR the durability in general... he didn't specify... well until now.. but not when he first posted.

Meh, seemed pretty specific to me. stick out tongue

jinzin

Originally posted by H. S. 6
Yeah, and Cap's head wasn't taken off. So I guess it wouldn't cut through Spidey, huh? so spiderman knows how to use that sheild as well as cap does? What the f**k?

H. S. 6

Originally posted by jinzin
so spiderman knows how to use that sheild as well as cap does? What the f**k?

cap as flung that thing through alien aircraft, androids, and apache hellicopters, but at the same time taken out 4 hydra agents without leaving a scratch on them using it.. he we know that cap can use it to an uber effective degree... but it DOES seem to be "idiot proofed" incase other parties got a hold of it.

I don't know how well Spidey needs to know how to use it when all he did was smack Cap upside the head with it. With Peter's strength, I think it'd be pretty easy to slice through Cap, if the shield is capable of the things you say it is. wink

EDIT: And as much as I'd like to continue this debate, I'm off to bed. Goodnight, everyone. stick out tongue

Arahan

Man you really dont like Spiderman (jinzin)

jinzin

Originally posted by H. S. 6
I don't know how well Spidey needs to know how to use it when all he did was smack Cap upside the head with it. With Peter's strength, I think it'd be pretty easy to slice through Cap, if the shield is capable of the things you say it is. wink

EDIT: And as much as I'd like to continue this debate, I'm off to bed. Goodnight, everyone. stick out tongue

it IS capible of these things.. look:

http://img500.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ca25045hl.jpg
http://img500.imageshack.us/my.php?image=captainamericaiii25p342tk.jpg
note: he tosses his shield faster than a rocket's escape velocity.
http://img500.imageshack.us/my.php?image=captainamericav327p097zm.jpg
also in reply to your bulletproof theory, this guy shruggs off bullets.. he DOES NOT shrugg of cap lol.

http://img370.imageshack.us/my.php?image=captainamerica203105cq.jpg

and I don't think that using the shield to cut through something has much to do with strength than is does technique... namor has taken that shield and beamed hank pym in the head with it.. it just ricocheted off.... like i said idiot proof.. most things manufactured by the military are.

jinzin

Originally posted by Arahan
Man you really dont like Spiderman (jinzin)

Grimm22

The sheild has been shown to easily chop of body parts.

If Cap can trick Spidey and get one good hit with his sheild, the match is over wink

xmarksthespot

Originally posted by jinzin
note: he tosses his shield faster than a rocket's escape velocity.
http://img500.imageshack.us/my.php?image=captainamericav327p097zm.jpg
blink

Seen it and I seriously hope you don't consider that a "feat" usable in a versus thread....

Alfheim

Look the thing you got to understand about cap is that eventhough people say that he is peak human hes not, he is superhuman.

I mean lets take Hawkeye for example how many times have you seen him shoot guns and weapons out of multiple attackers. They will tell you that Hawkeye has no powers but to do what he does you need superhuman skill.

In the marvel universe extremely talented and peak human is just another word for superhuman.

Alfheim

To be quite honest if you have examples in the marval universe of Cap giving spidey a good fight I dont know why you guys are still arguing. It seems some people just cant take it.

Metalmanx

Originally posted by jinzin
"AND HAS PRECOG"

exactly.... he has precog which allows him to dodge lasers..

lazers and bullets can't use his precog against him.. good fighters however can.. and have...

See, this right here makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

Precog. He knows an attack is coming before it comes. He knows what it will be and where it will POTENTIALLY land so he can avoid it in time.

Other, far slower opponents using his precog against him? What the hell? Does Spidey only predict one move every Thirty seconds now? What the f**k?

His Spider-Sense would allow him to know each and every attack thrown his way before it occurs, thus knowing the set-up attack and then the real attack. Whatever Cap ties to set up, Spidey will already know what it is.

Cap may have planned 2 steps ahead of Spidey, but Spidey has read said plans ahead of time.

Metalmanx

Originally posted by H. S. 6
And what, while Spidey sits back and lets Cap hit him?

Okay, so let's say we do get in close. What is Cap going to do, exactly, assuming he'll be able to keep up with him? Punch him? But wait, the armor is bullet-proof. I suppose that's not going to work. Throw his shield at him? We all know what happens then.

Please tell me how Cap's going to "get the upper hand" before Spidey either A) lays him out, or B) webs him down.

Spidey really should be able to stand there and take punches to the face from Cap all day long.

I'm reminded of when much-younger Spider-Man FLICKED Walrus-Man (or whatever his name was) in the face and knocked him out. And, as lame as he was, Walrus-Man did have a degree of superhuman strength and durability.

Now imagine a full-out, non-held back punch.

Why is Spidey's super strength not applicable to Cap?

By the way, I know you're arguing Spider-Man, but I just felt compelled to ask this anyway. wink

Metalmanx

Originally posted by Soljer
Wait, so now 'bullet proof' means totally impervious? Go tell that to Kevlar.

And what is he going to do in close? How about...dodge spiderman's first punch, follow up with a body shot, slap his shield across spidey's face, and then hit him with a right hook. In ten seconds. Like he did in the scans I showed.

Hey, what happened after that? I mean, what happened after the end of those scans? The fight couldn't have just stopped. What was the outcome?

Metalmanx

Originally posted by jinzin
well if we're talking about the shield.. if cap threw that at spiderman without holding back and it connected.. shock

that sheild has gone through an admantium coated ultron construct... it would go through spiderman just as well.

That, I cannot agree with.

Yea, it's gone through some durable things before. But against a person is completely different. Especially a person with superhuman durability.

Out of all the times that Cap has thrown his shield all out, when has it gone through his (non-robot) opponent? confused

It would hit Spidey really hard, yes. I never doubt that. But it would just carry him a bit with its momentum, not go through him. roll eyes (sarcastic)