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Well, three years on and here we go again.

This thread is here to do two things- to sort out for certain who is on what Path, and to go through the often elongated process of getting these Oracel predictions sorted out!

Here goes then...

Everything begins with choice...

THE PHILOSOPHY AND COMBAT PATHS


Ok, the basic choice you have to make is a choice of Path.

Do try and be sure about this choice. There is a point at which it will become irrevocable, and literally you can change your mind up to that point, but from the start of the game, Philosophy players will be receiving hints and experiences linked to tha Path, possibly in lieu of providing useful combat help.

So if you change Paths mid-game, you will have wasted some time. Not much time, for sure, but enough to make it worthwhile you being sure before we start!

I've talked a lot about what the different Path choices mean in earlier threads heralding this game. Here is a recap:

- It's not about clever or stupid, or throughtful and unthoughtful. The Combat Path needs intelligent play to win, and the Philowsophy Path is not a degree course. It's about style, and what you want from a Matrix gaming experience.

- The best example from the films is Reloaded. Neo is on the Philosophy Path, talking with the Oracle, the Councillor, the Merovingian, Smith and finally the Architect, where his big Philosophy moment comes, He chooses to save Trinity and- it seems- doom Zion. Even though his is not the Combat Path, he sitll gets very significant fights! Difference is, nothing depends on the fighrs except his own life, which is hardly without value, of course.

Morpheus and Trinity are on the Combat Path. They stay with Neo a lot of the way, even get to meet the Mero, but they don't really have to worry about what he says. They get into the biggest set-piece fight- the Highway- and it has a set objective- to protect the Keymaker.

- Absolutely no background in Philosophical learning is needed for that Path. if Neo can do it, so can you, All you need is the ability- or maybe simplky the desire to make the effort- to think about certain concepts and ideas. These ideas will be fairly simple ones, though possibly explored in-depth. Of course, if you do have such an educational background and want to bring it to the table, that's great!

- New players, I recommend you talk it over with those who have done it before. Also have a look at the 'Philosophy Path revealed' thread, which goes through the storyline from the last game as was relevant to the Philosophy path.

- The split doesn't have to be even, but if there is going to be great disproportion, better the Combat Path gets more. You can never have too many fighters.

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There is s difference between knowing the path, and walking the path


Ok, now, all of that applies to the Path idea in general, and was exactly followed last game.

Just as a warning, it is a little different this time.

For a start, there will eventually be one unified team objective in this game, unlike last time when there Philosophy Path was there to understand Jericho (a rather personal goal), whilst the Combat Path were out to get the cipher; the two only unifying because the Philos needed rescuing after they got their answer.

Of course, if there is rescuing to do, it's always going to be the Combat Path's job, somply because there are not really many situations in the Matrix where you can actually defuse danger by thought or understanding.

This game is vicious. The Matrix itself is vicious- Morpheus loses most his crew, and only two out of three mian characters survive the films. There is no mass wipeout planned- that's just demoralising- but there is extreme danger. Those standing between danger and disaster will be the Combat Path. That is their job!

The Philosophy Path does have its own section, and there is a specific 'guns down, Philosophy time' element. But it is not at all like it was last time. There is no central puzzle that your characters must solve to proceed, in the same literal way there was with Melitus. There IS definitely a central problem you need to solve by brainpower not brawn, though not is not uncommon in my RP games. But although that problem is an important part of the Path, it is actually 'just' a problem and not a deep Philosophical test, as was Melitus'.

Instead, the Philosophical 'test' for those players this time is continuous. This game is about certain themes, and Philosophy players will be encouraged to consider the reasons for, and consequences of, their actions in regards as to what has been presented to them. This will be presented so generally that there is nothing to stop the Combat Path people considering it also! But the direct consequences, and certainly me looking to whether you are succeeding on the Path- will be levelled at the Philo players.

So... think about all that.

You don't believe in all that fate crap...

One way or another, it seems the Oracle is pretty genuine in the Matrix universe. Make up whatever reason for it you like. Is the Oracle truly mystical and gifted with future sight? Or does she 'simply' understand choices so well that she can calculate all possibilities based on what people can do?

Who can know such things? Only the Oracle...

The Oracle has met every solider of Zion. And when you first met her as a free Human, she made a prediction for you.

That prediction forms your personal plot for the Matrix game, as opposed to the general plot.

It is your job to come up with a prediction; one that I will allow. Here, we shall wrangle through this and make sure everyone has something that works.

Here are some important points:

- They can't all come at once., Some where hinted at last time, but that's all probably forgotten by now. This can be a very long-term project.

- Predictions are short. "You must chose between your Life or Morpheus'". There's an example. "You will find the One," is another. Waffley preictions are bad ones.

- They have purpose. The Oracle is never going to simply tell you you will die next week in a car accident. Why would she bother? She does not randomly dispense the future. She tells people glimpses of what can happen to them, so that people can then help themselves! Oracle predictions are meant to be helpful, though normally indirectly, by encouraging a person to think.

- They should leave you confused. Even "You will find the One" was a whole lot more complex than it seemed, even for a diehard like Morpheus. You do not understand your own prediction, and as it is mine to spring on you, you don't really have a part in saying what it is.

- They are neither utterly precise or utterly vague. If they are too precise, I simply can't bring them into the game. If they are too vague, they aren't really predictions.

- Don't rely on odd interpretation to get out of a bad prediction. A prediction "You must die or all your friends will" will mean that. Neo might be able to come back, but he's The One. If you make a prediction that rather clearly kills either yourself or your friends, then the logic will be followed through, and it will likrly be you.

- This is a single prediction. Some predictions were voided last time becuase they actually broke down into two different things. Just the one, please.

- Some were also voided on being attempts to 'get out of jail', along the lines of "You will make a big mistake but it will be alright." No no, mistakes are mistakes! The Oracle prediction is there to aid role-playing, not actually bring benefit to you.

Ok, folks, make some submisisons, and they will be reviewed in due course.

And if you want to know mine from off-line as an example?

It was "You will find the shield, but it will not protect you."

And it's happened, btw, and it was true.

Can we keep ours? I remember how difficult it was to think of an original one.

Yes you can.

You know which Path Ares is, and if you don't, there's something terribly wrong.

"You will have to make a choice of life and death, and the result will not be what you expect."

Same as before.

"To face your Fears, Could lead you either to Destruction, or Empowered enlightenment."

Hope that one works. I have been without a prediction for around Three Years now.

"Though you feel guilty about your past, there will be a time when you must choose between coming to terms with that past, or being of benefit to others."

The return of Mors' prediction.

"Your fiery personality will lead to chaos for many, but in the end, you will be a savior for some."

I changed it from deaths to chaos...make it less negative and possibly a tad vaguer...?

"As a non-seeker of fame and recognition, you will either find that your role in this will lead to either a great need for your abilities or a personal sacrifice to further others along the way. Of either eventuality, it will be a result of a choice of faith or of responsibility..."

It doesn't sound vague but it leaves a near-endless openning for possibilities, interpret it any way you please Ush!

I'm still thinking about whether or not I'm going Philosophy or Combat.

I think that's too long, Aliies.

aww I thought as much anyway

"Your role in this will be a result of a choice of faith or of responsibility... And of either eventuality, you will live to regret the outcome or die knowing you did the right thing..."

I shall be going Combat Path once more. As for the Oracle, I think I'll stick with:

"There will be an event, and when it happens you must choose to help yourself, or your friends."

I just went to retrieve mine:

"The fight of your life shall pass, and you won't have a scratch on you."

I'm going with Philosophy.

"Your affliction will become your saving grace."

"You will have to choose between loyalty and the knowledge you desire.... and the price of understanding may destroy you."

Philosophy Path for me.

That's two predictions I am afraid, Melkor.

I'd like to keep my old one if that's possible Ush

(rings bell)

Oracle evaluations are beginning today.

People, please note, there is not a large amount of time left. Full play should begin by the end of the first week of October. Anyone without at least a pending prediction by then does not play, and of course I need the Path choice.

k I'll get on Storm's case. I assume you still know our path choices: Storm goes philo I go Combat

What about this:

"You may find the understanding you desire...... but the price could break you."

Barb is Combat Path.

I will get my prediction together ASAP....

San is combat path again, though, of course.

Berserker is Philosophy

"Your Rage will cut the Matrix in Half"

"Doubt will be the fire of your delight."

Philo.

I'm Philo, and my prediction will be:

"You will soon wither away, but will be given the choice of new life or the death of your brothers in arms"

"Love is your passion and goal, and it may be your saving grace."

?

^ Philo, right?

"Fear may best you, but it does not know you unless you allow it to."

Combat.

Do keep them coming, folks. Diagnosis on them may take a little while; one particular issue is that the stories were written with off-line propheices in mind, so things have to be scrutinised to see if there is crossover or if things will have to be twiddled or what-not. Objective is that it is all 100% sorted by the end of the First Assignment.

Philosophy Path.

"A secret revealed upon you might be a secret untrue."

You know, I think this is my least favorite part of creating a character because I have such a hard time coming up with something that's a. not crap, b. not totally cliched, and c. not too similar to someone else's.

"A lack of trust in others can lead to your downfall."

Is that good?

Combat path, of course, btw.

This took far too long, and I'm sure I'll have to think up another one...

"Your reliance on others will leave you unprepared at a key moment."

My prediction.
"The game will come to you."

Philosophy Path.

I can't think of a prophecy, any suggestions?

Nope.

Just read everyone else's, and see if you get any ideas.

Hell, Sirin used a song lyric...

Ok, this prolly really sucks, but: "You may rest, but never forget your past, or it will be your undoing."

Oracle yay!

Oracle issues must be addressed- that is to say. a reasonable attempt made to address- before the Second Assignment.

Before I start, though- thanks very much for trying with these. I know it is awkward.

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Helios: "You may rest, but never forget your past, or it will be your
undoing"

One general theme we are now saying is that Oracle prophecies that depend on background, history or personbality require us to have an idea of what these things are.

So, first off, we want to know what it is in your past that might need forgetting.

Secondly, this one might need more detail else it might not amount to much.

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Firewall: "Your role in this will be a result of a choice of faith or of responsibility... And of either eventuality, you will live to regret the outcome or die knowing you did the right thing..."

Before we go anywhere on this we need to know the faith-based aspects of your character

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Cloud: "There will be an event, and when it happens you must choose to help yourself, or your friends"

The first bit is being excised as taken for granted.

So this then becomes:

"You will have to choose to help yourself or your friends."

Which is very Matrixy, possibly a but too much so, being very sinilar to Neo.. Cloud has a lot of background to work with here with your stories and what-not, Spike- how well does he normally work with friends?

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Azrael: "The fight of your life shall pass, and you won't have a scratch on you."

Cleared.

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Ares: "You will have to make a choice of life and death, and the result will not be what you expect"

Cleared, with a buty.

This one works. But we tried to get it in last time. The problem is, there is good inherent drama in a choice of life or death, and just enough leeway there about what that actually means to work well (whose life, whose death, which one is desirable). We then have this added consequence of the result being not what you expect.

Which kinda takes away from the drama of having to make the choice, because the consequence that is the drama won;t actually happen as the choice dictates. So it is harder to put in than we might have thought.

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Barb: "To face your Fears, Could lead you either to Destruction, or Empowered enlightenment"

Tqo questions- what are Barb's fears?

Second, we want to be clear about what you are getting at with 'Empowered Enlightenment."

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Mors: "Though you feel guilty about your past, there will be a time when you must choose between coming to terms with that past, or being of benefit to others"

We want to know about your pazt. Actually, I have an idea you have done this, so please refresh my memory.

Might try and think of a way to make this one flow more smoothly as well.

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Heph: "Your fiery personality will lead to chaos for many, but in the end, you will be a savior for some"

Cleared.

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Melkor: "You may find the understanding you desire...... but the price could break you"

We'll need some direction on that first bit. What does Melkor really want to know? And we mean REALLY want?

Also we are getting a little dodgy on some of these conditionals. Prophecies like to deal with certainties by their very nature; 'coulds' and 'maybes' sit badly in them, because anyone can say something MIGHT happen. Only an Oracle can ber certain.

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Berserker: "Your Rage will cut the Matrix in Half"

Very punchy and commendably terse. I'm almost sorry to say there are two big issues:

1. This is kinda passive. It's something that will happen and there isn;t mucht to be done about it, and all you will be able to say after is that it happend pretty uch as she said, rather than there being specific drama from you about it

2. This might be pushing the limit of what we can get into the game. It might actually never happen on that basis!

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Sirin: "Doubt will be the fire of your delight"

Beautiful! But... I'm sorry, we can't do anything with it. Have to try again there.

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Balder: "You will soon wither away, but will be given the choice of new life or the death of your brothers in arms"

In structure it is good. The only problem is- that Choice doesn't look like an issue at all. Either you get new life or your friends die? Errr... I'll have the life, please?

We need a choice with weight to it. Do that and it is cleared.

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Klez: "Love is your passion and goal, and it may be your saving grace." Love not a game focus."

This is cleared. But you might want a totally different one.

Why? Ok, this can be done, but it will be harsh. if you are cool on that, then stick with it.

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Melis: "Fear may best you, but it does not know you unless you allow it to."

Ok, two problems. First of all, it's not something we can kinda lead you into without you knowing. It would require a point where, in effect, we'd have to mind control your character to run away from something, because we can't rely on you as a player definitely doing things the way the Prophecy says.

Second, similar to Sirin's, we can't make that second half work. Sorry.

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Mirage: "A secret revealed upon you might be a secret untrue."

Logically, passed. Practically, it might be rather flat, dramatically. Could be a bit of a "Is that all it is?" Propehcy.

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San- "A lack of trust in others can lead to your downfall.

Ok, two things there

1. It requires San being the type who doesn't trust. Very possible!

2. Might be a bit easy. I mean, there'll be some dramatic point which involves you trusting someone... and then all you have to do is go against type and actusally trust them, and that'll be it.

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Hawk: "Your reliance on others will leave you unprepared at a key moment."

I'll need to know a LOT about Hawk for this; tricky as he was not in the first game.

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Burn- "The game will come to you". See Sirin. Apologies.


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Fire- "You will have to find out the difference between illusion and reality."

Snipped of the first bit. Fine- though possibly The Matrix is drowning in that being the issue; it could apply to everyone.

Originally posted by Ushgarak
Oracle yay!

Oracle issues must be addressed- that is to say. a reasonable attempt made to address- before the Second Assignment.
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Berserker: "Your Rage will cut the Matrix in Half"

Very punchy and commendably terse. I'm almost sorry to say there are two big issues:

1. This is kinda passive. It's something that will happen and there isn;t mucht to be done about it, and all you will be able to say after is that it happend pretty uch as she said, rather than there being specific drama from you about it

2. This might be pushing the limit of what we can get into the game. It might actually never happen on that basis!

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How about this Ush
"Your Rage will guide you to the ends of the Matrix if you let it though you shall never see it"

Would it be easier if Ares removed the 'and the answer...' part?

Originally posted by Ushgarak
Mors: "Though you feel guilty about your past, there will be a time when you must choose between coming to terms with that past, or being of benefit to others"

We want to know about your pazt. Actually, I have an idea you have done this, so please refresh my memory.

Might try and think of a way to make this one flow more smoothly as well.

No problem. Rex and I have been reworking Mors' background as well, so it's more consistant.

Mors was given the title of Captain of the Thanatos after showing remarkable leadership skills and after his Captain was crippled by a Sentinel. However, in a very important mission, he completed the mission but lost part of his crew to an Agent. Those that survived- two Naturals, horrified by the deaths- then mutineed against Mors, killing his Operator. Mors then killed them before the ship was torn apart by Sentinels.

So, basically, Mors feels guilty about losing his entire crew at the hands of an Agent and by his own hand.

And for smoother flowing, do you mean sentence structure?

As sadistic as this may be for Klez...I want to find out the hard way what you mean by harsh.

Neat. Also just noticed I left in a note there about love not being a game focus. Didn't mean peoplre to see that, but not tha tbig a deal. 'tis true- thus far. Look for yours coming in a later story. Besides, you've got enough to worry about with Sienar as far as currently planned stories go.

New submissions will be explored ASAP!

Ares- literally, yes. But I suspect we might then be stuck about what it actually means, because you make life/death decisions all the time. I think the idea to qualify it a little was good, just that particular qualification brought it in a difficult direction for us.

Mors- thanks, will get back to you, and yes. I don't think I did my best work when I worded that one; I think the Oracle would out it differently.

Originally posted by Newjak
How about this Ush
"Your Rage will guide you to the ends of the Matrix if you let it though you shall never see it" Wanted to make sure ths wasn't lost on the last page

Blah, stupid predictions.

Anyway, on the first point made about mine...San's not a naturally trusting person at all, so yeah. Second, um, I don't know...

Ok, well before he was freed (so that would be 6 months before this game...I think....) he was willing to help his friends out regardless of what happened to him. Although then there wasn't such a pressing possibility of death from helping them out.

Then after he was freed he still kept his same principals and convictions about what he was willing to do for his friends. He was willing to risk himself for his friends, would have been willing to sacrifice himself and his friends if it meant the end of the war. But...after he was nearly killed letting everyone escape after the last game he may be a little "reluctant" to help them again.

But also there's the bystander effect, where people say they'd be willing to help others out and know that if the situation arose they'd help, but when it does they don't as their mind prevents them from helping.

Also if it's an agent that he's going to have to go up against he will run!

Originally posted by Ushgarak
Balder: "You will soon wither away, but will be given the choice of new life or the death of your brothers in arms"

In structure it is good. The only problem is- that Choice doesn't look like an issue at all. Either you get new life or your friends die? Errr... I'll have the life, please?

We need a choice with weight to it. Do that and it is cleared.


How about this:

"You may act strong, but your facade will soon break to reveal your greatest weakness".

I know it could apply to everyone and implies just about everything but that's what I like about it. It's up to you how it will play out in the game (I won't be able to see it coming). Not every Prophecy has to be as straight forward as "You will find the one" or "You will fall in love with the one"

True, but just about none of the submitted ones are that simple either!

I know. I was just making my point, but if you want me to change it I will.

Ares' is the closest to being that simple, and even then... ermm

Nah, it'll swing, Fire.

Melkor desires to know about the reason behind it all, Matrix and beyond.... I envision him as a great individualist who felt conditioned most of his life.... and he isn`t sure that he no longer is. He believes that only the one that has ultimate understanding can be trully free... otherwise his choices may be too constrained.

I it also puzzles him that programs can be sentient....

So is my prophecy okay if I remove the conditionals? Or should I return to the choice being between loyalty and knowledge? (Assuming that I am not out of the game for missing assignment, of course)

I'll get back to you. That info is very useful.

Or how about instead of having to choose between myself and my friends, choosing between the mission objective and my friends.

Hmm... I didn't see any comments on my prediction. Maybe you didn't see it, Ush? I'm rewording it anyways, as I noticed an error in the words I chose.

"Your affliction will become your salvation."

No, I saw it, just didn't think you were playing!

Oh, well now you know differently.

Will check it out ASAP.

What about: "You will have to choose between loyalty to your cause and understanding you desire?"

Ush, were we finished with my Prophecy, actually?

Oh hell no...